< 1347148876 651267 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1347148894 52195 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :For a function definition, int main() is identical to int main(void), which is explicitly permitted. < 1347148928 607948 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ISO C also *permits* non-specified types for main, IIRC. < 1347148966 126360 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1347148974 244003 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghci allows Unicode line-drawing characters as operator names < 1347148978 349779 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1347149071 302712 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let (┌────────┐┌─────────────────┐┌────────┐) = (+) in 2 ┌────────┐┌─────────────────┐┌────────┐ 3 < 1347149072 498441 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 5 < 1347149257 975234 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1347149622 939107 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (`div`) 2 3 < 1347149623 830335 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : : parse error on input `)' < 1347149658 994520 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 2 `+` 3 < 1347149659 887201 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : : parse error on input `+' < 1347150726 817909 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 2 `(+)` 3 < 1347150727 759805 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : : parse error on input `(' < 1347150730 86916 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bah < 1347150799 721927 :sivoais!~zaki@199.19.225.239 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1347150839 344633 :sivoais!~zaki@199.19.225.239 JOIN :#esoteric < 1347151116 628043 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no way to use `` on anything but an alphanumeric identifier, alas < 1347151360 133147 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Quit: Are you telling me you can build a time machine but you can't cook a cheese soufflé? You've got your priorities all wrong! < 1347151449 234927 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, hello from Portland, Oregon. < 1347151454 541186 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there not a good lint for C anymore? < 1347151457 816167 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :splint doesn't support C99... < 1347151461 88240 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Time zones are kinda weird. < 1347151474 265322 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :HELLO FROM THE FUTURE < 1347151500 998131 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :portland, oregon, isn't that were Gregor is < 1347151508 239860 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know. < 1347151518 410408 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor at least has been here, since he spoke of the food in here. < 1347151544 322857 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess he may be the kind of person who does moving and stuff. < 1347151575 212267 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :*is from < 1347151584 780264 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1347151629 136839 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :HELLO FUTURE GOOD TO SEE YOU ARE STILL ALIVE < 1347151744 680514 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woke up at 3am to catch the flight from Helsinki, and it's now 3:49am the next day in Finland, but here it's supposedly still Saturday, and it's just getting to be 6pm. < 1347151825 426974 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I am apparently faster than my bags, since I managed to catch the Seattle-Oregon transfer (even with baggage claim + customs + baggage recheck + security check in the way) with 10 minutes to spare, but my bag didn't; it took the next Seattle-Portland flight (an hour later). < 1347151866 989852 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Turns out there was a direct AMS-PDX flight leaving ten minutes before my AMS-SEA, too; I'm a bit confused why they didn't book that for me. I guess this must've been cheaper. (Or maybe I was late.) < 1347151877 935531 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seattle-Portland transfer, I mean. < 1347151903 663948 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Travel is all so confusing. I think I'll go buy stuff. -> < 1347153709 537546 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Almost assuredly price is the reason. < 1347153760 647808 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :who was booking it for you? < 1347153769 872854 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Direct flights are expensive. To the point that a flight from A to B is usually more expensive than a flight from A to C with a layover at B. < 1347153889 892654 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think that's usually the case < 1347153893 317519 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is occasionally the case < 1347154028 637022 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :people on flyertalk seem to think that a) it's rarely the case, and b) airlines don't try very hard to keep you from just leaving the airport at B < 1347154031 616496 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travelbuzz/1349573-intentionally-miss-connection.html < 1347154099 730191 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :expect the rest of your ticket to get cancelled and your checked luggage to get routed to /dev/null < 1347154128 715595 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :The checked baggage is an issue. < 1347154137 773560 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah apparently the insider term for this is "hidden city ticketing" < 1347154184 304184 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I know that it's frequently the case with A=IND, B=ORD. < 1347154200 925962 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/08/magazine/mag-08subversion-t.html < 1347154202 844373 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Err, wait, that's a slightly different case, but same idea. Buying A->B->C to get B->C < 1347154226 238690 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. a flight from IND->SFO via ORD is $159, but a direct from ORD->SFO is $210 < 1347154244 74722 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, i see < 1347154256 460275 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :The SAME direct, mind you :) < 1347154295 503932 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, your destination probably needs to be a major hub for that to work. < 1347154320 485826 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1347154328 635854 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it works when your desired route is a near-monopoly < 1347154404 194446 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, haha, this column is by nate silver < 1347154406 220911 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't even notice < 1347154513 249276 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :checked baggage is best avoided, anyway :) < 1347154757 838896 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: what dates were those flights on? < 1347154780 744277 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would expect ORD-SFO to be reasonably competitive < 1347154835 763208 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a search on Oct 16 finds AA, UA, VX, DL, US all $140 or less < 1347154837 782590 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly non-stop < 1347154881 418477 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :one time i flew DSM-DEN-SFO-LAX which was pretty silly < 1347155124 860850 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think the shortest commercial flight segment I ever took was MSN to MKE < 1347155151 203846 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :unplanned; another plane had crash-landed at Milwaukee and they diverted us to Madison temporarily < 1347155928 224230 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has had it cheaper to fly out of COS rather than DEN before...
< 1347155945 194701 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Keep in mind the flight from COS was a short connecting jump to DEN. < 1347156073 232653 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347156231 106028 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :We have a university-wide quasi-exclusive thing about booking all air traffic via a particular Finnish travel agency. < 1347156262 845663 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :They sent me four suggestions sorted by price and I chose the least annoying-looking one. < 1347156279 660304 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It has a direct PDX-AMS flight on the way back home.) < 1347157171 75205 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I was looking on the 15th, a Saturday. < 1347157185 412721 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: And also, direct flight. < 1347157225 598363 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I just did THE SAME EXACT SEARCH, but now there are tickets for half the price X-D < 1347157229 518364 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Air travel, folks. < 1347157231 264245 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1347157274 220461 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :having prices that go up and back down makes sense < 1347157283 227384 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :from a business perspective < 1347157311 889143 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't really fault them for that, even if it is annoying to the consumer < 1347157384 233525 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bing Travel (formerly Farecast) will attempt to predict whether the price is going to go up or down < 1347157475 302341 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I'm quite accustomed to this nonsense. < 1347157482 20925 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Luckily I never have to pay for my tickets ^^ < 1347157614 208488 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :height scares the hell out of me < 1347157634 155948 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i would rather not travel at all.. < 1347157643 389474 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :the spacial world in general scares me < 1347157683 983997 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Feels weird just to swipe a credit card everywhere; at home we always stick them halfway in and then key in a PIN code. Or if not PINning, then at least sign a piece of paper. < 1347157808 593481 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1347157924 926540 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i feel important with my debit card :3 < 1347157944 303785 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i used to have a mere keycard < 1347158027 152302 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :height scares the hell out of me, but not on planes fortunetely < 1347158035 512877 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*a < 1347158105 920083 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :every part of flying sucks except the part where you're actually in the air < 1347158144 341326 :mig22!~miguelort@bb116-15-65-102.singnet.com.sg JOIN :#esoteric < 1347158213 682306 :TodPunk!~Tod@166-70-93-209.ip.xmission.com QUIT :Quit: This is me, signing off. Probably rebooting or something. < 1347158683 948065 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: KLM's in-flight magazine had a multi-page feature about Trondheim. < 1347158698 937178 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :good, good < 1347158962 114015 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1347158984 183354 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was easier when i was younger, long bus rides < 1347158996 381573 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was interested in the technological expansion < 1347159009 106873 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the projects people were working on < 1347159026 559904 :TodPunk!~Tod@166-70-93-209.ip.xmission.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1347159065 155958 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember the best busride ever was one long trip back from a camp when i was discussing video games with my friend < 1347159099 86621 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :he told me his dad knew something about some video game console supiter jupiter < 1347159122 164470 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :considering that sega had saturn and neptune, i have to wonder if it was actually a real thing < 1347159196 852667 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION thinks of the jupiter ace, but you're too young for that
< 1347159233 566897 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, itidus21 isn't saying he used it himself. < 1347159290 101595 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sega_32X was initially supposed to be called jupiter < 1347159375 787056 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :this bustrip may have been in 1992... < 1347159394 36897 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not sure < 1347159434 548730 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently saturn is pronounced Satān in japanese... < 1347159435 572252 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i started secondary college in 1994 and it was a primary school camp < 1347159449 394942 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Yup. < 1347159456 514086 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so mr satan in dbz might be mr saturn? < 1347159460 83941 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which sounds absolutely nothing like English "satan". < 1347159489 61800 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but does it sound like "satan" in most european languages _other_ than english? < 1347159512 862700 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: sahtahn would be a rough approximation of the sound of it... < 1347159525 519702 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh.. < 1347159531 377668 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbz satan wasnt sataan < 1347159542 476950 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: Nah, it's definitely supposed to be Mr. Satan there. < 1347159550 861061 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :" In 2009, his real name was revealed to be Mark (マーク Māku?), which is a pun on the word "Akuma", meaning "devil/demon" in Japanese. " < 1347159558 90402 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically it sounds like when norwegians are swearing _particularly_ forcefully. got it. < 1347159619 600428 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Japanese long vowels (denoted by that mark over the vowel) aren't different vowels, they are just literally pronounced longer. < 1347159663 372690 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :are they double vowels? < 1347159672 96568 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought you meant the ah's to represent long a's < 1347159692 260876 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I was saying "sahtahn" to approximate the sound in English phonology. < 1347159706 739724 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then commented that a Japanese long a is just a longer Japanese a. < 1347159712 181159 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: Yes, they are pronounced twice as long as a normal vowel. < 1347159719 788409 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: Two morae instead of one. < 1347159748 987788 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :the topic in here is so sensitive to my random comments.. < 1347159756 34039 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's good, same in norwegian (while swedish has a bigger difference...) < 1347159793 622118 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is not good because i just dont actually do esolangs < 1347159798 152733 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :for long vs. short a that is < 1347159834 25721 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i feel like my presence here is killing the channel... < 1347159867 294161 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: We mostly don't esolang here anyways. < 1347159874 911804 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but... < 1347159875 979611 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not you, it's the common trend. < 1347159884 94236 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And predates you, I'm pretty sure. < 1347159885 461039 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so many major projects have formed in the history of #esoteric < 1347159891 964221 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's been more than usual esolanging lately < 1347159913 637398 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :still not a majority conversation < 1347159919 958256 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :the eso lang wiki itself, codu, hackego, fungot, the logs, the quotes < 1347159920 469451 :fungot!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: ok. the errors are just when installing the launcher < 1347159957 872307 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :dwarf fortress sessions, < 1347160000 371096 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i simply don't contribute to such things < 1347160026 709239 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, no one was really talking when you started the topic < 1347160083 483197 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and japanese and linguistics have been discussed here long before you joined < 1347160093 60795 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1347160105 486189 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :^_^ < 1347160126 12638 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe since pikhq started learning it < 1347160145 469156 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which, IIRC, was actually a little *before* I joined this channel, actually. < 1347160151 887844 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :then i guess i was wrong < 1347160152 602856 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though I sucked then. < 1347160204 773494 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was interested in japanese for quite a while... < 1347160209 953325 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i vaguely recall japanese have sucking vowels < 1347160214 497449 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*has < 1347160230 437665 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Does it? < 1347160231 843599 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see the japanese as an example of how interesting a foreign culture can be < 1347160241 732362 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it just unvoiced ones < 1347160258 440262 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :its.. basically i see the whole world is turning to crap < 1347160277 735727 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :a lot of absurd ideals being sought < 1347160284 332782 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The vowels are IPA /a/ /i/ /u/ /e/ /o/. < 1347160293 481044 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :the humanity is being drained away < 1347160340 110729 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :its all about money < 1347160376 301530 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean for example... colonization kills cultures < 1347160408 717453 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :the most warhungry cultures expand the farthest < 1347160640 593888 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i mean to say is, all the interesting aspects of japanese culture are a result of it's long term isolation < 1347160757 275562 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :when cultures are concentrated and left alone to their own devices, things go better < 1347160906 46870 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahhhh my mom is so loud on the phone < 1347160918 759225 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :trying to block it out with music and headphones < 1347160925 352261 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i cant think straight < 1347161130 294737 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PART #esoteric :"ichi ni san yon go" < 1347161842 240475 :TeruFSX!~quassel@65-128-147-76.mpls.qwest.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1347161880 43258 :hagb4rd!~hagb4rd@koln-4d0b785b.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347161945 174456 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am writing the rules for a game called "Sorcery Card". There are 24 ways to play. < 1347162523 206341 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1347162822 927420 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1347166296 276596 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1347166665 532854 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let (×) = (*) in 2 × 3 < 1347166666 594540 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 6 < 1347166697 285543 :hagb4rd!~hagb4rd@koln-4d0b785b.pool.mediaWays.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1347166893 182903 :ogrom!~del@143.122.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee JOIN :#esoteric < 1347167115 625834 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ket (*) = (x) in 2 * 3 < 1347167118 505604 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :woops < 1347167121 647625 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let (*) = (x) in 2 * 3 < 1347167122 721757 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `t1 -> t2 -> t' < 1347167122 930038 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred type ... < 1347167127 518156 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/ < 1347167911 922710 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1347168281 909258 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah! Blakeyrat is a total moron amirite? < 1347168332 89994 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably. < 1347168456 385350 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is reading his "The Linux CLI sucks" thread
< 1347168474 465959 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and he keeps saying incredibly idiotic things < 1347168509 979105 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about it sucks? < 1347168528 731262 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://forums.thedailywtf.com/forums/p/26646/302986.aspx < 1347168538 284660 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Linux CLI is good. In my opinion, he is very wrong. < 1347168549 484241 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have recently written some music yesterday and today. < 1347168568 912860 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, what kind of music? < 1347168582 133486 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, you're right, it is, and he is. < 1347168645 151202 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :soundnfury: http://2a03.free.fr/?p=pub&dir=zzo38 kind of music. (The zzo38_2 is the recent one; read 00README.txt for information) < 1347168684 152649 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, chiptune < 1347168712 858437 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You will need NES/Famicom emulator (or a hardware NSF player) in order to play it. < 1347168741 972668 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, 'fraid I can't be arsed < 1347168780 268103 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'll bookmark it in case my arsedness coefficient increases later < 1347168793 810465 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1347168832 68499 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you want to modify it, that is OK with me. < 1347168974 859285 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unlikely; I know shit all about the Famicom < 1347168982 477365 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a ZX Spectrum fanboi < 1347169002 379924 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno even what cpu the Famicom has. Is it 6502? < 1347169041 940049 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, except it lacks decimal mode. < 1347169094 122985 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You can still set and clear decimal mode, and if the flags are pushed on the stack it will still specify if it is set or not, but it won't affect the operation of addition and so on.) < 1347169119 490225 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, the Z80 doesn't have a decimal mode. It just has N and H flags and a magic "DAA" instruction < 1347169127 742294 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Decimal Adjust Accumulator) < 1347169140 783838 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which, btw, is a pig to implement in an emulator < 1347169183 70437 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :do { bonghits } while (0); < 1347169218 249744 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are you doing while 0? < 1347169231 998996 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an idiom for C macros < 1347169252 769121 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't that just equivalent to { bonghits }? (Brackets retained for scoping-ism) < 1347169254 902009 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://stackoverflow.com/questions/257418/do-while-0-what-is-it-good-for < 1347169255 787896 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :When I learned of that I now do sometimes use do { ... } while(0) in a C macro. < 1347169291 845453 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do! While! 0! Good gods, y'all! What is it good for? Absolutely nothing! < 1347169351 738995 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second answer is actually a totally different use of do { ... } while (0) < 1347169359 445517 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which i don't think i've seen in actual code < 1347169414 36597 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, yes, that is another use, if you do not want to name a label. < 1347169446 304066 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Frankly, if something you want to do takes multiple statements to achieve, I don't think it should be a macro. < 1347169455 477929 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is an idiotic viewpoint < 1347169456 719041 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :inline functions spring to mind < 1347169477 549536 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :many uses of macros cannot be written as inline functions < 1347169478 59576 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, there are some things that macros will do better. < 1347169488 806638 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But some things are better with inline functions. < 1347169498 634391 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example if it needs access to the scope or the control flow (return etc) at the call site < 1347169518 641467 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :longer macros represent a greater savings of duplicated code < 1347169545 290497 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I think I would rather use 'goto' instead of do { ... break; ... } while (0); < 1347169567 758850 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: well if you need that then your control flow is excessively baroque and obtuse < 1347169581 459655 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :goto is unstructured, you savage < 1347169596 481848 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah guys i heard goto is considered harmful so let's write really ugly weird code to avoid it < 1347169603 823197 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :soundnfury: you're just wrong < 1347169604 901391 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: goto is fine, put the raptors away < 1347169605 69918 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :C is excessively baroque and obtuse < 1347169607 117175 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Yes, you can use goto there; unless you don't want a label, or if there are other purposes having to do with macros that you need this break < 1347169617 640115 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: wow, what a reasoned and convincing argument < 1347169621 27924 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :For example if use many times in a macro and you don't want duplicate label names < 1347169627 137321 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, mosh doesn't do color prediction. < 1347169627 164422 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"you're just wrong". I'll have to remember that one. < 1347169633 126104 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :soundnfury: i can't argue against you because you aren't presenting any argument < 1347169636 231701 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :soundnfury: Errors are baroque and obtuse control flow. < 1347169638 483246 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I too would usually use goto in this case. < 1347169641 149759 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Editing a file with syntax highlighting over a slow connection is funny. < 1347169658 167344 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think he's arguing that he's correct. < 1347169692 947330 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I'm arguing that 'doing clever things with macros' encourages you to write code so clever you can't maintain it < 1347169705 895872 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, you can go overboard with macros < 1347169715 635744 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the other hand, you can make things much nicer if you use them right < 1347169730 202408 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but "only one statement per macro" is not a suitable guideline < 1347169758 433555 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, we'll just have to respectfully disagree there < 1347169772 530649 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :right then < 1347169778 792188 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using macros to write multiple statements is not particularly virtuosic < 1347169795 715026 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :A lot of library plumbing is done that way < 1347170087 65896 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :By the way, using ewd rhetoric has about the same effect on people as if you went around riding fixies < 1347170091 677884 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think C macros is useful, although a bit weak. < 1347170124 261747 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :soundnfury: I count over 4000 uses of the "do { ... } while (0)" trick in the Linux kernel codebase < 1347170137 714032 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not holding up Linux as the be-all standard of a beautiful C program < 1347170151 237800 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's a huge codebase worked on by a lot of very smart people < 1347170156 706498 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and apparently a number of them disagree with you ;P < 1347170176 243828 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :\E x. x \in C && pretty x? < 1347170202 767361 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I'm not surprised. There's no One True Brace Style, either, but we're still allowed to hold opinions on which is best < 1347170222 236094 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but allow me some skepticism if you claim that my brace style is "baroque and obtuse" < 1347170222 954791 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's my /opinion/ that "do { ... } while (0)" is Considered Harmful < 1347170237 735397 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that's an arbitrary aesthetic judgement on your part, then fine < 1347170241 883930 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes; and you can program using the brace style you prefer. < 1347170245 363035 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i agree that the need for this extra while loop is ugly < 1347170247 792044 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :A brace style could be baroque and obtuse... < 1347170251 625126 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it is the solution to a problem which needs solving < 1347170251 762173 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if(foo) < 1347170252 482858 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :{ < 1347170253 243130 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In Haskell you can even omit the braces if you prefer.) < 1347170255 366146 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric : bar; } < 1347170273 308329 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd say that's pretty obtuse, but it's valid C so what the fuck, do what you like < 1347170290 970679 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :soundnfury: Yes, do what you like. I don't like that brace style either but use if you want to. < 1347170313 544407 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer: < 1347170318 216007 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :void xyz(void) { < 1347170318 766192 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you started this conversation you really did not seem to be describing an aesthetic preference < 1347170329 956387 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric : if(a) { < 1347170334 262518 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric : bc(); < 1347170336 961793 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric : de(); < 1347170337 874028 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric : } < 1347170338 727118 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :} < 1347170356 174413 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you hate this style then don't use it. < 1347170379 947704 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :soundnfury: your rule about macros is fundamentally unlike a brace style question because I can rewrite any code to use whatever brace style you prefer, but there are many macros I fundamentally can't write with only one statement! < 1347170394 174986 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are limiting the expressiveness of code and not merely imposing an aesthetic rule < 1347170401 746948 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :do { ... } while(0) is one statement, though. < 1347170437 178890 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :another reason to prefer macros over inline functions in C is that macros can be type-generic < 1347170463 358816 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the same macro can work on float or int, or it can work on every struct with a field of some particular name < 1347170470 652295 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Yes they can; there are other things you can do with macros too, though; not only those things! < 1347170478 878520 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :again reducing code duplication, and making things clearer if used tastefully < 1347170486 309163 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But those are some of the things done, and I have done things like that too. < 1347170494 667243 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some things better with functions, though. < 1347170499 978370 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1347170504 263360 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to consider each circumstance < 1347170516 694907 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is why blanket rules like "goto is bad!" or "multi-statement macros are bad!" are bad < 1347170535 226338 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do think that all else being equal, a multi-statement macro should get more scrutiny < 1347170540 341822 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in terms of "am i being too clever" < 1347170546 91929 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree; goto is not bad, and macros is not bad, etc < 1347170550 690530 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :@yarr < 1347170550 860641 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arrr! < 1347170553 842636 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :@quote scrutiny < 1347170554 13019 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ksf says: There's always going to be cases where good programs are rejected. But those who abandon close scrutiny for the sake of ease have earned neither ease nor maintainable programs. < 1347170554 949460 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :one thing that was kind of hard for me to accept is that sometimes, the best way really is just to duplicate some code < 1347170674 921354 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait < 1347170685 49940 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :We are discussing the harmfulness of common C idioms < 1347170688 45722 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes that may be the case. < 1347170689 144081 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :in #esoteric? < 1347170705 485631 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But sometimes macro is better at least my opinion. < 1347170708 224111 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux programmers seem to have gone a bit overboard with this idiom < 1347170716 300075 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :do { current->hardirq_context++; } while (0) < 1347170723 591671 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no need for it here, right? < 1347170733 611548 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In that case it would certainly seem you don't need it. < 1347170750 110850 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it catches some cases of misuse better < 1347170756 514435 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :prevents you from using that expression as an expression < 1347170768 419041 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes that is one possibility. < 1347170781 434859 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, every macro that expands to a statement is placed in do { _ } while(0) < 1347170791 552728 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is some reason for it < 1347170799 171872 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: couldn't you do that with ((void)(current->hardirq_context++)), or am I mistaken? < 1347170808 396108 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly < 1347170817 399356 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :soundnfury: here is a pretty good one: < 1347170822 516935 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Of course, you could still use it in an expression, but not any expr you'd be likely to write) < 1347170831 106928 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define might_sleep() do { __might_sleep(__FILE__, __LINE__, 0); might_resched(); } while (0) < 1347170837 626454 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Consistency can be a reasonable goal in itself. < 1347170850 202135 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: yeah < 1347170859 90429 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :As long as you have to resort to code duplication, it's probably better to have the same pattern everywhere. < 1347170863 466105 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :People are pretty good at patterns. < 1347170868 797950 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1347170885 79483 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes it more likely they will DTRT when they add a second statement to your macro < 1347170887 745611 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they should allow return from a void function to have an expression of a void function call optionally in order to specify tail call hint for the compiler. < 1347170920 548077 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, cute < 1347170944 882073 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But, they don't allow that.) < 1347170994 636177 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :C ought to have void values. < 1347170998 77424 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure gcc ignores almost all voodoo constructs that programmers throw in to hint at optimizations < 1347171002 866294 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, they would be much more useful in C++ than in C. < 1347171019 738311 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then they should allow in C++ as well. < 1347171049 663607 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Justification: template res_t foo(...) { struct { res_t res; run() { res = ...; } s; ...; return s.res; } < 1347171070 183404 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can probably specialize a template on void. < 1347171075 992487 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1347171080 803526 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But then you have to write the code twice. < 1347171103 50828 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if gcc has rules specifically to detect silly tricks people do and turn them into code that's actually good on modern machines < 1347171112 201496 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: GCC does allow that, and I've used that idiom in one case. < 1347171125 868138 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need to specialize templates anyway, because your template probably won't all work the same way for rvalue-refs, lvalues, lvalue-refs, lvalue-const-refs, pointers, or the new atomic types < 1347171127 813207 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not to specify an optimization hint, just to make things clearer. < 1347171149 620887 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: They do? Do other compilers supporting GNU89 (such as Clang) supports that? < 1347171172 138108 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: it probably happens as special cases of some optimizer passes < 1347171213 182918 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Yes, it works in Clang too. < 1347171231 749889 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there any other compilers supporting GNU extensions? < 1347171245 684376 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :icc supports some < 1347171266 410013 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think some GNU extensions are very widely supported < 1347171270 725474 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example // comments in c89 mode < 1347171288 669866 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :icc uses edison's parser < 1347171306 221050 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Calling that a GNU extension is a bit strange. < 1347171309 533707 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Presumably edg implements common extensions < 1347171316 217505 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's... a extension supported by gnu < 1347171331 194677 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: most of them can't be removed at the parsing stage, though < 1347171341 49700 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: gcc doesn't support // comments in c89 mode, actually. < 1347171345 919965 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It supports them in gnu89 mode. < 1347171348 381799 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the entire front-end < 1347171363 848643 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always use GNU89 mode except compiling a program requiring a different mode. < 1347171375 406858 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Intel mainly implements the back-end < 1347171382 957571 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Isn't that true of every mode? < 1347171414 554136 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I am not sure exactly you mean. < 1347171455 805406 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose it's not really. < 1347171466 236557 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: ah, right < 1347171484 502075 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but strangely (i discovered today) it allows mixed declarations and code with -std=c89 < 1347171491 394945 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is, declarations after statements < 1347171496 4220 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :only with -pedantic does it complain < 1347171528 800395 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :-std=c89 without -pedantic isn't real -std=c89 < 1347171533 931974 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::3 < 1347171541 295116 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :gotta sleep, ttyl all < 1347171552 579226 :soundnfury!~edward@static-87-243-208-102.adsl.hotchilli.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nn then < 1347171585 349694 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :The gcc developers officially take the standards as guidelines < 1347171620 465233 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I,I non-standard static analysis < 1347171624 646627 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :So they try to implement the standards for you, but It's A Crapshoot < 1347171637 431304 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the default is always -gnuXX < 1347173378 397971 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1347176957 957155 :epicmonkey_!~epicmonke@188.134.41.211 JOIN :#esoteric < 1347178279 817166 :AnotherTest!~tim@94-224-23-251.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1347178305 940628 :AnotherTest!~tim@94-224-23-251.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1347179415 206096 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal JOIN :#esoteric < 1347179746 269428 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1347179754 412699 :Vorpal_!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal JOIN :#esoteric < 1347181623 869510 :kinoSi!~kinosi@27-96-32-84.ipq.jp QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1347181650 666061 :kinoSi!~kinosi@27-96-32-84.ipq.jp JOIN :#esoteric < 1347182251 68938 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1347182494 300422 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1347184835 628694 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1347187902 293070 :Dovregubben!~kurt@c-67-160-13-34.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1347188195 697224 :Dovregubben!~kurt@c-67-160-13-34.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347188663 224808 :Dovregubben!~kurt@c-67-160-13-34.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1347188684 4468 :Dovregubben!~kurt@c-67-160-13-34.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347191081 266847 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1347193942 649847 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1347195145 317198 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-156-72.as43234.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347195441 889280 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-156-72.as43234.net QUIT :Quit: brb < 1347195489 767559 :ogrom!~del@143.122.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee QUIT :Quit: Left < 1347196025 625855 :kinoSi!~kinosi@27-96-32-84.ipq.jp QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1347196052 886440 :kinoSi!~kinosi@27-96-32-84.ipq.jp JOIN :#esoteric < 1347196058 572319 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-2-127-22.as43234.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347196729 981938 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1347198687 712889 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-2-127-22.as43234.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1347199714 644671 :mig22!~miguelort@bb116-15-65-102.singnet.com.sg QUIT :Quit: mig22 < 1347199897 86240 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-2-127-22.as43234.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347200045 182837 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 8 * 19800 + 33000 < 1347200046 400527 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 191400 < 1347202801 884737 :epicmonkey_!~epicmonke@188.134.41.211 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1347203156 18428 :epicmonkey!~epicmonke@188.134.41.211 JOIN :#esoteric < 1347203709 16848 :epicmonkey_!~epicmonke@188.134.41.211 JOIN :#esoteric < 1347203714 647734 :epicmonkey!~epicmonke@188.134.41.211 QUIT :Read error: No route to host < 1347205113 496044 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1347205209 955188 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1347205938 174449 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1347207229 343656 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1347207709 892836 :MoALTz_!~no@host-92-8-236-175.as43234.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347207876 897887 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-2-127-22.as43234.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1347207913 683210 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347207995 240228 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1347208058 685268 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages? < 1347208058 859859 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, no messages today. < 1347208111 55865 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1347208249 236614 :epicmonkey_!~epicmonke@188.134.41.211 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1347208282 79601 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1347208772 334856 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : A brace style could be baroque and obtuse... < 1347208773 245785 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1347208844 39261 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :do {{ /*********************** GLORIA ***********************/ {{ < 1347208851 554768 :MoALTz_!~no@host-92-8-236-175.as43234.net QUIT :Quit: brb < 1347208854 764080 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: something tells me that your nes sound files are very difficult to play. < 1347208871 963697 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-236-175.as43234.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347208879 469311 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have several nes emulators, and i see the online file directory where the nes music is contained < 1347208890 891878 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : }} /****************** IN EXCELSIS DEO *******************/ }} < 1347208901 7538 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :however... the operation of appending one file onto another is beyond my ken < 1347208906 384082 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :while (0); < 1347208912 885763 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: You need not append one file onto another to play them. < 1347208923 879570 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Appending one file onto another is only if you want to play ZZT files. < 1347208936 54913 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :^bonus points for using the word ken < 1347208936 78269 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a Famicom emulator. < 1347208945 476327 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh < 1347208952 837034 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :HEY YOUR BLATHER IS RUINING MY BAROQUE BRACE STYLE < 1347208978 760916 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: To play the .NSFs you need not append any files. < 1347208979 145592 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you fix it? < 1347208987 383212 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets let oerjan do his work < 1347209003 75211 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i'm finished but it got a bit broken up < 1347209007 932203 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :do {{ /*********************** GLORIA ***********************/ {{ < 1347209009 926124 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : }} /****************** IN EXCELSIS DEO *******************/ }} < 1347209011 735705 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :while (0); < 1347209059 889216 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: I clarified the text and will upload a new version later today. < 1347209069 146982 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :For now, just load the .NSF files without appending anything. < 1347209091 495786 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i said fix it i meant can oerjan fix his baroque brace style :D < 1347209098 137765 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did < 1347209122 975548 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :yup < 1347209125 811135 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :success < 1347209127 284329 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :the text doesn't seem to be properly centered in the /***/ blocks < 1347209147 292444 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes I know that; but that is not what I meant. < 1347209158 145985 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant that you can load the .NSF without appending one file onto another. < 1347209170 213709 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: sadly GLORIA and EXCELSIS DEO don't have the same parity, so i cannot do that < 1347209186 327002 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*IN EXCELSIS DEO < 1347209188 248444 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, choose a different proverb? < 1347209193 963259 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever that is < 1347209207 367974 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :A hymn lyric < 1347209212 679101 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha... the nes emulator is happy with nsf < 1347209221 923384 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ding dong merrily on high, I think? < 1347209240 192308 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :dongs < 1347209243 24543 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-236-175.as43234.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1347209288 119355 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i know < 1347209311 696312 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :do {{ /********************** LAUDATE **********************/ {{ < 1347209345 865365 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : }} /********************** DOMINUM **********************/ }} < 1347209350 366719 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :while (0); < 1347209378 713316 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah... virtuanes doesn't like it, but nestopia does < 1347209404 658992 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am using VirtuaNES; they should work with VirtuaNES. < 1347209413 795948 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i set it up weird < 1347209416 133282 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :who knows < 1347209430 349574 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But any compliant emulator should play them. < 1347209435 179942 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe my virtuanes is out of date < 1347209453 439686 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did notice however that virtuanes had a nicer gui < 1347209462 301124 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it didn't do anything < 1347209482 729997 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need to tell it to start the music! Unlike other emulators it will not start automatically. < 1347209503 968919 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go Option->Controller->NSF Player you can configure which key to start music. < 1347209510 970446 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1347209527 852575 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : Ding dong merrily on high, I think? <-- that may be where i heard it first (our english teacher in high school was a nice old scottish woman) < 1347209530 215338 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: when you indent, do you reduce the number of asterixes to match? < 1347209562 814935 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ding dong merrily on high, hosana in excelsis < 1347209563 896171 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: obviously. < 1347209569 68830 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah ok! < 1347209573 851172 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :No wait < 1347209577 239606 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's something else? < 1347209578 318583 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1347209579 192557 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is happening now < 1347209581 493272 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I DO NOT KNOW < 1347209606 976034 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pie iesu domine, dona eis requiem < 1347209610 757278 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :atriq: there's a long "gloooooooooria" inside it, and in excelsis. i don't think the "in deo" was there when she taught us, but i've heard it with it later < 1347209630 577866 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1347209634 564272 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-in < 1347209692 629758 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, i think her version had "hosana in excelsis" but i've heard oslo gospel choir sing "in excelsis deo" < 1347209715 196811 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think hosana is hebrew? < 1347209723 386006 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38 (Untitled) #2 is a nice music < 1347209793 159230 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: OK. Did you read the comment? (The file 00README.txt has comments for all of this music) < 1347209794 21401 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347209803 972447 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i peeked at it < 1347209834 861617 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :my nes rom folder is such a mess.. and is 374mb due to lots of repeats < 1347209857 993630 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could organize them into directories < 1347209866 770197 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Hosanna is a liturgical word in Judaism and Christianity. In Judaism, it is always used in its original Hebrew form, Hoshana." < 1347209887 957542 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have not really put enough effort into the rom collection < 1347209909 204598 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :""Gloria in excelsis Deo" (Latin for "Glory to God in the highest") is a hymn known also as the Greater Doxology (as distinguished from the "Minor Doxology" or ..." < 1347209931 716347 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dumped ROMs may be given differing filenames from different sources, including based on method of dumping; homebrew ROMs tend to have only a single filename and do not have that problem. (You may have both kinds on your computer.) < 1347209933 219259 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello guys! I wanted my first message on the channel today be about my love for coffee. so there it is: I LOVE COFFEE thank you for your time < 1347209949 531674 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: my strategy was to download torrents with as many nes files as possible < 1347209982 49422 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The hymn begins with the words that the angels sang when the birth of Christ was announced to shepherds in Luke 2:14" < 1347209982 260017 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: O, in that case, yes there are going to be lots of repeats, of dumped ROMs especially. < 1347209989 386036 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that's where that's from < 1347210001 75565 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but naturally, the people who build such torrents have not invested endless time making it perfect < 1347210003 807224 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arc_Koen: welcome, I hope you'll enjoy loving coffee in this channel < 1347210022 527841 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I promise you I will < 1347210055 994842 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what's up? any new TC proofs, a major breach in computational banana schience fiction? < 1347210058 884396 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder who added "I HAVE NOW" to the topic and what it means < 1347210079 976018 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least for GameBoy, homebrew ROMs downloaded from sources which also include dumped ROMs generally change the filenames of homebrew ROMs as well, though. < 1347210091 910669 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I don't know for NES) < 1347210094 55479 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :searching the logs for "have you" might give a beginning of answer olsner < 1347210109 987187 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might! < 1347210127 145437 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like roms. i like the way they sever most dependancies < 1347210201 563815 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arc_Koen: we are living in Pax Coffeana! < 1347210213 425525 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically... i like that you don't have to install a rom... you don't have to even unzip it < 1347210220 582295 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :all those wars in ancient times were just because they couldn't get their morning coffee < 1347210231 820639 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :with roms you can keep a set of games in their zip files < 1347210234 820777 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: when I was in prepschool we have had *one* algorithmic test in a whole year < 1347210237 524945 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, the "I HAVE NOW" comes from a picture I saw and showed to oerjan < 1347210243 702908 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :atriq: nice < 1347210249 948873 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I answered every question except one *and it's been haunting me since then* < 1347210268 255669 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like any system which has such an airtight file storage < 1347210272 317744 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yesterday I had coffee with my grandmother; she makes very, very strong coffee < 1347210279 219098 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/217130_3530847072634_1433380748_n.jpg < 1347210292 614160 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :atriq: that's funny < 1347210293 653138 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I drank two cups and yesterday night I was unable to sleep < 1347210310 811673 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the solution to the unanswered question *appeared* to me < 1347210316 693151 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :at approximately 4am < 1347210325 693482 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ironically it was pretty simple :( < 1347210332 369001 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :today my dinner was 2 rolls with hommus dip, sliced ham, and mild american mustard < 1347210366 164096 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly the zenith of luxury < 1347210396 285287 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : so what's up? any new TC proofs, a major breach in computational banana schience fiction? <-- you _have_ looked at Banana Scheme, right? it's not new, though. < 1347210396 558775 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :bread rolls? < 1347210400 25103 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya < 1347210407 23351 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have, oerjan < 1347210411 672683 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :not royce rolls < 1347210413 174439 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I found it great < 1347210428 418303 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : I wonder who added "I HAVE NOW" to the topic and what it means <-- i did, it was a reference to a picture someone linked of a dog < 1347210434 165537 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1347210448 360088 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I read zzo's language with time travel < 1347210462 152915 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it was in category "uncomputable" and I wondered "what else can there be in that category?" < 1347210468 407468 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I pretty much read all pages < 1347210559 78587 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i have always liked wave patterns ever since i saw akira < 1347210572 403614 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, http://esolangs.org/wiki/You_are_Reading_the_Name_of_this_Esolang is a nice name for a language < 1347210604 668237 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :that aspect of the akira story was exciting < 1347210636 21379 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :every time you read it you get that nice feeling of "appropriately, I *am* just now reading the name of that esolang" < 1347210700 547202 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: Do you like any of other musics in there? And, yes, the ROMs are generally a single file which works in any compatible emulator or hardware, so that is OK. NES/Famicom games are being written even very recently, even though Nintendo no longer supports them. < 1347210794 756855 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :nintendo is a big believer in investing absurd amounts of money into useless novelty gimmicks such as virtual boy and 3ds, although i am still curious to play a 3ds one day < 1347210826 567456 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhmm < 1347210844 960027 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have designed (but not implemented) a hardware NSF player. The hardware is the same for any .NSF file, it can use any combination of expansion chips, including banked, NTSC, PAL, multi tracks. Push left/right select track number, START to play music, A button to stop. < 1347210846 744879 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i am just replaying zzo38 #2 at the moment < 1347210881 747120 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: the 3DS has sold pretty well < 1347210883 316816 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: Have you ever written any .NSF music? < 1347210927 629896 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: yeah..... i guess i do want one.. because 3d does sound fun < 1347210931 673241 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's funny to use 'useless novelty gimmicks' as a criticism when talking about video games < 1347210971 62489 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: no i havent. < 1347211001 567280 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: you're right. it's a bit of cognitive dissonance in part < 1347211032 905938 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-224-125.as43234.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347211083 106875 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :With the 3DS if you take photographs using the camera and it is connected to the internet, then Nintendo can look at them (it says so in their license agreement). I don't know why; it is no sense. The license agreement also says young children should not use the camera so that Nintendo cannot see them. < 1347211155 500636 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sigh itidus21 < 1347211220 228828 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: my concern is partially the fact that it supposedly gives a lot of people headaches, and can't really be played for hours on end, and 3d setting is advised to be turned off around children < 1347211236 60501 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But 3DS does have a program for a one-time fee of $8.00 to write and run programs in BASIC. < 1347211243 62800 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also that the virtual boy flopped completely < 1347211262 252074 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: Yes, that too. You can turn off and adjust the 3D setting by a slider at any time, though. < 1347211270 384895 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: ...that's not available in EU yet :( < 1347211274 266210 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It took me a while to figure out what the problem with 3D games is but then i realized you’re talking about stereo games. < 1347211325 995058 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: i don't see how the virtual boy is relevant < 1347211335 254638 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the 3DS has been on sale for more than a year < 1347211345 398906 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you do not need to speculate to determine if it is a flop < 1347211347 491085 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was nintendo's first attempt at selling stereo graphics < 1347211394 770377 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :guys i think 3D movies are a fad, I think _Avatar_ won't do very well at the box office < 1347211412 264400 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arc_Koen, what's your opinion on the Fancy L problem? < 1347211431 641329 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just honestly can't understand how you think itidus21 < 1347211433 80358 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have determined that many people prefer the 2D version of the movies in this area, although 3D version is still played and some people like it. < 1347211452 430087 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: i'm mentally ill really. < 1347211459 687262 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :theres no two ways about it < 1347211512 155595 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have invented a "NTSC stereovision" protocol where at first is synchronization signal, three gray frames followed by black, white, black, white, black, white, black, white, black, white, and then the left frame alternates with right frame; nine unchanging frames turns off stereovision. < 1347211530 320018 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can be used with digital as well. < 1347211548 27140 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also usable with VGA, PAL, etc. < 1347211576 411752 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arc_Koen, http://esolangs.org/wiki/%E2%84%92 < 1347211591 964223 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the 3DS sales were poor initially but have picked up, to "solid" if not "runaway success" < 1347211597 845277 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"After a very rocky start, Nintendo has announced it sold 4.5 million Nintendo 3DS handhelds in the United States during its first year. Believe it or not, that's better than the much-loved Nintendo DS did with its first year." < 1347211602 604545 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: i know how to give you insight into how i think < 1347211623 754376 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: Have you ever written any music at all or try to or intend to? I used PPMCK to write these .NSF musics although other programs exist too. < 1347211649 872637 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: nice, but i think 14.99 FPS is not enough < 1347211698 176430 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I suppose you are correct. Still, the similar thing can be used with formats other than NTSC. < 1347211705 473077 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I sincerely don’t see why you keep creating protocols and cable specifications based on analog legacy video systems. Why not a fast packet-based digital bus? < 1347211713 52499 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, how does it interact with interlacing < 1347211735 855733 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you send a full left frame in 2 interlaced half-frames, and then a full right frame? < 1347211747 441548 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Yes. < 1347211760 893686 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you did a left half-frame and then a right half-frame, you could get better framerate < 1347211761 380855 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still, using formats without interlacing it may work better. < 1347211769 598817 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe the interlacing artifacts would be horrible in 3D < 1347211770 851603 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know < 1347211781 596540 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: this is entirely safe for work http://oi48.tinypic.com/2iji4ar.jpg < 1347211786 408686 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Yes that is another possibility; but I also don't know if interlacing artifacts will be horrible in 3D. < 1347211802 303439 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still it could use with other formats such as the "Digi-RGB" format of my design. < 1347211821 436846 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :a picture says 1000 words i like to think < 1347211840 170525 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have 4 notepads open < 1347211874 599633 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is reminded of how awful the lack of virtual desktops is.
< 1347211906 105245 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Digi-RGB is four pins for red, four for green, four for blue, one for clock, one for synchronization, and the others for power/ground. The aspect ratio is always a power of 4/3, which ensures that the correct screen resolution is always known. < 1347211954 952733 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is it 12-bit color? < 1347211964 274874 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other than some electrical specifications and stuff, this is basically entirely how it works. It is a very simple protocol. < 1347211967 312331 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :the icons behind all that are a mess too < 1347211975 607473 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Restricting it to sRGB might also be not the best idea. < 1347211975 781201 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: No; I forgot to mention: There are two clocks per pixel. < 1347211977 561115 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or do you have multiple clocks per pixel < 1347211978 644792 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1347211996 442648 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that does sound simple < 1347212006 607282 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i have anvil studio for playing with midi files but is a long time since i did that < 1347212051 373857 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as 8bit music goes i am interested in the way creativity thrives under constraints < 1347212058 923302 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the host wants to turn off the display for power saving, you can fix the synchronization signal high. < 1347212157 193532 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i have a copy of warioware diy for ds which has a music editor for short music about 16 seconds long i think < 1347212167 955773 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe its 8 seconds < 1347212173 569 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and repeated twice for 16 < 1347212203 65050 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: There is also program to convert MIDI to .NSF, I think, by Tom 7 Entertainment System. There is also PPMCK (I use a version of PPMCK which I have made improvements to), Famitracker, NerdTracker, and possibly others. < 1347212217 544823 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :in midi i just clicked on random spots < 1347212251 94714 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm.. actually some of the midi music i came up with isn't all that bad < 1347212255 709461 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :its merely terrible < 1347212258 495900 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ZZT music player I have written for Famicom will also be .NSF format. < 1347212284 425246 :ogrom!~del@gprs-inet-65-156.elisa.ee JOIN :#esoteric < 1347212295 38981 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like the bull in a museum approach to music composition < 1347212297 909322 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other programs I have heard for writing .NSF musics is Impulse Tracker to .NSF, and SuperNSF (which includes a software synthesizer, I think) < 1347212315 125249 :Eladith!~eladith@gzrrplox.kortex.jyu.fi QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1347212360 502790 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In that music collection of my .NSF music files, the .mml are the source files and are just plain text files; you can look at them if you are interested in it. < 1347212364 479059 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i have started to ponder about the relationship between things... < 1347212412 740678 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, with the sound track of a movie, the main relationship between the music and the footage is that someone decided to put them together < 1347212426 284815 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1347212446 525532 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :its an unsettling idea really < 1347212483 880155 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, sometimes the people make the music specifically for this movie < 1347212503 107617 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :its almost as if the director is trying to trick you into listening to their favorite songs, and asking you to pay for the privelige < 1347212503 626858 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But sometimes they just make various music and then see which one they want. < 1347212506 278164 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :its rather clever < 1347212595 412211 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... next time you want to show someone your favorite music < 1347212605 54709 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :simply set it to an interesting footage! < 1347212613 720187 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1347212625 878009 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :im half-joking < 1347212690 981458 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yeah good point.... maybe if i had actually composed music i would understand a bit more < 1347212728 737595 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :when in doubt, people like me always assume the option which involves humans being brain-dead < 1347212729 784039 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can try to write a .NSF music if you want; first you will need some software which will compile it. Two main styles are MML and trackers; some prefer one and some prefer another. < 1347212786 526036 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then, you have to learn the 2A03 audio and the expansion audio. < 1347212799 131851 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :people often assume, "when he did that, he did not think about it..." < 1347212822 776499 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is probably a fallacy in itself < 1347212823 472293 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: Yes that does sometimes seem to be the case that they did not think about it very well. < 1347212832 673435 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Not always, though.) < 1347212978 753555 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other than MML and trackers, another possibility is using MIDI recording. < 1347213027 743223 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :theory of mind of a stranger can't be very accurate < 1347213040 331275 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree < 1347213183 810917 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you used any other programs for writing music, other than Anvil Studio? < 1347213231 974378 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am bad at arriving at a point. but i mean i don't understand what an artist or composer does. i almost have trouble believing in art at all. and no i haven't < 1347213260 422273 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think different composers can compose music using different ways < 1347213288 285742 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :However I know some things about music theory, so I can use that too. < 1347213315 967572 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think people can impart their uniqueness on what they do < 1347213353 82525 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes I think so too. < 1347213392 24194 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess what i really mean by that is, the way one person does things will always be different from how everyone else does it < 1347213406 448458 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1347213526 936498 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1347213533 880433 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and maybe this is always true, except, when measuring what people do, somehow theres a finite number of options < 1347213596 805356 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :in anatomy, no animal is ever precisely matching the anatomy of it's species < 1347213612 265861 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's always somewhere in a continuum of evolution < 1347213694 567481 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :an eye is an eye but it is evolving beyond some other eye, and evolving towards some other eye < 1347213745 243645 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would think that, although it is continuous only the discrete ways are realized as I think quantum physics works like this? < 1347213768 682674 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Therefore it applies to everything, whether it is physics or chemistry or biology or electronics < 1347213771 164671 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have no idea < 1347213775 660723 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha < 1347213817 718202 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :atriq: hmmmm trick question < 1347213866 346789 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I personally feel "is said language turing-complete or not?" is not enough of a question to describe a language's computational class < 1347213879 944866 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, Turing-machines don't even have i/o < 1347213909 130202 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have now typed the changes of the character sheet of Dungeons&Dragons game; I helped another player to fill their character sheet and now I have put it into the computer too. This also include entirely story text too, and all character sheets, footnotes, etc < 1347213925 834353 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am thinking that in the acts of rolling a dice, or flipping a coin, a person cannot express their uniqueness... but on the other hand something tells me that they can < 1347213929 442078 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arc_Koen: OK; does computation class include I/O class though? Perhaps I/O class is another difference thing. < 1347213978 6013 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: computation class includes rogue, paladin, cleric, mage, sorceror, and assassin < 1347213991 500914 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: well, I never said it had to be linear :) classes are set, so there is not necessarily an absolute order on them < 1347213996 920896 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, can I be a cleric? < 1347214000 63143 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :if people were not expressing some form of being unique then elections would have everyone voting the same way < 1347214010 500887 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :atriq: you want to be the healer? < 1347214013 154124 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: ha ha no I do not think so. < 1347214016 750899 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, yeah < 1347214023 186263 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're pretty cool guys < 1347214028 997519 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :A cleric does not necessarily have to be the healer, although generally it would be. < 1347214048 612278 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could I be a mezzer? < 1347214073 854769 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In D&D game I am in, there are two player characters, one fighter and one wizard (actually multi-classed). < 1347214085 530034 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just made a new programming language called Healing Serj. It is Cleric-complete. < 1347214145 734987 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In D&D game I do the psychic healing myself. < 1347214158 844736 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :what race < 1347214188 747101 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :My character is illithid wizard, other character is human fighter < 1347214241 659668 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you have to read the file to learn what happened in this game. Actually it started with a different player who is now out and the new player who is human fighter came in afterward. < 1347214250 807030 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is a different player and a different character. < 1347214283 20149 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :only if you read my file < 1347214288 532496 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What file? < 1347214304 966626 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :character reference < 1347214319 47399 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK do you have URL (or netcat transfer)? < 1347214343 443132 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you have google account? < 1347214346 210493 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1347214362 398830 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1347214383 255377 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :the file currently only exists as a google doc and it is constantly changing < 1347214395 36358 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1347214416 208814 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe you can do netcat transfer of the current version? < 1347214446 403241 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :not from my phone. < 1347214449 76882 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1347214454 361618 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just had idea. < 1347214499 560065 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would prefer a text file rather than a Google Docs file anyways < 1347214510 856886 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too < 1347214515 708444 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i didnt make the thing < 1347214517 659540 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But use a different format if it is necessary. < 1347214560 465232 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then put it on your computer and then transfer it to text format, and then host it or upload it to another host or netcat transfer it to me directly. < 1347214872 109164 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1347214878 978973 :itidus20!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1347214934 449639 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i cant download it :/ < 1347214986 460053 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then copy it to the clipboard and paste it. < 1347215008 522452 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If that won't work either, retype it or take a screenshot. < 1347215027 943085 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(using a camera if necessary) < 1347215059 404257 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't Google Docs allow converting to other formats, though? So why can't it work? < 1347215112 706983 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does but not for mobile < 1347215199 677732 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then transfer it to your desktop computer. < 1347215293 385800 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :With mine, I am only one changing it, and it is available for public, you can download the .tex and .dvi files (the .dvi may not be up to date) < 1347215351 390884 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :And in addition you can easily download it by wget or netcat so it is not necessary to use a web browser. < 1347215444 314795 :itidus20!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au NICK :itidus21 < 1347215504 213791 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will wait until it is more uptodate and not changing as much < 1347215661 675592 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. < 1347215868 395714 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have Dungeons&Dragons character? What is their name? < 1347215887 848535 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :My character's name is Iuckqlwviv Kjugobe (I generated at random on my graphing calculator) < 1347215895 687259 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1347215900 911975 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :but can you pronounce it < 1347215914 394475 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine is an elven mage named lola < 1347215977 181861 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes I can pronounce it, but some people find it difficult. < 1347216029 479695 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you a fighter, a social, or a thinker. < 1347216034 338090 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :mymoney's on thinker < 1347216043 605108 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1347216069 166096 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :you like puzzles and traps and mysteries < 1347216073 503718 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1347216080 515655 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The other player character is fighter. < 1347216085 740164 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :man i must be psychic < 1347216109 721466 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :My character is also psychic^Wpsionic. < 1347216127 250960 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :psichonic < 1347216131 388537 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :We do both do various things, just mainly my character is thinker and other character is fighter < 1347216206 643223 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i meant you as a player, though it doesnt surprise me that your character is just like you < 1347216237 715049 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :funny, the vulcans think time travel is impossible, but places where "the laws of physics don't apply" are fine < 1347216259 411446 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes, as me as a player is the one thinking about the game mostly. < 1347216318 450554 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :And my character is not just like me; nor is the other player's character exactly like her, either. < 1347216341 198495 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-224-125.as43234.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1347216786 422505 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1347217231 170455 :ogrom!~del@gprs-inet-65-156.elisa.ee QUIT :Quit: Left < 1347217476 434370 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1347217642 236267 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, you tell me when you have the file I will look if you want me to. < 1347218453 825965 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there tests for pseudorandom number generators programmed in 6502 machine code? < 1347218460 392875 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://img.reversegif.com/14022.gif < 1347218532 942794 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :idgi < 1347218902 24316 :AnotherTest!~tim@94-224-23-251.access.telenet.be QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1347218905 558159 :atriq!~Taneb@host-2-99-84-46.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1347219270 382434 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is a good simple pseudorandom number generator usable to shuffle a deck of cards which can be programmed in a 6502 machine code? < 1347219325 443580 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://forums.wolfram.com/mathgroup/archive/2003/Feb/msg00456.html here is some discussion of simple PRNGs < 1347219372 599386 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :MWC256 is pretty good but it involves 32-bit math and wants 1kB of state < 1347219451 239369 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-2-123-15.as43234.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347219733 593409 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could capture the RNG's output from an emulator and then run it through http://www.phy.duke.edu/~rgb/General/dieharder.php < 1347219912 447364 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :This program is for Famicom and should make one using 8-bit math and not as much RAM; MMC5 can be used for multiplication if it helps, another idea is the microphone but that is only Japanese systems and doesn't generally work with emulators, and I don't know how sensitive it is anyways. < 1347220034 722121 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey guys, if I'm willing to learn a (non-esoteric) concurrent programming language, what would you recommand? I thought maybe occam-pi but I would be glad to have a second opinion < 1347220137 229667 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Also won't work on all real Famicoms. < 1347220166 326888 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: The AV Famicom didn't have a microphone, instead opting for NES controller ports. < 1347220175 862139 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not think the microphone is sensitive enough anyways as far as I know. < 1347220188 397975 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the AV Famicom is the Japanese version of the top-loading NES) < 1347220430 334957 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1347220448 187390 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yes for those reasons, probably should not use microphone. < 1347220624 955854 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :For what I am doing I need to shuffle a standard deck of cards, however the ranks are not relevant, only the suits are used. < 1347220889 714441 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if there are other features of the 2A03 audio, of PPU, and/or of common mappers, which may be used to help random numbers. < 1347221089 579443 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :most games from way back then used user interaction delays as sources of randomness < 1347221126 841951 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :like "fifteen frames between loading this menu and the user pressing a key" < 1347221169 794156 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did intend to use that as the seed for the random number generator. < 1347221232 942911 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you can use this http://codebase64.org/doku.php?id=base:small_fast_8-bit_prng < 1347221240 337659 :Vorpal_!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1347221241 374959 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1347221856 695778 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arc_Koen: erlang or haskell perhaps? (from hearsay really. the latter is my favorite PL but i don't really use the concurrency parts.) < 1347221882 959246 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I did not even realize haskell had concurrent programming < 1347221909 543219 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :pure functionalness really helps make some aspects of it easier (i hear :) ) < 1347221927 389999 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :easier to learn? < 1347221935 191274 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-163-145-146.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arc_Koen: I'm told it's really good, but I've not played with it enough. < 1347221943 430290 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, easier not to mess up with deadlocks and the like < 1347222003 532531 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll look into it, thank you < 1347222093 714395 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :erlang afaik has a single concurrency model based on message passing and automatic distribution. haskell has a lot of different possibilities but mostly for single multicore chip work (there is distribution research but it's not really part of normal haskell yet i think) < 1347222126 701813 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghc haskell has both concurrent IO actions and parallel evaluation of pure function applications < 1347222131 86874 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :different constructs for each < 1347222143 33601 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah, there isn't much for distributed programming < 1347222149 381047 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the infamous STM monad < 1347222170 185816 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :people talk about Cloud Haskell as a replacement for Erlang, but it's still research grade as far as I know < 1347222178 427617 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell supports the IO monad, the STM monad, and the function monad. < 1347222185 987928 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's all monads, you see. < 1347222187 71316 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least in #haskell they downplay all that "trivial" boring engineering work needed to actually use stuff < 1347222192 762259 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmmm yes that's what I wasn't attracted by erlang much. I have no use for *actual* distribution - is it possible to use concurrent programming in haskell with more concurrent parts than cores on my computer? < 1347222194 596293 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(software transactional memory, where everything that could break the model is disallowed by types) < 1347222205 450643 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arc_Koen: yes, you can easily spawn 1,000,000 threads in GHC < 1347222221 123609 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are lightweight threads which map onto a configurable number of OS threads (usually one per core) < 1347222221 647528 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION sads at how expensive threads are on the JVM
< 1347222247 403714 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that does sound very attractive < 1347222256 200677 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: "is disallowed by types" is a bit silly. < 1347222263 64067 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you can do blocking IO from those million threads, and the GHC runtime translates that into efficient event-based system calls (e.g. select, epoll, kqueue) < 1347222267 606581 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like saying that everything that does IO is disallowed by types. < 1347222282 764723 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's pretty sweet < 1347222294 3511 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only thing types do in that case is catch errors early. < 1347222299 354559 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think that new clojure language may also be good for concurrency with encouraged but not enforced pure functionalness, but i haven't looked at it < 1347222336 66805 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: well i was trying to find a phrase that didn't require understanding monads already :) < 1347222348 871571 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the other hand, it's a huge amount of work to learn Haskell well enough to write complicated robust performant programs < 1347222374 521720 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has nothing to do with monads! < 1347222375 397039 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a lot of the lore you need to know is poorly documented and basically exists as oral history in #haskell < 1347222378 432014 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and #haskell sucks < 1347222414 72982 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that really true? < 1347222416 768186 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The first sentence, I mean. < 1347222421 888397 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think so < 1347222434 991580 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are a lot of Haskell people who don't use #haskell at all... < 1347222446 205240 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i don't know how they get by < 1347222460 515652 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :honestly there's not that much overlap between #haskell users and core Haskell library developers < 1347222468 500839 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or people who are using Haskell in real world applications < 1347222470 591605 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as i can tell < 1347222475 195930 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so maybe my other claim is bs < 1347222487 384379 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION won't dispute the second one.
< 1347222493 368187 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i was doing more haskell i felt like a lot of the things I knew, i couldn't find any specific reference for < 1347222499 854703 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :much less a top-level "Here are the things you should learn" document < 1347222509 32356 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as performance, understanding evaluation model, GHC tricks, etc < 1347222511 855901 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's true. < 1347222521 545594 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should write a Haskell book! < 1347222524 646689 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1347222539 826543 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why can I do (!! 4) [0..10] but not (!! 4 [0..10]) < 1347222553 154401 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (!! 4 [0..10]) < 1347222554 200260 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Overlapping instances for GHC.Show.Show ([a] -> a) < 1347222554 218916 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use of... < 1347222554 545324 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm starting to wonder if there's a similar "need to be in the IRC channel" issue with Clojure < 1347222566 845662 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (!! 4 [0..10]) "hello monqy" < 1347222567 931533 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 'o' < 1347222568 839607 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: that parses as (!! (4 [0..10])) < 1347222576 993884 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION shouldn't do that. :-(
< 1347222583 216002 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't do it in #haskell, at least. < 1347222590 70183 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck lambdabot < 1347222620 491589 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : a lot of the lore you need to know is poorly documented and basically exists as oral history in #haskell <-- what about stackoverflow? < 1347222624 701197 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah maybe < 1347222752 805388 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Should I do https://www.coursera.org/course/crypto ? < 1347222766 308537 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1347222774 141723 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, why does (!! 4) [0..10] work when the type is [a] -> Int -> a < 1347222800 668287 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(`operator` arg) = (\x -> x `operator` arg) < 1347222803 491154 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: (!! 4) is syntactical sugar for \x -> x !! 4 < 1347222830 317377 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, because !! is an infix operator < 1347222834 84946 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1347222844 463842 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(+ x) and (x +) are special syntactic forms < 1347222847 326884 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :for any infix operator + < 1347222849 977465 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are called "sections" < 1347222868 303309 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :_except_ - , for which (- x) doesn't work (it gives negation instead. < 1347222870 49173 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1347222879 954051 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (- 4) < 1347222880 979252 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : -4 < 1347222908 62395 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :((-) 4) < 1347222911 363168 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ((-) 4) < 1347222912 385794 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Overlapping instances for GHC.Show.Show (t -> t) < 1347222912 597074 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use of `... < 1347222918 304576 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ((-) 4) 4 < 1347222919 196206 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 0 < 1347222945 155687 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could've picked *any* number other than 4 for the second argument... < 1347222950 441430 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ((-) 4) 3 < 1347222951 578432 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1347222957 639125 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (4 -) 3 < 1347222958 567383 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1347222960 864429 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (subtract 4) 3 < 1347222962 18372 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : -1 < 1347222968 897837 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :() deinfixes < 1347222971 325619 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: you shouldn't actually try to learn from lambdabot < 1347222979 894605 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it implements a bizarre variant of Haskell with a bunch of nonstandard definitions < 1347222983 54742 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: also shachaf's complaint and kmc's swearing above is because lambdabot has a special instance which makes it able to treat functions as numbers. which means some of the examples work differently < 1347222983 738490 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I mostly use ghci < 1347222987 190594 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the amusement of the regulars in #haskell < 1347222998 759475 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: stop making my point a half second before i finish it :) < 1347223004 356371 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently they find it entertaining to confuse beginners, or something < 1347223010 225071 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: What sort of function will it treat as a number? < 1347223030 925168 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think oerjan means "numbers as functions". < 1347223034 206176 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :numeric literals in Haskell are overloaded < 1347223038 376994 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :4 has type (Num a) => a < 1347223045 992519 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can take on any type in the typeclass Num < 1347223058 393877 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and lambdabot has an instance (Num a) => Num (b -> a) < 1347223072 638629 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t 4 :: Char -> Int < 1347223073 739284 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Char -> Int < 1347223081 477525 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is equavalent to (const 4) i.e. \x -> 4 < 1347223082 790985 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: well that would explain why the chatter count in haskell is about 950, c++ is about 650, and c is about 450 ... on freenode < 1347223084 236268 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 4 5 < 1347223085 280464 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 4 < 1347223096 234736 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 4 "sucks" < 1347223097 128218 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 4 < 1347223108 291924 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :then addition is like (f + g) x = (f x) + (g x) < 1347223109 316935 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :one could naively assume that haskell was the preferred language of freenode chatters < 1347223110 381729 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so forth < 1347223114 882197 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1347223118 459003 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (4 + 5) "foo" < 1347223119 320631 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 9 < 1347223120 681382 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: why which < 1347223125 164111 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why does lambdabot do that < 1347223139 83546 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the regulars in #haskell find it amusing to play with these ideas < 1347223149 379029 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not really fair for me to say they find it amusing to confuse beginners < 1347223153 282858 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it certainly does confuse beginners < 1347223163 406805 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and nobody much seems to care < 1347223171 625173 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't beginners use ghci though =P < 1347223171 643699 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :#haskell is full of people who talk past each other about what's the best way to teach Haskell < 1347223175 240709 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You care, at least. < 1347223176 948545 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing ever changes, nobody writes anything down < 1347223186 553745 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but I quit #haskell < 1347223193 330979 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :after making some attempts to get people to fix things < 1347223203 468494 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: a lot of them join #haskell for help < 1347223207 868590 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i popped in just to check the count < 1347223210 845166 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: yes, but sometimes beginners ask haskell questions in irc and then it's nice to have lambdabot to demonstrate < 1347223211 16694 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then someone tries to use lambdabot to help them < 1347223216 516134 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then lambdabot does something confusing < 1347223227 140326 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and five people try to explain the confusing thing all at once < 1347223227 300346 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :943 or so.... thats really quite a packed channel < 1347223233 609372 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then they start arguing about which explanation is better < 1347223241 918607 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds funny < 1347223244 828541 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: you can check the count with /list #haskell < 1347223246 903094 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :But unhelpful < 1347223250 258057 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :humm < 1347223251 962104 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it gets old ;P < 1347223316 10287 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Great, I did /list kmc and now it's listing all the channels < 1347223336 602809 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok i guess /list can be a _little_ dangerous >:) < 1347223353 463945 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I somehow didn't get flooded off by the /list < 1347223396 586664 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is possible freenode is a little more careful about sending /list responses < 1347223481 244248 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems to me that it is simply ignoring the kmc argument, which seems singularly unhelpful < 1347223535 6888 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ignoring the kmc argument, just like #haskell < 1347223546 378705 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT EXPLAINS EVERYTHING! < 1347223661 31111 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1347223701 747022 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :eek lag < 1347223806 717834 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it was a side effect of me using /rawquote, it disappeared when i did a /whois < 1347223836 613645 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as in, irssi registered lag but there wasn't _really_ any...) < 1347223923 708259 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm no, it is happening again. it's because /rawquote swallows pings < 1347223973 57347 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION thinks /rawquote is wrong but can never remember the correct command to send things directly to the server from irssi (it is _not_ /raw)
< 1347224179 518545 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1347224186 252734 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1347224224 377050 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so /rawquote swallowed a ping reply from the server, causing irssi to timeout :P < 1347224246 586157 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it was /quote btw but i had to google it) < 1347224257 505056 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :irssi's help is _not_ good. < 1347224280 819965 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: so, have you? :) < 1347224283 377558 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :#python has more users than #haskell curiously < 1347224383 656719 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :testing < 1347224383 675366 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no TOPIC #esoteric :I HAVE NOW | Official channel of ESME | ESME is the best programming language. Why have you abandoned ESME? | Do not fret, ESME can forgive you. Give yourself freely to ESME. | http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ | http://esolangs.org/wiki < 1347224435 912046 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i notice ESME is not _actually_ all caps but it feels like it should be < 1347224766 256406 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-2-123-15.as43234.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1347224845 210220 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1347225143 923928 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://fd-imaging.com/the-worlds-tiniest-tiff-image/ < 1347225196 694315 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1347225209 102791 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :reminds me of http://www.muppetlabs.com/~breadbox/software/tiny/teensy.html < 1347225214 114556 :kmc!~keegan@c-76-119-235-30.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a classic < 1347225218 936352 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-) < 1347225343 182795 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, update < 1347225351 731641 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And tswett < 1347225360 533372 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And sorry about not mentioning updates before < 1347225427 81712 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, good old sgeobot < 1347225539 20568 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :MOST SHOCKING TWIST YET < 1347226057 434513 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :twisted elecric cords < 1347226059 859593 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*+t < 1347226067 41733 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*+h < 1347226071 641260 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, no < 1347226087 514428 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-*+h < 1347226413 573320 :KingOfKarlsruhe!~chatzilla@p5B131C9B.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1347226583 726005 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mgifos < 1347226631 62502 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least on my computer the command is /RAW to send directly to the server, it does no further processing and only sends it directly to server; if you want CRLF you have to add that yourself too. (If you don't want this then you don't use /RAW) < 1347226711 744060 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what they are in irssi and other programs. < 1347226788 995261 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think /raw is common, and it's annoying that irssi calls it something else < 1347226812 578783 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :/quote in irssi < 1347226819 981581 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it does send the CRLF < 1347226834 709892 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: um yes it does. /rawquote doesn't, however. < 1347226852 367152 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is how i got disconnected a while ago < 1347226880 271082 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, so that is why it doesn't work. < 1347226946 759325 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :specifically i got back the following answer after doing /rawquote help < 1347226949 155647 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:51 helpPING Unknown command < 1347227062 759442 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means irssi never got back an answer to its automatic PING, which means it timed out. despite lots of other lines flowing back and forth. < 1347227792 595249 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: My irssi doesn't have /rawquote < 1347227801 169073 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you sure it's not part of a script < 1347228086 919041 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's listed with /help, but it has no help itself < 1347228223 39152 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :"We decided to remove /rawquote because it serves no purpose." < 1347228246 243864 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my irssi is a little old then < 1347228280 473692 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :0.8.12 < 1347228732 40789 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, so far this year, two IRC channels I'm in have experienced significant drama < 1347228736 898271 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder when #esoteric's due < 1347228750 673464 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yesterday. < 1347228751 928820 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION chokes
< 1347228762 865340 :impomatic!~digital_w@146.90.199.184 JOIN :#esoteric < 1347229000 988241 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arc_Koen: sorry, not dramatic enough < 1347229040 839406 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION chokes, then explodes
< 1347229059 605692 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks in this Sorcery Card game, you could instantly win if you are dealt the XXI XX XIX XVIII XVII XVI of trumps, since you can deal more damage than their starting hit points are. < 1347229230 474212 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if you could evolve levels of a game with a fitness function that leads to the player having a certain amount of trouble, no more, no less. < 1347229244 233671 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try. < 1347229258 458468 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Such that as the player improves, the levels will on average get harder, and if the player starts slipping, they start getting easier. < 1347229278 376799 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although, since it's such a random walk, it's likely not going to feel like that over the short term < 1347229286 90527 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really like that; they should get harder by selecting a difficulty setting instead. < 1347229306 942737 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Of course one of the difficulty settings could be, automatic.) < 1347229651 592971 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you are too fast to be dramatic! if i'm only choking there will be that long, painful time when i'm not dead yet but people feel helpless and don't know how to save me. besides, many people enjoy explosions, so where's the drama? < 1347229746 188447 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'sa gritty action-o-drama! < 1347229869 557886 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : I wonder if you could evolve levels of a game with a fitness function that leads to the player having a certain amount of trouble, no more, no less. <-- i have a theory that's how the real world works. also someone decrease my level _just_ a tad, please? < 1347230000 446791 :KingOfKarlsruhe!~chatzilla@p5B131C9B.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.2 [Firefox 15.0.1/20120905151427] < 1347230598 449658 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1347231009 728348 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1347231211 805043 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :zra recursive acronym... < 1347231718 908309 :itidus21!~itidus21@CPE-120-148-51-163.gdfw1.vic.bigpond.net.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was thinking about evolution in gaming < 1347232230 482014 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1347232464 393340 :heroux!~heroux@5070823C.static.ziggozakelijk.nl QUIT :*.net *.split < 1347232464 542923 :Lumpio-!~user@62-113-182-248.bb.dnainternet.fi QUIT :*.net *.split < 1347232464 644520 :SimonRC!~sc@217.155.91.250 QUIT :*.net *.split < 1347232529 708260 :heroux!~heroux@5070823C.static.ziggozakelijk.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1347232529 726635 :Lumpio-!~user@62-113-182-248.bb.dnainternet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1347232529 726697 :SimonRC!~sc@217.155.91.250 JOIN :#esoteric < 1347233582 383736 :Arc_Koen!~Arc_Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Quit: Are you telling me you can build a time machine but you can't cook a cheese soufflé? You've got your priorities all wrong! < 1347235031 123347 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there something wrong with this? x@(Surreal l _) <= y@(Surreal _ r) = null (filter (y <=) l) && null (filter (<= x) r);