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00:41:53 <oerjan> <b_jonas> luckily it's not pizza <-- then it must be bell pepper and aubergine stew, just the way shachaf hates it
00:57:57 <HackEso> foil//Foil is a material that provides protection against evil, such as mind control rays. To protect the world many heroes spend a lot of their time foiling villains.
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04:38:53 <esowiki> [[User:IFcoltransG]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=66651 * IFcoltransG * (+369) Created my user page. Check it!
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07:08:15 <shachaf> "The reason why frequent restarts help solve problems faster is that while the solver does forget all current variable assignments, it does keep some information, specifically it keeps learnt clauses, effectively sampling the search space, and it keeps the last assigned truth value of each variable, assigning them the same value the next time they are picked to be assigned"
07:08:27 <shachaf> I didn't consider that last part.
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07:24:35 <jix> shachaf: it also keeps the scores used for the variable selection part of the decision heuristic
07:25:29 <jix> shachaf: so it is likely that it will branch on a similar set of variables after a restart
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08:07:59 <int-e> who exactly is dying in out-of-order execution
08:12:22 <jix> int-e: that's an issue that may take until retirement to figure out
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08:37:56 <Taneb> IOCCC sources have been released
08:41:06 <shachaf> Taneb: There's a list for that.
08:45:23 -!- int-e has set topic: IOCCC source code escaped | Welcome to the international center for esoteric programming language design, development, and deployment! | https://esolangs.org | logs: https://esolangs.org/logs/ http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D https://github.com/KrzysztofSzewczyk/esologs/.
08:46:25 <Taneb> shachaf: quite possibly
08:47:07 <HackEso> FireFlist* \ aglist* \ bardsworthlist* \ bobadventureslist* \ calesyta2016list* \ danddreclist* \ don'taskdon'ttelllist@ \ dontaskdonttelllist* \ ehlist* \ emptylist* \ erflist* \ flist* \ idealist* \ ioccclist* \ keenlist* \ list* \ listen* \ listlist* \ llist* \ makelist* \ makelistlist* \ minimalist* \ mlist* \ olist* \ pbflist* \ slist* \ smlist* \ stylist* \ testlist* \ xkcdwhatiflist* \ ysaclist*
09:03:33 <FaeFly> ..what's the FireFlist
09:06:55 <int-e> `culprits bin/FireFlist
09:07:10 <int-e> hmm. must be old :)
09:07:13 <shachaf> Why is my solver extremely slow?
09:07:43 <shachaf> I thought it was because I'm being very inefficient, but my friend's solver is also very inefficient and is also written in Python and is only slightly slower.
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09:13:33 <int-e> Ah, Anevka. Things are coming together.
09:14:09 <int-e> shachaf: could you have bad benchmark(s)?
09:14:18 <int-e> as in, one of the solver gets lucky, the other not
09:22:15 <shachaf> It's the same random 3SAT instance.
09:22:52 <int-e> and you've tried several I suppose?
09:23:11 <int-e> but who knows, maybe you are doing something wrong
09:23:18 <shachaf> I think my time is roughly consistent.
09:23:31 <shachaf> I suspect this is just naıve in a way their solver isn't.
09:23:45 <shachaf> I wasn't worried about it because I was going to implement watched literals anyway, but it's a bit odd.
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09:28:20 <wib_jonas> `ioccclist https://www.ioccc.org/years.html#2019 The source code for the winners of the 26th IOCCC has been released.
09:28:21 <HackEso> ioccclist https://www.ioccc.org/years.html#2019 The source code for the winners of the 26th IOCCC has been released. : b_jonas rain2 rain1
09:28:36 <shachaf> Hmm, it might've just been luck for this instance.
09:28:46 <shachaf> If I assume false instead of true, the time goes way down.
09:29:48 <wib_jonas> "<jix> int-e: that's an issue that may take until retirement to figure out" => beautiful ambiguous statement, playing on how "retirement" has both a technical meaning in this context and an everyday meaning
09:30:48 <wib_jonas> oerjan: you can make bell pepper stew in an oven?
09:31:34 <wib_jonas> oerjan: oh right, it's just "foil"
09:31:43 <wib_jonas> oerjan: as for "hungry", the relevant wisdom is
09:31:46 <HackEso> Ostrich used to be a large middle European empire in frequent conflict with Turkey. After a famine it sort of split into Ostrich/Hungry. Alas its policy of keeping its head in the sand did not get it through the Great War, and with its final attempts to take flight failing, it ended up cut into several pieces.
09:32:50 <wib_jonas> this was apparently written by you
09:33:55 <jix> wib_jonas: as does "issue" :)
09:36:03 <wib_jonas> let me thing where else on the internet should I ping with this news
09:37:59 <int-e> jix: ah, didn't see those... now I feel bad :P
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09:47:41 <shachaf> OK, I think it was just my variable-picking strategy being very bad.
09:49:25 <int-e> plausible... out of curiosity, did you test a satisfiable or an unsatisfiable problem?
09:49:40 <shachaf> Both, but mostly a satisfiable one.
09:51:39 <int-e> I'd probably use mostly unsatisfiable instances for comparison between solvers... or many satisfiable instances. Luck is too much of a factor for satisfiable instances.
09:52:48 <int-e> people also randomize inputs... shuffling literals and clauses.
09:53:52 <wib_jonas> int-e: and randomly negating them, like in bfjoust
09:55:22 <int-e> bfjoust is not random though, is it
09:55:49 <jix> even for unsat instances variance is crazy, which makes good benchmarking take a long time and cost a lot :(
09:57:14 <wib_jonas> int-e: the random space is so small that we try all possibilities, so we don't do a real random sample, but the idea is the same
09:57:40 <wib_jonas> some instances work better when you negate the direction, so we try both negated and non-negated
10:19:47 <Lykaina> 40 min till quiet time in my apartment building is lifted
10:22:12 <Lykaina> i'll take meds then and go back to sleep
10:26:20 <int-e> the mace is in the house
10:27:25 <int-e> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzPf4RRG1Rc ;-)
10:27:55 <int-e> "LIVE State Opening of Parliament: 14 October 2019"
10:35:37 <Lykaina> i wonder if the uk is pissed that they voted for brexit
10:36:21 <int-e> they're still divided on that according to polls
10:37:19 <wib_jonas> Lykaina is probably on the east coast of North America then
10:38:31 <int-e> queen arrived, house of commons summoned... this will take a while :)
10:39:34 <Lykaina> if they do a no-deal brexit, i will be disappointed
10:39:55 <int-e> At this point I won't. But it's unlikely to happen just now.
10:40:42 <int-e> I'm kind of expecting another extension and a general election in the UK. But I don't really know; I think nobody does.
10:41:03 <Lykaina> i hope they stay in the eurozone
10:41:36 <int-e> That seems unlikely.
10:41:52 <wib_jonas> right, they need to sacrifice a prime minister as a scapegoat a few times per year, and a general election is the easiest way to choose the next person to be sacrificed
10:42:06 <int-e> Oh Johnson's speech has begun. (Read by the Queen, of course.)
10:42:44 <wib_jonas> int-e: huh, why would the Queen read the PM's speech?
10:42:58 <int-e> wib_jonas: Because that's how this "Queen's speech" works.
10:43:59 <wib_jonas> also, we've got the near final results for the local govt elections. opposition win in Budapest is now confirmed, in fact they got one more place than they seemed to have when I checked in the evening.
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10:44:49 <int-e> wib_jonas: Well it is the UK. :P
10:45:58 <int-e> Lykaina: did you know that Corbyn is pro Brexit?
10:46:22 <int-e> The leader of the Labour party.
10:46:44 <int-e> The party line is different, interestingly enough.
10:47:58 <int-e> Nah, they are opposing parties.
10:48:02 <Taneb> Lykaina: tories = conservative party, who are in government and led by Boris Johnson
10:52:32 <Lykaina> which country is led by boris badnoff? i forgot
10:52:40 <int-e> and the queen has left
10:53:28 <int-e> I'm not sure what happens next... apparently the house of commons members return there...
10:54:07 <Taneb> There's a debate on whether the Commons accept the Queen's Speech
10:54:25 <int-e> Nice. Should be fun.
10:54:59 <Lykaina> what did the queen argue for/against?
10:55:37 <int-e> brexit, law and order, environmental protection (interestingly enough), leadership (of the UK in the world) after brexit
10:55:43 <int-e> I don't remember all of it.
10:56:29 <int-e> I'm sure we can read the whole thing online in a couple of hours.
10:58:36 <int-e> (law and order... there was a bit about giving the polic force the means of defending themselves, and something about giving them the power to arrest people with warrants by "trusted partners".
10:59:48 <int-e> Anyway. I've never seen this ceremony; now I have. Yay me :)
11:01:13 <Taneb> If she were here she's probably be the oldest person in the channel
11:03:00 <int-e> Lykaina: Anyway, the polls that I recall said that a small majority would be in favour of staying in the EU now. However, not all of those people want to abandon the Brexit process...
11:04:37 <int-e> Lykaina: The first question is entirely hypothetical... if the Brexit process had not been started, and there was a referendum on that today just like there was (uhm, 3?) years ago, how would they vote.
11:05:47 <int-e> The second question is about actually going back and stopping the Brexit process that has been started and ongoing for all the time since.
11:06:09 <int-e> I imagine a lot of people now want it to be over with, not really caring about the result.
11:08:04 <int-e> (for my standards)
11:08:23 <Taneb> Actually... I'm mixed up, it was in the summer, wasn't it?
11:08:32 <Taneb> And then article 50 was invoked the following Spring
11:08:58 <int-e> Let's meet in the middle!
11:14:58 <wib_jonas> The queen ended the speech, now she's leaving.
11:15:31 <wib_jonas> I don't understand how this works.
11:18:01 <Taneb> wib_jonas: I think your coverage may be behind?
11:18:57 <wib_jonas> "<Taneb> If she were here she's probably be the oldest person in the channel" lol
11:19:04 <HackEso> people who taneb isn't? ¯\(°_o)/¯
11:19:08 <HackEso> people who taneb aren't? ¯\(°_o)/¯
11:19:12 <Taneb> `? people who taneb is not
11:19:13 <HackEso> elliott, a rabbi, Mark Zuckerberg, James Bond, Queen Elizabeth the first. Pending approval: Shigeru Miyamoto.
11:20:09 <wib_jonas> Taneb: this youtube thingy says it's "live", but then, I've see so many things in television where they still have the "live" caption when it's replayed, so I don't really trust it
11:20:24 <wib_jonas> either they should add "not live" as a caption, or add a timestamp next to "live"
11:20:28 <int-e> wib_jonas: The live stream has ended 20ish minutes ago
11:25:59 <Taneb> Fun Taneb fact: I have what is to my knowlege the largest collection of autographed Haskell textbooks
11:27:45 <wib_jonas> Taneb: how many of those did you autograph yourself?
11:28:32 <Taneb> wib_jonas: zero, they are both autographed by the respective author
11:29:00 <Taneb> (one by Graham Hutton and one by Simon Marlow)
11:29:43 <Taneb> Programming in Haskell (second edition) and Paralle and Concurrent Program ming in Haskell
11:29:56 <int-e> Btw, LYAHFAGG would earn you negative points.
11:30:40 <int-e> Funny, there are more Haskell textbooks than I thought.
11:31:44 <wib_jonas> `slashlearn people who taneb is not//Taneb is not elliott, a rabbi, Mark Zuckerberg, James Bond, Queen Elizabeth the first, or anyone older than Queen Elizabeth the Second. Pending approval: Shigeru Miyamoto.
11:31:46 <HackEso> Relearned 'people who taneb is not': Taneb is not elliott, a rabbi, Mark Zuckerberg, James Bond, Queen Elizabeth the first, or anyone older than Queen Elizabeth the Second. Pending approval: Shigeru Miyamoto.
12:18:53 <esowiki> [[Deadfish~]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66652&oldid=66648 * A * (+124) /* Implementation */
12:19:54 <arseniiv> <int-e> Btw, LYAHFAGG would earn you negative points. => hm but it’s where I learned about zippers first
12:21:35 <int-e> arseniiv: if you ever start a collection of haskell textbooks, this is the one you hide in the attic.
12:21:59 <int-e> that's all I was saying ;)
12:22:38 <int-e> and obviously I'm compleeeetly objective about this.
12:23:02 <int-e> Not tainted by personal opiona at all.
12:32:10 <wib_jonas> int-e: what does the second A stand for in "LYAHFAGG"?
12:32:27 <arseniiv> my one concern is that its density is pretty low
12:33:51 <int-e> wib_jonas: I thought there was an "a" there. I didn't check.
12:37:26 <wib_jonas> arseniiv: yeah, that means you can't even effectively use it as a doorstopper
12:38:07 <int-e> wib_jonas: Yes, I've marvelled at "opiona" as well... :)
12:38:19 <int-e> A stroke of genius. Or maybe just a stroke. Who knows.
12:39:00 <wib_jonas> fungot, do you have an opiona on the opiuma crisis?
12:39:00 <fungot> wib_jonas: as soon as i get the feeling i'm saying the point of
12:40:19 <int-e> fungot: you should become a politician
12:40:19 <fungot> int-e: and besides, some people don't
12:40:26 <fungot> int-e: on the other hand i you *do* have install priviledges then it's much too dark as well :) just trying that now. well, maybe
12:45:04 <wib_jonas> doorstoper reminds me of this old strip https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/2006-12-14
12:46:53 <arseniiv> <int-e> A stroke of genius. Or maybe just a stroke. Who knows. => please don’t give genii strokes, it’s bad for their healths
12:48:46 <arseniiv> wib_jonas: rofol => I meant the first doorstopper message but I’ve seen that strip too
12:49:39 <arseniiv> I won’t say “rofol” on a cruel humor, it would be too much even if it has some fun :)
12:56:06 <esowiki> [[Deadfish~]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66653&oldid=66652 * A * (+15) /* Implementation */
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14:53:19 <rain1> exciting about IOCCC!
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16:43:27 <esowiki> [[User:AnimaLibera]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66654&oldid=66539 * AnimaLibera * (+36)
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17:04:11 <lambdabot> ESSB 141650Z 35004KT 320V030 9999 FEW022 08/07 Q1014
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20:44:05 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Refp * New user account
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20:50:57 <arseniiv> I am prone to crash into nostalgia and it’s bad and unconstructive
20:53:02 <arseniiv> now I hopelessly tried to find a photo of a place which isn’t the same anymore as it was rebuilt several years ago. And I don’t know if it persisted and from which mobile phone it was shoot at all, maybe from the one which isn’t turning on anymore
20:53:58 <imode> "if the data exists, the thing exists" is a fallacy I run into.
20:54:23 <arseniiv> though I flagged several photos as broken in filenames and added some code to my program for filling in creation date of a file when it’s newer than its modification date (yep that happens)
20:54:23 <imode> it's why I take photos of everything and stow them away like a squirrel. it isn't healthy and it's not constructive.
20:55:30 <arseniiv> and not that even that place was significant to me to be in, it just had a funny design of its name
20:56:47 <arseniiv> this was a cafe inside a big place, the place got rebuild and I won’t walk in its old layout anymore, and it’s a bit sad, and in that cafe I don’t remember to be in
20:57:47 <arseniiv> also I was stupid to clean some DVDs with a version of the not-so-yearly backup
20:59:14 <arseniiv> and there were some DVD-Rs which persisted only because I couldn’t clear them. And later they proved to be useful, even
20:59:39 <arseniiv> despite being made in approx. 2008
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21:32:39 <b_jonas> imode: taking photos of everything and filing them away is a good thing. it is constructive.
21:33:30 <int-e> until you imagine the growing pile of picture creeping up on you and burying you under an avalanche of impressions to sort through.
21:33:53 <HackEso> Alice doesn't want to go among mad people.
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22:51:28 <b_jonas> int-e: I haven't been taking enough pictures, and I spent way too little time sorting through them and publishing the ones that I should publish, and I feel some amount of shame about that. but a growing pile creeping? nah, that'll never happen
22:51:48 <b_jonas> admittedly I am somewhat conservative with how many pictures I take
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23:23:27 <arseniiv> int-e: we should just wait for arriving of a good AI photo sorter, no worries about piles, why
23:26:51 <arseniiv> “these twenty photos are almost the same, these eight are all blurry, these three differ in these details, these eleven I don’t advise to look for too closely due to too many arthropodes depicted”
23:27:12 <arseniiv> the first comma should be a colon instead
23:28:36 <arseniiv> and then you look at all twenty two of them anyway as you think there could have been false negatives and interesting artistic possibilities
23:30:10 <arseniiv> there are two extra ones due to a flaw in AI so that when it inspects images, it sometimes adds their weighted averages to the mix
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