< 1472083213 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: anyway, we have such a system now, it's just a different page. < 1472083221 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1472083257 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, a quickbooks spammer in the aubse log < 1472083294 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(even better, we could make a user's first couple of edits non-binding (administrators must approve them), but the user isn't informed (while logged in, they see their edits as if they had gone through)) < 1472083319 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But that'd probably require someone to create an entirely new MediaWiki plugin) < 1472083322 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you didn't give em time to introduce emself ;P < 1472083359 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would have been hilarious if that was the first user to manage the process < 1472083414 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey since when does ais523 idle :( < 1472083428 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, were their edits after account creation purged from Recent Changes, or was it just assumed they're a spammer because no introduction was created within 2 minutes?) < 1472083431 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: No idea < 1472083463 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: it won't require an entirely new mediawiki plugin because there's already an approved version feature. < 1472083472 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm beginning to feel like the wiki is becoming a game of Papers, Please < 1472083476 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah? < 1472083495 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I decided to idle more < 1472083500 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, it will probably either show up in HackEgo announcements, or make them useless... < 1472083501 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been idle in my idling recently < 1472083505 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1472083507 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also, for a while I idled but not in #esoteric) < 1472083565 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pending changes doesn't stop spam < 1472083574 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it hides spam from public view but it still forces admins to go and clean the spam up manually < 1472083577 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION . o O ( What we really need is a decoy esolangs.org that's unrelated to the REAL esolangs.org ) < 1472083648 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe we should just ban the word 'quickbooks' from ever appearing on the wiki... < 1472083653 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: it wasn't purged, and you can see that (except for completely deleted pages) with the Show bots option < 1472083692 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :but how about we get in touch with these spammers and offer to let them by ad-space? they could put a banner up "want to participate in a sort tech support scam for fun and (our) profit?" < 1472083698 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :buy < 1472083709 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :short < 1472083918 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@2a00:f41:38b9:75ba:de85:deff:fe55:967a JOIN :#esoteric < 1472083920 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`cwlprits wegian < 1472083921 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1] shachaf shachaf shachaf < 1472083941 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1472083942 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`howg wegian < 1472083943 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​ learn A wegian is an equivalence class of #esoteric regulars. There are two main wegians, the Nor (from Finland) and the Glas (from Hexham). \ rm wisdom/wegian \ sedlast s/member/regular/ \ learn A wegian is an equivalence class of #esoteric members. There are two main wegians, the Nor (from Finland) < 1472083954 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: You removed it for some reason. < 1472083958 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it was scow. < 1472083968 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was hilarious < 1472084135 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? member < 1472084136 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sorry, #esoteric has regulars, not members. Who told you about members? There are definitely no members here, and you wouldn't be allowed to know about them, anyway. < 1472084353 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it was funny < 1472084390 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks at the logs and thinks bojidar_bg must have been missing something. < 1472084412 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :also esoteric has the best members. they're yuuuuge! < 1472084431 0 :FireFly!~firefly@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? wegian < 1472084432 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :A wegian is an equivalence class of #esoteric regulars. There are two main wegians, the Nor (from Finland) and the Glas (from Hexham). < 1472084440 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes to look up this yuge meme < 1472084441 0 :FireFly!~firefly@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like it < 1472084632 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Trump reference < 1472084640 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in the US presidential candidate < 1472084643 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: also bernie, it seems < 1472084680 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh, if someone says "yuge" out of context the sentence it's in is almost certainly intended to be attributed to Trump (and the word is used to make people read the rest of the sentence in Trump's voice) < 1472084709 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :OKAY < 1472084741 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do people suddenly not refer to politicians by their last names anymore < 1472084751 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just wanted to talk about huge members < 1472084764 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: also, bojidar_bg was speaking about feather hth < 1472084771 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1472084772 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh dear < 1472084795 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think he may not have understood the rewinding time semantics. < 1472084864 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :dill pickles: garlicky or no? < 1472084871 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is feather going to be still alive yet now? < 1472084880 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :GARLIC. ALWAYS. < 1472084892 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: it wioll haven been. < 1472084923 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*be < 1472084929 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: It depends on the politician < 1472084931 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid grammar. < 1472084942 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: pickle opinion? < 1472084955 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: i don't really have a relationship to dill, sorry < 1472084975 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some are referred to by their full name, some by their last name, some by saying the letters in their initials, and at least one by just his middle initial < 1472084995 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you should. < 1472084999 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you should. < 1472084999 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan for president < 1472085008 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION notes that norwegian politicians have been first-named for decades. < 1472085008 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: pickle opinion? < 1472085028 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :although not consistently. < 1472085056 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: PICKLES ARE VERY GOOD AND THERE'S ABSOLUTELY NOTHING WRONG WITH THEM AT ALL I LOVE THEM AND THEY DON'T HAVE A GUN TO MY HEAD < 1472085079 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: who is this "full name" politician of which you speak? < 1472085086 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Most old ones < 1472085088 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Does Harald V even have a last name? < 1472085095 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION seems to have stopped reading norwegian news < 1472085106 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :George Washington is usually called "George Washington", at least much more commonly than just "Washington" < 1472085107 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: i don't think so. < 1472085118 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: nah. those were either last name or nickname < 1472085165 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you left off nickname and spelling initials of nickname from your list < 1472085166 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: What do people call George Washington if not that? < 1472085178 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :washington < 1472085189 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: That's less common than "George Washington" < 1472085225 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And "Bill Clinton" and "Teddy Roosevelt" (we count "Teddy" as his first name. Don't question it.) < 1472085237 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe now, but back then "general washington" or "president washington" or even "mr washington" was more common < 1472085240 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Andrew Jackson" < 1472085241 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well yeah < 1472085244 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :True < 1472085263 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i always just say jackson for andy jackson < 1472085311 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't know until recently that Benjamin Harrison was the grandson of William Harrison. < 1472085316 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other two are just fullnames to distinguish them from others with the same name < 1472085319 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i,i grandharrison < 1472085342 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :tippecanoe the 2nd < 1472085359 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: "IIRC many IRC servers have been modified to close the connection if they see anything that looks like it's part of the wrong protocol" => yes, but more importantly, many irc servers (but not the one on freenode) require you to pong a ping whose body has a random string before you can do anything, to stop blind attacks that don't read what < 1472085359 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the server says. < 1472085378 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :and bill clinton is just slick willy < 1472085409 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are even so helpful as to send you a notice after a few seconds if your client doesn't automatically pong so that you can pong manually. < 1472085420 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or at least, some servers are.) < 1472085436 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen this on multiple networks. < 1472085438 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pøng < 1472085438 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :pong < 1472085458 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I have to remember how ø is pronounced again < 1472085462 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it more like ö or like aw? < 1472085465 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC it's one or the other < 1472085502 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was ö < 1472085509 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: According to the guy at Epcot, it's something like "oo-i" (short i sound) < 1472085519 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least, that's its name < 1472085546 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: that's fairly close to ö, if you remove the i (but keep the transition between the oo and the i) < 1472085550 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's like ö. It's really the same as ö only the Norwegians use a same spelling for it. They also use æ instead of ä. < 1472085564 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so do they use œ for anything? < 1472085572 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, that's the French < 1472085577 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Ah, yes, that's probably what it is < 1472085609 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: ø is not a diphthong hth < 1472085631 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :diphthongs are mostly an English thing I think < 1472085651 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they're often comparable to vowels in other languages if you just take the transition and leave out the vowel at either side < 1472085651 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like swedish ö, which is like german ö but with more protruded lips. < 1472085674 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc < 1472085737 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the problem with taking English vowels as a base for _anything_ is that their actual pronunciations are so much varied by dialect < 1472085746 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's å which is like aw hth < 1472085752 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: that's a good point < 1472085753 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ah right < 1472085778 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: however, there are some relatively standardised pronunciations (such as the ones that are used on national BBC shows when they're trying to be understandable) < 1472085802 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose maybe you could still use them if you are, like, native English and are familiar with lots of dialects on four continents, so that you can say something is like this vowel as pronounced by people in this obscure Indian town where somehow everyone happens to have the same dialect. < 1472085826 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It certainly won't work for me, because I'm very bad at English pronunciation, and certainly can't pronounce vowels properly according to any dialect. < 1472085868 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I probably don't even recognize them properly unless I really pay attention, because I have no idea which word is supposed to have which of the three o vowels. < 1472085881 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: norwegian has diphthongs too, but they're written as two vowels. < 1472085907 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: in English sometimes we write them as two vowels, and sometimes we don't! < 1472085922 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and sometimes the second vowel is an e later in the word < 1472085935 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which you have to magically teleport back to the vowel it modifies < 1472085941 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and sometimes an e really is just an e < 1472085998 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, but the problem isn't those two vowels. I can't distinguish the two long ones (the "note" vowel from the "caught" vowel) and those aren't the two that many dialects unify < 1472086013 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are the nationalities (in demonym form) of all #esoteric regulars? < 1472086022 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, I can't distinguish them unless I pay attention, I unify them in my mind, which is why I don't remember which word has which one < 1472086035 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: we have like five different long vowels in most of the less vowelmergy dialects < 1472086045 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and in the most vowelmergy dialects it's best just to figure out the word from the consonants) < 1472086057 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: many are Norwegian or British < 1472086065 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: Yes < 1472086093 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: english, scottish, norwegian, finnish, swedish, hungarian, polish, french, canadian, austrian, german < 1472086106 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: "note" and "caught" are pretty different, though, at least in the relatively neutral accent I have (my parents are from different parts of the country so their accents sort-of averaged out) < 1472086120 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :south korean, belgian < 1472086123 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: I can imagine that there are accents where they both make an "oi" sound though < 1472086129 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(flemish iirc) < 1472086146 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: they are different, yes. "note" has the diphtong, "caught" has the plain long closed o < 1472086153 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :american of course < 1472086157 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I'd more likely interpret "noite" as "night" rather than "note" < 1472086169 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So other #esoteric equivalence classes include an and ish, I guess? < 1472086172 0 :moonythedwarf_!~IceChat9@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1472086176 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: well "caught" is an aw, "note" is an oe < 1472086186 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are normally considered pretty different as vowels go < 1472086199 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that diphtong (unlike the "bite" and "make" dipthong) is such a crazy alien thing for my Hungarian ears that I just mentally transform it to a plain long o < 1472086204 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess the vowel in "caught" is also often spelled or < 1472086211 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning that they both are types of o < 1472086216 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I don't think of them like that < 1472086237 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I undipthongise an oe it becomes more like a ur < 1472086240 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: What's the caught/cot difference pre-merger again? < 1472086251 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the "there" diphtong is also alien, but I mentally transform it to a long OPEN e, so I don't confuse it with any other English vowel < 1472086273 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: "o" in cot is a short vowel and can't easily be extended < 1472086277 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :your voice cracks up if you try < 1472086280 0 :moonythedwarf_!~IceChat9@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf JOIN :#esoteric < 1472086294 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(some dialects have been extending it into an or, much like in caught; that's the merger) < 1472086315 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: air is pretty rare as vowels go < 1472086320 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I somehow managed it twice in a sentence by mistake < 1472086321 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :dependent on what you mean by regular, i can include indian, dutch. oh and i forgot italian. < 1472086339 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly because I was thinking about it and subconciously chose words that used it < 1472086364 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure what the spelling that actually starts with e rather than a is < 1472086366 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe eyr < 1472086367 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :there might be an israeli which isn't also american, i'm not quite sure. < 1472086373 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect it's actually a tripthong, though < 1472086378 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than a dipthong < 1472086394 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: basically, the "bite", "make", "now" diphtongs map to what you can get in Hungarian from semivowels, spelled as "áj", "éj", "au" (the latter only when pronounced as one syllable) which occur in actual words, whereas the "note" and "there" are crazy so I can't imagine them as diphtongs, only as single sounds < 1472086400 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it starts as ay, then becomes ee, then becomes er < 1472086427 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: we have many more dipthongs than that, though < 1472086430 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about "paint"? < 1472086442 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that one's /really/ common so I'm surprised you haven't listed it < 1472086449 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think there's also an icelandic. < 1472086450 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais: I think "paint" has the "make" diphtong, doesn't it? < 1472086455 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, yes < 1472086457 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :missed it < 1472086460 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION checks the dictionary < 1472086467 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :for anything more, i'd have to start looking at /who output. < 1472086472 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, same dipthong < 1472086480 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for some reason I missed it in your comment < 1472086496 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I wonder where my reverse phonetic dictionary got to < 1472086511 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not something I've needed for decades < 1472086524 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the worst sound? < 1472086538 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :we've had australians and new zealanders before, but i'm not sure if there are any here these days. < 1472086540 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is one more, the "here" diphtong, which is less common, and I DO confuse it with the ordinary long i sound from "sheep", and there are some other vowels that might be diphtongs in some pronunciations < 1472086542 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(actually I'm not 100% sure I ever really needed it; I read a lot so it's rare to need to figure out how a word is spelled given only its pronounciation, the reverse problem is more common) < 1472086554 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, what I'm confused about very often depends on the spelling too < 1472086558 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, "here" is distinct and also fairly rare < 1472086569 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I know English spelling much more than pronunciatino < 1472086572 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can blame you for that < 1472086576 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I chat too much in English < 1472086579 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : (and in the most vowelmergy dialects it's best just to figure out the word from the consonants) <-- hm ... english abjad < 1472086604 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sixthong < 1472086615 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: well you have problems like the spelling "ere" being used for two distinct vowel combinations < 1472086625 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : hppavilion[1]: many are Norwegian or British <-- i don't think there are more than two norwegians. and i'm not sure if the other guy is still here. < 1472086635 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and not being the spelling that you'd use for either if you were trying to construct a consistent spelling for dipthongs) < 1472086655 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rune was norwegian, I think, but I haven't seen them for ages < 1472086668 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: oh also swiss, when he comes around. < 1472086701 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Oooh, english abjad < 1472086724 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(what is the highest-order thong used in any common languages?) < 1472086749 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: instead of the crazy attempts to invent alternate spelling system, at least one person has started to devise an alternate English _dialect_ where the pronunciation is connected better to the writing yet is also more or less understandible as a dialect of English by existing speakers, < 1472086749 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : wob_jonas: "note" and "caught" are pretty different, though [...] <-- iirc they're much more different in english (RP) than in average american < 1472086754 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was the homepage again < 1472086770 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.phon.ucl.ac.uk/home/mark/regeng/ < 1472086771 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that < 1472086777 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadly it's an unfinished project < 1472086786 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's a really good idea and they started it the right way < 1472086788 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: "General American" plz twh thx < 1472086789 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I'm talking about british english here, I'm much less experienced with american < 1472086810 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric : [an error occurred while processing this directive] < 1472086813 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :followed by a 404 message < 1472086857 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a pronunciation that is more close to British in many ways, probably because it's influenced by my learning English in early years (at which time obviously I didn't chat on the internet in English) < 1472086880 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but of course it's also a horrible English as second language pronunciation with Hungarian accent < 1472086884 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they're pretty different, anyway. < 1472086897 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : I guess the vowel in "caught" is also often spelled or <-- only possibly equivalent in non-rhotic accents? < 1472086918 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I think that's pretty much the definition of a non-rhotic accent < 1472086951 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(hm, can dipthongs be r-colored?) < 1472086987 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I find it hard to hear the difference between the rhotic and non-rhotic pronouncation though because they both have the same meaning in English < 1472086988 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, non-rhotic is most of it, but also the rest of vowels (that don't have r in them) are more like British < 1472086991 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my brain didn't learn the difference < 1472086996 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hpp: yes, the one in "fire" < 1472087004 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a triphtong but still < 1472087031 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, that's why I can't just learn to _pronounce_ a rhotic pronunciation, even though I'd prefer to < 1472087065 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : What's the worst sound? <-- czech r hacek hth < 1472087068 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's hard to bring myself to actually pronounce any "r" that isn't pronounced in non-rhotic < 1472087073 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"air" is another rhotic tripthong I think < 1472087122 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :caught is the same as cot < 1472087145 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :short o < 1472087181 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Can't figure out what that means < 1472087192 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: that's the caught/cot merger < 1472087200 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, that's the "there" vowel < 1472087202 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not about rhoticity, as much as short 'o' becoming long 'or' < 1472087206 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so is the "here" vowel < 1472087211 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: yes < 1472087213 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(doubly-rhotic vowel...) < 1472087226 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: "arr", like a pirate? < 1472087232 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure < 1472087236 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ř < 1472087268 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If we assume that any vowel can be made rhotic and that a rhotic vowel is still a vowel, then you should be able to arbitrarily rhotate any vowel) < 1472087275 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so would that be a taught-tort merger? < 1472087293 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In math, r's must be pronounced with omega rhotations) < 1472087312 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(French is the most erhotic language) < 1472087321 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : oerjan: "General American" plz twh thx <-- OKAY < 1472087348 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I speak something like GA but with even more mergers < 1472087401 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION thwacke hppavilion[1]. 0.95 shachafs. < 1472087422 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :father bother taught cot all have the same vowel < 1472087440 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If General American becomes too dense, we'll reach a singularity and all possible mergers will occur < 1472087451 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: ? < 1472087457 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Making all words exactly the same < 1472087464 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait. < 1472087464 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: I beg to francophonely disagree hth < 1472087470 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: would we have to speak in Unary? < 1472087474 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: cf. erhotic. < 1472087475 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You highlighted me so I thought you thought I made a pun. < 1472087477 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yes < 1472087485 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should use some other unit that doesn't highlight me. < 1472087502 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the shachaf? < 1472087510 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: use grumpychafs < 1472087513 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION thinks that at school, we were supposedly learning a british pronunciation of english. but when at 18 i got to travel to australia, people there commented on how american we sounded. < 1472087520 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds sort-of like a sheaf < 1472087520 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, "father" and "brother" seem like they should have similar sounds, but they don't < 1472087523 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so more imperial than metric < 1472087527 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: shachaf gets hilited on the chaf part. < 1472087534 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess for it to be a metric unit of measurement shachaf would have to become a world-famous scientist < 1472087550 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1472087558 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :foTR bruDR < 1472087563 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hpp: so does "word" and "sword" < 1472087565 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: the thing that gives it away to me is normally word choice < 1472087565 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: e isn't? < 1472087571 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like people saying "bathroom" to mean "toilet" < 1472087584 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a common result of people learning English from American soaps < 1472087596 0 :moonythedwarf_!~IceChat9@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1472087600 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: it's Taneb who's the inventor < 1472087600 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: My coworkers always made fun of a British coworker. < 1472087611 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Well yeah < 1472087612 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :He would say that he washes his hands in the toilet. < 1472087617 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? tanebventions < 1472087618 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tanebventions include automatic squirrel feeders, necessity, Go, Windows 98, submarine jousting, Fueue, the universe, metar, weetoflakes, Tanebventions, persistence, the BBC, progress, and this sentence. See also tanebventions: math. He never invents anything involving sex. < 1472087640 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I dont think in British English you'd word it like that < 1472087643 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? tanebventions: math < 1472087644 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathematical tanebventions include D-modules, Chu spaces, the torus, Stephen Wolfram, Klein bottles, the axiom of choice, the reals, Lambek's lemma, pointless topology, and histograms. < 1472087651 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a sensible sentence would be along the lines of "I'm going to the toilets to wash my hands" < 1472087656 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? torus < 1472087657 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Topologically, a torus is just a torus. Taneb invented it. < 1472087658 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Hmm, maybe they just made fun of him by rephrasing it. < 1472087663 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :all in all my dialect has 13 vowels and four vowel-like consonants < 1472087674 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Anyway we also got the word "sauzzled" from him, and others. < 1472087682 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You wouldn't spell it like that either. < 1472087684 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: the usual spelling I see is "sozzled" < 1472087686 0 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-97-58.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472087692 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :sozLd < 1472087692 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`le/rn torus/Topologically, a torus is just a torus. Taneb invented it so he'd have something to drink his coffee out of. < 1472087693 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not a very common word, though < 1472087694 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Relearned «torus» < 1472087699 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :given that it's slang, and fairly rare slang at that < 1472087702 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It's not? < 1472087717 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's widely understood, right? < 1472087718 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sozzled < 1472087723 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : oerjan: Can't figure out what that means <-- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%98 (hm i'd never heard that narvik thing before) < 1472087725 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, widely understood at least < 1472087731 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we just have so many different words for being drunk < 1472087745 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that any particular word is fairly uncommonly used unless it's very commonly used < 1472087756 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(err, urban dictionary is probably NSFW for language) < 1472087768 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :NSFL < 1472087772 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(so you might not want to check it at work) < 1472087788 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: E.g. https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-VqbkoZcfbEg/V5l94B-IxQI/AAAAAAAABQQ/CaflMWl7Z2o8dk4zkQfB4iXFSclFlTI5ACL0B/w1056-h1408-no < 1472087810 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what an uninformative URL < 1472087852 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an image but doesn't even end in a image format < 1472087867 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: If I didn't already know for a fact that googleusercontent.com was actually owned by google, I'd be suspicious < 1472087882 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :google1mag3s.info < 1472087892 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: I'm suspicious anyway < 1472087900 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the whole point of that domain is that it's for content that google doesn't trust < 1472087915 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's a different domain so that it violates the same origin policy if it tries to do anything with google cookies or the like) < 1472087927 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, yes < 1472087929 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I copied it from a Google Hangout conversation. < 1472087940 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :so let's see...i missed a discussion of vowel pronunciations, shachaf's grumpiness, and the differences between american and british...anything interesting? < 1472087950 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The URL was even worse before, but I removed the bit at the end that said "account id" < 1472087969 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :my spelling system also solves the metre meter debacle by spelling it mEtR < 1472087970 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: it depends on what you consider interesting, I guess < 1472087989 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spelling ought to be completely distinct from pronunciation. < 1472087989 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what do you consider interesting? < 1472087992 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I'd probably go with googlelmages.info, and always write it in almost-full caps like GOOGLElMAGES.INFO < 1472087995 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait or is that mEdR < 1472087997 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we've had some BF Joust stuff too (mostly because Lymia went and wrote a program generator that writes a program to beat the entire hill) < 1472088003 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: they are, in tibetan < 1472088019 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I consider the BF Joust stuff to be interesting, if fairly annoying < 1472088020 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm does my dialect even distinguish t and d in words? < 1472088031 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i was here for that, i think? < 1472088039 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the English stuff is offtopic but interesting enough to not enforce topicality on it < 1472088045 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If Americans don't want to use the metric system, why did we insist on changing the spelling of metre?) < 1472088055 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that said, something has to be both highly offtopic and highly uninteresting before we enforce topicality here) < 1472088064 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: because f the french < 1472088072 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was also some discussion of Feather < 1472088076 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit I have a batter-badder merger < 1472088079 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fortunately I missed that < 1472088080 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I'm pretty sure America likes the french < 1472088081 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But ais523 would rather have an offtopic-conversation. < 1472088087 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/-/ / < 1472088096 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: See: Mandarin < 1472088099 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: how did you come to this conclusion? < 1472088099 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not sure where that German influence came from. < 1472088102 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: t/d merge isn't that rare < 1472088111 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Revolutionary War < 1472088114 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: is the Feather stuff even worth looking at? < 1472088116 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : I guess for it to be a metric unit of measurement shachaf would have to become a world-famous scientist <-- . o O ( who's the most obscure scientist with an SI unit ) < 1472088125 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I don't think there was more than a line or two. < 1472088126 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Personally, I think we should go back to the Old English system of spelling where you can do pretty much whatever you want and nobody complains < 1472088131 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have half a feeling that nobody else can really discuss Feather as it is because although I don't understand it either, I know more about it than most people < 1472088151 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Surely the smoot is at least as well-known as some SI units. < 1472088159 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: PODCAST CHICKEN < 1472088162 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: then you are pretty sure the pre-americans of 225 years ago liked the revolutionary pre-napoleonic french of 225 years ago < 1472088167 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I know much more about it than the normal person, having only a negative 432 IQ when thinking about it" < 1472088176 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yeah < 1472088201 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, I'm not even sure if I ever wrote down my big list of things a language needs to be Feather < 1472088202 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1472088207 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because doing so would require thinking about Feather < 1472088208 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But most Americans can't really tell the difference between 225 years ago and today except in technology < 1472088211 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, I'm on the verge of thinking about it right now < 1472088226 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you never could even explain it in enough detail that anyone could even begin to infer such things < 1472088233 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you asked me before that, I almost would've said Napoleon died long before the Revolutionary War < 1472088244 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I know < 1472088264 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: You didn't mess with tenses enough < 1472088267 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is at least partly because all the more concrete bits keep changing to fit the more conceptual bits in < 1472088287 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the time travel model itself is very firm and easy to explain < 1472088288 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: now you're begging to question again. how do you know what most americans *today* believe and understand? < 1472088311 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Isn't the entire point of Feather that it's impossible, even with an oracle for all the biggest distinct undecidable problems? < 1472088317 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's basically "change the value that a clone function returned via rewinding in time to the point it was run, then continuing") < 1472088321 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: no < 1472088329 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would be boring. < 1472088330 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly I haven't figured out how to make it work, but it's meant to be possible < 1472088335 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I'm an American and I live today < 1472088337 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a time paradox would typically lead to an infinite loop < 1472088351 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the bigger problem is that a time loop can happen despite the lack of a contradiction < 1472088366 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: so am i, but i get the sense my understanding of american zeitgeist differs from yours < 1472088374 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. the problem is, when you go back and change the past, you need to change it in such a way that you decide not to use your time machine in the future < 1472088383 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ideally without changing anything else < 1472088395 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Are stable time loops possible? And are paradoxes the only (or best) way to execute an infinite loop? < 1472088400 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :some fixes to this problem involve, say, checking if an object has a method, and if not, going back in time to add it < 1472088422 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: stable time loops are possible in the same way that terminating recursion is possible < 1472088426 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need to find a base case somewhere < 1472088440 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was planning to have regular recursion too for loops < 1472088441 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: So it isn't a proper stable time loop then < 1472088444 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Feather isn't intentionally hard to use < 1472088461 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: well, the thing is < 1472088470 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :suppose you write an infinite recursion < 1472088475 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can approximate that with a finite recursion, right? < 1472088497 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(depending on the algo the approximation might either be good, or terrible, but the point is that you get a better approximation by cutting it off after a larger number of steps) < 1472088531 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: my sense of the american zeitgeist with regards to france is "it's far enough away to mostly ignore, but you'd think they'd help with the war more given their muslim problem. also they spell and pronounce everything all wrong" < 1472088542 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is waiting for a yes, or possibly no < 1472088574 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't get to ask me about Feather without having to think about the consequences too! < 1472088632 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :<\oren\> holy shit I have a batter-badder merger <-- coincidentally i learned just the other day about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flapping < 1472088711 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :…did I break hppavilion[1] already? I haven't even really reached the mindscrewy part yet < 1472088772 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems like it < 1472088788 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :feather does that...it's paradoxically quite the heavy burden to bear < 1472089477 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :* ais523 is waiting for a yes, or possibly no <-- it works in denotational semantics < 1472089504 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes, I know it works < 1472089510 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just don't know whether hppavilion[1] knows it works < 1472089516 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1472091054 0 :Phantom___Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1472094058 0 :erdic!~erdic@unaffiliated/motley QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1472094135 0 :erdic!~erdic@unaffiliated/motley JOIN :#esoteric < 1472094320 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@2a00:f41:38b9:75ba:de85:deff:fe55:967a QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1472094536 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472096956 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite < 1472097530 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1472098239 0 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet JOIN :#esoteric < 1472098732 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1472099772 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07S.I.L.O.S14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49632&oldid=49623 5* 03Rjhunjhunwala 5* (+591) 10 < 1472099805 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07S.I.L.O.S14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49633&oldid=49632 5* 03Rjhunjhunwala 5* (-11) 10 < 1472101306 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :?metar CYVR < 1472101306 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :CYVR 250300Z 31006KT 30SM FEW240 20/15 A3012 RMK CI1 SLP202 DENSITY ALT 300FT < 1472104433 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I got a raise, does that indicate that I'm doing a good job? < 1472104449 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/If // < 1472104475 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ask them < 1472104751 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: wage? < 1472104765 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :normally there is only a slight correlation < 1472105087 0 :Caesura!~Aedile@cpe-75-187-129-201.neo.res.rr.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1472105198 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: really? what determines pay increases normally? < 1472105235 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Flapping of butterflies, near as I can figure. < 1472105281 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: the duration of employment so far, employer's urge to share the profits, some quantum entanglements, etc < 1472105401 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see. maybe I'll just look up some sort of management book < 1472105465 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: more seriously, the most important factor determining your wage is the wage at the first month (or year) < 1472105503 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are always exceptions, but normally the increments (even after incentives) are not large enough to make up for the loss at the first wage < 1472105527 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the sad thing is the first wage is often determined by very irrational factors < 1472105552 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... well, my pay when I started this job was 70 kilodollars, and it's been raised to 80, but I wasn't told why < 1472105577 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should ask them why < 1472105582 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is how you can learn. < 1472105582 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :70k$ for years and then raised suddenly? < 1472105599 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: no, I got this job last year < 1472105604 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :One possibility is inflation I suppose < 1472105605 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :after graduation < 1472105636 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yeah, this year, the canadian dollar went down after the price of gasoline < 1472105679 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, the durational increment is one way to counter inflation < 1472105694 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I live in Canada, but I do not pay attention to that kinds of stuff; I do not drive a car < 1472105718 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you've got no explanation it is most likely explanation: you've got the standard increment < 1472105742 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess asking about the true explanation doesn't harm, though < 1472105873 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It probably means that your employer thought you were underpaid, and enough to worry about retention. < 1472105937 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whether that's due to re-evaluating how good of a job you were doing or market changes or other reasons, who knows. < 1472105956 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: actually, now that I think about it, maybe they noticed those google people stalking my linkedin < 1472106014 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :google people always stalk everyone < 1472106031 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, Google pays more than that even for entry-level engineering employees. < 1472106041 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not on linkedin (for my personal policy to avoid SNSes anyway) and was contacted three or four times so far < 1472106052 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though, Google also tends to employ in areas where 80 kilodollars is starvation wages. < 1472106056 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even for interns, I think. And so do most silly valley employers as far as I know. < 1472106062 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: bay area? < 1472106074 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472106076 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup. < 1472106077 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even 120k$ will barely make a cut, I guess < 1472106100 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Top internship offers in silly valley: https://twitter.com/rodneyfolz/status/724787290824798209 < 1472106124 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :120k$ goes somewhere from not far at all to, well, living pretty comfortably. Depending strongly on personal choices. < 1472106155 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, I bet I could get my school to unblock PornHub by justifying it with http://www.pornhub.com/insights/ (actually 100% SFW, surprisingly, assuming that sex-related words describing what people search for for purely statistical reasons aren't considered NSFW) < 1472106178 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: my average monthly expense does not exceed 1200$, I think, and I'm paid several times more (less than \oren\ however ;) so I'm pretty comfortable with that < 1472106196 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(They'd have a lot of trouble figuring it out, and I'd need to have a justification along the lines of "I need it for an essay", but it would work) < 1472106216 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :When I moved to the bay area in 2010, my expenses were ~$1000/month. < 1472106235 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: Yeah, if that's your typical monthly expenses $50k is pretty nice. < 1472106260 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly my standard of living would have been higher for the same cost somewhere else. < 1472106263 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I made the personal choice to keep living in my parents' house with no rent, hence my only expenses are food, cell phone and video games < 1472106273 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...wow, http://www.pornhub.com/emoji is just wrong < 1472106275 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: it's weird that the price level of Korea is actually considerably high < 1472106287 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good god does cost of living effect the value of money. < 1472106314 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :If income scales with cost of living, it probably makes sense to live in the highest cost-of-living area. < 1472106319 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, it usually doesn't. < 1472106330 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: the effect of higher price level seems to affect multi-person households, though < 1472106336 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/the effect of/* < 1472106348 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/\/\*$/\/\/*/ (sigh) < 1472106367 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION should have used s### instead < 1472106459 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect that *on average* the income to cost of living ratio is best near reasonably sizable cities but not the huge ones, in the US. (think Kansas City) < 1472106466 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean yeah, living at your parents' house as an adult is sometimes considered.. pathetic, but most people in my generation are doing it anyway... < 1472106492 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: Maybe pathetic by some, but by current generation standards it's hardly noteworthy. < 1472106512 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Particularly if you've got a paying job. < 1472106543 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :living alone is a bit hard, especially when you haven't lived alone at all < 1472106560 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :My parents left home at like 18 and got their own apartments and cars and such < 1472106565 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was on dorms for some decades and I was quite comfortable living alone < 1472106589 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: Anyway I bet you could be making a lot more money elsewhere if you cared to. < 1472106594 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :When my mom was my age, she had 4 kids. < 1472106619 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Possibly, but not relative to cost of living for him. < 1472106627 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I *had* to live with parents when I've initially graduated, but I got frustrated enough that I've got a shared house next year < 1472106628 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably even in Toronto. < 1472106634 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I don't know. < 1472106647 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: $80k *and living in his parents house*. Hard to beat. :) < 1472106674 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's ~$62k in USD < 1472106690 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't be surprised that \oren\ can put 90% of one's income to the saving account ;) < 1472106695 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/that/if/ < 1472106700 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I once did < 1472106708 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wishes he made $62k in St Louis. < 1472106716 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now down to about 60% < 1472106719 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Granted, at $55k I lived like a king there. < 1472106757 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, $750 rent, how I miss thee. < 1472106776 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :rent in toronto is typically $2000/mo < 1472106785 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :or more < 1472106795 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's pretty expensive. < 1472106829 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not *quite* Bay Area madness, but that's not far off. < 1472106846 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Berkeley I pay <$1500/month for a 1br apartment. < 1472106860 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which I think is somewhat below market. < 1472106867 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1472106879 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly it's not the highest-quality of apartments. But it's also walking distance to BART and to the office I work at. < 1472106892 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can get it to 1400 if you're willing to take an hour commute to work in the city centre < 1472106992 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :depending on public transport quality it might be actually a good trade-off < 1472107012 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :public transit in toronto? horrendous < 1472107019 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thought so < 1472107063 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I take the subway to work currently, and over a distnce of 5 km, it's only marginally faster than walking < 1472107092 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my house and workplace are about 20km apart, but there is a crazy subway inbetween which takes only <15 min (!!!!!) < 1472107102 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seoul is kind of crazy city < 1472107122 0 :Woody!~Woody@245.186.197.77.rev.sfr.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472107127 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a nice subway < 1472107170 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :trains discussion in #trains hth < 1472107179 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :TIL that channel < 1472107195 0 :Woody!~Woody@245.186.197.77.rev.sfr.net QUIT :Client Quit < 1472107265 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :...does that channel really exist < 1472107270 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course. < 1472107299 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :this summer the streetcar is down because... I have no idea why. they just decided to tear up the tracks < 1472107339 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so instead there is a bus, which is much slower than walking because of traffic < 1472107387 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :traffic made worse because of the construction in the middle of the road < 1472107434 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I tend not to talk much about trains because I know of several train maniacs (I tend to mock them with that word, hah) and every time I say about trains I cannot switch the topic to others < 1472107439 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I bet they'll leave giant potholes in the road till next summer < 1472107455 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: That's why it's a separate channel. < 1472107459 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1472107467 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you can not pay attention to it when you don't want to. < 1472107488 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :...wait so you are assuming that I'm supposed to join that channel already < 1472107780 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're not supposed to do anything. < 1472107958 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, thought that I'm supposed to join to that channel and *ignore* any conversation < 1472107968 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not to join is an option apparently < 1472107977 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can do whatever you like. < 1472109082 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Megastructure is a stupid word < 1472109344 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly, we must also define Hellostructure, Yoctostructure, Zeptostructure, Attostructure, Femtostructure, Picostructure, Nanostructure, Microstructure, Millistructure, Centistructure, Decistructure, Dekastructure, Hectostructure, Kilostructure, Gigastructure, Terastructure, Petastructure, Exastructure, Zetastructure, Yottastructure, and Hellastructure as well if we wish to use it < 1472109361 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Along with, perhaps, Myriastructure and Dimistructure < 1472109651 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikipedia's article https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megagon has the example image labeled "a regular megagon" < 1472109679 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you open the image, it says in the description that it's just a black circle < 1472109697 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ask for your money back. < 1472109987 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i first sumbled upon it on https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/65537-gon < 1472110021 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you open the actual svg, it _is_ a circle < 1472110134 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope, it is clearly not a circle. < 1472110162 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :The SVG has a big ol' in it. < 1472110190 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, sl someone actually did it? < 1472110191 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :neat < 1472110221 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup. Checked the source. < 1472110487 0 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is the minimum n for which a 1-pixel-wide regular n-gon, on a typical display, is indistinguishable from a circle? < 1472110745 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 pixel wide isn't very wide at all < 1472110747 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 HTH < 1472110801 0 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was just a warm-up problem, of course < 1472110809 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :"indistinguishable" by what means, and what is a "typical display" < 1472110814 0 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :(3, 4 if anti-aliased?) < 1472110871 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this era of billion pixel displays they may all be invisible on one of those ;-) < 1472111292 0 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is the minimum n for which a solid regular n-gon is indistinguishable from a disk, if both are rendered 1000 pixels in diameter with 256-level linear grayscale anti-aliasing? < 1472111452 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1472113364 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do I get to choose a non-integral offset for rendering, and can I distinguish all grey levels? < 1472113603 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Somehow these clarification questions are more interesting to me than the problem itself... I can do estimates like when the polygon border never differs by more than 0.1 pixels from the circle, but the actual question seems to require doing the actual rendering, at least partially, for various n and adjusted radii... doing that efficiently will get messy) < 1472113985 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you imagine if another fermat prime is ever found < 1472113998 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone will have to construct it as a regular polygon < 1472114052 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472114890 0 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :the next constructible p-gon candidate is 2^2^33 + 1, apparently < 1472115081 0 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: since the relative distances of the vertices (and pixel fragment areas) are irrational, any solution will probably have non-zero wiggle room for the offsets (both linear and angular) < 1472115143 0 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe this can be provably solved by relaxation to some linear programs... < 1472117008 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1472117750 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`bardworthlist http://www.bardsworth.com/?comic=the-simplest-solution < 1472117751 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: bardworthlist: not found < 1472117757 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, we don't have that? < 1472117758 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well < 1472120120 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: yes I got to the point where there's wiggle room; that's what I called messy. < 1472120129 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wiggling room < 1472123100 0 :rntz!~rntz@96.95.216.165 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1472123107 0 :rntz!~rntz@96.95.216.165 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472125702 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Alacrity14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49634&oldid=43000 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+13) 10/* External resources */ obviously < 1472127076 0 :7ITAADPZ4!~nick@62.6.146.242 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472127178 0 :7ITAADPZ4!~nick@62.6.146.242 PART #esoteric : < 1472129581 0 :sebbu2!?@? NICK :sebbu < 1472129942 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1472130979 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472131190 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1472131269 0 :espes!~espes@205.185.120.132 QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1472131352 0 :espes!~espes@205.185.120.132 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472132955 0 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-97-58.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-0/s526x395/14034901_329713930752185_4290839317358935232_n.jpg?oh=1572f16b3581b724deb362f55e644180&oe=5857D782/join #lainchan < 1472132960 0 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-97-58.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :dangit < 1472132982 0 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-97-58.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :COmptuer you need to actually pay attention when I do things like ctrl+a to high light text. < 1472133243 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18e43ef5.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1472133288 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07MiniStringFuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49635&oldid=49158 5* 03Erikkonstas 5* (+208) 10File argument < 1472134609 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1472135930 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07S.I.L.O.S14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49636&oldid=49633 5* 03TuxCrafting 5* (+39) 10i dont think you want this in a `pre` block < 1472136148 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07S.I.L.O.S14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49637&oldid=49636 5* 03TuxCrafting 5* (+13) 10It's not Markdown ._. < 1472138685 0 :PinealGlandOptic!~PinealGla@82.144.205.57 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472138704 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1472139063 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` ls bin/b*list < 1472139065 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bin/bardsworthlist < 1472139074 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: i recommend correct spelling hth < 1472139310 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah.... right < 1472139313 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :typo < 1472139543 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1472139630 0 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1472139816 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :panel 2 of today's darths & droids doesn't make sense to me. have they managed to mix up annie and sally? < 1472139856 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :otoh sally is in university now, isn't she... < 1472139858 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Talk:MiniStringFuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49638&oldid=49119 5* 03Erikkonstas 5* (+710) 10Joke? Not designed as a joke, though. < 1472139862 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe not. < 1472139912 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07MiniStringFuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49639&oldid=49635 5* 03Erikkonstas 5* (+28) 10 < 1472139945 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Joke language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49640&oldid=49062 5* 03Erikkonstas 5* (+21) 10MSF- in! < 1472139956 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait... annie and _ben_? < 1472139980 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION assumes he'll find out in the forum. < 1472140022 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07!!SuperPrime14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49641&oldid=49034 5* 03Erikkonstas 5* (+0) 10 < 1472141663 0 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-nfnwgyujzbogfiwr QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1472141671 0 :heroux_!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-xriyroheyybpwmtf JOIN :#esoteric < 1472141699 0 :heroux_!?@? NICK :heroux < 1472142918 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :man we need more people in other time zones. < 1472143000 0 :MoALTz!~no@78-11-183-124.static.ip.netia.com.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1472143013 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe less? < 1472143031 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Proposal: put all of north america on one time zone < 1472143051 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and all of europe on another < 1472143072 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(re above: apparently no one in the forum thought it was weird) < 1472143080 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? oren < 1472143080 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren is a Canadian esolanger who would like to obliterate time zones so that he can talk to his father who lives in the same house. He'll orobablu get the hang of toycj tuping soon. He also has a rabid hatred of the two-storey lowercase a and other shady characters. < 1472143095 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :WE ALL KNOW WHAT YOU THINK ABOUT TIME ZONES < 1472143125 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :is france on the same time zone as poland yet? < 1472143146 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's just an hour difference, it's not like it'll matter < 1472143159 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, it looks like they are < 1472143161 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :if poland even is eastern - let me check < 1472143170 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@time FreeFull < 1472143172 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Local time for FreeFull is Thu Aug 25 16:39:32 2016 < 1472143192 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not poland. oh right he's actually in the uk isn't he < 1472143208 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@time nortti < 1472143209 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Local time for nortti is Thu Aug 25 18:40:09 2016 < 1472143219 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's better. finland is eastern. < 1472143233 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the uk is weird on the map I found. It's not on the same time zone as spain < 1472143270 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the uk isn't weird by definition, that's where the zero meridian is. < 1472143278 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means that you can change time zones by flying directly south < 1472143295 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the spanish decided to join their french neighbors, though. < 1472143349 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the middle zone contains a lot more countries than you'd think just by geography. < 1472143393 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably because it is convenient for neighbors to have the same one. < 1472143532 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well maybe everyone in eurasia should use Moscow time < 1472143564 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, there is a lot of countries in UTC+1 < 1472143611 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both France and Spain should be in UTC+0 by geographyy < 1472143625 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :But they're in UTC+1 for some reason < 1472143744 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e8/Standard_World_Time_Zones.png < 1472143746 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well actually, now that britain isn't in the EU, it whould be easier for the EU to have a single time zone < 1472143752 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Timezones are weird < 1472143755 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1472143791 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and we should have as few of them as possible < 1472143796 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: You'd need to change the timezone of Greece, Bulgaria and Romania though < 1472143817 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nepal is UTC+5.75 < 1472143833 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whyyyyy < 1472143855 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Australia is split into UTC+8.75, UTC+9.5 and UTC+10 < 1472143857 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :they should be the same as either china or india < 1472143890 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :India is UTC+5.5 < 1472143943 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really care what the offsets are, I just think there should be fewer zones < 1472143958 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll never convince people < 1472143967 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :india and china each have only one zone < 1472143970 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :standardize on UTC+3.14 everywhere < 1472143988 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :despite their horizontal extent < 1472143992 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: WHAT? isn't Australia split to three zones, two of which are integer hours offset? < 1472144016 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION checks < 1472144060 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: Oh, the map I'm looking at might not be fully correct < 1472144098 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :timezones are great and we should have as many as possible :D < 1472144138 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Australia is split to +0800 (Perth), +0930 (empty desert), and +1000 (where all the big cities are) < 1472144166 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, how about eight time zones: San Francisco, New York, London, Berlin, Moscow, Delhi, Beijing, Tokyo < 1472144242 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: that doesn't work. you can't have all of the African tropics switch DST backwards < 1472144290 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, how about eight time zones in the northern hemisphere, and the southern hemisphere does somthign else < 1472144306 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do we need to put entire countries or territories in the same time zone? let's just inconvenience everyone proportional to their size and have 24 time zones which exactly correspond with 15 degree multiple longitude lines < 1472144337 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: mostly for easy referencing < 1472144353 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: lol good one < 1472144366 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like "I'm in China, therefore, beijing time, all the time" < 1472144384 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :china is weird < 1472144414 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be a lot easier to reference by just looking up a place's longitude and not having to do any special casing < 1472144432 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :just put gps chips in every clock too < 1472144544 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe all of north america should use Dallas time < 1472144634 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'd be cool if all of the world used actual local time, like how it was back in the time of sun dials < 1472144662 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually that would suck. did suck. that's why zones were invented < 1472144721 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, people actually noticed it when they began traveling fast by train < 1472144737 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: that was more like in the time of temple clocks < 1472144742 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: exactly < 1472144753 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :they used local times everywhere, which was horrible for following train travel timetables < 1472144759 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hard to put together a train time table when every town uses a differentime < 1472146086 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Later < 1472146628 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder why all my spaceplanes hav twin tails < 1472146725 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :you played a lot of sonic when you were younger < 1472146885 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1472147863 0 :macin!~macin@106.208.126.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472147943 0 :macin!~macin@106.208.126.154 PART #esoteric : < 1472149337 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472150392 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1472151299 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-84.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1472151346 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-84.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a way to draw a regular hexagram in one stroke the same way you can a regular pentagram? < 1472151376 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-84.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm going to guess no, and that that's true for any n-gram where n is even) < 1472151406 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's two triangles < 1472151408 0 :nortti!nortti@ayu.smar.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a rule for draw a graph without taking an edge twice, but I forget what it is < 1472151410 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-84.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh, looks like I'm wrong; you can do it with an octagram < 1472151449 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :nortti, there must be either zero or precisely two nodes with odd degree < 1472151455 0 :nortti!nortti@ayu.smar.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, thanks < 1472151465 0 :nortti!nortti@ayu.smar.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea, that makes sense < 1472151470 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-84.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :(heptagrams are much more holy than hexagrams) < 1472151472 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :If zero, it makes a loop < 1472151474 0 :nortti!nortti@ayu.smar.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, for a hexagram, yes < 1472151594 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-2hj4tbos9tbg52s4n1sxw2kmb.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1472151889 0 :bibibi!~bibibi@64.137.202.202 QUIT :Changing host < 1472151889 0 :bibibi!~bibibi@unaffiliated/bibibi JOIN :#esoteric < 1472153301 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-84.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :If there are pronouns for nouns, why are there not proverbs for verbs or proadjectives for adjectives or proadverbs for adverbs? < 1472153821 0 :nortti!nortti@ayu.smar.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are pro-forms, which are more general version of pronouns < 1472153874 0 :Reece`!~Ner@cpc4-wiga13-2-0-cust799.18-3.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472154338 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: just draw the inner hexagon first then add the points to the sides. < 1472154422 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472154435 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: furthermore, after 6 vertices, there is not "a" regular n-gram. there are many different n-grams for each n. < 1472154457 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiyais523 < 1472154493 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1472154504 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-84.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1472154549 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :welcome back to idling land < 1472154558 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :made any useful or fun code lately? < 1472154585 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, Quickbooks is following me around: http://thedevilspanties.com/archives/10418 < 1472154607 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-84.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1472154694 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: not really < 1472154699 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have an esolang idea but I haven't written any of it down < 1472154708 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote wikipedia < 1472154709 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :104) * Phantom_Hoover wonders where the size of the compiled Linux kernel comes from. To comply with the GFDL, there's a copy of Wikipedia in there. \ 888) is there a way to tag things on wikipedia as "wtf this makes no sense"? quintopia: {{featured article}} < 1472154720 0 :nortti!nortti@ayu.smar.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is this margis enough space to contain it? < 1472154725 0 :nortti!nortti@ayu.smar.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :*margin < 1472154753 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nortti: it should have a fairly short description in English < 1472154760 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just need to translate it from internal-thought-language < 1472154871 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like it because it's very simple and helps make progress towards at least two of the ideas I had < 1472154882 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure if I should write an interp myself or leave it to someone else < 1472154921 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should implement it in BCT < 1472154971 0 :shikhin!?@? NICK :hahagoodidea < 1472154975 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1472154981 0 :hahagoodidea!?@? NICK :D < 1472154987 0 :D!?@? NICK :colonD < 1472154988 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is the sort of language that's much easier to compile than interpret < 1472154994 0 :colonD!?@? NICK :shikhin < 1472154996 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'd hate to write a compiler in BCT < 1472155018 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wasn't being particularly serious < 1472155196 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :irony transports really well on IRC < 1472155216 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably wasn't particularly ironic either < 1472155225 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's go with flippant < 1472155251 0 :Zarutian!~zarutian@168-110-22-46.fiber.hringdu.is JOIN :#esoteric < 1472155328 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472155383 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION watches expectantly whether ais523 writes the idea up < 1472155408 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm thinking about the details atm < 1472155411 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't hold your breath man. give him some space. < 1472155460 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes it takes years to write up ideas < 1472155473 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah. < 1472155475 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know. < 1472155476 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes it takes indefinitely long (e.g. Feather) < 1472155717 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07David Madore14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49642&oldid=45477 5* 03B jonas 5* (+21) 10 < 1472156327 0 :Kaynato!~Aedile@cpe-75-187-129-201.neo.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1472156551 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-84.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1472157064 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1472157147 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07EXCON14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49643&oldid=35250 5* 03Mychal 5* (+543) 10Added Io implementation < 1472158057 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1472158209 0 :augur!~augur@2602:304:cdac:e260:a470:45f6:2c84:df73 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472158712 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-84.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1472158824 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bleh, I need to do this right < 1472158836 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's one of those things that once I define the language, it'll be hard to change < 1472158845 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are certain properties I want it to have that I'm not sure it wil have < 1472159526 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-84.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1472159679 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, that sucks < 1472159711 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are mature languages that have ugly faults that are very hard to fix now, and would have been trivial to fix with no drawbacks when they were first designed < 1472159720 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :compatibility is a bitch, but we depend on it < 1472159782 0 :shikhin!?@? NICK :socanifirefly < 1472159786 0 :socanifirefly!?@? NICK :shikhin < 1472159848 0 :shikhin!?@? NICK :shikhpin < 1472160125 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have a list of words and you must produce a number N in [3,5] and a list of 10 letters (which can be repeated) such that there are at least X words in your list that are at least N letters long that can be written by using only letters in your list < 1472160305 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you can always just start over if you get things wrong. look at python 3.x < 1472160309 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: what < 1472160320 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll make an example < 1472160333 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: in esolangs there are other issues < 1472160341 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. escaping syntax in Underload < 1472160347 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was in the original spec but never implemetned < 1472160387 0 :Reece`!~Ner@cpc4-wiga13-2-0-cust799.18-3.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Quit: Alsithyafturttararfunar < 1472160404 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: sure, that sort of things happens even in non-esolangs < 1472160416 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the infamous EOF issues with Brainfuck. < 1472160428 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I don't think those were ever actually resolved though < 1472160436 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could argue about EOF issues in C < 1472160438 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :word list is english dictionary, my number is 3, my list is A B C A D E G A I D and these words are at least 3 letters long: decade bed dice ... < 1472160458 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. Yeah, EOF in Brainfuck was not resolved, the status quo is "-1, 0, or no change; pick one" < 1472160469 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(specifially, what happens if you read EOF from a terminal and then read again; the C spec implies you should get EOF again, on Linux/UNIX you can get data though) < 1472160478 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: as one of the more famous examples (that is luckiliy mostly a thing of the past) is the original meaning of the export keyword in C++93 which has to do with templates and separate compilation and almost nobody implemented it < 1472160503 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the C spec implies that? < 1472160510 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: I think so < 1472160520 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I asked Usenet about it at one point, because it was an interesting question < 1472160532 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the basic issue is that the concept of "end of file" doesn't really apply to unix/linux syscalls < 1472160539 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have a "no data" return but it doesn't mean the same thing < 1472160541 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Not especially the case: if you're using stdio routines, POSIX says you keep getting EOF. < 1472160568 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I think I've seen a file spontaneously un-EOF using stdio < 1472160572 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might be misremembering though < 1472160578 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because reading an EOF from the terminal via a syscall, has stdio set the EOF flag. < 1472160579 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, either I'm missing something or that was broken. < 1472160594 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: while we're there, is it true that on some unices you could lseek a terminal and get success? < 1472160604 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it may be that the EOF flag stays set but getchar returns non-EOF < 1472160612 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: I don't know, but it wouldn't surprise mte < 1472160614 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*me < 1472160621 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd expect it to be a no-op with an incorrect return value < 1472160638 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've heard a rumour about that, and it's scary because I'd like a way to test whether a file descriptor can be seeked (so that a program can use a faster algorithm if it can be seeked, or a slower and more memory-consuming one if it can't). < 1472160658 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Both POSIX and C say that's invalid, but it's possible for an implementation to be invalid. < 1472160662 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the rumour was that it read and wrote some sort of byte counter that was also incremented when you read (or written, I dunno) bytes to the terminal < 1472160672 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a completely meaningless counter that is < 1472160691 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: what's more interesting is not whether you can seek a terminal, but whether you can tell a terminal < 1472160694 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yes, it's effectively a no-op < 1472160707 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I said lseek. that's the syscall behind both seek and tell. < 1472160724 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no separate tell syscall, you just call lseek with 0 offset and SEEK_CUR directionality < 1472160730 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The behavior of lseek() on devices which are incapable of seeking is implementation-defined." LOL. < 1472160751 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: ah right < 1472160764 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: they SORT OF need to say that because of tape drives that can somewhat seek but not arbitrarily like a hard disk or a regular file < 1472160790 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I just tested, the problem is with fgets < 1472160806 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it reads an EOF it sets the EOF flag to 1 < 1472160816 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but otherwise acts as though the EOF wasn't there < 1472160821 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. it keeps returning data if the data is present < 1472160837 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Holy hell, that's actually in POSIX. < 1472160841 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: can you clear that flag with clearerr() or fseek() ? < 1472160854 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: clearerr() should work, I'd have thought < 1472160866 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Correction, that's in ISO C. < 1472160876 0 :PinealGlandOptic!~PinealGla@82.144.205.57 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1472160878 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also fgets appears to read one read() result at a time; I don't know if it has signal handler handling < 1472160891 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's kind-of hard to make a signal handler interrupt the middle of an fgets < 1472160893 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless, hmm < 1472160908 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :fgets per ISO C does not examine the end-of-file indicator, while most other functions do. < 1472160915 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could specify unbuffered I/O, then fgets into a buffer which was partly in unmapped memory < 1472160936 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: would that send a signal as opposed to just an EFAULT with no signal? < 1472160937 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you could handle the SIGSEGV via allocating the rest of the buffer < 1472160958 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect that's technically undefined behaviour though < 1472160969 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: logically it should send a signal, shouldn't it? < 1472160971 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I think in Linux no syscall raises a SIGSEGV from faulting on a user memory access synchroniously. < 1472160981 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it should return EFAULT I think < 1472160989 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: flock() in another thread and then raise a signal in that thread. < 1472160990 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Voila. < 1472160990 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, the syscall would efault, but fgets should convert that into a segfault < 1472160996 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what... < 1472160999 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would segfault if it were using buffered I/O! < 1472161000 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno < 1472161027 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wouldn't interrupt the read(), granted. For that it'd need to be blocked on something.) < 1472161032 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :EFAULT isn't even a legal value from fgets, AFAICT it doesn't set errno < 1472161034 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :(like a pipe) < 1472161040 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah < 1472161045 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is up with this function! < 1472161053 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: at that point it's probably implementation-defined, I've no idea what fgets would do < 1472161089 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you could try to simulate an interrupted syscall by ptrace with a debugger, breaking on the syscall and sending a signal < 1472161103 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :POSIX' semantics for fgets errors are "see fgetc", FWIW. < 1472161119 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: not fread? < 1472161140 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :If a read error occurs, the error indicator for the stream shall be set, fgets() shall return a null pointer, and shall set errno to indicate the error. < 1472161141 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, it does set errno < 1472161145 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: Not fread. < 1472161150 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forgot I had the POSIX manual here as well as the Linux one < 1472161154 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :until just now < 1472161165 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/ Helpful advice. < 1472161184 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :posix manual (needs free registration once) => https://www2.opengroup.org/ogsys/catalog/t101 < 1472161197 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :linux manual => https://www.kernel.org/doc/man-pages/ < 1472161216 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also glibc manual is relevant => https://www.gnu.org/software/libc/manual/ < 1472161240 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :openbsd manual and freebsd manual resp => http://man.openbsd.org/cgi-bin/man.cgi , http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi < 1472161255 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're connected on the internet, you likely have lots of manuals < 1472161270 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, I also have local copies of some of these for convenience < 1472161330 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the POSIX manual is in the Ubuntu repos < 1472161335 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :man 3p fgets, etc. < 1472161345 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(once it's installed) < 1472161347 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: most of it, yes < 1472161827 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` quote shachaf | paste < 1472161830 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/file/tip/paste/paste.4030 < 1472162184 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? minkoijjikop < 1472162185 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :minkoijjikop? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1472162194 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone add a wisdom for that < 1472162203 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe make an esolang of that name < 1472162376 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1472162433 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: fehér leple foszlányait < 1472162761 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :No-got. < 1472162786 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1472162793 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: See above. < 1472162793 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: would not work either on some ms-dos compilers. :) i remember. < 1472162982 0 :FireFly!~firefly@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't know you were around back then, fungot < 1472162982 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: i'll look into it later tonight.) < 1472163056 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so in this other irc network there's a game we play < 1472163060 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's basically scrabble < 1472163077 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :bots generates 10 letters which can be repeated, and a number < 1472163098 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you must write as many words as possible with those letters, and your words must be at least letters long < 1472163116 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :problem is: the current bot is awful < 1472163146 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. it just produced this list N D S L Z R A U U K and you had to write words that are at least 5 letters long < 1472163163 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :and exactly 0 italian words fit that criterion < 1472163178 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1472163179 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :really? < 1472163182 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1472163191 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, it has two vowels < 1472163200 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and enough consonants < 1472163207 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you allowed to add accent to the letters? < 1472163208 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't repeat letters < 1472163219 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1472163227 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you said "can be repeated" < 1472163227 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. "sara" has 2 a but that list only has 1 < 1472163237 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah in that list there are two u's < 1472163248 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that sense they can be repeated < 1472163258 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you'd need to find something that ands in an "a" and has a "u" in it? < 1472163275 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes or maybe no a and two u's < 1472163287 0 :moonythedwarf_!~IceChat9@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf JOIN :#esoteric < 1472163301 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my problem is: how do i generate better lists of letters? < 1472163339 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: are you allowed to add accents to those letters? < 1472163360 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :we use a dictionary that has many unaccented versions of accented words < 1472163423 0 :moonythedwarf_!?@? NICK :polybot < 1472163446 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: idekinn hideg éj sziszeg aztán < 1472163447 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: 4 cakeprophet: bf ( thread-id 3) ( 4 5 ( ( 1 3)... < 1472163481 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :cake-prophet? < 1472163545 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: nekem fütyöl < 1472163545 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: ( a regex literal would not be allowed in sisc? < 1472163574 0 :polybot!?@? NICK :moon < 1472163584 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: CakeProphet was a regular here a while back < 1472163586 0 :moon!?@? NICK :moonythedwarf < 1472163597 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah, that explains it < 1472163600 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC the full username was "the prophet wizard of the crayon cake" but it doesn't fit on IRC < 1472163662 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: my algorithm would be this: generate letters according to letter frequencies of the language, then check a wordlist to see how many words there are (computers can do this quickly) < 1472163665 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's not enough, reroll < 1472163675 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually I already have a program for solving this problem < 1472163689 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it works like this: I have a wordlist where the words have had their letters sorted into alphabetical order < 1472163710 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I just create a regex a?d?k?l?n?r?s?u?u?z? < 1472163717 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and regex it against the wordlist < 1472163721 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice! < 1472163784 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are 20 5-letter-or-longer words that fit these rules in English (using my English word list) < 1472163792 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just roll the 16 boggle master cubes and discard 6 at random < 1472163794 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the vast majority are four-letter words that have been pluralized by adding an s < 1472163805 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is very good thanks < 1472163837 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are two six-letter words: "kudzus" and "drunks" (both five-letter words that were pluralized by adding an s) < 1472163849 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have such a wordlist for Italian but it should be easy enough to generate one < 1472163857 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1472163865 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks a lot that's a very nice hint < 1472163900 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Máglyára, ki ellenszegül, minden velsz énekest! < 1472163900 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: yes it's stupid a 6 can't be applied: it's not a useful religion for developing a http server application < 1472163908 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course you need some sort of dictionary to go back from the sorted words to the originals, but that's easy enough to write as well < 1472163926 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually i don't need it < 1472163940 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bleh, it's so hard to get out of the habit of seeing foreign words and trying to guess what they mean from the spelling < 1472163942 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's fine as long as it matches 20 or more words < 1472163945 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but with Hungarian there's no point < 1472163965 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as it'd only work on loanwords < 1472163967 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: all four of the above are quotes from Arany János poems < 1472163973 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(admittedly Hungarian does have a lot of loanwords) < 1472164092 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the poems should be easy to find, and some of the poems even have translations, you can try to find some on http://www.magyarulbabelben.net/works/hu-en/Arany_J%C3%A1nos-1817 -- I don't know how good translations they are < 1472164116 0 :shikhpin!?@? NICK :shikhin < 1472164142 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Szondi két apródja" has a translation by Makai Ádám, presumably that's a good one because he's famous, I've no idea about the rest < 1472164193 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: fewer loanwords back then in the 19th century, especially very few loanwords from English < 1472164252 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, the quotes alone aren't very meaningful without knowing the whole poem < 1472164440 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: do you have a twin? < 1472164440 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: the interpreter exposes the c library < 1472164822 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Anyu, én igyekszem a haragom levetni. < 1472164858 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-2hj4tbos9tbg52s4n1sxw2kmb.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in < 1472165009 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: I find your lack of uptime disturbing < 1472165311 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Idea: a multiplayer online game where the protocol between server and client is open, and therefore anyone is welcome to produce their own game client < 1472165334 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus all game logics must be enforced at the server < 1472165487 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so some of the metagame would be programming a better/more efficient client < 1472165537 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to most games where using a better client would be considered cheating < 1472165847 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :E.g. consider a FPS where use of aimbots is not only allowed but encouraged, but the game simulates such things as recoil at the server. < 1472165878 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's with fungot? < 1472166780 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1472166911 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`8-ball when will I be young again? < 1472166911 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is decidedly so. < 1472166916 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no < 1472166949 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think it is good with non-yes/no questions < 1472166962 0 :Zarutian!~zarutian@168-110-22-46.fiber.hringdu.is QUIT :Quit: Zarutian < 1472167290 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PART #esoteric : < 1472167464 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Special:Log/block14]]4 block10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5* 10blocked [[02User:199.15.233.16210]] with an expiry time of 1 year (anonymous users only, account creation disabled): Spamming links to external sites < 1472167504 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm. < 1472167511 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1472167514 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what's with fungot. < 1472167514 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: and i think it does < 1472167533 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I guess it was just the reply count limit. < 1472168115 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? irc < 1472168116 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :IRC is short for "Internet Relay Chat". It is named so because all the servers are constructed from relays. < 1472168169 0 :olsner!~salparot@c80-217-120-181.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? fungot < 1472168169 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: not? its simplicity is not a procedure < 1472168170 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot is our beloved channel mascot and voice of reason. < 1472168343 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18e43ef5.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472168531 0 :byteflame!~byteflame@wopr-144-167-202-13.ddns.ualr.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1472168825 0 :byteflame!~byteflame@wopr-144-167-202-13.ddns.ualr.edu QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1472168916 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: thanks to you, now i have this https://arin.ga/gqBhgB/raw < 1472168940 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :neat < 1472169096 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472169123 0 :Lord_of_Life!Elite12246@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-gcsbdpqpzzlypkwx QUIT :Excess Flood < 1472169147 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :my dictionary has 282043 words and that thing takes .186s https://arin.ga/NKWiVq/raw < 1472169150 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an awk script < 1472169254 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://arin.ga/nhRTKL/raw here it is < 1472169428 0 :Lord_of_Life!Elite12246@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-ildhnuqfyzkjcmcn JOIN :#esoteric < 1472169517 0 :MoALTz!~no@78-11-183-124.static.ip.netia.com.pl QUIT :Quit: Leaving