00:02:52 -!- LKoen has quit (Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”). 00:10:36 -!- imode1 has quit (Quit: WeeChat 2.1). 00:10:54 -!- imode has joined. 00:57:35 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 02:40:23 [[TPPL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55581&oldid=55562 * Saka * (+140) /* Instructions */SPIN 03:12:56 -!- variable has joined. 03:39:22 -!- Naergon has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 04:10:00 -!- doesthiswork has quit (Quit: Leaving.). 04:16:13 I'm having a crisis. 04:44:00 -!- Naergon has joined. 04:51:35 so I've been going through some automata theory recently, trying to soak up all I can from a bunch of resources, and looking into odd automata. 04:51:51 2-stack PDAs, queue automata, storage modification machines, the works. 04:52:36 something I've been frustrated at is that nobody seems to be doing anything "practical" with these machines outside of simulating a TM tape. 04:53:20 so for something like a queue automata, I don't know what an addition algorithm for two binary numbers looks like using purely the queue, but I know what the translated-from-a-TM version looks like with a marker to mark the end of the tape. 04:54:45 why in the world did you bother then? sure, you showed that these models are TC, but is the end goal of using these models to just simulate a TM tape, plop down the equivalent transitions and call it a day? 04:55:50 are turing machines really the simplest universal automata that can be devised? every other model just seems to target them! 04:56:01 apart from register machines and counter machines and such. 04:56:23 just seems like if you go any lower you hit a point where you have to abstract upwards to a TM and its tape. 04:57:51 I guess you could argue there are varying forms of complexity (in terms of step counts and such for simple operations) but if you're abstracting upwards you're always going to be slower than a TM! 05:05:29 [[TPPL]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55582&oldid=55581 * Saka * (+12) bold 05:05:40 I just really wonder if there's a point of finding smaller and smaller models of computation if we're just going to do all of our work by simulating a TM. 05:10:47 -!- doesthiswork has joined. 05:25:14 -!- imode1 has joined. 05:27:17 -!- imode has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 05:33:26 [[Between]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55583 * Saka * (+2430) New 05:33:53 [[User:Saka]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55584&oldid=55568 * Saka * (+14) 06:31:45 -!- imode2 has joined. 06:35:05 -!- imode1 has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 06:40:27 -!- imode2 has quit (Quit: WeeChat 2.1). 06:40:46 -!- imode has joined. 06:52:01 -!- variable has quit (Quit: /dev/null is full). 07:03:16 -!- doesthiswork has quit (Quit: Leaving.). 07:19:16 -!- joast has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 07:25:25 -!- imode has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 07:51:50 -!- arseniiv has joined. 08:07:36 -!- myname has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 08:19:22 -!- myname has joined. 09:07:58 -!- sftp has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 09:08:50 -!- sftp has joined. 09:25:11 [[Talk:Between]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55585 * Plokmijnuhby * (+246) Created page with "Your truth machine suggests i inputs an integer. Is this correct, and if so is there any way to change it to string? Also is there any way to take the nth character of a strin..." 09:25:56 -!- nobody_ has joined. 09:26:02 hi 09:26:16 -!- nobody_ has quit (Client Quit). 09:27:12 [[Talk:Between]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55586&oldid=55585 * Plokmijnuhby * (+91) 10:14:15 -!- xkapastel has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 11:39:46 [[Between]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55587&oldid=55583 * Saka * (+4) /* Truth Machine */ fix 11:40:35 [[Talk:Between]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55588&oldid=55586 * Saka * (+235) 11:44:35 [[Between]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55589&oldid=55587 * Saka * (+120) /* Operations */ C 11:49:30 -!- APic has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 11:49:42 [[Talk:TPPL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55590&oldid=55521 * Saka * (+141) 12:06:54 -!- SopaXorzTaker has joined. 12:23:44 -!- APic has joined. 12:35:35 -!- SopaXorzTaker has quit (Quit: Leaving). 12:46:09 -!- joast has joined. 13:00:33 -!- doesthiswork has joined. 13:09:52 [[Talk:Between]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55591&oldid=55588 * Plokmijnuhby * (+448) 13:22:44 [[Talk:Between]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55592&oldid=55591 * Saka * (+170) 13:51:04 [[Talk:Between]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55593&oldid=55592 * Saka * (+69) forgot sig 13:52:24 [[TPPL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55594&oldid=55582 * Saka * (+127) /* Instructions */ COPY 14:58:32 -!- moony has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 15:00:05 -!- ATMunn has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 15:00:12 -!- Bowserinator has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 15:00:32 -!- xkapastel has joined. 15:07:21 Vorpal: hm I even boldly suggest CADD have 5 arguments, #−1, #0, #1, #2, #3, all #−1..#1 should be nonzero to make addition <-- huh? 15:08:35 oh, we couldn’t switch on/off _any_ code, could you add another argument to CADD, so that it will be <-- hm, can't you switch off a variable currently? Setting it to zero? 15:08:43 -!- ATMunn has joined. 15:08:50 -!- Bowserinator has joined. 15:08:57 -!- moony has joined. 15:09:10 @messageds 15:09:11 @messages 15:09:12 You don't have any messages 15:09:26 -!- variable has joined. 15:10:41 @tell arseniiv okay will look at that tomorrow, busy this evening. But CHLT shouldn't be needed, You could define halting as when no instruction was executed during the last iteration. At that point it is obvious nothing more can happen 15:10:42 Consider it noted. 15:30:40 -!- idris-bot has quit (Quit: Terminated). 15:31:40 -!- Melvar has quit (Quit: thunderstorm). 15:33:34 -!- moony has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 15:48:38 -!- moony has joined. 15:49:29 hm, can't you switch off a variable currently? Setting it to zero?> can and do in gist linked, but it’s not enough (I suppose) 15:53:10 t could be it’s just my faulty implementation idea, but I couldn’t think of something else 15:53:57 Vorpal: ^ 16:14:39 -!- Naergon has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 16:18:57 -!- moony has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 16:24:35 -!- moony has joined. 16:47:03 -!- myname has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 16:47:09 -!- myname has joined. 16:58:09 -!- moony has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 16:59:27 -!- ATMunn has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 17:00:05 -!- Bowserinator has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 17:07:04 -!- Melvar has joined. 17:10:32 -!- Bowserinator has joined. 17:10:45 -!- ATMunn has joined. 17:10:58 -!- moony has joined. 17:21:25 -!- zzo38 has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 17:32:11 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 17:49:44 . o O ( The next 500 markup languages. ) 17:57:57 -!- ATMunn has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 18:03:27 -!- ATMunn has joined. 18:13:00 -!- moonythedwarf has joined. 18:13:51 -!- ATMunn has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 18:16:20 -!- moonythedwarf has quit (Client Quit). 18:19:34 -!- ATMunn has joined. 18:21:34 -!- imode has joined. 18:53:07 -!- imode has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 19:00:32 arseniiv: fair enough, okay 19:00:40 will have to look in it further tomorrow 19:00:53 -!- imode has joined. 20:12:56 -!- erkin has joined. 20:23:52 -!- imode has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 20:25:46 -!- imode has joined. 20:42:02 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 20:43:06 -!- Naergon has joined. 20:56:55 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 21:00:34 -!- uplime has changed nick to nchambers. 21:14:49 -!- arseniiv has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 21:24:28 -!- imode1 has joined. 21:27:21 -!- imode has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 21:35:53 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 21:41:42 -!- idris-bot has joined. 21:43:38 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 21:43:39 -!- erkin has quit (Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...). 22:03:57 -!- pikhq has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 22:04:52 -!- pikhq has joined. 22:33:29 -!- imode1 has quit (Quit: WeeChat 2.1). 22:33:44 -!- imode has joined. 23:43:15 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer).