< 1363305601 443564 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there are a lot of episodes that do their own take on some TV sci-fi cliche
< 1363305631 520241 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who was the character in SG-1 who a similar thing happened to?
< 1363305643 642849 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was it the character that this same actor played?
< 1363305682 383623 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you seem to be under the impression i've watched sg-1
< 1363305686 16022 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh
< 1363305698 656483 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why's the kind of (->) have question marks in it?
< 1363305801 430597 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :λ> :k (->)
< 1363305801 620623 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(->) :: * -> * -> *
< 1363305825 736672 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: In older versions of GHC it was a thing related to unboxed types and such.
< 1363305838 196277 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can pretend it's * -> * -> *
< 1363305851 108918 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, just checking.
< 1363305860 124580 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, (iirc the next episode is A Good One)
< 1363305868 905573 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also the one after that is definitely a good one_
< 1363305875 849587 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then there's another good one two after that
< 1363305918 635908 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, does this mean to imply that there are episodes that aren't good?
< 1363305927 271255 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::k (-> Int) -- parse error?
< 1363305929 44013 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :parse error on input `Int'
< 1363305929 689732 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there bad episodes?
< 1363305948 756512 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well uh
< 1363305958 546494 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't watch episode 14
< 1363305974 326197 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :imo do watch episode 14 and compare it negatively to PMMM
< 1363305977 382344 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: Yes, you can't section (->)
< 1363305992 567616 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact you can't section any type-level things.
< 1363305993 644839 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike, you are the worst?
< 1363305995 71819 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: why not? I mean, :k ((->) Int) works.
< 1363306005 73308 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: ((->) Int) is (Int ->), first of all.
< 1363306008 182658 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes.
< 1363306018 645806 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, (Int ->) doesn't work either.
< 1363306022 597069 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would be nice if the syntax (Int ->) worked. Maybe 4someone should add it.
< 1363306036 11058 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(4someone = you)
< 1363306044 871940 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's just a little sugar thing, though.
< 1363306054 622121 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :'coure.
< 1363306055 352447 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sections don't make as much sense on the type level because there are no type lambdas.
< 1363306056 524646 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :course*
< 1363306073 593382 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I.e. (-> Int) doesn't make sense, because there's nothing reasonable you can translate it to.
< 1363306077 164931 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, and I suppose I can't do flip (->) Int to get (-> Int).
< 1363306125 3033 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right.
< 1363306305 672888 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think something's gone funny with my video playback
< 1363306324 698000 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes sections repeat
< 1363306347 209783 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or... hmm, not sure
< 1363306438 547595 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :After this episode going to work on blog post.
< 1363306497 658083 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goddammit Hulu, clicking the side != restart video
< 1363306569 471572 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it's more time shenanigans???
< 1363306854 611905 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hulu's been acting up
< 1363307049 855211 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363307350 41408 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363307413 444716 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :sup
< 1363307759 69585 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm stumbling on something for my small VM for video games
< 1363307785 773417 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :needs a jit obviously
< 1363307788 641555 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some types of gfx effects will be kinda slow
< 1363307801 236965 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :alpha blending in particular
< 1363307820 104736 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I don't even wanna think about bilinear interpolation
< 1363307922 38656 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :bilinear interpolation is just, like, a horizontal filter then a filter filter, right?
< 1363307928 359297 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's only two taps so it shouldn't be that atrocious
< 1363307983 404854 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's for like, whole images, you could probably use an existing library even :o
< 1363308068 748843 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :bilinear interpolation murders most CPUs actually
< 1363308071 178512 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like
< 1363308075 334771 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :4 reads instead of 1
< 1363308101 271215 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then interpolation across 3 or 4 color channels (RGB or RGBA)
< 1363308131 265859 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think you have to do any more reads... 
< 1363308149 685109 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, like, if you need to bilinearly interpolate a 16x16 region, you only need a 17x17 region as input, I think?
< 1363308164 435605 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what you're describing is a filter, not bilinear
< 1363308166 339114 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey haskellites, what is fail for
< 1363308177 133071 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems like an odd thing to have in Monad
< 1363308186 455387 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but... a bilinear interpolator is just an H filter and a V filter unless it's not separable...
< 1363308189 753019 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :right...?
< 1363308221 396766 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fiora : if your polygon is not rotated and your scaling factor is integer then you can do it that way yes
< 1363308235 951954 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :scaling factor is integer?
< 1363308246 32200 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah like you're scaling 2x or 3x or 4x
< 1363308249 643308 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not 2.2352x
< 1363308257 947296 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think that's required, I think the good algorithms can do it even when it's fractional
< 1363308261 100189 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, lemme test
< 1363308277 819264 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's fractionnal then you get a branch in the middle of the algo I think
< 1363308312 929840 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think swscale has a thing where it JITs a horizontal scaler for your given scaling percentage, I have no idea how it works though
< 1363308316 530087 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :not very expensive when your pipeline is super short but on more modern architectures you get the branch penalty half the time
< 1363308346 468704 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fiora: yeah exactly
< 1363308380 825514 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :once you add rotation the whole thing falls apart
< 1363308397 266304 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you have to do 4 real pixel reads and then interpolate the values
< 1363308401 913569 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :rotation is icky :<
< 1363308436 813726 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: fail is for pattern match failure
< 1363308445 551934 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :> do { Just x <- return Nothing; return x }
< 1363308447 39444 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :  No instance for (GHC.Show.Show (m0 b0))
< 1363308447 190720 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :   arising from a use of `M91964446...
< 1363308457 487401 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :> do { Just x <- return Nothing; return x } :: [Int]
< 1363308458 961779 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :  []
< 1363308477 956694 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok not the most illustrative example
< 1363308484 400970 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :do { Just x <- return Nothing; return x } :: Maybe Int
< 1363308489 683283 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :er.
< 1363308491 425934 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> do { Just x <- return Nothing; return x } :: Maybe Int
< 1363308493 199137 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :  Nothing
< 1363308494 370959 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway the thing to the left of <- can be a pattern; if it fails to match, 'fail' is invoked
< 1363308509 179962 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :imo 'fail' shouldn't be in Monad but in some MonadFail class which is additionall required if you use refutable patterns in 'd'
< 1363308509 705219 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :with what?
< 1363308512 236030 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :'do'*
< 1363308526 66029 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rigel's an idiot (I'm still watching episode)
< 1363308526 612183 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :with some compiler-specific description of the pattern match failure
< 1363308536 131708 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :good error detection
< 1363308547 751078 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :> do { Just x <- return Nothing; return x } :: State Int Int
< 1363308549 385787 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :  No instance for (GHC.Show.Show
< 1363308549 546000 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :                    (Control.Monad.Trans.Sta...
< 1363308556 938928 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fail "foo" :: IO Int
< 1363308557 457313 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :> execState (do { Just x <- return Nothing; return x } :: State Int Int)
< 1363308558 785750 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :  No instance for (GHC.Show.Show (GHC.Types.IO GHC.Types.Int))
< 1363308558 949737 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :   arising fro...
< 1363308559 112297 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :  can't find file: L.hs
< 1363308563 701837 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :for fuck's sake
< 1363308569 224241 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :L.hs is my favorite file
< 1363308574 887691 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, the point i'm /trying/ to make is that a lot of monads don't have anything sensible to do with 'fail'
< 1363308581 280574 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's why i'm asking
< 1363308586 814373 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :only some monads represent error handling / alternatives / nondeterminism
< 1363308595 196104 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :like fail "foo" :: [whatever] being [] is... odd
< 1363308597 470915 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even then, you might not want to allow silent pattern match failure
< 1363308608 919585 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it IS quite convenient when e.g. doing nondeterministic programming with []
< 1363308629 738762 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, you can have type variables in ::, of course you can
< 1363308635 660015 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fail "foo" :: [a]
< 1363308637 551761 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :  []
< 1363308643 456611 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: http://privatepaste.com/824967e6a8  okay wow this is actually crazy
< 1363308648 428822 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :type variables to the right of :: are implicitly universally quantified
< 1363308663 403996 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :aren't type variables  implicitly universally quantified in general?
< 1363308673 876567 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless they are explicitly universally quantified ;P
< 1363308676 975286 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's an extension
< 1363308685 388664 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i noticed
< 1363308687 876524 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :or introduced from an outer scope, which is also an extension
< 1363308692 542432 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i tried to get my pedant on and it didn't work. sad
< 1363308700 92760 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora: "This scaler is made of runtime-generated MMXEXT code using specially tuned pshufw instructions." metal
< 1363308712 37950 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :savagely hand-optimized assembler
< 1363308733 584109 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: hello
< 1363308747 978758 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if one could do even better with pmaddubsw
< 1363308752 250613 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks up, notices x86_reg as a typename. wat
< 1363308769 666898 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... I'd guess it's the size of a native register?
< 1363308775 130932 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so like, 32-bit on x86_32, 64-bit on x86_64
< 1363308775 618749 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess
< 1363308785 425392 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly it just reminds me of how ineffectual "register" apparently is
< 1363308801 288764 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: i can explain the question mark kinds if you like
< 1363308801 650456 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if you're on x86_16
< 1363308811 269794 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm guessing this code doesn't work on 16-bit <.<
< 1363308817 538620 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it uses mprotect >.>
< 1363308818 182347 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah this is crazy stuff
< 1363308818 459778 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: oh, go ahead. (i've gotten around to reading haskell in haskell)
< 1363308828 443238 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well do you know how unboxed types work in GHC
< 1363308830 363160 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: i read spj's paper about I# and such if that helps
< 1363308834 831490 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1363308845 353528 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but otherwise no, i don't really
< 1363308847 153030 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fiora: hm, now I wonder how much of the instructions added after the 386 work in real mode
< 1363308852 198092 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fiora: probably not many
< 1363308873 768122 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well Int is represented, like every Haskell value, as a pointer to a heap object.  but Int# is represented as a bare machine word
< 1363308877 678837 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this much you may already know)
< 1363308884 360402 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1363308901 837475 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so for example values of type Int# can't be passed to polymorphic functions, which are compiled only once for all types and expect to treat those values uniformly
< 1363308911 642137 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so Int# has to be a different kind of type than Int
< 1363308920 765745 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, clever
< 1363308931 776936 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :in old GHC that kind is named #
< 1363308939 888373 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has some alphabetic name now
< 1363308958 907324 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what's the kind of (->), the type constructor of function types?
< 1363308973 586746 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose you want to support Int# -> Int# and such
< 1363308973 952330 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :functions are all represented by heap objects, so it's ... -> *
< 1363308981 406732 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: huh, weirdly, a lot of new ones apparently can o_O
< 1363308982 536164 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the arg and return types can be either boxed or unboxed
< 1363308988 602815 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but uh, ?? being a union of * and # seems like it would be really weird
< 1363308990 124426 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like "popcnt" has a 16-bit real mode version and apparently works in real mode?
< 1363308992 901911 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is really weird
< 1363308995 270247 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's... that's like, SSE4
< 1363308997 319703 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :strange
< 1363308998 639362 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like subtyping at kind level
< 1363308999 980873 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there you go
< 1363309002 584114 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :awesome
< 1363309022 228453 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyhow
< 1363309025 741736 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ? is the superkind of * and # and (#), where (#) is the kind of unboxed tuples
< 1363309027 110085 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you call kinds on the next level again? is that where you give up and go with type3
< 1363309031 55895 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. (# 1, 2 #)
< 1363309051 150949 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: some people call them 'sorts' but in general it's nice to have uniform Set :: Set0 :: Set1 :: ...
< 1363309057 224556 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1363309059 278601 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fiora : tbh alpha blending is probably a bit overdone by now
< 1363309067 795559 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :esp. in dependently typed contexts, where distinguishing types from values is not really the goal
< 1363309070 246331 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :after almost 20 years of openGL stuff
< 1363309087 159227 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :same for bilinear
< 1363309087 972924 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but but but excuse to use pmaddubsw 
< 1363309089 603211 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you stratify in order to have a consistent logic, not in order to erase some things after compilation
< 1363309092 551375 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes i wonder why mathematicians don't just start out with numberings, but then i remember this is the discipline that gave us x with a dot for derivatives
< 1363309115 416584 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: hey you can put a lot of dots above an x
< 1363309120 164693 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ẍ
< 1363309127 538675 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i forgot the combining character for one dot though :(
< 1363309128 265690 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway unboxed tuples are even less first-class than unboxed values
< 1363309142 132424 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least in old GHC you can only return them, not take them as args
< 1363309143 112775 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i remember somebody who was possibly shachaf complaining about it
< 1363309157 168939 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the only thing you can do after calling a function which returns one is to immediately pattern-match out the components
< 1363309163 549495 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also: i still think of types as a compilation thing instead of a logic thing. possibly this is because i am bad at logic
< 1363309165 808405 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :case f x of (# a, b #) -> ...
< 1363309175 895367 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that amused me because it's pretty well the same as CL multiple value returns :P
< 1363309179 923771 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's... yeah
< 1363309200 45662 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and GHC will implement it just by putting a and b in separate STG-machine registers
< 1363309201 58340 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fiora: :D
< 1363309204 984555 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than building a heap object
< 1363309211 249339 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1363309217 273324 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :vectored return is what it's called?
< 1363309224 865745 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora: i'm horribly curious what "LOCAL_MANGLE" could mean in the paste
< 1363309225 918777 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fiora: well, deformation/warping/texture mapping effects aren't too hard
< 1363309244 622820 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fiora: even on a straight dumb word-addressing RISC
< 1363309304 42135 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but simd is fuuuun
< 1363309330 592148 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: I'm guessing it has something to do with pleasing the inline assembler but gosh I have no idea 
< 1363309342 859040 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha yeah
< 1363309356 314392 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm definitely starting to consider adding simd instructions
< 1363309381 436115 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora: oh, also the IDE interlude in ##asm made me want to mention slime-macroexpansion-mode but i don't know if it would be feasible or useful for assembly macros
< 1363309424 587464 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :slime?
< 1363309433 78373 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :lisp mode for emacs
< 1363309454 635300 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I see *someone* is writing yet another image scalar that's not gamma-aware.
< 1363309461 578949 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically if you have a macro form you can C-c m on it and a buffer pops up with the expansion, and you can do it again in the expansion, so you can see what something expands to.
< 1363309462 756912 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goodie, incorrect results.
< 1363309500 603550 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: that's like, the fastest one in the library, I think
< 1363309506 188559 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it's intended to be very good
< 1363309532 183652 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora: Eh, hardly anyone actually does that anyways.
< 1363309538 436822 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still sucks.
< 1363309539 737620 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :gamma aware sounds painful though, I've read the articles about it but egh, sending every byte through a lookup table...
< 1363309573 234818 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1363309585 289446 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq : bilinear is already cpu killing and you want to add more to the massacre? :D
< 1363309657 459651 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can use a 50-tap sinc filter too >:3
< 1363309666 360242 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1363309680 781615 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :even on sound that's overkill
< 1363309687 552353 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and on sound you can hear the alias
< 1363309704 41507 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION was kidding XD
< 1363309754 88071 :carado_!~carado@2a01:e35:8b61:e430:221:63ff:fe9a:3747 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363309786 111070 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The *cheap* way is basically doing each pixel to the power of 2.2 before scaling, and then to 1/2.2 after...
< 1363309795 387569 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: mostly i was wondering about fail because haskell-in-haskell has mgu :: (Monad m) => Type -> Type -> m Subst and such, seemingly for no other reason than the use of fail. so i thought that seemed more like somewhere you'd use Either
< 1363309799 935851 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note, technically wrong, but damned close)
< 1363309808 552109 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: but i seem to not understand the haskell "philosophy" on exceptions anyway
< 1363309811 401583 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, geez, not even that's correct?
< 1363309818 887129 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, one more episode then I will blog
< 1363309842 56099 :carado!~user4539@2a01:e35:8b61:e430:6ef0:49ff:fe73:1fd0 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1363309849 572400 :carado_!~carado@2a01:e35:8b61:e430:221:63ff:fe9a:3747 NICK :carado
< 1363309852 60153 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora: The sRGB to linear mapping is not done via a straight gamma of 2.2, but rather a somewhat weirder function.
< 1363309878 418085 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess a lookup table would be able to get it at least?
< 1363309881 584289 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :srgb... is that calibrated on CRTs or LCDs?
< 1363309901 507785 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://soundcloud.com/stevexr1p/i-am-the-doctor-nintendo-remix
< 1363309985 720477 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :A chiptune mix of the theremin-heavy Who theme sounds surreal
< 1363310027 438190 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno if I like it
< 1363310029 914537 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The exact function is... x <= 0.04045 -> x/12.92; otherwise -> ((x+0.055)/(1.055)) ^ 2.4
< 1363310054 384744 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow.  that's... that's really... I don't even
< 1363310057 375638 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where x has been scaled to be between 0 and 1 from whatever your sample size is.
< 1363310091 535734 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note that you really want your intermediates to be either floats or 16-bit ints.
< 1363310114 533413 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah gonna be soooo sloooooooooooooow :D
< 1363310151 810141 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but the average of 0 and 255 will be 187, as it should be.
< 1363310169 113323 :Bike_!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363310236 479826 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's fine on non-realtime stuff like photoshop I guess
< 1363310251 865086 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-239-237.ptld.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1363310257 620800 :Bike_!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net NICK :Bike
< 1363310270 503102 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but Photoshop doesn't do this.
< 1363310288 828394 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :or if you do something like inverse gamma all your textures and then in the final HDR shader reapply the gamma
< 1363310317 690741 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: actually I was kinda wondering something about that, if like, in photoshop I change the image format to 16-bit or 32-bit, does it go linear?
< 1363310322 174499 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :or does it use gamma there too?
< 1363310376 525325 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora: i don't know.
< 1363310417 280684 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah!  http://forums.adobe.com/message/2615874  says that 32-bit float is always gamma 1.0
< 1363310437 602934 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and apparently you can even set up a custom RGB profile with gamma 1.0 o_O
< 1363310445 317243 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1363310505 430153 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, if you are working in 32-bit float in Photoshop you get things working right.
< 1363310595 54228 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :just getting brushes to work right is good enough to me :D
< 1363310772 146674 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the general problem with just leaving it with the RISC opcodes is that people are going to program in the effects that render well in software
< 1363310791 222440 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :IE the same ones seen in a zillion demoscene demos and late DOS games
< 1363310930 45169 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're not bad (they're good at some types of "juice" :D) but not too original either
< 1363311303 860246 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: ah yeah, that was a somewhat old style
< 1363311313 129890 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(using a generic monad for 'fail')
< 1363311323 774530 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think these days people will look at you funny for writing that kind of code
< 1363311336 897253 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you would use Maybe, Either, or some class more specific than Monad
< 1363311456 831075 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah the sRGB function is chosen "to approximate a gamma of about 2.2, but with a linear portion near zero to avoid having an infinite slope at K = 0, which can cause numerical problems."
< 1363311511 751014 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :So thoughtful
< 1363311567 257756 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: it's "calibrated for CRTs" in the sense that the CRT voltage -> luminance function is close to that gamma of 2.2, so you can output sRGB values directly as CRT voltages and it works ok
< 1363311605 13428 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but an sRGB value corresponds to a particular color (i.e. CIE XYZ tristimulus value) independent of what display technology is in use
< 1363311666 170394 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :your display technology needs to do whatever is necessary to ensure that sRGB values correspond to linear light intensity according to the specified curve
< 1363311689 602029 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1363311704 508085 :kallisti!~eris@168.28.136.16 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363311704 658770 :kallisti!~eris@168.28.136.16 QUIT :Changing host
< 1363311704 658942 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363311709 277411 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a ThinkPad laptop that has a color calbiration sensor in the wrist rest
< 1363311714 422849 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you just shut the lid and it does its thing
< 1363311830 995713 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake QUIT :Client Quit
< 1363311847 204324 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363312095 761329 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::>
< 1363312548 44409 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1363312566 327008 :kallisti!~eris@168.28.136.16 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363312566 477519 :kallisti!~eris@168.28.136.16 QUIT :Changing host
< 1363312566 477694 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363312567 178416 :kallisti_!~eris@168.28.136.16 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363313287 140740 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: does lyah go into error handling much? like not catch, just how idiomatic code deals with exceptional situations
< 1363313778 193505 :jhaimar!~canaima@190.77.25.204 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363313826 15175 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Quit: Arc_Koen
< 1363314014 620810 :jhaimar!~canaima@190.77.25.204 PRIVMSG #esoteric :holaaa
< 1363314046 585849 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`welcome jhaimar 
< 1363314052 649560 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :jhaimar: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.)
< 1363314700 104317 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: don't know
< 1363314711 748951 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think RWH has some stuff on the IO-monad sort of exceptions
< 1363314764 450813 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :lyah mentioned IOError but said you'd usually use pure mechanisms instead
< 1363314814 828151 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle try
< 1363314814 978138 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.OldException try :: IO a -> IO (Either Exception a)
< 1363314815 131514 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :System.IO.Error try :: IO a -> IO (Either IOError a)
< 1363314815 281611 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Exception.Base try :: Exception e => IO a -> IO (Either e a)
< 1363314846 625989 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha.
< 1363315112 56540 :carado!~carado@2a01:e35:8b61:e430:221:63ff:fe9a:3747 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1363315375 855927 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well IOError is pretty primitive
< 1363315382 72910 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but GHC has a more powerful system of IO exceptions
< 1363315384 697572 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :extensible
< 1363315410 825094 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i may be some kind of heretic, but I think the IO monad is a pretty good 'getting shit done' monad
< 1363315416 358739 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has exceptions, state, threads, oh and IO
< 1363315439 435901 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :for some huge program it might be nice to build an ornate transformer stack of separate exception handling, state, etc.
< 1363315451 92434 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's a big pain for small program
< 1363315536 8803 :jhaimar!~canaima@190.77.25.204 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1363315919 68434 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1363316182 47349 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, separate state is still nice for not having to pass IORefs around, unless you make a global IORef
< 1363316242 754758 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's true
< 1363316379 769461 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically what i'm asking is, for something like the haskell-in-haskell code that doesn't involve anything IOy but exceptions, would using that exception hierarchy be the idiomatic solution, or what?
< 1363316420 163674 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, probably Maybe or (Either t) or some other error monad
< 1363316432 764292 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :compilers typically have to do errors, fresh variable names, and maybe other state
< 1363316445 469720 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION does a jig
< 1363316452 352537 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha
< 1363316468 970726 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i'll do is, create a module which defines a monad with the necessary operations
< 1363316479 552829 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm used to exceptions being more complicated than just bare strings, too :/
< 1363316479 702791 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :exported abstractly, so other code can't see the details of how that monad is implemented
< 1363316491 15791 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :could be a transformer stack, could be something else, doesn't matter
< 1363316499 748406 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :GeneralizedNewtypeDeriving for MonadState etc. is useful
< 1363316512 138571 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: sure, you can use whatever type you like with Either / ErrorT
< 1363316512 875091 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no errors across module boundaries?
< 1363316523 416559 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: no
< 1363316546 251419 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i'm saying is, the fact that the monad is StateT s (ErrorT e (Whatever ...)) is not exposed
< 1363316576 581439 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :m
< 1363316601 493573 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you would only expose whatever primitives you need
< 1363316609 536821 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :throw, catch, gensym, whatever
< 1363316623 254824 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rest of the compiler just uses those and doesn't worry about the implementation of this monad as an algebraic data structure
< 1363316655 569465 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :IOW i'm saying that monad transformers are a useful shortcut for building monads, but that doesn't mean they should be all over the code which /uses/ those monasd
< 1363316660 636452 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :monasdf
< 1363316673 921344 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you'd make your own error protocol? Also I don't even know what IOW or monad transformers are so you're probably wasting this on me, sorry.
< 1363316688 41258 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :IOW being "in other words"
< 1363316694 630661 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :o
< 1363316714 315405 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the most important idea here is abstract data types
< 1363316721 232129 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really anything to do with monads
< 1363316745 75948 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :implementing monads as abstract data types is often a good idea for the same reason as implementing anything else as an abstract data type
< 1363316862 465994 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363316925 332807 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Bike may be wondering if you'd have to use different functions to raise errors from a 'standard' function?
< 1363316938 16542 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The answer to that is no if you write the monad transformer properly
< 1363316984 935440 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think
< 1363317087 539071 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I seem to lack the ability to phrase what I mean to ask.
< 1363317331 723032 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :right the error handling situation with 'standard' functions is a clusterfuck
< 1363317355 242797 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're using some error handling monad, there's no way to make (say) 'head' produce an error in that monad
< 1363317381 614554 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :really
< 1363317388 894264 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is hard to integrate two libraries which both do error handling
< 1363317402 237670 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that were developed independently
< 1363317402 495978 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, that about answers it, thanks
< 1363317435 902228 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean *maybe* they allow a generic MonadError (http://lambda.haskell.org/hp-tmp/docs/2011.2.0.0/packages/mtl-2.0.1.0/doc/html/Control-Monad-Error-Class.html#t:MonadError)
< 1363317438 872890 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but usually not
< 1363317451 640133 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you end up writing a lot of little wrappers to convert between different sorts of error handling
< 1363317456 467524 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1363317458 788724 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not that bad but it's kind of annoying
< 1363317471 236731 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's one reason why I say that everything that does IO should just use IO's exceptions
< 1363317477 620832 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than say ErrorT e IO
< 1363317609 874526 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's T there mean, by the way
< 1363317614 102521 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :transformer
< 1363317620 318026 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric ::k ErrorT
< 1363317621 664458 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :* -> (* -> *) -> * -> *
< 1363317639 72258 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :o
< 1363317647 551589 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`slist
< 1363317647 882084 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :for an error type e :: *, and a monad m :: * -> *, (ErrorT e m) is a monad
< 1363317649 220726 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: slist: not found
< 1363317653 3482 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :^list
< 1363317653 153659 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb atriq Ngevd Fiora nortti Sgeo ThatOtherPerson alot
< 1363317654 758265 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOT UPDATE
< 1363317657 427096 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT NEW ALBUM
< 1363317687 706924 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is MonadError not a transformer?
< 1363317693 612803 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it's not even a type
< 1363317697 338456 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a type class
< 1363317702 297775 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh duh
< 1363317708 788384 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :classifying all the monads in which errors can be thrown
< 1363317775 849412 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's useful because it lets you throw an error without knowing at what layer of the stack your ErrorT or similar thingy is
< 1363317792 456198 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and should allow library code to generalize for more users
< 1363317806 234247 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i dunno, in practice most libraries don't use it
< 1363317816 780057 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes the type signatures longer and uglier and it requires type system extensions
< 1363317821 102383 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dear Hulu: If I press go back 10 seconds 3 times, it does not mean jump forwards 5 minutes.
< 1363317826 728043 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, what extensions?
< 1363317838 65307 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's one that uses type families and one that uses multiparameter type classes with functional dependencies
< 1363317848 974337 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, that's another problem: there are (at least) two MonadErrors
< 1363317849 949333 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :gosh
< 1363317851 599063 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually a lot more
< 1363317880 734826 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is that every monad-which-supports-errors is associated with a particular error type
< 1363317886 700352 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the type class needs a way to talk about both of these at once
< 1363317894 716748 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :in standard Haskell, type classes can have only one parameter
< 1363317898 680820 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :among numerous other restrictions
< 1363317924 272621 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :type classes were the big new experimental feature in Haskell and they were somewhat conservative about them
< 1363317952 790518 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah.
< 1363317999 516386 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell is a language where the community observes that there are 50 incompatible error handling monads, and the response is 50 incompatible packages for generically handling all error handling monads
< 1363318000 713775 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363318038 994738 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the generalization of having thirty RFCs. genius.
< 1363318057 660508 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the great thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from
< 1363318342 391691 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yeah that is the worst
< 1363318345 95248 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know why it does that
< 1363318430 297750 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe if we just pared everything down so we only had one programmer left, they could agree on what to use. ...but then, they could be sgeo
< 1363318713 719699 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a world with only one programmer, Hacker News will still be 40% articles about How To Hire Programmers
< 1363318731 550213 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean it's that much harder!
< 1363318796 56196 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't understand how programming exists as a job market, i mean everybody seems to care about how to hire and how to be hired that i see that more than actual programming sometimes?
< 1363318847 588106 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well nobody actually knows how to hire programmers
< 1363318853 788279 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and none of the article have any empirical basis or references
< 1363318860 846126 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :right i mean
< 1363318862 417548 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're all linkbait basically
< 1363318877 167396 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want to attract attention to your company, post a semi provocative article about how you hire people
< 1363318877 394255 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the programming industry built on writing programs to autogenerate shitty articles on hiring programmers
< 1363318881 97214 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ksplice is guilty of this too
< 1363318905 899493 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://blogs.oracle.com/ksplice/entry/how_to_quadruple_your_productivity
< 1363318924 702508 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hey, haskellhaskell has n+k patterns
< 1363318940 106878 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :this got a ton of hate mail from people who didn't understand that intern = paid intern
< 1363318952 351667 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :also a bunch of horrible comments about all the women in those photos, of course
< 1363318954 460558 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it says "paid" in the second paragraph
< 1363318962 315108 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: i think that was an edit
< 1363318964 914686 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :see last graf
< 1363318965 64802 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1363319015 543642 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :n+k patterns are... silly
< 1363319027 745562 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure about any stronger negative judgement
< 1363319030 621309 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :has n+k but not irrefutable patterns
< 1363319035 104991 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: do you know about view patterns
< 1363319049 30206 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :naw
< 1363319050 270486 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :they kind of generalize n+k patterns
< 1363319063 703322 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :How often are view patterns used?
< 1363319082 70447 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (\(id -> a) a + 1) 5
< 1363319084 56255 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :  <hint>:1:15: parse error on input `+'
< 1363319085 882211 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops
< 1363319089 41906 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (\(id -> a) -> a + 1) 5
< 1363319090 714470 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :  6
< 1363319094 719384 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay
< 1363319124 790804 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: you can write (f -> p) and it matches x iff pattern p matches (f x)
< 1363319143 108333 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds undecideable
< 1363319148 927196 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1363319158 588939 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just apply f to the argument and match that
< 1363319161 296302 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, if f x doesn't terminate, I guess it is
< 1363319173 502571 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i mean yeah
< 1363319195 311246 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let loop x = loop x in (\(loop -> x) -> x + 1) 5
< 1363319198 813226 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess the ability to do arbitrary computation on the left side of the = is a bit remarkable
< 1363319198 977492 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :  mueval-core: Time limit exceeded
< 1363319247 591651 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but guards also do that
< 1363319268 400528 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :functions for all
< 1363319289 975118 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It basically lessens the temptation to just expose constructors for the sake of ease of pattern matching
< 1363319307 276010 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :This way, you can have an abstract data type, and have a function that turns it into something you can do pattern matching on
< 1363319309 106372 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363319327 696237 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's exactly what the page i googled up said.
< 1363319437 286642 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of their example views uses view patterns on itself in its definition, noice
< 1363319562 899187 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1363319587 764691 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is this in lambdabot because it's standard now or because caleskell is weird
< 1363319611 837161 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also what the hell is an "outjection"
< 1363319650 316112 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: i'd say neither
< 1363319659 537464 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's in lambdabot because it's a GHC extension that they decided to turn on
< 1363319674 505788 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"caleskell" refers less to language extensions and more to strange default imports that hide the standard ones
< 1363319678 661638 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kay
< 1363319683 311878 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not like lambdabot has any crazy language extensions above and beyond the ones GHC has
< 1363319686 330008 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :...to my knowledge
< 1363319687 477030 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants MultiWayIf
< 1363319702 885525 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't that guards
< 1363319723 461851 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's less noisy than a case with guards
< 1363319780 768636 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the example they have with an actual n+k pattern being made out of a view pattern is kind of... dull
< 1363319819 257249 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"fib (np 2 -> Just n) = fib (n + 1) + fib n" instead of "fib n = fib (n - 1) + fib (n - 2)" I guess?
< 1363319991 429847 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i came up with this: http://mainisusuallyafunction.blogspot.com/2010/09/view-patterns-for-validation.html
< 1363319996 269963 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the first time i'm sure
< 1363320077 616123 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh hey, you mention failure
< 1363320086 188115 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"monthV (rangeV "monthV" 1 12 -> m) = months !! (m-1)"
< 1363320092 474190 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That duplicate monthV bothers me
< 1363320138 27794 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :«This "range checking pattern" would be rigid syntax in most other languages. Here it's just something that emerges from the programming paradigm.» Do you like your comments
< 1363320424 348788 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric ::)
< 1363320579 838764 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :reminds me that i haven't read kuhn. is that why "paradigm" came to be used in programming that way
< 1363320591 790593 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know
< 1363320614 237483 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i generally think the idea of 'paradigm' in programming is suspect
< 1363320625 768215 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe this article predates my conversion to this view
< 1363320639 755797 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you didn't write the paradigm thing
< 1363320645 574599 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1363320647 685794 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well then
< 1363320657 718612 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i said, a comment
< 1363320695 981586 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess paradigms are fine, but i'm annoyed when people are like "right, we're using paradigm X therefore everything must be done according to paradigm X and the language must be chosen primarily for its uncompromising support of paradigm X"
< 1363320714 69466 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, wikipedia's doing that thing where it has a history of the thing instead of a history of the concept of the thing. how am i supposed to sate my etymological fetish this way
< 1363320725 261437 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :to me the different 'paradigms' are techniques that are even more powerful when used together, when appropriate
< 1363320740 274962 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you considered using a "multi-paradigm language"
< 1363320743 308230 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1363320744 702884 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :alt. multi-rhetoric language
< 1363320749 801966 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P
< 1363320751 614991 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1363320762 179254 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :" There is still some controversy by notable programmers such as Alexander Stepanov, Richard Stallman[3] and others, concerning the efficacy of the OOP paradigm versus the procedural paradigm." why the hell did i even try looking this up?
< 1363320788 917322 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1363320878 90617 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, kuhn definitely seems to be the one who put "paradigm" into its modern usage, and 1962 is early enough to get picked up by the OOP craze for sure
< 1363320901 243775 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1363320907 318469 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is important
< 1363320927 663242 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but uh anyway that paper is neat, thanks for showing me it whenever you did that
< 1363320946 318084 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :which paper? THiH?
< 1363320956 49262 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yah
< 1363320969 324579 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :David Baltimore also gets some credit for popularizing / ruining the word 'paradigm'
< 1363320990 68367 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a biologist?
< 1363320996 883335 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1363320999 769356 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and former president of Caltech
< 1363321009 684035 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :THiH?
< 1363321015 202657 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Typing Haskell in Haskell
< 1363321022 730552 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah
< 1363321055 270486 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.cripplingdepression.com/index/16 pictured here in panel 2
< 1363321093 666480 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the wild fast paced life of a caltech administrator
< 1363321137 427069 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1363321154 321639 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i forgot why he was deemed to be Moneybags Baltimore but the name stuck for at least the 4 years I was there
< 1363322433 407489 :glogbackup!~glogbacku@64.31.59.246 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363326732 115508 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: vectored-return is something else.
< 1363326734 427910 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think?
< 1363326756 123593 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah it's hyphenated
< 1363326760 12429 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION isn't going to read the whole thing.
< 1363326769 811454 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole what
< 1363326930 644760 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :scrollbacklog
< 1363327056 599961 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :imo it sucks
< 1363327101 793848 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :help need to force food self
< 1363327388 382962 :impomatic!~digital_w@87.115.125.6 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1363327434 394883 :madbr!boulam@198-84-253-87.cpe.teksavvy.com QUIT :Quit: Radiateur
< 1363329332 208171 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds
< 1363329363 381621 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363331681 583248 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: Lol oop and prodecudral
< 1363331719 990713 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i prefer unstructured, freeform programming
< 1363331737 420011 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: What language does that? Perl?
< 1363331770 740940 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can structure just about anything
< 1363331781 584507 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perl is better described as antistructured programming.
< 1363331816 954203 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :perl has first class functions man, functional as shit
< 1363331876 854104 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perl has TC regexes; I fail to see your point.
< 1363331916 628155 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :See? It's basically a Post system. Very computer sciencey.
< 1363331938 473263 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway. Haskell report calls \ a "backslant". I have never heard this before, what is happening.
< 1363332150 883397 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net QUIT :Quit: Reconnecting
< 1363332167 167471 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363332218 778623 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Quit: Cya
< 1363334031 76746 :epicmonkey!~epicmonke@188.134.41.112 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363334387 3128 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363335020 42516 :epicmonkey!~epicmonke@188.134.41.112 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1363335051 688309 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :
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< 1363336413 923516 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds
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< 1363341443 199975 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363343635 35526 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: hello
< 1363344286 552385 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363344347 209834 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds
< 1363344378 383516 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363346678 621624 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363346739 564316 :mtve!~mtve@10130.x.rootbsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shorter "hello world" in malbolge in 78 bytes by kenrube: (=<`#9]~6ZY32Vw/.R,+Op(L&%I#"Fg}Cdz@xw=*z]Kw%ot4Uqpihm,Owi)tfI$c"n`}}]/zZx;W:(
< 1363346771 317879 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :!malbolge (=<`#9]~6ZY32Vw/.R,+Op(L&%I#"Fg}Cdz@xw=*z]Kw%ot4Uqpihm,Owi)tfI$c"n`}}]/zZx;W:(
< 1363346773 151699 :EgoBot!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello, world.
< 1363347037 956274 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363347108 316477 :mtve!~mtve@10130.x.rootbsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmm, i guess shinh did it in 75 bytes (! insted on .) at http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?hello+world
< 1363347453 263557 :mtve!~mtve@10130.x.rootbsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like kenrube's homepage btw (not really sure its his, but it was mentioned somewhere linked to him) - http://www.yyyyyyy.info/
< 1363347552 331037 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :very good
< 1363347613 878612 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@remember kmc Haskell is a language where the community observes that there are 50 incompatible error handling monads, and the response is 50 incompatible packages for generically handling all error handling monads
< 1363347614 43613 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will never forget.
< 1363348121 165387 :Yonkie!~Yonkie@ip.82.144.202.167.stat.volia.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1363348135 864561 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@quote error handling
< 1363348136 190207 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No quotes for this person. There are some things that I just don't know.
< 1363348141 99143 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@quote error.handling
< 1363348141 248665 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc says: Haskell is a language where the community observes that there are 50 incompatible error handling monads, and the response is 50 incompatible packages for generically handling all error
< 1363348141 248891 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :handling monads
< 1363348143 213261 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@quote error.handling
< 1363348143 384770 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc says: Haskell is a language where the community observes that there are 50 incompatible error handling monads, and the response is 50 incompatible packages for generically handling all error
< 1363348143 534285 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :handling monads
< 1363348374 399203 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1363348906 231565 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363349086 195197 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363349229 178853 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363349272 309261 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1363349345 567226 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 QUIT :Client Quit
< 1363349617 419788 :carado!~carado@2a01:e35:8b61:e430:221:63ff:fe9a:3747 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363350175 228379 :dessos!~dessos@c-174-60-176-249.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363351015 1350 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Suggn. remove Brainfuck and its derivatives from the 'low-level' category.
< 1363351086 222522 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i should say that on the wiki instead...
< 1363353808 76171 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363354001 819497 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Kolmogorov
< 1363354016 366705 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it just me or is this not based on a kolmogorov machine at all
< 1363354148 343552 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quit
< 1363354152 824275 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net QUIT :Quit: Poulet!
< 1363354152 974532 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: quit: not found
< 1363354223 520203 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363354225 572229 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363354327 634531 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? HackEgo 
< 1363354329 648083 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :HackEgo, also known as HackBot, is a bot that runs arbitrary commands on Unix. See `help for info on using it. You should totally try to hax0r it! Make sure you imagine it's running as root with no sandboxing.
< 1363354394 327998 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :haircut oh no
< 1363355273 543096 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1363355399 306730 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363356553 191250 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: bf is low-level...
< 1363356681 958573 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363356725 294205 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: glad to see you revived since yesterday.
< 1363356778 37527 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :mtve: wow, you spoke
< 1363356792 458893 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was starting to believe fizzie killed you and hid the body and was just running an IRC client to hide the truth
< 1363356915 794921 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily, the haircut helped
< 1363357442 503424 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :help suddenly I have an idea of why recruiters are the devil
< 1363357455 197484 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel very pressured into making a hasty decision if I get an offer
< 1363357483 287188 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :recruiters aren't there to land you the best job. their goal is to land you *a* job.
< 1363357523 399298 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how's it low-level
< 1363357567 173532 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what constitutes high-level
< 1363357577 122483 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i already replied on the wiki
< 1363357965 851538 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm
< 1363357973 680970 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :would e.g. lazy k count as low-level then
< 1363358071 921145 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363358369 693485 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: replied again
< 1363358372 709651 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and uhhhh not sure
< 1363358379 453244 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :like I said it's hard enough for imperative languages
< 1363358389 222384 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess SKI is definitely low-level
< 1363358402 661187 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure about lambda calculus, it has a means of /abstraction/ (indeed it's all it has), which distinguishes it from e.g. BF
< 1363358436 998997 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I guess you can abstract in SKI too, but it's basically as painful as not abstracting, so...
< 1363358772 602020 :tromp__!~tromp@rtc35-242.rentec.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can abstract at compile time in combinatory logic
< 1363358855 361486 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: hello
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< 1363359280 73309 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1363359584 54415 :carado_!~user4539@2a01:e35:8b61:e430:6ef0:49ff:fe73:1fd0 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1363359832 460706 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363360692 466869 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1363360997 858889 :nooodl!~nooodl@91.177.55.142 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363361013 476929 :carado!~carado@2a01:e35:8b61:e430:221:63ff:fe9a:3747 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1363361046 59572 :carado_!~user4539@2a01:e35:8b61:e430:6ef0:49ff:fe73:1fd0 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363361078 135653 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363361756 221745 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1363361903 569197 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363361921 77738 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1363361945 505717 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363362212 589414 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1363362967 280871 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :job offer
< 1363363123 249071 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay
< 1363363223 167386 :c00kiemon5ter!~c00kiemon@foss-aueb/coder/c00kiemon5ter PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1363363245 187982 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION cheers ♪
< 1363363368 845532 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just don't want to be stuck in a Java career for the rest of my life.
< 1363363543 658639 :augur!~augur@129-2-129-34.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363365525 729481 :carado_!~user4539@2a01:e35:8b61:e430:6ef0:49ff:fe73:1fd0 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1363365560 128139 :carado!~user4539@2a01:e35:8b61:e430:6ef0:49ff:fe73:1fd0 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363365613 882514 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: hello
< 1363366062 44196 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363366726 484321 :epicmonkey!~epicmonke@host-224-58.dataart.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds
< 1363368196 456803 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: don't worry. even if you begin by being a not-java developer, it will find a way to infect you, to creep on you, to assimilate you.
< 1363368301 100931 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: this is just an internship right?
< 1363368311 437145 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, no
< 1363368354 263070 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1363368357 186884 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :*oh
< 1363368362 431231 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :well then, uh, don't be?
< 1363368520 72926 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1363368670 356427 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :imnsho, java development only sucks when you're stuck with a large, fat, enterprisey project. but then, I believe everything that uses the ‘enterprise’ buzzword sucks.
< 1363368696 585168 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :^
< 1363368714 709816 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: Java is only vaguely useful in large, fat, enterprisey projects.
< 1363368780 157045 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363368809 878472 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, I think I can survive dealing with Java for some time, but I don't want 'some time' to be 'the rest of my life'
< 1363368840 608394 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't worry, they'll be a new stereotypical enterprise language soon enough.
< 1363368846 586254 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if the only actual 'job' I can list on my resume in the future is Java...
< 1363368857 520993 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if I've done all these personal projects etc.
< 1363368864 751705 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: the only problem then (for Sgeo) will be that he only knows Java
< 1363368908 279229 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :fsvo "only"
< 1363368934 676171 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :learn everything you can get your hand on. casually mention that you have an interest into uncommon technologies (fsvo uncommon). shotgun new projects, talk and exchange with your colleagues. get known for your initiative.
< 1363368942 108277 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :^
< 1363368961 527270 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: The language is less important than the skills
< 1363368971 610129 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Emphasize the transferable skills on your resume
< 1363369012 350707 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The best tech firms know that a skilled programmer can learn $LANG on the job, and that having programmed in $LANG does not mean you are a skilled programmer
< 1363369039 642192 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd much rather hire (for a Python job) an intelligent guy who's never used Python than a moron who has
< 1363369399 713466 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the downside there is that you're in a python job.
< 1363369628 66769 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the right level of elitism for the job
< 1363369762 887280 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363369767 12770 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: tl;dr don't worry, just don't mention Java too much on your resume
< 1363369776 139454 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :the point is not that you are developing in Java. The point is that you are developing
< 1363370256 625263 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think a better worry than the idea that you might be shoehorned into a java career long-term
< 1363370261 563205 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the fact that you will be writing in java every day.
< 1363370336 613876 :AnotherTest!~AnotherTe@94-224-28-191.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363370340 981802 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no human has enough finger length to support a whole-life java career. you'd have to have extra knuckles grafter to your fingertips to cope with the amount of typing.
< 1363370346 414152 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/grafter/grafted/
< 1363370354 195774 :Mathnerd314_!~quassel@palevsky-223-221.rh.uchicago.edu NICK :Mathnerd314
< 1363370428 260121 :augur!~augur@129-2-129-34.wireless.umd.edu QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1363370448 483059 :augur!~augur@129-2-129-34.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363370494 207008 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there may be some Javascript. Hopefully more as time goes on.
< 1363370521 381432 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd rather JAva than JS
< 1363370549 316678 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i disagree
< 1363370556 512417 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I kmcagree.
< 1363370558 878708 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm writing a lot of JavaScript lately and finding it fairly pleasant
< 1363370570 209806 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yeah uh the fact that you'll get anonymous functions doesn't really make this sound like a dream job to me yet
< 1363370582 970929 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has its warts but it's a pretty simple + flexible language
< 1363370591 444919 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also are you sure they don't just not understand the difference between Java and JavaScript :P
< 1363370592 276213 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the community is not afraid of a little FP the way the Python community is
< 1363370603 415041 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :because in JavaScript lambda is practically the only abstraction you get
< 1363370606 214037 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm sure.
< 1363370608 71740 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so they use it to build objects, modules, etc
< 1363370613 346741 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a way that warms the heart of any Lisp weenie
< 1363370622 838281 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe Scheme weenie i should say
< 1363370633 607966 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway it's a funny real-world demonstration of the Lambda the Ultimate principle
< 1363370665 561151 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a principle?
< 1363370673 94159 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: are you sure they're sure
< 1363370685 853958 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: i'd say that's a fairly inaccurate view of javascript's oop
< 1363370686 407633 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :mainly i just can't get worked up about the difference between JavaScript / Python / Ruby / whatever
< 1363370693 17325 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's all pretty minor once you know Haskell and C++
< 1363370701 254256 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah i'm glossing over
< 1363370718 755088 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :javascript's oop can't decide whether it wants to be prototype-based or not
< 1363370726 205712 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363370733 86292 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have transcended the arguments and attained lingual nirvana, free of worldly desires
< 1363370823 299401 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :They know the difference between Javascript and Java.
< 1363370834 437794 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, is Angular.JS fairly well liked?
< 1363370871 983394 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"AngularJS is what HTML would have been, had it been designed for building web-apps"
< 1363370882 889163 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think a lot of JS-bashing comes down to looking down one's nose at Web programmers as "not real programmers" and misunderstanding what the Web is
< 1363370906 719061 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is, by far the easiest way to write an application and distribute it to a lot of people very quickly
< 1363370930 276139 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i too am guilty of this viewpoint in the past
< 1363370938 112975 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363370996 304717 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bash JS because it's a shitty language
< 1363371003 874722 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think this contract would make actually be with the recruitment firm
< 1363371004 679266 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :not because web programming isn't real programming
< 1363371017 21592 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :????? :)
< 1363371019 245300 :nortti!~juhani@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bash JS becaus I think it is badly designed language
< 1363371022 269080 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't program JS without strapping a ridiculous framework on top of it
< 1363371026 976770 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :like jquery
< 1363371034 992064 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :are we talking JS? heheheheheheheehehehhehehe lets not
< 1363371063 168097 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :unrelated notice: please stop referring to "May you live in interesting times" as an "ancient Chinese curse". thanks in advance
< 1363371063 318409 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION prods monqy's hehehe-box to unstick it.
< 1363371072 936961 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :thoily
< 1363371074 915261 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :just talk about men making tigers instead
< 1363371079 436471 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: now I'm thinking of the inspirational japanese tumblr
< 1363371110 212532 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow programming in JS requires the use of libraries?  what a shit language!
< 1363371130 329069 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_you_live_in_interesting_times it's like, all the examples are English language and it was first attested by an English ambassador what a weird coincidence huh
< 1363371141 50739 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc, PHP is totally the best language ever!
< 1363371151 685025 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :snerk
< 1363371153 249988 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ancient chinese secret, eh?
< 1363371156 69221 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ancient english curse
< 1363371158 616383 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :No need to import stuff much of the time
< 1363371165 158564 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Florida Man Arrested For Punching Firefighter In The Groin
< 1363371183 201971 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yeah it's super convenient
< 1363371194 560302 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :my favorite php libary thing is probably the thermidorian date functions
< 1363371203 802126 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: we were talking Sgeo's upcoming java job that's going to be lots of fun for him before
< 1363371224 896472 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I must admit it's convenient in languages like Python to not need _third-party_ libraries.
< 1363371229 879222 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Much of the time
< 1363371230 879758 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :like just in case you want to use a dead 19th century date format
< 1363371240 869295 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: does sgeo fully comprehend what he's getting himself into
< 1363371254 941032 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anybody fully comprehend anything, when you get down to it
< 1363371256 736515 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: and it's, like, 20th century
< 1363371275 770385 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora: ancient 20th century curse
< 1363371293 884998 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :still, I think inspirationaljapanese wins the mocking contest
< 1363371299 561402 :epicmonkey!~epicmonke@188.134.41.112 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363371312 13416 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would love to be the guy who gets to make up some shit as an ancient chinese curse
< 1363371321 131949 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder what the other ones were before they decided on "may you live in interesting timse"
< 1363371322 28574 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: it's said that the last guy who understood anything there was to be known was Poincaré.
< 1363371333 162058 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what regions of curseology were traversed
< 1363371334 494213 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh.
< 1363371338 605336 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Recruiters are the devil.
< 1363371344 235314 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and poincaré was kind of a dick. it all works out
< 1363371356 299171 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently, I'm not entitled to employee benefits that the company provides.
< 1363371356 576486 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora: my new tattoo means "world peace" *throws a cabbage at you*
< 1363371370 616875 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: didn't kmc tell you to avoid them
< 1363371377 346704 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow its almost as if kmc told sgeo to avoid recruiters 20 times
< 1363371380 139969 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :good timing
< 1363371389 8 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok. who here first stumbled upon that inspirational japanese thing. I have this sudden urge to whack them.
< 1363371397 269544 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Python's stdlib is kinda shit for a lot of things though
< 1363371401 623883 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, urllib2 doesn't check SSL certs
< 1363371403 942942 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and has a terrible API
< 1363371409 790776 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: nope sorry it's awesome
< 1363371419 9695 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: wait, this is like, a full time job, not an internship, and they're not giving you benefits? @_@
< 1363371419 707739 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to use requests or curl if you don't hate yourself
< 1363371440 299971 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: it's disturbing my qi! it unaligns my chakras! it's full of glaring and blaring and ugly colours!
< 1363371440 778121 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: no smacking that tumblr is amazing
< 1363371440 927790 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora, it's a contract job with possibility of full-time job with the company itself at the end
< 1363371451 17888 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :... that... seems... fishy
< 1363371468 656364 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: http://inspirationaljapanese.tumblr.com/post/40826225940/   this is one of my favorites
< 1363371472 93224 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: rip your qi chakras
< 1363371480 786482 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :chakren?
< 1363371484 570866 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :like kraken
< 1363371486 557406 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(is kraken plural)
< 1363371487 536400 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kraka
< 1363371490 609341 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :actual translation: 0,0SHINJI, PILOT THE EVA
< 1363371526 372178 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :#japan #japanese #quote #inspirational #motivational #kawaii #sugoi #uguu
< 1363371565 505355 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora: bwah ah ah ah ah! ok. that site is awesome.
< 1363371575 417712 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :'Tis.
< 1363371584 951638 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love it because like, it doesn't do that dumb thing where you put offensive phrases in japanese and mistranslate them
< 1363371588 212979 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but rather just, /funny/ things
< 1363371606 89754 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, this is interesting
< 1363371627 413194 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's really great if you understand Japanese.
< 1363371630 42214 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"apparently my recruiter needs to know if i'm a virgin, for some party"
< 1363371658 572635 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell him that you're a gemini, and that it's against your religion.
< 1363371660 295554 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Shall we do the Harlem Shake today?" and "live every moment and love every day" Haaaah
< 1363371676 607223 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It occurs to me that I don't know if it's a good idea to talk about this stuff in publically logged channel
< 1363371691 875692 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :recruiters are known to trawl the #esoteric logs for candidates
< 1363371703 937293 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: maybe you should figure out?
< 1363371741 719722 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: say, if you ever come to Montréal one day, could you wear an orange vest with ‘Hi there, I'm Sgeo’ written in large friendly letters on it?
< 1363371753 780806 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(so that I can covertly recruit you)
< 1363371762 77230 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :didnt you decide it was a bad idea to talk aout this stuff in a publicly logged channel like two years ago
< 1363371808 716573 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that decision was publically logged, so he had to discard it
< 1363371861 940010 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :According to this, since I haven't yet been employed by the recruitment firm, I can freely talk about what I know about the company
< 1363371864 638874 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thin
< 1363371866 480187 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think
< 1363371874 714202 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, they don't /let you talk about the company/? @_@
< 1363371909 861465 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :They don't let me talk about confidential information I learn after my employment with the recruitment firm
< 1363371934 694101 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :... what exactly classifies as confidential information...? and um.  why is the recruitment firm doing the employing o_O
< 1363371962 131297 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know yet what classifies as confidential information
< 1363371964 608314 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeos recruiter is recruiting him for the recruiting form
< 1363371981 604646 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what constitutes classified information is classified
< 1363372011 224406 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :this seems really weird
< 1363372025 154604 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora, the recruitment firm wants to make money off of my employment
< 1363372055 133472 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm... but I thought they get paid by the company when the company hires you?
< 1363372063 986726 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i assign kmc to this job
< 1363372113 380815 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The contract with the firm says the company isn't allowed to hire me without recruitment firm's written consent, but that after 6 months, they can be required to give said consent
< 1363372138 960264 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :This sounds really dumb for a lot of reasons. Is it really dumb?
< 1363372151 546597 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :o_O    I guess I don't really know enough to be sure but that sounds incredibly fishy
< 1363372163 905129 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :is sgeo getting scammed
< 1363372172 181896 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe the company doesn't exist
< 1363372191 866614 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The company is the ISP that I use.
< 1363372203 85400 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm online and not hallucinating right now.
< 1363372217 168797 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, that's what they want you to think
< 1363372223 312737 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :we are Friday.
< 1363372242 744544 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott is the new number two
< 1363372255 944668 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, so Optimum Online have lots of secrets they don't want us knowing about.
< 1363372272 550872 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't hide from us, CSC Holdings, LLC.
< 1363372290 152940 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think this is just standard boilerplate stuff
< 1363372298 741266 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least, standard for this recruitment firm
< 1363372308 928990 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would there NOT be a provision covering confidential information?
< 1363372326 620224 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't trust this boiler. i think this boiler is going to explode and kill somebody who is possibly you, and then a three hundred year old witch will arise from the ashes, cursing her colonialist murderers.
< 1363372327 270912 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, I think that provision is usually in your employment contract
< 1363372333 77114 :AnotherTest1!~AnotherTe@94-224-28-191.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363372334 818323 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thing that you sign when you actually get a real job
< 1363372341 353299 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora, this _is_ my employment contract
< 1363372352 715399 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would be employed with the recruitment firm.
< 1363372353 102909 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://img.optimum.net/images/feedmill/custImage/121003/1349293765966-537x261.JPG they definitely seem suspicious
< 1363372374 495819 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you want to work for a recruitment firm?  but I thought it was an ISP... I'm confused...
< 1363372376 642610 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would you be employed by the recruiting firm?
< 1363372379 777890 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw this sounds shady as all heck lmao
< 1363372385 236270 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would a dog have an mp3 player? he doesn't even have any pockets, where would he put it? it just doesn't add up.
< 1363372386 1056 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :how has this not been ringing alarm bells for you
< 1363372395 916048 :AnotherTest!~AnotherTe@94-224-28-191.access.telenet.be QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1363372398 289355 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: thats probably a telephone. makes perfect sense
< 1363372406 775960 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The people at the company seemed to recognize the firm
< 1363372418 726446 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've heard of things like this before, don't they usually do this to hire innocent victims as contractors so they can pay them half as much, and then toss them after 6 months?
< 1363372447 992973 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: who uses headphones with a telephone??
< 1363372455 198618 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also who calls a cell a "telephone"
< 1363372458 868041 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you an Optimum agent
< 1363372466 729839 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :u figured me out
< 1363372469 300463 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i actually call them mobiles
< 1363372478 177466 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a much better name than cellphone or phone or whtaever
< 1363372484 803291 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they're not really primarily phones any more
< 1363372485 255198 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're talking about witch-talk-boxes? 
< 1363372533 191004 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :miniaturized ENIACs
< 1363372610 534891 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The colloquial Finnish term for them derives from the word for "hand", presumably because that's what you use to hold them.
< 1363372677 983685 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least the colloquial Finnish term that I know, I'm sure them youngsters have completely different words nowadays. (I sound like an old fart.)
< 1363372715 639809 :nortti!~juhani@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: you mean "kännykkä"?
< 1363372724 484571 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :nortti: Yes.
< 1363372738 153961 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, or "känny".
< 1363372739 761516 :nortti!~juhani@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that derived from "käsi"?
< 1363372754 826490 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :nortti: That's what http://fi.wiktionary.org/wiki/k%C3%A4nnykk%C3%A4 claims, and it's also what I thought.
< 1363372777 964696 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, from käsi or kämmen, but it's all handy anyway.
< 1363372795 195202 :nortti!~juhani@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh. trademarked by nokia
< 1363372802 772691 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363372851 232152 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess Germans have "Handy"? So it's not so unique.
< 1363372862 552606 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: hands free 'phones need headphones...
< 1363372899 41848 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :'phones for your 'phones.
< 1363372910 251748 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phonemes in your phones.
< 1363372944 61285 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :always tying it to speech recognition, fizzie
< 1363372986 722309 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should write down somewhere the things that are concerning me
< 1363372990 514137 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's just "speech" in general.
< 1363373002 571183 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm that makes me wonder if it's harder to talk on the phone if you use a language with way different phonemes from whatever phone compression is optimized for
< 1363373032 751566 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code-excited_linear_prediction   I think this is the general category of what they use?
< 1363373043 656029 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: I'm not sure how "way different" (natural) languages go, really. The equipment is, after all, pretty much the same.
< 1363373062 799688 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 QUIT :Quit: Bye
< 1363373066 784087 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The original algorithm as simulated in 1983 by Schroeder and Atal required 150 seconds to encode 1 second of speech when run on a Cray-1 supercomputer." XD
< 1363373095 636900 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: well there's ejective constants off the top of my head. i think the human phonemic inventory is at least twice as big as english's maybe?
< 1363373158 813312 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :How long does it take for the PC speaker to move fully? I read 60ms somewhere, and 1/60000000s elsewhere, but neither seems correct to me?
< 1363373225 452535 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's see, english uses about 35 i guess, but this language !Xū uses 141
< 1363373226 903890 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: Sure, but it's not like it'd be all *that* closely optimized for a particular phoneme set.
< 1363373246 375048 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess that's what i'm wondering.
< 1363373283 914593 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: raw phoneme counts tend to be higher than what is logically understood between speakers of a language. you need to group allophones together.
< 1363373309 807786 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Are you trying to rediscover 6-bit audio through PC speaker?
< 1363373315 117117 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :IPA has "107 letters, 52 diacritics, and four prosodic marks", and I understand it covers things pretty well; and anyway the differences are going to be quite small the more exact you get.
< 1363373337 543463 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see absolutely nothing in the employment contract about the raises that I have been promised.
< 1363373339 507118 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am alarmed.
< 1363373347 490908 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, some sounds tend to be really close by, and the human brain infers what they should be from context. that's how ventriloquists speak, by approximating sounds and letting the ears do the rest.
< 1363373358 834440 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how ver. strange
< 1363373407 492080 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: No, I mean why would you be employed by the recruiting company as opposed to the company you'll be working for
< 1363373410 936778 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's weird
< 1363373421 174865 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I did some googling and it sounds like it works like this
< 1363373425 783696 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :recruiting companies are hired to search for contractors
< 1363373434 74607 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the contractors sign up for the job and sign contracts with the recruiting company
< 1363373447 513673 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the recruiting company charges the main company, takes a gigantic cut of the pay, and gives some to the contractor
< 1363373453 573264 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :recruiting companies sacrifice virgin BSs to the underworld, and bind demons to contracts with their client corporations
< 1363373467 580477 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: PC speaker is only 1-bit audio; I am trying to figure out how to accurately make an emulation of it.
< 1363373471 93771 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a bs?
< 1363373476 893442 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :bachelor of science
< 1363373477 43100 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bachelor's
< 1363373490 292899 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :banks, sganks.
< 1363373526 172006 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Clearly you haven't seen what people have done with it
< 1363373528 296372 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The LP model (which CELP still is based on) is arguably designed more based on the speech hardware than the speech wetware, anyway. (Though I suppose the "hardware" in this case is pretty wet too.)
< 1363373543 342735 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like ocal cords?
< 1363373545 75284 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :vocal
< 1363373546 803360 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: "What people have done with it" is, I think, the reason for the "accurate emulation".
< 1363373548 199220 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Either way, you could look at the way dosbox emulates it
< 1363373584 721771 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: The hardware is only 1-bit, but you can push out 6-bit sound with cleverness
< 1363373588 531978 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which was my point
< 1363373613 684538 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does DOSBox do consider all of that stuff? Also, would some filters be needed?
< 1363373623 870326 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct_Stream_Digital   oh this was that 1-bit audio compssion method
< 1363373650 357834 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: Yes, and my point is that that is the reason why "accurate emulation" is necessary.
< 1363373651 271541 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's 1,193.18 kHz 1-bit. If you're fucking clever you could actually dither that up such that the quantization noise is 20+ kHz.
< 1363373667 948384 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then you've got utterly reasonable audio.
< 1363373688 623345 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine what people actually *did* was somewhat simpler, just because of computational resources, though.
< 1363373689 559126 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Dosbox does emulate it pretty accurately
< 1363373710 455039 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does Adlib pretty well too
< 1363373739 939998 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually haven't seen any more-accurate Adlib emulation than in Dosbox
< 1363373742 473061 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find on the real PC speaker, some high tones play a bit differently than others?
< 1363373759 11213 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: Is that OPL3?
< 1363373811 713304 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yeah, I at least *think* what you're looking at is resampling 1-bit 1.19318 MHz audio to 16-bit 44.1 kHz.
< 1363373823 19232 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Adlib is OPL2
< 1363373838 962015 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dosbox does emulate OPL3 too though
< 1363373844 351233 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, it is OPL2. Well, DOSBox also emulates OPL3; but does that work as good?
< 1363373844 591072 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(given how the PC speaker works I'm pretty sure it's PCM like that)
< 1363373859 302949 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes
< 1363373866 584078 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363373899 22277 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Crazy high noise floor of course, but what can you do?
< 1363373923 909973 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I once found a OPL2 and OPL3 instrument maker program, it didn't work natively but it works on DOSBox.
< 1363374001 62109 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :fasttracker II had a pc-speaker output
< 1363374023 925061 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a well-known PC speaker soundcard driver for Windows 3.x.
< 1363374044 438410 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I think pretty much anyone would have been able to make a speech thing clone, and have fasttracker output through that instead
< 1363374055 90515 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which would give significantly better quality than any pc speaker
< 1363374150 407025 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :VGM format supports OPL2 and OPL3, and even OPL4, and can even have two of each, but there is currently no support for PC speaker.
< 1363374154 931405 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there's an ALSA driver too? 
< 1363374321 126640 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :This OPL2 instrument maker can be used to test instrument sounds for OPL2 and OPL3 (it does support the waveforms of OPL3, but not 4-operator channels). I have already written a program to test instrument sound of OPLL. (Both programs require emulators, but a different emulator)
< 1363374422 72171 :AnotherTest1!~AnotherTe@94-224-28-191.access.telenet.be QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1363374438 31234 :AnotherTest!~AnotherTe@94-224-28-191.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363374440 251633 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Speaking of PC speakers, it seems that these days it's not uncommon to have a (crummy, but still a) speaker wired to the onboard audio chipset so that it can make real sounds without any cleverness. That's the case with both of my workstations at work.
< 1363374584 42786 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a PC speaker in this computer too. However emulation should still be required since some are not implemented perfectly and you might want to run the program on a computer which is not a PC, too.
< 1363374759 384458 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The different tone of the high notes might have to do with the time to move the speaker, or of the duty cycle (which is as close to 50% as possible, but not always exactly)?
< 1363374933 689723 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1363375033 442420 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is different to many sound chips that make square waves, which will use the period for half of the wave cycle instead of the full wave cycle (or, if you can adjust the duty cycle, usually whatever the smallest duty is).
< 1363375853 748818 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the plus side: I can leave without penalty as long as I give 5 days notice, and there's no non-compete if I leave
< 1363375909 736850 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :downside is you'll be leaving the recruiting firm rather than an employer because you're being scammed or something??
< 1363375982 319268 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I kind of burned a bridge with the internship possibility :(
< 1363375983 865865 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :downside to a plus side? this is hard.
< 1363375999 211359 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Said that I'm no longer looking for an internship)
< 1363376024 78892 :AnotherTest!~AnotherTe@94-224-28-191.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1363376041 777359 :AnotherTest1!~AnotherTe@94-224-28-191.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363376405 421961 :AnotherTest1!~AnotherTe@94-224-28-191.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds
< 1363376647 590496 :carado!~user4539@2a01:e35:8b61:e430:6ef0:49ff:fe73:1fd0 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1363376664 475534 :AnotherTest!~AnotherTe@94-224-28-191.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363376679 96494 :carado!~user4539@2a01:e35:8b61:e430:6ef0:49ff:fe73:1fd0 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363376688 691878 :AnotherTest!~AnotherTe@94-224-28-191.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice, ipv6
< 1363376706 579404 :AnotherTest!~AnotherTe@94-224-28-191.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why doesn't my ISP do that
< 1363376831 99755 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the day we'll all be on ipv6 is the day ipv8 will be out.
< 1363376969 551081 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happened to ipv5
< 1363376981 497366 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think that's a dead experiment for streaming
< 1363377045 151099 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Version 5 was used by the experimental Internet Stream Protocol.)
< 1363377100 831987 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t 'a' :: a
< 1363377102 515211 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :    Couldn't match type `a1' with `Char'
< 1363377102 664650 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :      `a1' is a rigid type variable bound by
< 1363377102 664749 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :           an expression type signature: a1 at <interactive>:1:1
< 1363377168 628395 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :???
< 1363377376 3102 :AnotherTest!~AnotherTe@94-224-28-191.access.telenet.be QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1363377580 62055 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363377627 106046 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hellørjan.
< 1363377635 985473 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloily
< 1363377667 54972 :augur!~augur@129-2-129-34.wireless.umd.edu QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1363377702 979762 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :<elliott> I was starting to believe fizzie killed you and hid the body and was just running an IRC client to hide the truth <-- i take it this was the obvious explanation.
< 1363377799 376266 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :finland, etc
< 1363377963 72598 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :<Bike> don't worry, they'll be a new stereotypical enterprise language soon enough. <-- it will be based on haskell, but watered down to be codeable by enterprise drones, in a way that completely ruins the advantages of the language. </prophetic>
< 1363378011 855083 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :like how java is "just" "a" watered down "small" "talk"
< 1363378029 487252 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: are you thinking about F#?
< 1363378036 286386 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is Scala watered down?
< 1363378048 398320 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happens if you water down water?
< 1363378056 607008 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, scala is watered up
< 1363378058 484911 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :scala might be watered up java
< 1363378060 140587 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Homeopathy.
< 1363378074 205973 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah. I forgot.
< 1363378074 355611 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :watering up sounds like it means exactly the same as watering down
< 1363378089 535800 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :inflammable
< 1363378120 499806 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: well F# is based on ocaml... but is it watered down enough to be coded by drones?
< 1363378139 360764 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :->
< 1363378166 237585 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :~duck ->
< 1363378166 876241 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :<pre><code>Usage: &#x28;-&gt; x&#x29;
< 1363378167 26242 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :       &#x28;-&gt; x form&#x29;
< 1363378167 26435 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :       &#x28;-&gt; x form &amp; more&#x29;
< 1363378167 26592 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :</code></pre> Threads the expr through the forms. Inserts x as the
< 1363378167 26702 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :second item in the first form, making a list of it if it is not a
< 1363378167 26809 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :list already. If there are more forms, inserts the first form as the
< 1363378167 26942 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :second item in second form, etc.
< 1363378188 251949 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1363378200 831947 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow what
< 1363378213 528788 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the hell does duck do anyway
< 1363378215 335900 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds fungotty.
< 1363378215 749202 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: and no web browser or file manager stinks, and the extended s42 networking support)
< 1363378216 855489 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :~duck ~duck
< 1363378217 52735 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :--- No relevant information
< 1363378225 48300 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wiseguy, eh
< 1363378225 198415 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :~duck duck duck go
< 1363378225 718257 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Duck Duck Go is a search engine based in Valley Forge, Pennsylvania that uses information from crowd-sourced sites (like Wikipedia) with the aim of augmenting traditional results and improving relevance.
< 1363378246 475110 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :~duck ~duck ~goose
< 1363378246 644451 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :--- No relevant information
< 1363378248 309567 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :o
< 1363378263 950920 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :~duck llama llama duck
< 1363378264 570499 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :--- No relevant information
< 1363378270 618646 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: not sure about that, probably just watered down enough to be useless for non-drones
< 1363378342 908223 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :for your late friday enjoyment: http://youtu.be/HbPDKHXWlLQ
< 1363378385 965989 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot?
< 1363378386 320007 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: of course the command processor's initialization logic. it's pretty easy to do
< 1363378395 895347 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:06:03 <oerjan> <Bike> don't worry, they'll be a new stereotypical enterprise language soon enough. <-- it will be based on haskell, but watered down to be codeable by enterprise drones,  in a way that completely ruins the advantages of the language. </prophetic>
< 1363378396 45005 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like some things about LLVM but I also think some parts of it are badly designed and many things it doesn't do, the way to fix it seems making an entirely new one, which does not have this problem.
< 1363378401 933041 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i believe you will find this exists and is called "scala".
< 1363378406 366435 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :except it's even more complex somehow.
< 1363378448 275382 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking of Curry-Howard with logic having numbers, and I have some idea of it.
< 1363378468 927202 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It could be, the equality now means a type of a bijective function between finite types.
< 1363378490 793311 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that it?
< 1363378630 39685 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: the sound quality of that clip is amazing
< 1363378698 751228 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know i didn't mean "stereotypical" to imply that you should stereotype it
< 1363378750 762551 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monotyping is just too restrictive, Bike
< 1363378761 47748 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: I think it is part of the experience. maybe.
< 1363378785 809179 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: if I could choose, I might choose not to experience that part
< 1363378806 796898 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :please tell me "stereo" isn't actually used in type theory, i have enough trouble with the colloquial vs the psychological
< 1363378826 444161 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: well there's monotypes and polytypes
< 1363378833 341574 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be cute to refer to the latter as stereotypes
< 1363378846 529411 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :stereo is two though
< 1363378849 236305 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: But what if they are more than that?
< 1363378916 324666 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you could mean stereo to be a rank-1 type or something!!!
< 1363378953 497349 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, perhaps it can?
< 1363379188 499419 :nooodl_!~nooodl@91.177.19.186 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363379406 689065 :nooodl!~nooodl@91.177.55.142 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1363379558 487709 :epicmonkey!~epicmonke@188.134.41.112 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1363379592 554611 :Nisstyre!~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1363379618 755984 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is how I described, how Curry-Howard would work with logic having numbers?
< 1363379773 881927 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :<elliott> except it's even more complex somehow. <-- aka "it doesn't fit my prophecy at all"
< 1363379799 803692 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the monomorphism restriction seems... weid
< 1363379803 840995 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have now finished writing the recording for the Dungeons&Dragons that I played on Monday.
< 1363379808 946747 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: :'(
< 1363379851 697650 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: you do recordings too? I thought I was quite alone doing that.
< 1363379873 726195 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: I didn't know you do it. Well, now you know!
< 1363379904 357141 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zzo38computer.org/dnd/recording/level20.tex
< 1363379920 765988 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in tex too? same here.
< 1363379922 712105 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :<Bike> stereo is two though <-- the non-sound-related meanings of stereo- have nothing to do with "two".  its greek meaning is supposedly "solid".
< 1363379937 218593 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooooo that sounds way too usable in types
< 1363379942 937261 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't give people ideas!
< 1363379949 910471 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: O, I didn't know that either! Now I do know. But, what macros have you used with it? (I used a macro file I wrote myself for this purpose.)
< 1363379970 262167 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, how did "solid" come to mean two-channel audio?
< 1363379975 589356 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok the picture-related ones also indicate "two"
< 1363379981 982006 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: plain old latex. just a moment, let me find where I stashed them...
< 1363380032 142572 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: it vaguely means "three-dimensional".
< 1363380055 239110 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: OK. Yes, that is what a lot of people use, and you can use it if you want, but I find the other one better.
< 1363380125 333297 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: But neither stereo sound or stereo video are three-dimensional (although stereo video is used to simulate 3D).
< 1363380146 881808 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: they make the _illusion_ of three-dimensionality
< 1363380164 249470 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Yes, I suppose they do that.
< 1363380183 763053 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though ambisonics could actually be said to be three dimensional in some form.
< 1363380199 802560 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, ambisonics could be three dimensional.
< 1363380211 305917 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If you are using three-dimensional ambisonics.)
< 1363380212 379000 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(surround sound scheme where you basically specify spherical harmonic parameters)
< 1363380252 873337 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think each of those get related to "two" because the fact that we have two eyes and two ears means two channels is enough to make the illusion half convincing.
< 1363380258 644787 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: darn. don't have them with me, only on my home comp.
< 1363380276 221396 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we had three ears, stereophonic sound would require three speaker >:)
< 1363380282 656446 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*speakers
< 1363380288 699205 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell boily good monday morning! this is myself from last friday. I forgot to forward the logs to zzo38.
< 1363380289 84376 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can tell yourself!
< 1363380295 72311 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think ambisonics is something like YUV but with audio?
< 1363380325 487219 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: OK, then you can get when you want to, later, if you want to. To compile my file, you will need the file dungeonsrecording.tex which is in the same directory.
< 1363380373 62312 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Well, perhaps if it was, that is what would be called stereophonic sound; but now stereo sound is two channels so if someone has three ears they would still use stereo with two channels, I would think.
< 1363380398 649898 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you have a Haskell program return a unix return value?
< 1363380428 821721 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: Yes.
< 1363380457 322867 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :main :: IO Int?
< 1363380463 292629 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :No.
< 1363380480 20497 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need the library which tells it to return the return codes.
< 1363380539 517536 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :<Bike> the monomorphism restriction seems... weid <-- it's basically "things that look syntactically like they should only be evaluated once must be able to easily be implemented as being evaluated only once." the rest follows from how typeclasses are usually implemented with dictionary passing.
< 1363380543 495612 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :System.Exit.exitWith :: ExitCode -> IO a
< 1363380577 7282 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: Do you like my recordings?
< 1363380601 592499 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: can't read them now, but they look very promising :D
< 1363380606 200268 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK
< 1363380700 421457 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes, that's just language evolving and solidifying though.
< 1363380714 917460 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Yes, that is what I mean.
< 1363380883 664435 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo -e 'import System.Exit\nmain = exitWith $ ExitFailure 42' > /tmp/tmp.hs && runghc /tmp/tmp.hs; echo $? # just testing
< 1363380890 28280 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :42
< 1363380926 40132 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would it make any sense to take the job, and if I don't get the promised raise, just quit?
< 1363380947 991089 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or should I be trying to get the raises into the employment contract
< 1363380960 596967 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: well, that's the plain identifier = ... version anyway.  the complicatedPattern = ... version (which cannot be fixed with an annotation) is stricter because it can make types stupidly ambiguous.
< 1363381077 276969 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, if you have (a,b) = something and you need _both_ the type of a and b to determine what the type of something should be
< 1363381125 55645 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it makes no sense to have that (typeclass) polymorphic while a and b don't need to be used together.
< 1363381235 909811 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the reason why there is no restriction if typeclasses are involved, is because haskell without typeclasses has full type erasure so actually _can_ use the exact same representation evaluated only once, for all types.
< 1363381244 54167 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*are _not_ involved
< 1363381409 322941 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run interp haskell 'main = print "test"'
< 1363381415 78331 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output.
< 1363381418 685799 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run interp haskell 'main = print "test"'
< 1363381429 119018 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output.
< 1363381434 853680 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sigh*
< 1363381444 700465 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or hm wait
< 1363381458 670952 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`interp haskell main = print "test"
< 1363381463 543932 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output.
< 1363381467 242780 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHATEV
< 1363381650 990514 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has no output, because print :: IO ().
< 1363381667 48706 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well, it takes an argument, but the end result is.)
< 1363381667 736433 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION swats boily -----###
< 1363381696 863450 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION does that anime thing and catches the swatter with his open hands.
< 1363381730 26872 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is not fooled since he has watched nearly no anime
< 1363381799 713280 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> print "test"
< 1363381801 362257 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :  No instance for (GHC.Show.Show (GHC.Types.IO ()))
< 1363381801 511875 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@74.207.243.105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :   arising from a use of ...
< 1363381815 577971 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sensible
< 1363381861 804407 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: but, but... it's a staple! like the school festival and the beach episode and the power of friendship and...!
< 1363381890 921093 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :I KNOW NONE OF THOSE THINGS
< 1363381917 517585 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though you're apparently an anime staple?
< 1363381924 821769 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION magical girl transformation
< 1363381926 338843 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am?
< 1363381941 665317 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: I don't recognize it either, and I've seen a bit of anime at least
< 1363381957 852077 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there's a trope for that...
< 1363381972 643556 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well catching your swatter with open hands is a staple evidently
< 1363381975 595433 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep! that: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BarehandedBladeBlock
< 1363382025 281038 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was hoping for a trope about not recognizing anime tropes
< 1363382036 307765 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora, is your magic want a swatter
< 1363382039 159362 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*wand
< 1363382080 141881 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ummm in an RP I'm in it's a flashlight?
< 1363382208 851107 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you seen the anime "Kaiji"?
< 1363382245 819473 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that the one about Go
< 1363382255 933408 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :No
< 1363382256 304269 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hikaru no Go is the anime about Go
< 1363382260 72483 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes
< 1363382269 783443 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't use a torch as a magic wand
< 1363382271 121073 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forgot how far I got :(
< 1363382271 467391 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, I saw akagi and probably should see kaiji
< 1363382271 966320 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just silly
< 1363382281 994644 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can torch a magic wand
< 1363382294 877301 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora: I saw Akagi too, and I like both of those
< 1363382358 60181 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's a magic flashlight, it blasts beams of light and love at witches
< 1363382425 401733 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll try to sneak something to that effect in our next campaign, and see how it goes from there.
< 1363382446 954722 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: did you get to that episode where he plays Go?
< 1363382495 547490 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiora, so it's like a lightsabre
< 1363383218 980886 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363383259 766178 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Riding Mill is surprisingly easy to get lost in
< 1363383265 527884 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you know they have like 5 village halls?
< 1363383488 420324 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: ooh, you almost have a patch in ghc
< 1363383544 578616 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Except that someone else wrote it?
< 1363383552 530449 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like this situation better.
< 1363383568 830330 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This is a slightly refined version of a patch by shachaf" it says
< 1363383580 563380 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this the empty class things
< 1363383581 322426 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :er
< 1363383583 603961 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zero-parameter calss things
< 1363383583 922039 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1363383589 438312 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it support adding methods
< 1363383591 164244 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlike shachaf's
< 1363383852 325242 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :This sounds ridiculous
< 1363383856 856917 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Link?
< 1363383964 100228 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why doesn't Haskell already have zero-parameter classes?
< 1363383984 732725 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're called types
< 1363384003 165452 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :That isn't exactly the same
< 1363384005 668038 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, wouldn't they have kind Constraint?
< 1363384010 908435 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :sssshhh
< 1363384011 574194 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rather than *
< 1363384017 863701 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Wait, I hope so.
< 1363384020 204055 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you check?
< 1363384024 857122 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Otherwise I don't like it so much.
< 1363384052 356399 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363384056 707080 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, perhaps because they're kind of useless if you don't think about them much?
< 1363384159 65126 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`WeLcOmE {^Raven^} 
< 1363384162 535216 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​{^RaVeN^}: wElCoMe tO ThE InTeRnAtIoNaL HuB FoR EsOtErIc pRoGrAmMiNg lAnGuAgE DeSiGn aNd dEpLoYmEnT! fOr mOrE InFoRmAtIoN, cHeCk oUt oUr wIkI: hTtP://EsOlAnGs.oRg/wIkI/MaIn_pAgE. (FoR ThE OtHeR KiNd oF EsOtErIcA, tRy #EsOtErIc oN IrC.DaL.NeT.)
< 1363384188 992440 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: can you check?
< 1363384203 117841 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nevertheless, it seems that they are just another case of the classes, so it should be supported like multi-parameter are; also, they could be used if you don't define the instance until another module
< 1363384254 338840 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Can you?
< 1363384257 735201 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :My dad's concerned about lack of specification of how many hours I would actually be working
< 1363384297 551788 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, have we accidentally encountered eachother face to face thus destroying the universe yet?
< 1363384356 561086 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net QUIT :Quit: Poulet!
< 1363384419 958314 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1363384454 952382 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: no
< 1363384458 79286 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey everyone.
< 1363384464 260833 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What else might be useful is define types local to a block
< 1363384465 968785 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes back to lurking.
< 1363384479 288042 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quoth the {^Raven^}, "nevermore".
< 1363384481 167632 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}: What is it that you wanted?
< 1363384511 550127 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not psychic.
< 1363384514 314053 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}: wow weren't you here in like 2005
< 1363384518 578514 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
< 1363384524 715595 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used to hang out here an era ago.
< 1363384540 61978 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}: Well, we changed the logs since then.
< 1363384555 943198 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmmm, I guess my memory sucks X-D
< 1363384593 291781 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember you Gregor and a few other peeps.
< 1363384603 953345 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, was I here in 2005?
< 1363384607 390375 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good.
< 1363384607 607654 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forgot when I showed up
< 1363384613 509843 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`pastelogs Sgeo
< 1363384624 309829 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.15649
< 1363384635 129328 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`relcome {^Raven^}
< 1363384635 294424 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}, do you remember me
< 1363384638 408865 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​03{^Raven08^}: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric progr05amm04ing langu02age design05 a06nd deploym12en05t! For 10more 14infor12mat05i06on, che12ck out 07our 08w09iki: h05ttp://eso07langs.org/wiki/Ma10in13_Page. (For the oth12er kind of 06esoterica, try #esoter08ic on13 irc13.da14l.n13et.03)
< 1363384647 741435 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey I was
< 1363384713 354662 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wasn't
< 1363384721 939858 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's been 8 years, I barely remember breakfast.
< 1363384735 357901 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm...
< 1363384741 925590 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm elliott's good twin
< 1363384745 308356 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do I recognize this Raven person?
< 1363384748 936358 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you believe six impossible things before breakfast, now?
< 1363384787 761022 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :You bet. 5 of them are the alarms I vainly hope will awaken me.
< 1363384798 879266 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`pastelogs Raven
< 1363384805 999318 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.10124
< 1363384848 580392 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, may have been before my time.
< 1363384857 273440 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`pastelogs pikhq
< 1363384864 937950 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.5264
< 1363384876 707739 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION waves?
< 1363384937 496801 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a internet protocol for log in to send/receive SQL commands and response?
< 1363384938 52502 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi {^Raven^}
< 1363384945 457580 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey kmc.
< 1363384957 117186 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes it's called any text field on any PHP website
< 1363384961 3102 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was some scary pastelog.
< 1363384978 9195 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}: No; I mean without website and without necessarily PHP
< 1363384993 632489 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc
< 1363384996 745872 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}, on my pastelog, I appear and hold a conversation I remember having... about a year before I knew IRC existed
< 1363385013 483796 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc:
< 1363385045 416216 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Is there separate protocol, though?
< 1363385162 237520 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I think every SQL server package has their own protocol
< 1363385165 470512 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know of a standard one
< 1363385185 41437 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(probably each has several protocols, realistically)
< 1363385233 240128 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps a generic one could be made, then.
< 1363385291 811040 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In case you want to any clients who might connect on the SQL, to be able to operate it remotely.
< 1363385315 752527 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oblig XKCD: http://xkcd.com/927/
< 1363385327 711927 :augur!~augur@129-2-129-34.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363385369 443791 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that is how it works, sometimes.
< 1363385375 900552 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really like USB; it has problems.
< 1363385379 877842 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :need a standard for dealing with multiple competing standards
< 1363385381 59313 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :cell phone chargers have actually become a lot more standard
< 1363385393 338619 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :as have character encodings
< 1363385394 778320 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think my favorite version of that is still zzo38 saying he conforms to a lot of stuff others don't, though
< 1363385405 267304 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: There is, such as internet, we have different port numbers for other protocols.
< 1363385422 828086 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well played.
< 1363385441 696338 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :internet? yeah, i'd say internet
< 1363385456 58754 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess it is an inter net work after all
< 1363385456 729445 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd have to limityourself to lowest common denominator SQL wchich could be limiting in itself
< 1363385470 534739 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQmK1CnwOUI
< 1363385500 873793 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this better than windows 1.0's ads
< 1363385513 9249 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}: To ensure working with everything you will, even though some servers may use additional commands, which might work too even though such thing is not SQL standard and not guarantee working everything.
< 1363385514 556195 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow he does sound drunk
< 1363385531 380992 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :post your.... photographs......
< 1363385578 624749 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes there are different standards, but often they don't even conform, anyways.
< 1363385582 688191 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}, so what have you been up to in the past few years
< 1363385610 987157 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like PostScript and PDF and Microsoft paper format, so I use DVI.
< 1363385633 469925 :jiella!~jiella@gprs-internet-bceef7-124.dhcp.inet.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363385633 619548 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Not all PHP website is SQL anyways.
< 1363385641 35643 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :SQL is a different programming language to PHP.
< 1363385643 670594 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has been getting paid to write programs for a living
< 1363385659 399556 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :crazy
< 1363385661 248469 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}: What programs?
< 1363385726 674255 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :For telephone I use POTS.
< 1363385744 843236 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :smoke POTS everyday
< 1363385759 914036 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mostly large scale websites. Nothing I'd like to talk about though I like to keep my personal and professional lives seperate.
< 1363385768 114109 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK
< 1363385813 819592 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}, did you get asked the Hexham question when you used to be here?
< 1363385837 528481 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, so you don't write any Famicom games?
< 1363385849 503256 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hexham question?
< 1363385851 545001 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-26-83.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hard to get paid to write Famicom games these days, I expect
< 1363385862 721814 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}, do you live in Hexham?
< 1363385868 627412 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nah.
< 1363385872 783078 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I suppose you are correct.
< 1363385876 27328 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about Finland
< 1363385876 518216 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}: wait are you the person who made that Lost Kingdom thing
< 1363385879 123567 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's more like who doesn't write famicom games
< 1363385888 686935 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliot, sure am.
< 1363385897 386890 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i knew the name seemed familiar!!!
< 1363385904 569063 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hear ais523 almost beat it
< 1363385935 270817 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Props, to Calamair without whom it wouldn't have been possible
< 1363385940 994151 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Calamari
< 1363385948 382963 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I have written one Famicom game, called "Famicom Hangman", but I might write more later on, based on some of the games I have made in QBASIC, but a bit different. However, BIGMAZE might be too slow on Famicom because it has to make up a random maze and it uses a slow algorithm to do so.
< 1363386056 869040 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Trivia: the "piet" package on Hackage seems to suck
< 1363386087 417413 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: Do you?
< 1363386102 287105 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't. I am the answer to the question.
< 1363386113 753448 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am the Famicomless spoken of in old legends.
< 1363386176 594554 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, what have I missed in the lasy 8 years or so since I last logged in?
< 1363386231 492971 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Underload
< 1363386236 362521 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty cool esolang
< 1363386246 452662 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :BF Joust?
< 1363386293 293343 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The... wiki changed host?
< 1363386326 131823 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Fancy L problem?
< 1363386344 226820 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...fungot?
< 1363386344 674314 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: like docstrings or something? :p. ugh i need to find more minor details to fiddle in my toy lisp interpreter turned out to be a
< 1363386349 200103 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The chat is made up of different people
< 1363386355 932885 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and HackEgo too probably
< 1363386390 435985 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? Ngevd
< 1363386392 120099 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​�P��=�9hR�3���*9���߳��t��m)��Ϩ�ٰ��qu�!�p \ 5IQ�����x^���i����8�?0BמvaoR�Wz��.�q�P�,��'vֆc���mC~C��e��|��
< 1363386400 496264 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The many names of Taneb?
< 1363386436 674569 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fax and cheaters' banishment?
< 1363386450 886477 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover's Tumblr?
< 1363386458 759716 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The harrowing of hell.
< 1363386517 580484 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey came back to tell elliott to shut up about Scots and then left again.
< 1363386568 143216 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You missed the new language I made that only I seem to care about.
< 1363386574 682945 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, you also missed PSOX
< 1363386583 441358 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :PSOX came and went
< 1363386584 763319 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You also missed cpressey, maybe.
< 1363386587 121787 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Another thing that only I care about)
< 1363386619 463303 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fax isn't banned.
< 1363386623 718904 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :PSOX, awesome
< 1363386630 968597 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, did you read that one thesis on trusting trust?
< 1363386632 198548 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually only cheater and dbelange are banned.
< 1363386641 224950 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :A bit like PESOIX only more implemented
< 1363386663 470062 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike, funny thing is, I never actually read it
< 1363386667 696394 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :For all that it's inspired me
< 1363386712 411043 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well don't feel bad, nobody else has read it either
< 1363386720 782845 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a lot like worse is better probably
< 1363386770 970028 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}: you are still too early to miss Feather.
< 1363386782 974709 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i read the original reflections on trusting trust, it's accessible so why wouldn't you
< 1363386788 403640 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't read the defeating trusting trust thing
< 1363386795 617006 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadly nothing like PESOIX and PSOX has taken off.
< 1363386822 326156 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.dwheeler.com/trusting-trust/ this one
< 1363386842 175021 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I recall someone did write a nice POSIX PESOIX layer.
< 1363386844 616278 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybet hat's the one Bike meant.
< 1363386853 623120 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :since the original one isn't a thesis
< 1363386857 768570 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that's what i was thinking of
< 1363386861 528896 :jiella!~jiella@gprs-internet-bceef7-124.dhcp.inet.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1363386882 50463 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}: you have also missed ///
< 1363386896 848944 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the mass Haskellization.
< 1363386916 398614 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what was there before the mass Haskellization
< 1363386926 156975 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :On topic discussion.
< 1363386934 412716 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoa
< 1363386935 265644 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :everybody were diehard snobol programmers
< 1363386935 511750 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no there wasn't :P
< 1363386938 746319 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :technically i think you may have missed LOLCODE, i'm mentioning this only to annoy the others.
< 1363386950 472234 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-219-9.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eff you. :P
< 1363386951 964428 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and ESME.
< 1363386953 859741 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember writing a few CGI programs in pure BF back then.
< 1363386981 570556 :jiella!~jiella@gprs-internet-bceea6-97.dhcp.inet.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363386992 644099 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`welcome jiella 
< 1363386995 300119 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :jiella: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.)
< 1363387013 172076 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1363387053 424440 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :despite Phantom_Hoover's best intentions, you have also missed a heap of brainfuck derivatives.
< 1363387115 328402 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, would you say MIBBLLII is a brainfuck derivative
< 1363387165 648946 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: well then it would obviously be in the category, wouldn't it?  duh.
< 1363387188 840423 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was inspired by the concept of brainfuck derivatives
< 1363387232 931822 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i recall when i arrived Backflip was one of the first new languages.  so since i arrived after you left, you probably missed that.
< 1363387258 814089 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact we've pretty much forgotten it, even though ais523 made derivatives of it.
< 1363387282 86331 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: ha, i like it
< 1363387292 357033 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :was Emmental around back then? and Jolverine, those are cpressey languages i recall working on.
< 1363387307 39649 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Qdeql.
< 1363387321 518875 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh is bckw just a superset of ski
< 1363387345 281535 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :a superset of a subset of ski
< 1363387362 211670 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, < doesn't seem to be in bcwksdkfasd
< 1363387365 307742 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: a re-basing, so to speak.
< 1363387379 284418 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :is k in bckw the k in ski?
< 1363387392 981119 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1363387398 637111 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :S is some garbage, though
< 1363387401 134279 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :p.s. single-combinator bases are way cooler
< 1363387417 4153 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mibbllii has more combinators. clearly software bloat.
< 1363387431 491356 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :you missed Real Fast Nora's Hair Salon 3: Shear Disaster Download
< 1363387452 8559 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, looking at the title, are esolangs still on topic?
< 1363387464 355862 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike, BCKW and SKI are similar but different
< 1363387464 746519 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :ostensibly yes
< 1363387470 855274 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find BCKW easier to code with
< 1363387497 48007 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}: the _title_ isn't always on topic.  more so now than usual, actually.
< 1363387498 619069 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}: as you can see the people in the channel still know things about them.
< 1363387506 770750 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe that's a misuse of ostensibly if it doesn't actually say anywhere that esolangs are on topic
< 1363387520 345405 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :ostensibly off topic, supposedly on topic, actually not usually on topic
< 1363387537 888824 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i can't think of a single-combinator base off the top of my head, fuck
< 1363387550 765257 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike, there's Iota's i
< 1363387555 835115 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i = \x -> x S K
< 1363387563 644274 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think zzo38 arrived after me, so all his languages, such as Flogscript
< 1363387574 940729 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, that works
< 1363387604 172252 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has some nefarious plans but nothing that actually has any code behind yet.
< 1363387639 523191 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it a bf derivative i bet it is
< 1363387649 524710 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course many others arrived after me, but zzo38 was _very_ prolific at the beginning.
< 1363387717 980084 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :imo the topic of #esoteric should be the topic of #esoteric
< 1363387746 653833 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :good opinion. approved
< 1363387749 231941 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :recursive topics, nice
< 1363387802 740467 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: who died and made you opinion police
< 1363387814 251613 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Gandhi.
< 1363387819 951234 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1363387855 342775 :augur!~augur@129-2-129-34.wireless.umd.edu QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1363387862 569682 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363387874 394851 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't say I approved it.
< 1363387889 948521 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, Eodermdrome.
< 1363387924 910542 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: i was shooting the figurative messenger
< 1363387926 467874 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, why didn't i list it on my article page, i proved it TC
< 1363388034 968095 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should make another esolan
< 1363388036 617274 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :esolang
< 1363388046 415240 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fucktrust
< 1363388066 967713 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should it be more Trust-ish languages, or something else?
< 1363388074 253338 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really don't have any other ideas :(
< 1363388091 694934 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :whenever you feel inesolangadequate just remember that i don't even have a wiki account
< 1363388116 110850 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And my first esolang was an Ook! derivative
< 1363388127 521735 :nooodl_!~nooodl@91.177.19.186 PRIVMSG #esoteric :make a programming language that's a game engine
< 1363388152 441107 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, braintrust is not my first esolang
< 1363388160 223658 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know that
< 1363388162 88689 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just I suck
< 1363388202 416410 :nooodl_!~nooodl@91.177.19.186 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the interpreter is a game. code is inputted and executed by performing tasks in-game
< 1363388205 408183 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Going to read some Paranoia Live logs
< 1363388233 474179 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooodl_, there was a PS2 game like that, I believe
< 1363388238 36207 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only released in Japan
< 1363388312 923596 :Fiora!~Fiora@ec2-50-17-93-47.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :RPG Maker?
< 1363388346 462723 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm still surprised Fueue is turing complete
< 1363388380 754318 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :...how could it not be.
< 1363388389 126287 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno
< 1363388398 536957 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: who needs ideas when you have desire & ambition
< 1363388407 342541 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless it were obviously restricted like Ftack
< 1363388436 491016 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Unimplementable) esolang idea:
< 1363388439 532053 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not just turing complete, it's turing complete if you remove like half the instructions
< 1363388473 87689 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}: you also missed Fueue, if i didn't mention it yet.
< 1363388480 840891 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Esolang that would be turing complete except there's one specific calculation that cannot be performed, one program that cannot be run, even by, say, simulating GoL
< 1363388544 701160 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I don't think such thing is possible even mathematically
< 1363388586 648421 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: seems very hard to define properly while still giving an interesting result...
< 1363388586 797265 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure it is. Just check that no parts of the program = the forbidden program, with an implementation in a super-TC language.
< 1363388628 711993 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i suspect in that case, you would find it hard to prove any given program _could_ be run.
< 1363388634 805010 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have a very curious definition of "sure it is"...
< 1363388702 807529 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that program could give you, in an unprovable way, the ability to simulate the forbidden one.
< 1363388765 202627 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: oh well, arithmetic is overrated anyway
< 1363388768 984426 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hm i note that for underload, it is not known how to remove a or * from a program, other than by converting it to a turing machine first...
< 1363388879 16275 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: without a or * there is no way to construct _new_ subprograms, which means if you take the subprograms you start with you almost have a TM by definition.
< 1363388890 636588 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1363388933 441863 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems like there should be a way to do a translation that results in less indirection/program explosion than going through a TM, but what do I know
< 1363388945 10350 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I was thinking of a and * _separately_
< 1363389007 38192 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i think there can only be a constant factor difference.
< 1363389028 931284 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok if you do them _separately_, maybe...
< 1363389045 870824 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :a just gives you a sort of added counter ability.
< 1363389094 517928 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have thought before that you can remove either a or *, _and_ ~ without dropping all the way down to a minsky machine.
< 1363389143 468969 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363389161 854875 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is just thinking that it would be interesting to a have an underload program --> :()^ program that works subset by subset, rather than involving a big first leap of conversion to TM then compilation
< 1363389168 852300 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :...i suppose removing just * would probably allow you to do something resembling brainfuck with unbounded calls
< 1363389169 3688 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*:()^ program transformation
< 1363389180 853674 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cells
< 1363389192 15057 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :cells _and_ tape
< 1363389359 143009 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/1adb56/wikimedia_enables_lua_scripting_for_page_content/
< 1363389444 92470 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks
< 1363389486 215471 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :good strikethrough
< 1363389545 627168 :monqy!~help@pool-98-108-214-230.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: hello
< 1363389738 736226 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mediawiki markup is a thing of beauty
< 1363389748 253699 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like pointy lisp
< 1363389793 368422 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I happen to like MediaWiki format too, compared to other wiki
< 1363389795 626335 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :does hackego have a function to spit out a link to the wiki for a given term?
< 1363389941 68708 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mediawiki is shit and yet i've yet to see another wiki system that isn't annoyingly awkward
< 1363389975 107823 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wiki maybe
< 1363389976 355608 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: wiki: not found
< 1363389981 830147 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^wiki maybe
< 1363389981 980602 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/maybe
< 1363390062 562388 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Esolang interpreters right on the Esowiki pages!
< 1363390141 2313 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, yes, OK, but still I like MediaWiki syntax compared to other wiki.
< 1363390143 597205 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`paste bin/wiki
< 1363390146 464364 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/bin/wiki
< 1363390160 762065 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :helpful
< 1363390168 200082 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh
< 1363390171 363561 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right im dumb
< 1363390176 82067 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, fix that
< 1363390818 215518 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoa
< 1363390834 650224 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :My Tumblr profile picture's cropped so it says "CE CREAMS HER"
< 1363390863 660545 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :a clear case of karma.
< 1363390867 11427 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sex acts with obscure pronouns are most tolerant sex acts
< 1363390867 161304 :{^Raven^}!~Raven@cpc5-shef11-2-0-cust141.barn.cable.virginmedia.com PART :#esoteric
< 1363390918 737784 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg
< 1363390942 398007 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :raven's isp hub thing is in sheffield
< 1363390948 216559 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's dangerously close to hexham
< 1363390956 762382 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :he was already asked.
< 1363390959 695394 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's like 100 miles away from Hexham
< 1363390992 601223 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :look
< 1363390999 292558 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's in The North
< 1363391008 609378 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://maps.google.co.uk/
< 1363391009 543943 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is TOO CLOSE FOR COMFORT
< 1363391011 170342 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait
< 1363391015 893053 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?saddr=hexham&daddr=sheffield&hl=en&sll=52.8382,-2.327815&sspn=7.728394,20.214844&geocode=FfnQRgMdcMXf_ykVmDENYpB9SDEEwA0heCs6qA%3BFQmILgMde5Hp_ykVvuj6qQp5SDF4sAav9ScoPg&t=h&mra=ls&z=8
< 1363391029 228385 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sheffield's practically midlands!
< 1363391040 414774 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's closer to ais523 than it is to me!
< 1363391049 555281 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have heard people say nottingham is where the north starts
< 1363391057 167648 :nooodl_!~nooodl@91.177.19.186 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow hexham is very Northern
< 1363391060 20597 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :relatedly: warwick is so full of southerners i feel so alone
< 1363391094 187601 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, that's your own fault for not abusing free university education in Scotland
< 1363391103 308874 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :abusing???
< 1363391124 749501 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not our fault we're politically disconnected from the south
< 1363391141 102506 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think {^raven^} gvae up on us
< 1363391146 715577 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also gave
< 1363391159 685275 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: btw someone should update ^wiki
< 1363391165 486776 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am pinging you for absolutely no reason!
< 1363391173 939801 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone, n. fizzie
< 1363391208 187679 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :^src wiki
< 1363391210 41689 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^show wiki
< 1363391210 191202 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :+13[>+9>+9>+8>+4<4-]>3.<2-..-4.>3+6.-11..<-3.<-2.<-.>+.>.<-2.<-6.>2-2.>-.<2+4.>+12.<+2.<-4.>-12.>+.<-7.>+2.<+.-.<-2.>2+2.>.<2+9.<+2.>2.>+.<+3.-14.+2.-2.>.,[.,]
< 1363391233 855688 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen http://esolangs.org/wiki/
< 1363391273 192555 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds
< 1363391287 262431 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`interp bf_txtgen http://esolangs.org/wiki/
< 1363391291 62606 :nooodl_!~nooodl@91.177.19.186 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the hexhammian english accent like
< 1363391292 876268 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also: wow yorkshire is altogether too big
< 1363391299 751806 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed
< 1363391300 744079 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :171 +++++++++++++++[>++++>+++++++>+++++++>++++++++<<<<-]>>>-.>----..<<+++++++.<--.-----------..>>---.<+++.>>-----.---.<----.>++.<++++++.<.<-.>>>+.+++.<.<<+.>++++.>++.++.--.<<. [864]
< 1363391308 831760 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooodl_, northumbrian
< 1363391321 317283 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooodl_, it's a bit like geordie
< 1363391321 994464 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^def wiki bf +++++++++++++++[>++++>+++++++>+++++++>++++++++<<<<-]>>>-.>----..<<+++++++.<--.-----------..>>---.<+++.>>-----.---.<----.>++.<++++++.<.<-.>>>+.+++.<.<<+.>++++.>++.++.--.<<.,[.,]
< 1363391322 144168 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Defined.
< 1363391328 436280 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^wiki Esme
< 1363391328 585883 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Esme
< 1363391335 542306 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooodl_, illustrative example courtesy of google: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTfC1BIgTCw
< 1363391345 344781 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooodl_, but with a bit of posh English in it too
< 1363391356 759061 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably representative of elliott's voice
< 1363391358 430563 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: pls save kthxbye
< 1363391369 622443 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, the Northumbrian accent is mainly further North
< 1363391399 630867 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you picked the optimal article to test it on, too
< 1363391409 767628 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Starting from Blyth and ending near Berwick
< 1363391432 819733 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fading from Geordie to Borders Scottish
< 1363391451 600743 :nooodl_!~nooodl@91.177.19.186 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yikes
< 1363391477 825508 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i know right?
< 1363391478 829827 :nooodl_!~nooodl@91.177.19.186 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is this true (ph's link)
< 1363391480 860616 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't really have an accent
< 1363391483 70517 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1363391486 373491 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :except like vaguely british
< 1363391488 507021 :nooodl_!~nooodl@91.177.19.186 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok good
< 1363391498 49196 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :élliott
< 1363391510 52984 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yeah, the Hexham accent is somewhere between vaguely british and geordie
< 1363391551 609240 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have an accent!!
< 1363391566 403511 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, i used to think that but apparently my accent is identifiably scottish
< 1363391567 108526 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a ridiculous accent
< 1363391595 821774 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't have an accent, Ø is a perfectly undivided letter
< 1363391596 866589 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm now imagining Phantom_Hoover with a somewhat confused thick Glaswegian accent)
< 1363391609 608987 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(all the more confused because he's not from Glasgow)
< 1363391614 757591 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are the actual worst
< 1363391621 308784 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would stab you but i'm not from glasgow
< 1363391634 452003 :nooodl_!~nooodl@91.177.19.186 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if only i could hear talk_esme_baby
< 1363391635 365814 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: well I assume there's some rhoticity in mine. I forget whether it's the rhotic kind or the non-rhotic kind
< 1363391637 990377 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know on twitter glasgow is being bombed right now
< 1363391641 544675 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also have the worst accent
< 1363391656 152431 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: twitter has bombs now?
< 1363391661 869366 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a kind of nasal upper class Northern english with slight Australian and Dutch twinges
< 1363391688 850996 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the hexham accent is thoroughly rhotten
< 1363391690 567111 :Bike!~Glossina@207-224-22-243.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://twitter.com/RealTimeWWII/status/312604111843495936 bombed... by terrorists
< 1363391691 450657 :nooodl_!~nooodl@91.177.19.186 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds very good taneb
< 1363391718 579342 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: well that's just regular glasgow
< 1363391721 757038 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote glasgow
< 1363391724 111456 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :460) <Phantom_Hoover> Riots in Glasgow would probably be reported as a sudden drop in crime. \ 616) <Phantom_Hoover> No you can't fight crime in Glasgow.  <Phantom_Hoover> It's like trying to get rid of the space-time continuum. \ 784) <Taneb> Phantom_Hoover, like Glasgow but nicer  <Taneb> So, not like Glasgow at all
< 1363391754 720489 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, i stopped doing it when it became mainstream
< 1363391786 140603 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run quote glasgow | tail -c300
< 1363391787 808900 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :over> Riots in Glasgow would probably be reported as a sudden drop in crime. \ 616) <Phantom_Hoover> No you can't fight crime in Glasgow.  <Phantom_Hoover> It's like trying to get rid of the space-time continuum. \ 784) <Taneb> Phantom_Hoover, like Glasgow but nicer  <Taneb> So, not like Glasgow at all
< 1363391794 858185 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :bo ring
< 1363391800 281758 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote Hexham
< 1363391801 477492 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :623) <ais523> also, why isn't monqy from Hexham? his name sounds like he should be \ 692) <ais523> oh right: Frooxius, you wouldn't happen to live in Hexham, would you?  <Frooxius> No, sorry.  <ais523> phew  <Ngevd> How about Finland?  <Frooxius> Why would I live there?  <fizzie> That's a *very* good question.  <fizzie> Why would anyone? \ 956) <bo
< 1363391814 674330 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run quote hexham | tail -c300
< 1363391816 227735 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :uld you?  <Frooxius> No, sorry.  <ais523> phew  <Ngevd> How about Finland?  <Frooxius> Why would I live there?  <fizzie> That's a *very* good question.  <fizzie> Why would anyone? \ 956) <boily> had a fit of a stroke of genius, and google mapped hexham.  <boily> it's in the friggin middle of nowhere!
< 1363391847 965137 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run quote Hexham | tail -c600
< 1363391849 347823 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :623) <ais523> also, why isn't monqy from Hexham? his name sounds like he should be \ 692) <ais523> oh right: Frooxius, you wouldn't happen to live in Hexham, would you?  <Frooxius> No, sorry.  <ais523> phew  <Ngevd> How about Finland?  <Frooxius> Why would I live there?  <fizzie> That's a *very* good question.  <fizzie> Why would anyone? \ 956) <bo
< 1363391852 848192 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-148-13-114.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope