< 1440547224 522128 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm maybe it wasn't on the web < 1440547227 495642 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.orenwatson.be/fontdemo.htm is updated < 1440547264 615475 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now with 100% as many snowmen < 1440547283 303199 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: the same number of snowmen? < 1440547285 19700 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :er. wtf did i just mean < 1440547287 691033 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the last mathematical operator? < 1440547301 231460 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no i mean I added the snowman < 1440547313 344168 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :⋿ < 1440547358 37440 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: 100% as many of something is the same number of that thing < 1440547400 142188 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know, I know < 1440547400 239740 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :100% as much math < 1440547416 235635 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember some time ago I needed to know some algorithm relating to Levenshtein distance and Damerau-Levenshtein distance but I do not remember what, and it wasn't simply calculating the value. < 1440547444 712643 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unicode ⋿ < 1440547461 110262 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :U+22FF Z NOTATION BAG MEMBERSHIP \ UTF-8: e2 8b bf UTF-16BE: 22ff Decimal: ⋿ \ ⋿ \ Category: Sm (Symbol, Math) \ Bidi: ON (Other Neutrals) \ Character is mirrored < 1440547464 375549 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: was it that text generation for a console? < 1440547474 436263 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Maybe; I do not remember < 1440547507 244674 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I think it may have had something to do with optimizing Damerau-Levenshtein distance < 1440547519 532110 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :unicode bag brackets are so good < 1440547536 870070 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :⟅1,1,2,3⟆ < 1440547563 15806 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have those, what characters are they < 1440547576 738860 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :...my font does have them < 1440547578 738963 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1440547588 16559 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :least useful characters ever < 1440547592 200585 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :27C5,27C6 < 1440547597 234591 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1440547613 507900 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll upgrade that block's priority < 1440547628 31109 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you like brackets. < 1440547964 405300 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I think what I needed was a way to sort a list of items such that the sum of the Levenshtein distances of pairs of adjacent elements is minimized. (Either that or maybe it was actually the Damerau-Levenshtein distance; I do not quite remember. Or perhaps with generalized costs.) < 1440548008 917187 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't that the travleing salesman problem? < 1440548028 987144 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it is < 1440548035 108722 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose it is similar at least < 1440548201 204223 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can reduce it to the traveling salesman problem and then use an existing algorithm for that < 1440548275 873039 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, OK, but still I do not quite remember what it is I have needed before, or what for, so I won't do it now. < 1440548345 680033 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: What text generation for a console do you refer to? < 1440548921 186012 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was either famicom or z-machine, i think < 1440548923 456142 :qwertyo!~qwertyo1@77.28.73.97 JOIN :#esoteric < 1440548947 308538 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :you were trying to do it with few instructions < 1440549040 630097 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember about Z-machine trying to encode text using as few Z-characters as possible, yes < 1440549088 512326 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1440549090 438471 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The algorithm that Infocom has described in their documentation does not work, and anyways they did not use it (they simply avoided using any permanent shifts at all; Inform does the same). < 1440549121 779401 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :still related to my typo thingy: does this list cover pretty much all the commands you use frequently? < 1440549124 695254 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash sh git sudo python iptables uname node perl wget curl tmux screen tar grep find ssh sed awk vim emacs diff sort pwd gzip free htop top kill cp cat mv ls du dd df rm rmdir mount chmod chown passwd mkdir locate man tail head less ping date file apt apt-get aptitude pacman yum rpm which ifconfig < 1440549199 812522 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: Not really, although I expect different people it will be pretty differently (it also depends what distro is in use, and other stuff) < 1440549206 787606 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :almost: scp nano and svn are missing < 1440549218 523208 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok i'll add them < 1440549251 350926 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It may be useful to allow customization though < 1440549253 24023 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm caching the corrections for those commands < 1440549260 27303 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :customization? < 1440549287 900413 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since they are different for different pairs of people and computers they use < 1440549315 996168 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes ofc i'm just writing this to speed up the lookup for the common cases < 1440549392 17965 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's not in that list i just perform a regular lookup from all the commands in your system and ask the user if the closest guess is what they meant < 1440549398 603584 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, OK, I don't really know what is most common but that seem reasonable I suppose. Depending how vim is set up it may also be started just by typing "vi" instead, is one; also some (including myself) will use dc as well, commonly < 1440549419 314315 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok adding scp nano vi svn hg < 1440549419 955223 :Slereah!~Slereah@APuteaux-653-1-83-93.w90-61.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1440549420 674750 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: Yes but you could have, if the user wants to change it then they can recompile it < 1440549442 582646 :Slereah!~Slereah@APuteaux-653-1-83-93.w90-61.abo.wanadoo.fr NICK :Guest71111 < 1440549452 160312 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no real need to recompile, you can just add your own to the configuration file < 1440549486 803633 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: OK, then, but it may depend how the lookup works exactly, if it needs to be reindexed or not. < 1440549493 274017 :Slereah__!~Slereah@APuteaux-653-1-254-187.w83-204.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1440549540 198656 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Note that even what I have for Z-machine (which is based on much of your help, but also many of my own things), is only optimal if no fwords are used; with them it is much more complicated since they can interfere with what permanent shifts should be used and not, therefore changing the length. < 1440549565 356349 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :the lookup stops when it finds a word that has a levenshtein distance < 2 from the command you typed < 1440549586 403774 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION recalls someone noting about spell checking that if you're a severe enough dyslexic, asking "did you mean this" is insufficient: they won't necessarily know even if they see the word < 1440549613 137289 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :o: < 1440549621 901693 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: O, I suppose that can work, then. < 1440549634 605857 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that was not the exact phrasing, mind you < 1440549733 758157 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are strange things (although I have considered them and made the algorithm take them into account), for example in the string "01234X56789" it will be most efficient to encode the "X" using an ASCII escape even though "X" is in the Z-character set. < 1440550300 776324 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Temporary shifts from state 0 to state 1 or 2 are one Z-character long. Permanent shifts from state 0 to state 1 or 2 are two Z-characters long. Permanent shifts from state 1 or 2 to state 0 are one Z-character long. All other shifts are not allowed. Uppercase letters happen to belong to state 1, and digits happen to belong to state 2; also, state 2 is the only state where ASCII escapes can be used. < 1440550366 329416 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1440550451 309278 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1440550526 149407 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ git statu < 1440550528 681096 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :git: 'statu' is not a git command. See 'git --help'. < 1440550530 583095 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you mean one of these? < 1440550532 593183 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric : status < 1440550534 609577 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric : stage < 1440550536 556213 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric : stash < 1440550540 677373 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ stupid git doesn't use the levenshtein distance < 1440550654 308708 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does git use? < 1440550690 966180 :Melvar`!~melvar@dslb-084-062-089-154.084.062.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1440550783 378754 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno, looks like they only check the beginning of the word < 1440550785 27669 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-088-076-099-076.088.076.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1440550793 955179 :Melvar`!~melvar@dslb-084-062-089-154.084.062.pools.vodafone-ip.de NICK :Melvar < 1440550848 520154 :idris-bot!~idris-bot@dslb-088-076-099-076.088.076.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1440550874 306879 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok i was wrong < 1440550884 18650 :idris-bot!~idris-bot@dslb-084-062-089-154.084.062.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1440550897 612646 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it could be smarter -_- < 1440551088 655099 :mihow!~mihow@50-206-98-70-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net QUIT :Quit: mihow < 1440551538 583029 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ecco the dolphin < 1440551538 674752 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :echo; msg:IrcMessage {ircMsgServer = "freenode", ircMsgLBName = "lambdabot", ircMsgPrefix = "Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet", ircMsgCommand = "PRIVMSG", ircMsgParams = ["#esoteric",":@ecco the dolphin"]} target:#esoteric rest:"the dolphin" < 1440551622 428754 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would want the operating system for portable computers which would consists mainly of only a Forth environment and a SSH client, and then some things can be compiled in or not based on the hardware you intend to use it on < 1440551627 256867 :qwertyo!~qwertyo1@77.28.73.97 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1440551732 797039 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you're rewriting unix in forth < 1440551852 344464 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not really < 1440551885 721012 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would be simpler than UNIX if you don't need a full system; you can SSH to your computer at home if you need UNIX < 1440552943 606259 :Melvar`!~melvar@dslb-188-109-011-178.188.109.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1440552983 38833 :idris-bot!~idris-bot@dslb-084-062-089-154.084.062.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1440553047 822015 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-084-062-089-154.084.062.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1440553152 401978 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is not as though SSH is all that UNIX-specific, except by happenstance. < 1440553193 300590 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: apparently Microsoft have claimed that ssh support in Powershell is a priority for the Powershell team < 1440553199 259589 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure it actually does support it yet though < 1440553221 584251 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC it shipped in Windows 10 < 1440553234 759817 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, no, not yet but they damned well intend to. < 1440553240 909283 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both in client and server. < 1440553718 506750 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes it doesn't have to be a UNIX server, that is just one possibility < 1440553885 649741 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :A very likely one, but not at all inherent in the scheme. < 1440553894 78735 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It could just as easily be SSHing into another Forth machine. < 1440554567 53241 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :/topic whereas with a 9 you're curling the defender to the left < 1440554697 501357 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what's the correct way to write a 9, exactly? < 1440554697 951378 :Melvar`!~melvar@dslb-188-109-011-178.188.109.pools.vodafone-ip.de NICK :Melvar < 1440554709 600042 :idris-bot!~idris-bot@dslb-188-109-011-178.188.109.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1440554716 520601 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The other day, I decided to try to come up with exact descriptions of the uppercase Latin letters. < 1440554720 857820 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wasn't quite sure how to describe C. < 1440554734 430743 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's B, though... < 1440554782 93787 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1440554864 693704 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"There are three strokes. The first stroke is a line from top left to bottom left. The second stroke is a clockwise arc, beginning at top left, proceeding through mid-top right, and ending at mid left. The third stroke is also a clockwise arc, beginning at mid left, proceeding through mid-bottom right, and ending at bottom left. The third stroke may extend slightly farther to the right than the second stroke." < 1440554918 198071 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, here we go. < 1440554954 705543 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"There is only one stroke, which is a counterclockwise arc, beginning at mid-top right, proceeding through top center, then through bottom center, and ending at mid-bottom right." < 1440554992 641557 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you can put them into METAFONT < 1440555056 393604 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Describing G is gonna be tough. < 1440555061 194361 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nobody knows what a G is really shaped like. < 1440555137 710602 :idris-bot!~idris-bot@dslb-188-109-011-178.188.109.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1440555152 635910 :Melvar`!~melvar@dslb-178-000-203-254.178.000.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1440555218 612356 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-188-109-011-178.188.109.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1440555308 236092 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes you could even be SSHing into another Forth machine, if it has a SSH server, but as far as I know Forth machines don't usually run SSH servers, isn't it? < 1440555370 585571 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1440555402 106409 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some device drivers and filesystem drivers (and software to use them) may be provided optionally for such thing as a camera, harddrive, floppy/CF/SD/MMC/USB, CD/DVD, fax modem, sound card. < 1440555464 240177 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if you don't have a fax modem you could try to send a fax using the audio port (you may use an external device to connect it to a telephone line, such as the data port of a telephone found at a hotel), so that if you are working on something and you want to print it out, then you can do so. < 1440555532 896342 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the file is on a remote server then they may also have a program on the remote server to select printer controller mode and then convert DVI to Sixel graphics and then the local program can then convert the Sixel graphics into fax machine format. < 1440555692 126798 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another optional device might be a mouse which can be used to send xterm mouse commands and to copy/paste text on the screen. And then, you would have either wired ethernet or wi-fi or both, if you have wi-fi then you would also have a program to find the access point and to enter the password and so on. < 1440555778 826058 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440555816 213871 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl JOIN :#esoteric < 1440556031 818387 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Based on my ideas of how such a system would be used you probably don't need support for the filesystems of CD and DVD, although you might want to play an audio CD. < 1440556268 485691 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1440556287 4675 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1440556311 482592 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are three strokes. the first is a straigt line from top right to middle right. the second is a counterclockwise arc from top middle through middle left, bottom middle, ending at middle right. the third is a straight line from middle right to the centre < 1440556332 152045 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm.. wait < 1440556349 810182 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are three strokes. the first is a straigt line from top right to top middle < 1440556370 632311 :Melvar`!~melvar@dslb-178-000-203-254.178.000.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1440556392 630946 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second is a counterclockwise arc from top middle through middle left, bottom middle, ending at middle right. the third is a straight line from middle right to the centre < 1440556395 437056 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should make the description by mathematical notations, or by using METAFONT < 1440556395 805007 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1440556420 65614 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: that isn't as cool as having the system parse English text < 1440556429 40512 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-092-072-156-168.092.072.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1440556556 456542 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could have it to parse English texts too perhaps and convert them into METAFONT codes that can call the use of some macros; that way the thickness and other variation can be change by changing the macros and/or by changing the value of global variables < 1440556759 575814 :MDude!~fyrc@pa-67-235-0-195.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDream < 1440556912 575387 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Correct, Forth machines generally don't run SSH servers. This is a hypothetical possibility, not something I anticipate anyone actually doing. < 1440556964 69184 :Melvar`!~melvar@dslb-092-072-174-102.092.072.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1440557100 610805 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-092-072-156-168.092.072.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1440557142 896590 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't forth be more useful if the underlying cpu architecture was stack-based somehow < 1440557185 401300 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: It may if the CPU instruction set is designed to run Forth; a few do have some instructions like that, but even if it doesn't you can still implement Forth < 1440557189 783410 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :X forwarding doesn't seem needed here (it would just complicate it), but what may be useful might be "Plan9 forwarding"; is such a thing possible to do with SSH? < 1440557211 805506 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: You can forward arbitrary ports over SSH, so "yes". < 1440557232 427377 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Additionally IIRC the protocol can be expanded to cover unforeseen needs. < 1440557349 197123 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you do that then you could use it to access a CF card on the client rather than being physically connected the device to the server < 1440557478 242291 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl JOIN :#esoteric < 1440557565 152339 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin QUIT :Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1440557689 40881 :Melvar``!~melvar@dslb-088-078-251-201.088.078.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1440557732 354956 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1440557756 370552 :mauris!~mauris@2601:58a:100:1dbb:c095:e98d:7a0f:49f2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1440557756 424943 :mauris!~mauris@2601:58a:100:1dbb:c095:e98d:7a0f:49f2 QUIT :Changing host < 1440557756 425006 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl JOIN :#esoteric < 1440557821 939889 :Melvar`!~melvar@dslb-092-072-174-102.092.072.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1440558011 45913 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-188-109-013-169.188.109.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1440558144 546765 :Melvar``!~melvar@dslb-088-078-251-201.088.078.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1440558161 993210 :Melvar`!~melvar@dslb-084-062-111-166.084.062.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1440558308 567109 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-188-109-013-169.188.109.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1440558684 493823 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07GolfScript14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43913&oldid=43403 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-25) 10Seems alive again < 1440559426 18836 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07K-on Fuck14]]4 M10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43914&oldid=43411 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-6) 10/* Perl Implementation */ Mediawiki markup needs only one space, and doesn't ignore extras < 1440559497 941131 :mauris_!~mauris@c-67-191-112-170.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440559497 995663 :mauris_!~mauris@c-67-191-112-170.hsd1.fl.comcast.net QUIT :Changing host < 1440559497 995744 :mauris_!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl JOIN :#esoteric < 1440559706 324316 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1440561406 358307 :mauris_!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl NICK :mauri < 1440561429 591023 :mauri!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl NICK :mauris < 1440561897 49811 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@133-171-58-66.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440561904 8131 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi? < 1440561905 764111 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep < 1440561908 612498 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sal' < 1440561910 902716 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like I got on alright < 1440561917 139930 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. < 1440561945 204517 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fond of the HP Pavilion or something? < 1440562013 57722 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1440562034 944513 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 NICK :LenovoThinkpadT5 < 1440562039 786893 :LenovoThinkpadT5!~oren@65.94.102.49 NICK :ThinkpadT540p < 1440562093 177978 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Refract14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43915&oldid=43454 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-13) 10Some proofreading < 1440562275 126515 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know of a program to read and show where all of the backreferences are in a DEFLATE stream? If it doesn't exist I could write one though < 1440562370 258268 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know of one. < 1440562754 489905 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07N14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43916&oldid=43434 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+11) 10wikify < 1440563178 79788 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Jumper14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43917&oldid=43446 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+1) 10tag error, section case < 1440563207 137867 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c0f875.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is my solution for a Hack ASM project readable or terrible? http://pastie.org/private/zvdtyldnacegggvd95v4og < 1440563232 963040 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Jumper14]]4 M10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43918&oldid=43917 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-12) 10/* Examples */ oh and more of these markdown spaces < 1440563309 425117 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I wrote one of those for my custom compression format, but it doesn't do DEFLATE < 1440563330 983609 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: can you add a spam detection for when people start lines with 4 spaces twh < 1440563356 172853 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION only mostly joking < 1440563357 353090 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: What is your custom format? < 1440563373 718523 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: are actual spambots doing that? or is it humans who don't know how to wikify? < 1440563389 902046 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the latter < 1440563408 292469 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: it's basically a recursively-defined dictionary, where strings are defined in terms of shorter strings < 1440563424 521693 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :until eventually you can write the entire string you care about concisely < 1440563450 30261 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my tests it had much better compression than gzip even with no attempt at optimization, and when heavily optimized, was slightly better than bzip2 < 1440563462 998438 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately, "slightly better than bzip2" isn't really a selling point when there are other compression formats around which are much better < 1440563540 901026 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I need a nonrecursive dictionary for use with Z-machine text compression, because Z-machine does not support recursive dictionaries. < 1440563554 560013 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: What kind of data have you tried to compress though? < 1440563564 591961 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I tested it on the GPL version 3 and on a C-INTERCAL paxball < 1440563660 516480 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depending on the kind of data some preprocessing steps may be useful; much depends on the kinds of data I think, which is why I wanted to make the compression format where it joins together various blocks which may include compressed user-defined codes too < 1440563678 197897 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Is there a good reason to call it a paxball? < 1440563705 972897 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, the pax format is basically ustar. < 1440563709 902581 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: it's INTERCAL, thus it's arbitrarily different for no good reason < 1440563713 428824 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :other than being different < 1440563716 272618 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fair enough. < 1440563729 145109 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it's INTERCAL, which means that it especially tries to follow standards if nobody else does < 1440563732 782737 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1440563747 936803 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also, pax is backwards-compatible and so people can actually read it) < 1440563759 372736 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(because pax is literally ustar with extensions) < 1440563765 741705 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :being different for the sake of it is INTERCAL's actual reason for existence, though < 1440563773 866470 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like being hard to compile is Befunge's < 1440563782 599878 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other stuff, such as the actually-kind-of-neat control flow model, came later < 1440563791 24155 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That seems to understate the difficulty of compiling Befunge. < 1440563813 669230 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it was the invention of NEXT FROM that really kicked it off < 1440563865 254905 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :having functions that can call themselves opens up a bunch of possibilities that would be awkward to do in other ways (I mean, without other code having to call into them first) < 1440563909 910312 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07???14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43919&oldid=43768 5* 03108.35.44.196 5* (+479) 10Explain the name “???” < 1440563974 743660 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is C-INTERCAL compilable in a K&R C compiler? < 1440563978 97290 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: anyway, wrt that detection thing, it would be possible to display a message that just explained how wikimarkup worked, which would just be the message (plus requiring a second confirm) < 1440563991 637203 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I don't think so, but I'm not sure; maybe if you used unprotoize first < 1440564019 315070 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably not worth the effort. Being pedantically correct C is itself probably worth it. < 1440564153 740612 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1440564256 170033 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know how to prove that the algorithm I am using for figuring out optimal shift sequences for Z-machine text is perfect? < 1440564477 543857 :ThinkpadT540p!~oren@65.94.102.49 NICK :oren < 1440564829 305103 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: wasn't it based on finding the optimal sequences for initial substrings, given each final state? so assuming all states are accounted for, it should be just induction on adding another character... < 1440564900 409442 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, the sequences for each substring must be optimal for given initial and final state < 1440564933 457134 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: huh, I didn't realise you'd written a golfscript derivative < 1440564975 187741 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently! < 1440565015 372739 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: That isn't the entire thing; there is other stuff too that I added, because it isn't quite as simple as I had explained to you at first; nevertheless I believe that your way would work but see the entire thing to learn how it works < 1440565034 885243 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is http://zzo38computer.org/zmachine/doc/tricky.txt < 1440565096 330144 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: that customizable h command is genius :-) < 1440565111 563014 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh Black-Johansen < 1440565160 983051 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like my f command too!! so good for code golf < 1440565166 189698 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does f do? < 1440565183 836130 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :push a string containing all of fizzbuzz < 1440565186 465842 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I still need to write an interpreter for that language where you give it the number of an anagolf problem < 1440565214 91162 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?FizzBuzz#ranking < 1440565215 469001 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it tries out the solutions to that problem that are visible in reveal source, and takes a majority vote < 1440565223 808574 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is f customizable too? < 1440565233 611541 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadly no! wow, maybe it should be < 1440565246 850555 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, the logical consequence of this < 1440565260 630681 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is to write a language that's TC using nothing /but/ standard programming examples as commands < 1440565268 789759 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, you can do control flow by feeding a hello world to a fizzbuzz, or something < 1440565323 427815 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :print fizzbuzz[fibonacci(1)] < 1440565328 381342 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds interesting < 1440565365 487559 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :imo it should be TC but the only things it can actually output are standard programming example things < 1440565367 203917 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd be great because it'd be really hard to show off its TCness without there being an easy way to write whichever example program you picked < 1440565377 410365 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: TC internals but only standard example as output? < 1440565381 499358 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1440565386 47395 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-193-184.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1440565417 772572 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can write a program that counts from 1 to 10, but only by counting in unary using "hello world"s as a unit < 1440565439 906840 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :separated by... "99 bottles of beer on the wall"s < 1440565440 561025 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That'd be a fun Brainfuck interpreter. < 1440565478 956289 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: I've recieved horrified complements for the way I did I/O in Radixal!!!! < 1440565528 985074 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ugh, that fourth exclamation mark /still/ gets me even nowadays, although it's not quite as mind-destroying as it once was) < 1440565530 31068 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-193-184.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1440565575 977842 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :mind-destroying how so < 1440565584 874299 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"To avoid confusion, all numbers in this specification will be written in Roman numerals." is still one of my favourite sentences < 1440565597 65843 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: I decided that three was the highest justifiable number, which is why it uses four < 1440565612 467953 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :good. agree < 1440565637 376632 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Radixal!!!!14]]4 M10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43920&oldid=36037 5* 03Ais523 5* (+0) 10/* Radixal!!!! integers */ fix accidental use of decimal, which would crash the reader if encountered < 1440565689 832278 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh nooooo i found https://esolangs.org/wiki/EsoInterpreters again < 1440565690 655533 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: as long as the cost table still is correct with your adjustments, and all characters either follow it or have cost entirely independent of state (i.e. they can be ignored), then it should work... < 1440565691 989088 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric : (Yes, this means that although arbitrary codepoints can be input, it's not possible to output arbitrary codepoints; programmers are encouraged to find similar-looking codepoints that can be output and use them instead.) < 1440565701 622013 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: hmm, that makes me want to work on the Underlambda project again < 1440565708 409576 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I got bogged down in details < 1440565721 586029 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i like the idea of the new language < 1440565738 182849 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so do I < 1440565743 624433 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Gotta love INTERCAL. < 1440565745 758519 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it'd be hard to make it work, and I don't really want a hard-assed version < 1440565748 570910 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :go for it < 1440565749 437242 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*half-assed < 1440565767 86802 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to extend the chain. but how do you actually implement things like Lazy K < 1440565773 592003 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, how do we get control flow out of standard examples? clearly fizzbuzz can do some sort of loop, but… < 1440565844 109620 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :string building can be made by accessing an index in 99 bottles of beer < 1440565865 645678 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what operation lets us index strings? < 1440565874 479856 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It certainly seem different than how Infocom intended it, but it is the way optimal for their design. Their design is strange in this way, it seem like; not only with text but also with instructions and other stuff, there are strange things you can do which are almost certainly not what Infocom had in mind. < 1440565907 72869 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about looping by passing callbacks for fizz() and buzz() < 1440565933 735971 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what about c like pointer arithmetics for that? < 1440565947 390052 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: nah < 1440565960 335543 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizz and buzz should actuaöly be related to fizz and buzz < 1440565967 725343 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't just rename commands < 1440565969 785399 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :They almost certainly would not have purposely designed it such that these kind of algorithm would be in use. < 1440565971 608502 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: the problem there is that you'd probably just put all your logic in fizz and have a no-op for the buzz < 1440565980 617619 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes :( < 1440565992 629382 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: what sort of keyboard lets you typo an ö? < 1440566002 691519 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a german one < 1440566018 939575 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(What their compiler actually does is not use any permanent shifts at all; only temporary shifts are used. They have put in other features too which they have never used.) < 1440566027 336807 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I guess next to l is a reasonable position for that < 1440566033 303585 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :almøst a norwegian too < 1440566057 305239 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ü is next to p and öä are next to l < 1440566087 475621 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://cadie.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/INTERCAL-style-guide.html Clearly I should use INTERCAL at work. < 1440566096 450646 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh the german keyboard is probably close to swedish then < 1440566117 453664 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: fun fact, I have commit access to that repo < 1440566122 59206 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :my keyboard has öä marks on those keys but their not active < 1440566146 299032 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do think the swiss keyboard is weird < 1440566173 854264 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Joystick support, XZIP menus, the ORIGINAL? instruction, etc. I have also seen various other things in their story files (from disassembling them in the debugger I wrote) that I have been able to optimize even more better, too.) < 1440566177 288158 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially since caps lock + shift + x = x does not hold < 1440566197 75712 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not difficult to write interactive programs in Lazy K. However, you should be aware that doing so is, technically speaking, a sin. < 1440566202 288884 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: I was thinking "that doesn't work on my keyboard" then realised I rebound caps lock ages ago and sort-of forget its original purpose < 1440566217 762554 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had an alternative binding (shift-shift) to turn on caps lock for a while < 1440566219 683423 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but only used it once < 1440566229 534904 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if you can modify other keys with shift, why not shift?) < 1440566287 885542 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :brillänt < 1440566299 563499 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: huh, I've just noticed that that style guide doesn't outright say "alternate sparks and ears at alternate levels of grouping", which is normally considered the #1 INTERCAL readability tip < 1440566314 1904 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sort-of gets close but doesn't outright state it < 1440566327 757188 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the examples seem to be written in that form (because what sane programmer wouldn't?) < 1440566336 352623 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is an à key that does ä on shift, À on caps lock and Ä on shift+caps lock < 1440566357 683455 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: ugh, most keyboards that need that sort of thing use altgr for that purpose < 1440566405 400345 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(although on a UK keyboard, altgr is used for two keys: the second |, which is different from | on many OSes but not on Linux/X by default, and € which was a relatively recent addition) < 1440566422 457691 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not quite sure why we had an altgr key, actually, other than futureproofing < 1440566446 971614 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't even know how to make the second | < 1440566448 356622 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the secondary | can't be that important, as shown by the fact that the two are frequently merged < 1440566457 331771 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: it's altgr-` on a UK keyboard < 1440566465 407705 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes one is drawn solid and the other as a broken line < 1440566469 140026 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or one is thicker, or the like < 1440566477 641550 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but both map to the ASCII version with the config I have at the moment < 1440566526 27091 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: I think some Hebrew layouts use caps lock + shift + numbers for the what's-it-called. < 1440566530 725117 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, reading that style guide again < 1440566533 976110 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Diacritics? Whatever the name is in English. < 1440566543 893421 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm amused at how ".5 is always a boolean" has become such a standard in the INTERCAL community < 1440566556 335514 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just sort-of happened with the system library's convention, then sort-of expanded from there < 1440566578 507179 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: As I understand it, AltGr mostly came into being in the UK as a consequence of using the ISO mechanical layout rather than the ANSI mechanical layout. < 1440566592 839618 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect this is at least half to do with a really common technique of using an undocumented part of the system library internals to save one line of code < 1440566617 87704 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(to the extent that when I wrote syslibc, I had to preserve that undocumented behaviour because too much existing code broke otherwise) < 1440566662 921467 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, PLEASE NOTE is my standard comment syntax, but only because it looks better than the alternatives < 1440566704 137094 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Aaaah*. The UK keyboard is designed to also be usable for Irish. < 1440566724 485625 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes sense, although in that case I'd expect Irish letters to appear on the keycaps < 1440566753 297305 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know why they don't, but apparently the vowels have accented versions selected with Alt-Gr. < 1440566756 376532 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Con: Allowing extra groups sometimes allow you to avoid having to exchange all the rabbit-ears in a subexpression with sparks (and vice versa) when editing code." < 1440566765 167235 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, they've come /really really close/ to insisting that they always alternate < 1440566767 549197 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and still haven't stated it < 1440566774 183296 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That might be intentional. :) < 1440566775 283498 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess the author must just have assumed they said that already < 1440566788 861229 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :æe→ø↓ (altgr-vowels on my keyboard) < 1440566815 205974 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that e the same as an ASCII e? they look identical to me but that'd seem like a huge waste of an altgr binding < 1440566817 909045 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :left arrow and doiwn arrow? < 1440566845 725581 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know altgr-e is é on Windows, and is sometimes even written as such on the keycap < 1440566853 96516 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :try the e and then ` < 1440566861 243352 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :In a way I'm spoiled by the ANSI keyboard. It's friggin' great for English and programming. < 1440566869 257521 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: I can type é as altgr-; e < 1440566872 792972 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably something to do with those being all they do. :P < 1440566886 495134 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's my muscle-memorized keybinding even though é can be typed as compose, e, ' < 1440566903 687447 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I think languages tend to be designed around keyboards, especially more recently < 1440566932 349784 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :¬ would presumably be used more if the UK keyboard was also used in the US < 1440566951 456969 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also historically; the US keyboard layout is very close to the typical typewriter layout. < 1440566982 145913 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen typewriter layouts with no 0 or 1 < 1440566993 234163 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you were supposed to use O and I instead < 1440567062 214762 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, quite specifically the US keyboard layout is *basically* the Selectric keyboard layout (which was slightly different from traditional in where some of the special keys got located). < 1440567192 700063 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I think they are called vowel pointing < 1440567210 619077 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wikipedia says so) < 1440567228 770606 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :AZERTY (which i usually use) has a separate key for a letter that exists in exactly one french word < 1440567237 830911 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :some other junk is on it if you hold shift. but wow < 1440567283 762572 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: That's a verb, it sounds like. < 1440567290 372906 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Huh. The actual *spec* for the UK keyboard doesn't actually specify any use for AltGr, it just specifies it'll be there. < 1440567296 676420 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niqqud the name is just transliterated. < 1440567306 566354 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I don't know whether to use q or k or what, and a double one or a single one. < 1440567311 169803 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'm glad I have an altgr, anyway < 1440567320 680819 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but this does not make it any easier to explain the key to Americans < 1440567342 715803 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've taken to binding right-win to Compose, which at least gets faintly similar flexibility. < 1440567354 555809 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it was just future expansion? € is pretty important nowadays and it was nice that we had somewhere to put it once we discovered we needed it? < 1440567365 390337 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(there's also an iso-8859 variant which has a euro in and is otherwise -1) < 1440567386 128320 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used to bind the menu key to Compose. < 1440567394 521561 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's windows 1252 < 1440567397 118797 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :This keyboard has neither a menu key nor a right Windows key. < 1440567401 699584 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also a consequence of being near to the EU -- note that *physically* all the European keyboards are actually identical. < 1440567422 842835 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The differences are just in the keycaps and what the OSes do with 'em. < 1440567430 337089 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, there's two or three such variants: < 1440567445 321027 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually four or more < 1440567460 299166 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: huh, US keyboards are physically different from UK ones? < 1440567466 474545 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1440567482 725725 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:KB_United_States-NoAltGr.svg This is a normal US keyboard. < 1440567493 513967 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :some of the keys are different shapes but I thought that was just done via the use of keycaps that didn't plug into all of the (whatever you call the thing that keycaps plug into) < 1440567504 989105 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :because iso-8859-15 is the modification of iso-8859-1 with euro, and iso-8859-16 is the modification of iso-8859-2 with euro and the disunified Romanian letters, these two don't get used much because they came late and unicode was already well-spread by the time; < 1440567535 158070 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You've *buttons* we don't have. < 1440567557 931503 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yeah, no. Each keycap has its own hole. < 1440567558 651586 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also have a numpad < 1440567570 229636 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and arrow keys < 1440567580 213169 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and cp1252 is the modification of the original cp1252 without renaming it, with euro added, and cp1250 is the modification of the original cp1250 with euro and the disunified Romanian letters added, without renaming, and these do get used a lot because some Windows programs use locale byte encodings by default and these often are the locale's byte encodings < 1440567610 333755 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa whoa whoa < 1440567610 642098 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@133-171-58-66.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1440567619 284384 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :An extra key? TG. < 1440567624 113392 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that's a bizarre place to put \ < 1440567630 658379 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I was doing that on the basis that you can easily switch a UK keyboard over to being interpreted as US < 1440567635 546936 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then you just have some duplicate keys < 1440567656 185390 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the main one being that our # key becomes a duplicate \) < 1440567667 921515 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though, L-Alt and R-Alt generate different codes, so you *can* switch to a more general sort of layout. Namely, US-International, which has R-Alt as Alt-Gr. < 1440567678 562250 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:KB_US-International.svg < 1440567681 282037 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH so that's why my friend's laptop has two \ keys < 1440567684 659805 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :US International (AltGr Deadkeys) is the right one. < 1440567703 571133 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Very few actually use the thing. < 1440567718 569642 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been using it for a long time. < 1440567738 308849 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@133-171-58-66.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440567765 936162 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But deadkeys are scow. < 1440567838 591985 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then there's the rarely used Canadian multilingual keyboard. :) < 1440567884 248870 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:KB_Canadian_Multilingual_Standard_comment-en.svg Yeah, that's right. Two Alt-Gr buttons. < 1440567974 496322 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well < 1440567982 703811 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was a nap and a half < 1440567988 751822 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, more like about 12 naps < 1440567994 747204 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, more like a solid night's sleep < 1440567996 707233 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a half < 1440568004 835887 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just accidentally slept for about 12 hours < 1440568025 152994 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: wow, that's crazy < 1440568025 967222 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haneb < 1440568034 570609 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b01:cddb::f63 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION should go bed. < 1440568053 969758 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: my record is something like 18, that's only happened something like twice though < 1440568061 588632 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I was very tired for other reasons beforehand < 1440568069 19700 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've done 20 I think < 1440568075 784333 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :more worrying is when I'm really tired, go to bed, wake up feeling refreshed < 1440568080 871903 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then realise I've only been asleep three hours < 1440568081 945833 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I was not expecting to go to sleep at all < 1440568093 619844 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just intended to have a short nap < 1440568101 951578 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then go around trying to establish the date because three and twenty-seven seem about equally believable < 1440568112 44669 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and the most accessible clocks show time but not date) < 1440568129 425543 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1440568160 589611 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1440568186 570420 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yeah. my firend has a Acer Aspire 6920G (giant media centre lap-crusher) with the canadian multilanguage layboard < 1440568191 916928 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I sometimes sleep short and feel refreshed, or sleep very long, but I don't get confused about the time, I almost always sleep in a way that I know approximately how much time I slept, without a clock < 1440568238 855357 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait that's not the right model... < 1440568250 569983 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I had a really bad night on Sunday night and was tired for most of yesterday < 1440568326 260863 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently the keyboards sold in Sweden have two Swedish keyboard layouts printed on them, which differ only in two keys: the ; and ' have ö and ä swapped < 1440568346 308555 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like that < 1440568375 479012 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have made up a VM as well as Minesweeper and Robotfindskitten and Munching Squares and a few other examples < 1440568378 436958 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1440568402 937398 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl JOIN :#esoteric < 1440568448 438167 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zzo38computer.org/prog/quackvm.zip - Source-codes is provided, and needs xterm and Linux to run; CTRL+Q quits and CTRL+R restarts. < 1440568557 125627 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right. it's acer aspire 6920ZG, note the Z, for, uh... really really bog < 1440568666 877214 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://regmedia.co.uk/2008/03/14/acer_6920_1.jpg < 1440569061 80107 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c0f875.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if zzo38 would like Hack ASM < 1440569157 70921 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: some browser don't support gopher -__- < 1440569163 67654 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :browsers* < 1440569182 344506 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Trivia: I have a gopher-accessible selfie < 1440569190 558936 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is the only thing I have put in the gopherspace < 1440569228 884297 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :i expected a question < 1440569275 373209 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: Yes, some don't, but some do and there are also standalone gopher clients, and extensions to support gopher in some browsers < 1440569350 841713 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Brainfuck Sharp14]]4 M10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43921&oldid=43670 5* 03Hppavilion1 5* (+46) 10Fixed formatting (whoops) < 1440569414 421944 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh right, my esolangs page is also accessible via gopher < 1440569421 300833 :evalj!~jeval@BC066B86.catv.pool.telekom.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1440569426 937380 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And an interpreter fro brainfuck in Snap < 1440569427 895439 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.anybrowser.org/campaign/ you two read this < 1440569504 301894 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe I've seen that before, and agree with the sentiment < 1440569554 480954 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah... back ages ago I once had a cgi page that printed a Best Viewed With marker for the other browser than the one you were using < 1440569581 321042 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1440569597 181551 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :best viewed with one or more eyes < 1440569626 132579 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :back in those days sites had said “Best Viewed By Internet Explorer at resolution 800x600” or something. These days they don't say that, they're just silently broken on most browsers and window sizes and font sizes other than what they were testing for. < 1440569632 472207 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(you don't need parallax to view this page) < 1440569661 677288 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This is best viewed in a browser" < 1440569677 660918 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Stop reading it using curl" < 1440569680 892532 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: no, I don't want that either. a webpage should be readable without eyes too, on a Braille terminal or screen reader or with the bytes relayed directly to my mind or whatever < 1440569682 265660 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just don't do anything that cares about such things; leave the client to decide the best way to render it. Gopher requires this. < 1440569695 111433 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: ok, wget -O- < 1440569698 688509 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes, that's the correct approach < 1440569698 801073 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1440569723 19608 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea if my esolangs page (the only page I really maintain) is readable with a screen reader or Braille terminal < 1440569729 564454 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's generally easy too, with only a few cases where it's difficult because of some feature I want not accessible in an easy portable way < 1440569745 929981 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1440569782 600226 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: what matters most for that is that you don't put important information (like text of the links on a menu listing the pages of your site) in images showing text only, but also as text (possibly alt text) < 1440569805 957905 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: I tried to add "best viewed with one or more computing apparatuses" and gave up < 1440569821 167509 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas, the only image is a little public domain button at the end < 1440569841 823398 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :many people use an image representation of their email address < 1440569871 573975 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, mine is in plain text and uses no techniques to forestall spiders < 1440569871 998663 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://aiju.de/ but there's this other approach < 1440569872 356841 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you can also use a text description of your email address, that is also used < 1440569873 196423 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: I use both an image representation and an obfuscated text on my homepage < 1440569893 955977 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of my pages can be read using curl < 1440569906 801748 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: obfuscated like "feed this to a brainfuck interpreter"? < 1440569916 692332 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: as in Contact e-mail: ambrus@@mmaatthh..bbmmee..hhuu < 1440569920 62903 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: no < 1440569931 71720 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mostly just use plain text files anyways, so you can easily just use command-line program anyways < 1440569935 368137 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: cute < 1440569938 620836 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :specifically, if you leave off the .htm, you will typically get a plain text version < 1440569949 711810 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because of some cgi i wrote < 1440569960 480199 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's from way back. these days I don't hav to matter because I get lots of academic spam from my email appearing in metadata of scientific publications in plain text unobfuscated < 1440569993 178341 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :just thought i'd mention that my pastebin, http://arin.ga serves a raw version when viewed with curl and wget, or a html version with a browser < 1440569996 947815 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1440570046 356107 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a TeX representation for my email address: \sideset{someone}{\!mearie}{\mathop{@}}\!_\cdot org < 1440570069 228452 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I use HTML even for most of the simple pages (eg. http://www.math.bme.hu/~ambrus/pu/verst and the other two poems quoted on my homepage): that makes it slightly easier to provide metadata, and people can still read or copy the text easily. < 1440570082 520264 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(of course, I have also noted that any email pointing to the present domain will reach me) < 1440570087 547835 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, my esolangs page doesn't get through w3c's validator unscathed < 1440570119 643588 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I put metadata only using tags in the root page (that's all it contains), since that is the only page that needs metadata. < 1440570146 100304 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: sure, that works too, at least if you make sure the http headers are correct < 1440570162 912251 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are some metadata you can give as either a http header or html elements < 1440570173 956186 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the html elements were first, but then they invented a solution for non-html data < 1440570188 595076 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c0f875.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1440570195 652994 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the stuff I have tried it with (only OpenID actually, so far) do work < 1440570227 591465 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1440570327 940056 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But basically I thought, if the html page contains mostly text without tags, then people can read the source even without a html viewer, so I don't bother keeping it text < 1440570341 599955 :mauris!~mauris@c-67-191-112-170.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440570341 654042 :mauris!~mauris@c-67-191-112-170.hsd1.fl.comcast.net QUIT :Changing host < 1440570341 654089 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl JOIN :#esoteric < 1440570388 916469 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that does help too. < 1440570466 927938 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a HTTP headers for giving the language of the text, and I think there's some for giving the canonical url (same as in html) and instructions for crawlers to index or not index it < 1440570474 347987 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and more < 1440570483 730223 :Guest71111!~Slereah@APuteaux-653-1-83-93.w90-61.abo.wanadoo.fr NICK :Slereah < 1440570488 767936 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I think one for the title too < 1440570508 39896 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :because plain text is plain text and doesn't have a general way to represent any of these < 1440570511 843006 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just can use robots.txt to tell crawlers not to index it (although I allowed wget) < 1440570574 63861 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes, robots.txt tells about the noindex, but you may also want to tell about the nofollow, for user-submitted material that contains spam < 1440570611 667853 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :to indicate that even though it contains links to buy-rolex-sunglasses-cheap-online.com, you're not trying to say that's a good site < 1440570627 500029 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you still want to allow the robots to crawl and make that page searchable < 1440570687 827789 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :practically speaking, the encoding and language are the most important for plain text < 1440570695 434139 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like to use nofollow < 1440570716 735170 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just use ASCII encoding so it doesn't matter. < 1440570718 219661 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nofollow is for untrusted html < 1440570765 482384 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's also why I think rel=nofollow etc. is a bit unfortunate, since it really has to be a container attribute affecting all descendants) < 1440570808 431547 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even for untrusted HTML, I don't like to use nofollow, or to obey it except for internal links. < 1440571794 882845 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just use plain text mostly, it works fine < 1440571916 43311 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: sure, but obviously ASCII encoding won't work for me for those three poems, they contain non-ascii, so I have to specify an explicit encoding < 1440571929 498636 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, in that case you do. < 1440571930 891363 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(namely utf-8 or iso-8859-2) < 1440571958 482123 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But ASCII should be use when possible. Of course in some cases it isn't, so you use other encodings < 1440572068 921763 :x10A94!~x10A94@178.252.73.97 JOIN :#esoteric < 1440572104 172985 :evalj!~jeval@BC066B86.catv.pool.telekom.hu QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1440572202 977472 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, hungarian poetry with only ascii characters < 1440572233 331043 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's probably a lot harder than with norwegian < 1440572281 287963 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 JOIN :#esoteric < 1440572307 954068 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but it is one kind of restrictive writing to try I suppose, like they make poetry with other kinds of restrictive writing too (no "e", word lengths must follow a predefined pattern, initial letters of each word must spell out a prefix of the full poem, etc) < 1440572590 622047 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@133-171-58-66.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1440573128 88914 :J_Arcane_!~chatzilla@37-219-195-15.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1440573230 275633 :J_Arcane!~chatzilla@37-219-195-15.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1440573243 336284 :J_Arcane_!~chatzilla@37-219-195-15.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi NICK :J_Arcane < 1440573830 993784 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :fnyrd < 1440573859 2409 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: being fit probably includes surfing . < 1440573909 90380 :J_Arcane!~chatzilla@37-219-195-15.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1440574030 643080 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're australian, yes. if you're norwegian, somewhat more doubtful. < 1440574986 46058 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you any like a tsume shogi game? < 1440575168 569499 :nisstyre!~yourstrul@oftn/member/Nisstyre QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1440575400 188712 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Z? < 1440576116 421640 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I am finding level 63 difficult < 1440576150 582664 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am going to head off now, I think < 1440576161 350217 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1440576308 575328 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1440576448 861782 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The king is going to escape < 1440576631 295217 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1440576676 313148 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 JOIN :#esoteric < 1440576722 122729 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :" hm, hungarian poetry with only ascii characters" -- that's hard, because á and é are very common letters < 1440576727 694693 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yes < 1440576747 738164 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, I did it now < 1440576755 558730 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what game is this? < 1440576764 1182 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tsume shogi game < 1440576789 322584 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it a puzzle game? < 1440576793 271431 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1440576865 956195 :nisstyre!~yourstrul@li611-52.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1440577140 944896 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1440577232 935370 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone hacked an italian gov site http://www.giustiziaminorile.it/ < 1440577281 89671 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :they wrote a couple of meaningless sentences with several spelling mistakes in a green monospaced font + low res jpeg picture as a background < 1440577979 782606 :Patashu!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1440578086 307793 :J_Arcane!~chatzilla@37-219-195-15.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1440580574 97501 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1440581295 556999 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1440582025 522389 :llue!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu JOIN :#esoteric < 1440582052 991185 :lleu!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1440583148 33509 :aretecode!~aretecode@209.58.130.130 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1440583343 97557 :aretecode!~aretecode@209.58.130.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1440583476 398901 :rdococ!~rdococ@unaffiliated/octagonfly QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1440583496 94347 :rdococ!~rdococ@unaffiliated/octagonfly JOIN :#esoteric < 1440583782 939552 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1440583829 91060 :rdococ!~rdococ@unaffiliated/octagonfly QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1440583936 307748 :rdococ!~rdococ@unaffiliated/octagonfly JOIN :#esoteric < 1440584281 315026 :rdococ!~rdococ@unaffiliated/octagonfly QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1440584304 377049 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 JOIN :#esoteric < 1440584371 964714 :rdococ!~rdococ@unaffiliated/octagonfly JOIN :#esoteric < 1440584714 171714 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1440586658 537731 :FireFly!~firefly@firefly.xen.prgmr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1440586810 609988 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@ip-78-102-58-167.net.upcbroadband.cz JOIN :#esoteric < 1440587855 459531 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 QUIT :Quit: Poulet! < 1440588120 440583 :FireFly!~firefly@firefly.xen.prgmr.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1440588132 575012 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-38-201.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1440588176 999204 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-38-201.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1440588177 90833 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1440588260 855677 :Patashu!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1440588263 691007 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1440588312 134050 :Patashu!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1440588567 106100 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1440589468 864550 :MDream!~fyrc@pa-67-235-0-195.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1440590542 35079 :TieSoul!~quassel@86.89.119.147 JOIN :#esoteric < 1440590712 352575 :Melvar`!~melvar@dslb-084-062-111-166.084.062.pools.vodafone-ip.de NICK :Melvar < 1440590839 47651 :TieSoul!~quassel@86.89.119.147 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1440590944 923165 :TieSoul!~quassel@2a02:a448:4a62:0:548d:2bb6:e105:b48e JOIN :#esoteric < 1440590958 660665 :idris-bot!~idris-bot@dslb-084-062-111-166.084.062.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1440591625 830098 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera, I can't work out what that translates to... Children's Justice? < 1440591635 678062 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :("giustiziaminorile" that is) < 1440591851 162532 :FireFly!~firefly@firefly.xen.prgmr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1440592104 978007 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :They also put that consipracy theory music on the sitr < 1440592158 963626 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, the child courts? < 1440592214 535453 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1440592400 832821 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently yes < 1440592416 850048 :oren!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dipartimento_per_la_giustizia_minorile < 1440592441 164204 :Patashu!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1440595287 959787 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-jkinuzxevfgoltmn QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1440595323 195246 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-hphfffjzaknejeqd JOIN :#esoteric < 1440595736 667056 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1440596661 629413 :ProofTechnique!~Ptech@65-183-137-193-dhcp.burlingtontelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440596866 589054 :aloril!~aloril@84.248.14.20 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1440596933 247928 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c0f875.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440596972 434142 :aloril!~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw2-54f80e-20.dhcp.inet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1440597447 509842 :gonad!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu JOIN :#esoteric < 1440597651 449352 :llue!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1440597729 885659 :augur!~augur@c-73-46-94-9.hsd1.fl.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1440597884 337548 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1440598423 938484 :augur!~augur@c-73-46-94-9.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440600139 461595 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: yes, sorry for not explaining it < 1440600152 143761 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No worries < 1440601207 240004 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.yoda.arachsys.com/pics/calling/ these are actual pictures of jon skeet < 1440601216 213637 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :highest rep on stackoverflow < 1440601920 780550 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :He looks like someone who has fun < 1440602005 363185 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a link to his christian preaching site < 1440602030 414464 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the girl with the leash looks like she has fun < 1440605349 39546 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :tsk, why does Isabelle make it so hard to define functions that aren't actually functions ;-) < 1440605386 623729 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's isabelle? < 1440605396 620455 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a theorem prover < 1440605400 141680 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1440605421 70594 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is not the first time i ask it < 1440605600 964848 :ProofTechnique!~Ptech@65-183-137-193-dhcp.burlingtontelecom.net QUIT :Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1440606075 482878 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440606491 961697 :tromp__!~tromp@rtc35-240.rentec.com QUIT : < 1440606936 536273 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1440607635 660570 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1440607760 914245 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, I should probably try to start a conversation on #isabelle instead < 1440607799 163777 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grumble grumble websites that disable pasting into password boxes. < 1440607990 156315 :ashl!~ash@185.83.217.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder what they think they're achieving with that < 1440608565 315523 :tromp_!~tromp@rtc35-217.rentec.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1440609325 14689 :ProofTechnique!~Ptech@65-183-137-193-dhcp.burlingtontelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440609390 403293 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1440610287 877121 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: are you erik demaine? < 1440611075 722519 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that sounds like a ridiculously bad idea < 1440611118 774057 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :"my password is so much safer now that I had to paste it to an editor window in order to copy it" < 1440611380 601927 :Slereah!~Slereah@APuteaux-653-1-83-93.w90-61.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh, you are more at risk from password bruteforcing than you are of hackers getting in your computer < 1440611542 676320 :idris-bot!~idris-bot@dslb-084-062-111-166.084.062.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1440611543 92459 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-084-062-111-166.084.062.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1440611546 90873 :Melvar`!~melvar@dslb-092-072-161-166.092.072.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1440611551 126228 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bruteforcers won't use copy&paste < 1440611560 399420 :ashl!~ash@185.83.217.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :citation needed. < 1440611583 948318 :ashl!~ash@185.83.217.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably the reason for pasting is that they use randomly generated password < 1440611585 591003 :ashl!~ash@185.83.217.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1440611586 440951 :mihow!~mihow@50-206-98-70-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440611591 34041 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :doing stuff by hand takes way too much time and work < 1440611600 606065 :ashl!~ash@185.83.217.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems much more likely that such passwords would be stolen than brute-forced < 1440612635 476818 :Melvar`!~melvar@dslb-092-072-161-166.092.072.pools.vodafone-ip.de NICK :Melvar < 1440612674 109921 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1440613126 952401 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1440613143 576025 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440613233 984480 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1440614322 907560 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Has anyone written self-fulfilling statements about controversial incompatible grammar changes, such that eg. in the standard grammar X the statement parses as (I hope that the gods forbid me that (I have used grammar Y, which will not happen).), < 1440614339 759523 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in the heretic grammar Y it parses as (I hope that ((the gods forbid me that I have used grammar Y), which will not happen))? < 1440614354 199442 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to compose a nice statment like that about the heretic cucmen variant of the lojban grammar. < 1440614409 919582 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Making such a statent is possible, but I'd also like to make it nice, so that it doesn't sound too contreived, and is somewhat robust. < 1440614447 681702 :Hoolootwo!~Hooloovoo@d1g1t4l.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :that almost sounds like INTERCAL's abstain < 1440614455 113264 :Hoolootwo!~Hooloovoo@d1g1t4l.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not exactly < 1440614462 460033 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1440614918 991122 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1440615082 11546 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1440615259 30246 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: cucmen? < 1440615290 833978 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, what on earth is a "heretic grammar" even < 1440615401 185034 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric : Grumble grumble websites that disable pasting into password boxes. <-- at least with browsers you can probably just fiddle with the input box using dev tools < 1440615411 325842 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: i know someone who's even maurer than you < 1440615521 587453 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes i believe i've seen this someone in #haskell < 1440616324 284229 :TieSoul!~quassel@2a02:a448:4a62:0:548d:2bb6:e105:b48e QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1440616697 651887 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: by heretic variant, I mean it is a language that I disdain and claim shouldn't ever be used, because it is so incompatible with lojban that both speaking it will confuse listeners who expect lojban and speaking lojban will confuse listeners who expect cucmen, and even if you are aware of both of them, it is often hard to write sentences in a way that they have identical meaning in both. unlike, say, C and C++, where it is easy to write C code tha < 1440616709 635688 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlike, say, C and C++, where it is easy to write C code that also works in C++ if you know the basic differences. < 1440616757 928279 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i google "cucmen +lojban" i get zero results; where is this a thing? < 1440616819 949189 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i guess you mean: a sentence that is true in both languages but parses differently < 1440616828 279723 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: by cucmen in particular, I mean what's sometimes called "cmevla-brivla merger" or something like that (but that's a bad name). it's the grammar variant that removes the (sumti-6 -> LA [relative-clauses] CMENE) production and adds the (tanru-unit-2 -> CMEVLA) production. < 1440616871 239728 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :some people speak this variant and even try to advocate it. < 1440616936 737021 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha. i love how lojban is supposedly perfectly unambiguous, but it really isn't, because people keep pulling shit like this < 1440616946 118194 :impomatic_!~digital_w@31.185.136.135 JOIN :#esoteric < 1440617018 922757 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1440617026 379733 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: yes, and that modified language doesn't even deserve to be called lojban, unlike some extensions that are actually good. < 1440617066 595915 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to make a public statement that if someone knowingly and deliberately keeps using cucmen even after he is taught of the errors in his ways, he is a heretic and shall be excummunicated, and shall ask the gods for foregiveness by repeating that prayer, in lojban, and understand it. < 1440617082 20773 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :like apparently they were changing what "lo" means, but all of the tutorials still explained old "lo", and it made me realize the language was silly and i sort of lost interest. < 1440617122 319818 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the prayer shall be self-fulfilling in the sense that they can't speak it in cucmen and still hope the gods will foregive them. < 1440617151 963728 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if they see the light and speak it in lojban, the gods will already have forgiven them. < 1440617187 553760 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does this make sense, at least in #esoteric ? < 1440617211 848407 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes sense < 1440617250 719870 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I'm asking if anyone has already done some statement similar to this, about possibly other topics than cucmen. < 1440617316 503685 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The goal is that the statement shouldn't seem to be contreived for this purpose, but should sound natural, so as to demonstrate in a self-contained way why cucmen is a bad idea and is very incompatible with lojban. < 1440617323 308258 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :(even when i google "cucmen" "lo" "mi" i find no sources calling this thing that. is it your own nickname for the concept, or?) < 1440617334 671738 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: it's my own nickname, yes < 1440617340 557168 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1440617408 847742 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the name others use is something like "cmevla-brivla merger" but that's a _bad_ name, because that makes it sound as if it's a conservative extension that permits you to use cmevla in more ways. in reality, it's changing cmevla so you usually can't use them in ways that you can in lojban. < 1440617502 755655 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I needed a short nickname that's easy to remember and recognize, and I also wanted it to be a cmevla (or juxtaposition of multiple cmevla) because I think that helps compose this statement. < 1440617534 899702 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, the statement will probably contain the word "cucmen" and use that to help the ambiguous parsing. < 1440617563 463762 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I haven't got the statement yet, so it's possible it won't actually have that word, or won't use it in a way significant for the parsing difference. < 1440617613 31814 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's also possible that what I wrote above won't be the meaning of the statement of course. I chose that particular meaning because I think it's possible to write the statement to mean roughly those two things, but I might have to change it to actually work. < 1440618120 503219 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07User:Nooodl/vector.css14]]4 N10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=43922 5* 03Nooodl 5* (+48) 10Created page with "h1, h2, h3, h4, h5, h6 { font-family: Georgia; }" < 1440618208 540363 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :i... i like serif headers. what can i say < 1440618392 132150 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can make the declaration say that you have to pray to something like "lo la .lojban. cafyfraxu cevni" = the merciful gods of Lobjan, which is an example for a phrase that isn't trivial to modify in a way that it parses correctly in both lojban and cucmen. < 1440618427 264884 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@94-224-64-77.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1440618702 556025 :x10A94!~x10A94@178.252.73.97 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1440618810 578325 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1440619159 208698 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1440619335 604181 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that in the prayer, I want to use a phrase with form similar to {lo nu co'e la .cucme. poi brodi poi brodu} where the {poi brodu} part is an inner qualifier for the whole phrase, but in cucme it is an outer qualifier for the {la .cucme.}, < 1440619413 320690 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :only that way it doesn't have the right meaning, because it's not cucme that I want to qualify, but the forgiving. < 1440619445 907944 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wait < 1440619446 748024 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1440619455 899975 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll have to think of how this works < 1440621714 747597 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lua has changed a lot since I last looked at it (at version 5.1). I should look at the details. < 1440621726 272547 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(See http://www.lua.org ) < 1440622758 102976 :ProofTechnique!~Ptech@65-183-137-193-dhcp.burlingtontelecom.net QUIT :Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1440623084 176902 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@94-224-64-77.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1440623166 697128 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@94-224-64-77.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1440623294 49451 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1440623524 166646 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1440624246 120741 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1440624591 398256 :llue!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu JOIN :#esoteric < 1440624693 812771 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@94-224-64-77.access.telenet.be QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in < 1440624834 569890 :gonad!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1440625086 12739 :ProofTechnique!~Ptech@c-24-147-92-185.hsd1.vt.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440625154 30671 :trn!jhj@trnsz.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1440625160 150940 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03IfThenElse 5* 10New user account < 1440625228 422681 :gonad!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu JOIN :#esoteric < 1440625301 758995 :gonad!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu NICK :dagon < 1440625301 861570 :trn!jhj@trnsz.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1440625360 603421 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1440625452 457685 :llue!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1440625556 573890 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1440625647 843597 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : " hm, hungarian poetry with only ascii characters" -- that's hard, because á and é are very common letters <-- my guess is it's still easier than doing without e in norwegian, and possibly even english? < 1440625689 734749 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, what i recall from hungarian grammar is that the most basic suffixes don't have long vowels unless the root ends with a vowel. < 1440625756 700173 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm is he asleep < 1440625910 871077 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Somehow I thought an "IfThenElse" account already existed, it sounded familiar. < 1440625911 699421 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :in norwegian nearly all verb suffixes (except "strong" verbs past tense) contain e, as do all the articles. < 1440625961 201973 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and most of the noun endings too < 1440625989 846793 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but nouns don't have suffixes in the indefinite singular. < 1440626025 167436 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1440626055 593255 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Sigh* < 1440626090 983782 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :nynorsk fares a little better on the verbs, they often have a instead < 1440626114 310396 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :School is hard :( < 1440626114 827532 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no:har = en:has works < 1440626131 487089 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(either bokmål or nynorsk) < 1440626172 598078 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose poetry can get away with leaving out articles a lot < 1440626214 329923 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Poetry can get away with not using any real words, I think, if you're flexible enough. < 1440626256 541971 :dagon!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1440626257 123835 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep http://www.nale.no/nale/favourites/jevkulturuke.html < 1440626303 292481 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :only the title and final word are real (although the final word needs an extra l) < 1440626342 270915 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yet the meaning of the poem is perfectly clear < 1440626397 873326 :lleu!~gnomebad@88.202.254.4 JOIN :#esoteric < 1440626397 966788 :lleu!~gnomebad@88.202.254.4 QUIT :Changing host < 1440626397 966855 :lleu!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu JOIN :#esoteric < 1440626407 673952 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: the meaning is not perfectly clear hth < 1440626421 440865 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Cannot read property 'row' of null" it's not good. < 1440626436 663328 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no, I'm still awake < 1440626458 3188 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes, it's probably easier than writing without "e" in English < 1440626464 124691 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what do the title and final word +l mean? < 1440626464 239066 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: it is if you know the meaning of those two words hth < 1440626485 345515 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: culture week (a kind of festival) and cowpie nonsense < 1440626504 883338 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a _rural_ festival, generally) < 1440626536 689538 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: is one of them something a rooster says twh < 1440626538 537584 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well, frequently, anyway) < 1440626545 741908 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :here's something similar http://www.libellulus.com/article-ulcerations-111381103.html < 1440626559 450199 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: that would be "kykelipi", except for the final two letters < 1440626577 590990 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i.e. the title of the entire poetry collection) < 1440626578 767058 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it would be "kykeli"? < 1440626583 821215 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :kykeliky < 1440626602 318706 :impomatic_!~digital_w@31.185.136.135 QUIT :Quit: http://corewar.co.uk < 1440626614 805068 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :in hebrew a rooster says "kukuriku" < 1440626626 94078 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@74-114-87-64.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1440626629 387799 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently that's true in croatian too?? < 1440626685 546461 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :kukeleku < 1440626742 918009 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauris: have you considered changing your name to maurest < 1440626769 120655 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm there's a single word in that word that isn't an anagram of the rest < 1440626773 266059 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*in that list < 1440626786 839499 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: someone's gotta be the positive degree < 1440626916 91199 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :maurissimus < 1440627091 25106 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :here's a live reading by the poet hth https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tz8hxErxhBI < 1440627110 339220 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I just did a quick search (may have bugs) among Arany János's poems in Hungarian for consecutive sequences of entire lines containing only ascii. < 1440627123 615925 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The longest there is is only 10 words. < 1440627157 98202 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, not something you do by chance < 1440627261 847282 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :In case you're curious, tied for the longest is the last two lines of the famous ballad Ágnes Asszony. < 1440627369 315338 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And in this book of his poems, en-dashes, quotation marks, and italicized text (all three of which he uses regularly) are all represented as ASCII characters, so this is a very charitable interpretation of ASCII-only. < 1440627383 967331 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elipsis too. < 1440627536 907305 :hppavilion[1]!~hppavilio@133-171-58-66.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1440627651 791168 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, my search has a bug. < 1440627654 47067 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let me fix it. < 1440628067 331384 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Longest found now is 18 words. < 1440628559 689971 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does google search only give you the choice between "all languages" and "whichever language is your setup"? there's no fucking way to say i want anything _but_ hungarian. < 1440628601 397746 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(trying to find any english description about the poem) < 1440628646 562480 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :try https://www.google.com/preferences < 1440628684 31013 :mauris!~mauris@unaffiliated/nooodl PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, https://www.google.com/preferences#languages < 1440628687 119308 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or https://www.google.com/advanced_search ? < 1440628729 720383 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm advanced search looks more promising < 1440628764 313696 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 JOIN :#esoteric < 1440628789 604269 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the trouble is, google.no doesn't have advanced_search listed anywhere. < 1440628802 58333 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Neither does google.com < 1440628818 778821 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i found it via https://encrypted.google.com/search?q=advanced+search hth < 1440628893 200885 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah i still get only album listings and videos < 1440628940 806172 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hellørchaf. < 1440628986 890112 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess this will have to do http://virginmediashorts.com/film/4478/the-ballad-of-mistress-agnes < 1440629168 164239 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if google is removing and hiding all the really good search options because they're too computation intensive < 1440629201 694230 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION watches fizzie and pikhq accusingly < 1440629218 195347 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah, out of the accusation zone < 1440629240 946103 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh did you use to work at google < 1440629268 652324 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure this is extensively described in the google non-disclosure agreement < 1440629780 144907 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: There was a third one too, I forget who. < 1440629857 521586 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :FWIW, if I search something at google.com, then the SRP's "cogwheel" menu does have an "Advanced search" option. < 1440629873 811437 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where you can set any particular language. < 1440629904 113574 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, where SRP is the "search results page", sorry. < 1440629904 786835 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you can't exclude languages. < 1440629914 861448 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: whoa whoa whoa < 1440629917 199465 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :what/srp < 1440629937 879955 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it something else? I don't really remember, it's just "the serp". < 1440629986 690287 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea. < 1440630001 41136 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've forgotten so many Google code names and things. < 1440630003 294855 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's wonderful. < 1440630022 840215 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :They certainly like having code names and terms, I've noticed that much. < 1440630149 883363 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aw, the let-sen-crypt launch was pushed back. < 1440630158 38160 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"General availability: Week of November 16, 2015" < 1440630166 78728 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it was supposed to be either August or September. < 1440630214 597049 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do remember a build system with an unfortunate name. < 1440630220 884095 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So unfortunate that they renamed it. < 1440630275 555782 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, they've got http://bazel.io/ open-sourced now. < 1440630332 224354 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that one, the thing with the web UI. < 1440630333 943491 :rdococ!~rdococ@unaffiliated/octagonfly QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1440630355 521196 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :If they've renamed it, I might not have heard of the previous name. < 1440630379 306894 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has a very fast new name. < 1440630473 24242 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa, speaking of Google websites, did you come across that one great site? < 1440630478 215743 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I probably shouldn't talk about it in here. < 1440630522 811916 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, go/that-one-great-site didn't go anywhere. < 1440630601 252667 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, is go/guy still around? < 1440630758 368376 :rdococ!~rdococ@unaffiliated/octagonfly JOIN :#esoteric < 1440630968 234185 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-193-184.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, did shachaf stop working at google? < 1440630988 694226 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-193-184.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote google < 1440631010 572320 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :304) Google Maps has options for "avoid highways" and "avoid tolls", but no "avoid Chicago" \ 672) northern ireland is quite a way to drag someone from scotland <-- not really. I just checked in google earth Vorpal: but dragging people across water's a bit tricky \ 769) Gregor: hey no fair doing ungoogl < 1440631017 694815 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't worked at Google for over a year. < 1440631167 322886 :rdococ!~rdococ@unaffiliated/octagonfly QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1440631441 399413 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: There are 128 different "go/guy"s, as far as I can tell. Plus the web-based list searches only by prefix, not by regex, which is silly. < 1440631765 17892 :rdococ!~rdococ@unaffiliated/octagonfly JOIN :#esoteric < 1440631803 574477 :FireFly!~firefly@firefly.xen.prgmr.com QUIT :Changing host < 1440631803 628840 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly JOIN :#esoteric < 1440632111 80580 :rdococ!~rdococ@unaffiliated/octagonfly QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds