< 1559261451 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1559262681 0 :joast!~rick@cpe-98-145-132-215.natnow.res.rr.com QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1559263975 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559264152 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1559264385 0 :MatrixBridge!matrixirc@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-wjwbjujuqejlyfea JOIN :#esoteric < 1559264388 0 :MatrixBridge!matrixirc@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-wjwbjujuqejlyfea PART #esoteric :"User left" < 1559264489 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559264578 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1559264601 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`welcome Xylochoron < 1559264602 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Xylochoron: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: . (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on EFnet or DALnet.) < 1559264615 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how's it going < 1559264628 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ask fungot < 1559264628 0 :fungot!~fungot@2a01:4b00:82bb:1341::2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: shortly after the war, the strength of the interests of your hearers, there to shine forever, while the world lasts, a warning to protect their own buildings ( which were without any fnord or fnord anything. will you let in a mussulman? will you hazard so desperate a step while there is any mistake about it," said clodius. < 1559264707 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, i'm a regular on the esolangs Discord server. working on a thing to compile turing machines into cyclic tag these days.... < 1559264713 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i gather you guys are not big fans of discord. < 1559264780 0 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION definitely isn't < 1559264802 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhm, anyway, i know i'm just like, showing up in ur server all of a sudden, but, well, some of us discorders are like, not so happy about discord ourselves, and there's this open source thing like discord called Matrix, < 1559264807 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :hail eris < 1559264809 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i'm 4 sure not asking you guys to join that or anything < 1559264811 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just like, < 1559264816 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wondering if we can make a bridge? < 1559264833 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know someone asked about that for discord before and i heard u guys said no, but maybe matrix would be ok? < 1559264835 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :all hail discordia < 1559264859 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't people already use Matrix with IRC? < 1559264862 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just though i'd ask, there's a lot of us who are curious to know what you guys are all talking about but are kinda stuck on some of the features of discord :-/ riot has pretty much the same features and is open source and stuff so, < 1559264868 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ummm < 1559264874 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok sorry i'm actually just new to matrix today X-D < 1559264880 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like tswett[m] here is doing that. < 1559264885 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i might not be completely understanding how it works haha < 1559264911 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i made my own esolang room there, but if there's a way to just connect with you guys more directly that'd be great to < 1559264915 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*o < 1559264915 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway I'm not the person to ask about these things but I usually don't like these bridges. < 1559264952 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene PRIVMSG #esoteric :Xylochoron: There already is a bridge. I'm using it right now. < 1559264959 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, i gotcha. let me actually just look into if there's a more direct way to < 1559264960 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ok! < 1559264972 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :IRC has plenty of problems but at least it's relatively simple and a protocol you can make your own clients for. < 1559265025 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :simple isn't necesarily a huge benefit for me but like, i'm sure it is for others, to each their own i dunno? < 1559265036 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do i get on your side of the bridge tswett[m] < 1559265037 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1559265047 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm new to matrix just today haha < 1559265072 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you just join #freenode_#esoteric:matrix.org. < 1559265081 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :would love to know what u guys have been talking about. have some good friends on discord too though i hope i can convince evryone to merge or something....... < 1559265090 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok. let me try that again hang on < 1559265099 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1559265132 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :man, web software is scow < 1559265134 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559265140 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1559265226 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you know that the Matrix standard specifies RESTful HTTP APIs for securely transmitting and replicating JSON data between Matrix-capable clients < 1559265245 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :are all things that describe themselves as RESTful bad < 1559265248 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also use Discord, by the way, so I'd be interested in knowing about the esolang Discord. :D < 1559265248 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :imo probably < 1559265383 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol i guess i can tell you about the esolang discord, but really over there we've been talking about switching to matrix < 1559265399 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it'd be a little weird to have some people moving that way and others this way lol < 1559265444 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's fair. :D < 1559265452 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry could you tell me that address to add on matrix again < 1559265477 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nevermind found it lol < 1559265534 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry for being dumb but i'm actually having some trouble figuring out how to join from matrix < 1559265540 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :where do i plug in "#freenode_#esoteric:matrix.org" :-/ < 1559265576 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm trying to "create a new room" and typing that address into the search bar < 1559265593 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing comes up, searching for esoteric doesn't come up with anything either < 1559265602 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're on riot.im? < 1559265632 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1559265638 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm using the desktop riot client thing, < 1559265642 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene PRIVMSG #esoteric :Click on the join-a-room button, type in #freenode_#esoteric:matrix.org, and hit enter. < 1559265655 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene PRIVMSG #esoteric :You won't see any search results, but that doesn't matter. < 1559265662 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ok let me try again < 1559265682 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly JOIN :#esoteric < 1559265715 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok right wow, all i had to do was hit "join" and not worry about it being in the search results duh < 1559265715 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like you did it. :D < 1559265723 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks cool < 1559265726 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene PRIVMSG #esoteric :Welcome to the Dark Side. < 1559265736 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :u has cookies? < 1559265778 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :this should be cool, i'm always worried that on discord we're talking about stuff you guys have already figured out the answer to over here haha < 1559265834 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like how to write a loop in ///. :D < 1559265841 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc everyone wants to know that < 1559265847 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :slashes is best esolang < 1559265858 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene PRIVMSG #esoteric :Holy cow, I invented /// half my life ago. < 1559265868 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :srusly? cool < 1559265890 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was 13 at the time, now I'm 26. < 1559265927 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1559265971 0 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1559265986 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm so sad i didn't get into programming when i was younger than i did, but i hope i'm making up for it in time. i'm 35 and only really started coding around 22 or so D-: < 1559266000 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess i messed around with calculator basic in middle school a little bit lol < 1559266004 0 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah you don't have to start early to be great at it < 1559266014 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :but its pretty cool to hear about people making that kind of stuff at like 13 < 1559266032 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i've made some stuff so, < 1559266041 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm like, the oldest person by far on the discord server haha < 1559266049 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least of people who've admitted their ages, < 1559266075 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, random point though lol < 1559266381 0 :Xylochoron!44bb4477@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.187.68.119 QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1559266613 0 :budonyc!~budonyc@c-24-62-204-147.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559267004 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene QUIT :Changing host < 1559267004 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@unaffiliated/tswett JOIN :#esoteric < 1559267004 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@unaffiliated/tswett QUIT :Changing host < 1559267004 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene JOIN :#esoteric < 1559267250 0 :budonyc!~budonyc@c-24-62-204-147.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1559270794 0 :joast!~rick@cpe-98-145-132-215.natnow.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1559270907 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-173-73-86-145.washdc.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559272810 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT : < 1559274772 0 :esowiki!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559274873 0 :esowiki_!74e4b1f4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.244 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559274943 0 :esowiki_!74e4b1f4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.244 PART #esoteric : < 1559275022 0 :esowiki!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric : 03:27 User talk:Groowy‎ (diff | hist) . . (+760)‎ . . Ais523 (talk | contribs) (Creative Commons licenses make it legal to do certain things with the work, but there are restrictions; Esolang doesn't meet those restrictions, so you can't post Creative Commons work (other than the unrestricted CC0) here) < 1559275275 0 :esowiki!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1559275333 0 :esowiki!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559276676 0 :a_!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559276685 0 :a_!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? A < 1559276686 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :A is one of seven villages in Norway. The BBC invented them by not understanding things on top of letters. < 1559276695 0 :a_!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? User:A < 1559276696 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :User:A? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1559276714 0 :a_!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? User:A < 1559276715 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :User:A? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1559276724 0 :a_!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? A < 1559276725 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :A is one of seven villages in Norway. The BBC invented them by not understanding things on top of letters. < 1559276742 0 :a_!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? adu < 1559276743 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know adu? Adu adu adu adu adu! < 1559276749 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-173-73-86-145.washdc.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes? < 1559276755 0 :a_!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? aloril < 1559276756 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :aloril? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1559276766 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-173-73-86-145.washdc.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's happening < 1559276783 0 :a_!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PART #esoteric : < 1559276792 0 :esowiki!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1559276839 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :a_ is pretending to be the esowiki bot now. < 1559276894 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? Å < 1559276895 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​Å _is_ a village in Norway, unless you're the BBC and don't understand things on top of letters. < 1559276908 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`grWp things on top < 1559276909 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :a:A is one of seven villages in Norway. The BBC invented them by not understanding things on top of letters. \ å:Å _is_ a village in Norway, unless you're the BBC and don't understand things on top of letters. \ cocoa:A is a village in Norway. The BBC invented it by not understanding things on top of letters. < 1559277502 0 :a_!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559277521 0 :a_!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? Apic < 1559277522 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apic? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1559277532 0 :a_!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? b_jonas < 1559277533 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas egy nagyon titokzatos személy. Hollétéről egyelőre nem ismertek. < 1559277542 0 :a_!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? bobby < 1559277543 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :bobby? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1559277557 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :a_: You are being obnoxious and repeatedly engaging in behaviors that people have asked you to stop. < 1559277580 0 :a_!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 QUIT :Client Quit < 1559278634 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-173-73-86-145.washdc.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: thanks < 1559279042 0 :Zsdf!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559279047 0 :Zsdf!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? shachaf < 1559279048 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Queen Shachaf of the Dawn sprø som selleri and cosplays Nepeta Leijon on weekends. He hates bell peppers with a passion. He doesn't know when to stop asking questions. We don't like this. < 1559279058 0 :Zsdf!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 QUIT :Client Quit < 1559279344 0 :Zsdf!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559279347 0 :Zsdf!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a_: You are being obnoxious and repeatedly engaging in behaviors that people have asked you to stop. < 1559279352 0 :Zsdf!74e4b1f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.116.228.177.242 PART #esoteric : < 1559279686 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is the deal with this person's random harassment < 1559279689 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :leave me alone, a_ < 1559279782 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559279967 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1559280569 0 :Frater_EST!~adrianbib@wsip-68-15-198-210.ok.ok.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559280674 0 :Frater_EST!~adrianbib@wsip-68-15-198-210.ok.ok.cox.net PART #esoteric : < 1559282520 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf,int-e : hm, i've pondered that median thing, before < 1559282640 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which thing? < 1559282683 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :orin : "`x' is at most `y'" is written `x =< y' < 1559282708 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :the `(a \/ b) /\ (a \/ c) /\ (b \/ c) = ... = (a /\ b) \/ (a /\ c) \/ (b /\ c)' one < 1559283047 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was pondering "matching" on bags < 1559284229 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zfnlgwh4k4ewtw.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1559284232 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-173-73-86-145.washdc.fios.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1559284559 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, right. < 1559286368 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-56-81.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1559286380 0 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:8c3e:ed2b:9a48:4317 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559288219 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-25-0.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett[m]: in that case look at the other string-rewriting esolanguages at http://esolangs.org/wiki/Category:String-rewriting_paradigm < 1559288259 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-25-0.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett[m]: 13 years ago, that was around 2006, right? http://esolangs.org/wiki/Fuun_DNA is from 2007 < 1559288304 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-25-0.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :xylochoron[m]: basic of what calculator specifically? it's hard to guess because I don't know when you were in middle school < 1559288318 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-25-0.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, "oldest person" < 1559288323 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-25-0.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1559288380 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-25-0.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, if you were that old, you wouldn't have had a calculator with basic in middle school < 1559289780 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-25-0.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, thunderstorm warning for today, sunday and monday < 1559289953 0 :GeekDude!~G33kDude@unaffiliated/g33kdude QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1559290890 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-25-0.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1559292117 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1559292141 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559292897 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559293078 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1559294022 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559295207 0 :GeekDude!~G33kDude@unaffiliated/g33kdude JOIN :#esoteric < 1559296817 0 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:8c3e:ed2b:9a48:4317 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1559297271 0 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:8c3e:ed2b:9a48:4317 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559297454 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@24.185.132.57 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559297637 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1559297823 0 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1559297892 0 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559300296 0 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:8c3e:ed2b:9a48:4317 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1559300972 0 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:8c3e:ed2b:9a48:4317 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559301587 0 :Camto[m]!camtomatri@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-tbwztqowexzbbnsp JOIN :#esoteric < 1559302818 0 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-etsislqlhatruona JOIN :#esoteric < 1559303525 0 :sebbu3!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1559303582 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh nice, I hadn't seen this one before. website registration form, with javascript that checks whether the password you want to set satisfies their password complexity criterion. it lists each condition in a separate line, and checks immediately during typing the password, so when you type the first capital letter, it marks "At least 1 capitalized < 1559303582 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :letter" checked. < 1559303623 0 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1559303635 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah, "Avoid using '," , & ,< , >,/ special character" because they apparently aren't sure they can write working javascript or sql placeholders or something < 1559303659 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me try to remove that javascript and register with a password that fails some of those criterions < 1559303674 0 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :little bobby tables < 1559303721 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1559303764 0 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1559305374 0 :dingwat_!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fnzypqwzztfgpeae JOIN :#esoteric < 1559305408 0 :j4cbo!sid186930@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-nfetsubgsxpxqelz QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1559305431 0 :j4cbo!sid186930@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rhlvmgrmtzwmpdca JOIN :#esoteric < 1559305449 0 :trn!~trn@prone.ws QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1559305465 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ QUIT :Quit: CHEAPIE! What did you do to the bouncer?! :P (jk) < 1559305467 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1559305500 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe JOIN :#esoteric < 1559305546 0 :dingwat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jyehrfxgokygwsba QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1559305548 0 :dingwat_!?@? NICK :dingwat < 1559305550 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-bcieqxgctslcgene QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1559305553 0 :wmww!wmwwmatrix@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-wmciwysmbcheifxf QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1559305616 0 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-zadsdxeddlqlkcxy JOIN :#esoteric < 1559305692 0 :rdococ!rdococ@cheapiesystems.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1559305736 0 :wmww!wmwwmatrix@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-ixbelvdoswrqbheb JOIN :#esoteric < 1559306625 0 :trn!~trn@prone.ws JOIN :#esoteric < 1559307396 0 :sebbu3!?@? NICK :sebbu < 1559308276 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski: fun fact: (a \/ b) /\ (a \/ c) /\ (b \/ c) = (a /\ b) \/ (a /\ c) \/ (b /\ c) implies distributivity (assuming a lattice). Fairly difficult... < 1559309184 0 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds interesting < 1559309186 0 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is that < 1559309220 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know why. I've just proved it ;-) < 1559309274 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the shape vaguely resembles distributivity in that it swaps inner and outer \/ and /\. < 1559309314 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But beyond that I have little intuition. < 1559309371 0 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :how did you prove that < 1559310150 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: neat! And you don’t need bounds or negation, only lattice axioms? < 1559310186 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1559310213 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's funny because my paper proof is incorrect... but I convinced Isabelle ;-) < 1559310405 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: did you give any hints to Isabelle, or did it just derive the result automatically? < 1559310427 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :let’s see… if c ↦ b, that median thing implies (a ∨ b) ∧ b = (a ∧ b) ∨ b. Hm, that’s in axioms already, wrong turn < 1559310433 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I proved an intermediate lemma. < 1559310514 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then I used sledgehammer so there's a proof step I don't understand at all :) < 1559310789 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: I think you used distributivity in that thought. < 1559310838 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(assuming that c |-> b means c = c \/ b) < 1559310942 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, wrong way, that should be b \/ c = b. < 1559311003 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :(do you mean, assuming that `c =< b' ?) < 1559311053 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would rather not involve the order at all at this point. < 1559311103 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i don't see what "if c ↦ b" or "assuming that c |-> b" even means) < 1559311140 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :read it as an implication, then rewrite it as \supset ;-) < 1559311287 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: why, I simply substituted b for c and used some associativity and idempotency < 1559311302 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh. < 1559311322 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am cryptic :D < 1559311324 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay then < 1559311336 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I read something else, so I gave away a bit of a hint :) < 1559311362 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in retrospect reading it as a substitution would've made perfect sense. < 1559311482 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had a TI-89 graphing calculator with basic on it. They were introduced in 1998, when I was in 7th grade. < 1559311494 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/TI-89_series < 1559311513 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cost about the same as it does today too, yay for monopoly? < 1559311534 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :See also: https://xkcd.com/768/ < 1559311589 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do I @ that guy... < 1559311625 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :@freenode_b_jonas:matrix.org: < 1559311626 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unknown command, try @list < 1559311661 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha, you were in middle school when the TI-89 was already available. I don't think you're the oldest < 1559311739 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :⌜↦⌝ is not an implication arrow, to me < 1559311828 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski: I read something that I wanted to see. < 1559311856 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :? I’m the oldest amonth those who’ve admitted their ages on the Discord server, which is most. I think the second oldest is like 23. If there’s older people here yeah that’s great < 1559311858 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see < 1559311859 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :xylochoron[m] : fwiw, it's not IRC custom to prefix people's nicknames with sigils like `@', when messaging or referring to them. simply mention their nickname, e.g. at the beginning of the message, followed e.g. by a comma or a colon, and the message < 1559311887 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok sorry! < 1559311936 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :(many IRC clients hilight a message / alert a user, if their nickname is mentioned, first thing in a message. i think not as many do that, in case the nickname is mentioned somewhere else in a message. though i think most also highlight/alert, on private message ?) < 1559311958 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :(oh .. and `@' already means something else on IRC (namely that the person in question is an operator on the channel)) < 1559311973 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :xylochoron[m] : just fyi :) < 1559312030 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok thanks :-D I am a little embarrassingly new to this so just let me know thanks :-D < 1559312033 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :(perhaps the other old people are ashamed to admit how old they are, on Discord ?) < 1559312051 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes it could be < 1559312073 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :The 13 year olds are happy to speak up though... < 1559312085 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that was partly in jest) < 1559312102 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok! < 1559312126 0 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what discord channel? < 1559312244 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://discordapp.com/invite/say2ERQ?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app < 1559312281 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I can’t believe I’m within several years of 30. It feels so old :\ < 1559312285 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :am I old < 1559312294 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was actually trying to convince some of those guys to switch to matrix with me but not sure how much success I’m having < 1559312304 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :please tell me here are someone over 80 < 1559312347 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've chatted with people on IRC who're at least 70, i think < 1559312363 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah can I please talk to an actual old person lol < 1559312365 0 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least some of them behave like it < 1559312366 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've chatted people in real life who're at least 70 < 1559312377 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cool < 1559312377 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1559312388 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weird < 1559312399 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm I’m chatted with my grandmother :o :o < 1559312416 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps you could chat to two people, whose combined age is at least seventy ) < 1559312418 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :it’s unbelievable^W^W < 1559312424 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1559312432 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski: oh, that could work too < 1559312446 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :have my hon. and learned friend fungot chatted with people who're at least 70? < 1559312447 0 :fungot!~fungot@2a01:4b00:82bb:1341::2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: " had the reviewer's object, in whatever hands, whether high or low prices, whether he chooses to call one two, and eight grinders. its body is covered with an obscurity not to be begged. they must at length have a retreat from the malice of his adversary, by fnord cringing to the public peace. if our liberty has enfeebled the executive power, rendering government in all undertakings for the public necessities, and c < 1559312482 0 :rdococ!rdococ@cheapiesystems.com QUIT :Changing host < 1559312482 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ JOIN :#esoteric < 1559312491 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski: hm, combined ages should indeed make things more bearable… I hope! < 1559312514 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :My grandparents once were talking about how when you’re 60, 50 is so young, when 70 60 is young, 80 70 < 1559312514 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or smthng like that < 1559312539 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway did int-e say that there was a hint? should I presume b ≤ c and try to make something of that?.. < 1559312557 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :xylochoron[m]: makes sense, too, yeah < 1559312558 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps sum is not the appropriate arithmetical (geometrical ?) operation ? < 1559312643 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :as we’ve seen, max is pretty boring, so maybe arithmetic-geometric mean or something < 1559312645 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :> logBase 2 (2 ** 30 + 2 ** 40) < 1559312647 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 40.00140819439281 < 1559312674 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski: hm I think base 2 is unnatural < 1559312675 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :too close to `max', i suppose < 1559312695 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :> log (exp 30 + exp 40) < 1559312697 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 40.00004539889922 < 1559312713 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha it’s even less useful < 1559312717 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that much difference < 1559312719 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :> logBase 1 (1 ** 30 + 1 ** 40) < 1559312722 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : Infinity < 1559312797 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :yesterday I learned P(Z) = Q ∪ {∞}, acted on with usual fractional-linear transformations < 1559312830 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :> [30 ** log 40,40 ** log 30] -- and this is greater than sum < 1559312833 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : [281139.7457691163,281139.74576911645] < 1559312851 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :"fractional-linear" ? < 1559312872 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be that different because Z has so many non-unit elements < 1559312948 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski: I mean, x ↦ (ax + b) / (cx + d) where a, b, c, d ∈ Z < 1559313057 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, reminds be of Möbius transformations < 1559313083 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, they are precisely these transformations of P(C) < 1559313095 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder whether that's related to "linear relations" < 1559313104 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :`P' being powerset ? < 1559313104 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/srv/hackeso-code/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: P': not found < 1559313127 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, P just stands for projectivization < 1559313136 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. ok < 1559313153 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :though usually I’ve seen it come after something, like in RP^n < 1559313158 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was confusing me for a bit < 1559313182 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :(RP^n is P(R^(n+1)) IIRC) < 1559313192 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, I should have foreseen :) < 1559313196 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :aye < 1559313244 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is reminded of musical intervals < 1559313276 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1559313463 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, so the "[m]" is something that the bridge of this "matrix" chat appends? < 1559313494 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably < 1559313499 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that explains a lot, because earlier I've seen a different channel with a lot of users with that in the nick < 1559313512 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :though i think not all people connected via Matrix has that nickname suffix < 1559313547 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could be just a default < 1559313672 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw `\(x,y) -> x ** logBase b y' is commutative < 1559313777 0 :arseniiv!?@? NICK :arseniiv[hm] < 1559313787 0 :arseniiv[hm]!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1559313802 0 :arseniiv[hm]!?@? NICK :arseniiv < 1559313814 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski: http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/diary/february_2019.html#february_16 < 1559313837 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Baez has a diary now ? < 1559313844 0 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :my favourite funfact in that regard was how gdc(fib(x), fib(y)) is supposedly fib(gdc(x, y)) < 1559313869 0 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never proofed it, though < 1559313914 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :fwiw, i was mostly thinking of it, in the context of modular arithmetic (so `logBase b' is the "index", the discrete logarithm, wrt the primitive root `b') < 1559314018 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: that one is true, < 1559314063 0 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: but why < 1559314124 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there's a more general statement that you could conjecture but that's false: namely that for any second order linear recurrence of the form s_0 = 0; s_1 = 1; s_{k+1} = A*s_{k-2}+B*s_{k-1}; you'd get gcd(s_x,s_y)=s_{gcd(x,y)} < 1559314132 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's interesting to find a counterexample to that < 1559314170 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: prove at first that if k divides n then fib(k) divides fib(n), then the converse of that < 1559314185 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :use the recurrence relation directly < 1559314205 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and look at the sequence modulo fib(k) < 1559314254 0 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fib is weird < 1559314273 0 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@105.157.25.67 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559314302 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it's not < 1559314314 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is typical for such second order linear recurrences, < 1559314572 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :including the important case of s_k = 2**k - 1, which is what you get for A=-2, B=3 < 1559314596 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you might already know that if k divides n, then (2**k - 1) divides (2**n - 1) < 1559314602 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: ^ < 1559314881 0 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@105.157.25.67 QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1559314915 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe it's not true in that case? < 1559314917 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember < 1559314938 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the direction that if k divides n then (2**k - 1) divides (2**n - 1) is true, < 1559314943 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just perhaps not the converse < 1559315039 0 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@105.156.255.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559315154 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think both are true for that sequence < 1559315527 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: for my part, I consider number theory an obscure discipline of magic < 1559315946 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distributive_lattice#Characteristic_properties < 1559315976 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also my lemma is to show that the lattice is modular.) < 1559317041 0 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559317225 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559317476 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@24.185.132.57 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1559317736 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: for my part, I consider lattices an obscure discipline of magic. I'm fine with some special cases of course. < 1559317751 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: but the statement I made isn't too deep in number theory of course < 1559317756 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :some parts of number theory are magic, sure < 1559317760 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know those < 1559317776 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that applies to more or less any branch of mathematics < 1559317797 0 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1559317827 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: mhm of course I’m not too deep in lattices, but I don’t consider them magic, it’s just something partially unknown to me, without strange feelings < 1559317928 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: the second one there looks like it seems practical for some subtyping typechecking/inference algorithms < 1559317965 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :In any case, I still don't have a complete paper proof for this. It's kind of annoying. :) < 1559317975 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559318159 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1559319052 0 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@105.156.255.223 QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.4 < 1559319728 0 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey esofolks < 1559319740 0 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are these lattice formulas decidable? < 1559319878 0 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> The classical papers Ph. M. Whitman [1941] and [1942] solved the word problem < 1559319880 0 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for free lattices: Whitman gave an algorithm for determining if two lattice terms < 1559319881 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : error: < 1559319881 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : Data constructor not in scope: The :: t0 -> t1 -> t2 -> b0 -> cerror: Va... < 1559319881 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : • Variable not in scope: papers < 1559319882 0 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(polynomials) were equal in all lattices. < 1559319897 0 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this sounds like a Knuth-Bendix type thing, but for lattices? < 1559319986 0 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@105.156.255.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559320075 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559320105 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Impossible to say without having a closer look. < 1559320164 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Knuth&Bendix' approach can fail even for equationaly theories with a decidable word problem) < 1559320171 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :*equational < 1559320210 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Wikipedia is wrong on this... sigh. < 1559320267 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1559320392 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It claims that Knuth-Bendix completion is a semi-decision procedure, but that's only true for ordered completion, aka unfailing completion, which came quite a bit later... due to Bachmair and Dershowitz I guess?) < 1559320556 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :rain1: it's also worth noting that the decidable word problem has little bearing on the question whether a given equation implies another in the theory of lattices; adding the first equation changes the equational theory, after all. < 1559320589 0 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1559321869 0 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:8c3e:ed2b:9a48:4317 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1559321892 0 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@105.156.255.223 QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.4 < 1559321934 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-56-81.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559322302 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1559322424 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1559322834 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559323062 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1559323559 0 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@105.156.255.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559324177 0 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@105.156.255.223 QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.4 < 1559324325 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-56-81.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1559324686 0 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:b8ef:117a:5cf7:9c27 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559324935 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559324957 0 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:b8ef:117a:5cf7:9c27 QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1559325111 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1559325165 0 :budonyc!~budonyc@c-24-62-204-147.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559326056 0 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:b8ef:117a:5cf7:9c27 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559326406 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559326585 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1559326692 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559326693 0 :ivzem[m]!ivzemmatri@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-udpxjpfvzclvvtkh JOIN :#esoteric < 1559327459 0 :budonyc!~budonyc@c-24-62-204-147.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1559327538 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :xylochoron[m]: if you like the /// esolang, then among the other string-replacement languages https://esolangs.org/wiki/Category:String-rewriting_paradigm , you may want to check out https://esolangs.org/wiki/Fuun_DNA , which is another one where the only way to loop is to copy your source code < 1559327556 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :only in that one, it's much easier to copy, because it can match more freely than just literals < 1559327750 0 :callforjudgement!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559327755 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1559327872 0 :callforjudgement!?@? NICK :ais523 < 1559328338 0 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:b8ef:117a:5cf7:9c27 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1559328563 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559328769 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1559329121 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-56-81.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559329235 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok interesting < 1559329266 0 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpqncsdzlgrwmfly PRIVMSG #esoteric :one thing i like about slashes is that it's TC with only two symbols, but ofc there's esolangs i like that have more than two symbols also :-P < 1559329421 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :one symbol is all you need hth < 1559329675 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, actually < 1559329687 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's another set of such languages, though they also make copying easy: < 1559329738 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/wiki/McCulloch%27s_second_machine counts as string-rewriting, right? < 1559330818 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1559331460 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1559331463 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1559332386 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1559332394 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-56-81.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1559332436 0 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:b8ef:117a:5cf7:9c27 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559332554 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559332728 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1559333318 0 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1559333440 0 :budonyc!~budonyc@c-24-62-204-147.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559334687 0 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559334705 0 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :has anyone built a brainfuck interpreter that can execute /dev/urandom? < 1559334863 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559335108 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1559335595 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything inside the outer brackets has to be saved until that loop is finished, and if you find ] before [ then it won't be valid (but you could use ] to separate the program from the input, perhaps) < 1559335602 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :?messages-loud < 1559335602 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf asked 1d 21h 51m 10s ago: Do you like GF2P8AFFINEQB? < 1559335609 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I don't know < 1559336422 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559336607 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1559336666 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: sorry for my connection < 1559336683 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559336701 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Soni: I'm not sure; you'd have to make the execution start running the program as it read it < 1559336734 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's basically what Easy interpreters do, but they read input and program from the same stream so it isn't the same language as brainfuck (that's why it has a different name) < 1559336753 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd be easy enough to adapt an Easy interpreter to read input and program from different files… < 1559336825 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there any interesting quines that don't look like the classic quine? < 1559336845 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: what counts as looking like the classic quine? < 1559336848 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are lots of quines < 1559336849 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean that they don't have two copies of almost the same string, one quoted and one not, or something, but use some other mechanism. < 1559336880 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: in some languages you can have just one copy of most of your code and recover it < 1559336895 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, like e = '... code here ...'; eval(e) < 1559336916 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, using the language's mechanism for it (or reading the input file) seems a bit uninteresting. < 1559336925 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then there are quines where there are two copies, but the data one is encoded so much that it doesn't look anything like the code < 1559336932 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :not just a few backspaces, but completely encrypted < 1559336951 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and of course the code and data can intermix < 1559336995 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect the answer to my question is no, this is more or less the only way quines can work. < 1559337017 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's all sorts of strange language-dependent stuff like error quines < 1559337049 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: there are two common classes of non-degenerate quines which don't have a large repeated section: eval quines and topological quines < 1559337072 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (a(:^)*S):^ < 1559337072 0 :fungot!~fungot@2a01:4b00:82bb:1341::2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a(:^)*S):^ < 1559337093 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: sorry for my connection < 1559337106 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559337116 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's an eval quine < 1559337119 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are topological quines? < 1559337139 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah nice < 1559337143 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: they're quines in languages like Befunge which make use of parts of the language world which wrap around < 1559337153 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that the "repeated section" only actually appears once in the program < 1559337185 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh, so like the seek DATA,0,0 quines in perl? < 1559337193 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :which read their own source code < 1559337199 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or do those count as eval quines? < 1559337212 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's either a topological quine or just plain cheating, depending on your point of view < 1559337251 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :toplogical quines in Befunge normally start with an unmatched " < 1559337262 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, there are plain cheating ones, such as ones that access a copy of the source code that's outside the source code, such as downloading them from the internet, or reading it from a different file < 1559337272 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which puts the whole program inside the string (because the playfield wraps around, so the " matches itself), but it's /also/ outside the string so it runs after the entire thing has been placed into a string literal < 1559337311 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1559337363 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there may be other quine patterns too, but classic/topological/eval are the three main categories I'm aware of < 1559337394 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also double-literal quines but those probably count as cheating, they abuse a bug in codegolf.stackexchange's definition of a quine < 1559337412 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does double-literal quines mean? < 1559337425 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they ban literal-only quines, but in languages where programs run right to left and literals just echo themselves, you can write the same literal twice < 1559337444 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then each of the literals prints the other, rather than each literal printing itself, so it doesn't count as literal-only < 1559337452 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1559337458 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, a literal-only quine is this sort of thing: < 1559337460 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 123 < 1559337462 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 123 < 1559337466 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not very interesting < 1559337543 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so classic means the quine has some data and some code that prints the data twice, and one of the time it prints it it matches the data, right? and it counts even if the code and data are intermixed, or if the data is encoded in some unrecognizable way? < 1559337599 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what makes it classic is that the code and data parts are mostly disjoint? < 1559337603 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a classic quine is a program as code, + an encoding of that code as data < 1559337630 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the encoding might be weird or whatever but it's still just a separate part of the program < 1559337637 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then from that encoding, you generate both the code and the encoding itself < 1559337693 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally, I tried to come up with a precise definition of a classic quine, but oerjan came up with a silly counterexample where you have /two/ identical data sections, each of which is used to generate the other (so that data is never used to regenerate itself) < 1559337710 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1559337741 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of my quines are classic quines then, though I have some eval quines and even cheating quines < 1559337850 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`perl -e print unpack a35X35a34xaXXaaXaXXa,"print unpack a35X35a34xaXXaaXaXXa,\"\\" < 1559337851 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :print unpack a35X35a34xaXXaaXaXXa,"print unpack a35X35a34xaXXaaXaXXa,\"\\" < 1559337895 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`perl -eprint unpack a43X43a42xaXXaaXaXXa,"`perl -eprint unpack a43X43a42xaXXaaXaXXa,\"\\" < 1559337895 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​`perl -eprint unpack a43X43a42xaXXaaXaXXa,"`perl -eprint unpack a43X43a42xaXXaaXaXXa,\"\\" < 1559337988 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`perl -eprint+("`perl -eprint+(","\"",",","\\",")[g1012131121212133121414=~/./g]")[g1012131121212133121414=~/./g] < 1559337988 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​`perl -eprint+("`perl -eprint+(","\"",",","\\",")[g1012131121212133121414=~/./g]")[g1012131121212133121414=~/./g] < 1559338139 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zfnlgwh4k4ewtw.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1559338855 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559339028 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1559339094 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection timed out < 1559340181 0 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1559340285 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: I just made up the term "classic quine", I don't know what it's called. < 1559340286 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1559340304 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, cross-talk < 1559340305 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean a quine which is generated by Lawvere's theorem or something. < 1559340316 0 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1559340321 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: well, ais523 also used "classic", so that sounds good < 1559340496 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :There isn't even a Wikipedia page for Lawvere's theorem. < 1559340840 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Y combinator is also arguably a quine. < 1559340854 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least it's a special case of diagonalization. < 1559340891 0 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-131.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1559340951 0 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@105.156.255.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559340971 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Y print) is a quine < 1559340988 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, hmm, no < 1559340990 0 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@105.156.255.223 QUIT :Client Quit < 1559340996 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it doesn't print its own source code, but its own /output/ < 1559341007 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1559341056 0 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1559341159 0 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559341268 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lawvere's theorem is: In a CCC, if there's a surjective phi : A -> B^A, then every arrow f : B -> B has a fixed point < 1559341320 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: what's the quantifier on A, \exists or \forall? < 1559341377 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :exists < 1559341427 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-173-73-86-145.washdc.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559341452 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I shouldn't say surjective in a CCC. < 1559341513 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find CCCs really unintuitive because there are two different vaguely function-like things (categorical arrows, and exponentials) < 1559341542 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I find it hard to keep them apart in my head < 1559341543 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you have an evaluation map. < 1559341564 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the idea is that they're similar enough that you don't need to. < 1559341653 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, there are functors as well, those are also vaguely function-like < 1559341677 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :And natural transformations! < 1559341682 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1559341693 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm one of the few people who always specifies everything involved in a natural transformation, rather than eliding < 1559341708 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because a) people get really sloppy when discussing them, and b) I find myself hopelessly confused without doing that < 1559341715 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like whiskering notation for natural transformations? < 1559341729 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used to think it was a bad shorthand but after a while I decided it was brilliant. < 1559341753 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :page 49 of my thesis shows the notation that I use < 1559341758 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what the whiskering notation is < 1559341761 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whiskering is composing natural transformations and functors, as in Fε or εF < 1559341807 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which means respectively: (Fε)_x = F(ε_x) and (εF)_x = ε_{Fx} < 1559341828 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes sense for /natural/ transformations, doesn't it? < 1559341845 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's much the same thing as omitting parens when you have a string of associative operatoins < 1559341884 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`smlist 501 < 1559341885 0 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :smlist 501: shachaf monqy elliott mnoqy Cale < 1559341886 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree that it makes sense. < 1559341899 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems like a disaster on unnatural transformations, but people don't study those much < 1559341906 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm looking for your thesis now to find page 49. < 1559341917 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are the things people normally elide? < 1559341935 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the functors, normally < 1559341952 0 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@136.169.205.133 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559341956 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like the definition of a natural transformation as a functor : CxI -> D? < 1559341966 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the source category, but I can forgive eliding that < 1559341969 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where I the the category with two objects and three arrows, one between the two objects. < 1559341986 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that definition seems horrible :-D < 1559341991 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doens't necessarily mean I don't like it < 1559342004 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like the one-sorted definition of a category? < 1559342008 0 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:995f:fb71:b9c7:d768:2a:c389 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's nice from the perspective that it looks a whole lot like the traditional definition of a homotopy < 1559342024 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's where you only define the arrows, and leave the objects implicit. < 1559342034 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can also define one-sorted functors and one-sorted natural transformations. < 1559342045 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably an object is somehow identified with its identity arrow? < 1559342067 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1559342081 0 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:995f:fb71:b9c7:d768:2a:c389 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the objects are good for the sake of understanding < 1559342086 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :In this definition, a natural transformation : F -> G : C -> D gives an arrow in D for every arrow in C. < 1559342092 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rather than merely for objects in C. < 1559342111 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.5.188.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1559342118 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The identity arrows correpond to the usual components of a natural transformation. The non-identity arrows correspond to diagonals of the naturality square. < 1559342222 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, Lawvere's theorem says that the fixed point of f is, in pseudo-lambda calculus notation: (\x. f(phi(x)(x))) (\x. f(phi(x)(x))) < 1559342251 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is obviously just Y. < 1559342291 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you get Cantor's theorem and other diagonalization arguments from this as well. < 1559342344 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :phi is the isomorphism between B and B^B that you use to talk about the untyped lambda calculus as a CCC. < 1559342376 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You can also define it in Haskell, newtype Rec a = Rec (Rec a -> a), which lets you define Y.) < 1559343048 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I see your notation now. It's very explicit. < 1559343158 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1559343316 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1559344042 0 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1559344045 0 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-etsislqlhatruona QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1559344170 0 :budonyc!~budonyc@c-24-62-204-147.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1559344288 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: sorry for my connection < 1559344300 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559344454 0 :arseniiv_!?@? NICK :arseniiv < 1559344798 0 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.205.133 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1559345065 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like my variation of Along and Across? Now there is output (a single number), and you can use numbers as inputs of the along program rather than bits. < 1559345217 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: well, Along and Across was designed for a very specific purpose (to attempt to work out if a specific definition of Turing-completeness was reasonable), your version doesn't achieve the same goals I had but might achiieve different goals < 1559345223 0 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1559345285 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that said, the difference in the along program inputs might not be relevant, although it isn't obvious < 1559345323 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It depends what along language is in use < 1559345346 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I should think the output doesn't change the Turing-completeness. < 1559345497 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, the output is irrelevant for TCness < 1559345756 0 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you make a program that just does whatever it wants < 1559345775 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/wiki/Baby_Language ? < 1559345874 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1559345881 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Did you write https://www.realworldtech.com/forum/?threadid=150494&curpostid=169010 ? < 1559346055 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98439.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1559346819 0 :Phantom___Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1559346925 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I think so. < 1559347040 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1559347043 0 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not really. more like, glue random things together and see what happens < 1559347094 0 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we ever figure out how life started, that'll probably help us figure out how to bring it to computers < 1559347115 0 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but we have no idea how life works < 1559347129 0 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we can simulate all the chemistry and physics involved and it's all very expensive < 1559347143 0 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but understanding how it actually works is something else entirely