00:04:52 -!- MoALTz_ has joined. 00:07:06 -!- MoALTz has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 00:10:10 -!- heroux has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 00:20:11 -!- Froox has joined. 00:20:53 -!- Frooxius has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 00:24:29 -!- ZombieAlive has joined. 00:25:05 -!- tlewkow_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 00:27:40 -!- heroux has joined. 00:31:03 -!- shikhout has changed nick to shikhin. 00:41:31 -!- AndoDaan has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 00:41:42 -!- AndoDaan has joined. 00:44:34 -!- Dulnes has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 01:01:12 -!- adu has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 01:03:54 -!- adu has joined. 01:04:08 -!- Dulnes has joined. 01:20:42 -!- madbr has joined. 01:35:38 -!- ZombieAlive has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 01:35:59 -!- ZombieAlive has joined. 01:56:19 -!- AndoDaan_ has joined. 01:58:46 -!- AndoDaan has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 02:04:50 -!- _AndoDaan_ has joined. 02:05:16 [wiki] [[And then]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=41168 * Lucasieks * (+466) Created page with "This language is like BF, but you need to put " and then" between commands. It works like this: We have our sweet little cute program in BF. +> We add the andthens. + and th..." 02:05:48 [wiki] [[And then]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41169&oldid=41168 * Lucasieks * (+8) 02:06:19 [wiki] [[And then]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41170&oldid=41169 * Lucasieks * (+2) 02:07:56 ok this has to be a troll. 02:08:06 -!- AndoDaan_ has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 02:08:12 [wiki] [[Joke language list]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41171&oldid=40755 * Lucasieks * (+47) 02:08:21 i believe it 02:08:35 oh it's a joke language 02:08:41 "define start as this big thing past the colon" 02:08:44 lucasieks has been around 02:08:50 should i feature it 02:08:57 no hth 02:09:02 absolutely 02:09:12 it's tempting 02:09:18 maybe I'll be forced to if oerjan doesn't feature something else soon 02:09:47 i think fizzie agreed to maybe write a blurb 02:10:27 tempting to just preemptively block whoever thought AnneFrank would be a good username 02:10:38 i was wondering about that one too 02:11:26 but i kept silent lest i become tempted to make really awful puns 02:13:48 i expected elliott to snark now, but i guess he's too scared of the possible puns 02:14:13 dude, if I was scared of your puns I'd have left long ago 02:14:27 well you will nazi _these_ coming 02:15:45 hmm... how2design branch predictor 02:16:13 just use organically grown branches 02:17:14 architectural target: in order, short mips-like pipeline (5 stages or so), instruction words are 64 bit and are split into 3 instructions of ~20 bits each (load/alu unit, store/alu unit, branch/alu unit) 02:17:26 essentially a very small vliw 02:17:39 very small very large, check 02:19:05 more or less a 3 way superscalar MIPS except the instruction pairings are baked beforehand 02:20:30 not that you guys would care since you guys only care about networking, encryption, haskell and linux 02:21:52 i only care about haskell and puns hth 02:23:22 [wiki] [[Main Page]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41172&oldid=40670 * Lucasieks * (+52) 02:23:38 my target is something that renders gfx and mixes sound 02:24:39 so it needs a hardware multiplier and some way of drawing textures without wasting a gazillion cycles on cobbling addresses together 02:25:04 -!- AndoDaan_ has joined. 02:25:17 [wiki] [[Main Page]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41173&oldid=41172 * Oerjan * (-52) Undo revision 41172 by [[Special:Contributions/Lucasieks|Lucasieks]] ([[User talk:Lucasieks|talk]]) (I see nothing wrong with it) 02:25:46 I'm interested in CPU architectures, it's just anything I say to you would roll right off anyway 02:25:49 not that I have any expertise at all 02:26:07 what do you mean it would roll off? 02:27:50 -!- _AndoDaan_ has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 02:28:24 -!- bb010g has joined. 02:28:55 If I wanted specifically using Haskell involved CPU design, I would prefer to add some stuff so that it is design for Haskell usage; I think something like this has already been done actually. 02:29:34 elliott : are you telling me that my current design is unsound? :D 02:29:45 or just goes way overboard 02:30:04 nope 02:30:11 I'm not adequately qualified to assess your design 02:30:38 makes sense 02:30:58 I'm getting into the calculation latency etc stuff and only professionals really deal with that :/ 02:33:54 also it's hard to tell if a design is balanced and will work, or if it's crippled and will never be fast 02:34:50 I suppose you can estimate it, but you might not be precise in making an estimation of such. 02:34:51 make 10000 prototype chips with small schematic changes, have them drive robots, select the survivors 02:34:54 even intel has failed multiple times at that (iAPX 432, i860) 02:36:00 [wiki] [[Main Page]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41174&oldid=41173 * Lucasieks * (+26) 02:37:40 ... 02:37:59 [wiki] [[Main Page]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41175&oldid=41174 * Ehird * (-26) if you'd prefer to be unable to edit this page, I'd be happy to block you 02:40:04 for my application (video games), the small, really classic RISC designs have worked well (mips, arm, superH...) 02:40:26 It even depend what game though 02:40:55 i wonder how well 3d games do on risc, not that that's a terribly good question 02:41:04 i guess n64 was uh... what was n64 02:41:14 mips? i think playstation was mips 02:41:35 psx was mips, n64 was mips as well 02:41:42 ps2 was a mips derivative I think 02:41:50 and PSP as well 02:42:12 i'm just thinking of all the weird shit in the current gen 02:42:22 god, "reality coprocessor" 02:42:38 the current gen is really boring 02:42:44 sega 32x, saturn and dreamcast were superH 02:42:46 it's just x86. okay plus the wii u 02:42:51 that's what i mean yeah. 02:42:58 "risc losing out??" 02:43:01 handhelds are like all ARM 02:44:08 well that sounds pretty logical 02:46:05 there's nothing really special about RISC, it's just a well balanced family of architectures in general 02:47:25 i'm trying to write headlines here 02:48:41 get a leg up with ARM hth 02:49:26 -!- nisstyre has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 02:49:45 -!- Phantom__Hoover has joined. 02:57:11 -!- hjulle has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 03:00:24 -!- AndoDaan_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 03:00:49 -!- AndoDaan_ has joined. 03:03:15 "fromEnum" is terribly long... 03:04:02 [wiki] [[Talk:Newton]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41176&oldid=40041 * Lucasieks * (+114) 03:04:16 that it is. 03:04:49 so that's my third 183 character non-cheating Dominosa. 03:05:18 (the other two are very similar, but each changes something non-trivial) 03:10:48 there was a point where i though a short fromEnum would have helped, but i no longer think so. 03:25:59 -!- tlewkow has joined. 03:26:23 -!- _AndoDaan_ has joined. 03:26:30 -!- adu has quit (Quit: adu). 03:26:51 -!- GeekDude has quit (Quit: {{{}}{{{}}{{}}}{{}}} (www.adiirc.com)). 03:29:12 -!- AndoDaan_ has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 03:30:16 -!- tlewkow has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds). 03:32:35 -!- MoALTz__ has joined. 03:36:04 -!- MoALTz_ has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 03:40:17 Lnging for the days of the SNES, eh? 03:43:18 -!- Phantom__Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds). 03:44:35 -!- Dulnes has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 03:45:18 snes has a lot of cool games 03:45:39 <_AndoDaan_> F-Zero 03:46:05 <_AndoDaan_> and maybe that paraglider game. 03:46:25 -!- _AndoDaan_ has changed nick to AndoDaan. 03:46:51 still play those sometimes. 03:46:55 basically you can't do anything so you have to keep your game small 03:47:07 imo http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Fox_2 03:47:11 which means if you spend as much time it's more polished 03:47:39 Constantly bitched it after 3stages in StarFox me. 03:48:36 I do a barrelrole until my fingers bleed, but it's never enough. 03:48:41 emulating this thing must be a pain in the ass, i just realized 03:49:22 I'm trying to design a vm that's easy to emulate but can also run fast IRL 03:49:46 don't allow people to plug in games with custom coprocessors in them, then 03:50:01 -!- AndoDaan has quit (Quit: Quit). 03:52:44 -!- shikhout has joined. 03:55:40 -!- shikhin has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 03:58:40 oerjan: ah I think I understand your trouble regarding the search order. 03:59:25 177, getting there. 04:04:02 There, 175 non-cheating, 164 cheating slightly. yay. 04:06:19 funny statistics though. (I won't bother with the slightly cheating version) 04:06:24 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 04:07:44 oerjan: surely there must be *some* room for optimization. 04:07:53 dominosa small seems like hell 04:08:09 elliott: I disagree, obviously. 04:08:42 you can solve a problem while thinking it's hell 04:08:47 is this a kidn of pizza 04:09:04 elliott: well I didn't think it was hell because I approached it as a compression problem. 04:09:20 sure if you cheat :p 04:09:33 -!- MDude has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 04:09:35 by that approach, it's not a cheat 04:09:45 ah, fair enough. 04:10:27 (you can see that I also stuck to my previous convention of using "alt" to mark the alternative approach to the problem that is not data compression ;-) ) 04:10:33 -!- jameseb has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 04:10:46 (though that's not a very firm convention) 04:10:58 -!- jameseb has joined. 04:10:59 oh, wait 04:11:04 I thought you meant that what you did wasn't actually cheating 04:11:23 you should really mark "data compression" solutions :p 04:11:29 elliott: Yes, that's what I said. 04:12:10 well, ok. I can't figure out whether you mean you use a different definition of "cheating", or whether you actually solved the problem in a way everyone would consider non-cheat but that still approaches it as a data compression problem. 04:12:32 elliott: it's too much hassle, because I *will* accidently submit an improvement under the plain "int-e" nick at some point. 04:13:10 (as can be seen in Wow, where I tried sticking to (boring) and (alt) throughout.) 04:14:35 * elliott nods 04:15:34 I like that 798-byte Python solution to Wow. 04:15:42 elliott: I'm bending the notion of cheating. Anyway, I was initially answering your claim that Dominosa was hell. By never trying not to cheat (in your terminology ;-) ), it turned quite pleasant. 04:15:52 the pinnacle of golf. 04:15:53 s/turned/turned out/ 04:16:56 elliott: oh yes, I particularly like the space between print and " 04:17:04 elliott: and of course, the nick that goes with it. 04:17:10 well, if you're not going to try, why bother trying? 04:17:19 eliminating the space would be a bit pointless. 04:17:33 elliott: It's the salt in the soup. 04:17:51 elliott: It's so fundamentally against any golfer's instinct. 04:17:54 I should submit an answer like that to every problem 04:18:03 if sys.stdin.read() == '...': 04:18:06 print ... 04:18:07 elif ... 04:18:23 I mean, eliminating superfluous whitespace is the first thing you do, before you even start thinking about imrpovements. 04:18:44 int-e: I think printing a huge constant string with escapes is also against any golfer's instinct :p 04:19:05 http://www.anagolf.org/ hm 04:20:10 Bicyclidine: you know the correct link, right? 04:20:47 Let me guess, ANA = All Nippon Airways? 04:21:08 maybe not :) 04:22:07 why would an airway golf 04:22:35 because you can sponsor pretty much anything you like as an airway. 04:22:57 oerjan: surely there must be *some* room for optimization. <-- perhaps. i went through several improvement iterations already. 04:23:11 Bicyclidine: http://www.ana.co.jp/anaopen/ hth 04:27:56 there was one point that didn't feel necessarily optimal, though. 04:29:54 i suppose there's always the possibility we've missed different ones 04:32:04 -!- Dulnes has joined. 04:32:20 Arent we all pikhq_ 04:33:59 > map length ["notElem","all(/=)"] 04:34:00 [7,7] 04:34:19 i recall checking that before :) 04:34:42 so that could explain 4 alphanums difference 04:34:56 ah 04:35:56 perhaps our approaches are really different 04:36:20 always a possibility 04:36:27 it's just hard to imagine ;-) 04:36:52 I mean, coming up with different approaches is hard. 04:37:20 i suppose i'll remember this the next time i need to explain kolmogorov complexity 04:37:48 i can think of another variation with equal length that might give you 4 more symbols 04:38:00 possibly even 5 04:38:05 oerjan: Like the McCarthy thing, where the fundamental idea was to use strings of ")" as unary numbers, instead of an Int counter. When I found that, that's when I said "McCarthy is beautiful" 04:38:32 figures, because i never did 04:39:42 -!- shikhout has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 04:46:34 -!- ZombieAlive has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 04:56:42 -!- CrazyM4n_ has joined. 05:00:31 [wiki] [[Talk:And then]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=41177 * Orenwatson * (+653) complaining 05:00:42 [wiki] [[Talk:And then]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41178&oldid=41177 * Orenwatson * (+95) 05:02:36 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 05:02:50 [wiki] [[Talk:And then]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41179&oldid=41178 * Orenwatson * (+4) corrected perl code 05:24:36 [wiki] [[User talk:Orenwatson]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=41180 * AnneFrank * (+28) Created page with "Goodness me brainfuck indeed" 05:25:23 -!- CrazyM4n_ has quit (Quit: Lost terminal). 05:26:05 temptation to block rising 05:27:12 -!- zzo38 has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 05:34:11 [wiki] [[User talk:Orenwatson]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41181&oldid=41180 * AnneFrank * (-20) 05:34:57 huh. 05:35:04 go for it 05:35:46 that's a strange edit? 05:35:47 [wiki] [[User talk:Orenwatson]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41182&oldid=41181 * Orenwatson * (+144) reply to confusing message. 05:35:54 [wiki] [[Special:Log/block]] block * Ehird * blocked [[User:AnneFrank]] with an expiry time of indefinite (autoblock disabled): please pick a different username 05:38:45 [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * BillGates * New user account 05:38:58 i can only see this going well 05:39:31 lol. 05:39:51 tempting to block again to see what they come up with next 05:40:05 this brings back memories... of xbill 05:40:50 indefinite (autoblock disabled): that one was funny, let's see what you can really do 05:40:53 hey i guessed right 05:41:17 faking the colour, dedication 05:42:25 well BillGates is borderline but it will maybe fall on the wrong side of the border when they make another bizarre edit 05:42:30 although wikipedia would block that name in an instant 05:42:51 [wiki] [[User talk:BillGates]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=41183 * BillGates * (+121) Created page with "How do you create a throw/catch error for perl or am i mistaken on the panguage? im probably mistaken but if im not help" 05:43:01 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:BillGates 05:43:01 I hope not to seem unfriendly or make you feel unwelcome, but I noticed your username, and am concerned that it might not meet Wikipedia's username policy. After you look over that policy, could we discuss that concern here? 05:43:05 Bill Gates is the name of a well-known living or recently deceased person which is a violation of the username policy. 05:43:19 [wiki] [[User talk:BillGates]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41184&oldid=41183 * BillGates * (+0) 05:44:10 [wiki] [[Special:Log/block]] block * Ehird * blocked [[User:BillGates]] with an expiry time of indefinite (autoblock disabled): I meant a username that doesn't impersonate anyone living or dead other than yourself, please 05:44:31 I like the "or recently deceased" part. 05:44:43 I'd appreciate learning your own views, for instance your reasons for wanting this particular name, and what alternative username you might accept that avoids raising this concern. 05:45:05 for a second i thought you meant you were copy pasting wikipedia's mention to this peep 05:45:22 it would be fun if it were the real Bill Gates. 05:45:33 youf ucked up, elliott. you fuckued up 05:45:47 int-e: and simultaneously the real anne frank? 05:45:47 [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Josaphine O'Conner * New user account 05:45:56 elliott: Soul wandering? 05:46:16 is Josaphine O'Conner a corruption of some well-known name or something 05:46:23 [wiki] [[User talk:Josaphine O'Conner]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=41185 * Josaphine O'Conner * (+39) Created page with "Better? i used my name if you dont mind" 05:46:24 not that i can see 05:46:27 oh 05:46:29 well that works 05:46:43 oh google. "Josephine O'Conner Death Records - FindTheBest Genealogy" 05:46:47 The Wrong O'Conner 05:46:47 By: RoyalPurple4 05:46:47 Thanks to Brian Josephine's life is in danger, and some of Bragas men are on the hunt for O'Conner and Toretto. They will do anything to protect their family, even if it means getting Jack involved. (This is one of these kinds of stories that you write late at night, and decide to post. I apologize for any errors in the writing.) 05:46:56 thanks google 05:47:25 http://www.foreignaffairs.com/author/josephine-oconnor-howe oh ho 05:47:36 wow, flagrant. 05:47:55 [wiki] [[User talk:BillGates]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41186&oldid=41184 * Orenwatson * (+212) answered question. 05:48:09 oh no 05:48:12 this is going to be such a mess 05:48:21 can someone, like, merge those pages 05:48:35 wouldn't that be you 05:49:31 if I hadn't just said that, yes 05:49:54 well played 05:49:58 [wiki] [[User talk:Josaphine O'Conner]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41187&oldid=41185 * Josaphine O'Conner * (+127) 05:50:09 elliott: I know! Put them in a Web Ring! 05:50:22 int-e: ;_; 05:50:59 are we being watched... I'm mostly kidding with all this. 05:51:21 it's the real bill gates and he has the NSA monitoring us............... 05:51:22 [wiki] [[User talk:Josaphine O'Conner]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41188&oldid=41187 * Orenwatson * (+424) answered question (on her new user page). 05:53:26 -!- Oren has joined. 05:53:44 well, anyway, this gives the excellent illusion of making it look like the wiki was really active today 05:53:56 `relcome Oren 05:53:58 ​Oren: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: . (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.) 05:54:24 Thanks. 05:54:39 elliott: So it's Much Ado about Nothing? 05:54:40 we've been watching 05:54:41 waiting 05:54:57 lurking 05:55:06 now the prey has arrived and we're ready to leap 05:55:09 you know what would inflate it even further? oerjan featuring a new language 05:55:16 weltanschauung 05:55:49 -!- zzo38 has joined. 05:56:02 [wiki] [[User talk:Josaphine O'Conner]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41189&oldid=41188 * Josaphine O'Conner * (+273) 05:56:39 i'm digging this 05:57:09 "im going to be a detrament to this community", really? ... (and I don't mean the typo) 05:57:46 -!- bb010g has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 05:57:47 as an actual detriment to the community, i'm watching the competition carefully 05:58:44 * elliott shakes head fretfully at this channel 05:58:49 anyway, my first thought when seeing the question was "this is not stackoverflow". 05:58:50 I'll try and answer her issue... 05:59:28 [wiki] [[User talk:Josaphine O'Conner]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41190&oldid=41189 * Orenwatson * (+329) 06:01:14 so... them esolangs 06:02:19 you mean, them brainfuck-clones... http://esolangs.org/wiki/Talk:And_then 06:02:30 YABFC 06:02:53 people have been despairing brainfuck clones for pretty much the entire seven years I've been here :p 06:02:58 *despairing of 06:03:31 sadly your perl script cannot reproduce And then because of the "mandatory header" if nothing else. 06:03:40 at least it was added to the _joke_ language list and not the real one. 06:04:05 I haven't been here long and I'm already like 絶望した! 06:04:25 every time I see a bf clone 06:04:42 zetsuboushita.gif 06:05:15 you get numbed to it 06:05:31 sadly most of the non-BF clones aren't that great either 06:05:48 oerjan: I "agreed", but didn't get anything done. Huge surprise there. Maybe today! 06:06:33 fizzie: did you get the memo? we're going against the process and featuring And then immediately, for the rest of time 06:07:33 -!- nisstyre has joined. 06:07:45 [wiki] [[User talk:Josaphine O'Conner]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41191&oldid=41190 * Josaphine O'Conner * (+189) 06:08:37 ok. 06:09:02 Is she being DDOS'd by hakkers on steroids? lol. 06:10:08 How about those turkeys 06:11:22 Also do some of these bots work or are they users who are names that 06:11:36 uh, what? 06:11:57 Glogbot 06:12:04 applybot 06:12:04 I had turkey at thanksgiving dinner... it was delicious cooked by my aunt. I live in Canada but my aunt lived most of her life in Boston... 06:12:09 glogbot does the codu.org logs 06:12:14 Ah 06:12:15 applybot... does something. I forget what. 06:12:19 applys 06:12:21 applies, probably. 06:12:24 Yeah 06:12:25 i think it started with an m 06:12:28 some proofy language 06:12:32 miranda? 06:12:39 mumps 06:12:47 mumps. 06:12:52 wasn't it hol light or isabelle or something 06:12:55 oh 06:12:57 maybe misar??? 06:12:58 mizar. 06:12:59 Doesnt Canada have October thank give 06:13:02 isabelle sounds right 06:13:07 misabelle 06:13:18 i said i THINK it srats with an m, asshole 06:13:27 there are also some bots that don't have "bot" in the name. for instance clog, and Bicyclidine 06:13:39 Heh 06:13:57 -!- Bicyclidine has changed nick to Botcyclidine. 06:14:12 that's correct. oct 12 is canada thankgiving. but some people in my family are form america, so we celebrate both. 06:14:23 s/form/from 06:14:32 To comply with IRC standards, this interface will now prevent botloops via standard mechanisms. 06:14:41 .@quit 06:14:49 ...almost didn't put that . in 06:14:58 I'm a responsible lambdabot admin who is not at all forgetful 06:15:09 Lol 06:15:11 https://room208.org/qdb/334 good times 06:15:57 Slowly closes my many tabs 06:17:09 Is cannabalism bad? 06:17:18 Or 50/50 06:17:31 good way to get terrifying diseases 06:17:41 only if you're eating other people. 06:17:53 Dont eat the brain 06:18:02 Lots of chemicals 06:18:14 you know, that's another thing in that book, it wouldn't have covered kuru either 06:18:20 And such 06:18:24 the book on neurobiology of disease i almost bought and have not mentioned to you before this point 06:18:30 can prions be transmitted if the meat is cooked to gray? 06:18:49 Mm 06:18:58 Dead prions are still bad 06:18:59 that would probably denature them 06:19:16 Poor alchohol on it 06:19:32 And they squiggle out 06:19:44 the british ought to know after that mad cow thing 06:19:46 yaeh, i was thinking about the denaturing of the proteins. 06:20:01 "It was reported in January 2011 that researchers had discovered prions spreading through airborne transmission on aerosol particles," well, just give up 06:20:12 awww crap 06:20:14 Hhh 06:20:21 Thats crap news 06:20:27 I'm glad we're finally getting around to having the mature, channel-wide discussion about vore we've all been waiting for 06:20:27 WHO recommends "Immerse in a pan containing 1N NaOH and heat in a gravity-displacement autoclave at 121 °C for 30 minutes; clean; rinse in water; and then perform routine sterilization processes" 06:20:31 Botcyclidine: i see good opportunities for a zombie plague here 06:20:41 Botcyclidine: for eating human meat? 06:20:51 obviously 06:20:52 I'm going to believe the WHO has recommendations about that and you can't convince me otherwise 06:20:55 routing sterilization processes means burning it, right 06:20:59 *routine 06:21:15 elliott: world humanitatian organization 06:21:23 *humanitarian 06:21:23 oerjan: sauteeing, actually 06:21:28 Gravity displacement autoclave? 06:21:31 probably means dunking it in burning alcohol 06:21:35 quoth wikipedia: "[The prions'] structural stability means that prions are resistant to denaturation by chemical and physical agents, making disposal and containment of these particles difficult." 06:21:49 Dulnes: an autoclave that works by letting the steam out through gravity 06:21:53 er 06:21:54 dunking it in burning alcohol? fancy restaurants do that. 06:22:00 Botcyclidine is better informed, I see. 06:22:04 got that backwards, the steam comes in from the top and sinks down 06:22:16 K 06:22:29 the thing with autoclaves is they have to remove the air somehow, see 06:22:55 Mature channel wide discussion of vore? what do you mean elliott 06:23:01 https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8c/Broad_billed_prion.jpg can't be denatured 06:23:04 elliott: if you use @quit once, it'll come back. if you use it again too soon, it will stay away. 06:23:21 Just 06:23:34 i'm pretyt sure i could denature that bird. 06:23:36 Put your meat in a fireplace then 06:23:41 might violate some ethics rules in the process, but hey 06:23:43 Dulnes: I have no idea how to adequately answer your question 06:23:52 Ok 06:23:53 please don't fuck fireplaces though 06:23:55 can't cook an omelette without boiling a few vertebrates 06:24:00 vore = fetish for eating people. I saw actual evidence of this fetish in Akihabara... Never again. 06:24:02 Wat 06:24:16 Thats a thing? 06:24:23 oh you sweet child 06:24:45 I dont often scroll deep web 06:24:51 yes it is. I have seen too much in this short life... 06:24:55 you know, I think I'm going to officially decree vore as off-topic for #esoteric 06:25:09 Well 06:25:12 can you even do that? 06:25:17 I can try 06:25:19 The topic is visual studio 06:26:00 Well i think ive seen worse than vore then 06:26:04 i see Dulnes hasn't learned about rule 34 yet 06:26:11 Rule 63 06:26:21 i remember using visual studio 06:26:23 and i have 06:26:32 I just dont browse 06:26:38 wrote a web portal for my dragon cars eating each other fetish community 06:26:40 oerjan got the rule right the first time 06:26:59 Botcyclidine: why?! 06:27:03 I have an idea, let's talk about literally anything else 06:27:10 Nop 06:27:25 Well 06:27:29 Who here still likes Visual Basic? 06:27:40 Heh 06:27:48 I am still nostalgic for it 06:27:57 before .net 06:28:03 Are you nostalgic for it 06:28:14 when i was young and formative*, i read a 21 days VB book that had a line about C programmers always having to play catch up to VB programmers 06:28:20 Or for what was happening in your life at the time 06:28:55 Lets talk Bout 06:29:02 War 06:29:02 I loved the drag and drop interface. If only someone made something like that for PHP/JQueryUI 06:29:06 Botcyclidine: is the footnote ever going to come 06:29:11 yeah, it was very convenient 06:29:12 i'm with elliott 06:29:32 The drag and drop was handy 06:29:42 *i am probably using this word wrong, but i only care enough to mark an asterisk and write this out, not enough to look it up 06:30:07 later i used blitzbasic and it didn't have drag and drop ness 06:30:09 Botcyclidine: you could at least have written formaline 06:30:22 and, laterer, i used matlab's interface generator, which is very similar to VB 06:30:37 probably uses the same... something 06:30:37 Latererer than that? 06:30:53 well, the matlab thing was a few months ago 06:30:59 Ah 06:31:04 Nvm then 06:31:17 after that i joined the peace corps and died attempting to invade honduras? what do you want me to say 06:31:47 Remember dial up 06:31:51 isn't that more like a war corps thing 06:32:43 remember the fresh smell of organically harvested rubber roasting in the morning 06:32:52 ? 06:32:56 ahhhhh, the 90s 06:33:03 Oh god 06:33:29 how do you organically harvest rubber? just like... poke a tree? 06:33:44 Botcyclidine: without GMOs 06:33:48 Set fire to rubber wood 06:34:19 Oren: btw I'm sorry to report this channel is usually less out-of-control than this 06:34:28 somehow it seems to catch fire when new people join 06:34:32 Oh question when did you start coding elliott 06:34:41 [wiki] [[Talk:Newton]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41192&oldid=41176 * Oerjan * (+1) fmt 06:34:47 2004ish, when I was about 8. 06:35:15 Mmm 06:35:19 what 06:35:24 How old are you 06:35:27 You're younger than me! 06:35:30 Botcyclidine: what a question. "The latex is a sticky, milky colloid drawn off by making incisions into the bark and collecting the fluid in vessels in a process called 'tapping'." 06:35:30 I mean I did some things with, like, typing out BASIC programs into old computers before that and the like, but not really much in the way of original programming. 06:35:34 I'm 19. 06:35:37 that math is not hard, peep 06:35:44 int-e: so, poking it. 06:35:59 Im always confused on years i forget time aloy 06:36:02 Alot* 06:36:16 also 06:36:21 19?! 06:36:27 Botcyclidine: well, 2014-(2004-8) gives the wrong result. 06:36:28 Much youth 06:36:32 I'm actually twelve. 06:36:34 elliott: close though 06:36:41 I'm 21 06:36:47 like you can drink in the US either way, probably 06:36:48 Dulnes: I felt a lot younger when I first joined here and I was 11 :/ 06:36:51 im 25 06:36:53 or was it vote 06:36:59 US drinking age is 21 06:37:04 wow, really 06:37:11 I know, right? your country is weird 06:37:11 how do they manage 06:37:25 Your parents must be very lax to let you internet at 11 06:37:26 alright this time I be the brit and you be the american 06:37:27 [wiki] [[User talk:Orenwatson]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41193&oldid=41182 * Oerjan * (+49) unsigned 06:37:44 'murica 06:37:44 [wiki] [[User talk:Orenwatson]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41194&oldid=41193 * Oerjan * (+1) oops 06:37:47 *fires revolvers into the air* 06:37:50 Dulnes: I had internet for years before that. 06:38:06 Again much youth 06:38:18 Ill probably die at 34 06:38:36 Since i have seizures and such medical issues 06:38:38 [wiki] [[User talk:BillGates]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41195&oldid=41186 * Oerjan * (+50) unsigned 06:38:54 that sucks 06:38:57 Spend it wisely 06:39:10 I don't think any of my medical issues are likely to significantly shorten my lifespan 06:39:11 talking about vore on the internet 06:39:31 that's not generally considered a medical issue Botcyclidine 06:40:04 clearly you haven't seen the new DSM 06:40:43 Seizures & Brain cancer are probably the top two that are going to kill me 06:40:45 didn't they remove most of the paraphilia stuff 06:40:49 due to my statistical groups I am most likely to die of suicide. 06:40:58 Slaps oren 06:41:00 same 06:41:11 (I think) 06:41:13 guys dont talk bout suicide 06:41:16 Shhh 06:41:18 why not 06:41:27 SHHH 06:41:34 am i missing something here 06:41:39 Anyways different topic 06:41:50 ok 06:41:54 Thanks 06:41:55 Hey, I got something actually, just a sec 06:41:57 I think I prefer fatal morbidity to Visual Studio support. 06:42:07 heh 06:42:10 [wiki] [[User talk:Josaphine O'Conner]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41196&oldid=41191 * Oerjan * (+177) unsigned 06:42:10 https://twitter.com/neuroecology/status/537790766178136064 06:42:27 Ok, so long as you don't give me flashbacks to that attic in Akiba. 06:42:29 Leaves internet 06:42:54 msvc vs gcc... so many ways to interpret the same c++ standard 06:43:04 the secret vore attic 06:43:06 Unplugs modem and dips it in hydrochloric acid 06:43:23 geez mon, didn't know you were so sensitive about computational neuroscience 06:43:29 also someone should be punched for 32 bit long in 64bit msvc vs 64bit in 64bit gcc 06:43:34 no idea who but someone 06:43:56 long should be 64-bit with mingw I think? 06:44:04 a lot of things would break if it violated the platform ABI 06:44:14 . o O ( "Of course people eat people. Which part of 'omni' in 'omnivore' didn't you understand?!" ) 06:44:43 elliot: not secret. you literally go to top floor of any store in akihabara and go upstairs. don't go to the top floor of any manga store... ever. 06:44:46 Death isnt really a topic for me since im going to Die in 9 years and leave my kids behind. 06:45:16 elliott: never really used mingw directly but if I'm not mistaken it has a mix of posix ABI stuff and win32 ABI stuff 06:45:43 like, gcc link system but it also has to deal with msvc generated dlls to be useful 06:45:44 just use int64_t if you need a particular bit length. 06:45:44 Night guys 06:46:01 or int32_t or whatever 06:46:06 madbr: if it had 64-bit long then calling functions in libraries not compiled with mingw would be kinda bad 06:46:18 i don't think HCl would be good for disposing of modems, btw 06:46:23 no idea what it does 06:46:29 it probably has a switch 06:46:43 bubbles hydrogen gas... don't light a match 06:47:01 or boom hindenburg 06:47:09 well, yeah, but i mean it's notterribly efficient destruction wise 06:47:36 Seetee 06:47:44 * oerjan wonders if Dulnes's irc client has the /me command 06:47:53 elliott : windows/posix mixes are usually kinda insane, too 06:47:58 see: cygwin 06:48:08 i DO USE mINgw FOR MY OWN PROGRAMS 06:48:17 I do use MinGW for my own programs 06:48:35 why does the capslock key still exist 06:48:43 To type in all capitals 06:48:50 Oren: Why do you type in all lowercase then? 06:48:52 so i have something to hit to turn on my mic. actually no zzo's answer is better. 06:49:11 you can compile non-win32 executables in cygwin 06:49:18 (ELF binaries I think) 06:49:20 and run them 06:49:21 Unfortunately the light on my keyboard to indicate caps lock is broken 06:50:02 i type in all lowercase because i see no reason to press shift when i would be fully understood even if i did not. 06:51:09 also: there are two x64 ABIs (microsoft/msvc and posix/gcc) 06:51:32 yes that's retarded 06:51:47 i set capslock to shift into japaneseたとえば、これ。 06:53:22 it would be interesting to calculate the number of manhours lost to the win32 vs posix differences actually 06:53:39 probably "lots" 06:54:15 starting with every time i have to convert \r\n to \n 06:55:02 and C:\\blah\\afsf to /blah/afsf 06:55:12 madbr: I try to write program to avoid such things, when they are needed I can use #ifdef and that stuff; for example to change stdin/stdout into binary mode if the program is using it 06:55:30 Oren: In Windows the C functions can you backslash or forward slash both are acceptable 06:55:54 And you can use fopen(...,"wb") it selects binary mode; on UNIX it is treated the same as "w" 06:57:04 @tell Dulnes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvlllG1FwjI revise your disposal strategies 06:57:04 Consider it noted. 06:58:05 "Skip to 4:20 for the burst." I always skip to 420 06:58:29 don't we all 06:58:43 anyway it looks like it's caused by pressure buildup anyway 07:00:01 my mom was all proud when I smoked pot for the first time. made me never want to do it again - what's the point if your mom doesn't hate it? 07:01:44 i never did it again after that. 07:02:32 last time i mentioned #drugz to my parents my mom related drinking booze through a catheter. 07:02:39 zzo38 : yeah that's the basics of it but there's much more gory fallout 07:03:09 like utf-16 vs utf-8 filename handling 07:04:18 or abs() being integer on gcc (you're supposed to use fabs() instead, and it also interacts with the C/C++ divide) 07:04:58 I just always use ASCII filenames and avoid that issue 07:05:15 also, caps sensitive filenames 07:05:33 That's fine until your clients in Japan and Europe are yelling at you. 07:06:27 because esmé.doc isn't uploading 07:07:12 or your program gets installed to a path that has é somewhere in the folder name 07:07:14 is that an esme joke 07:07:28 yes 07:07:44 how do you even know about esme 07:07:56 or you write a python 2 script. é appears somewhere. the whole thing crashes 07:08:09 I have lurked on the wiki for ~three years 07:08:10 (sorry but that's retarded) 07:08:43 do you know about the brainfuckiest 07:09:07 It crashes because an incorrect character appears somewhere? That's certainly not good, it should just treat them as any other bytes in the input file are, and therefore don't crash. 07:09:27 Inside of an identifier it could display an error, but in a string literal it should be permitted. 07:09:38 zzo38 : yes but obviously python2 was designed by an idiot 07:10:04 in theory you're supposed to use a different string type 07:10:05 i tried using eight bit characters for some ascii hardware i had and kana came out 07:10:07 Maybe it is. 07:10:09 lemme tell ya, that surprised me 07:10:39 in practice, aint nobody have time for that 07:10:47 Botcyclidine: That is because you have to use the correct character encodings, clearly. 07:11:01 hiragana or katakana? some old japanese computers mapped kana to some of the upper 128 chars 07:11:03 it turned out not to be ascii, indeed 07:11:05 madbr: Do you mean normal strings are 7-bit character strings? 07:11:27 ASCII is only 7-bits so 8-bit character sets, if they are ASCII, are actually extended ASCII. 07:11:37 Oren: kana. after some searching i found out it's a typeface particular to the kind of screen. it was almost shift-jis but not, so frustrating 07:11:54 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JIS_X_0201 probly 07:12:06 basically if é appears anywhere, the default string operations in python2 cause an exception and stop the program 07:12:35 let's see... nope. lemme grab it again 07:12:41 wow I'm glad I use perl despite its linenoiseness 07:12:42 because it's "invalid for the default string type you're supposed to use the unicode string type or something" 07:13:00 unicode in perl is no picnic 07:13:11 Oren: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hitachi_HD44780_LCD_controller#Font 07:13:34 also retarded: the uppercase version of i in Java is I 07:13:35 Morning! 07:13:41 by the way, are you at all related to orenronen 07:13:44 EXCEPT if your computer is in turkish 07:14:05 then it's İ 07:14:14 So I have a serious question. In Funciton, how do you define a function that takes two lambdas and an integer as its input, and returns one of those two lambdas depending on whether that number is nonzero? 07:14:16 can you lay off the "retarded" 07:14:20 surprise your program crashes in turkey 07:14:40 I always use "C" locale and avoid such problems, but I wrote program in C anyways. 07:14:53 the hitachi thing looks like a variant on jis 208 07:15:03 or rather super set of 07:15:04 My shell scripts on UNIX systems I access I always set the locale to C explicitly in order to avoid problems 07:15:05 the kana thing was also pretty funny because my program was super buggy and just dumped memory at the thing, so all this half-japanese gibberish scrolls by as i pull out my hair 07:15:16 elliott: I've lost many hours to figuring out why some tool suddenly stopped working 07:15:32 insulting things is fine, just use a different insult if you would 07:15:43 you can say whatever you want, I'm just asking you not to use that word 07:15:52 I am entirely unrelated to orenronen 07:15:56 figured 07:16:01 so far as I know 07:16:06 i don't know these japanese name thingies 07:16:09 and turning out because word decided to turn "..." into "…" 07:16:12 madbr: What tool is that? 07:16:14 -!- MoALTz__ has quit (Quit: Leaving). 07:16:49 Do you mean Microsoft Word? You can turn off autocorrection in Microsoft Word. 07:17:01 zzo38 : an internal tool that turned an excel sheet of like all the sfx in a game (often with 1000+ sounds) into xml for the engine 07:17:10 you could introduce yourself as mister dogfucker and i'd be like nice to meet you 07:17:17 zzo38 : I know but the sound designer that made that excel sheet didn't 07:17:55 [wiki] [[Talk:Funciton]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41197&oldid=38214 * B jonas * (+376) /* Conditional returning lambda */ new section 07:18:00 or he typed some french into the comment section somewhere and the parser choked anyways 07:18:20 or also some unicode version of "-" that's not the real dash 07:18:41 I'm not Japanese -- I learned it from a dear friend in primary school. My last name is Watson 07:18:54 i figured 07:18:58 Those are some problems caused by Unicode and stuff, although it shouldn't care about the character encoding used in comments; that doesn't make sense. 07:19:06 that you aren't japanese, anyway, not the other stuff 07:19:10 My japanese is terrible but i can survive in japan 07:19:21 zzo38 : the string just gets copied into a dictionary 07:19:36 which is enough to crash the script 07:20:11 Yes, it is designed badly then 07:20:11 because python2 strings crash instead of doing something sensible 07:21:16 Why can't the language just treat all upper-byte characters as if they were legal identifier letters? 07:21:19 also filling docs with "accents in filenames don't work" and adding checks in scripts etc 07:21:42 In the programs I have written I generally accept any characters in comments, but outside of comments usually only ASCII characters are allowed (although there are a few exceptions in some cases). 07:21:45 why can't it just treat C1 control characters correctly, imo, 07:22:07 Oren : probably got fixed in python3. which does you no good because nobody uses it because it's not compatible with python2 07:22:12 Oren: That is another way too, yes. CWEB converts all 128-255 characters into letters so that it can be used in a C program. 07:23:06 b_jonas: sorry, this channel is about unicode :p 07:23:18 sound designers are not technical people 07:23:28 Becuause of this ascii rubbish all Japanese coders code their stuff in Engrish instead of understandable japanese 07:23:45 b_jonas: but maybe this will help: Since the only datatype in Funciton is the arbitrary-size integer, a compliant interpreter must allocate a non-zero integer to every lambda closure the program creates. The lambda expression box returns an integer that identifies the closure, and the lambda invocation box will use the number to identify the lambda closure to invoke. This approach has many ... 07:23:47 Although, the #TITLE command in VGMCK accepts UTF-8 encoding 07:23:51 ... advantages; in particular, you can automatically have lists of functions. The integers returned are required to be non-zero as a convenience so that the user code can still use the number 0 to mean null or false in cases where a lambda is optional. 07:24:06 Oren: I have seen program with the comments in Japanese though; it isn't much problem. 07:24:27 they don't understand that calling a sfx explosion_deuxième_prise.wav is going to break some way or another 07:24:30 If the compiler doesn't accept arbitrary comments then it isn't very good. 07:24:44 several parts of programs aren't in comments 07:25:28 so then you need a second guy to go through their stuff to make it ok for computers because computers are stupid 07:25:40 elliott: hmm, that might work 07:25:46 elliott: no wait 07:26:00 elliott: that might cause some difficulties of how garbage collection works 07:26:21 you'd have to define how exactly you're allowed to store functions to keep them referenced 07:26:33 cap sensitive file systems will also break in not-so-cool way 07:26:37 b_jonas: okay, but it doesn't, so by the axiom that GC never breaks a program, it will work 07:26:37 so it's possible, but the language spec would need some extension for it 07:26:46 sounds like it pretty much excludes garbage collection 07:26:51 name an asset Funky_stuff.wav 07:27:03 you can do conditionals with lambdas as much as with integers 07:27:06 oerjan: maybe… but this seems a more practical language than that 07:27:08 play funky_stuff.wav in your code 07:27:09 since they are integers :p 07:27:12 can you use a conservative collector, btw i am not paying attention 07:27:16 it looks like it works 07:27:20 b_jonas: practical? it stores strings in BigInts 07:27:24 the game ships 07:27:49 surprise the sfx doesn't play on iphone or whatever because the file system is case sensitive 07:27:50 elliott: yeah... and the example implementations of the functions aren't too efficient either 07:27:52 not even with reasonable alignment (21 bits) 07:28:06 and nobody caught it because it plays on windows 07:28:15 -!- Patashu has joined. 07:28:20 In otherwords in order to be compatible with everything, you have to put everything as binary inside the exe. 07:28:23 what I was thinking is that it would just extend the nand operation to return something sensible for lambdas, so that you can still use it for conditionals 07:28:31 oren : yes 07:28:52 b_jonas: but lambda expressions evaluate to integers 07:28:52 oren : one favorite strategy is "One huge data file" 07:28:53 like, 0 NAND somelambda is still -1, and -1 NAND somelambda is somelambda, and stuff 07:28:58 so that wouldn't work 07:29:01 (usually a zip with compression turned off) 07:29:10 the zip parses the same on every platform 07:29:19 surprise it works 07:29:21 You can put everything into a SQLite database for example too 07:29:35 There are many ways to put multiple data into one file 07:30:06 elliott: oh wait 07:30:18 elliott: you're right, the description says " 07:30:20 zzo38 : like 10 meg data files that are going to be updated over svn and baked through data generation/compression scripts? 07:30:23 Since the only datatype in Funciton is the arbitrary-size integer, a compliant interpreter must allocate a non-zero integer to every lambda closure the program creates. 07:30:29 The lambda expression box returns an integer that identifies the closure, and the lambda invocation box will use the number to identify the lambda closure to invoke." 07:30:41 so they practically can't be garbage collected 07:30:41 b_jonas: I quoted that to you earlier :) 07:30:42 ok 07:30:57 probably not a great design decision, IMO 07:30:57 elliott: I didn't know that was a quote 07:30:58 sorry 07:31:05 zzo38 : also there are 1000 of these files 07:31:06 ok, well this answers the question] 07:31:08 ah, yeah, I should probably have added quotes 07:31:16 sorry about that, bad dhabit 07:31:19 *habit 07:31:21 especially since lists of integers are essentially a form of godel encoding 07:31:36 [wiki] [[Talk:Funciton]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41198&oldid=41197 * B jonas * (+173) /* Conditional returning lambda */ 07:31:46 there's just no way to know how an integer referring to a lambda may be hidden 07:31:49 zzo38 : also the suits/marketing guys want to have DLC and then you need multiple data paths for god damn everything 07:33:04 Or it's an application that users make files with, so, you're at the mercy of the users' filename choices 07:33:06 madbr: Well, depending what file you can certainly still use SQLite; it is actually pretty powerful. There is also OHRRPGCE "lumped" foramts, which is like a simple file archive basically. 07:34:05 oren : yes 07:34:06 for example saved games or user-made maps 07:34:17 also have the problem 07:34:18 dude 07:34:21 megazeux 07:34:27 uses free standing files 07:34:33 oerjan: never mind hiding it, you could also just iterate through all integers and try calling them as lambdas later on 07:34:43 Yes I know how MegaZeux works 07:34:48 a game is a folder of data files songs etc 07:34:57 Yes 07:34:58 well maybe it dies if you hit an invalid one but that doesn't matter 07:34:58 it used to be a DOS program 07:35:15 which means that to even work on Posix it has to simulate caps insensitivity 07:35:15 Yes I know that too I used the DOS version and actually know of some of the significant differences 07:35:36 (Which actually broke some of my older MegaZeux games) 07:40:01 Ok, 07:40:15 i'm back from looking up megazeux 07:40:30 -!- Botcyclidine has quit (Quit: leaving). 07:40:47 -!- Bicyclidine has joined. 07:42:14 is it just me or does every document file format eventually become turing complete? 07:42:43 obviously. 07:42:49 what with VBA and javascript for example 07:43:01 wait a min, javascript is not a document file format 07:43:11 maybe you meant HTML? 07:43:13 Oren: I don't know. I suppose it depend. I know TeX can do a lot of program. 07:43:20 lifthrasiir: no, javascript in (html and in pdf) 07:43:22 javascript was added to html becuase html was not sufficient 07:43:27 b_jonas: :o 07:43:50 VBA was added to docs and xls becuase they needed programmability 07:43:53 Oren: I think HTML is pretty sufficient really 07:44:23 not sufficient for users' wants 07:45:13 HTML as a document format is sufficient already, HTML as an application platform... would be never sufficient. 07:45:20 Oren: you're getting it backwards. HTML is sufficient for what the users want, it's not sufficient for what the people who want to make their websites unusable want 07:45:40 and we are living in the age that somehow mixes both 07:46:05 (or maybe it's sufficient for what the users need, but not sufficient for what the users want?) 07:46:08 javascript is not industrial grade enough to build a serious game on 07:46:09 HTML+CSS+JavaScript works as a VM in many cases, although it is a terrible design for such a thing! 07:48:33 Which is why jquery was invented. 07:48:41 and then angular js 07:49:05 No, it is still a terrible design; JavaScript isn't a bad programming language, it is that the VM design is terrible. 07:49:50 no the ui is terrible. I want by drag and drop forms and buttons back, that I had for VB apps in 1999. 07:50:38 the problem isn't with javascript, it's how many websites that wouldn't need it have an interface that require you to run a beefy box and wide bandwidth to access something that they could just publish on a simple text interface through a 32 kilobit/second modem 07:51:03 including some online banking stuff 07:51:23 and they manage to modify websites that used to work fine to do this too 07:51:24 noone knows how to use telnet anymore. 07:51:28 including online banking 07:51:38 I do think SSH would be better for this bank interface anyways 07:51:48 Oren: it needn't be telnet, it can be just plain small htmls with no fancy javascript thingies where there's no point adding them 07:52:02 (Telnet isn't secure enough though. Actually, HTTPS also isn't quite as secure enough.) 07:52:13 zzo38: no, I think just plain nineties style html with ZERO javascript and zero images would work for this banking interface 07:53:07 they managed to make an interface where I can't just type a date to an input box, I have to use their fancy unusable javascripd date chooser 07:53:13 It would, but I think SSH is working OK 07:54:04 zzo38: not for banking, but for other stuff, a html interface is usually better than an ssh interface, because it's easier to automate, especially if they put in helpful class and id attributes everywhere 07:54:27 The problem is that there isn't a standard in HTML<5 07:54:28 It deepnds much on the design. 07:55:30 Oren: there is, but who cares, it can be just a plain text input box (which is what the html5 date control falls back to, and no matter the fancy control, I want to just type in a fucking date as YYYY-mm-dd without having to use the mouse and trying to navigate through calendar pages) 07:55:59 they should just have a text input box 07:57:18 at least the online banking interface has the advantage that it's completely replaced only like once every five years, unlike some crazy websites 07:58:50 I dunno if that's a virtue. My father's website has worked the same since 1994, only the backend has been updated. 07:59:05 it's a virtue only in comparison 07:59:35 so it is exactly as you describe, no JS, all pure html forms 08:00:58 I don't insist on having no javascript, only that it works without the javascript too. 08:01:09 And the javascript shouldn't actively make it more difficult to use the page. 08:02:45 maybe that's too much to ask though 08:04:16 that any technology not create work as well as saving work, is too much to ask possibly 08:04:59 I tend to get philosophical at 3am. 08:05:00 -!- nooga has joined. 08:06:15 hello 08:07:02 it's 8 am. 08:08:12 -!- nisstyre has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 08:08:19 Hello, London? 08:08:58 or possibly Portugal 08:10:20 or burkina faso 08:12:51 related : http://xkcd.com/1335/ 08:13:34 i had to look up a country in africa at gmt. my first guess was niger, but it's just a little too far east 08:14:55 hm. i bet elliott lives in Drowning Maud Land. 08:16:17 SANAE IV. yes. 08:18:06 *Dronning 08:18:15 it's norwegian for Queen hth 08:18:37 sanae - I immediately thought of 東方, and there is a user on this irc with the name drdanmaku 08:18:47 drowning queens 08:19:30 i don't think she drowned, she had something chronically bad let me check 08:19:38 I pronounced that in my head as drawning, not drowning 08:20:20 that's good, if you want to be slightly closer to correct pronunciation 08:21:31 hm it seems to have been a sudden illness 08:21:42 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maud_of_Wales#Maud.27s_death 08:22:59 youngest daughter of the king of england. european royalty have weird family trees 08:23:29 but then so do I, blah... 08:23:58 http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/52/EgyptianPtolemies2.jpg 08:24:13 "it could be worse" 08:25:19 yeah our king's mother was swedish royalty, his (paternal) grandmother (maud) was english royalty and his grandfather was danish royalty 08:25:20 yah a few kissing cousins doesn't compare 08:25:48 however both he and his son have married "ordinary" people 08:26:03 the riff rafff 08:33:42 -!- nooga has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 08:36:08 -!- nisstyre has joined. 08:37:54 idea: rather than most languages where we struggle or use libraries for dates and times, a language in which the only type is datetime. 08:39:08 and containing many constructs useful for such type. 08:39:28 -!- nooga has joined. 08:39:58 sounds promising 08:40:17 it will be the first computer essentially based on computus 08:42:56 characters -, T and : are reserved for ISO-8601 literals, which require no quoting. So you would just write x=2014-06-25T06:36:09 08:43:41 also + for time zone 08:44:07 in fact maybe use ADD DIVIDE COBOL style 08:44:18 and SUBTRACT. 08:44:21 etc. 08:45:08 ADD 3 DAYS TO x. 08:46:48 ROUND x TO A WEEK 08:46:53 What about, advance until Sunday, advance until full moon, advance until Easter, advance backwards such that Sun's ecliptic longitude matches that which Mars has during the current date... 08:47:17 ROUND x TO NEXT SUNDAY 08:48:00 Maybe ADVANCE is a clearer keyword tho 08:48:15 This will be the SQL of dates. 08:48:35 except that SQL is already the SQL of dates. 08:48:51 nvm 08:49:11 I know how to program SQL too. It has no commands like that though 08:51:05 not like that, but most web programs store and handle dates in SQL that I've seen... that might just be me though 08:51:31 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Gnite). 08:51:51 I think php has better native dates than perl -- that might be it. 08:53:57 ADD 1 MONTH TO x -- this is a really complex operation for many reasons 08:54:25 ADD 1 QUARTER to x 08:55:23 ADVANCE x TO NEXT HOLIDAY 08:55:46 requires sophisticated locale 08:57:34 LET y BE ALL WEEKDAYS FROM x TO z. 08:57:52 BUSINESS DAY is a thing too 08:58:44 and then you have time. SET x TO 8:00 THAT DAY 08:59:47 I'mma try and build a prototype of this when I have time. 09:01:16 when you have TIME 09:03:28 SET x TO LAST OF exam_days. ADD 1 DAY TO x. PRINT x. 09:04:08 PRINT x AS DATE FORMAT WORDS 09:05:15 >>>Wednesday, December 17, 2014 09:06:28 -!- nooga has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 09:09:04 really every part of a datetime needs to be nullable. 09:27:22 -!- AndoDaan has joined. 09:30:24 Is it alright if I use a talk/discussion page, specifically MNNBFSL's, to write down my non concrete musing on possible constants/algorithms/converting from BF? 09:31:29 fizzie: supercheat? 09:33:02 Why on that page? 09:33:31 converting from BF to what? 09:33:40 MNNBFSL 09:34:06 cat does that 09:34:06 and i mean constants/algorithms in MNNBFSL 09:34:46 cat? 09:34:47 O, OK, I think is OK I suppose? 09:35:44 AndoDaan: nice job on that MNNBFSL Interpreter 09:36:44 thanks! I'm not sure if it does error handling perfectly/well though. I might have to double check that. 09:37:11 I see. まだ名前のないBrainfuck Stack Language is it? 09:37:22 Yeah. 09:37:43 Unnamed Brainfuck Stack Language 09:38:17 "not yet having a name" 09:38:59 As far as I could make out from google translate, that's what the author left the name as. 09:39:30 mada namae no nai 09:40:15 wooho my little japanese knowledge finally pays off 09:40:53 :) 09:41:27 my japanese knowledge mostly pays off in not needing to wait for scanlators... 09:43:02 [wiki] [[MNNBFSL]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41199&oldid=41164 * Orenwatson * (+15) explained what language the name is in 09:43:53 AndoDaan: you can btw. embed " in strings with \' 09:43:59 !blsq "\'"0!! 09:43:59 | '" 09:44:01 !blsq "\'"0!!Q 09:44:01 | " 09:44:14 \' is the escape sequence for " 09:45:02 Helpful, thanks. Should I add the link to the first mention of MNNBFSL (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdsOTr6SmDrxuWE7sJFrkhQ) 09:45:16 http://d.hatena.ne.jp/yshl/20140726 09:45:22 that one 09:46:33 phew, accidental youtube link was non-incriminating. 09:47:44 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7JVlpm0eRs 09:48:07 In that name, まだ名前のないBrainfuck風スタック言語 , the 風 which on the wiki is simply "fu" should be translated as "style" or "method" 09:48:32 or transcribed properly as fū 09:49:15 hmm stack styled, sta fu ck 09:49:43 [wiki] [[MNNBFSL]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41200&oldid=41199 * Orenwatson * (+11) made translation of fuu 09:51:53 the fuu literally is the chinese character for "wind" but it also means the general "direction of flow" of something etc... chinese characters are hard 09:53:09 and the sma echaracter is pronounced differently when it means the other meaning 09:53:41 I didn't know something like gofundme existed 09:53:52 and I'm suprised that they actually can raise the money 09:56:56 According to the Japanese developer, this is a cat program in mnnbfsl: 09:56:58 [<+++++"[->+++++<"][]">"++>] [.,] 09:57:13 You probably have to have a good pre-existing online presence to have any luck. 09:57:23 why is it so different from the one on the wiki? 09:58:35 Completely blew that. 09:58:38 thanks. 09:58:51 AndoDaan: or a good story. 09:59:26 mroman: I wanted to distinguish it from "cheat". 09:59:27 [wiki] [[MNNBFSL]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41201&oldid=41200 * AndoDaan * (+28) /* Examples */ fixed wrong code 09:59:45 so 09:59:54 supercheat > cheat > no cheat 10:00:23 -!- Oren_ has joined. 10:00:31 The other program on the japanese website is apparently a "busy loop" 10:00:50 [<+["] 10:01:36 -!- Oren has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 10:02:18 are there competitions for bf busy beavers? 10:02:23 this comment presents FizzBuzz in MNNBFSL 10:02:23 mroman: "no cheat" should (modulo bugs) find a valid solution to any solvable Dominosa instance (with the same size); "cheat" makes one untrue assumption and tweaks the search a bit to succeed on the three test puzzles and probably some vaguely defined subset of others; "supercheat" just encodes the output and doesn't actually solve the problem. 10:02:26 http://d.hatena.ne.jp/yshl/20140823 10:02:58 Oren_, https://github.com/yshl/MNNBFSL/tree/master/example it's all gathered there. 10:03:14 Ah ok. 10:04:23 fizzie: oh 10:04:28 that's what we call an embed solution 10:04:36 which is usually suffixed with (embed) 10:04:44 I've heard the term, but int-e was using just (cheat). 10:05:27 In retrospect, that would've been more informative, if less whimsical. 10:09:14 [wiki] [[MNNBFSL]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41202&oldid=41201 * AndoDaan * (+23) /* Commands */ changed 9+1 to 9=8+1 10:12:15 Looking at the cat example, it seems it's using the loop method I've been trying to form. 10:12:33 that's good. 10:24:35 -!- Dulnes has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 10:43:34 `8ball is it too early yet? 10:43:35 Don't count on it. 10:46:03 It is too early for what? 10:47:14 to be awake possibly 10:47:43 how can it be too early yet though is another question. 10:48:37 yet implies something is false will become true, but being too early only ever changes from true to false ... hmmm.... 10:49:25 -!- nooga has joined. 10:50:10 Don't you have a clock? 11:05:39 oh look, everyone, 11:06:18 http://underhanded.xcott.com/?p=26 The 7th Underhanded C Contest is now Open 11:06:44 yeah, twelve days old news. I didn't notice till now. 11:07:27 also, 23rd IOCCC winners announced: http://www.de.ioccc.org/2014/whowon.html 11:07:29 that's more recent 11:08:44 Yusuke Endoh is that Ruby guy, isn't he? 11:09:05 dunno 11:09:24 wait, two klingon web servers? 11:09:25 what the heck 11:10:49 Yup, he's the ruby guy 11:11:01 also the guy who made http://mamememo.blogspot.se/2010/09/qlobe.html and https://github.com/mame/quine-relay 11:18:32 -!- boily has joined. 11:28:49 -!- AndoDaan has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 11:51:02 @massages? 11:51:03 Sorry, no messages today. 11:58:30 @messages-old 11:58:30 You don't have any messages 12:01:27 -!- Patashu has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 12:29:27 -!- boily has quit (Quit: FLAMBÉD CHICKEN). 12:58:56 -!- GeekDude has joined. 12:59:04 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 13:10:34 :( beginning to look like Rust flat out won't work for my use case 13:29:25 . o O ( Use case: Erecting a Steel Framework. ) 14:02:16 -!- hjulle has joined. 14:13:32 [wiki] [[Dimensions]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41203&oldid=41096 * TomPN * (+3) /* Increase and decreasing the value of a cell */ 14:36:05 -!- GeekDude has changed nick to GeekAfk. 15:06:24 Anyone had any experience with F#? 15:20:55 -!- hjulle has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 15:41:14 -!- cluid has joined. 15:41:15 hi 15:41:24 Hey, cluid 15:41:36 b_jonas, did you work on Janus? 15:42:09 i got confused sorry 15:44:49 zzo38, BTW, I saw some dead links on C2 wiki 15:45:01 relating to RegXy 15:45:12 so i've just realised that i don't actually know what colour red bull is 15:45:16 is it red? 15:47:31 It is colored E150a and E101. 15:47:33 -!- idris-bot has quit (Quit: Terminated). 15:48:17 I would like to improve the RegXy page on esoteric wiki 15:48:29 but also I couldn't find it because I thought itw ould be called Reg Xy 15:48:44 -!- idris-bot has joined. 15:49:06 -!- GeekAfk has changed nick to GeekDude. 15:50:08 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 15:53:42 is there something like a comesub, which is like a comefrom but pushes the from address to the return stack? or would that defeat the whole point of comefrom? 15:53:56 -!- copumpkin has quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…). 15:55:26 -!- GeekDude has changed nick to GeekAfk. 16:08:30 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 16:12:25 -!- nooga has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 16:13:15 where can i see the code 16:13:16 http://www.de.ioccc.org/2014/whowon.html 16:14:02 cluid: you can't yet. the source code is usually released a few weeks later, probably in January 16:14:02 Usually it takes them a while to release the sources. 16:14:10 D'oh, too late. 16:19:49 thanks 16:20:25 -!- cluid has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 16:25:08 -!- GeekAfk has quit (Quit: {{{}}{{{}}{{}}}{{}}} (www.adiirc.com)). 16:39:44 -!- shikhin has joined. 16:42:28 -!- ZombieAlive has joined. 16:48:45 -!- Dulnes has joined. 17:01:51 -!- Lorenzo64 has joined. 17:06:32 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 17:26:07 -!- tlewkow has joined. 17:32:42 Good morning 18:01:26 -!- nys has joined. 18:06:57 Why doesn't C have a bitwise rotate operator??? 18:07:30 Oren_: Same answer as any C question: because it hates you. 18:07:32 My assignment is to do SHA1 18:09:01 So I have to define yet another bit_rotate() macro... a macro which appears in so many programs, like the max macro 18:10:51 Proposal for C2020 - add a variadic max operator 18:11:47 And a ones-complement add operator. 18:11:49 defining a correct, type-generic max is kind of hard. 18:12:23 So long as it works for integers and floats... 18:12:25 in fact it might require C11 18:12:35 Oren_: the main problem is that max(x, y) usually evaluates x or y twice 18:12:48 that's why it should be in the compiler... 18:12:53 not a macro 18:13:03 you can avoid this with gcc statement expressions but, I think, at the cost of breaking things if y references whatever name was used to put the result of x in 18:13:08 (I don't think gcc has proper gensym) 18:13:13 Oren_: libecb has a bit rotation function/macro, see http://software.schmorp.de/pkg/libecb.html 18:13:16 with C11, you can use _Generic and dispatch to actual functions 18:13:45 Oren_: you could try to use that instead of defining your own 18:13:48 max(x, y) should be a macro for __Max() or something, the way they did typeof and bool 18:13:54 -!- Lorenzo64 has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 18:14:12 well, building it into the compiler is kind of sad. 18:14:19 it's like admitting your language has zero abstraction power. 18:14:38 C *does* have zero abstraction power 18:15:06 #define has less power than sed 18:16:13 elliott: fuck _Generic 18:16:16 fuck everything about it 18:16:47 Such strong feelings X-D 18:16:51 Oren_: aw c'mon, people have implemented functional programming languages entirely in the preprocessor 18:16:54 it's not *that* bad!! 18:17:20 Gregor: it's a horrible hack 18:17:27 IImade a sed scipr once that added a swap operator 18:17:29 it breaks layering 18:17:44 <> 18:17:49 x <> y 18:17:56 the C committee persists in adopting very poor solutions to their problems 18:18:10 becuase it is a commitee 18:18:36 * elliott looks for that thing gcc has that is kind of like gensym 18:18:38 Oren_: C++'s committee is waaaaaay more sane 18:18:40 at least I remember it having something along those lines 18:18:42 good languages are designed by one visionary or two, not 15 guys 18:19:01 although I guess that C++ is the exception that proves the rule 18:19:07 gcc has some magical builtins 18:19:07 — Built-in Function: void * __builtin_apply (void (*function)(), void *arguments, size_t size) 18:19:09 -!- Lorenzo64 has joined. 18:19:11 This built-in function invokes function with a copy of the parameters described by arguments and size. 18:19:18 Oren_: haskell is designed by committee 18:19:37 the Great Man theory has been obsolete for a while :p 18:20:44 i wish we'd go back to "visionary" meaning "hallucinating" 18:20:52 -!- Oren_ has left. 18:21:13 Bye, Oren_ 18:22:12 was that a ragequit, or... 18:23:41 of course it is maybe relevant that haskell was designed by committee /after/ said committee had separately made a bunch of languages similar to Haskell that they wanted to unify 18:24:47 -!- tlewkow has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 18:26:12 [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * SuperJedi224 * New user account 18:26:26 I was recently implementing an assembler (of sorts) for x86_64. 18:26:27 [wiki] [[User:SuperJedi224]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=41204 * SuperJedi224 * (+6) Created page with "Hello!" 18:26:43 x86_64 machine code is a true nightmare. 18:29:23 [wiki] [[GridScript]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=41205 * SuperJedi224 * (+655) Created page with "GridScript is an esoteric programming language designed by SuperJedi224. It is not yet implemented. ==Sample Programs== ===Hello World=== #Hello World. @width 4 @heigh 1 (1..." 18:30:27 the google doc calls # an "octothorpe" 18:30:31 imo make this the featured language 18:31:10 Of course it's an octothorpe. 18:31:28 That's the original(?)/best name for it. 18:31:44 i imagine originally it was called something like "what the hell is this" 18:31:51 anyway this looks like befunge 18:32:39 Bicyclidine: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Number_sign#Other_names_in_English <-- srsly, octothorpe is for real X-D 18:32:39 [wiki] [[GridScript]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41206&oldid=41205 * SuperJedi224 * (+91) /* Sample Programs */ 18:32:52 i know it's real 18:32:56 it's still hilarious 18:33:02 Fair 'nuff. 18:33:27 [wiki] [[Talk:GridScript]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=41207 * 71.222.118.42 * (+162) the pearl that lies in the sea hard by the loud-breathing serpent 18:33:49 nice edit summary 18:34:15 gonna just put completely random quotes in my edit summaries from now on 18:34:20 that's how i roll 18:34:42 my other edit summary was "hot singles in fungot's area" but that was nearly relevant, i'll have to be more careful 18:34:44 Bicyclidine: but t-rex, you can't play the game optimally! and assuming that in a man... or a woman, dromiceiomimus 18:34:44 -!- tlewkow has joined. 18:35:30 [wiki] [[GridScript]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41208&oldid=41206 * SuperJedi224 * (+0) 18:35:59 -!- tlewkow has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 18:36:31 [wiki] [[GridScript]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41209&oldid=41208 * SuperJedi224 * (+27) 18:36:56 [wiki] [[Language list]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41210&oldid=41120 * SuperJedi224 * (+17) /* G */ 18:37:57 I quite like the edit summary no https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=X%2B%2B&diff=prev&oldid=40155 18:38:00 I think I was very tired for that 18:38:03 *on 18:38:42 -!- Bicyclidine has quit (Quit: Lost terminal). 18:39:40 -!- tlewkow has joined. 18:40:06 -!- tlewkow has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 18:41:35 [wiki] [[GridScript]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41211&oldid=41209 * SuperJedi224 * (-1) /* Truth Machine */ 18:41:43 -!- Bicyclidine has joined. 18:42:25 fungot: qwantz eh? 18:42:25 FireFly: all that means is that if a building? tornadoes? ghost ships! ships sent sailing and found drifting weeks or months or so, with some stranger's fingers in my mouth was full of cans of frozen concentrated juice at the grocery store, i'd miss tasting the inside, there's real organs! 18:42:57 nice 18:43:04 eeh, if that's what you're into, fungot... 18:43:04 FireFly: a bush. so that raises a good point, t-rex? that would be good to have you for dinner, t-rex 18:43:48 fungot has weird taste 18:43:48 FireFly: but that makes things worse than ever! everybody is going to be a surprise 18:45:33 -!- tlewkow has joined. 18:50:01 Hooray for native support for imaginary numbers ... 18:55:18 -!- tlewkow has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 18:59:20 [wiki] [[GridScript]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41212&oldid=41211 * SuperJedi224 * (+659) /* Sample Programs */ 19:01:04 Hooray for good, logical argumentation at the Finnish Parliament regarding this citizen petition about allowing same-sex marriage: (paraphrasing) "It's not about equality. We don't have jurisdiction to change the laws of nature." 19:03:05 parliament learns about bird reproduction, institutes new "it's not cheating if they're more than 50 meters away" rule 19:04:35 "It's obvious that the change would be detrimental to children's rights." 19:04:51 Most of the opponents are playing the "but think of the children" card. 19:04:52 -!- Oren has joined. 19:06:08 man for all the good finnish things.. 19:06:49 (Adoption rights are one of the major things differentiating Finland's current "civil partnership" from marriage, that's why.) 19:10:20 The man I ordered a pizza from which never arrived this evening is apparently in the hospital with a neck injury sustained after someone struck him head on while he was delivering said pizza ... 19:10:40 ouch. 19:10:51 I hope the pizza was worth it 19:11:47 His brother just arrived with our pizzas and a free bottle of coke. 19:12:54 a free bottle of coke for getting your deliverer in hospital 19:13:06 tastes like malice 19:13:08 Yeah. It's pretty surreal. 19:13:26 I just hope he's OK. He's a really nice guy, and he makes the best kebab in town. 19:13:54 horrible strategy: pay people to hunt down and injure those delivering your pizza so you always get free stuff 19:13:57 My wife had to take the call, and she didn't have the heart to ask for a refund. 19:14:09 neck injuries sound unpleasant 19:16:10 http://isometri.cc/strips/this_is_neck_crick/ yes 19:22:43 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 19:28:01 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 19:34:36 -!- Dulnes has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 19:47:47 -!- nooga has joined. 19:51:13 -!- ais523 has joined. 19:55:13 -!- Oren has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 20:03:08 -!- Patashu has joined. 20:07:51 -!- Oren has joined. 20:22:05 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 20:22:15 [wiki] [[GridScript]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41213&oldid=41212 * SuperJedi224 * (+241) 20:22:27 ais523: in case you missed it, the ioccc winners' name is out: http://www.de.ioccc.org/2014/whowon.html 20:22:45 also the Underhanded C contest is open: http://underhanded.xcott.com/ 20:22:56 b_jonas: I noticed both, but thanks for the reminder 20:24:22 -!- Lorenzo64 has quit (Quit: Leaving). 20:25:53 -!- Patashu has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 20:31:03 -!- callforjudgement has joined. 20:31:18 -!- Bicyclidine has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 20:31:30 -!- ais523 has quit (Disconnected by services). 20:31:32 -!- callforjudgement has changed nick to ais523. 20:32:36 -!- Bicyclidine has joined. 20:46:52 [wiki] [[GridScript]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41214&oldid=41213 * SuperJedi224 * (+468) 20:50:28 [wiki] [[GridScript]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41215&oldid=41214 * SuperJedi224 * (+38) /* Fibonacci Sequence */ 20:55:18 -!- tlewkow has joined. 21:01:54 -!- tlewkow has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:02:20 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 21:12:44 -!- hjulle has joined. 21:22:31 -!- tlewkow has joined. 21:34:31 -!- nisstyre has quit (Changing host). 21:34:31 -!- nisstyre has joined. 21:43:54 -!- nys has quit (Quit: quit). 21:53:40 -!- shikhout has joined. 21:54:55 -!- Oren has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 21:55:50 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:56:53 -!- shikhin has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 21:56:56 -!- Oren has joined. 22:02:17 -!- ais523 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 22:02:31 -!- ais523 has joined. 22:02:35 -!- GeekDude has joined. 22:02:51 -!- tlewkow has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 22:03:49 -!- tlewkow has joined. 22:16:09 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds). 22:26:04 does anyone know how long catching a SIGSEGV usually takes 22:26:20 (from the invalid access to getting your SIGSEGV handler called) 22:26:22 -!- callforjudgement has joined. 22:26:22 on linux, say 22:27:12 -!- ais523 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 22:27:34 -!- callforjudgement has changed nick to ais523. 22:33:58 depends greatly on OS and I think that is the kind of thing that would depend on processor model 22:34:12 some processors can't even detect it... 22:35:32 okay, yes, x86-64 linux 22:35:46 "modern x86 unix", I'm only looking for a rough estimate really 22:36:33 I sort of suspect that using this to detect running out of a bump-allocator memory pool is a lot worse than just adding a branch to allocation unless running out is extremely rare, but I'm curious 22:37:12 So then it depends on what the linux kernel does on interrupt vector number 13 22:38:02 me, i use synthesis os, so i get forty thousand interrupts per second and it works, 22:49:32 -!- oerjan has joined. 22:51:58 -!- dts has changed nick to dts|feasting. 22:53:17 -!- ais523 has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 22:53:43 -!- ais523 has joined. 22:59:04 -!- Oren has quit (Quit: Page closed). 23:04:20 -!- mhi^ has joined. 23:15:28 -!- nooga has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 23:16:06 -!- S1 has joined. 23:17:23 -!- nooga has joined. 23:18:13 -!- S1 has quit (Client Quit). 23:20:48 -!- Froox has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 23:21:06 -!- Froox has joined. 23:32:30 -!- ais523 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 23:32:41 -!- ais523 has joined. 23:34:02 @tell mroman which is usually suffixed with (embed) <-- if you want people to follow conventions you should actually state them on the website hth 23:34:02 Consider it noted. 23:34:17 elliott: I have the vaguest feeling I actually tested the "trap sigsegv and fake 0" Befunge stack against a regular "test on every pop" stack, and... well, I think the signal handling was "pretty fast" in an absolute sense, but still of course orders of magnitude slower than a single test. (On the other hand, many Befunge programs never pop from an empty stack at all.) 23:34:55 I'm sure people have benchmarked Linux signal delivery overhead, though, which I'd guesstimate is the larger component, compared to the hardware side. 23:35:02 fizzie: I'm wondering about it for, e.g., knowing when you're out of copying GC heap. 23:35:17 I think collections in a generational collector are probably too frequent for it to pay off. 23:37:25 how many befunge programs test the depth of stack? 23:38:07 it might be easier to have a sizeable buffer of zeros preallocated 23:38:07 I imagine even if programs do pop an empty stack, they probably do it infrequently 23:38:17 -!- nooga has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 23:38:27 and have the depth test do a subtraction 23:39:50 then the sigsegv thing could bump that back up, causing a low average cost 23:42:02 there's that a* word i can never remember again 23:42:08 Amortized. 23:42:21 I wouldn't be surprised if Mycology was the only real program that actually checked stack depth. 23:42:46 `learn_append oerjan He can never remember the word "amortized" so he put it here for convenience. 23:42:48 Learned 'oerjan': Your evil overlord oerjan is a lazy expert in future computation. Also an antediluvian Norwegian who hates Roald Dahl. He can never remember the word "amortized" so he put it here for convenience. 23:43:18 now i just have to remember that i put it there should be easy 23:43:20 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 23:43:24 Hello 23:43:28 `? Taneb 23:43:29 Taneb is not elliott, no matter who you ask. He also isn't a rabbi although he has pretended in the past. He has at least two backup keyboards with dodgy SHIFT KEys, and five genders. (See also: tanebventions) 23:43:45 tuona serab 23:43:58 `learn Taneb is not elliott, no matter who you ask. He also isn't a rabbi although he has pretended in the past. He has at least two backup keyboards with dodgy SHIFT KEys, and cube root of five genders. (See also: tanebventions) 23:44:01 Learned 'taneb': Taneb is not elliott, no matter who you ask. He also isn't a rabbi although he has pretended in the past. He has at least two backup keyboards with dodgy SHIFT KEys, and cube root of five genders. (See also: tanebventions) 23:44:23 > 5 ** (1/3) 23:44:25 1.7099759466766968 23:44:33 Sounds about right 23:45:47 > log 2 23:45:49 0.6931471805599453 23:46:15 hm... 23:47:03 wait i thought i'd memorized that as 0.701something 23:47:10 > sqrt 2 23:47:11 1.4142135623730951 23:47:16 > 1/sqrt 2 23:47:17 0.7071067811865475 23:47:45 > 1.01**100 23:47:47 2.7048138294215285 23:47:57 hm no 23:48:01 There is sooomething that begins like that 23:48:10 oh that's approximately e of course 23:48:16 > exp (- 1) 23:48:17 0.36787944117144233 23:48:45 oh well my logarithms in the head are rarely more accurate than 0.7 anyway 23:49:00 > log 10 23:49:02 2.302585092994046 23:49:24 My brother passed his driving test today :) 23:49:48 > 1.1**10 23:49:49 2.5937424601000023 23:49:56 wait this is stupid 23:52:24 Taneb: congrats, ben 23:52:34 :) 23:52:43 He is 60% of my nick 23:52:49 that's what i remembered 23:53:55 > logBase 2 10 23:53:56 3.3219280948873626 23:54:01 > logBase 10 2 23:54:02 0.30102999566398114 23:54:11 hm maybe it's that 23:54:30 0.30103 should be easy to remember 23:55:28 Not as easy as 2.718281828 23:55:35 hm that might have a large continued fraction coefficient 23:55:41 "and so on" 23:56:00 how much faster is call compared to push + jmp? surprisingly google doesn't have an answer for this 23:56:08 interested in the corresponding answer for ret, also 23:56:19 > 1/logBase 10 2 23:56:20 3.321928094887363 23:56:33 > 1/(1/logBase 10 2-3) 23:56:34 3.1062837195053827 23:56:46 > 1/(1/(1/logBase 10 2-3)-3) 23:56:48 9.408778735386232 23:56:59 > 1/(1/(1/(1/logBase 10 2-3)-3)-9) 23:57:00 2.4463112031871153 23:57:13 > 1/(1/(1/(1/(1/logBase 10 2-3)-3)-9)-2) 23:57:15 2.2405890617555295 23:57:38 maybe it doesn't really show up as that. well 9 is fairly large. 23:57:48 > 1/(pi-3) 23:57:49 7.062513305931052 23:57:54 > 1/(1/(pi-3)-7) 23:57:55 15.996594406684103 23:58:05 > 1/(1/(1/(pi-3)-7)-15) 23:58:06 1.0034172310150002 23:58:41 1%(1/16+7)+3 23:58:41 [ 1 23:58:42 FireFly: 1 23:58:45 > 1%(1/16+7)+3 23:58:47 No instance for (GHC.Show.Show a0) 23:58:47 arising from a use of ‘M57241604867522287715068.show_M57241604867522287715... 23:58:47 The type variable ‘a0’ is ambiguous 23:58:47 Note: there are several potential instances: 23:58:47 instance [safe] GHC.Show.Show 23:58:51 oops 23:58:57 > 1/(1%16+7)+3 23:58:58 355 % 113 23:59:04 [ (1 %@| ]) 10^.2 23:59:04 FireFly: 3.32193 23:59:16 [ <. (1 %@| ])^:(<20) 10^.2 23:59:16 FireFly: 0 3 3 9 2 2 4 6 2 1 1 3 1 18 1 6 1 7 1 1 23:59:34 NB. hth