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00:31:42 <Sgeo> I wonder if I can get kmc into Rebol...
00:32:16 <Sgeo> I think there may be some similarities to Kernel... although I don't quite understand bindology well enough
00:32:42 <Sgeo> ('Bindology' being Rebol's fancy term for how binding works)
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01:33:38 <zzo38> One limitation in SQLite is that extensions cannot add new commands entirely.
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01:36:02 <zzo38> Maybe it is not such a problem, although it would be nice to be able to create macros.
01:42:48 <elliott> does anyone here put their browser cache in /tmp
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02:16:42 <elliott> mmm the bfq io scheduler seems nice
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02:49:08 <Sgeo_> `run main = print $ let 2 + 2 = 5 in 2 + 2
02:49:13 <HackEgo> bash: main: command not found
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04:01:06 <Sgeo_> I was checking that my code was correct. Was trying to show that in a Rebol chatroom that has a bot that connects to ideone
04:01:28 <FreeFull> > let (+) = (Prelude.+) . succ in 2 + 2
04:02:25 <FreeFull> Wait, I don't know why that works
04:05:50 <Sgeo_> "Animation style, alternative to animated GIFs (see sample - works in Internet Explorer with plugin; also see tile-test)"
04:06:18 <Sgeo_> Yes, we should all install a REBOL plugin into our browsers to see animated graphics.
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04:09:54 <shachaf> mnoqy: i hugged kmc today "ur next" hth
04:10:21 <shachaf> (Except for the whole part where you don't want hugs? So I guess not.)
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04:15:20 <Lymia> Is this, like, a Lisp that actually uses M-expressions!?
04:16:06 <Sgeo_> I don't know what M-expressions were actually like, but I'm going to say probably not
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04:18:35 <Lymia> Precedence for bare-word operators...
04:19:30 <Lymia> This looks to be... a language that probably has very messy semantics.
04:22:42 <Sgeo_> Some things are messy, but I think some things are nice
04:32:33 <mnoqy> is that "sgeo wisdom"
04:32:41 <mnoqy> Sgeo_: can I have more "sgeo wisdom"
04:36:50 <Sgeo_> random/only ["yes" "no"]
04:49:25 <lambdabot> *Exception: show: No overloading for function
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05:00:17 <FreeFull> > ((,) . succ $ 1 1) :: (Int, Int)
05:00:18 <lambdabot> Couldn't match expected type `(GHC.Types.Int, GHC.Types.Int)'
05:00:51 <FreeFull> Wait, I think I know why it doesn't work >_<
05:02:42 <FreeFull> I guess I still don't know haskell
05:03:13 <lambdabot> The function `(,)' is applied to three arguments,
05:04:05 <lambdabot> (Enum (a -> a), Num a) => a -> a -> a
05:05:52 <FreeFull> Yeah, of course that doesn't make sense
05:06:38 <Bike> what are you trying to do exactly
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05:36:01 <Sgeo_> If no one wrote an irc:// scheme for REBOL, maybe I should
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09:31:07 <fizzie> Vorpal: Speaking of high-resolution monitors, Asus has just announced a 31.5" 3840x2160 (aka "4K") computer monitor -- that's 140 dpi, even if it's kind of overly big for many desktops. (Also it's probably going to cost a lot.)
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12:23:14 <Sgeo_> So, this spam claiming to be from FedEx has a subject line FedEx!!!
12:23:28 <Sgeo_> It's as though FedEx is really excited about itself
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13:42:01 <fizzie> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/113389132/Misc/20130601-electricity-is-fun.png
13:52:11 <fizzie> (It's what they have in Denmark, I understand.)
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14:02:03 <ion> FedExcited
14:09:23 <Sgeo_> I should watch Monty Python and the Holy Grail
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14:22:49 <oerjan> happy duplicate australian mailman list reminder day
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14:24:50 <Sgeo_> http://i.imgur.com/PL8ricO.jpg
14:25:21 <elliott> oerjan: huh, I got no australian reminders. just actual reminders.
14:26:29 <oerjan> wait, agora-* aren't australian?
14:27:06 <oerjan> hm i guess it doesn't count if they're dated june 1
14:27:07 <elliott> oerjan: oh well sure. but it's not an australian reminder unless it comes a day early.
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14:27:19 <elliott> I wonder why the australian list stopped sending reminders
14:27:26 <oerjan> ok then. but you also got a duplicate?
14:27:43 <elliott> or if I did then gmail lost the other
14:28:31 <oerjan> i didn't get one from yoyo, but i got one from yzma.clarkk.net and one from agoranomic.org, with the same named lists but in different order.
14:29:06 <oerjan> the lists themselves were @agoranomic.org in both cases.
14:30:30 <elliott> oerjan: ah. presumably because the lists moved recently
14:30:48 <oerjan> also, my back hurts with my laptop sitting on the sofa table :(
14:31:08 <elliott> laptop tip: there is no comfortable way to use a laptop
14:31:49 <oerjan> ...it worked well enough when sitting on the table of my old apartment, which was essentially a workbench
14:32:10 <oerjan> and of comfortable height with an ordinary chair
14:32:30 <elliott> have you tried putting it on your lap hth
14:32:50 <oerjan> yes. yesterday it got too hot for that, but i guess it hasn't warmed up yet.
14:33:38 <oerjan> oh and i think i'll have to wait until i've finished my breakfast.
14:34:21 <oerjan> anyway, i hope my initial hate for all the little annoying details of my new apartment subsides soon.
14:35:10 <oerjan> it of course does have that one huge pro: no housemates!
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14:35:19 <elliott> hey i was just about to ask about those.
14:36:31 <oerjan> otoh there's still construction work in the area, the fridge is (still) noisy, and some neighbor apparently has a dog.
14:38:07 <elliott> is this the same fridge, or do you have a fridge ghost haunting you
14:38:19 <oerjan> fridge ghost, clearly.
14:38:40 <oerjan> i am clearly having some kind of mystical attraction to noise hth
14:41:33 <oerjan> it's called "the law of attraction" in mystical circles. it says that you attract things you are passionate about, whether positively or negatively. at least i hope it includes positively as well.
14:42:58 <elliott> what if you are passionate about not being attracted?
14:43:28 <oerjan> then you're james randi and ruin the experience for everyone else hth
14:44:21 <oerjan> also, that's the obvious reason why science cannot prove this law hth (yes, i know of the other obvious reason)
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14:48:32 <oerjan> hexham attracts hexham
14:57:27 <oerjan> elliott: you may be delighted to know that yesterday IE got so t(h)rashy on my usual newspaper comic site that i actually installed google chrome. you may not be delighted that it didn't really help, and that the site itself is so trashy that many of the links (randomly) didn't work in chrome.
14:59:49 <oerjan> not that they _always_ work in IE either. especially the "like" button sometimes hangs up.
15:01:32 <elliott> oerjan: today chrome, tomorrow netbsd on toasters.
15:01:54 <oerjan> alas i don't have a toaster.
15:02:09 <elliott> yes, you know it's really bad when you start buying them just to run netbsd on them.
15:02:28 <elliott> ...you have a kettle right? i understand americans don't have the kinds of kettles we have and this disturbs me
15:02:53 <Taneb> My monitor keeps turning off and on
15:03:02 <oerjan> yes but i never use it and also haven't moved it over from the old apartment yet.
15:03:21 <elliott> you know what's great? toasters. highly recommended
15:03:44 <Sgeo_> I remember having the kettle discussion before. As far as I'm aware, a kettle is a thing that whistles when water is boiling
15:04:12 <Taneb> Sgeo_, those exists, but so do electric kettles
15:04:19 <Taneb> Which just turn themselves off
15:04:21 <oerjan> technically there may be a toaster in my store of things from the old house which i cannot bear even thinking about and don't you start like my dad who is purely by chance coming here tomorrow
15:04:57 <Sgeo_> Taneb, but how will you know when your water is done boiling?
15:04:57 <elliott> ...your dad is a fan of toasters?
15:05:09 <Taneb> Sgeo_, it sort of clicks
15:05:11 <oerjan> wait, it has to whistle? then i probably don't have one.
15:05:13 <Taneb> And a light goes off
15:05:18 <elliott> no it doesn't have to whistle
15:05:21 <elliott> if it whistles you have the wrong kind
15:05:28 <oerjan> it is generally kettle-shaped, though.
15:05:43 <elliott> the right kind is nice and reassuring and is part of the elite group of appliances that have soft power cords.
15:07:00 <oerjan> finest alumin(i)um, i suspect, which is why it wasn't brought over because somehow there was an impression the new apartment had an induction stove but it doesn't anyhow.
15:09:45 <elliott> it should be finest plastic
15:10:00 <elliott> i fear only Taneb truly understands kettles here
15:10:22 <Sgeo_> Wait, you can actually afford aluminum stuff? Isn't that insanely expensive?
15:11:13 <Taneb> elliott, one of my friends has the wrong kind, but he also has an AGA cooker so it is okay
15:11:24 <elliott> Taneb: i'm busy trying to understand Sgeo_'s statement
15:11:26 * Sgeo_ was vaguely trying to pretend to be from the past
15:11:52 <Taneb> elliott, it was addressed at oerjan
15:12:43 <Sgeo_> http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/elements/features/2010/blogging_the_periodic_table/aluminum_it_used_to_be_more_precious_than_gold.html etc etc
15:14:50 <oerjan> elliott: i don't think my dad uses toasters much.
15:15:18 <Taneb> elliott, can you help me learn Agda
15:15:57 <oerjan> Taneb: just put types everywhere, and values in the types hth
15:17:30 <oerjan> i do recall something about napoleon (I or III?) getting awesome aluminum plates
15:18:50 <Sgeo_> Article said that Napoleon III gave aluminum cutlery for guests, with gold cutlery being the lesser cutlery
15:19:03 <Sgeo_> " and the minor emperor Napoleon III reserved a prized set of aluminum cutlery for special guests at banquets. (Less favored guests used gold knives and forks.) "
15:19:15 <Sgeo_> There. I should do that instead of trying to rephrase
15:20:46 <oerjan> napoleon iii was quite a guy.
15:23:41 <Phantom_Hoover> Sgeo_, fun fact, in dwarf fortress aluminium is as valuable as platinum
15:24:36 <Phantom_Hoover> (doesn't aluminium look kind of drab when used for cutlery?)
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15:27:37 <oerjan> ""Above all, people adored Element 13's color and luster, which reminded them of the sparkle of gold and silver—a brand-new precious metal."
15:27:48 <oerjan> which means "no", i think.
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15:29:29 <Phantom_Hoover> maybe it's some modern surfacing thing they do that makes it look dull grey rather than actually shiny
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15:33:35 <oerjan> i was going to click the vanadium article, but it opens in a new window even with ctrl
15:34:04 <oerjan> which is of course a deadly sin (while opening in a new window without ctrl is only a grievous one.)
15:34:04 <Phantom_Hoover> i love vanadium because i can never remember anything whatsoever of interest about it
15:34:16 <Sgeo_> Try right-click and open in new tab?
15:34:21 <oerjan> which is pretty much why i wanted to click on it
15:34:55 <oerjan> Sgeo_: there's not actually a real link, it's flash
15:35:12 <elliott> gold cutlery seems kind of tacky
15:35:43 <Sgeo_> Oh, I didn't even notice the little period table. Have Flash set to click-to-play
15:36:34 * oerjan finds a proper link to it
15:37:05 <oerjan> little houses on the hillside, little houses made of gold
15:37:59 <oerjan> when the sea squirts have enough, we're doomed
15:40:35 <oerjan> but beware of the sea squirt vampires
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17:14:33 <Sgeo_> The Court Jester or Monty Python and the Holy Grail?
17:17:23 <fizzie> Monty Court and the Holy Jester.
17:17:45 <fizzie> That's when you set up your 3D system so that you get one movie on left eye and the other on right.
17:18:33 <shachaf> Sgeo_: The Court Jester hth
17:19:06 <shachaf> Bike: should i watch _Singin' in the Rain_
17:23:41 <shachaf> do you just answer yes to everything..............!
17:27:07 <shachaf> well then i guess i shouldn nt take movie adviçe from you!!
17:29:00 <fizzie> fungot: Movie adviçe please.
17:29:01 <fungot> fizzie: i've been somewhat frustrated on my first tries. i get this thing start installing, i'll come back to fnord
17:29:25 <oerjan> fungot: what about plan 9 from outer space?
17:29:26 <fungot> oerjan: i haven't tried it out in usenet for all to despise." with no bindings is valid.) comic 17 is fnord, young skywalker"
17:29:42 <oerjan> fungot: well usenet is almost dead anyway.
17:29:43 <fungot> oerjan: better still, haven't you got can't you make it ' x 3 works.
17:30:09 <shachaf> Bike: should i watch Real Fast Nora's Hair Salon 3: Shear Disaster Download
17:30:20 <Bike> No, Taneb should.
17:30:33 <shachaf> should i watch _Nora's Hair Salon_
17:31:24 <Bike> Refer to previous mesage.
17:32:56 <Sgeo_> I should make a comparison thing between Rebol and Kernel to try to convince kmc to look at it >.>
17:33:08 <Sgeo_> And maybe not mention it before I do so
17:34:21 <shachaf> Make sure it has affine types.
17:34:26 <nortti> damn, camino browser has ceased developmenr
17:36:11 <oerjan> shachaf: spoiler: nora dies
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17:40:22 <Sgeo_> Guy in Rebol chat is raving about SpaceChem as an educational tool
17:40:33 <Sgeo_> (raving in a good way)
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17:59:36 <nortti> sorry? I can't understand you
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18:26:55 <oerjan> ok they're all on that irccloud.com thing except surma
18:28:08 <HackEgo> not lately; try `seen ggherdov ever
18:28:16 <HackEgo> not lately; try `seen ggherdov ever
18:28:24 <HackEgo> 2013-03-31 20:12:10: <ggherdov> oerjan: thankyou!
18:28:42 <oerjan> i suppose they were collateral damage
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18:33:10 <oerjan> perhaps someone klined everyone matching uid*
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18:39:56 <Sgeo_> Saw this in another channel
18:39:57 <Sgeo_> http://thehathorlegacy.com/why-film-schools-teach-screenwriters-not-to-pass-the-bechdel-test/
18:40:02 <Sgeo_> Don't know how real that is
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18:48:52 <phamiltiz> Can this be made shorter in an esoteric lang?
18:49:13 <phamiltiz> Input: http://pastebin.com/uwbmWGSz
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18:51:19 <phamiltiz> My perl script produces this output: http://pastebin.com/pnpsUgu5
18:52:11 <phamiltiz> How short can it be made in any Lang? :D
18:55:29 <phamiltiz> 0 bytes would not achieve the goal
18:55:53 <phamiltiz> You need code in order to run something
18:56:20 <Bike> just have an interpreter that interprets an empty string to do whatever your script does.
18:56:27 <AnotherTest> it's a language in which the empty program is defined to do exactly what you want of course
18:56:39 <phamiltiz> The point is not to use my script at all
18:57:09 <phamiltiz> I want to see if it can be made shorter in an esoteric Lang
18:57:23 <oerjan> i think it could make it shorten in _perl_, anyhow
18:58:02 <AnotherTest> I think you mean "can it be made shorter in an esolang that also does other (possibly) useful stuff"
18:58:08 <phamiltiz> What Lang could you make it shortest
18:58:22 <AnotherTest> well the language suggested earlier of course
18:59:00 <AnotherTest> but I think the length of your program will depend more on /how/ you write the code in this situation
18:59:43 <phamiltiz> Well it must generate the same output
18:59:46 <oerjan> hm haskell could be short if we assumed that exact format
19:00:20 <Bike> phamiltiz: the one where the empty program does what the script does.
19:01:02 <AnotherTest> Well if you removed all of the redundant statements and white-space, and made all identifiers really short (and eliminated all redundant identifiers), it would be shorter
19:01:30 <AnotherTest> nvm what's in the parenthesis, not always/usually correct
19:02:31 <Bike> you can probably do that with unix tools in in a line or two of line noise, i imagine
19:03:07 <AnotherTest> Well if you want to golf you might use something like Burlesque I guess, great language for that
19:03:07 <oerjan> :t map (head &&& length) group . sort . catMaybes . map (stripPrefix "username:" . drop 2 . words) . lines
19:03:08 <lambdabot> Couldn't match expected type `b0 -> c0' with actual type `[b1]'
19:03:08 <lambdabot> In the return type of a call of `map'
19:03:08 <lambdabot> Probable cause: `map' is applied to too many arguments
19:03:31 <oerjan> :t map (stripPrefix "username:" . drop 2 . words) . lines
19:03:33 <lambdabot> Couldn't match expected type `Char' with actual type `String'
19:04:09 <Bike> phamiltiz: probably sed
19:04:41 <oerjan> :t map (stripPrefix "username:" . (!!2) . words) . lines
19:05:02 <oerjan> :t map (head &&& length) group . sort . catMaybes . map (stripPrefix "username:" . (!!2) . words) . lines
19:05:03 <lambdabot> Couldn't match expected type `b0 -> c0' with actual type `[b1]'
19:05:03 <lambdabot> In the return type of a call of `map'
19:05:03 <lambdabot> Probable cause: `map' is applied to too many arguments
19:05:47 <oerjan> :t catMaybes . map (stripPrefix "username:" . (!!2) . words) . lines
19:05:54 <oerjan> :t sort . catMaybes . map (stripPrefix "username:" . (!!2) . words) . lines
19:06:05 <oerjan> :t group . sort . catMaybes . map (stripPrefix "username:" . (!!2) . words) . lines
19:06:21 <oerjan> :t map (head &&& length) . group . sort . catMaybes . map (stripPrefix "username:" . (!!2) . words) . lines
19:06:49 <Bike> he's writing your script in haskell.
19:07:21 <phamiltiz> But how is he importing the input?
19:07:48 <oerjan> haven't got to that part yet
19:08:36 <oerjan> > map (head &&& length) . group . sort . catMaybes . map (stripPrefix "username:" . (!!2) . words) . lines $ "1.Vote (from:minestatus username:zsamkj address:174.1.** timeStamp:2012-04-30 20:10:51 -0700)\n2.Vote (from:minestatus username:revolutionxx2 address:50.129.** timeStamp:2012-04-30 20:11:02 -0700)"
19:08:37 <lambdabot> [("revolutionxx2",1),("zsamkj",1)]
19:09:43 <phamiltiz> The problem now would be to test all the 30 lines of input
19:10:00 <oerjan> well yes, can't get that into lambdabot easily
19:12:31 <oerjan> :t mapM_ putStrLn . map (\s -> head s ++ " occurs->" ++ show (length s)) (head &&& length) . group . sort . catMaybes . map (stripPrefix "username:" . (!!2) . words) . lines =<< getContents
19:12:32 <lambdabot> Couldn't match expected type `b0 -> [String]'
19:12:32 <lambdabot> In the return type of a call of `map'
19:12:48 <oerjan> :t mapM_ putStrLn . map (\s -> head s ++ " occurs->" ++ show (length s)) . group . sort . catMaybes . map (stripPrefix "username:" . (!!2) . words) . lines =<< getContents
19:15:22 <oerjan> gah cutting and pasting from irc isn't nice
19:16:29 <oerjan> i cannot manage to edit the form after pasting wrongly :(
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19:17:15 <oerjan> i assume it's because i'm on IE 8, oh well.
19:19:27 <oerjan> phamiltiz: the thing is pasting from irc doesn't get it correctly formatted and it wasn't a whole program anyway.
19:20:29 <phamiltiz> oerjan > map (head &&& length) . group . sort . catMaybes . map (stripPrefix "username:" . (!!2) . words) . lines $ "1.Vote (from:minestatus username:zsamkj address:174.1.** timeStamp:2012-04-30 20:10:51 -0700)\n2.Vote (from:minestatus username:revolutionxx2 address:50.129.** timeStamp:2012-04-30 20:11:02 -0700)"
19:20:55 <oerjan> ...we already tested that with lambdabot
19:21:31 <phamiltiz> What doesn't get formatted correctly?
19:21:43 -!- AnotherTest has left.
19:21:48 <phamiltiz> Because I sent you the input on pastebin?
19:22:35 <nooodl_> n%{' '/2=9>}%:x.|${0):0': '@.x\`{=}+,,' occurs->'\n}%
19:22:37 <Bike> why not download the raw paste to lambdabot and just run the haskell locally.
19:23:29 <oerjan> Bike: because lambdabot doesn't support downloading hth
19:23:39 <phamiltiz> No chance understanding that golf script
19:24:05 <Bike> oh, right, i meant hack ego.
19:24:11 <Bike> w/e they're all practically the same fucking bot
19:24:16 <nooodl_> i'll make an explanation thingy
19:25:05 <oerjan> phamiltiz: i managed to submit it but it's never finishing compiling
19:25:39 <oerjan> my guess is it has finished but my browser hasn't noticed
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19:27:20 <phamiltiz> nooodl_ how does your golf script take input?
19:27:38 <nooodl_> from stdin. there's no other way
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19:28:20 <oerjan> i have too many tabs open to close IE, and too little memory on this old laptop to open chrome (which, accidentally, i only installed yesterday)
19:28:49 <oerjan> however i have another way
19:29:19 <oerjan> `fetch http://oerjan.nvg.org/test.hs
19:29:25 <HackEgo> 2013-06-01 19:29:24 URL:http://oerjan.nvg.org/test.hs [200/200] -> "test.hs" [1]
19:29:30 <phamiltiz> Nooodl_ so how does your golf script work
19:29:37 <olsner> IE fails to close if you have too many tabs open?
19:29:44 <oerjan> `run ghc --make test.hs
19:29:49 <HackEgo> [1 of 1] Compiling Main ( test.hs, test.o ) \ \ test.hs:2:80: Not in scope: `group' \ \ test.hs:2:95: Not in scope: `catMaybes' \ \ test.hs:2:112: Not in scope: `stripPrefix'
19:30:13 <oerjan> olsner: no, but i don't want to reopen all of them afterwards.
19:30:24 <oerjan> no wonder it doesn't compile
19:30:44 <oerjan> `fetch http://oerjan.nvg.org/test.hs
19:30:47 <HackEgo> 2013-06-01 19:30:46 URL:http://oerjan.nvg.org/test.hs [213/213] -> "test.hs.1" [1]
19:31:07 <oerjan> `run ghc --make test.hs
19:31:09 <nooodl_> http://bpaste.net/raw/oBwty2rsVEjLEHxO4SGu/
19:31:10 <HackEgo> [1 of 1] Compiling Main ( test.hs, test.o ) \ \ test.hs:2:80: Not in scope: `group' \ \ test.hs:2:95: Not in scope: `catMaybes'
19:31:46 <oerjan> `fetch http://oerjan.nvg.org/test.hs
19:31:48 <HackEgo> 2013-06-01 19:31:47 URL:http://oerjan.nvg.org/test.hs [250/250] -> "test.hs" [1]
19:31:49 <oerjan> `run ghc --make test.hs
19:32:17 <HackEgo> [1 of 1] Compiling Main ( test.hs, test.o ) \ Linking test ...
19:32:21 <oerjan> this is the point where HackEgo dies, obvio... oh.
19:32:34 <nooodl_> in the final block i've just displayed the stack
19:33:22 <oerjan> goddamn you websites _no sane person_ wants links to open in a new window by default!
19:33:59 <oerjan> `fetch http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=uwbmWGSz
19:34:02 <HackEgo> 2013-06-01 19:34:00 URL:http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=uwbmWGSz [2916] -> "raw.php?i=uwbmWGSz" [1]
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19:34:10 <zzo38> oerjan: Especially if you make it the left button for same window and middle button for new window
19:34:28 <oerjan> `run ./test <'raw.php?i=uwbmWGSz'
19:34:30 <HackEgo> Anonymous occurs->2 \ Baglex occurs->1 \ M3thud occurs->1 \ Mitzuki_Tsukashi occurs->1 \ Mo_Digger occurs->1 \ Organtrail occurs->1 \ RiceKnight occurs->1 \ Ryan2823 occurs->1 \ VolitionEos occurs->1 \ XxDarkAngel_xX occurs->1 \ counto1 occurs->1 \ dude1576 occurs->1 \ hungoverfurball occurs->1 \ jamesus occurs->2 \ jonathanklarlund occurs->1 \ kua
19:34:44 <oerjan> phamiltiz: looks good :)
19:34:58 <nooodl_> `fetch http://www.golfscript.com/golfscript/golfscript.rb
19:35:00 <HackEgo> 2013-06-01 19:34:59 URL:http://www.golfscript.com/golfscript/golfscript.rb [8834/8834] -> "golfscript.rb" [1]
19:35:28 <nooodl_> `echo "n%{' '/2=9>}%:x.|${0):0': '@.x\`{=}+,,' occurs->'\n}%" > test.gs
19:35:30 <HackEgo> "n%{' '/2=9>}%:x.|${0):0': '@.x\`{=}+,,' occurs->'\n}%" > test.gs
19:35:47 <nooodl_> `run echo "n%{' '/2=9>}%:x.|${0):0': '@.x\`{=}+,,' occurs->'\n}%" > test.gs
19:35:49 <HackEgo> bash: n%{' '/2=9>}%:x.|${0):0': '@.x\`{=}+,,' occurs->'\n}%: bad substitution
19:36:17 <nooodl_> `fetch http://bpaste.net/raw/C76Falgtu390Rz4jmqW6/
19:36:19 <HackEgo> 2013-06-01 19:36:18 URL:http://bpaste.net/raw/C76Falgtu390Rz4jmqW6/ [53/53] -> "index.html" [1]
19:36:52 <nooodl_> `run ruby golfscript.rb index.html <'raw.php?i=uwbmWGSz'
19:36:54 <HackEgo> bash: ruby: command not found
19:37:10 <nooodl_> `run rm index.html golfscript.rb
19:37:57 <oerjan> anyway i declare this to have reached the "it's possible" step where mathematicians customarily go back to bed
19:39:02 <oerjan> or in my case, to the fridge hth
19:40:09 -!- sebbu2 has changed nick to sebbu.
19:42:22 <phamiltiz> J is a language for the mathematicians
19:44:40 <Bike> "Cognos · Bayesian Enhanced Strategic Trading · Fax Focus, Inc. · Hewlett Packard · Intel · Korea Telecom · Luen Thai · Maple Partners · Microsoft · Niagara Mohawk Power · Nikko Securities · Novell · Okada Denki Co. Ltd. · Pivotal Technologies · Syngenesis, Inc."
19:44:47 <Bike> one or more of those are possibly banks or bankoids
19:45:49 <olsner> those are all just categories in the functor of endobankoids
19:47:02 * itsy wonders how to contact Darkman
19:47:45 <Bike> the dark signal
19:49:27 <itsy> Obvious now you mention it. I've wasted so much time with the bat signal :-(
19:54:43 <oerjan> the problem with the dark signal is, it's dark hth
19:55:22 <oerjan> although ironically, bats can "see" it just fine.
19:56:44 <itsy> I assume Darkman can "see" it too?
19:57:00 <itsy> According to legend he was bitten by a bat.
19:57:16 <oerjan> if he's a bat. since batman is dark, it stands to reason darkman would be bat.
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20:40:59 <Bike> "OEvolve: OEvolve is an e-mail list for Objectivists and others interested in the proper application of evolutionary principles to diet, fitness, and health. Its purpose is to facilitate discussion about the practical sciences of cooking, nutrition, fitness, health, and more. " haha, what
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20:52:48 <Sgeo_> As long as they don't start applying 'evolutionary principles' to morality... oh wait
20:52:58 <pikhq_> Sigh, I *still* haven't found a good RSS reader.
20:53:40 <Sgeo_> I'm going to keep using Google Reader until the day it closes.
20:57:30 * itsy is still using Google Reader
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20:57:42 <itsy> I wonder if there's a decent RSS reader for Android
20:58:24 * pikhq_ checks to see if Liferea stopped sucking.
20:58:30 <pikhq_> And yeah, I'm using Google Reader too.
20:59:58 <pikhq_> Oh sweet, Liferea stopped sucking.
21:00:04 <shachaf> pikhq_: My father switched from Google Reader to Feedly.
21:00:09 <shachaf> pikhq_: He says it's good.
21:06:41 -!- itsy has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds).
21:08:47 <Taneb> If I ask for help learning Agda in #agda, will they be annoyed
21:08:57 <Sgeo_> I saw "Intel launches Haswell processors:"
21:09:02 <Sgeo_> And misread it as Haskell
21:09:06 <Taneb> Sgeo_, same, multiple times
21:09:36 <shachaf> Taneb: I imagine that you'll be much less annoying than some people who've asked for help before.
21:19:03 <oerjan> the haskell groundswell
21:20:13 <oerjan> Taneb already knows another language where you can be annoying in the type system
21:32:29 <shachaf> In Agda you can be annoying in the same way at every level.
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22:08:40 <itsy> Is there a better way to do this? var dt = new Date(); if (new Date(2013,5,3) <= dt && dt <= new Date(2013,5,6)) { ... stuff ... }
22:09:23 <oerjan> i smell an uninitialized date comparison hth
22:09:46 <Bike> i was guessing date without parameters gave you the present date
22:09:49 <itsy> Doesn't new Date() give today's date?
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22:11:46 <oerjan> although looking at the current date, i suspect if (false) would be an appropriate rephrasing hth >:)
22:13:00 <oerjan> (don't mind me, i don't know the language so i wouldn't know if it has a better idiom)
22:13:30 -!- carado has joined.
22:13:50 <oerjan> that is, i doubt there's a better way that works across all C-lookalikes.
22:13:51 <shachaf> oerjan: itsy is writing unit tests for his time machine hth
22:15:07 <itsy> At least Chrome no longer gets angry if I change the system date while it's open.
22:17:23 <itsy> This is better! var dt = new Date(); if (new Date(2013,5,3) < dt && dt < new Date(2013,5,7)) { ... stuff ... }
22:18:33 <itsy> (since the date object also stores the time)
22:19:01 <shachaf> Presumably those mean different things, in that case?
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22:19:52 <itsy> new Date(2013,5,6) sets the time to midnight in the new date object.
22:20:20 <itsy> new Date() get's today's date, including the time.
22:21:03 <shachaf> Right. Checking x <= 6 isn't the same as checking x < 7, when x can be 6.5.
22:21:04 <itsy> Comparing for equality also includes the time...
22:22:41 <itsy> I'm happy with it now :-) (Apart from Javascript's stupid 0 = January, 1 = February thing)
22:23:39 <Taneb> "But it was that same internet that directly led to his imprisonment a year ago next month." -- BBC News website
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22:31:40 <fizzie> 0-based month numbers have a long pedigree. (At least it doesn't do the 113 = year 2013 thing.)
22:34:49 -!- phamiltiz has quit (Remote host closed the connection).
22:35:12 <zzo38> ifMUD does make 113 if you are at year 2013.
22:37:09 <fizzie> Things that get implemented as thin things over the C/POSIX "struct tm" sometimes do.
22:37:31 <zzo38> I think ifMUD is written in Perl, though.
22:41:00 <fizzie> Perl localtime/gmtime elements "come straight out of the C `struct tm'" (perldoc -f localtime), too.
22:57:36 <lambdabot> cmccann says: I still kind of expect that the next standard will be haskell2017 or something, and all it will do is a minor change to lexical syntax of comments that fixes nothing but nevertheless
22:57:57 <shachaf> @where+ quoerjan @quote oerjan
22:58:05 <lambdabot> oerjan says: i only do impractical things
22:59:00 <oerjan> i think that's the only one
23:00:01 <lambdabot> oerjan says: i only do impractical things
23:00:03 <lambdabot> oerjan says: i only do impractical things
23:00:03 <lambdabot> oerjan says: so does this mean that a comonad is like a wildlife preserve on an island in a sea of nuclear waste?
23:00:06 <lambdabot> oerjan says: @. read run (\s -> s ++ show s) "@. read run (\\s -> s ++ show s) "
23:00:13 <lambdabot> oerjan says: @. read run (\s -> s ++ show s) "@. read run (\\s -> s ++ show s) "
23:00:25 <shachaf> @@ (@@ @where quoerjan) worries
23:00:36 <shachaf> @@ @@ (@where quoerjan) worries
23:00:37 <lambdabot> oerjan says: 'N' :( 'o' :) " worries"
23:03:28 <Bike> http://static1.businessinsider.com/image/51a8edc369bedd1f5600000a-780-586/screen%20shot%202013-05-31%20at%202.36.05%20pm.png nasty
23:04:44 <lambdabot> monochrom says: no, you're thinking imperatively. when thinking functionally, you just worry one element, and let recursion worry the rest
23:04:45 <lambdabot> monochrom says: "mechanical layout" means the robot had to know this layout in order to mechanically enter stuff through the keyboard. "but why through the keyboard, why not through USB?" you ask.
23:04:45 <lambdabot> well, 20 years ago, there was no USB, and overall robot-to-computer interfaces were pretty crude, full of mechanical layouts"mechanical layout" means the robot had to know this layout in order to
23:04:45 <lambdabot> monochrom says: no, you're thinking imperatively. when thinking functionally, you just worry one element, and let recursion worry the rest
23:04:46 <lambdabot> monochrom says: the selfish program's motive is to fool the programmer
23:06:52 <kmc> well motorola finally invented the edible password: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/05/31/motorola_tattoo_pill_authentication/
23:08:08 <Bike> kmc: http://static1.businessinsider.com/image/51a8edc369bedd1f5600000a-780-586/screen%20shot%202013-05-31%20at%202.36.05%20pm.png cool industry huh
23:09:00 <shachaf> kmc: i realized today that the thing you would work on at mozilla is a web application
23:09:11 <kmc> shachaf: lol
23:09:28 <kmc> browsers are considered systems programming now, get w/ the times
23:09:38 <shachaf> the webbiest web application of all
23:10:09 <kmc> http://nationaldayofhacking.info/
23:11:00 <shachaf> http://www.paloaltoonline.com/news/show_story.php?id=29818
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23:15:25 <kmc> shachaf: wow
23:15:39 <kmc> palo alt. toon line
23:16:00 <kmc> The city will also set up a "Tech Farmers Market," where instead of farm-to-table goods, there will be ideas-to-minds concepts.
23:17:34 -!- Phantom__Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds).
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23:22:48 -!- kmc has set topic: Ideas-to-minds concepts | http://underhanded.xcott.com/?page_id=5 | http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric | There exist Turing machines that halt in some models of ZFC, but not others..
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23:38:27 <oerjan> i was wondering about what it was in http://stackoverflow.com/a/16552361
23:39:31 <oerjan> oh hm it's probably \((x,y),z) -> (x,(y,z))
23:39:56 <shachaf> I've seen that called that before.
23:40:28 <oerjan> zzo38: i think that way of formulating Reader and Writer (co)monads might interest you
23:40:40 <oerjan> maybe it works for more categories
23:41:56 <oerjan> @tell zzo38 Interesting formulation of Reader and Writer (co)monads in http://stackoverflow.com/a/16552361
23:43:16 <oerjan> zzo38: let's hope nobody else had sent you messages
23:44:48 <zzo38> I do know about that kind of reader/writer monads and the related comonads which use the other datatype, called env and trace.
23:45:14 <oerjan> zzo38: i was more pointing at the use of comonoid"
23:46:43 <nooodl_> "--that is because CCCs are boring!" what's a CCC
23:46:55 <oerjan> cartesian closed category, i think
23:47:15 <shachaf> either that or cocartesian coclosed cocategory....................
23:47:31 <Bike> is coclosedness openness
23:47:48 <shachaf> is coclopenness clopenness
23:47:55 <shachaf> also is that the most awkward word to spell of all words
23:48:04 <zzo38> Well, yes you get that "CoMonoid" automatically and that is one way to do it, although you don't need.
23:48:19 <nooodl_> is a cocartesian product a cartesian coproduct
23:48:29 <oerjan> basically a category where Hom(A,B) is also an object, and you can do function applicationy things
23:49:17 <oerjan> zzo38: i was thinking that maybe it meant you could define the (co)monads more generally than in a ccc if you had comonoids
23:49:39 <kmc> also can somebody explain the last part of the topic to me
23:50:26 <zzo38> oerjan: Maybe; I don't know.
23:50:27 <oerjan> nooodl_: more or less. there might be something fishy about bottoms in there.
23:50:57 <Bike> I swear I read an explanation about models as pertains to computability theory once
23:51:03 <nooodl_> is () the terminal object in Hask
23:51:27 <Bike> it's actually (17,"Hello Wrold") but that's a common misconception
23:51:32 <oerjan> <shachaf> is coclopenness clopenness <-- imo yes
23:51:54 <nooodl_> Bike: that's not an object in Hask!!!
23:52:13 <Bike> your mom isn't an object in hask
23:52:42 <oerjan> i suppose lack of terminal objects is one thing that breaks ccc
23:52:47 <Bike> kmc: maybe you could have a model where the sum of all integers exist, and then have a turing machine that sums all integers. i dunno
23:52:53 <oerjan> i think it needs products too
23:53:26 <oerjan> Bike: it's more subtle than that
23:53:34 <nooodl_> http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Hask#Hask_is_not_Cartesian_closed ew
23:53:55 <Bike> oerjan: thinking is hard
23:54:01 <zzo38> (->) has 0 as an initial object and () as final object. Therefore you can make the corresponding comonad/monad too. You also have a tensor category because it is (***). Actual programs in Haskell aren't so ideal, due to various reasons.
23:55:51 <oerjan> kmc: the halting problem means there are TMs which zfc cannot prove whether they halt or not; by godel's completeness theorem there are ZFC models in which each are true statements.
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23:58:37 <oerjan> kmc: afaik that's both what i thought from before and what was recently discussed in the channel
23:59:23 <oerjan> although the channel discussions seemed to devolve into confusion about the meaning of truth and proof in this case