< 1503795503 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloerjan < 1503795551 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloony < 1503795643 0 :^arcade_droid!~arcade_dr@unaffiliated/arcade-droid/x-4286778 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503796668 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503798859 0 :^arcade_droid!?@? NICK :use_strategy_lol < 1503798865 0 :use_strategy_lol!?@? NICK :^arcade_droid < 1503798949 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`5 w < 1503798954 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/2:xyzzy//Nothing happens. \ bitcoin//bitcoins are coins that have been drilled through with a bit, and can be strung together in long chains. This practice dates to ancient China, and the Chinese remain experts in bitcoin manufacturing. A chain can support up to 21 million coins before breaking. \ bride theory//Bride theory is a theory involving < 1503798955 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`n < 1503798956 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2/2:a headhunter who dresses in yellow. \ tarafurnar//Tarafurnar is the event after which you'll be seen. \ acab//ACAB is short for "all codecs are broken". < 1503798999 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`cwlprits bitcoin < 1503799007 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafët < 1503799019 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does a chain really break once it reaches 21 million coins? < 1503799043 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :all cows are bovine < 1503799215 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :all chicken are boily. < 1503799248 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: chicken of the woods is the best chicken hth < 1503799253 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm still convinced that bitcoin is part scam, part money laundering. < 1503799294 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloochaf. next time I'm in the vicinity of the Mycoboutique, I'll buy some. < 1503799310 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that your fancy french name for the woods < 1503799313 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :imo just go to the woods hth < 1503799319 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PART #esoteric :""leave me alone"" < 1503799324 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ JOIN :#esoteric < 1503799326 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm far from woods... < 1503799363 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there is http://www.mycoboutique.com/fr/ . < 1503799575 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503799846 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503800271 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1503801765 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: PILOT CHICKEN < 1503802901 0 :ATMunn!~ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn26 QUIT :Quit: See ya! o/ < 1503805488 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does "Turing-compIete" mean (as opposed to "Turing-complete")? < 1503805659 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode I < 1503805661 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+0049 LATIN CAPITAL LETTER I] < 1503805662 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1503805694 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: thanks, those looked so similar in my browser font that i didn't notice there _was_ a difference < 1503805700 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which is probably the point) < 1503805716 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Browser font? < 1503805719 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or possibly the mediawiki font < 1503805740 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: https://esolangs.org/wiki/Jeeves < 1503805798 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see. < 1503805852 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :itym Why, good Dr. Oerjan, they do in fact look similar! hth < 1503805862 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or evil, if you prefer that.) < 1503805865 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dr. Oerjan? < 1503805871 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought Ørjan was the doctor? < 1503805877 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? ørjan < 1503805878 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your pal Ørjan is oerjan's good twin. He's banned in the IRC RFC for being an invalid character. Sometimes he publishes papers without noticing it. < 1503805897 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` grWp -l twin < 1503805911 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​* \ ☾_ \ c# \ myname \ orin \ örjan \ ørjan \ pico \ sewerjan \ twint-e \ typoerjan \ אrjan < 1503805943 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes certain people in this channel take things a bit too far. < 1503805968 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're all doctors, except sewerjan who couldn't afford the student fee < 1503805990 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? sewerjan < 1503805992 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sewerjan is oerjan's extremely poor twin. < 1503806014 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you didn't say "we're all doctors" < 1503806025 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? örjan < 1503806027 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​Örjan is the diæresed twin. He will punctuate your vöẅëls, and maybe a few other unsuspecting letters. < 1503806034 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? typoerjan < 1503806035 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :typoerjan is oerjan's clumsy twin. < 1503806091 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503806122 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`dowg sewerjan < 1503806132 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :10333:2017-02-22 learn sewerjan is oerjan\'s extremely poor twin. < 1503806143 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`learn boorjan is oerjan's uneducated twin. < 1503806146 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned 'boorjan': boorjan is oerjan's uneducated twin. < 1503806326 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503806381 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`5 w < 1503806387 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/2:amiga//Amiga is Spanish for a female friend. \ pirate//Pirates are humourously nautical persons. Their grammar is friendly and plural. \ apt-get//apt-get installs whatever you wanted, plus whatever Mark Shuttleworth wanted. \ zork//Zork is like York, except for the first letter. Uaneb invented it. \ lie bracket//Politicians try to stay within t < 1503806391 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`n < 1503806392 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2/2:he lie bracket: Not so many lies that voters cannot stand it, but not so few that they think you have nothing to give them. < 1503808497 0 :hppavilion[1]!~dosgmowdo@93-231-58-66.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503808791 0 :fuzzybunny44!~HP_DC7900@67-42-233-79.ptld.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503809471 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503809743 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1503812164 0 :fuzzybunny44!~HP_DC7900@67-42-233-79.ptld.qwest.net PART #esoteric : < 1503812551 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite < 1503812574 0 :sleffy!~sleffy@c-24-7-67-0.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503812719 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503812975 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503815391 0 :PinealGlandOptic!~PinealGla@82.144.205.57 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503818208 0 :atslash!~atslash@broadband-46-188-0-82.2com.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503818515 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503818523 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wgrep -i hz < 1503818523 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: wgrep: not found < 1503818542 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` grep -Ri hz wisdom < 1503818543 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wisdom/sbus:SBus is the standard bus in many a Sun SPARC-based system, capable of coping with thirty-two (32) bits in parallel, at rates of around 16.67 to 25 MHz. There is a 96-pin connector, and the cards lay parallel to the motherboard, like toppings on a sandwich. \ wisdom/2600:2600 Hz is a tone made by Captain Crunch's whistle. \ wisdom/john:J < 1503818555 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`2 ``` grep -Ri hz wisdom < 1503818556 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2/1: < 1503818573 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`1 ``` grep -Ri hz wisdom < 1503818574 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/1:/hackenv/bin/`: eval: line 5: unexpected EOF while looking for matching ``' \ /hackenv/bin/`: eval: line 6: syntax error: unexpected end of file < 1503818586 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1503818599 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` grep -Ri hz wisdom | tail -n+3 < 1503818600 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wisdom/john:John is not Hziulquoigmnzhah of Cykranosh, the dread spawn of Cxaxukluth, according to http://smbc-comics.com/index.php?id=4072 < 1503818710 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least not that John. < 1503818717 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently that name wasn't even invented by SMBC. I thought it was. < 1503818755 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I guess "john" has a double meaning that I didn't intend there. < 1503819202 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503819221 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503819237 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503819436 0 :atslash!~atslash@broadband-46-188-0-82.2com.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503819443 0 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1503819892 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1503820590 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503820631 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :M:tG stuff: http://www.manaleak.com/mtguk/2017/06/unstable-magic-the-gathering-spoilers-news-updates/ spoilers for the upcoming Unstable unset. < 1503820872 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I expected they'd do more reprints from black-bordered world, but no, only one aside from basic lands. < 1503821002 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and why is the green-white faction green-white too) < 1503821214 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, apparently that set still uses the fractions from unhinged < 1503821580 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fractions *are* broken numbers after all < 1503821643 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know this puzzle: I think of a polynomial of any degree with natural coefficients. How many points do you need me to evaluate it at to figure out what it is? < 1503821692 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: that one is easy, but I recall there was some twisted harder version < 1503821715 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's easy. What's the harder version? < 1503821742 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember < 1503821750 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, easy? < 1503821787 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the solution is straightforward. < 1503821791 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the easy, but impossible, version uses integer coefficients) < 1503821819 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You mean it's easy because the answer is "it's impossible"? < 1503821826 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1503821834 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure. < 1503821837 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: no < 1503821846 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but here the coefficients are natural numbers < 1503821848 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was talking to int-e. < 1503821851 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :which makes this possible < 1503821858 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't make a difference < 1503821868 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :still possible with integer coefficients < 1503821877 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, it is? < 1503821887 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the degree is unknown, isn't it < 1503821888 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That seems suspicious to me. < 1503821893 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, degree is unknown < 1503821894 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, the degree is unknown < 1503821908 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it's impossible with integer coefficients < 1503821928 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no way < 1503821942 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just need to pick your favorite transcendent real number and evaluate it there < 1503821947 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1503821952 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that uniquely designates the polynomial < 1503821968 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the result that is < 1503821983 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway I want to think a bit < 1503821990 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I was thinking that the polynomial is evaluated at integer points as well. < 1503822010 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it is? that was the harder version, yes < 1503822022 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in that case, two points for natural coeffs and impossible for integer coeffs I believe < 1503822050 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I was also assuming that. Using a transcendental number makes it... ugly.) < 1503822093 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I was thinking it but didn't specify it. < 1503822180 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes, 2 is enough < 1503822231 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe specifying that I had a computable algorithm in mind is enough. < 1503822635 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it enough? < 1503822671 0 :sleffy!~sleffy@c-24-7-67-0.hsd1.ca.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1503822727 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know; I suspect that if you input something like sum 1/2^2^k then the answer will include all the information one needs. < 1503823503 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact any computable transcendental number greater than 1 will work. The point is that if you use a number greater than 1, then the integer part of the result gives you an upper bound on the coefficients and the degree, so that when you reach the fractions, only finitely many candidate polynomials remain; you can evaluate all those at your number and eliminate those whose value does not equal... < 1503823509 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :...the given one. Because the number is transcendental, and disequality of computable reals is semidecidable, only one polynomial will remain in the end. < 1503823565 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So is convolution with a kernel, the kind that people talk about in image processing, a special case of the usual convolution? < 1503823568 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems like it must be, but the relationship isn't obvious. < 1503823597 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :using a "nice" computable real like that sum 1/2^2^k one I suggested should make it much more efficient though :) < 1503823614 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1503823654 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: yes < 1503823793 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does it work? < 1503823799 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The obscure part to me is why it's called a kernel :/ < 1503823819 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just an ordinary discrete, two-dimensional covolution, no magic at all? < 1503823824 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :*convolution < 1503823849 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are the functions being convolved? < 1503823860 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the image < 1503823880 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the kernel, with the center at (0,0), and perhaps a switch from k(x,y) to k(-x,-y). < 1503823903 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :This works for a 1D image and 1D kernel, right? < 1503823913 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The 1D image is presumably a function : [n] -> R or something like that. < 1503823922 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the 1D kernel? < 1503823922 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :[n]? < 1503823930 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :[n] meaning the set of naturals < n < 1503823939 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually an interval [-k,k] < 1503823952 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(of integers) < 1503823967 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, and what's the convolution? < 1503823976 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: works for 2D images too < 1503823980 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :In general I expect a convolution to look like this: (f * g)(x) = A_{i,j | b(i,j) = x} { c(f(i), g(j)) } < 1503823983 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right? < 1503823988 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: the image is one of the functions, and the kernel is the other one < 1503824007 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :f |-> \x -> sum_{i in Z} f(x-i)k(i) < 1503824038 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: there has to be a sum in there (unless you're a mathematical physicsist and using tensor notation) < 1503824045 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you said k was only defined on the interval [-k,k]? < 1503824051 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: A,b,c are operations < 1503824061 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :For example A = Σ, b = + , c = · < 1503824068 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which would make it (f * g)(x) = Σ_{i,j | i + j = x} { f(i)g(j) } < 1503824073 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :f(x+i) k(i) which is probably how it's implemented, and corresponds to the switch from k(x) to k(-x) I suggested. < 1503824078 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: um, that seems garbled < 1503824084 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the non-ascii part that is < 1503824088 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes < 1503824102 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's supposed to be a capital sigma and a multiplication dot < 1503824116 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But A might be min, or maybe an integral or something. < 1503824119 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you either assume the kernel and image are zero in the rest of the places, or you say the sum only goes when both i and j are in the respective domains < 1503824130 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1503824139 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: f is the image; g is the kernel, possibly reflected, and one of the points is that g(j) is zero almost everywhere. < 1503824170 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, redundancy is redundant. < 1503824183 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? redundancy < 1503824186 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since redundancy exists, it's redundant for Taneb to invent it. < 1503824192 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I guess I see. < 1503824207 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: either that or it converges to zero exponentially fast as j goes to infinity and -infinity, and when computing we may approximate the small values with zeros < 1503824224 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Concretely convolution in the finite case where b = + usually corresponds the antidiagonals of some matrix, right? < 1503824233 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: well the question was about image processing :) < 1503824240 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :people often convolve images with bell curves, but since they don't need infinite precision, it's practically zero far enough < 1503824264 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: for image processing still, people blur images with gaussians < 1503824295 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: yes, for 1d < 1503824319 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what's the matrix here? < 1503824354 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: yes, but I believe they tend to do that by iterating rectangular filters like [1/3,1/3,1/3] < 1503824355 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: the matrix is the outer product of two vectors, the first vector is column vector of values of f, second vector is row vector of rosw of g < 1503824377 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: that or something similar, which is a good approximation < 1503824388 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Say I have an image [1,2,3,4,5,6,7] and I convolve it with the kernel [a,b,c] < 1503824393 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't always exactly use [1/3,1/3,1/3] but still < 1503824407 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: yes, box filters was the main point < 1503824415 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's does the matrix end up being there? < 1503824419 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I believe that's what they are called) < 1503824490 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then there are these fast methods for computing such convolutions even if the image and kernel are both big, of which the most famous is called fast fourier transform, but there are other transform methods < 1503824514 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: [1;2;3;4;5;6;7]*[a,b,c] < 1503824519 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd expect [c, b+2c, a+2b+3c, 2a+3b+4c, ..., 5a+6b+7c, 6a+7c, 7a] in an actual implementation, and possibly truncated < 1503824533 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: that's the convolution < 1503824537 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the usual definition would swap a and c. < 1503824540 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: But what are the antidiagonals of that? < 1503824562 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: wasn't that the question? < 1503824578 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: one antidiagonal is [1*c, 2*b, 3*a] < 1503824591 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or backwards maybe < 1503824596 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whichever way you read it < 1503824633 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: " What's does the matrix end up being there?" < 1503824719 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh if you want to have a trace in the definition < 1503824733 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: no < 1503824737 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Trace? < 1503824759 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :sum of diagonal entries, in the case of matrices < 1503824762 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: Oh, I see. < 1503824773 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's just antidiagonals in a non-square matrix. < 1503824870 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503825046 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So how does that work with the definition I gave above? < 1503825059 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :img : [7] -> R < 1503825074 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :krn : [3] -> R < 1503825194 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b(i,j) = i-j, c(x,y) = x*y, A = sum < 1503825210 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty sure b should be + < 1503825238 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ is standard; - is what implementations tend to do < 1503825240 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends on which direction you convolve. some call the plus version convolution, some call it correlation and the minus version convolution. < 1503825253 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a terminology difference. < 1503825271 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like which direction of fourier transform is forward is also a terminology difference < 1503825306 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to read documentation carefully to find out what conventions it uses for the formulas < 1503825324 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a bit surprising that img/krn don't have the same domain. < 1503825330 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :to actually get a result of length 9, you should pad 'img' with two zeros to the left and to the right. < 1503825337 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I suppose you can extend them both to Z and define them aas 0 everywhere else. < 1503825362 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So how does the 2D version work? < 1503825374 0 :kurolox!~Kurolox@81.red-88-4-114.dynamicip.rima-tde.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503825383 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :same, but now i and j are pairs and b is pairwise addition < 1503825395 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b((i1,i2),(j1,j2)) = (i1-j1,i2-j2) < 1503825396 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or pairwise subtraction, whichever) < 1503825401 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or addition < 1503825402 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes sense. < 1503825413 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Subtraction is so confusing. < 1503825417 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want it to be commutative. < 1503825481 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can easily implement one from the other by reversing one of the inputs < 1503825489 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure. < 1503825492 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :subtraction corresponds to r = 0; for (int i = 0; i < ker.length; i++) r += img[x+i]*ker[i]; res[x] = r; < 1503825564 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like convolution in contexts where you don't have inverses so you can't even say f(i)g(x-i) < 1503825643 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and the whole thing is made cool by the fact that GPS devices do 1d convolution < 1503825656 0 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1503825664 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :They do? < 1503825674 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's one of the most important technological uses < 1503826120 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically GPS satellites can't be each assigned different frequencies like radio stations, so you can't pick their signals out with just simple electronics, their signal is really weak, and they aren't just round-robin broadcasting either, they just all talk at the same time, < 1503826182 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so to pick out the voice of one satellite from the others and all the other noise that's actually stronger than the signals, GPS clients digitize the signals they receive and convolve it with what the GPS is expected to say to find out when they received that signal, and they do the convolution in microchips digitally < 1503826199 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's quite crazy < 1503826745 0 :augur!~augur@c-73-71-242-163.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503826985 0 :augur!~augur@c-73-71-242-163.hsd1.ca.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503828364 0 :wob_jonas!b03f186b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.107 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1503833396 0 :kurolox!~Kurolox@81.red-88-4-114.dynamicip.rima-tde.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie probably went to work already, right? < 1503835960 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :What, on a Sunday? < 1503835986 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not that far gone yet. < 1503837470 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503837479 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/5cZlR8am <- feedback/ideas? < 1503837483 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a 2d bot programming game. < 1503837496 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :with swarms of bots. < 1503837570 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if a bot dies it'll respawn at the base) < 1503837630 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe st/ld should be 16bit < 1503837653 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that way it's probably possible to have scouting bots scan the whole field into team memory < 1503837659 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :might be used for pathfinding then < 1503838441 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :can RET be used for computed gotos? < 1503838687 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, there's no indirect addressing it seems < 1503838883 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and bots might want to know how healthy, strong or eagle-eyed they are. < 1503839457 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. true. < 1503839462 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ret? < 1503839463 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1503839468 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can just push a number and then use ret < 1503839475 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :call/ret stack and data stack are the same < 1503839675 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :jumps/calls are absolute < 1503839680 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can use ret. < 1503839711 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then there's the business of interleaving all that concurrent activity. < 1503839754 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well each bot executes one instruction < 1503839756 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then the next bot. < 1503839782 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :A1,B1,A2,B2,A3,B3 I guess. < 1503839810 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although might be cool if bot can sleep < 1503839816 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and forfeit their time slots for a few rounds. < 1503839826 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. if you have the ball < 1503839830 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then the other bots sleep < 1503839838 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means the bot with the ball can move faster :D < 1503839907 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/UvEQlm3l <- updated < 1503839996 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and yeah. bots keep their power-ups < 1503840014 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that taking them actually is of benefit. < 1503840320 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happens if you walk into an obstacle or other bot? < 1503840475 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503840516 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd say that's a nop then. < 1503840522 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't walk into non free space < 1503840533 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(execept for picking stuff up or returning ball to base) < 1503842407 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503842686 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503844623 0 :ATMunn!~ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn26 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503845670 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503845926 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503846394 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1503848077 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@188.189.82.125 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503848915 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503849195 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1503849976 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode ςσ < 1503849977 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+03C2 GREEK SMALL LETTER FINAL SIGMA] [U+03C3 GREEK SMALL LETTER SIGMA] < 1503850426 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@188.189.82.125 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503850550 0 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1503850569 0 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1503850589 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1503850596 0 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Client Quit < 1503850869 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503851072 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503851078 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :re < 1503851497 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503851594 0 :n00blet!~n00blet@ppp108-178.static.internode.on.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503851878 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503852096 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the moment your df interpreter doesn't terminate < 1503852101 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you KNOW you fucked up BIG < 1503852104 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because df doesn't even have loops. < 1503852148 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :df, hmm. dwarf fortress, probably not. < 1503852174 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh there was this deadfish thing < 1503852197 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1503852202 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just horribly slow < 1503852205 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT THE FUCK < 1503852263 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what language stack did you write it in? < 1503852649 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503852794 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :python :D < 1503852832 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( perhaps it's a long-winded program ) < 1503852836 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :isidsddsdiisddisiiisiiiiiiiiiiiiio < 1503852840 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay it works. < 1503853426 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :iiiidsiiiisddddddddddddo < 1503853434 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is great :D < 1503853533 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :iissdddsddddddo < 1503853536 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1503853578 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :iiisiiisiiiiiiiiiio < 1503853584 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this looks optimal I'd say < 1503853610 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. no. < 1503854282 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1503854286 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do I define a nice heuristic function < 1503854291 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that it optimizes also for length. < 1503854374 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1503854375 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1503854380 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :iissdddsddddddddddddo < 1503854383 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now it's optimal :D < 1503854501 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :iiisiiiisddddddddddddo < 1503854564 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :for numbers >3, you can just start from the nearest square... except when that square is 256 < 1503854587 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1503854673 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and there is a similar special case around 65536, of course) < 1503854799 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :now... should iissisdssss print 0 in deadfish? < 1503854970 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. < 1503854989 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but this is why I believe genetic evolutionary algo stuff will never find certain solutions. < 1503855006 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I know :) < 1503855009 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems not to be able to be able to find a solution for 257 < 1503855017 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a haskell program to generate the shortest dfconstants. < 1503855023 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(https://esolangs.org/wiki/Deadfish/Constants) < 1503855093 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, 257 is awkward... iissisdddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddd < 1503855140 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503855367 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's never going to combine into that. < 1503855376 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll reach 255 eventually < 1503855378 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then < 1503855380 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll stuck < 1503855602 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :iissisdddddddddddddddddddddddddddddd'o < 1503855614 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :259 < 1503855617 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok works :D < 1503855618 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1503855667 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sidssiisiisisdddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddd < 1503855673 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably needs some dead code elimination :D < 1503855680 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sidss is pretty useless at the front :D < 1503856210 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503856493 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :isi+s+dAdsidi+iAss/aA-aiaiad*d-s-+diii+i+iadd/diA+d+/d < 1503856496 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this will produce 257 :D < 1503856499 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in extended deadfish :D < 1503856705 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :yey < 1503857117 0 :trn!jhj@prone.ws QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1503857550 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Bitmapper 5* 10New user account < 1503858491 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503858797 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1503858833 0 :zseri!5e86dad0@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.218.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503859605 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: how about this, iiisisdddddddsddsiiisddddddsdddddddsddsiiiisiiiii produces -2 on a 32 bit deadfish implementation < 1503859714 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Unlikely to be optimal, but this involves quite a bit of manual effort so I will stop there. Also, doing that for 64 bits seems to be out of reach for me right now) < 1503859857 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some implementations may use decimal arithmetic, such as the one for Famicom and the one for MIX, and possibly some others too. < 1503859882 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, feel free to come up with code for such implementations < 1503860346 0 :trn!jhj@prone.ws JOIN :#esoteric < 1503860465 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/mfiYr4C4 < 1503860479 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my code is probably not the best to produce offspring anyway. < 1503860483 0 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1503860494 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and always taking the ten best is probably not good. < 1503860501 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the ten best tend to look pretty much alike in the end < 1503860512 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it'll never really produce 257 < 1503860717 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503860965 0 :n00blet!?@? NICK :n00blet_ < 1503861052 0 :n00blet_!?@? NICK :o_0 < 1503861434 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :creationists were right. < 1503861450 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :evolution is a lousy idea :) < 1503861460 0 :o_0!?@? NICK :n00blet < 1503861976 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so much fun... "iiisisdssissdsiississdddsiissiiiisiiiii" produces -2 as well, and is optimal. < 1503862033 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :iissdddsiiiiiisisdsiisisdsiisiiiiii produces 255, and iissdsdssisiiiisiisssdddsddds produces 257, all assuming 32 bit deadfish < 1503862297 0 :sleffy!~sleffy@c-24-7-67-0.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503862504 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, finally, a Hello, world! program (with final newline): iiisdsiiiiiiiiossssiiisisioiiiiiiiooiiioisssiiisddsdddddoddddddddddddosssiiisiisddoddddddddoiiioddddddoddddddddossssiisiisdddodsssiiisio < 1503863298 0 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1503863439 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey guys i created hardfish a much harder variant of deadfish < 1503863480 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of s there's c < 1503863486 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :where c = one collatz step < 1503863501 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so 257 is iiicicciicdcdidcc < 1503863549 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or iiiciciicicdcdcc < 1503863670 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: http://codepad.org/vL6jJHNg < 1503863857 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this assumes wrap around though right? < 1503863873 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1503863902 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's what I mean by "32 bit deadfish", numbers wrap at 2^32. < 1503864000 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. < 1503864009 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are all numbers reachable with just i and c < 1503864049 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1503864060 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but without any two i's in succession < 1503864137 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, yes. < 1503864402 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :As a sketch, assuming unbounded natural numbers, you can first make the number big (so that the +1 of the 3n+1 becomes negligible for the next phase), then adjust the log_2 to have the right fractional part (the precision required for that is bounded by the target number; if it's n, then you want the fractional part between the fractional parts of log_2(n-1) and log_2(n)), and then divide by 2... < 1503864408 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :...repeatedly to get the number you desire. < 1503864610 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Mroman2 5* 10New user account < 1503865009 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: the approach is stupid though; for example, 257 is produced by iciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciciccciciciccciciciccciciciciciccccicicciccicicicicicicicicccicciciciciciccccciciciccccicicccicicciccciccccccciciciccicicicc < 1503865014 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52940&oldid=52937 5* 03Mroman2 5* (+108) 10 < 1503865025 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Hardfish14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=52941 5* 03Mroman2 5* (+698) 10hardfiiiiish < 1503865069 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting. < 1503865115 0 :n00blet!~n00blet@ppp108-178.static.internode.on.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503865179 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Hardfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52942&oldid=52941 5* 03Mroman2 5* (+36) 10/* Some Constants */ starting c is a nop obviously. < 1503865195 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd talk here more often, but I'd run the risk of self-contradicting people who at the same time don't harbor any hate for me at all, and have a grudge against me. < 1503865254 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, I wonder how the world would react if I was also an extremely unforgiving, confusing person. < 1503865325 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are confusing < 1503865362 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not unforgiving, though, and I don't contradict myself in the span of a few minutes. < 1503865376 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :inb4 mroman and everyone else thinks I do. < 1503865392 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :After all, that's all I ever seem to be. < 1503865393 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PART #esoteric :"Leaving" < 1503865546 0 :sleffy!~sleffy@c-24-7-67-0.hsd1.ca.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503866039 0 :MrBismuth!~ArcMrBism@2602:306:8325:a300:c801:d7f:77e1:92be QUIT :Quit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIIqYqtR1lY -- Suicide is Painless - Johnny Mandel < 1503866199 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Hardfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52943&oldid=52942 5* 03Mroman2 5* (+129) 10/* Some Constants */ more constants < 1503866203 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: http://sprunge.us/WRFH -- hardfish constants :) < 1503866237 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1503866239 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1503866245 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1503866246 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1503866254 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't have ii in your programs < 1503866273 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you actually forbade that. < 1503866279 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1503866290 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, easy to fix < 1503866300 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. found 30. iccicccicccicciccicicci < 1503866510 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Hardfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52944&oldid=52943 5* 03Mroman2 5* (+173) 10/* Some Constants */ more constants < 1503866533 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my evolver seems to be unable to find something for 38. < 1503866542 0 :MrBusiness!~ArcMrBism@104-50-90-48.lightspeed.brhmal.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503866812 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Hardfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52945&oldid=52944 5* 03Mroman2 5* (+55) 10/* Some Constants */ < 1503867141 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: http://sprunge.us/iKHK then < 1503867166 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a Hello, world!, assuming we add o: iciccicciciccioccicicccccccoicicciccicicciooccccccicccciciccioicciccoccccccccciccoicccccicioiccicicciciccioiciccccccccccicciocicicciccccioccccicccicocciccciccio < 1503867377 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you brute force them? < 1503867383 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or use that log2 method? < 1503867390 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's brute force < 1503867404 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the log2 method would produce much longer solutions < 1503867449 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's not that hard :( < 1503867451 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well.. < 1503867463 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example, 255, 256, 257 would have code of length 643 1106 226, respectively < 1503867490 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1503867493 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not very effecient yes < 1503867541 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you computed all 2^34 programs? < 1503867545 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this short time? < 1503867546 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :o_O < 1503867557 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it "only" grows as fast as the fibonacci numbers < 1503867567 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1503867569 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really 2^32 < 1503867573 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fix (scanl(+)1.(0:)) !! 34 < 1503867575 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :since ii is not allowed < 1503867576 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 9227465 < 1503867588 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :still quite managable, really < 1503867683 0 :zseri!5e86dad0@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.218.208 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's with the line " 27 - cciccciccicicci" in [[Hardfish]], I think "cc" at the begin is a nop? < 1503867697 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fix (scanl(+)1.(0:)) !! 37 -- actually < 1503867700 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 39088169 < 1503867731 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zseri: it was evolved < 1503867826 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: but the program actually enumerates values, so if two prefixes produce the same value they only count as one < 1503867846 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1503867848 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was EVOLVED < 1503867849 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1503867854 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I need to do some changes to it. < 1503867856 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :too boring this way < 1503867908 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zseri: people have the same complaint about DNA, most of it is, as far as we can tell, redundant, though sometimes we find a purpose for parts that were previously thought to be unused < 1503868009 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: and it turns out that *a lot* of values collapse. Here's a list of the intermediate set sizes: http://sprunge.us/IIjH (there are two sets in each iteration, one for programs ending in 'c' and one for programs ending in 'i') < 1503868187 0 :PinealGlandOptic!~PinealGla@82.144.205.57 QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1503868239 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Hardfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52946&oldid=52945 5* 03Mroman2 5* (-89) 10/* hardfish */ change a lot to make it more intelesting. < 1503868266 0 :dingbat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-cgrsmoxbnehcgxfj JOIN :#esoteric < 1503868277 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Hardfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52947&oldid=52946 5* 03Mroman2 5* (+5) 10* typo < 1503868308 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll pass, but 'r' is indeed interesting < 1503868342 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Hardfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52948&oldid=52947 5* 03Mroman2 5* (+136) 10+ let's support the o instruction as well. < 1503868381 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :in particular, it raises the question how to write Hello world with as few 'o' instructions as possible :) < 1503868499 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's possible with a single 'o' if one can find a code segment that produces 72 from 0, and can also produce all the other necessary values... and that may be tough to put into practice. < 1503868503 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1503868602 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, iriririr would produce 11? < 1503868639 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14 < 1503868655 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, right < 1503868730 0 :Deewiant!~deewiant@fr1.ut.deewiant.iki.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1503869141 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :qcrcrqirqrqic produces 11 according to my evolver :D < 1503869174 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :icrcr is also 14 < 1503869200 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :qiriri is 14 as well < 1503869234 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :iqrqcqiqrqiq is 257 :D < 1503869315 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes... whether it's possible to have less o's than output characters is interesting < 1503869346 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I have a hunch that these programs are probably longer than the ones with more o's in them < 1503869356 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well... gotta go < 1503869359 0 :mroman!b2c5eac4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.197.234.196 QUIT :Quit: cu < 1503869435 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :Am I right in thinking that simply typed lambda calculus + a fixed point combinator is Turing complete? < 1503870578 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: just to clarify, you'd have a fixed point combinator for each type? < 1503870614 0 :zseri!5e86dad0@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.218.208 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1503870705 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1503871170 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t \n f z -> n (\g x -> f (g x)) (\x -> x) z < 1503871171 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :(((t -> t5) -> t -> t4) -> (t1 -> t1) -> t3 -> t2) -> (t5 -> t4) -> t3 -> t2 < 1503872078 0 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGABRT, dying... < 1503873886 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1503873931 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503874547 0 :hppavilion[1]!~dosgmowdo@93-231-58-66.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1503875279 0 :kurolox!~Kurolox@81.red-88-4-114.dynamicip.rima-tde.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1503876673 0 :bouncingbuteo!~u0_a302@75-166-210-180.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503876756 0 :bouncingbuteo!~u0_a302@75-166-210-180.hlrn.qwest.net QUIT :Client Quit < 1503877356 0 :iovoid!~iovoid@unaffiliated/iovoid QUIT :Quit: * < 1503877391 0 :iovoid!~iovoid@unaffiliated/iovoid JOIN :#esoteric