00:07:32 boillo 00:17:13 bonsoerjan. 00:18:17 * oerjan was vaguely hoping for oerjour but guesses it's too late 00:19:26 tomorrow morning! don't lose faith! 00:20:13 今ボイリは 00:21:29 すみませんが、ちょっと違います。「ボアリ」です。 00:22:20 oren: actually I was reminded of TCP quite a bit 00:22:29 sequence numbers and checksums and all that 00:22:30 -!- GeekDude has joined. 00:28:09 -!- Fleur has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 00:58:42 i may eventually have to learn japanese just to keep up with the channel. 01:05:31 also, i'm with oren on the ip over tmuxxers. 01:06:59 I'm calling this program tmuxip, although it isn't duplex 01:09:22 oerjan: this chännel's lingua franca should be some Norwegian-Japanese pidgin crossover. 01:10:24 NoxJp is this channels OTP 01:11:54 there used to be a norwegian-russian pidgin but i don't think there's a norwegian-japanese one. 01:15:51 Ooh, norwegian has retroflex consonants, cool! 01:16:18 these have to be sacrificed for the greater good. 01:16:41 jeg wakarimasu for lite japansk til å lage en god eksempelsetning desu ka. 01:17:09 both norwegian and japanese have pitch accents, interesting 01:17:27 i read that in the language construction kit recently 01:17:51 Noxjp is definitely this chännel's OTP. incomprehensible, sounds like some Necronomicon juice extract, and has a few å sprinkled in. 01:18:25 * boily is glad to see zompist.com is still alive and as ugly as ever ^^ 01:18:53 boily: many norwegian dialects (including mine) also have a weird kind of retroflex l, i'd say that cannot be sacrificed hth 01:19:36 especially if we use that for both r and l 01:20:40 tdnrh, but for the sake of good international relations I'll let it go. 01:20:57 verly good 01:21:17 holy crap norwegian also has adjectives that change like verbs 01:21:29 oren: um where did you read that 01:22:14 i don't think that is true in any meaningful sense 01:23:12 oh, I see, your verbs don't change by gender but your nounds do? 01:23:18 well duh 01:23:19 adjectives I mean? 01:23:37 yes, gender is for nouns and adjectives 01:23:43 as is definiteness. 01:24:09 hungarian btw, inflects verbs for the definiteness of the object. 01:24:48 the verbs don't even change for plurality? even english does that 01:25:04 no, we lost person and number on verbs long ago 01:25:31 a century or more 01:25:47 but somehow you kept gender agreement on adjectives... 01:26:03 _and_ developed definiteness agreement hth 01:26:10 oh and number too 01:27:22 although it's sort of wishy-washy in that for most adjectives, all forms are the same except for the singular indefinite ones 01:28:37 although "liten" (little, small) has kept an unusual variety of forms, which includes cognates of both en:little and en:small 01:29:31 We don't inflect words too much either. *whistles unconvincingly* 01:29:48 OKAYSSÄ 01:30:21 The vowel disharmony made my left eye hurt. 01:31:30 * boily is glad to see zompist.com is still alive and as ugly as ever ^^ <-- good content doesn't need modern web design. in fact no one does. 01:31:45 oerjan: which case is it again? 01:32:09 fizzie: ÖKÄYSSÄ? 01:32:34 boily: I guess that's all right. 01:32:36 fizzie: i was divided on whether to use -A or -Ä at the end 01:32:42 boily: inessive iirc 01:33:01 Yes. 01:33:05 into the okay? I guess I could go with that. 01:33:14 no, in 01:33:19 aaaaaaaaaaaurgh. 01:33:20 into would be illative 01:33:26 also iirc 01:33:54 all those cases always confuse me. people should stick with verb conjugations; that's much simpler and easier. 01:34:03 mind you i use inessive because it's the one finnish case ending i can easily remember 01:34:47 The Finnish locatives are (I think) generally taught as two groups of three: inessive, elative, illative (the internals) and adessive, ablative, allative (the externals). 01:34:56 norwegian doesn't have much in the way of verb conjugation. certainly even less than english. 01:35:15 blarh I hated french because they have all these conjugations but never bother to actually SAY them, so why do they still WRITE them!?!?!? 01:35:30 fizzie: hungarian has those + an extra group for surfaces hth 01:35:58 oren: we do say them hth 01:38:10 that is, in hungarian you have to decide vaguely whether you're dealing with a point, a surface, or a volume before you choose locative cases. iirc. 01:38:36 je parl tu parl ii parl nu parlaw vu parlay ii parl 01:38:49 only two are in any way differnet 01:38:51 oren: *il 01:39:03 the l isn't actually pronounced 01:39:14 wait, it isn't? 01:39:20 oren: eh??? 01:39:41 also, your “ii” is suspiciously québécois... 01:39:53 I'm from canada... 01:39:55 also the -aw should be nasal 01:40:05 parlaw~ 01:40:32 * boily glares at oren 01:40:52 parlons! with a «on» sound! tsé, messemble, c'pas compliqué! quand même, là là... 01:41:34 In france do they actually say the n? 01:42:07 saying the n isn't the same as using a nasal vowel 01:42:11 their «on» is actually the same. there are differences with «an», and they have mostly merged «in» and «un» together. 01:42:25 un bon vin blanc 01:42:50 u~ bo ve~ bla~ 01:43:28 en god hvitvin hth 01:44:29 /œ̃bɔ̃vɛ̃blæ̃/ vs. /ɛ̃bɔ̃vɛ̃blɑ̃/. 01:44:49 oerjan: Apparently we have a third group of locatives for "state" (translative, essive and exessive, for entering, residing and exiting a particular state), but the exessive only exists in some dialects, and anyway I don't think our Finnish grammar classes really grouped them. 01:45:16 oerjan: Also I think we have some remnants of the Hungarian stuff, applicable to some particular words. Or something like that. 01:45:21 ic 01:45:32 naruhodo 01:46:06 je vois ça. 01:46:30 well i recall reading that the common ancestral language had a lot fewer cases than both hungarian and finnish, so it's not clear what is a "remnant" there... 01:47:15 (something like 6/7, which is about as many as protoindoeuropean i think) 01:47:52 which reminds me that i was going to look up the consensus number of cases in PIE 01:48:20 We should have a holidy called PIE day for confusion purposes 01:48:31 oren: fancy 01:49:24 boily: wait you canadiens say /blæ̃/ ? 01:50:38 Yes, we should have that on the 53rd day of August, because π*e = 8.539734... 01:50:47 -!- AndoDaan has joined. 01:51:05 oerjan: yes? 01:51:07 (And the de-facto π day already follows the ridiculous American month/day/year conventions.) 01:51:29 > exp pi 01:51:30 Ambiguous occurrence ‘pi’ 01:51:30 It could refer to either ‘L.pi’, defined at L.hs:161:1 01:51:30 or ‘GHC.Float.pi’, 01:51:46 * boily mapoles lambdabot 01:51:46 > exp GHC.Float.pi 01:51:46 oerjan: my dad does. I learned in school to say blaw but my dad corrected me with bleh 01:51:46 Not in scope: ‘GHC.Float.pi’ 01:51:49 That would be the EPI day, I think. 01:51:52 boily: fancy 01:51:55 * boily mapoles lambdabot again 01:51:58 @undef 01:51:58 Undefined. 01:52:00 s/eh/ah 01:52:03 > exp pi 01:52:04 23.140692632779267 01:52:12 -!- ^v^v has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 01:52:13 > pi ^ (exp 1) 01:52:14 Could not deduce (GHC.Real.Integral b0) 01:52:14 arising from a use of ‘GHC.Real.^’ 01:52:14 from the context (GHC.Float.Floating a) 01:52:19 > pi ** (exp 1) 01:52:20 22.45915771836104 01:52:37 hmm... which was it again, the one that hit about 19.999... 01:52:44 -!- ^v^v has joined. 01:52:48 > exp (exp 1 * (ln pi)) 01:52:49 Not in scope: ‘ln’ 01:52:49 Perhaps you meant one of these: 01:52:49 ‘n’ (imported from Debug.SimpleReflect), 01:53:06 > exp pi - pi 01:53:07 19.999099979189474 01:53:17 `thanks fizzie 01:53:18 Thanks, fizzie. Thizzie. 01:53:29 boily: I just googled the corresponding xkcd, to be honest. 01:53:56 (Second hit for "xkcd floating point library".) 01:55:57 rand()*(exp pi - pi), aka 80 01:59:41 also as for days, beware the ides of march 02:00:44 I generally just use a text editor, not an ide, so i'm safe 02:00:51 Beware your own desire to become kind, I'd say. 02:01:02 become King* 02:01:17 become King* 02:01:25 Damn keyboard. 02:02:55 my mouse has begun malfunctioning, which is annoying when it's my method to see if my display has frozen again 02:03:06 mechanical keyboards forevaaaaaaaah!!!!!1!!one!!!11!! 02:07:26 I bought a new mousepad a couple of days ago. It had "works with optical lasers Mice" on it's packedging, all proud and shit. 02:08:29 lol 02:08:29 What are actually the benefits of a mechanical keyboard? 02:09:25 nice solid keys with a long tracking, a keyboard that feels solid beneath your fingers, and snobby hipsterness :P 02:10:16 (also, annoying your coworkers with loud clicks and clacks :D) 02:10:50 Good selling points. 02:15:59 -!- ais523 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 02:16:19 -!- ais523 has joined. 02:16:40 -!- boily has quit (Quit: ANAEROBIC CHICKEN). 02:22:51 -!- Koen_ has quit (Quit: The struct held his beloved integer in his strong, protecting arms, his eyes like sapphire orbs staring into her own. "W-will you... Will you union me?"). 02:30:32 They also can stand up to my rough fingers without breaking 02:31:02 Usually the keyboard breaks first on my laptops, this is unusual 02:39:43 -!- ais523 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 02:39:56 -!- ais523 has joined. 02:55:59 -!- hjulle has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 02:56:39 -!- ProofTechnique has joined. 03:05:35 -!- ais523 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 03:05:44 -!- ais523 has joined. 03:07:29 -!- Patashu has joined. 03:11:46 so this is what I came up with: http://sprunge.us/IebA 03:11:50 rather inefficient but it seems to work 03:12:55 -!- Patashu has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 03:13:18 -!- Patashu has joined. 03:14:13 -!- callforjudgement has joined. 03:14:21 so this is what I came up with: http://sprunge.us/IebA 03:14:23 rather inefficient but it seems to work 03:14:26 -!- ais523 has quit (Disconnected by services). 03:14:28 -!- callforjudgement has changed nick to asi523. 03:14:30 -!- asi523 has changed nick to ais523. 03:18:35 -!- Patashu has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 03:18:55 -!- Patashu has joined. 03:31:50 -!- Patashu_ has joined. 03:31:50 -!- Patashu has quit (Disconnected by services). 03:34:47 -!- Patashu_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 03:35:00 -!- Patashu has joined. 03:42:53 -!- ProofTechnique has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 03:43:19 -!- GeekDude has quit (Quit: {{{}}{{{}}{{}}}{{}}} (www.adiirc.com)). 03:53:11 -!- Patashu has quit (Disconnected by services). 03:53:11 -!- Patashu_ has joined. 03:54:18 You posted twice as it turns out 03:56:07 -!- Patashu_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 03:56:30 -!- Patashu has joined. 04:02:25 what is that for ais523 04:02:45 zzo38: I wasn't sure if it went through the first time 04:02:59 quintopia: communicating binaries through a terminal multiplexer 04:03:42 to what end? 04:04:48 communicating files to non-networked systems 04:05:01 when the only connection you have goes through both screen /and/ tmux 04:06:27 Is tmux good? I love screen but I only use it for its 'don't die if I lose connection' properties 04:07:20 Sgeo: it's very similar to screen in most respects 04:07:24 probably the interface is a bit nicer 04:07:41 however, going through both screen and tmux is by far easier than trying to go through screen or tmux twice 04:08:01 Though it's not a fair comparison (the only time I used it was a pretty old version), tmux's terminal emulation when I used it was craaap. 04:08:17 i cant imagine such a connection 04:08:22 sounds absurd 04:09:53 quintopia: yes, but I came across one 04:10:02 and asked #esoteric because it was an interesting problem 04:10:14 it's possibly an avoidable problem – we could probably change the setup 04:10:31 but seeing if it was possible without changing the setup captured my interest 04:11:07 Why is it going through both screen and tmux? 04:11:41 it's using tmux as screen, and screen as a serial connection parser 04:12:07 what an idea 04:15:57 -!- Patashu_ has joined. 04:16:04 -!- Patashu has quit (Disconnected by services). 04:16:11 I feel like I understand screen even less than I did before 04:18:04 I should learn to use screen. 04:23:33 -!- oren has quit (Quit: Lost terminal). 04:32:24 Why does my speakers sometimes make extra noise that it isn't supposed to (but usually it doesn't)? 04:34:53 Could be one of a few different things. 04:35:23 Are you in the presence of a strong magnetic field? 04:35:41 I don't think so, but I don't know 04:37:34 -!- Patashu has joined. 04:40:57 -!- Patashu_ has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 04:46:06 -!- copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 04:53:18 -!- g2watson has joined. 04:53:36 screen is working ok! 04:53:49 whoops name wrong 04:53:53 -!- g2watson has changed nick to oren. 04:56:50 Hmm. I'm not familiar with any other programs which use control A as a command, thats convenient 04:58:53 -!- Patashu has quit (Disconnected by services). 04:58:53 -!- Patashu_ has joined. 04:59:04 * Sgeo is in the presence of a few magnetic fields, h2 04:59:05 h2h 04:59:23 -!- ais523 has quit. 04:59:31 -!- ais523 has joined. 05:02:01 -!- Patashu_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 05:02:12 -!- Patashu has joined. 05:03:13 -!- oren has quit (Quit: leaving). 05:07:59 A bit late to post this, but http://www.cadaeic.net/cadenza.htm 05:11:07 -!- g2watson has joined. 05:18:58 -!- ais523 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 05:19:08 -!- ais523 has joined. 05:22:05 -!- Patashu_ has joined. 05:22:05 -!- Patashu has quit (Disconnected by services). 05:27:20 -!- ProofTechnique has joined. 05:30:32 /quit 05:30:42 -!- g2watson has quit (Quit: leaving). 05:43:53 -!- Patashu has joined. 05:47:04 -!- Patashu_ has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 05:57:59 -!- g2watson has joined. 05:59:42 -!- ^v^v has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 06:00:09 -!- ^v^v has joined. 06:05:51 [wiki] [[Condit]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=42127&oldid=23186 * 86.164.23.31 * (-20) /* External resources */ remove "no longer working" since the link is valid 06:05:56 -!- Patashu has quit (Disconnected by services). 06:05:57 -!- Patashu_ has joined. 06:16:34 that's rare, for a link to start working again 06:22:45 normally when a link goes dead either the server is gone or the website has been reorganized 06:25:38 -!- g2watson has quit (Quit: leaving). 06:26:24 -!- Patashu has joined. 06:27:35 Well, my link is also broken, but not due to any reorganization or server is gone, but because the DNS is pointing to the wrong address. 06:27:59 -!- b_jonas has joined. 06:29:22 -!- Patashu_ has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 06:29:32 -!- Patashu has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 06:29:55 -!- Patashu has joined. 06:30:35 -!- oren has joined. 06:31:25 hello, all 06:32:04 b_jó napot 06:33:17 oerjan: What does that mean? 06:33:37 Can you figure out all of my three Magic: the Puzzling so far? 06:33:47 zzo38: b_good day 06:34:57 no, I think I only solved the first one 06:34:59 are there even three? 06:35:07 Yes, I made three 06:35:26 the first one is the one with that sea monster, one is the subgame Sharcantspell one 06:35:43 http://24.207.84.223/textfile/miscellaneous/puzzle.1 and puzzle.2 and puzzle.3 06:36:11 wasn't it at http://zzo38computer.org/textfile/miscellaneous/magic_card/ 06:36:25 O, yes, that's correct; I gave the wrong address 06:36:29 Thank you 06:36:50 Although the DNS is broke so type http://24.207.84.223/textfile/miscellaneous/magic_card/puzzle.1 and so on 06:38:20 See if you can figure even a little bit about the second and third one 06:39:06 I think I figured a little bit, namely that the Wishes are probably used from the subgame. 06:39:42 Yes, but now you have figure it out more 06:53:35 -!- Patashu has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 06:53:45 -!- Patashu has joined. 06:56:19 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Argh). 06:59:41 Are there any processes on Windows that renames files to m and then a number? 07:11:25 -!- Patashu has quit (Quit: Soundcloud (Famitracker Chiptunes): http://www.soundcloud.com/patashu MSN: Patashu@hotmail.com , AIM: Patashu0 , YIM: patashu2 , Skype: patashu0 .). 07:11:33 -!- Patashu has joined. 07:14:36 -!- FreeFull has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 07:16:18 -!- FreeFull has joined. 07:19:33 -!- Patashu has quit (Disconnected by services). 07:19:33 -!- Patashu_ has joined. 07:26:45 Someone else did figure out all of my puzzles 07:26:49 But now see if you know too 07:29:25 -!- Patashu_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 07:29:37 -!- Patashu has joined. 08:53:29 [wiki] [[Brainfuck bitwidth conversions]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=42128&oldid=40652 * Rdebath * (-3) Sigh 08:58:09 -!- copumpkin has joined. 09:02:45 -!- copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 09:34:58 -!- ais523 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 09:35:06 -!- callforjudgement has joined. 09:51:31 -!- callforjudgement has changed nick to ais523. 10:00:49 -!- ais523 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 10:01:08 -!- ais523 has joined. 10:01:10 -!- ais523 has quit (Changing host). 10:01:10 -!- ais523 has joined. 10:03:15 fungot: hmm 10:03:16 int-e: creates a vector of that length would be kept alive for running the whole scheme image, not when they are 10:16:48 -!- ais523 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 10:16:55 -!- ais523 has joined. 10:30:43 -!- boily has joined. 10:32:24 @tell oerjan Good moerjaning! 10:32:24 Consider it noted. 10:35:58 -!- SopaXorzTaker has joined. 10:37:20 -!- irctc997 has joined. 10:39:16 -!- irctc997 has quit (Client Quit). 10:46:10 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 10:52:13 good moaning 10:53:59 bon melliottin! 10:54:50 -!- ais523 has quit. 10:54:55 melliottin sounds like some kind of substance 10:56:08 "The word 'mellow' wandered around in his mind in search of something to connect with." 10:56:39 bint-e matin? 11:28:21 -!- Patashu has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 11:37:57 -!- boily has quit (Quit: INFORMED CHICKEN). 11:38:30 -!- AndoDaan_ has joined. 11:42:26 -!- AndoDaan has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 11:42:43 -!- AndoDaan_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 12:04:21 -!- Koen_ has joined. 12:15:38 -!- hjulle has joined. 12:42:19 -!- SopaXorzTaker has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 13:09:13 -!- Koen_ has quit (Quit: The struct held his beloved integer in his strong, protecting arms, his eyes like sapphire orbs staring into her own. "W-will you... Will you union me?"). 13:13:34 what 13:14:01 Terry Pratchett? but he was so young 13:15:24 Surely you must have heard of his Alzheimer's disease. 13:16:02 yes, but still 13:16:26 sad 13:17:13 he's going straight to my list of Notable deaths of this century, right now, no waiting time needed for me to consider if he's significant enough in this case 13:18:41 done. he's 20th. 13:19:00 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:B_jonas#Notable_deaths_of_this_century 13:20:39 -!- AndoDaan has joined. 13:33:45 -!- Mossyfunk has joined. 13:39:38 -!- Mossyfunk has left ("Leaving"). 13:57:41 -!- Koen_ has joined. 14:01:59 -!- copumpkin has joined. 14:06:33 -!- copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 14:13:52 int-e, though it didn't seem bad enough to kill him 14:14:43 -!- ^v^v has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 14:15:10 -!- ^v^v has joined. 14:16:17 -!- hjulle has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 14:20:05 -!- FallNWolf has joined. 14:30:22 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 14:32:05 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 14:38:47 Phantom_Hoover: Who knows. I've read that it was an atypical form of Alzheimer's which affects the back of the brain (and hence, motor skills) first; it's also closer to the pons https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pons that regulates breathing... 14:39:15 i guess 14:39:41 meh, I don't do distance medical diagnosis. I'm just sad he's passed. 14:40:47 well it's significant because he was very vocal about his intention to die on his own terms, before the disease took his mind 14:40:53 It's not a diagnosis, it's speculation. 14:41:23 but according to his publisher it wasn't suicide, assisted or otherwise 15:02:41 -!- copumpkin has joined. 15:02:48 -!- PinealGlandOptic has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 15:07:08 -!- copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 15:07:35 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 15:08:24 -!- ProofTechnique has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 15:08:50 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 15:10:35 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 15:15:17 -!- SopaXorzTaker has joined. 15:19:31 -!- SopaXorzTaker has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 15:21:54 -!- MoALTz_ has quit (Quit: Leaving). 15:22:14 -!- MoALTz has joined. 15:36:16 b_jonas: the list of "redirects from given names" on wikipedia seems to contain a lot of japanese names 15:38:23 -!- ProofTechnique has joined. 16:47:37 -!- Phantom__Hoover has joined. 16:47:40 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 16:48:44 -!- arjanb has joined. 17:06:37 -!- GeekDude has joined. 17:07:25 Says something about the cost of public transportation here: my bank's fraud detection systems declined my purchase of an annual ticket due to the "suspiciously high value". 17:10:08 Where you at? 17:15:52 London. 17:16:10 London, UK, to be more precise. I guess there are a lot of Londons in the states? There usually are. 17:17:33 There is a London in Canada 17:18:43 -!- AndoDaan has quit (Quit: Going, going, gone.). 17:19:14 -!- AndoDaan has joined. 17:20:57 -!- Phantom__Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 17:26:55 -!- AndoDaan has quit (Quit: Going, going, gone.). 17:27:17 London england is better than the one in canada tho 17:27:39 [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Hardiholpus * New user account 17:31:36 how much is an annual pass? 17:32:42 -!- AndoDaan has joined. 17:34:44 quintopia: For zones 1-2, it's 1284 GBP. 17:34:59 (Around $1900 in American terms.) 17:39:39 hmm. not that bad really... 17:40:18 so anyone have any idea why i can't open a chrome browser window. i can see in the task manager it is running, but there is no visible window. reinstalling doesn't help. 17:43:02 Well, it's worse than in Finland; an annual "local" ticket ("zone 1") is only 546.80 EUR, and even the entire metro area is just 1086.40 EUR. (The London one goes up to 3336 GBP for zones 1-9, but to be fair it's a much bigger system.) 17:43:27 Do you have a two/tree screen set up quintopia? 17:43:52 not that i know of, though i'm not sure how to check 17:44:38 -!- dianne has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 17:44:52 Nah, if there's only one screen in front of you then you probably have just the one screen setup then. 17:46:53 There pver a thousand people in #Haskell... how is that possible? 17:48:13 maybe it's a strange attractor. 17:48:18 -!- dianne has joined. 17:48:37 it's also a very functional IRC channel 17:48:56 .... 17:50:21 ??? 17:50:28 int-e: i don't know if i'd put it in that category 17:51:00 Despite the pun, I'm serious. The people there are helpful and overall very resistant to being trolled. 17:53:52 no they're not 17:54:09 unless it's gotten a lot better recently 17:58:11 -!- GeekDude has quit (Quit: {{{}}{{{}}{{}}}{{}}} (www.adiirc.com)). 18:00:21 obviously this worked better when there were only 300 people 18:08:23 -!- TieSleep has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 18:09:26 -!- GeekDude has joined. 18:11:26 This is the most idiotic piece of sycophancy I have ever read. http://www.forbes.com/sites/ewanspence/2015/03/14/tim-cook-apple-changing-the-world/ 18:12:31 thanks for linking it! now we can all feel that way too 18:13:28 haha okay this is great though 18:13:37 god bless the usa 18:20:18 isn't the latest line of apple products more overpriced and underperforming than the last line up? 18:20:42 elliott__: you pronounced murrica wrong 18:20:53 idk, let me get my objective apple flamebait calculator out 18:20:53 It doesn't take a Jobs to understand the necessity of basic iteration 18:21:11 back. it says if this is a discussion that ends up happening I'll hate everyone 18:21:18 . o O ( What does Apple sell? At a fundamental level, Apple sells change. -- Small and smaller change... shiny coins... ) 18:35:41 -!- adu has joined. 18:43:26 blah, they're changing the world, except Japan, where I didn't see a single Apple product the entire time I was there 18:44:30 Japan is a magical land, where features phones still live. 18:44:39 features phones? 18:45:35 non-smart phones, with like, buttons 18:48:14 Essentially japan is supposed to be famouse for their technology, but their use of technology is very... conservative, as it were. 18:49:23 They use windows XP a LOT, flip phones, fax machines, and CASH! 18:50:12 I paid for my hotel with a giant wad of Yen, apparently that is the normal way 18:57:04 paying for bus tickets was too much for me. 18:57:08 Also I paid for some other stuff with a wire transfer. A *wire transfer*. The people at my bank were kind of... amused 18:57:46 I like cash. But it's all reversed; paying when leaving the bus, taking care of one's own change... 18:58:47 Odd devices that eat both tickets and cash. 19:00:08 (From what I could see, the coins get sorted, while the tickets are shred to pieces.) 19:00:57 this is interesting to me, given I'm visiting Japan in May 19:02:53 To even take out cash, your cards most likely will only work at 7/11 or at the post office (yuubinkyoku) 19:03:13 hmm last time they didn't work anywhere at all 19:04:03 thanks for the translation. that will help me with my upcoming plan (keikaku) 19:04:12 Also, only Visa really works... 19:05:15 " All Maestro-branded EMV cards issued outside of the Asia/Pacific region are able to withdraw currency at Seven Bank and AEON Bank ATMs" -- this seems to be new. 19:05:51 Oh? Hmm, seems they are improving the system 19:06:11 -!- _1_a1exander114 has joined. 19:06:30 -!- _1_a1exander114 has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:08:24 elliott: keikaku doori. muhuhahahaha 19:09:38 (I lied. The last time I was there, AEON bank would accept the card, but their ATMs were hard to find and I didn't make use of them.) 19:11:51 http://www.mastercard.co.jp/personal/atm-notification.html looks official enough, but is there a date? 19:21:42 -!- adu has quit (Quit: adu). 19:29:36 -!- AndoDaan has quit (Quit: Going, going, gone.). 19:29:55 I think also in Japan a lot of compressed archives are .lzh although I can still use them on my computer because 7-Zip can open such file. 19:32:24 oren, int-e: we here also use cash, and some people like me also use phones with buttons that let me type without having to look at the screen constantly 19:32:52 and that don't require me to pay attention to software updates and disabling internet use and all kinds of nonsense I don't need to just, you know, phone people 19:33:20 but yes, getting up the bus on the back and getting off at the front and paying when getting off is crazy 19:33:26 that would never work here 19:34:08 I also prefer to use cash when paying for stuff, as much as possible; I don't have any credit card 19:34:39 I mix cash and debit card. But in many places here, you can't pay with a card at all. 19:35:05 Whereas in Sweden you can pay with a card basically _anywhere_ 19:41:02 I've used cash here in London exactly twice now, in the about 2.5 months I've been here. 19:41:19 fizzie: I see 19:41:59 Once when opening a bank account, to give it a nonzero balance, though I guess there was no particular reason for that; and the other day when I couldn't remember the PIN for the debit card, because of jetlag and not having used it at all during the two weeks in the states. 19:42:16 fizzie: has there been anything you didn't buy because you didn't have enough cash with you, or that you asked someone else to pay for you with cash? 19:42:34 No. 19:42:38 ok 19:43:19 [wiki] [[Brainfuck bitwidth conversions]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=42129&oldid=42128 * Rdebath * (+3663) Some expansion and alternatives. 19:43:41 I was in Sweden only for a week. I've seen only one place that required cash (as opposed to card), namely some public toilet. My brother is living there and he says that's true in general. 19:44:18 I think vending machines in general in Finland at least used to be cash-only. Though maybe that has changed. And there aren't that many of them. 19:44:39 Last time I was at the Helsinki Airport, I did buy a drink from an airport vending machine with a credit card. 19:44:48 But airports are special. 19:44:53 Of course for vending machine operators, cash is a burden. 19:45:13 You can pay with a mobile phone (by sending a SMS) in many things there these days. 19:45:19 possible 19:45:19 But I think that generally costs more than cash. 19:45:32 So from what I can see here (Austria), there are more vending machines that accept cards but not cash than vice versa. 19:45:53 If memory serves, the soda vending machines at the university took something like 1.60 EUR in coins, or 1.89 EUR with SMS. 19:46:11 Most vending machines here are cash only, and more than half are coin only. There are some new ones that also accept card, most importantly the new ones that sell public transport tickets and passes, when they work. 19:46:27 Also I feel strange for not paying anything for food at work. 19:46:58 Many places accept both debit cards and cash; credit cards are somewhat less popular. And some places (bars, a few small shops) don't accept debit cards either. 19:47:20 AIUI, in Finland it's not even taxationally possible to offer completely free lunches. Or at least very difficult. 19:47:30 There used to be a few vending machines that worked with phone cards, as an experiment, but they disappeared as most phones accepting phone cards have disappeared. Strantely, there are and were no public payphones that accept both coins and cards here. 19:48:25 I think there may be some vending machines that work with SMS, I'm not sure. You can buy parking tickets with SMS though. 19:48:57 I've never paid anything by SMS. 19:49:00 fizzie: hmm 19:49:16 int-e: I don't think I have either. I have paid with phone card a few times. 19:49:39 For soda. 19:50:18 My wife's place had subsidized lunch prices in the company cafeteria, and you could "pay" with the employee badge and it'd auto-deduct from salary, which I think was a reasonably common policy. 19:50:37 that's okay-ish. 19:51:07 And probably almost every workplace cafeteria has a separate (cheaper) employee price. But from what people have told me, the price can't be 0. 19:51:16 (-ish because the employer shouldn't really know how much I pay in the cafeteria) 19:52:43 fizzie: cheaper employee price makes sense 19:52:47 I wonder what Google does in Finland. They've got that data center, and I think a tiny sales office in Helsinki. 19:53:43 fizzie: could they just ask a very cheap nominal price instead of zero? or is that also banned? 19:53:52 for employees I mean 19:53:59 I don't know. All I know about this is hearsay. 19:55:42 or, say, sell a monthly dinner subscription to employees for chea 19:55:49 I don't know if it can be zero, but probably it shouldn't be zero, although it shouldn't be a problem to just decrease the price for employees. 19:56:00 (a horn of plenty (0:30)) 19:56:13 ((0:31) in some months) 19:56:35 YAFGC ... "whoops" indeed. (Tee hee!) 19:59:30 -!- Tritonio_ has joined. 20:00:47 -!- Patashu has joined. 20:03:00 -!- Tritonio has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 20:04:16 -!- Tritonio_ has changed nick to Tritonio. 20:11:06 [wiki] [[Turing Script]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=42130&oldid=42117 * 72.74.32.143 * (+57) 20:14:49 [wiki] [[Turing Script]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=42131&oldid=42130 * 72.74.32.143 * (+22) 20:16:26 [wiki] [[Turing Script]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=42132&oldid=42131 * 72.74.32.143 * (+1) 20:17:59 [wiki] [[Turing Script]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=42133&oldid=42132 * 72.74.32.143 * (+0) 20:23:54 -!- Patashu has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 20:28:27 -!- olsner has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:50:00 -!- Phantom__Hoover has joined. 22:00:26 -!- Vorpal has joined. 22:15:47 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 22:16:33 -!- olsner has joined. 22:29:10 -!- ^v^v has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 22:29:37 -!- ^v^v has joined. 22:38:31 -!- copumpkin has joined. 22:41:49 Is it possible that the clock set incorrectly causes HTTPS to stop working sometimes? 22:44:00 zzo38, if it is way off you could get certificate validation errors. You would need at least several days off, but it would still be rather unlikely. If it is years off (especially in the future) you will run into issues yes 22:44:50 If we are talking about seconds or minutes: then no 22:45:01 not as far as I know at least 22:45:50 I am about ten minutes off 22:46:18 Well, you should sync your clock still, but even so I don't think that would cause issues with https no 22:46:26 Some wikis force HTTPS even though I don't want it, and this causes some problems 22:46:44 It would break running irc servers (which need to be synced within seconds) 22:47:19 My IRC server isn't part of a larger IRC network, so isn't as much problem 22:47:37 Still, why run it 10 minutes off? 22:47:48 Why not just sync with ntp? 22:48:09 TLS handshake includes timestamps (in seconds) from both ends, but I don't think minutes should really break it. 22:48:23 (Also apparently the TLS 1.3 draft drops those.) 22:48:25 fizzie, it does? To prevent replay attacks? 22:48:51 I will fix the time 22:49:04 Could be. Although I think it has enough nonces in order to not need time. 22:49:09 Hm 22:49:26 -!- Fleur has joined. 22:49:35 But, what is the correct time anyways? What daytime server may I connect to? 22:49:50 pool.ntp.org is the usual ntp server 22:50:02 daytime server I don't know what you mean by 22:50:46 Daytime is the thing that runs in port 'daytime'. 22:51:49 Sends out an ASCII date in an abritrary format when connected to. 22:52:18 "There is no specific syntax for the daytime. It is recommended that it be limited to the ASCII printing characters, space, carriage return, and line feed. The daytime should be just one line." (RFC 867) 22:52:26 -!- boily has joined. 22:52:58 I found one 22:53:16 fizzie, That is the most underspecified crap of a non-joke RFC I have seen 22:53:25 Worse than the IRC RFC 22:53:53 It's kind of meant for humans. 22:54:25 RFC 868 describes the machine-readable counterpart. 22:55:20 I don't get why zzo38 isn't just using ntp though? 22:55:32 I'm not surprised, really. 22:55:35 There are also other chat protocols tham IRC but I have looked and don't like it much, and I think IRC is more better 22:55:52 Vorpal: I don't have a NTP client, also apparently they require a password? 22:56:31 Err no? 22:57:08 Even windows has a built in ntp client I believe in the time and date settings 22:57:26 I just used the TIME command to set the time though 22:57:31 It doesn't work very well (it syncs quite rarely), but it is still something 22:58:49 Good thing you talked about NTP, though, made me realize I should drop off the former ISP's time server from the list. 22:59:29 heh 22:59:49 fizzie, I used ptp recently, because ntp didn't keep the clocks in sync well enough 23:00:04 The router-modem my current ISP gave me has uk.pool.ntp.org and time.nist.gov configured as time sources by default. 23:00:19 I just switch to pool.ntp.org normally 23:00:32 uk.pool.ntp.org should work too 23:00:50 I believe pool without any country prefix is geodns-ed anyway 23:02:12 Hm how do I see what kernel module is handling a certain network interface? 23:02:20 lspci doesn't help, it is not a PCI device 23:02:35 Nor does lsusb help of course (not an USB device) 23:02:41 I'm guessing sysfs. 23:02:49 Something in /sys/class/net/$interface/ maybe. 23:03:58 xen:vif apparently 23:04:00 Okay 23:04:13 So ethtool probably won't work 23:04:48 Apparently the source of the official UK time (the National Physical Laboratory) runs public NTP servers (ntp[12].npl.co.uk) too. 23:05:12 Hm my desktop network interface support PTP hardware clock 23:05:13 cool 23:05:22 Don't have a use for it though 23:06:29 I almost ended up connecting two devices with three parallel Ethernet links the other day, for really stupid reasons. 23:09:34 thtahttah tad tod eodseonse'nst'n t's tos uosnuodnu dnt dot oot oob oab dabdad 23:10:14 it looks like we're breaking up I can hardly make out what you say 23:10:25 It wouldn't have been for anything smart like load-balancing/bundling. 23:10:32 > let s = "that doesn't sound too bad" in concat $ transpose [s,' ':s,' ':' ':s] -- I didn't actually type that. 23:10:33 "t ht ahttah tad tod eodseonse'nst'n t's tos uosnuodnu dnt dot oot oob oab ... 23:10:41 fizzie, what was it for then? 23:11:42 or perhaps I should write it as concat . transpose . take 3 . iterate (' ':) $ s. 23:12:20 int-e: kinda reminds me of http://esolangs.org/wiki/Truth-machine#Glypho 23:12:38 Vorpal: I'll try to make a long story short. My new ISP gave me a /29 IPv4 subnet, and a router with an integrated modem; they talk PPPoE over PTM-mode VDSL2. The "standard" configuration of having their router-modem terminate the PPPoE works, but they use some proxyarp stuff (because the PPP link negotiates a public IP inside the /29, and the router has to forward stuff to the rest of the ... 23:12:44 ... hosts), and initially it seemed like it'd require distinct MAC addresses for any distinct IP's. Since my own Linux router-box had four Ethernet interfaces, plugging three of them into the router-modem was one of the workarounds I was considering. 23:13:01 Vorpal: Later it turned out that it doesn't require distinct MACs, and I was probably just messing something else up. 23:13:53 fizzie, you could also solve that using some bridges and promisc mode perhaps? 23:14:02 Or macvlan devices. 23:14:22 I'm not familiar with those, but sounds reasonable based on the name 23:14:31 thtahta td odeosens'nt' ts osuonudn dt otoo ob abdad -- I guess the two list version is already bad enough. 23:14:37 The setup I *wanted* to make was to have the router-modem in pure "bridged" mode, and have the Linux box terminate the PPPoE connection, but for some reason I've just been unable to make that work. 23:15:18 It's one of these "real Busybox shell is too dangerous so we'll just provide a custom CLI" devices, so I can't peek into how they've configured PPPoE. 23:15:42 -!- Koen_ has quit (Quit: The struct held his beloved integer in his strong, protecting arms, his eyes like sapphire orbs staring into her own. "W-will you... Will you union me?"). 23:15:58 fizzie, hm with macwlan doesn't the interface still need to run in promisc mode? 23:16:10 To not filter the mac addresses at hardware levek 23:16:12 level* 23:16:15 I guess, but I think that happens automatically. 23:16:40 Right 23:16:59 Back in Finland I kinda-sorta used the "some bridges" mode to solve a different but analogous problem. 23:17:28 (The ISP there allocated all addresses strictly over DHCP, and you need distinct MACs to get multiple IPs requested out of a DHCP server.) 23:21:09 Now I'm not sure whether I should debug the "Linux server as PPPoE endpoint" issue more, since what I have now mostly works, and the only drawbacks seem to be slight feeling of inelegance, and the fact that one public IP is "wasted" on the router-modem. (But I don't need that many anyway.) 23:26:06 -!- oerjan has joined. 23:28:35 I 'I m'I m'g mog iogniogni gnt got ott oat latkla kll kil kileki ekt eht ihtsih sie sxe cxelcxulcsulisuvisevilevyle ylf yrf orfmor mon mon won woo wno .no.n. 23:29:40 Nah, I can do better. 23:29:44 I I'I'm'm m g gogoioiningng g t toto o t tatalalklk k l lilikikeke e t ththihisis s e exexcxclclulususisivivevelelyly y f frfroromom m n nonowow w o onon.n.. 23:31:39 nice. 23:31:42 Annoying thing: "adb shell ls ..." for some reason uses "\r\n" as the newline. 23:32:04 @messages 23:32:48 @tell boily And a good boiling to you 23:32:48 Consider it noted. 23:33:02 chicken soup? 23:33:12 POSSIBLY 23:33:34 PERHAPS 23:33:43 @clear-massages 23:33:43 Messages cleared. 23:33:57 hellørjan hth 23:34:18 -!- int-e has left ("POTENTIALLY POLLUTED POULTRY"). 23:34:18 -!- int-e has joined. 23:34:21 * boily mapoles tswett back into a coherent reality 23:34:24 k/ /ki ikc bananananasty ststswewettttt 23:35:44 ITYM / /k/kikicickckbkbabanan n n nanasaststyty y t tstswswewetettttt HTH 23:36:05 int-e: i dunno, no one told me the rules 23:36:21 > let s = "some rules" in concat $ transpose [s,' ':s,s] 23:36:22 "s sosomomeme e r rurululelesess" 23:37:34 > let s = "nonmonogamous" in concat $ transpose [s,' ':s,s] 23:37:36 "n nonononmnmomonononogogagamamomouoususs" 23:37:36 sosomo-meme 23:37:48 > let s = "onomatopoeia" in concat $ transpose [s,' ':s,s] 23:37:49 "o onononomomamatatotopopopoeoeieiaiaa" 23:38:09 f fafanancncycyy 23:38:33 O ononono momamata totopopopo eoeiei aiaa. 23:38:55 good night 23:39:09 I I I r reregegrgreretet t n nonotoththihiningng.g.. 23:39:23 -!- G33kDude has joined. 23:40:54 -!- GeekDude has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 23:40:56 -!- G33kDude has changed nick to GeekDude. 23:50:44 Old McDonal had a farm, O ononono momamata totopopopo eoeiei aiaa ♪ 23:53:10 > let s = "O ononono momamata totopopopo eoeiei aiaa." in concat $ transpose [s,' ':s,s] 23:53:11 "O O O o ononononononononono o m momomomamamamamatatata a t tototototopopopo... 23:53:20 meh. too long. 23:53:29 Was there, perchance, on this farm, a c cocowoww ? 23:54:52 probably a c chchickicknenn? 23:57:50 Oh, right, this is even channel-relevant. 23:57:51 As seen in the Computer History Museum, their big programming language timeline poster: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/113389132/Misc/20150315-intercal.jpg 23:59:27 clearly that is missing Feather 23:59:31 https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/113389132/Misc/20150315-intercal_full.jpg is the whole thing. 23:59:41 It's missing many things. I think INTERCAL was the only esolang that made the cut.