< 1469577643 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1469577703 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :bood evenily < 1469577889 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :børjansoir! < 1469578102 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469578285 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : long time no fet <-- hm cross-language pun? < 1469578324 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION checks omniglot for whether it works in any single one
< 1469578427 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm nope. no language has both ja=yes and no=no < 1469578436 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(on that list, anyway) < 1469578685 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : Remember kids: Chicken may seem fun, but remember to be safe <-- . o O ( UNSAFECOERCED CHICKEN ) < 1469578769 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? lel < 1469578777 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lel? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1469578780 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? lol < 1469578783 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol stands for laughing out legends < 1469578802 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds reasonable < 1469578829 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :league of loud < 1469578988 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469578998 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a fet? < 1469579055 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a fet accompli < 1469579128 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, Nofet is presumably Jafet's evil twin. < 1469579143 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or nemesis, maybe. < 1469579166 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the difference < 1469579192 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :nemeses don't need to be family hth < 1469579255 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm i suppose evil universe mirror twins aren't technically either. < 1469579293 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(exercise: how many ways can you permute evil, universe, mirror and twin there and still make sense) < 1469579306 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Are they genetic clones? < 1469579321 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is the goatee genetic? < 1469579340 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION mapole oerjan en français
< 1469579344 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: i thought cloning implied a common substrate. < 1469579523 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used to think "beard" meant "goatee". < 1469579534 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't know about the latter word. < 1469579541 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fancy < 1469579542 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still feel odd about using it. < 1469579560 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as you don't think it means goatse < 1469579589 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION points boily at myname
< 1469579606 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.o < 1469579667 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh? < 1469579668 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wut? < 1469579676 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah! < 1469579685 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION happily mapoles myname with glee
< 1469579692 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1469579697 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^ < 1469579710 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION *thwack* *thwack* *thwack* myname
< 1469579915 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469579982 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469579994 0 :boily_!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469580000 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: Poulet! < 1469580017 0 :boily_!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :maudit routeur de mes deux m'a te ******* aux vidanges tu vas voir ça sera pas long! < 1469580020 0 :boily_!?@? NICK :boily < 1469580079 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey how can i learn proper québécois when you censor the important words tdnh < 1469580148 0 :centrinia!~centrinia@107-208-218-105.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1469580171 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :«crisser» was the word. < 1469580271 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :squee! < 1469580375 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's the French «crisser» (“to screech”, “to squeal”), and Québécois «crisser» (“to do something with violence or suddenly”). < 1469580408 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ic < 1469580574 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :derived from Christ, commonly pronounced «crisse» /kʁɪs/. < 1469580612 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :jøss < 1469580735 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm apparently "sheesh" is also one < 1469580769 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :jøss? < 1469580821 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :jøss. < 1469580931 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469581294 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ssqueely? < 1469581379 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :squinthellopia. < 1469581418 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat do < 1469581501 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :random dizziness. not moving much. < 1469581537 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O < 1469581537 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@metar KATL < 1469581537 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :KATL 262352Z 20009KT 10SM FEW075 FEW250 33/17 A3000 RMK AO2 SLP147 CB DSNT S & SW T03330172 10356 20333 55002 < 1469581551 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :that got more mild since last i checked < 1469581556 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@vps.jaboja.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1469581585 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is it true that quebec is less anti-american than anglophone canadia? < 1469581650 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469581695 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :canadia is anti-american? < 1469581731 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :politically < 1469581777 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess my question supports your point. there's no feeling of animosity here. < 1469581797 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469581810 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469582235 0 :Zekka!~zekka@167.220.99.166 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1469583272 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently if no party gets a majority, then the House of Rep.s will pick the president, and the Senate will pick the vice president. that could be fun! < 1469583290 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469583375 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you could have Paul Ryan/Tim Kaine! Or Hillary Clinton/Donald Trump < 1469583397 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or any number of horrifying cross-party appointments < 1469583431 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469583477 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :My battery wasn't charging for some reason, so I bought a new laptop charger with more watts < 1469583486 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :now it's charging up good! < 1469583490 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat. < 1469583541 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat indeed < 1469583566 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :specifically, 90 wats instead of only 65 < 1469583655 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> replicate "wat" 25 < 1469583656 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type ‘Int’ with actual type ‘[Char]’ < 1469583656 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : In the first argument of ‘replicate’, namely ‘"wat"’ < 1469583656 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : In the expression: replicate "wat" 25 < 1469583663 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :dang < 1469583841 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehehe this is charging up so damn fast < 1469583850 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is anyone watching esa < 1469583986 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is esa < 1469584016 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :European Space Agency hth < 1469584047 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i always have a good eye on my space agencies < 1469584071 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :the North American Space Agency is better hth < 1469584104 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: it's National Aeronautics and Space Administration < 1469584110 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, "better" < 1469584127 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: no, it's an agency for canada and mexico as well < 1469584191 0 :Zekka!~zekka@216.206.111.151 JOIN :#esoteric < 1469584261 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`relcome Zekka < 1469584301 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469584328 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1469584343 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should sleep < 1469584366 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`relcome Zekka < 1469584371 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​09Zekka: 02Welcome 06to 13the 04international 07hub 08for 09esoteric 02programming 06language 13design 04and 07deployment! 08For 09more 02information, 06check 13out 04our 07wiki: 08. 09(For 02the 06other 13kind 04of 07esoterica, 08try 09#esoteric 02on 06EFnet 13or 04DALnet.) < 1469584375 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@localtime myname < 1469584377 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Local time for myname is Wed Jul 27 02:52:57 2016 < 1469584610 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: DEEP CHICKEN < 1469585370 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469585397 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: european speedrunner assembly < 1469585406 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1469585425 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :www.esamarathon.com < 1469585516 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469586018 0 :Zekka!~zekka@216.206.111.151 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1469586442 0 :Zekka!~zekka@216.206.111.151 JOIN :#esoteric < 1469586446 0 :Froo!~Frooxius@194.108.5.201 QUIT :Quit: *bubbles away* < 1469586608 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you run fast enough, you get into space, obviously. < 1469586701 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469586716 0 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@194.108.5.201 JOIN :#esoteric < 1469586977 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, i did that twice < 1469587279 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469587425 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is not the case that a human can run arbitrarily fast without getting into space. < 1469587456 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how so? < 1469587538 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469587621 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :As an example, I cannot run at 120 miles per hour (200 kilometers per hour) without getting into space. < 1469587641 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :define space < 1469587958 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469588156 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am wondering wether the sentence is corrext under the assumption that people cannot do arbitrary small turns < 1469588194 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. for every speed you are running, there should be a smallest possible circle you can run in < 1469588206 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the size of those should increment as speed does < 1469588225 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :leading to space at some ridiculously high speed < 1469588301 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well at some speed, the ground falls away from your feet and you can't accelerate yourself < 1469588349 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :only if you accelerate in steps that are too small < 1469588368 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i get from 0 to speed of light in one instant, that should work out < 1469588384 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you'll end up in space < 1469588393 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :SPAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACE < 1469588399 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the point < 1469588421 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: a = v^2/r hth < 1469588438 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1469588457 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :speed of light should be slightly higher < 1469588488 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :at horizantal speed v > sqrt(g*r), you fall upward < 1469588530 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(where g is earths gravity and r is earth's radius) < 1469588548 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i figured that much < 1469588561 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the equation might not be quite relativistically correct. < 1469588591 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Acceleration is square of speed divided by radius? < 1469588614 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a circular movement, yes < 1469588785 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1469588818 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so as long as r cannot get as close to 0 as wanted, you will always break out < 1469588824 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am correct then < 1469590534 0 :spiette_!~spiette@198-200-116-42.cpe.distributel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469590608 0 :spiette_!?@? NICK :simonp < 1469590635 0 :simonp!?@? NICK :spiette_ < 1469591788 0 :spiette_!~spiette@198-200-116-42.cpe.distributel.net QUIT :Quit: :qa! < 1469592844 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469594493 0 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet JOIN :#esoteric < 1469595395 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, I finally have a laptop charger that can charge while the sytem is powered up! < 1469595469 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :spiffy < 1469595608 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does the charger go on your lap? < 1469595659 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yeah but the obvious question is why did this laptop come with a 65 watt charger when that's inadequate to both charge the battery and run the system at full power < 1469595709 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :do they expect people to shut off their laptops to charge them? does anyone do that? < 1469595832 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suspect when you bought it, you forgot to check the box where it said to charge extra hth < 1469596227 0 :Kaynato!~Aedile@cpe-75-187-129-201.neo.res.rr.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1469596314 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION grabs the swatter and swats oerjan -----###
< 1469596347 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i expected that. < 1469598496 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-71-178-208-237.washdc.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469601008 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469601012 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469601358 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-71-178-208-237.washdc.fios.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1469601448 0 :contrapumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin QUIT :Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1469602243 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469603266 0 :byteflame!~cpt@50.25.160.41 JOIN :#esoteric < 1469603317 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite < 1469603369 0 :byteflame!~cpt@50.25.160.41 QUIT :Client Quit < 1469603386 0 :byteflame!~cpt@50.25.160.41 JOIN :#esoteric < 1469603485 0 :byteflame!~cpt@50.25.160.41 QUIT :Client Quit < 1469603500 0 :byteflame!~cpt@50.25.160.41 JOIN :#esoteric < 1469603777 0 :byteflame!~cpt@50.25.160.41 QUIT :Client Quit < 1469603794 0 :byteflame!~cpt@50.25.160.41 JOIN :#esoteric < 1469604643 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469604885 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1469605487 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :idea for a new kernel: let people use recv on non socket file descriptors < 1469605548 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :so e.g. you can do non blocking reads without fcntl < 1469605601 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes please. < 1469605629 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though... recv *already works* on non-socket FDs. < 1469605637 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it? < 1469605641 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think so? < 1469605654 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least not on linux < 1469605673 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty sure you get ENOTSOCK < 1469605714 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depends on if you have a non-zero flags argument. < 1469605728 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, huh. That's *optional* behavior. < 1469605746 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Per POSIX recv may refuse to work on non-sockets as it sees fit. < 1469605769 0 :sewilton!sid32560@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-froxskwkssibuhvk QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1469605791 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, per POSIX it's required to. < 1469605793 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, I suck. < 1469605836 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION pats pikhq's head
< 1469605839 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: More useful thing: let poll and/or select actually tell if a read request will block or not on a file. < 1469605847 0 :zgrep!sid43445@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bwwxspzwxaisivku QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1469605853 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly I have been up too long and should go to bed. < 1469605871 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1469605909 0 :Akaibu!uid118096@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wkfaygdxznvonssl QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1469605909 0 :sewilton!sid32560@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ukhrzazdeqedvvwz JOIN :#esoteric < 1469605913 0 :augur!~augur@2601:645:c100:63f1:8906:11fa:cb00:449a JOIN :#esoteric < 1469605949 0 :zgrep!sid43445@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tapzxtcbphndtmps JOIN :#esoteric < 1469606011 0 :Akaibu!uid118096@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jgbqintjraskqgns JOIN :#esoteric < 1469608654 0 :rntz!~rntz@96.95.216.165 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1469608712 0 :rntz!~rntz@96.95.216.165 JOIN :#esoteric < 1469610197 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://kat.am limited functionality < 1469610208 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm glad to see it back < 1469610537 0 :aloril_!~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw1-54fa3f-129.dhcp.inet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1469610573 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1469610671 0 :aloril!~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw1-54fa3f-129.dhcp.inet.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1469610671 0 :b_jonas_!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1469611864 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469612093 0 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1469612142 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1469612918 0 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet JOIN :#esoteric < 1469614733 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1469615518 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469615789 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1469616556 0 :augur!~augur@2601:645:c100:63f1:8906:11fa:cb00:449a QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469617177 0 :b_jonas_!?@? NICK :b_jonas < 1469619343 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469622302 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@massages-loud < 1469622302 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't have any messages < 1469622318 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: JANITOR CHICKEN < 1469622854 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`random-card < 1469622863 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm wait, actually < 1469622886 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I Know My ABC's \ 1UU \ Enchantment \ At the beginning of your upkeep, if you control permanents with names that include all twenty-six letters of the English alphabet, you win the game. \ UNH-R < 1469622904 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1469622910 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: un-card < 1469622924 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1469623009 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: un-cards are almost all the cards from the Unglued and Unhinged M:tG sets, two sets for sort-of self-parody that do things M:tG can't normally do. The cards have a silver outer border, and they're not legal for any sort of serious game or tournaments. < 1469623041 0 :FireFly!~firefly@firefly.xen.prgmr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`random-card < 1469623047 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vanquish the Foul \ 5W \ Sorcery \ Destroy target creature with power 4 or greater. Scry 1. (Look at the top card of your library. You may put that card on the bottom of your library.) \ THS-U < 1469623085 0 :FireFly!~firefly@firefly.xen.prgmr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, UNH-r / THS-U is the set < 1469623116 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`fetch http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/oracle/All%20Sets-2016-07-23.zip share/mtg/AllSets-2016-04-08.zip < 1469623116 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/oracle/All%20Sets-2016-07-23.zip%20share/mtg/AllSets-2016-04-08.zip: \ 2016-07-27 11:38:33 ERROR 404: Not Found. < 1469623126 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Firefly: yes. UNH is Unhinged. < 1469623140 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`fetch http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/oracle/All%20Sets-2016-07-23.zip < 1469623148 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2016-07-27 11:39:01 URL:http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/oracle/All%20Sets-2016-07-23.zip [719795/719795] -> "All Sets-2016-07-23.zip" [1] < 1469623167 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` mv -vi "All Sets-2016-07-23.zip" share/mtg/ < 1469623174 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​`All Sets-2016-07-23.zip' -> `share/mtg/All Sets-2016-07-23.zip' < 1469623215 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` cd share/mtg && unzip -l "All Sets-2016-07-23.zip" < 1469623216 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash: unzip: command not found < 1469623248 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :boo, "Our Market Research Shows That Players Like Really Long Card Names So We Made this Card to Have the Absolute Longest Card Name Ever Elemental" contains only 21 distinct letter (missing fjqxz) < 1469623267 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` cd share/mtg && zcat "All Sets-2016-07-23.zip" > allsets-2016-07-23.zip < 1469623275 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1469623295 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` wc share/mtg/allsetes-2016-07-23.zip < 1469623298 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wc: share/mtg/allsetes-2016-07-23.zip: No such file or directory < 1469623307 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` wc share/mtg/allsets-2016-07-23.zip < 1469623309 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​ 117206 527886 3165532 share/mtg/allsets-2016-07-23.zip < 1469623321 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` ln -svf allsets-2016-07-23.zip share/mtg/allsets.txt < 1469623326 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​`share/mtg/allsets.txt' -> `allsets-2016-07-23.zip' < 1469623380 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name harmless offering < 1469623382 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Harmless Offering \ 2R \ Sorcery \ Target opponent gains control of target permanent you control. \ EMN-R < 1469623387 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :`jar < 1469623401 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usage: jar {ctxui}[vfm0Me] [jar-file] [manifest-file] [entry-point] [-C dir] files ... \ Options: \ -c create new archive \ -t list table of contents for archive \ -x extract named (or all) files from archive \ -u update existing archive \ -v generate verbose output on standard output \ -f specify archive file name \ < 1469623413 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's your unzip ;-) < 1469623442 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I should just install a 7z < 1469623466 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` jar -t share/mtg/"All Sets-2016-07-23.zip" < 1469623499 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1469623750 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :mm < 1469623758 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`tar --help < 1469623760 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usage: tar [OPTION...] [FILE]... \ GNU `tar' saves many files together into a single tape or disk archive, and can \ restore individual files from the archive. \ \ Examples: \ tar -cf archive.tar foo bar # Create archive.tar from files foo and bar. \ tar -tvf archive.tar # List all files in archive.tar verbosely. \ tar -xf archive.t < 1469623763 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`bzip2 --help < 1469623765 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bzip2, a block-sorting file compressor. Version 1.0.6, 6-Sept-2010. \ \ usage: bzip2 [flags and input files in any order] \ \ -h --help print this message \ -d --decompress force decompression \ -z --compress force compression \ -k --keep keep (don't delete) input files \ -f --force overwr < 1469623767 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`xz --help < 1469623768 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usage: xz [OPTION]... [FILE]... \ Compress or decompress FILEs in the .xz format. \ \ -z, --compress force compression \ -d, --decompress force decompression \ -t, --test test compressed file integrity \ -l, --list list information about .xz files \ -k, --keep keep (don't delete) input files \ -f, --f < 1469624920 0 :Reece`!~Ner@cpc4-wiga13-2-0-cust799.18-3.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469624972 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is oerjan's hydra still alive? < 1469625056 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you aren't supposed to asl about someone elses penis < 1469625770 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :in HackEgo, do we have a directory under the versioned file system that's also in the shared library path? I want to install a binary that uses a shared library. if there's such a directory, I'll install directly. otherwise, I'll create a shell script wrapper that sets LD_PRELOAD < 1469625848 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, why don't we have a fracking /hackenv/libexec directory? < 1469625927 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, we can't have a user-writable directory in the GLOBAL shared library path, because that would require us writing the system /etc/ld.so.cache < 1469625942 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's apparently no LD_LIBRARY_PATH set < 1469625950 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, I'll create a LD_LIBRARY_PATH wrapper then < 1469626227 0 :byteflame!~cpt@50.25.160.41 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1469626398 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? myname < 1469626401 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname is not your name. You don't know what they are doing. Or you are doing. Or am I? He is Perl's evil twin brother. < 1469626633 0 :centrinia!~centrinia@107-208-218-105.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469626791 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`fetch http://russell2.math.bme.hu/~ambrus/pu/p7zip-16.02-linux-bin-only.tar.xz < 1469626808 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2016-07-27 12:40:03 URL:http://russell2.math.bme.hu/~ambrus/pu/p7zip-16.02-linux-bin-only.tar.xz [1143816/1143816] -> "p7zip-16.02-linux-bin-only.tar.xz" [1] < 1469626812 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` tar tf p7zip-16.02-linux-bin-only.tar.xz < 1469626815 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bin/ \ bin/7z \ bin/7za \ lib/ \ lib/p7zip-16.02/ \ lib/p7zip-16.02/7z \ lib/p7zip-16.02/7z.so < 1469626822 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` tar xvf p7zip-16.02-linux-bin-only.tar.xz < 1469626834 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bin/ \ bin/7z \ bin/7za \ lib/ \ lib/p7zip-16.02/ \ lib/p7zip-16.02/7z \ lib/p7zip-16.02/7z.so < 1469626838 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`rm p7zip-16.02-linux-bin-only.tar.xz < 1469626843 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1469626892 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1469626921 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` perl -pie y/\\r// bin/7z < 1469626923 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't open perl script "y/\r//": No such file or directory < 1469626927 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` perl -pi -e y/\\r// bin/7z < 1469626928 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1469626942 0 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote penis < 1469626943 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` perl -pi -e y/\\r//d bin/7z < 1469626951 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1469626952 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :52) if a girl is that cute, i don't care how many penises she has \ 173) oerjan: What, can girls aim their penises better? < 1469626980 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` perl -pi -e 's/LD_PRELOAD/LD_LIBRARY_PATH/' bin/7z < 1469626983 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1469627055 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` 7z # wtf? < 1469627056 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/hackenv/lib/p7zip-16.02/7z: 1: /hackenv/lib/p7zip-16.02/7z: Syntax error: "(" unexpected < 1469627065 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that error message even come from? < 1469627106 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` 7za < 1469627107 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash: /hackenv/bin/7za: cannot execute binary file < 1469627111 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1469627152 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :this doesn't seem to be working < 1469627840 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :might have to compile a new one or something < 1469627842 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait iwat < 1469628226 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469628423 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` objdump -p bin/7za | grep ^..NEEDED < 1469628425 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​ NEEDED libpthread.so.0 \ NEEDED libc.so.6 < 1469628459 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why. it's an x86_32 executable, and we don't have x86_32 libraries, not even libc.so.6 < 1469628480 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` objdump -f bin/7za < 1469628481 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​ \ bin/7za: file format elf32-i386 \ architecture: i386, flags 0x00000112: \ EXEC_P, HAS_SYMS, D_PAGED \ start address 0x0804a8f0 < 1469628527 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd probably have to build a static one for source if I want this < 1469628528 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1469628536 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or an x86_64 dynamic one from source < 1469629503 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18e43ef5.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1469629584 0 :byteflame!~cpt@70-89-65-45-little-rock-ar.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469630676 0 :gamemanj!~gamemanj@cpc84817-aztw28-2-0-cust142.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469630736 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1469633361 0 :gamemanj!~gamemanj@cpc84817-aztw28-2-0-cust142.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1469633726 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469634027 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1469637153 0 :Kaynato!~Aedile@cpe-75-187-129-201.neo.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1469637830 0 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1469638461 0 :Reece`!~Ner@cpc4-wiga13-2-0-cust799.18-3.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1469638575 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... are Hungary/hungry puns racist? < 1469638601 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: I don't think they're racist, but they're kind of boring < 1469638660 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about Turkey/turkey puns? < 1469638719 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the difference between racism and asians? ... < 1469638803 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know, what? < 1469638815 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :racism has many faces < 1469638844 0 :Reece`!~Ner@cpc4-wiga13-2-0-cust799.18-3.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469640399 0 :almightynsx1!~JD@2602:306:c472:5a79:303f:4f28:1bb6:4132 PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone know of any good documentaries about real magic? < 1469640458 0 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469640546 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :and with real you mean not the gathering? < 1469640574 0 :almightynsx1!~JD@2602:306:c472:5a79:303f:4f28:1bb6:4132 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1469640598 0 :almightynsx1!~JD@2602:306:c472:5a79:303f:4f28:1bb6:4132 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the card game < 1469640783 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1469641015 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469641102 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :`welcome almightynsx1 < 1469641107 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :almightynsx1: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: . (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on EFnet or DALnet.) < 1469641274 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1469641274 0 :centrinia!~centrinia@107-208-218-105.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1469642146 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1469642306 0 :almightynsx1!~JD@2602:306:c472:5a79:303f:4f28:1bb6:4132 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1469644140 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :the opposite of assassin is dickdickout < 1469646137 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera, I don't think ass has a defined opposite < 1469646157 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :One could argue that its opposite should be, for example, tits < 1469646655 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :mouth < 1469646696 0 :gamemanj!~gamemanj@cpc84817-aztw28-2-0-cust142.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469646795 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :horse < 1469646826 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, why am I doing this < 1469646837 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why am I nitpicking a joke I actually found rather funny < 1469646848 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera, apologies, and thank you for the joke < 1469647779 0 :Elronnd!elronnd@znc.dank.ninja PRIVMSG #esoteric :One might argue that the opposite of ass is philanthropist, but that completely ruins the joke < 1469647786 0 :Elronnd!elronnd@znc.dank.ninja PRIVMSG #esoteric :or perhaps good samaritan < 1469648090 0 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469648103 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Trump openly called for the russians to hack hillary and release her private emails < 1469648171 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The entire planet is entering an age of madness < 1469648323 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is going to be hilarious and terrifying at the same time < 1469648501 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, it's just us people who're going mad < 1469648532 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(mad human disease) < 1469648736 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? mad < 1469648739 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This wisdom entry was censored for being too accurate. < 1469648745 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`howg mad < 1469648751 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​ le/rn mad/This wisdom entry was censored for being too accurate. \ rm wisdom/mad #this thing has been too damn true lately \ revert \ for x in wisdom/*; do rev "$x" > "$x"a; mv "$x"a "$x"; done \ revert \ run rm -rf wisdom \ revert 0 \ run rm -rf wisdom/* \ Initial impor < 1469648860 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Why did you censor that wisdom entry? < 1469648911 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :He could've cited copyright reasons... except they expired, I think: '"But I don't want to go among mad people," Alice remarked. "Oh, you can't help that," said the Cat: "we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad." "How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice. "You must be," said the Cat, "or you wouldn't have come here."' < 1469648952 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember. < 1469648952 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Caroll died in 1898, there is no way the copyright hasn't expired < 1469648964 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? u < 1469648971 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :u monad? < 1469648976 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? the u < 1469648977 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The U are a very mad people. < 1469648980 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` rgrep -l mad wisdom < 1469648989 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wisdom/hydrogen \ wisdom/holy water \ wisdom/welcome.eo \ wisdom/nobody \ wisdom/itidus21 \ wisdom/everyone \ wisdom/\oren\ \ wisdom/pizza \ wisdom/skeleton \ wisdom/sand \ wisdom/the u \ wisdom/madness \ wisdom/vampire \ wisdom/prography \ wisdom/madbr \ wisdom/mroman \ wisdom/alice \ wisdom/marriage \ wisdom/lmt \ wisdom/progres \ wisdom/@ \ wisd < 1469649003 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :`skeleton < 1469649005 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: skeleton: not found < 1469649006 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? skeleton < 1469649007 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :A skeleton is an unintelligent undead, similar to the zombie but harder to create, because it's lacking most of the body. The best skeletons are made by groups of people, so-called skeleton crews. < 1469649032 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? hydrogen < 1469649033 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hydrogen is what stars are made of. There's a conjecture that at the immense pressures inside Jupiter or Saturn, hydrogen might form a superconducting liquid metal. < 1469649040 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` rgrep -lP '\bmad\b' wisdom < 1469649042 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wisdom/nobody \ wisdom/everyone \ wisdom/the u \ wisdom/alice \ wisdom/lmt \ wisdom/gamemanj < 1469649043 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, "made" < 1469649056 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`1 rgrep -P '\bmad\b' wisdom < 1469649059 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/2:wisdom/nobody:Nobody killed the cyclops Polyphemos after he tried to eat a shipful of sailors, and this perceived injustice made Poseidon so mad he swore vengeance at him and the gods couldn't calm him down for ten years. \ wisdom/everyone:Everyone in here is mad. \ wisdom/the u:The U are a very mad people. \ wisdom/alice:Alice < 1469649070 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`spam < 1469649072 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2/2:doesn't want to go among mad people. \ wisdom/lmt:lmt is insufficiently mad for this channel. \ wisdom/gamemanj:gamemanj is also the mad scientist I. N. Here. < 1469649161 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: anyway, good question... it was accurate in a good way. < 1469649191 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? alice < 1469649191 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alice doesn't want to go among mad people. < 1469649207 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :some traces remain, apparently. < 1469649213 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`cwlprits alice < 1469649217 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e ais523 mroman < 1469649224 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`howg alice < 1469649227 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​ revert accbc9c5c7ec \ echo wisdom/* | shuf | head -n 10 | xargs rm \ learn Alice doesn\'t want to go among mad people. < 1469649369 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I checked the log and indeed this is an offspring of the "mad" entry. < 1469649510 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Before oerjan *murdered* it. < 1469649572 0 :augur!~augur@2601:645:c100:63f1:3dd1:bab2:3e19:7c61 JOIN :#esoteric < 1469649684 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`1 rgrep madness wisdom < 1469649686 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/1:wisdom/madness:madness lies thataway. \ wisdom/mroman:mroman is a leading artist in password security (SFW). He also likes black madness. He can design password hashes that are worse than the identity function. He invented the identity function. He's also an artist in unconventional warfare. < 1469649729 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am curious to see such a hash function < 1469649750 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? identify function < 1469649751 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :identify function? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1469649767 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this `1 ? < 1469649770 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: take any constant function < 1469649790 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that's what i thought of, too < 1469649792 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone once gave me a puzzle: Find two periodic functions whose sum is the identity function. < 1469649795 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it may be hard to do worse than that) < 1469649801 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i wouldn't say it's worse < 1469649821 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is easy to login as someone else < 1469649833 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it is impossible to get the original password in case of a leak < 1469649854 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: hmm, true. so it depends on what you're trying to defend against < 1469650179 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: is it okay to work in Z/6Z? (I guess you want R -> R, but you didn't specify that) < 1469650183 0 :yurichev!~yurichev@82.144.205.57 JOIN :#esoteric < 1469650194 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The puzzle is R -> R < 1469650213 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it requires the axiom of choice. < 1469650301 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks I'll ponder that on my way home < 1469650356 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(involving the axiom of choice isn't much of a surprise) < 1469652296 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... something to do with interference patterns < 1469652521 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the periods definitly have to be different < 1469652586 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in fact, at least one of them has to be irrational < 1469653317 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, could you not just take the fourier series and divide it into two? < 1469653364 0 :augur!~augur@2601:645:c100:63f1:3dd1:bab2:3e19:7c61 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1469653597 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :suppose the period of f is a, and the period of g is b < 1469653721 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :f(x+b) = b + x - g(x) < 1469653959 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: okay, you don't have to be overly creative for that problem (no transfinite induction required) < 1469653976 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: (only a straightforward application of the AoX) < 1469653977 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm so you really need only find a single function g, and then prove that there exists an a, such that for all x, 0 = g(x) + a - g(x + a) < 1469653978 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :AoC. < 1469654029 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1469654055 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and also prove that there exists b such that from all x, 0 = g(x) - g(x + b) < 1469654081 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1469654342 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: axiom of choice? hmmm well what if you turned the real numbers into a cartesian product < 1469654477 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :one periodic function that might help is the modulo function < 1469654517 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1469654589 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION looks through thing equivalent to the axiom of choice. there are a lot
< 1469654617 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: http://sprunge.us/BWCV (spoiler) < 1469654686 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if you made the real numbers into a vector space and found a basis < 1469654745 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example the basis (...,10,1,0.1,...) < 1469654780 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :every real number can be represented as a linear combination of those < 1469654794 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :with integer coeficints too < 1469654838 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: but not uniquely, which is potentially a problem < 1469654839 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it isn't really a good basis because they aren't linearly indepeted < 1469654879 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: right so what we need is a basis where they're all primes or inverted primes or something < 1469654889 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not ruling out that such a vector space construction works but... it has to be over some field, and if you want to obtain the usual addition in R as vector space addition, the field must have characteristic 0. Q is probably the natural choice in that case. < 1469654933 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the coeficints would be rationals? ok < 1469654955 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :"if you want to obtain the usual addition in R as vector space addition" < 1469655049 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway I didn't find vector spaces useful here. < 1469655057 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: The person who gave me the puzzle used the vector space of R over Q. < 1469655061 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: well I do, because we need to have the end result two functions that add together < 1469655214 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1469655319 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: ok well that vector space must have a basis by the < 1469655323 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Axiom of choice < 1469655352 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so suppose it's some set of numbers A={a,b,...} < 1469655368 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :defiantly an infinite set < 1469655421 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :can we show that f_a(x) = the coeficient of x for a is periodic? < 1469655432 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: okay, I can make that work but it seems to be an unecessary complication to me. < 1469655443 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :or unnecessary < 1469655491 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469655554 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we can, then all that remains is to prove that there exists some other number z, such that for all x, f_a(x) + z - f_a(x + z) = 0 < 1469655687 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: Aren't real numbers already a vector space < 1469655706 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm f_a(b) = 0 for any b in A\a < 1469655722 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: sure, but not in a useful way for shachaf's puzzle < 1469655742 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and f_a(x+b) = f_a(x) + f_a(b) = f_a(x) < 1469655747 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's periodic! < 1469655759 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm thinking the two periodic functions aren't continuous < 1469655765 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :f_a(a) = 1 < 1469655774 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1469655783 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also you only have to find one periodic function < 1469655793 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: you can rest assured that they are not; their graphs are both dense in the real plane < 1469655812 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: and prove that x-f(x) is also periodic < 1469655931 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I think f_a(a^2) = a < 1469655964 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :The period doesn't matter < 1469655978 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :So let's assume it's 2*pi < 1469655983 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm I wonder what the period of x - f_a(x) would be? < 1469656010 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: it certainly does, you need it in order to prove that it's periodic < 1469656041 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, I assumed the periods have to be equal, but maybe not < 1469656049 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: they can't be equal < 1469656083 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet it'd be best to use a fourier transform somehow < 1469656087 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: otherwise the sum of the two functions would be periodic (with the same period, and potentially shorter ones), and f(x) = x isn't periodic. < 1469656118 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Good point < 1469656134 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Means that the periods can't be a rational multiple of each other either < 1469656169 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: in fact the two periods have to be incommensurable, as the Pythagoreans would say. < 1469656209 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well, as you just pointed out yourself) < 1469656237 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 JOIN :#esoteric < 1469656307 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :You do need an infinite number of discontinuities, but does the function have to be discontinuous everywhere, or can you get away with some continuity? < 1469656340 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: and the point of viewing R as a vector space, as far as I can see, is to make the two periods part of the basis of the vector space. So R as vector space over R doesn't help. < 1469656351 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, a calculus question. let me look at the logs (though I probably can't solve it, I'm bad at calculus) < 1469656364 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: no, continuity anywhere would contradict denseness of the graph in the plane ;) < 1469656369 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: more like an algebra question < 1469656377 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Ah, right, you already proved it's dense < 1469656396 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(smiley because it's a sledgehammer argument) < 1469656405 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the question? < 1469656421 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: finding two periodic function (R -> R) whose sum is the identity function < 1469656422 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Damn, it's actually really difficult to come up with functions that are continuous nowhere < 1469656443 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: f(x) = 1 if x in Q, 0 otherwise. < 1469656444 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: oh... I think I heard that, but I don't know a solution off-hand. hmm < 1469656447 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, wait, we have to use g(x) = f_a(x)a < 1469656464 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I mean in general < 1469656465 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, isn't that a set theory question actually? or at least one solution is < 1469656468 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means that g(x) still has period b < 1469656468 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember now < 1469656508 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also, g(x + a) = g(x) + g(a) = g(x) + a < 1469656531 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me think, I think there might be a construction using the well-ordering theorem < 1469656564 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :means that x + a - g(x + a) = x + a - g(x) - a = x - g(x) < 1469656575 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so x - g(x) has period a. < 1469656577 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :QED < 1469656577 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas brings out the big guns. < 1469656588 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: yes < 1469656597 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I already solved it < 1469656599 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I doubt there's a simple algebraic solutino < 1469656621 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that I have no idea how to construct a basis for R over Q < 1469656621 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: shachaf has a solution; I have one at http://sprunge.us/BWCV; \oren\ is stumbling around, I think; I don't know about FreeFull. < 1469656625 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, I think you need axiom of choice for it < 1469656632 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even have any idea how to do it, really < 1469656635 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: well, the Axiom of Choice will play into the solution in some form. < 1469656636 0 :gamemanj!~gamemanj@cpc84817-aztw28-2-0-cust142.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1469656640 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I want to think about it without reading a full solution for a little bit < 1469656653 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: but well-ordering may not be the best form :) < 1469656673 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: sure, it might be the theorem that every vector space has a basis (was mentioned above) < 1469656681 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: sure, I'm just stating it's there and summarizing what's happing, since you didn't look at the logs. < 1469656685 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Does it matter that it's sqrt(2) in particular? < 1469656688 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did look at the logs < 1469656692 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just not enough to see the question < 1469656698 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: no, it's just convenient. < 1469656711 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: I mean, name an irrational number! < 1469656716 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1469656726 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :by the way, do you know my other favourite maths question? not the Chameleon one, but the one that has a LOT of different ways to solve, which is why I like it < 1469656741 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you have such a basis A, then f_a(x)a where a is a member of the basis and f_a(x) is the coeficient of a in x, has period b where b is any other member of A, and x - f_a(x)a is periodic with period a < 1469656770 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would guess you can start with any two periods whose quotient is irrational < 1469656786 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not likely that there's a further restriction < 1469656786 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another irrational number: 1 + 1/(2 + 1/(3 + 1/(4 + ...))) < 1469656806 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: hmm, does that have a closed form? < 1469656820 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could check in plouffe's but I'm lazy < 1469656853 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: No idea < 1469656923 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found an article online that uses this approach < 1469656971 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :except they call f_a(x) instead (x,a) < 1469657003 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :they also have x^2 as a sum of periodic functions < 1469657034 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, indeed maybe it would be worth to use a vector space basis (of the reals over rationals), which can help because we know it's countable < 1469657035 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :A polynomial of degree n is the sum of n+1 periodic functions < 1469657045 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently < 1469657062 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: and the coeficints are each periodic < 1469657085 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: I don't see why that's important < 1469657092 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, I don't see why that's necessary < 1469657100 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might simplify the construction, but I don't see why < 1469657103 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1469657110 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I can't talk properly < 1469657113 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I proved it earlier < 1469657135 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :suppose a and b are two of your basis numbers < 1469657152 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :f_a(x) is the coeficint of a in x < 1469657165 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :f_a(b) must be 0 < 1469657178 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or else they aren't independent) < 1469657196 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :f_a(x + b) = f_a(x) + 0 < 1469657207 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(by linearity) < 1469657260 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: ok, now I don't get what you're talking about. what coefficients of what? < 1469657288 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well if x is in R, and A is a basis for R over Q < 1469657312 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means there exist functions f_a, f_b,.... for each a,b.... in A < 1469657335 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :such that f_a(x)*a + f_b(x)*b +.... = x < 1469657379 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :these rational coeficients are used to add up rational multiples of the basis numbers, to create each number in R < 1469657460 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: ah, ok. < 1469657500 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: ISC says it might be Besl(0,2)/Besl(1,2) < 1469657557 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then, the expansion of a in A would be (1,0,0,....) < 1469657591 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: Yeah, that seems to be actually the case < 1469657595 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then , we know that f_a(b) is 0, just as f_b(a) is 0 < 1469657637 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and f_a(x + b) = f_a(x) + f_a(b) = f_a(x) < 1469657649 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore f_a is periodic with period b < 1469657668 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as well as other periods, but it is enoght to have one) < 1469657679 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=BesselI(0,2)%2FBesselI(1,2) < 1469657702 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :It even gives a continued fraction < 1469657718 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :"(1,0,0,....)" -- the basis can't be countable, can it? < 1469657737 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh the point for the polynomials of degree n is that p() splits into a sum of n+1 functions with only n arguments each. < 1469657740 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: maybe not, but so long as we can choose two elements out of it < 1469657753 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :a, and b < 1469657758 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lower down, it says that 1.433127... = 1/2 for some reason < 1469657762 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, I'm stupid < 1469657776 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I said some really stupid things about this math problem above, so ignore almost all of it please < 1469657793 0 :Reece`!~Ner@cpc4-wiga13-2-0-cust799.18-3.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1469657797 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I think what I said work < 1469658040 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1469658079 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :x - f_a(x)*a defiantly has period a < 1469658091 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: uhm how do you define a sum of uncountably many terms? besides, the problem asked for a sum of only two periodic functions. < 1469658106 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :and can you please stop using "defiantly" instead of "definitely" < 1469658117 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: we're not defining it < 1469658120 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\ defiantly continues to use words int-e doesn't like < 1469658138 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: that was okay < 1469658145 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: we're just using the fact there exists a basis for R over Q < 1469658159 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: despite the fact that "definitely" also fits there... < 1469658176 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that we can select two numbers a and b out of said basis < 1469658190 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Presumably all but a finite number of components are 0. < 1469658217 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :such that the coefficent of a in x, f_a(x), has certain properties < 1469658249 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :specifically, f_a(x + y) = f_a(x) + f_a(y) < 1469658255 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :f_a(a) = 1 < 1469658262 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :f_a(b) = 0 < 1469658265 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's all < 1469658279 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: so f_a has period b, great... what now? < 1469658286 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: what's the other function? < 1469658295 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, x - f_a(x) has period a < 1469658302 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, x - f_a(x)a has period a < 1469658305 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoops < 1469658322 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the functions are f_a(x)a and x - f_a(x)a < 1469658338 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm. right, sorry. < 1469658344 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :which looks a lot less confusing written of paper < 1469658510 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(sorry, I got lost in the false attempt and irrelevant remarks... I missed the line where you wrote out x - f_a(x)*a, because I was too busy complaining about the word.) < 1469658534 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I seriously think I should rather solve this problem with the well-ordering theorem than with vector space basis < 1469658556 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the original problem? < 1469658594 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercha: prove that the identity function on the reals can be written as the sum of two periodic functions on the reals < 1469658601 0 :byteflame!~cpt@70-89-65-45-little-rock-ar.hfc.comcastbusiness.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1469658624 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I would prefer a constructed solution as opposed to my hypothetic existence proof < 1469658667 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :the followup problem (simplified version: write f(x) = x^2 as the sum of three periodic functions) will not work with the vector space approach, since that can only produce additive functions. (f(x+y) = f(x) + f(y)) < 1469658715 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well the axiom of choice very much seems necessary. (Though I have no proof of that.) < 1469658722 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, I understand if you want to factor the reals to equivalence classes of numbers whose difference is a sum of integer multiply of the two periods (let's call them 1 and sqrt(2) for simplicity) < 1469658734 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that doesn't need choice, I don't think I need a complete vector space basis < 1469658770 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do think the AC is necessary, but I'd not like to use it through a vector space basis, but through the well-ordering or something similar < 1469658786 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about plain AC. < 1469658797 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly that too < 1469658803 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll try to find a proof < 1469659624 0 :centrinia!~centrinia@107-208-218-105.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469659636 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :sketch for the simplified followup question: http://sprunge.us/DdKC < 1469659672 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok wait, I'm stupid < 1469659731 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or don't wait < 1469659757 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION exhales
< 1469659834 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I missed some terms there... < 1469659884 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, my favourite maths problem is at http://mathoverflow.net/a/90201/35417 : < 1469659899 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :correcting: http://sprunge.us/ALEN < 1469659914 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There exists a set $ A $ that is everywhere dense on the square $ [0, 1]^2 $, but such that for any real number $ x $, the intersections $ A \cap (\{x\} \times [0, 1]) $ and $ A \cap ([0, 1] \times \{x\}) $ are both finite. < 1469659933 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love that problem because there are so many different approaches for it that lead to a proof. < 1469659951 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So everyone you ask gives different proofs. < 1469660275 0 :byteflame!~cpt@c-71-238-242-230.hsd1.ar.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469660290 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :tooo many degrees of freedom. < 1469660294 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.kylem.net/stuff/zero_computer.html < 1469660333 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: yes, too many different sets $ A $ too. < 1469660419 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: how about the obvious bijection of rational numbers in [1,2) with powers of two as denominators to themselves: reverse the bits. < 1469660507 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(additional constraints: no choice; all the intersections should have size at most 1; high school level) < 1469660528 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm highschool < 1469660538 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: yes, that works. it's another version similar to the first solution I give in the node, where I define the set without powers of two < 1469660571 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's probably the solution that needs the least mathematical prerequisites < 1469660583 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means that normal mathematicians don't usually give that, they know too many advanced stuff for it < 1469660616 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh if I wanted a hammer I'd use transfinite induction on the cardinality of the continuum. < 1469660620 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I list the solutions in 8 bullet points ordered from most elementary to least elementary prerequisites. < 1469660682 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: yes, that's how the 6th solution works, it's a big hammer, at least for mathematicians like me who learned of set theory somewhat late < 1469660685 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, the 6th bullet point. < 1469660768 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(countable topological bases need extra work) < 1469660804 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: "extra work" hehe < 1469660818 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just take all the rational squares < 1469660893 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's too Borel. (I have not done much topology so I usually want circles with arbitary real diameter.) < 1469660904 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :arbitrary. < 1469660919 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then it's continuum sized. < 1469660931 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: hehe < 1469660946 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I mean, you don't really need to know what a "topological base" is for this < 1469660960 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just the way a topologist describes it < 1469660979 0 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1469660982 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just need to know basic real calculus, that every disk contains a rational circle < 1469660985 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, except for the random one these are all good proofs to my mind. < 1469661017 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1469661030 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what sense of "good proofs"? < 1469661064 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, in what sense is the random one not a good proof < 1469661064 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Err, sorry, I don't understand the last one. < 1469661068 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like set-theoretic structures like topologies, sigma-algebras, and filters. They lead to very weird properties < 1469661086 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, the last one was hard to understand, it took a LOT of time for my friends to convince me that it probably works < 1469661094 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why it's last < 1469661137 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem there is that that set is easy to come up with, and easy to conjecture that it works, but we didn't find an easier proof to prove that it works < 1469661170 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so once you fixate on that set, you're sort of screwed < 1469661212 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I love using the transfinite induction hammer for analysis proofs < 1469661221 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they tend to be excessively direct < 1469661240 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: what's your favourite problem with such a proof? < 1469661243 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I'm not very good with measure theory, which you need to make the probabilistic argument rigorous. < 1469661271 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: That every closed real interval is compact < 1469661294 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: yes, so if you know a lot of set theory but not much of advanced calculus, then the set theory proofs seems more natural to you < 1469661324 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: doesn't that have a more elementary proof too? < 1469661325 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Heine-Borel theorem, basically) < 1469661326 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1469661339 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :good < 1469661349 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I remember I read the proof first in a book that uses elementary maths only < 1469661368 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469661408 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc even the version that every bounded closed set in R^n is compact has an elementary proof there < 1469661418 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :The elementary proof is basically that, given an open cover, if you need infinitely many members to cover a closed & bounded set, you can assume it's an interval, then subdivide it to get a smaller set. < 1469661430 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :or multiple smaller sets, more accurately < 1469661435 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least one of which requires infinite cover < 1469661446 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can do this indefinitely to get an ever-decreasing sequence < 1469661458 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, so using the completeness of reals < 1469661499 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: btw, the *construction* in the last proof makes perfect sense, but I would have a much more elementary approach to establishing density. < 1469661520 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :eventually, the set gets small enough that it can be covered by a single member, which is the contradiction < 1469661524 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: does that give a working proof? if it does, I'd be interested < 1469661527 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :denseness < 1469661532 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :the transfinite proof I came up with is hilarious < 1469661589 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're trying to cover [a, b], let I_0 = (i_0, j_0) cover a, I_1 = (i_1, j_1) cover j_0, and so on < 1469661634 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't cover the entire interval, let I_{\omega} = (i_{\omega}, j_{\omega}) cover sup_{\alpha < \omega} j_\alpha < 1469661672 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :repeat this process transfinitely until it does cover the entire interval [a, b], which must happen because you have an open cover and there are more ordinals than intervals < 1469661774 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercha: go on < 1469661834 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :then for each limit ordinal \alpha you used, you can build a finite cover of [a, i_{\alpha}] by taking the previous limit ordinal's finite cover and adding successive intervals until you pass i_{\alpha}, which must happen after finitely many steps since the upper bounds converge to j_\alpha > i_\alpha < 1469661886 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just repeat this until you cover [a, b] < 1469661952 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what what < 1469661953 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you visualize it, what you're basically doing is finding the ordinal-like strucure in the upper ends of the intervals, you might try a bunch and find that they convege, and then try more and find that they converge, and then try this infinitely many times and find that *those* upper bounds converge, etc. < 1469661978 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can always cover the limit point and cut off all but finitely many previous intervals < 1469662112 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the argument I gave above doesn't, technically, work, because "previous limit ordinal" isn't well-defined. But it shows you the point of the argument. < 1469662136 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a transfinite induction on "there is a finite subcover of [a, i_{\alpha}]" < 1469662183 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1469662192 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: ^ < 1469662630 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: I think it's late and I'm too tired to think of math now < 1469662635 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but thanks for telling < 1469662794 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1469663032 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1469663150 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? alercah < 1469663159 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1469663556 0 :byteflame!~cpt@c-71-238-242-230.hsd1.ar.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1469663839 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1469663915 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@2a00:f41:3806:f8f1:de85:deff:fe55:967a JOIN :#esoteric < 1469663938 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :merheboily!