< 1527811214 13846 :iconmaster_!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:9ded:4732:55c1:d3d6 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1527811419 197077 :friendlyGoat!~Jonah@50.105.198.143 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1527811436 423133 :rodgort!~rodgort@68.ip-149-56-14.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1527811698 374792 :rodgort!~rodgort@68.ip-149-56-14.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1527811808 417382 :wob_jonas!b03f1937@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.55 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527811847 942474 :wob_jonas!b03f1937@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.55 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I can't reproduce what you did. If I export to pdf from scribus, it seems it insists on recompressing the jpeg images, rather then embedding them as is. < 1527811870 239024 :wob_jonas!b03f1937@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.55 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: how exactly did you do that? < 1527811873 772321 :wob_jonas!b03f1937@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.55 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there some magic setting? < 1527811927 465578 :wob_jonas!b03f1937@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.55 QUIT :Client Quit < 1527812325 288637 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527814140 267816 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell wob_jonas I don't think I did anything special. But it seems to (unfortunately) have something to do with the image: I did it for two random .jpg files, and one gets embedded as-is but the other is re-encoded. < 1527814140 401379 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1527814392 114754 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell wob_jonas I'm not sure what the crucial difference between the images might be. The re-encoded file has an embedded color profile while the embedded one doesn't, in case that matters. < 1527814392 191096 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1527814770 760827 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell wob_jonas I don't think that's the reason, though, because removing all metadata (which does get rid of the color profile; at least Gimp no longer does the conversion prompt) doesn't help. It gets still stored re-encoded, actually as PPM unless I explicitly request JPEG (and if I do, it's re-JPEG'd). < 1527814770 880402 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1527815174 955252 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell wob_jonas The non-working file is also a progressive JPEG (ImageMagick's "identify -verbose" reports "Interlace: JPEG"), while the working/embedded one is non-progressive ("Interlace: None"), in case *that* makes a difference. < 1527815175 55752 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1527815291 917448 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell wob_jonas That seems to be it (at least for my pair of images): if I use 'convert' to re-encode it as a non-progressive JPEG file, that does get embedded as-is by Scribus. < 1527815292 15753 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1527815408 681342 :iconmaster__!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:447b:674d:9782:7b62 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1527815501 634291 :user24!~void@p200300886900E100796685AC3938AA46.dip0.t-ipconnect.de QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1527815709 375127 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell wob_jonas FWIW, some earlier PS/PDF spec versions seem to have supported baseline (non-progressive) JPEG only, though since PDF 1.3 progressive files should be supported. There might be some other limitations on JPEG images in PDF as well that are relevant in your case. < 1527815709 467054 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1527815848 984951 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell wob_jonas If it *is* the same reason for you, jpegtran can do a lossless conversion from progressive to baseline (just call it on the file without the "-progressive" switch), and that was also enough to make my file get embedded as-is. < 1527815849 66865 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1527815891 111692 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I hope that's not too many messages.) < 1527816166 504457 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i recall lambdabot used to just lose them if there were too many, but vaguely think that was fixed. < 1527820338 220595 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a new favorite consonant. Labialised m < 1527821711 322303 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :wut < 1527821791 507384 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1527822033 762753 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently that does exist. < 1527822291 660895 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there any phonemes that technically exist but no langauge uses them? < 1527822309 45399 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that can be made via the normal methods, that is < 1527822608 173148 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, they're documented in fact. < 1527822632 804380 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :They appear (almost exclusively) in speech impediments or cases of glossolalia. < 1527822649 834354 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What kind of phonemes are only possible for monster with multiple mouths? < 1527822664 364706 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's an IPA extension describing them. In fact there's a symbol for speaking like Donald Duck. < 1527822814 967481 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes I don't know of any languages that use buccal speach < 1527822818 593977 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1527822890 865002 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voice_Quality_Symbols https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ExtIPA < 1527822930 711498 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1527822933 427501 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool! < 1527823586 895842 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying... < 1527824685 643635 :aloril!~aloril@80.246.146.6 QUIT :*.net *.split < 1527824685 883303 :Hoolootwo!Hooloovoo@hooloovoo.blue QUIT :*.net *.split < 1527824686 409956 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal QUIT :*.net *.split < 1527824686 555019 :dingbat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ufqtoovthumzppgu QUIT :*.net *.split < 1527824687 17044 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia QUIT :*.net *.split < 1527824847 725392 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1527824872 197579 :dingbat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kpmvjgpmdsqypxde JOIN :#esoteric < 1527824976 514238 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1527826241 97160 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also think 24 characters maximum password length is too short. The minimum should be four and the maximum should at least one hundred, preferably more. All bytes other than null bytes should be allowed in the password. < 1527827105 7564 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you know that? You can use bsdtar to read truncated ZIP archives; 7-Zip cannot read truncated ZIP archives, but bsdtar can. I learned that a week ago, so that is good in case I need to load a truncated ZIP archive in my computer. < 1527828410 858925 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-002-203-000-049.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Quit: thunderstorm < 1527828481 143390 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah, because libarchive reads from the start, and thus has some minorly quirky behavior with ZIP files. < 1527828837 486253 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :that will come in handy the next time that you'll have to deal with a damaged tape drive < 1527829222 774928 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, you never know. < 1527829344 394933 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit < 1527829666 217035 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good lord, is the Spaceworld '97 demo of Pokemon Gold weird in spots. < 1527829757 149793 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, there's a Ditto evolution and it's freaking disturbing. < 1527829795 592610 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, wrong channel. < 1527829799 120458 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though *shrug* < 1527829804 128606 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :My brother mentioned it earlier today. < 1527829904 324973 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :in freefall, dvorak may have to learn some boundaries, quickly. < 1527829920 505376 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You say that, but it's Dvorak. < 1527829956 70724 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless he wants to be forcefully thrown out of the house... < 1527830037 479993 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which you know will happen and he will just be confused about it. :P < 1527830056 239729 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :...point. < 1527830582 555421 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, somewhere in the foglio family there must be a pair of bickering siblings that gil and tarvek are patterned after. < 1527831632 402936 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric < 1527835242 17836 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1527835465 567993 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-uyiniflljyfmgcxp QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1527835946 184680 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1527836025 464917 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric < 1527836808 211509 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1527836934 331492 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1527838465 254130 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1527839246 770383 :aloril!~aloril@80.246.146.6 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527839246 770443 :Hoolootwo!Hooloovoo@hooloovoo.blue JOIN :#esoteric < 1527839246 847051 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal JOIN :#esoteric < 1527839246 847100 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia JOIN :#esoteric < 1527839606 29350 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1527840542 318898 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527840583 982555 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh! So maybe I have to change the PDF version in the export dialog. < 1527840632 130709 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't like to embed non-progressive jpegs, because those would increase the file size. < 1527840680 387473 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks for the hint, I'll experiment with this. < 1527840798 927523 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :" What kind of phonemes are only possible for monster with multiple mouths?" => https://stickman.qntm.org/comics.php?n=178 mentions something that the protagonists can't say because they don't have a second tongue < 1527841146 581961 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :" I have a new favorite consonant. Labialised m" => wtf < 1527841213 578687 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm still hoping to find a labialized w < 1527841836 234989 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1527841920 222484 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1527844407 495586 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: I tried all the PDF versions supported by my version of Scribus (1.3, 1.4, 1.5), but couldn't make it embed a progressive JPEG. It might be a limitation in the software. I don't think it's generally that big a size difference, though. (At least my test image only goes from 87902 bytes to 88946 with "jpegtran -optimize progressive.jpg >baseline.jpg".) < 1527844477 120986 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yes, but this is for large resolution high quality images of which I've already reduced the size < 1527844500 271079 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the total size of images is like 260 megabytes or something, so the size difference matters < 1527844520 842680 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll have to look at some other software though, it's possible that pdftex can help here < 1527844749 374110 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite < 1527844790 431428 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the layout you need is really simple, it might also be possible just to handcraft a .ps program (the jpeg files would just go in as-is as the image data, with filter /DCTDecode) and try any of the N tools that do PS-to-PDF conversion. < 1527844833 183720 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In theory you could even export the postscript from somewhere and just replace the images in it.) < 1527844834 905861 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yes, that's also possible < 1527844863 767906 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the layout is simple, except for three pages where I'm putting text, but I can make those text with a separate tool and export to ps and slice them together < 1527844872 753055 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, four pages where I'm putting text actually < 1527844901 835743 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ideally the table of contents page should have links to other pages, and a nice pdf table of contents, and I think pdftex can help there < 1527844910 119726 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or I can try libreoffice or ms office, maybe they can do this < 1527844962 984260 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the layout is basically just one image per page, with a variable but precise amount of white space on their four corners, that is. all pages are the same size, but I need the images placed exactly at the right spot. < 1527844978 244900 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/corners/sizes/ < 1527847032 350453 :iconmaster__!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:c806:d21b:959:3d1c JOIN :#esoteric < 1527847533 323764 :iconmaster_!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:f49a:5519:9cab:a6cf JOIN :#esoteric < 1527847740 343775 :iconmaster__!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:c806:d21b:959:3d1c QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1527848687 284284 :mniip!mniip@freenode/staff/mniip QUIT :Ping timeout: 600 seconds < 1527848982 445973 :mniip!mniip@freenode/staff/mniip JOIN :#esoteric < 1527850661 506783 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving. > 1527851596 325966 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03MostlyHarmless 5* 10New user account > 1527852006 262681 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55490&oldid=55483 5* 03MostlyHarmless 5* (+194) 10/* Introductions */ < 1527852465 341424 :iconmaster_!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:f49a:5519:9cab:a6cf QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1527852796 12436 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1527853328 481872 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1527855348 416393 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-002-203-000-049.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1527857303 12213 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527857996 498703 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but... this worked just a few hours ago. and I changed nothing, except for most of the code. < 1527857997 644322 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1527860309 534100 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-geuaxmdnwmgquose JOIN :#esoteric < 1527861231 154121 :MDead!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1527861311 684071 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1527861316 398212 :MDead!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDude < 1527861615 204405 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1527866268 967227 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: Found 1 in /dev/zero < 1527867073 437727 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1527871502 432023 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@185.131.67.118 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527871584 764926 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1527871594 705847 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1527871847 338602 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@185.131.67.118 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1527874570 222071 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1527875485 893402 :plokmijnuhby!4e93f0eb@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.147.240.235 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527876468 900630 :plokmijnuhby!4e93f0eb@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.147.240.235 QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1527877559 316660 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1527878749 239876 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@2a02:c7d:485a:3300:fb8b:fb15:c1d3:a33a JOIN :#esoteric < 1527878749 315275 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@2a02:c7d:485a:3300:fb8b:fb15:c1d3:a33a QUIT :Changing host < 1527878749 315350 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1527880069 321335 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527880081 353489 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi all < 1527880117 342811 :MDead!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1527880167 355199 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd like to ask about a certain computational model that has both real-world and esoteric uses. I don't have any specific questions except what its name is, but I'd like any general information. < 1527880235 894990 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1527880242 849765 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1527880252 605428 :MDead!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDude < 1527880324 985417 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not know how to answer if you do not give specific questions or at least to mention what kind of computational model it is. < 1527880387 641511 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The basic idea is that you have a computer with both a cpu+ram and a disk (which could be magnetic or solid state), but the computer could lose power at any moment unexpectedly, after which all the data in the ram and cpu is lost, and the program counter and other important registers are reset to some clean state from which you can boot easily. < 1527880475 408775 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The disk is non-volatile, but the sector you were writing at the moment when the power got lost can be corrupted, such that it will read with arbitrary contents and you can't directly tell that it is corrupt. (This is sort of a worst case model, a malicious corruption.) < 1527880552 217133 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the simple case, you have just one machine like this, and you write software for this. There is a well-known way how you can do reliable operations on this, with cow and a one-bit transaction boolean choosing between two roots, but there are nontrivial costs so optimizing for this model can be interesting. < 1527880617 475861 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :In more practical but harder to define real world cases, you have multiple computers each of which can lose power independently, and you want them to communicate with each other and solve tasks reliably, which is the difficult model that banks have to solve on their backend mainframes. < 1527880829 621760 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was also thinking of a related computing model, in which you only have a RAM and cpu, the cpu has very few registers, the RAM is written one word or one byte at a time, but at least writing a word is atomic, and the program counter could be reset to the entry point of the program at any time between any two memory writes. < 1527880926 46017 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously in all cases you need a little bit of progress guarantee, namely that at least sometimes the program gets ran for some nontrivial time, like for a day in the first case or 100000 instructions in the second case, but you still can't tell in advance when that will happen, because sometimes the program will get reset very early. < 1527881055 961164 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi zzo38 < 1527881092 385396 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1527881373 179643 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello < 1527881605 373263 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1527881917 312620 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: "the cpu has very few registers" - do you intend those to be preserved when the CPU resets? (otherwise I don't quite see how this is relevant) < 1527881954 441945 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe I do see < 1527881964 660828 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: the program counter definitely have to be reset. for the rest of the registers, it doesn't matter, you can just imagine they're memory-mapped registers and that's why they're preserved. < 1527881982 48523 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean you can't just do some big processing in the registers and commit with a few writes < 1527881986 646519 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1527882083 642596 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, this is easy to program for in principle (make a virtual machine with idempotent operations; update the virtual program counter last when emulating an instruction), and probably hard to optimize. < 1527882090 778385 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you can also have a cpu that has no registers apart from the program counter, except for internal ones used within an instruction, and the single memory write happens at the end of the instruction, and the internal registers are forgotten at that point anyway, in which case you can't observe whether they're preserved at the reset or not. < 1527882118 866729 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: yes, exactly, easy to program in principle but annoying in practice < 1527882286 393002 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well I would've expected the whole CPU state to be reset. (There are hot-pluggable CPUs, right? Though I suppose that in reality you'll want to shut down the chip in an orderly fashion, power down the socket, then change the CPU and then boot the new one up. But I don't know.) < 1527882318 292556 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: you can choose the whole cpu to be reset too, sure < 1527882344 10396 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm thinking more of a software emulation of this rather than an actual cpu < 1527882448 611982 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1527882477 712225 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1527882974 355484 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1527886950 711895 :iconmaster_!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:f49a:5519:9cab:a6cf JOIN :#esoteric < 1527888354 32492 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1527890949 980429 :choochter!choochter@nat/ibm/x-bewquklotngnzadc QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1527890975 333351 :choochter!choochter@nat/ibm/x-zzvopyntvtiamrde JOIN :#esoteric < 1527891142 682494 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1527891979 272752 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: nostril. < 1527891979 621965 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: ( ( go fishing yeah)) the one that's at home now i've got grandkids of about a month < 1527892003 108723 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? nostril < 1527892004 344651 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nostril is a common Québécois greeting. < 1527892005 399443 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: no fishing, I'm staying inside with AC. < 1527892005 535241 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: ( ( it's back at)) < 1527892020 961835 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wellob_jonas! < 1527892028 13138 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`dowg nostril < 1527892029 753143 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :11569:2018-05-29 learn Nostril is a common Qu\xc3\xa9b\xc3\xa9cois greeting. < 1527892030 412936 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloily < 1527892120 22843 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@metar CYUL < 1527892120 628687 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :CYUL 012200Z 28008KT 15SM FEW025TCU FEW035 SCT150 OVC160 28/21 A2968 RMK TCU1CU1AC2AS5 TCU TR SLP053 DENSITY ALT 2000FT < 1527893825 519137 :wob_jonas!b03f18d7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.215 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1527895853 567609 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1527895914 439270 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric > 1527896255 141061 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Micro14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55491&oldid=52156 5* 03Raddish0 5* (+199) 10I added a link to the completely new specification for Micro Version 2 > 1527896428 510427 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Raddish014]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55492&oldid=52093 5* 03Raddish0 5* (+14) 10I am now 14 (way back in December, but I'm lazy)