< 1318896397 949878 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → sleep < 1318896399 586494 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1318896648 618359 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com QUIT :Quit: *Never* push these two buttons two times!! Except the battery. < 1318896653 80205 :Timwi!~timwi@cpc1-cmbg13-0-0-cust215.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com QUIT : < 1318896793 755656 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318897220 532349 :CakeProphet!~eris@h44.44.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318897224 340365 :CakeProphet!~eris@h44.44.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net QUIT :Changing host < 1318897224 487059 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric < 1318898005 324399 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1318898852 86870 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318898873 195076 :ive!~nn@189.179.247.113 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1318898937 978611 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Trying to root my Nook < 1318898944 807042 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :TMI < 1318899069 215137 :cheater_!~cheater@ip-2-205-225-248.web.vodafone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1318899086 989835 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :*.net *.split < 1318899089 96909 :twice11!~twice11@lenny32.physik.fu-berlin.de QUIT :*.net *.split < 1318899089 243813 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :*.net *.split < 1318899089 613628 :cheater!~cheater@ip-2-205-225-248.web.vodafone.de QUIT :*.net *.split < 1318899089 760122 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org QUIT :*.net *.split < 1318899090 289327 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :*.net *.split < 1318899090 435887 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey QUIT :*.net *.split < 1318899090 905578 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org QUIT :*.net *.split < 1318899100 514885 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1318899107 178022 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1318899323 347887 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t Int -> [a] -> ([a], [a]) < 1318899329 19203 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318899329 166234 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318899329 166399 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1318899329 166481 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1318899329 166582 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1318899329 166661 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1318899329 166745 :twice11!~twice11@lenny32.physik.fu-berlin.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1318899332 290403 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle Int -> [a] -> ([a], [a]) < 1318899332 436982 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot? < 1318899332 583652 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :parse error on input `->' < 1318899332 730461 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle Int -> [a] -> ([a], [a]) < 1318899332 877240 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude splitAt :: Int -> [a] -> ([a], [a]) < 1318899332 877447 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List splitAt :: Int -> [a] -> ([a], [a]) < 1318899332 877561 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List genericSplitAt :: Integral i => i -> [b] -> ([b], [b]) < 1318899332 877667 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude splitAt :: Int -> [a] -> ([a], [a]) < 1318899332 877770 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List splitAt :: Int -> [a] -> ([a], [a]) < 1318899333 23993 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List genericSplitAt :: Integral i => i -> [b] -> ([b], [b]) < 1318899344 898367 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle a -> [a] -> ([a], [a]) < 1318899345 415139 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude splitAt :: Int -> [a] -> ([a], [a]) < 1318899345 610835 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List splitAt :: Int -> [a] -> ([a], [a]) < 1318899345 757420 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List genericSplitAt :: Integral i => i -> [b] -> ([b], [b]) < 1318899507 50465 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (break . (==)) 4 [1..10] < 1318899508 576952 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : ([1,2,3],[4,5,6,7,8,9,10]) < 1318899773 615661 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1318900207 948262 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is trying to do something nasty to Numbers < 1318900291 868345 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle list < 1318900292 215928 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :module Control.Monad.List < 1318900292 537699 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :module Data.List < 1318900292 684646 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Language.Haskell.Syntax list_cons_name :: HsQName < 1318900294 751650 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone else is looking at what I'm trying to do, but I'm hoping he's doing something ... else < 1318900314 144814 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hm < 1318900354 918571 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet JOIN :#esoteric < 1318900364 655145 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: just divide and conquer < 1318900366 477461 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I've already had to add this fun pragma: {-# LANGUAGE GADTs, ExistentialQuantification, Rank2Types #-}" < 1318900460 540953 :Zuu!~zuu@unaffiliated/zuu QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1318900489 212132 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not much. < 1318900598 368221 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :such an angry young man http://www.reddit.com/r/haskell/comments/lf71l/deprecate_preludehead_and_partial_functions/c2s80l2 < 1318900630 774809 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the worse that can happen if I put a class constraint in a newtype? < 1318900631 863551 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: That isn't angry. You've clearly never seen me get angry. < 1318900633 514775 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric : (Yeahyeah, modulo etc.) < 1318900641 147342 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I was just correcting the blog post amendment. :p < 1318900645 165497 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: See, that's me angry. < 1318900653 240851 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: You mean newtype (Foo a) => Bar a = ...? < 1318900655 423110 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: That's you every day of the week. < 1318900665 294342 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Take that newtype back! < 1318900682 640289 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not Bar a, just Bar, then the a is on the right of the = < 1318900683 485085 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ah but i'm just pointing out that your _base level_ is already angry. also, joking. < 1318900698 560136 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: Data-type contexts are not in Haskell. < 1318900702 727661 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Their extension is also deprecated. < 1318900705 454958 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh? < 1318900710 554934 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is because they do nothing. < 1318900714 84798 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :If they think you do, you are wrong. < 1318900721 67345 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(They do something, but it isn't what you want.) < 1318900728 831635 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You do not want a data-type context. < 1318900742 88485 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: But they *really* think I do! < 1318900791 703342 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, it won't make my instance work? < 1318900801 363221 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1318900812 976468 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ... can't write my instance then < 1318900816 21405 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would tell you what you need to do to make it work, but you probably don't even want to do that either. < 1318900819 130962 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hpaste. < 1318900924 804268 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hold on < 1318900964 942378 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hpaste.org/52778 < 1318900977 14729 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which instance is this? < 1318900999 776002 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Num FakeNum one < 1318901008 731893 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What the fuck sort of number is that? < 1318901010 708179 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't do that + there, and can't force these things to be num < 1318901018 526325 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: tricky ones. < 1318901018 677233 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: Just make an (a -> b) instance. < 1318901023 593475 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :...I can? < 1318901026 241986 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your (+) function is a trivial specialisation of it. < 1318901037 599098 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, WHAT? < 1318901099 281510 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: You handle Sgeo|web. < 1318901108 828504 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is too busy doing stuff he won't facepalm the next day about. < 1318901131 728543 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't think that's how it works. < 1318901145 892112 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Totally is. < 1318901148 159857 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: < 1318901151 158561 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (f + g) x < 1318901151 870885 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even know what Sgeo|web is trying to do. < 1318901152 278824 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Ambiguous type variable `a' in the constraints: < 1318901152 737877 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : `GHC.Num.Num a' < 1318901152 884391 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : ari... < 1318901154 631873 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah. < 1318901155 950303 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (f + g) x :: Expr < 1318901157 264580 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : f x + g x < 1318901208 466091 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then can I fill in my own values for x given that? < 1318901229 846376 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (f + g) 99 :: Expr < 1318901230 490936 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : f 99 + g 99 < 1318901236 370338 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (succ + pred) 99 < 1318901237 238858 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 198 < 1318901266 523835 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ($ "x") + ($ "y") $ length < 1318901267 369351 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2 < 1318901272 214306 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Stop abusing Sgeo|web. < 1318901282 994322 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait. < 1318901284 114026 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: ^ i think this one is precisely your type < 1318901285 449187 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1318901288 300298 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web is the abusive one. < 1318901294 255999 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: Stop abusing Haskell. < 1318901311 543181 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Sgeo|web has no concept of using a language as intended. < 1318901314 534175 :augur!~augur@216-164-57-20.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1318901321 916176 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: What are s and a? < 1318901328 45528 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this a continuation thing? < 1318901328 368490 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I know that the way I should be doing this is probably monads < 1318901344 89499 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ($ "3") + ($ "4") $ read :: Int < 1318901344 818892 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 7 < 1318901345 338478 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: What? < 1318901346 787928 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: s is something like a String, so I could pass in a function that takes a String and returns a number < 1318901351 254678 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :BRB < 1318901355 226177 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: There is nothing about monads here. < 1318901359 115948 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: ^ like that? :P < 1318901364 538419 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're just using "monads" as a mystical catch-all like everyone who doesn't know Haskell does < 1318901403 662314 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1318901456 140783 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: also note that instead of the lambda you could write (+) (FakeNum a) (FakeNum b) f = ... < 1318901458 241645 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ($ "3") ++ ($ "4") $ id :: String < 1318901460 23970 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : "34" < 1318901460 571252 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zomg < 1318901480 912503 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Or < 1318901484 309292 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(FakeNum a + FakeNum b) f = ... < 1318901488 828761 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I'm not sure that works. < 1318901493 973648 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instance methods have defined arity, don't they? < 1318901502 524791 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? didn't know you could write it like that on the lhs. < 1318901516 271747 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: believe so. < 1318901532 757416 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone else is trying to explain why I need GADTs < 1318901538 71396 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolwat < 1318901541 712598 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :why what are you doing. < 1318901542 108126 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you don't need to define them pointfully, if that's what you mean < 1318901548 684933 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I mean, does < 1318901552 537421 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a + b) c = ... < 1318901552 685287 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :work < 1318901553 861438 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: Where < 1318901567 926094 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm... < 1318901569 629574 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sine < 1318901572 922054 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't trust Haskell advice outside of #esoteric or #haskell :p < 1318901581 308396 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let (a + b) c = a c + b c in (sin + cos) 1 < 1318901582 242763 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Occurs check: cannot construct the infinite type: t = t1 -> t < 1318901583 326244 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: But seriously, just define the (a -> b) instance if you really must. < 1318901593 660212 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1318901594 817071 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a -> b) instance? < 1318901601 280535 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let (a + b) c = a c Prelude.+ b c in (sin + cos) 1 < 1318901602 123549 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1.3817732906760363 < 1318901608 49532 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, making a -> b an instance of something or is a -> b a class? < 1318901610 421628 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :suddenly < 1318901626 630473 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a -> b is definitely not a class. < 1318901634 61566 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's a type < 1318901634 448208 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: yes, making a Num (a -> b) instance, like the one lambdabot has < 1318901659 734605 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :though a a -> b class would be fun < 1318901664 712143 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a ($) method < 1318901686 818340 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :such that space application is translated to $ :P < 1318901696 931177 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"space application" being f x < 1318901724 879287 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would that make Arrows to be easier to use? < 1318901738 231961 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would mostly be bad I think. < 1318901744 770936 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: Arrows don't even have an apply method. < 1318901749 705306 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1318901756 452415 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you count ArrowApply :) < 1318901801 344949 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: anyway did you see my lambdabot examples above < 1318901817 86111 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ... don't quite understand it < 1318901819 81515 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: which doesn't fit the type of dollar < 1318901821 306056 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The examples < 1318901828 235646 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: < 1318901833 123722 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (length + length) "abc" < 1318901834 295016 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 6 < 1318901846 890979 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1318901849 325908 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmmmmmmm < 1318901860 435655 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i was trying to give examples that fit precisely his FakeNum type < 1318901881 785741 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t ($ "3") < 1318901882 665628 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall b. ([Char] -> b) -> b < 1318901895 1690 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Hardly matters if the instance doesn't exploit it. < 1318901898 718162 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ... let me see if I can use my useage < 1318901899 768149 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Not that it could.) < 1318901904 563513 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ($ "3") + ($ "4") $ read :: Int < 1318901905 463111 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 7 < 1318901907 414664 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where are the Data.Map functions? < 1318901932 541107 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : > (length + length) "abc" < 1318901932 687705 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : 6 < 1318901936 979515 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: In Data.Map. < 1318902006 166377 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :length * 2 :3 < 1318902027 302114 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (length * 2) abc < 1318902027 878114 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: `abc' < 1318902028 468331 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> Data.Map.lookup "x" + Data.Map.lookup "y" $ Data.Map.fromList [("x",2), ("y",3)] < 1318902029 149156 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: `Data.Map.lookup'Not in scope: `Data.Map.lookup'Not in scope:... < 1318902029 482851 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (length * 2) "abc" < 1318902030 331985 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 6 < 1318902035 199746 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 2 * length ^ 2 + 1 $ "hm..." < 1318902036 157420 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 51 < 1318902037 64852 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: M. < 1318902044 266607 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> M.lookup "x" + M.lookup "y" $ M.fromList [("x",2), ("y",3)] < 1318902045 131939 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : No instance for (GHC.Num.Num (Data.Maybe.Maybe a)) < 1318902045 506820 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use of... < 1318902072 499960 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (fromJust . Data.Map.lookup) "x" + (fromJust . Data.Map.lookup) "y" $ Data.Map.fromList [("x",2), ("y",3)] < 1318902073 420880 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: `Data.Map.lookup'Not in scope: `Data.Map.lookup'Not in scope:... < 1318902095 49311 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (fromJust . M.lookup) "x" + (fromJust . M.lookup) "y" $ M.fromList [("x",2), ("y",3)] < 1318902095 907626 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `Data.Maybe.Maybe a' < 1318902096 308983 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred ... < 1318902100 32402 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: Don't fromJust. :-( < 1318902116 691231 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how you could define a method that implements integral multiplication as recursive addition, that can take multiple different integral types. < 1318902128 7917 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus allowing length * 2 < 1318902143 809377 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...well, length isn't exactly integral. :P < 1318902145 455542 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1318902149 790572 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: There's an operator for that, and you don't understand (.). < 1318902205 871097 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: f (g x y) !== (f . g) x y < 1318902216 480365 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@unpl (f .) . g < 1318902216 708716 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(\ d i -> f (g d i)) < 1318902239 122322 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fromJust . M.lookup "x" + fromJust . M.lookup "y" $ M.fromList [("x",2), ("y",3)] < 1318902240 710501 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 5 < 1318902243 771496 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :FOR GOD'S SAKE < 1318902247 183407 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :M.! < 1318902255 763793 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (M.! "x") + (M.! "y") $ M.fromList [("x",2), ("y",3)] < 1318902256 598256 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 5 < 1318902268 284389 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, angry young man < 1318902281 187343 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318902320 756102 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ;_; < 1318902329 802702 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: lambdabot also has .: which does the same thing (f . ) . g but I'm not really sure that it's standard.. < 1318902340 598187 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle (.:) < 1318902340 744843 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :No results found < 1318902342 979081 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah... < 1318902424 486578 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :.:: < 1318902429 913181 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318902447 662135 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (M.!) "x" + (M.!) "y" $ M.fromList [("x",2), ("y",3)] < 1318902447 967020 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: not falling for it.... not falling for it.... not -- AAAAAAAH < 1318902448 569554 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `Data.Map.Map k a' < 1318902448 833313 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred ty... < 1318902450 283443 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (.::) < 1318902451 99985 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in scope: `.::' < 1318902455 489572 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: ;_; < 1318902458 228613 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm reminded of those principia mathematica dots < 1318902490 217922 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :which i suppose had a similar purpose of avoiding parentheses :P < 1318902491 842364 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION copies elliott's thing < 1318902492 520266 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: those are great < 1318902495 449458 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl (f .) . g < 1318902495 609331 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(f .) . g < 1318902496 960185 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (M.! "x") + (M.! "y") + 10 $ M.fromList [("x",2), ("y",3)] < 1318902497 920981 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 15 < 1318902498 214446 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1318902500 865746 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@let (.::)=fmap fmap fmap fmap fmap < 1318902501 258422 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh < 1318902501 766138 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Defined. < 1318902502 789927 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl \f g -> (f .) . g < 1318902503 184339 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(.) . (.) < 1318902507 440692 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :best operator < 1318902526 285888 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the "third nipple" operator < 1318902572 766423 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, arguably the best operator is in fact the angry totem pole and its arbitrary layering < 1318902582 872779 :augur!~augur@216-164-57-20.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1318902590 216877 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ((:[])>=>(:[])) 2 < 1318902591 121618 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [2] < 1318902610 107065 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ((:[])>=>(:[])>=>(:[])>=>(:[])>=>(:[])) 2 < 1318902610 926373 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [2] < 1318902621 46926 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you may include as many angry totem levels as you please. < 1318902634 356785 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the angry totem pole just keeps returning < 1318902652 552288 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh ho ho ho ho. my hat off to you sir. < 1318902666 464583 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does the Num (a -> b) instance use any extensions? < 1318902675 64289 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1318902688 804291 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: That would be Num b => Num (a -> b), and no. But good luck writing a Show for it... < 1318902705 97157 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ($ 2) :: Int -> Int < 1318902705 909316 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `GHC.Types.Int' < 1318902706 188855 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred type ... < 1318902707 961601 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1318902713 56762 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (+ 2) :: Int -> Int < 1318902713 895459 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Overlapping instances for GHC.Show.Show < 1318902714 187122 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : (GHC.T... < 1318902730 524910 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wouldn't attempt to write a Show for it, other than show = const "" < 1318902732 64856 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot: your instances are a mess < 1318902740 186540 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> id < 1318902740 978025 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Overlapping instances for GHC.Show.Show (a -> a) < 1318902741 484614 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use of `... < 1318902747 695340 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, where did bd_ appear from. < 1318902750 749889 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: more importantly, it's injecting a really ugly instance into the global namespace < 1318902751 151173 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, there it is. < 1318902756 999794 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Over there ---------> < 1318902797 217871 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: so later on if you write (f x y z) + 42 when f takes four arguments you get a real headscratcher of an error message... < 1318902827 89242 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally the Num instance for (a -> b) just lifts everything into the reader monad < 1318902827 590902 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> f x y z + 42 :: Expr < 1318902828 512770 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : f x y z + 42 < 1318902858 248572 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let f _ _ _ _ = undefined in f 1 2 3 + 42 < 1318902859 228652 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Overlapping instances for GHC.Show.Show (t -> a) < 1318902859 375355 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use of `... < 1318902877 214703 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let f _ _ _ _ = undefined in f 1 2 3 + 42 == 43 < 1318902878 94777 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : *Exception: (==): No overloading for function < 1318902894 934638 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops, your argument mismatch type error became a runtime error now :) < 1318902896 715516 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ((f + 1) 2 + 3) 4 + 5 :: Expr < 1318902897 713878 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : f 2 4 + 1 + 3 + 5 < 1318902910 390598 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I still think the proper way is to use monads, because this way, I can't do == with these things < 1318902918 931891 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 2 "best" "misfeature" < 1318902919 848822 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2 < 1318902923 444890 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: you still haven't defined how on earth this is related to monads in any way at all < 1318902925 809541 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least, unless you can write halts :: a -> Bool for me? < 1318902936 999282 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1318902945 253209 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, is that a sufficient condition for making (a -> b) an Eq instance? < 1318902946 78878 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I'm just going to leave you to this < 1318902949 211108 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :let halts = ((const True) $!) < 1318902950 46231 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just necessary? < 1318902953 801878 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1318902964 284715 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 2 . "best" . "misfeature" < 1318902965 38874 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `a1 -> a' < 1318902965 370357 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred type `[GHC.... < 1318902993 636788 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 2 "best" . "misfeature" < 1318902995 395329 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2] < 1318903006 128504 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t ($!) < 1318903006 809576 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. (a -> b) -> a -> b < 1318903009 859738 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: it's necessary but not sufficient. but anyway, you really don't want to use a Num (a->b) instance. Just define a proper GADT already :| < 1318903020 22220 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could even define Eq and Show if you did it with a GADT! < 1318903035 727661 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O < 1318903051 701182 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :structural equality, mind you < 1318903148 103246 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :bd_: how would a gadt help < 1318903164 105545 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://gist.github.com/1294383 something along these lines < 1318903186 528328 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I suppose if you get rid of the general liftSNs and use a limited set of operations (as would be needed for Eq), you could get away with regular datatypes < 1318903210 456838 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not just newtype FakeNum s a = FakeNum ((s -> a) -> a) < 1318903225 775907 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and instance Num a => Num (FakeNum s a) < 1318903244 778873 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't want to pollute instances of real functions < 1318903246 256676 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you could certainly do that, although then you can't define Eq and Show, and you're forced to choose the result type early on (or have rank-2 types scattered throughout the user's code) < 1318903281 183195 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm i guess i don't know what Sgeo|web wants to use it for, so maybe < 1318903282 117879 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, point is there's no reason to pollute instances of functions < 1318903294 545312 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I actually have a chance of getting the FakeNum s a thing to work, so < 1318903298 398472 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no reason to do what Sgeo|web is doing in the first place. < 1318903302 994789 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever that is. < 1318903304 562844 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :instance Something (a -> b) is fun to play with but not so fun to debug with < 1318903311 312831 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: for fun < 1318903324 785313 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: in that case I fully endorse the GADT method ;) < 1318903334 557038 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-31-252.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MSleep < 1318903336 581194 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :for values of fun equal to wasting your time painfully < 1318903368 573026 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I'm sort of using this as a "bad" suggestion for how to have a thing that you can specify "x"s etc. then later fill them it < 1318903393 642651 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :My good suggestion is still monads, since that can be made to work smoothly and sanely with == < 1318903426 856528 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION still doesn't understand how monads, which have embedded functions all over the place, can possibly be made to work smoothly and sanely with == < 1318903527 375519 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imNotCreativeEnoughToNameThisFunction do { a <- term "x"; b <- term "y"; return a + b == 5 } [("x",2),("y",3)] < 1318903550 306563 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: learn to precedence :P < 1318903558 874204 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :return (a + b == 5) < 1318903581 430361 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :bd_: monads don't inherently have embedded functions < 1318903583 413471 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :[] is a monad, after all < 1318903632 141683 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: that's called the reader monad, where term k = asks ($ k) < 1318903636 563083 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: good point < 1318903647 175487 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :bd_: if lists were functions < 1318903654 719278 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I fail to see how he'll construct his delayed-symbolic-evaluation monad without using embedded functions :) < 1318903657 261709 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :term k = asks (M.! k) :P < 1318903681 811871 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: my way is more general :) < 1318903696 514995 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bd_: oh, hmm, huh < 1318903701 78217 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :where the environment = M.! someMap < 1318903727 97369 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Reader monad is more sane than RVar for my purposes then >.> < 1318903733 949122 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now bd_ knows what I really want to do >.> < 1318903738 425349 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I don't. < 1318903747 426031 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The mcmc thing < 1318903756 724385 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still need to watch that video though < 1318903757 890315 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :... not seeing how Reader would be very helpful for that! < 1318903790 313441 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Function to adjust the values of the "random" variables, I guess < 1318903794 477752 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Again, I need to learn MCMC < 1318903809 974361 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm having an impression that I'm doing X-Y, but oh well < 1318903812 812200 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll learn < 1318903823 664230 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :RVar? < 1318903841 175855 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What on earth are you actually doing < 1318903847 949693 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :near as I can tell he's trying to do some sort of markov chain traverser < 1318903859 737431 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and was thinking about using Data.RVar for it < 1318903893 763336 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the docs for RVar have a nice random walk example that could probably be adapted to a markov chain easily enough... < 1318903905 835250 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well. "good luck with that" < 1318903922 251242 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've never even heard of rvar. looks way too complicated for this < 1318903950 196845 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1318903952 91736 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ < 1318903952 238459 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : 111 < 1318903952 238650 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ if impl(ghc == 7.2.1) < 1318903952 238759 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : 112 < 1318903952 238863 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ -- Doesn't work under GHC 7.2.1 due to < 1318903952 934467 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : 113 < 1318903954 976225 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ -- http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/ticket/5410 < 1318903957 44737 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : 114 < 1318903958 856186 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ Buildable: False < 1318903960 994196 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it doesn't work < 1318904048 963442 :bd_!~nanashi@satoko.is.fushizen.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice :) < 1318904246 19149 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.exoticmeatmarket.com/aflime.html LION STEAKS, GETCHER LION STEAKS < 1318906226 312665 :PatashuXantheres!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a question re: cygwin and languages that exec on the command line. Say I have a unix program (dd) that I want to be able to call from a program that I'm running on windows. I know that there are cygwin dlls that, if in the same folder as a unix program, let me call it from the command line. What do I have to do if it's from a program? Same thing? < 1318906395 641548 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the exe depends on the dll < 1318906398 765561 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's all < 1318906414 823158 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could even be in c:\windows < 1318906441 538382 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: yikes. < 1318906462 162733 :PatashuXantheres!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :So say both dd and cygwin's dlls are in my computer's path and from e.g. a java program I run the command 'dd blahblahblah'. It'll work? < 1318906480 689523 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: fake, right? < 1318906488 650992 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :PatashuXantheres: hopefully < 1318906497 201891 :PatashuXantheres!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :'hopefully' lol < 1318906499 535615 :PatashuXantheres!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au NICK :Patashu < 1318906528 332214 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The DLL needs to be in the lookup path for DLLs... < 1318906531 933658 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"If PETA will give 1000 jobs to American farmers and ranchers, Exotic Meat Market will stop selling any and all kind of meats which PETA wants us to stop." < 1318906545 39916 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember all the details of that, but I do remember that the directory of the EXE is in the lookup path. < 1318906590 156643 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :for digital forensics at university I have to write a program that can hide data on the hard disk such that normal techniques won't find it. my idea is to take a fat file system like on a flash drive, write to the bad cluster bitmap to mark a new cluster as bad, and then in that cluster write the information to hide < 1318906597 474158 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I *think* it's a configuration option, and that cygwin sticks the path to cygwin.dll in there?) < 1318906640 843734 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume by "normal techniques" they mean "looking around a mounted filesystem". < 1318906648 13030 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1318906659 64887 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that'd work quite well. < 1318906662 485720 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :awesome < 1318906692 122117 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could also do something more awesome and esoteric. < 1318906703 168451 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Store long file names without corresponding short file names. < 1318906709 317837 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm! < 1318906751 956164 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows simply considers such entries in the file name list to be empty, so as to be compatible with SFN-only FAT implementations. < 1318906888 172327 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you have to go to NT level to circmvrent that? < 1318906941 630080 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, you have to access the partition yourself. < 1318906953 163931 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's also part of Linux VFAT, I think. < 1318906975 645487 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1318908204 258514 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should I try to first grok GADTs or Rank 2 whatevers or existentials? < 1318908361 663383 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should first grok grokking. < 1318908366 353508 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :From this all else follows. < 1318908530 753002 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318908603 860925 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.35 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1318909342 377781 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Normally when creating a new type using type, newtype, data, etc., every type variable that appears on the right-hand side must also appear on the left-hand side. Existential types are a way of turning this off." < 1318909351 704070 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That... is stunningly simple to understand, I think < 1318909388 717458 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I have a feeling I'm missing the reason why that's normally the case < 1318909476 216723 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is an awful explanation < 1318909482 562304 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: In the simplest case, existential types are sort of like implicit casting to an interface in languages like Java < 1318909498 974118 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but with multiple parameters you get far more generality than you do with just an interface. < 1318909505 502878 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: i... < 1318909506 872863 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1318909513 982934 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is that not a good analogy? < 1318909525 369644 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: ask #haskell. < 1318909526 796155 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl (\x -> x%2==0) < 1318909526 986179 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(0 ==) . (% 2) < 1318909531 108470 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t isEven < 1318909532 12905 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in scope: `isEven' < 1318909532 803936 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: do those things not compare? do they not have similar roles? I think they do. < 1318909533 900621 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t even < 1318909534 835854 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Integral a) => a -> Bool < 1318909542 370631 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (%) < 1318909543 173873 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Overlapping instances for GHC.Show.Show < 1318909543 551460 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : (a -> ... < 1318909547 320344 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1318909552 420370 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (%) < 1318909553 324125 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Integral a) => a -> a -> Ratio a < 1318909565 960617 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: not what you want < 1318909577 603081 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t mod < 1318909578 459534 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Integral a) => a -> a -> a < 1318909587 732943 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> map (`mod` 5) [1..] < 1318909588 613255 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,2,3,4,0,1,2,3,4,0,1,2,3,4,0,1,2,3,4,0,1,2,3,4,0,1,2,3,4,0,1,2,3,4,0,1,2,... < 1318909597 206547 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> map even [1..] < 1318909597 967319 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [False,True,False,True,False,True,False,True,False,True,False,True,False,Tr... < 1318909608 894138 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> filter even [1..] < 1318909610 43686 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [2,4,6,8,10,12,14,16,18,20,22,24,26,28,30,32,34,36,38,40,42,44,46,48,50,52,... < 1318909617 210854 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> evens < 1318909618 102963 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: `evens' < 1318909621 698381 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1318909632 852862 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :though they may be in a library or something. no need. < 1318909634 347586 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (map (*2) . filter even) [1,2,3,4,5,8] < 1318909635 286632 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Integral a) => [a] < 1318909635 597297 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*thought < 1318909638 620885 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (map (*2) . filter even) [1,2,3,4,5,8] < 1318909640 155447 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [4,8,16] < 1318909754 433834 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: typeclasses, in the simplest case, are comparable to interfaces are they not? How is an existential type not like declaring a structure with attributes that have an interface type? variable with an interface type? < 1318909758 428464 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...er < 1318909769 147898 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol. accidentally hit enter before I ctrl+K'd < 1318909789 196341 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably should have ctrl+U'd though. < 1318909790 44572 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: i'm really not up to correcting your iffy analogy right now. i'm pretty busy. sorry < 1318909818 451469 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no need to correct. I'm not in any way saying it's a perfect fit. If anything typeclasses and existentials are a superset of it. < 1318909821 828503 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because... they are. < 1318909850 629052 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the things you can do with interfaces, you can do with typeclasses and existentials. < 1318909859 233179 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no? < 1318910197 878504 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1318910247 724875 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318910494 967026 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (\あ -> あ) 1 < 1318910495 798912 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1318910521 842499 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (\何か -> 何か) 1 < 1318910522 652601 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1318910661 982733 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :どうして日本語で書くの? < 1318910662 129710 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 1 2 3 4 5 < 1318910663 56424 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1318910725 713884 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a really bad hack to put in lambdabots evaluator simply so that you can write things like f x y z :: Expr < 1318910732 524117 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1318910737 493288 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :its pure haskell < 1318910738 664141 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1318910742 490060 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1318910751 710552 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't rely on that instance < 1318910764 148922 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't say it did. < 1318910767 796174 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :those two things are comoketely separate < 1318910770 98857 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes you did < 1318910771 211408 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm pretty sure that is the purpose of its existence. < 1318910774 520167 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1318910821 712435 :ive!~nn@189.179.247.113 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318910827 452148 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also "1 2 3 4 5" is not a valid expression according to GHC. < 1318910834 795283 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it is syntactically. < 1318910835 371659 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it is < 1318910861 13192 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hint: it will type with one line of code < 1318910876 385887 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 1 2 3 4 5 < 1318910877 242579 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1318910894 386846 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: an instance declaration, yes? Will it /run/ in one line of code? < 1318910921 343606 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 1 2 + 3 4 < 1318910922 224979 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 4 < 1318910931 819208 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t 1 2 3 4 5 < 1318910931 965741 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (1 2) 3 < 1318910932 794423 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall t t1. (Num (t1 -> t), Num t1) => t < 1318910933 24874 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1318910945 969430 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t 1 2 < 1318910946 761187 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall t t1. (Num (t1 -> t), Num t1) => t < 1318910957 667326 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1318910960 734492 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :fromIntergral? < 1318910960 970089 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It won't type; there's no instance of Num (a -> b -> c -> d) by default. < 1318910969 733435 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: 1 is a function, duh. < 1318910972 252968 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1318911014 365659 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but you're basically saying that valid Haskell != bad hack < 1318911041 808598 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"put in lambdabots evaluator" < 1318911045 305183 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which case, I'll get back to you when I finish my IsString instance that executes arbitrary perl. < 1318911060 894835 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: I'm pretty sure what you're seeing is just a normal, perfectly sane instance of Num. < 1318911075 6076 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nums via Church numerals, if I had to guess. < 1318911080 204718 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1318911080 557510 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 0.5 34 < 1318911081 454052 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 0.5 < 1318911095 560417 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Then what is it? < 1318911109 249166 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (sum / length) [0..9] < 1318911110 94585 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : No instance for (GHC.Real.Fractional GHC.Types.Int) < 1318911110 376639 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use o... < 1318911116 876825 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (sum / length) [0.0..9] < 1318911117 677640 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : No instance for (GHC.Real.Fractional GHC.Types.Int) < 1318911118 70629 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use o... < 1318911121 184446 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ffs < 1318911127 612997 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: "1 2" does not type with just Prelude. < 1318911148 393390 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :its not normal < 1318911149 644029 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sane < 1318911151 973596 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or church < 1318911167 39260 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then what *is* it? < 1318911187 671134 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t f x y z < 1318911188 495211 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall t. (SimpleReflect.FromExpr (Expr -> t)) => t < 1318911191 609209 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (length + length) [0,9] < 1318911192 524981 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 4 < 1318911196 943432 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: THAT IS UNRELATED < 1318911201 921519 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :_COMPLETELY_ < 1318911206 619974 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: OKAY I WAS SORT OF TESTING TO SEE IF IT WAS RELAX < 1318911221 698431 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: YOU EXPLAIN NOTHING < 1318911228 414419 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: < 1318911230 391534 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (length + length) [0,9] < 1318911231 188672 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 4 < 1318911234 466125 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: yeah I don't know why you're trying to elliott to explain anything. < 1318911238 207541 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (length / length) [0,9] < 1318911238 354314 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :+get < 1318911239 49383 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : No instance for (GHC.Real.Fractional GHC.Types.Int) < 1318911239 324325 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use o... < 1318911248 876027 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (length `div` length) [0,9] < 1318911249 800365 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : No instance for (GHC.Real.Integral ([a] -> GHC.Types.Int)) < 1318911250 88025 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from ... < 1318911252 826642 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh come on < 1318911261 33765 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (length - length) [0,9] < 1318911261 883153 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 0 < 1318911265 44417 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (length / length) [0.0, 0.9] < 1318911265 976464 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : No instance for (GHC.Real.Fractional GHC.Types.Int) < 1318911266 251908 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use o... < 1318911267 858642 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (length + 99) [0,9] < 1318911268 764673 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 101 < 1318911275 777667 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: explained. < 1318911286 377960 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want the name of the instance and its source. < 1318911302 791717 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :instances dont have names < 1318911313 443216 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know what I mean. < 1318911322 507369 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1318911350 539093 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, yes, you're a crazy person who thinks (length + length) [0,9] explains (length + length) [0,9] < 1318911362 963658 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i gave three examples < 1318911370 40581 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t length + length < 1318911370 412015 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :w/e, keep being stubborn < 1318911370 826521 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. [a] -> Int < 1318911380 229115 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (length +) < 1318911381 49365 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. ([a] -> Int) -> [a] -> Int < 1318911400 152179 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Num instance on functions, as far as I can tell. < 1318911433 645415 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instance of Num for (Num n) => (n -> n), apparently. < 1318911447 137746 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then "term term" automatically types as a -> b? < 1318911453 785830 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er a -> a in that case I guess. < 1318911464 746838 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: uhh < 1318911473 939437 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah if my examples typed with that < 1318911479 323207 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t \x->1 x < 1318911480 131061 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall t t1. (Num (t -> t1)) => t -> t1 < 1318911487 466380 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Derp. < 1318911504 937273 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not entirely clear how that magically makes integer literals into functions. < 1318911518 634710 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t 9 < 1318911519 525430 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall t. (Num t) => t < 1318911530 839107 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :This time I fixed the gopher SWPC for really. < 1318911533 296690 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: uh huh? < 1318911533 443310 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you actually know haskell < 1318911544 961345 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I do. < 1318911574 924007 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: do you actually know how to explain things instead of just being a jackass? < 1318911575 821869 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :practically every feature of the language i have had to explain to your confusion < 1318911580 352632 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Answer: no) < 1318911582 90760 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t 9 < 1318911582 943478 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall t. (Num t) => t < 1318911586 651331 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ Num instance < 1318911589 189593 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric := ????? < 1318911614 346040 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :at what point does 1 2 3 4 5 solicit the services of (+), (-), or (*)? < 1318911627 142551 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t 9 < 1318911628 70649 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall t. (Num t) => t < 1318911634 910392 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know the type of 9, sir. < 1318911635 535242 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ Num instance for functions < 1318911638 656946 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric := ????????????? < 1318911678 343854 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 9 . 8 < 1318911679 291472 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : No instance for (GHC.Show.Show (f b)) < 1318911679 591350 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use of `M2427776621... < 1318911685 45051 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (9 . 8) 7 < 1318911686 608010 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 9 < 1318911730 145899 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t const 8 < 1318911731 5687 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall t b. (Num t) => b -> t < 1318911744 726584 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (9 >>= 8) < 1318911745 613571 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (m :: * -> *) a b. (Num (m a), Num (m b), Monad m) => m b < 1318911777 436843 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (9 >>= 8) 7 < 1318911778 318145 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 8 < 1318911790 6345 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :exciting instance. < 1318911843 997037 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> map (5 + 5) [1..] < 1318911844 892597 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10... < 1318911879 218460 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 'a' 2 3 < 1318911879 992667 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `t1 -> t2 -> t' < 1318911880 252767 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred type ... < 1318911896 915609 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :needs moar OverloadedChars < 1318911907 828828 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :function instance of IsChar < 1318911915 142196 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Num instance of IsChar < 1318911918 700248 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :weak typing yesssssss < 1318911932 372432 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er well Int instance of IsChar. < 1318912009 54072 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fix 1 < 1318912009 932603 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1318912012 118902 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fixed. < 1318912102 620977 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: note that knowing Haskell does not instantly able to grasp your, honestly, shit explanations of things. For an example that isn't influenced by your inherent bias against me, see pikhq < 1318912108 371109 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/able/allow/ < 1318912121 483104 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/allow/allow me (?#ack...)/ < 1318912335 698711 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: If there is an instance of Num for (a -> b), then it immediately follows that for anything of type (Num t) => t (say, 1), it can be of type (a -> b). < 1318912382 778252 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, I was confused because I didn't realize that "f a" always enforces f to be type a -> b < 1318912394 527337 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to applying integers < 1318912408 577523 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, I knew intuitively that it does enforce that, but not that GHC does that. < 1318912420 28702 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It simply must. < 1318912421 335500 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's simple unification, there is no special rule < 1318912436 217101 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: cool, dude. < 1318912453 877016 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd literally have to break type inference for that to not happen. And a lot of other things besides. :) < 1318912472 379326 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, the more familiar example of a -> b as a Monad does the same thing. < 1318912486 709866 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :integer overloading magic just confused me. < 1318912500 227114 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*number < 1318912603 138111 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I was confused I thought the entire world was derived of special cases. < 1318912625 809225 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I too am under the impression that this is how you model things < 1318912636 3669 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed. < 1318912665 81664 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tend to model things with intuition. Sometimes this is inexact. Shit happens. < 1318912729 835333 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, you don't know Haskell, just a bunch of special cases? ok < 1318912754 134011 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, for starters, I do not fully know the process GHC uses to derive types. < 1318912770 596417 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :do I know Haskell. Sure, by some definition of know. < 1318912808 3111 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes this is totally a ghc specific thing < 1318912813 453758 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hindley and milner, famous ghc hackers < 1318912817 998567 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :languages = implementations < 1318912823 650569 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: totally. < 1318912849 695209 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps if you didn't know everything things like not knowing things would make more sense to you. < 1318912922 699198 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> iterate (*2) < 1318912923 572568 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Overlapping instances for GHC.Show.Show (a -> [a]) < 1318912923 863644 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use of... < 1318912925 908564 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t iterate < 1318912926 812874 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (a -> a) -> a -> [a] < 1318912935 342035 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> iterate (*2) 1 < 1318912936 85652 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,2,4,8,16,32,64,128,256,512,1024,2048,4096,8192,16384,32768,65536,131072,... < 1318912943 191695 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> iterate (\x -> x * x) 1 < 1318912944 39064 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,... < 1318912945 34923 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> iterate (\x -> x * x) 2 < 1318912945 918813 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [2,4,16,256,65536,4294967296,18446744073709551616,3402823669209384634633746... < 1318912953 610189 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> iterate (\x -> x * x * x) 2 < 1318912954 461324 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [2,8,512,134217728,2417851639229258349412352,141347765182270746366663800059... < 1318912963 269317 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> iterate (\x -> x * x * x * x * x * x) 2 < 1318912964 200738 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [2,64,68719476736,105312291668557186697918027683670432318895095400549111254... < 1318912970 423693 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okey, yeah, it's not going to overflow, is it? < 1318912975 6066 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> iterate 2 undefined < 1318912975 892555 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [*Exception: Prelude.undefined < 1318912978 766540 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1318912983 391368 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 2 undefined < 1318912984 296956 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2 < 1318913006 543329 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION scratches head. < 1318913019 721025 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src iterate < 1318913019 985051 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :iterate f x = x : iterate f (f x) < 1318913029 479793 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION scratches his head even more. < 1318913033 456336 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318913034 126286 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1318913049 393335 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> iterate 2 0 < 1318913050 309479 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [0,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,... < 1318913059 667149 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> join iterate 2 < 1318913060 528942 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Occurs check: cannot construct the infinite type: a = a -> a < 1318913063 830421 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah < 1318913078 905221 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> tail (iterate 9 undefined) < 1318913079 772742 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,9,... < 1318913084 96340 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> iterate 2 2 < 1318913084 904102 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,... < 1318913131 57209 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah okay. < 1318913147 99024 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, not referring to iterate 2 2 < 1318913150 368381 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I, uh, figured that out < 1318913167 111128 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was trying to write it with join. but the 2 on the left is not the same type as the two on the right. < 1318913180 284354 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> iterate unsafeCoerce undefined < 1318913181 74345 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: `unsafeCoerce' < 1318913184 979945 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :integer overloading, apparently the bane of my existence. < 1318913205 387316 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :So... < 1318913219 664002 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :forceEval :: a -> a < 1318913224 633048 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :forceEval = unsafeCoerce < 1318913232 119352 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :forceEval = id < 1318913234 29304 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :most likely < 1318913245 880862 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :though it could be unsafeCoerce :: a -> a < 1318913248 280656 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is just... id. < 1318913299 531177 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t join asTypeOf < 1318913300 535360 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. a -> a < 1318913303 151743 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :could also be that. < 1318913303 298399 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : forceEval :: a -> a < 1318913309 357438 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: a "forceEval" function makes no sense. < 1318913317 208981 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :semantically, implementation-wise, every-wise. < 1318913322 206144 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well.... < 1318913324 281827 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, it makes sense... as id. id is forceEval. :P < 1318913331 62538 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: No. < 1318913336 589648 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe "strict" would be a better word? < 1318913337 81195 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :;. < 1318913338 237206 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :reverse . reverse for lists < 1318913338 727557 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :;.; < 1318913346 981864 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: not id does not magically strictly evaluate. < 1318913349 651096 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(no < 1318913352 281194 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t seq < 1318913353 170279 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a t. a -> t -> t < 1318913368 869452 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :unsafeCoerce undefined seems to error, at least. < 1318913378 217156 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: when evaluated, yes. < 1318913388 725709 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: No, there is literally no way that makes any sense at all; if you think it does, you don't understand Haskell's evaluation model very well. < 1318913392 654404 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: try putting it as the second argument to const < 1318913397 138033 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ;.; < 1318913409 782155 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> undefined `seq` 2 < 1318913410 618156 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : *Exception: Prelude.undefined < 1318913413 985719 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION drops an anvil on elliott  < 1318913414 892590 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :Die < 1318913418 551480 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :k < 1318913425 23780 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: const 2 undefined == 2 < 1318913434 516298 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: const 2 (unsafeCoerce undefined) == 2 < 1318913439 393967 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t const < 1318913440 280338 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. a -> b -> a < 1318913443 506341 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> const 2 3 < 1318913444 309380 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2 < 1318913449 552881 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> const 2 "holy crap anything" < 1318913450 454642 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2 < 1318913467 597975 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's up, #esoteric < 1318913474 422891 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> const 2 (repeat "dude this list repeats /forever/") < 1318913475 249432 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2 < 1318913518 915336 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let x = repeat "dude this list repeats /forever/" in x `seq` const 2 x < 1318913519 777475 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2 < 1318913551 10893 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> seq (fix ($)) 2 < 1318913551 851758 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2 < 1318913561 401372 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t fix ($) < 1318913562 289632 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. a -> b < 1318913566 27827 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :No way that'll return, right? < 1318913571 831296 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1318913574 155543 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> seq (fix ($) 1) 2 < 1318913578 727111 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: note that when seq strictly evaluates something that doesn't mean that it evaluates the structure completely. < 1318913589 445811 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : thread killed < 1318913591 947112 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes sense =p < 1318913606 558999 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so repeat 2 `seq` 2 only evaluates the first node of repeat 2 < 1318913645 105810 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :deepseq? < 1318913669 545909 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a function called deepSeq that evaluates everything to its so-called normal form (aka "fully evaluated") < 1318913716 838483 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deepSeq (fix (1:) []) "wee" < 1318913717 899852 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: `deepSeq' < 1318913722 272876 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's called deepseq and it's in a type-class. < 1318913729 90354 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does not make sense for much data, and it is almost always a bad idea. < 1318913735 116694 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/much/many/ < 1318913862 591841 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: there's also a function ($!) f x = x `seq` f x < 1318913867 770192 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :aka strict application. < 1318914061 108240 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: but generally using seq and $! isn't really important unless you're trying to optimize code speed or memory use. < 1318914093 843088 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :seq needs to go back into a typeclass. < 1318914109 923253 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: por que? < 1318914114 708765 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also "go back" -- it was in one before? < 1318914120 126411 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1318914131 928947 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :In 1.4. Haskell 98 was a step back in several ways. < 1318914140 715406 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :What would the benefit of that be? < 1318914145 950708 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :class Eval a where < 1318914146 209395 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : seq :: a -> b -> b < 1318914146 356089 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : strict :: (a -> b) -> a -> b < 1318914146 356236 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : strict f x = x `seq` f x < 1318914164 486281 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also how does one write a seq instance < 1318914169 225435 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :without a seq? < 1318914172 390463 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Allows eta-expansion (because it doesn't say whether functions are lifted or unlifted); avoids massively complicating the semantic model (seq has no denotational semantics). < 1318914194 283089 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And makes parametricity hold more properly. < 1318914219 205602 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other excellent things 1.4 had: (++) in MonadPlus, monad comprehensions, "map" in Functor, empty Void type... < 1318914226 708497 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :waaaaaaah < 1318914234 806455 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so good. < 1318914242 335693 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happened Haskell 98? < 1318914272 129401 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and no "fail" in Monad. < 1318914274 739369 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps they were concerned with the typeclass overhead for the common case of lists? < 1318914279 774907 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is no overhead. < 1318914283 51569 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happened was concerns about newbies / quality of error messages; and proliferation of constraints in definitions. < 1318914290 888337 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, lame. < 1318914298 229097 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. using Seq added Eval constraints, and MonadFail constraints or whatever for partial pattern matches, and so on. < 1318914311 430790 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :filter :: MonadZero m => (a -> Bool) -> m a -> m a < 1318914311 594920 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :filter p = applyM (\x -> if p x then return x else zero) < 1318914316 129002 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not like they avoided a profusion of instance-related error messages. < 1318914320 989996 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I get plenty of those. < 1318914347 425436 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :did someone ping me? < 1318914352 405691 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: probably < 1318914381 359844 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay as long as it's not important enough that you said "yes" < 1318914400 925269 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :liftM3 :: (Monad m) => (a -> b -> c -> d) -> < 1318914401 252142 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : (m a -> m b -> m c -> m d) < 1318914401 398863 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :liftM3 f = \a b c -> [f a' b' c' | a' <- a, b' <- b, c' <- c] < 1318914403 858025 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Monad comprehensions. < 1318914416 270753 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.o < 1318914422 76331 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :monad comprehensions < 1318914433 608598 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I honestly < 1318914438 539192 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :never use list comprehensions. maybe I should. < 1318914468 17244 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :they say bitcoin is dead < 1318914486 892926 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: they said rock 'n' roll would die. < 1318914577 459121 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh programming C++ is like... flagellantism < 1318914601 472379 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"First you have to tell the compiler how to serialize any datatype, in general. Since Haskell datatypes have a regular structure, this means you can just explain how to serialize a few basic datatypes." < 1318914604 268106 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woah < 1318914608 584942 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I like where this is going < 1318914613 600000 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :programming C++ is like... programming fortran... without the hardcore hacker feel < 1318914652 89079 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :would that be more of C <->fortran relationship? < 1318914656 363655 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*wouldn't < 1318914735 276018 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh apparently fortran got OO, nevermind. < 1318914746 405288 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :like anyone uses it < 1318914763 64223 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm < 1318914765 565678 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should learn fortran. < 1318914774 519656 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: lust after fortran next < 1318914788 925730 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my Conquest of Programming Language Knowledge(tm) < 1318914847 98760 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the main restraint on said conquest being that I cannot think of projects as quickly as I can think of programming languages to learn. < 1318914955 660994 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t f < 1318914956 526429 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (SimpleReflect.FromExpr a) => a < 1318914957 693710 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t f 1 < 1318914958 633410 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall t t1. (Num t, SimpleReflect.FromExpr (t -> t1)) => t1 < 1318914986 267400 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not related to the integer overloading, but a similar idea. < 1318915109 18442 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t a b < 1318915109 965750 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `Expr -> t' < 1318915110 252893 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred type `Expr' < 1318915110 399477 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : In the expression: a b < 1318915115 739774 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t b < 1318915116 645113 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Expr < 1318915118 580121 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318915236 691969 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm why doesn't SimpleReflect document FromExpr.. < 1318915250 584333 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, aside from defining it in source code < 1318915252 432614 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't count. < 1318915293 836313 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: http://twanvl.nl/blog/haskell/simple-reflection-of-expressions < 1318915306 242813 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t fun < 1318915307 112804 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (SimpleReflect.FromExpr a) => String -> a < 1318915350 681266 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: just read that < 1318915352 322379 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the original post < 1318915352 469085 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fun "your mom is" a (var "hobag") < 1318915353 395660 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Ambiguous type variable `a' in the constraints: < 1318915353 674333 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : `SimpleReflect.FromExpr ... < 1318915360 373360 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fun "your mom is" (a::Expr) (var "hobag") < 1318915361 201883 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Ambiguous type variable `a' in the constraints: < 1318915361 590177 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : `SimpleReflect.FromExpr ... < 1318915362 933575 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sdfijsdfijwer < 1318915370 934505 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fun "your mom is" a (var "hobag") :: Expr < 1318915371 882208 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : your mom is a hobag < 1318915382 152929 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :bahahahahaha < 1318915415 121959 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t fun < 1318915416 43517 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (SimpleReflect.FromExpr a) => String -> a < 1318915417 93011 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1318915450 349641 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hobag barbie eh < 1318915456 534617 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t h < 1318915457 461801 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (SimpleReflect.FromExpr a) => a < 1318915460 437000 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun is how f g and h are defined. < 1318915467 593554 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fromExpr . var < 1318915543 340704 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION thinks it would be neat if more Haskell programs included a Blah.Reflect that exports SimpleReflect stuff. < 1318915585 374143 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as an educational tool. < 1318915640 660960 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION thinks that /me is a cool way to talk in the third person because he likes to do that sometimes. < 1318915689 873608 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION also finds it funny when people forget to convert to third person, so then some anonymous narrator is involved. I like this. < 1318915696 70590 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :fucking illeists < 1318915736 612501 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is going to see if he can now communicate entirely in third person for the remainder of the night. < 1318915765 17287 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION forgot to mention that he also wants to see if he can get away with this without annoying someone. < 1318915777 123821 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah, I messed up. < 1318915788 63339 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't mention anything, the narrator did. < 1318915792 620353 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, I mean < 1318915797 975444 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did all of the mentioning. < 1318915799 911773 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION did not. < 1318915839 435430 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1318915867 58397 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi monqy hi hi hi < 1318915869 582034 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :my program is broken monqy < 1318915871 246411 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :want to fix it??// < 1318915880 953566 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION greets monqy fondly. < 1318915901 351971 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH < 1318915903 245872 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH I AM SUCH < 1318915904 411321 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :A FUCKING IDIOT < 1318915906 310246 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OF COURSE IT DOESNT RUN < 1318915907 140749 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :BECAUSE < 1318915910 11055 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :THERES A "FOREVER" LOOP ABOVE IT < 1318915943 56224 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders why he stopped working on his RP-oriented MUD client. < 1318915956 726352 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION considers writing it in Fortran. Wow, that's a terrible idea CakeProphet. < 1318916013 325439 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I think if I did such a thing I would likely provide a custom client, because MUD clients are awful. < 1318916036 769535 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gave up on his quest for third-person narration. < 1318916082 936838 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: I wrote a program: http://sprunge.us/BMBZ < 1318916098 966400 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :program < 1318916100 326701 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa woah < 1318916101 175920 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :flood < 1318916103 905133 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :flud < 1318916125 767059 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it do things < 1318916128 925457 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: what flood < 1318916129 308731 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of imports < 1318916137 577776 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: earlier I discovered that flood is oddly spelled. < 1318916144 237292 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :considered the way it's pronounced. < 1318916146 237853 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :flod < 1318916170 442948 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: that's very few imports for haskell < 1318916172 872054 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :help battery brb < 1318916183 534310 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a lot of imports for me < 1318916188 340249 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i live in a cave) < 1318916232 745106 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello. test < 1318916232 891745 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :test test test. < 1318916232 891931 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :testing. < 1318916235 96584 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a test. < 1318916245 772528 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :awwww yeah connection wasn't interrupted. < 1318916265 228300 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import MC.Protocol < 1318916265 475167 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import MC.Protocol.IO < 1318916265 622070 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import qualified MC.Protocol.Client as C < 1318916265 622260 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import qualified MC.Protocol.Server as S < 1318916265 622387 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import MC.Utils < 1318916265 768657 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1318916267 590914 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Prelude hiding (catch) < 1318916269 789355 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Data.HashMap.Strict (HashMap) < 1318916271 676982 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import qualified Data.HashMap.Strict as HM < 1318916273 774461 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Data.ByteString (ByteString) < 1318916275 904275 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import qualified Data.ByteString as B < 1318916277 829413 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Data.Text (Text) < 1318916279 720655 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import qualified Data.Text as T < 1318916281 687001 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Control.Monad < 1318916283 665696 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Control.Exception < 1318916285 716292 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Control.Concurrent < 1318916287 692565 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Control.Concurrent.STM < 1318916289 828020 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Data.IORef < 1318916291 646505 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import System.IO < 1318916293 787576 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Network < 1318916295 748989 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Codec.Zlib < 1318916297 732445 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: :) < 1318916297 882925 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :imports < 1318916311 726216 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1318916313 67930 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember that logn list of inmports from whaichever cpmpiler that was < 1318916315 581702 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rlong one < 1318916324 368012 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it was long) < 1318916350 706462 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :too many imports are bad for the economy. < 1318916373 369799 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless the imports are goods that generate revenue domestically. < 1318916463 853330 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :economics are tricky when programming. It's like being in a circus. < 1318916465 774123 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :good night. < 1318916556 436694 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hey wait < 1318916566 107970 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :say I wanted to like... < 1318916585 699839 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :run a command in emacs, to load a bunch of files that I commonly edit as a group. < 1318916601 306918 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :does this already exist or do I need to go learn emacslisp? < 1318916807 452298 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: do you see any obvious refactorings... < 1318916810 937086 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like to make it a little prettier < 1318916917 283374 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing obvious.. id on't work much with fancy io < 1318916999 857427 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone know of a program that's basically tail -f + readline? < 1318917012 622873 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. it shows a log in realtime but provides an input line with editing that isn't overwritten by the log < 1318917024 197621 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :preferably just cat logfile | theprogram | processinput < 1318917117 323124 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Oi, you should refactor my code. (I say this because you're the only competent person in the channel.) < 1318917134 118234 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: which forever did you remove. < 1318917144 97094 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: What code? < 1318917158 885404 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: http://sprunge.us/caNc < 1318917159 707028 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That code. < 1318917248 841911 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the only thing I see is that you appear to write the equivalent of void . forkIO . forever twice. Though I doubt giving that a name really improves the code. < 1318917259 572335 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Not the equivalent. < 1318917266 920514 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`catch`/`finally`/ are inside the forever. Although, oh. < 1318917268 895514 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They shouldn't be. < 1318917273 493714 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, no. < 1318917274 477950 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're not. < 1318917277 874694 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yeah, no. < 1318917283 337797 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: The second "forever" is different. < 1318917284 910430 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: /hackenv/catch`/`finally`/: No such file or directory \ /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: /hackenv/catch`/`finally`/: cannot execute: No such file or directory < 1318917297 409405 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's void (forkIO (catch (finally ...))) < 1318917331 291410 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318917337 33017 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It doesn't look *that* horrible... < 1318917344 885911 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the point of all those voids? < 1318917355 190647 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: forkIO returns a ThreadId. < 1318917360 234849 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So? < 1318917369 467621 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm discarding it. The alternative is _ <-, but it's in tail position once there. < 1318917375 299234 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I like -Wall. :p < 1318917387 983505 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yes, it doesn't look horrible, I just want it to be nicer. < 1318917392 280607 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ignore e would be a nice function in Control.Exception < 1318917402 136680 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Presumably you're going to turn it into something more complicated later on? < 1318917408 648746 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Nope. < 1318917412 196214 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: This is literally the tool I need. < 1318917578 90296 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ignoreEOFError e = unless (isEOFError e) (throwIO e), I guess? < 1318917600 112973 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No liftA2ing that < 1318917605 204857 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Yeah, I did that (with applicative combinators). < 1318917613 16582 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bad elliott. < 1318917614 685399 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then Deewiant was like "seriously though" and I was like "yeah" and didn't actually put it in. < 1318917641 562011 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :flip (liftA2 unless) throwIO should be in Control.Exception. < 1318917668 362884 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: The problem with that is that the "where" one-liner sticks out. :p < 1318917673 66029 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :THIS TOTALLY MATTERS < 1318917678 747785 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I believe ignoreEOFError could be translated to when. < 1318917694 635729 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1318917696 356148 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1318917703 140030 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless = when . not < 1318917728 813576 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the condition relies on e so you can't do that. < 1318917734 116620 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't think this piece of code is really worth worrying about. < 1318917752 450078 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Yeah, but it distracts me from writing the other portion of this, namely a shell script. < 1318917764 291516 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ew, shell script. < 1318917781 937094 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the goal of this? < 1318917794 778846 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Backups. The reason I need this server is because of badly-designed software. < 1318917806 961194 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl (\e -> unless (f e) (throwIO e)) < 1318917807 316215 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :liftM2 unless f throwIO < 1318917810 532230 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Backups*? < 1318917812 679577 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, the shell script will literally be "echo foo | nc localhost 9999; blah; echo bar | nc localhost 9999". < 1318917817 2115 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's not so bad. < 1318917822 844300 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: I said no lift[A-Z]2! < 1318917843 521356 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even liftQ? < 1318917850 482106 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Specifically, I need to stop a piece of software from writing to the data while it's being backed up. < 1318917870 483692 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: It has a console designed to be used by human users read from stdin; I need to be able to use it while also having the script send commands. < 1318917879 254215 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So this program turns a single file into a line-multiplexed server. < 1318917903 429078 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1318917929 679746 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course this creates the problem of how _I_ interact with it, but that was why I asked if anyone knows of a tail -f + readline deal. :-) < 1318917954 684731 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yeah, rdiff-backup is doing the heavy lifting here. < 1318917956 694484 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tail -f + readline? < 1318917971 681627 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (\e -> unless (f e) (throwIO e)) < 1318917972 650596 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in scope: `throwIO' < 1318917976 687169 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, to give you a pseudo-stdin-stdout thingy? < 1318917980 103001 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t catch < 1318917981 42240 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. IO a -> (IOError -> IO a) -> IO a < 1318917982 779325 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Yeah. < 1318917991 22942 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: tail -f the log file, readline for the actual line input. < 1318918010 635933 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: (When stdin is a tty, the bad software does basic terminal stuff so that lines coming in don't overwrite the input.) < 1318918040 478256 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle (a -> Bool) -> IO () -> IO () < 1318918040 984645 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foreign.Marshal.Error throwIf :: (a -> Bool) -> (a -> String) -> IO a -> IO a < 1318918041 233415 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foreign.Marshal.Error throwIf_ :: (a -> Bool) -> (a -> String) -> IO a -> IO () < 1318918041 380051 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foreign.C.Error throwErrnoIf :: (a -> Bool) -> String -> IO a -> IO a < 1318918053 921868 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like that's a common pattern. < 1318918065 220287 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle+ < 1318918065 587318 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foreign.C.Error throwErrnoIfRetry :: (a -> Bool) -> String -> IO a -> IO a < 1318918065 821146 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foreign.C.Error throwErrnoIf_ :: (a -> Bool) -> String -> IO a -> IO () < 1318918065 967922 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foreign.C.Error throwErrnoIfRetry_ :: (a -> Bool) -> String -> IO a -> IO () < 1318918069 972244 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle+ < 1318918070 306600 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foreign.C.Error throwErrnoIfRetryMayBlock :: (a -> Bool) -> String -> IO a -> IO b -> IO a < 1318918070 580556 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foreign.C.Error throwErrnoIfRetryMayBlock_ :: (a -> Bool) -> String -> IO a -> IO b -> IO () < 1318918070 727146 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foreign.C.Error throwErrnoPathIf :: (a -> Bool) -> String -> FilePath -> IO a -> IO a < 1318918082 290868 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh. < 1318918092 782265 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :throwErrnoIfRetryMayBlock_ is a pretty bad name < 1318918101 470294 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, I remember that function. < 1318918120 182420 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was digging around in GHC's I/O implementation trying to figure out how the whole blocking thing worked. < 1318918126 901506 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's such a mess to figure out. < 1318918128 342025 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t isEOFError < 1318918129 134340 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in scope: `isEOFError' < 1318918136 508003 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@let isEOFError _ = False < 1318918137 659737 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Defined. < 1318918144 164124 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1318918144 842570 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : shachaf: (When stdin is a tty, the bad software does basic terminal stuff so that lines coming in don't overwrite the input.) <-- which bad software? < 1318918160 85520 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: rdif-backup? < 1318918160 700218 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: CB. < 1318918163 614721 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1318918168 391135 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: CB being? < 1318918169 542057 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: No, rdiff-backup is the good software I'm using to backup. < 1318918176 3618 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: CrBu. < 1318918181 737504 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like a riddle. Of time. < 1318918183 82417 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CrBu being? < 1318918190 383804 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: The bad software is the program I have to tell to stop writing to the files. < 1318918190 742884 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is it the mc server? < 1318918199 480962 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes. I dare not speak its name for the horrors it causes me. < 1318918208 588365 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why call it cb? < 1318918210 33892 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t unless < 1318918210 885791 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (m :: * -> *). (Monad m) => Bool -> m () -> m () < 1318918216 337762 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That's its name. < 1318918225 284879 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh craftbukkit-0.0.1-SNAPSHOT.jar < 1318918233 842841 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course < 1318918262 699048 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, using unless instead of the guard is probably better. < 1318918319 309452 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@whatis cb < 1318918319 574160 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know nothing about cb. < 1318918325 581813 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: craftbukkit < 1318918329 749790 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: that is what it is < 1318918338 278775 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, what? < 1318918342 508528 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: which is an minecraft server < 1318918343 38119 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That looks like a Minecraft thing. < 1318918345 647906 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: yes < 1318918349 276494 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does this have to do with backup? < 1318918353 833119 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it what it is? < 1318918355 691175 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: backing up the world? < 1318918363 756676 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION feels like he misunderstood something. < 1318918371 578522 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> unwords . reverse . words $ "is it what it is" < 1318918372 651055 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, well. It's just Minecraft, so I don't feel bad. < 1318918373 176766 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : "is it what it is" < 1318918379 403694 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: what? < 1318918387 390972 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@let onwords f = unwords . f . words < 1318918388 520623 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Defined. < 1318918395 767979 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> onwords reverse "is it what it is" < 1318918396 890036 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: wonderful < 1318918397 406293 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : "is it what it is" < 1318918408 751104 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t unwords < 1318918409 602683 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :[String] -> String < 1318918412 507263 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t words < 1318918413 400781 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :String -> [String] < 1318918416 475874 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I have to tell the piece of shit server to stop writing to the world every two seconds so I can rdiff-backup it. < 1318918433 669894 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sadly unwords . words =/= id. :-( < 1318918449 357927 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1318918452 787493 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck java in its flying ass < 1318918455 862114 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :for making fucking bytes signed < 1318918468 641187 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: you know that char in C is often signed? < 1318918471 828447 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"char" can and usually is signed in C, too. < 1318918480 574397 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I want my bytes to be unsigned < 1318918482 173722 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do I fix this < 1318918486 546489 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :unsigned byte? < 1318918486 756846 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :The difference being that C has the "unsigned" keyword < 1318918487 876138 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm getting like -12 instead of 244 < 1318918489 380385 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318918493 142573 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: char is for characters. < 1318918501 170470 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: You don't. < 1318918504 522872 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: Use int or w/e. < 1318918504 791376 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's why it's 32 bits long. < 1318918509 345376 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> w/e < 1318918510 249483 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : w / e < 1318918510 778141 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: The answer is, you use the signed types that are larger than the original unsigned type. I.e. use a short to hold an unsigned byte, use a long to hold an unsigned int. (And use a char to hold an unsigned short.) Yeah, this kinda sucks because now you're using twice as much memory, but there really is no other solution. (Also bear in mind, access to longs is not guaranteed to be atomic - although if you're using < 1318918517 781046 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://darksleep.com/player/JavaAndUnsignedTypes.html < 1318918528 483042 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm using the method read(byte[] b, int off, int len) though < 1318918531 658375 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no read for int[] < 1318918532 880178 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :or w/e < 1318918550 661656 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, so what if you want an unsigned long long or such in java? < 1318918561 557612 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: well it would be short for unsigned byte. < 1318918564 849699 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, I see what to do < 1318918567 389855 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :0x000000FF & (int)buf[index] < 1318918569 449952 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :this fucking shit everywhere < 1318918573 791826 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I'll make a method to do it for me < 1318918588 478590 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: If you delete cwd and then ^C your program, it complains. < 1318918593 897406 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just sayin'. < 1318918596 330681 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: abstraction????? Have you gone mad!?!?!?!? < 1318918598 510273 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: What. < 1318918608 615697 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: Or 0xFF. < 1318918612 499145 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, maybe that was runghc? < 1318918645 662261 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Sounds likei t to me. < 1318918648 552617 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Were you stress-testing that? < 1318918651 542192 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/i t/ it/ < 1318918657 150362 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep, runghc. < 1318918661 131937 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Nah, just habit. < 1318918763 335147 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION regularly deletes directories while there are still processes running in them. < 1318918769 414529 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also regularly exit bash with kill -9 $$ < 1318918774 174393 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1318918775 140545 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1318918785 771291 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: that takes MORE typing than just plain exit < 1318918800 342760 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to be joking < 1318918816 785888 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :excellent. works like a charm < 1318918821 551850 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :an ugly charm but who's keeping score < 1318918830 104537 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I shut down my computer with an axe. < 1318918931 401726 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm not. < 1318918938 440998 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It doesn't save command line history. < 1318918947 997900 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu learns the joys of abstraction. < 1318918951 51495 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: that can be disabled with set anyway < 1318918960 139146 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: After the fact? < 1318918963 183760 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe shopt < 1318918967 961273 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want *some* things to be saved in history. < 1318918970 520392 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: after starting the shell yes < 1318918982 870289 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't always know when I start a shell whether the commands I'm about to type are going to be something I want to save. < 1318918989 891416 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: hello < 1318918997 197623 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1318919082 719102 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1318920534 231153 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :mh < 1318920873 139599 :Zuu!~zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1318921005 374144 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :You do see quite a lot of &0x{ff,ffff} in Java thanks to the "only signed types" thing. < 1318921123 675002 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :The way they call the 8 bits wide type "byte" also makes it sound like it should be unsigned. Not that I have a better name for it. < 1318921165 4535 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :signed octet < 1318921211 221671 :ive!~nn@189.179.247.113 QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1318921211 691092 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Oi, do you know something which is like rlwrap, except it also handles output not overwriting input, and prints a prompt? < 1318921230 207700 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically I want to "tail -f server.log | magicprog | nc localhost 9999", where port 9999 is a server that writes to the console. < 1318921333 821045 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :See, fizzie knows. < 1318921366 910620 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"sictet", yes, that's what they should've called it. < 1318921368 534077 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not entirely sure what you want magicproc to do there. < 1318921393 741352 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Present readline prompt; and show its input but not overriding its input. < 1318921394 902917 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Err. That is to say. < 1318921404 509864 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Basically I want something that shows tail -f's output while letting me input things. < 1318921418 338843 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Without new data on tail -f overwriting my input line, like netcat-IRCing does. < 1318921421 319913 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Preferably line-edited. < 1318921426 584098 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has to exist, come on. < 1318921757 551240 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :But being in the pipeline like that, magicproc has no access to the controlling terminal. Or, well, I guess it could open it explicitly. Anyway, I don't think I've heard of such a thing. < 1318921914 501703 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about the output from "nc localhost 9999"? < 1318922056 141659 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, it's fine if it takes some parameters instead, of course. < 1318922060 910495 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: And that can just be discarded. < 1318922076 785913 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's this "srw is used to provide a simple line editing interface to a program. The output of the program does not interupt the input to srw, and the input to srw is not echoed." < 1318922082 181225 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I don't know if I'm just missing something. < 1318922109 327443 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's, you know, sucklessware, so it isn't using readline or anything simple like that. < 1318922126 16153 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm tempted to just write my own thing; it's just cat + readline. < 1318922132 185259 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But there must be _something_. < 1318922156 240392 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :where there's a way, perl can do it. < 1318922208 560800 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Do it then < 1318922217 20642 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah < 1318922239 582875 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I assume there are specific requirements that I'm not aware of, otherwise youd just use.... cat + readline < 1318922276 471111 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Hm. What if you rlwrapped "bash -c 'nc localhost 9999 >/dev/null | tail -f server.log'"? The input into that "program" would go to the nc, and the "program"'s output would be tail -f's output, and rlwrap (or srw, or something) would take care of providing line editing for the input and handling output such that it doesn't clobber the prompt. < 1318922317 697134 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That sounds plausible. I suppose it won't take care of, e.g. the completed line being printed out? < 1318922319 667323 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like REPLs. < 1318922340 911700 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hrm, probably not, unless your rlwrap-like tool has an "echo the command" flag. < 1318922364 660484 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also don't think rlwrap can print a prompt, but... it's a decent idea. < 1318922373 496267 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@katia:~/Code/line-server$ rlwrap "bash -c 'cat >foo | cat /dev/urandom'"rlwrap: Cannot execute bash -c 'cat >foo | cat /dev/urandom': No such file or directory < 1318922378 195908 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sigh. < 1318922422 392222 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric : -S, --substitute-prompt < 1318922422 577136 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric : Substitute the specified prompt for command's own prompt. < 1318922422 577339 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric : Mainly useful when command doesn't have a prompt. < 1318922431 49490 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1318922434 594455 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think you just don't use the qutoes? < 1318922439 813001 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Yeah. < 1318922472 59389 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems to echo the input, too. < 1318922496 889256 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least rlwrap bash -c 'cat >tmp.out | while true; do echo yay; sleep 1; done' seems to behave sensibly, discounting the lack of prompt, for which -S might help. < 1318922502 788205 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does "tail -f" really do that sleep-every-few-seconds thing nowadays? < 1318922548 481012 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: -S seems to have annoying side-effects: like it prints a > before every "yay" line. < 1318922558 833552 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since rlwrap kind of assumes that the thing is prompt-based. < 1318922605 995607 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Why would tail -f do that? < 1318922627 599658 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: -s, --sleep-interval=N < 1318922627 762536 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : with -f, sleep for approximately N seconds (default 1.0) between < 1318922628 13946 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : iterations < 1318922655 991147 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1318923070 922335 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah, how do I tell rlwrap that the prompt is just whenever I press enter? < 1318923573 938565 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :write it a letter < 1318923588 830546 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :begin with... Dear rlwrap: ... < 1318923599 340911 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you use the : because you mean business. < 1318923942 281504 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote my hide-data-on-fat16-and-retrieve-it program \o/ < 1318923942 733757 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :                                                        | < 1318923942 734050 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :                                                       /< < 1318923946 72091 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1318924082 887234 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db4ef42.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318924085 339106 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: pls tell me it wasn't actually in java < 1318924096 757796 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah I wrote it in java < 1318924099 192340 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :U mad? < 1318924122 788223 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :f7u12? < 1318924178 603466 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no not a channel I'll never care about ever :'( < 1318924186 62096 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :your omnipotence, please, have mercy < 1318924192 609742 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Excuse me -minecraft is where all the cool kids hang out. < 1318924195 52433 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :P.S. what should I have written it in < 1318924208 869842 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anything but Java. Or Perl. < 1318924236 13970 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm basically the ultimate programming scrub < 1318924241 73850 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote it in the BlueJ IDE < 1318924266 917351 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I cause you to stop existing somehow < 1318924309 380158 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db4ef42.pool.mediaWays.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1318924316 104304 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db4ef42.pool.mediaWays.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :e=mc² < 1318924319 72680 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not you. < 1318924320 434431 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu. < 1318924323 434449 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also wrong. < 1318924323 762120 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db4ef42.pool.mediaWays.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know < 1318924325 562855 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db4ef42.pool.mediaWays.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1318924336 227592 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :look on the bright side < 1318924338 384669 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not itidus12 < 1318924339 10937 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :E = blah blah pc blah. < 1318924347 302328 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: Yes, that is one way in which you are distinctly inferior. < 1318924352 174869 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1318924352 421785 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also it's itidus20. < 1318924355 780364 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh oops < 1318924372 665245 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: The #esoteric cable has strongly agreed on the policy of itidus20 supremacy. < 1318924386 539439 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :supremacy to everyone? < 1318924387 496509 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just me < 1318924413 243615 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everyone. Except fungot. < 1318924413 394604 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: to. why, this is for you guys are a lot < 1318925067 134594 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Hmm, what if the "nc" part was extended so that it printed a recognisable prompt after each input? < 1318925589 232832 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"At first I thought your program made a fractal image derived from the bootsector for easy human categorization. I get paranoid somebody's gonna call my operating system a virus, the bastards! http://www.losethos.com" < 1318925595 562932 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :LoseThos guy is still most funny guy. < 1318925665 506971 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Must anticipate what 14Mhz clock will be when message arrives at application. Microsoft will laugh at you. (There is lots of stuff going on in many tasks in windows all the time and time slices are handed out to tasks and anticipating what a 14MHz clock will be when a time slice is handed to an application and it executes a certain way into the application code with the message getting dispatched... Microsoft would laugh at you. In wet-wired log < 1318925665 668640 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ic, no less! Now, what were you saying to God and I? Lemme get some popcorn.)" < 1318926066 845530 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318926132 12368 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is Ireland a thing that exists. < 1318926515 888724 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318926716 907360 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1318926844 939020 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1318926859 914294 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318926966 61355 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I made a complicated bash thing that prints a new "> " prompt after each line, but it didn't help. The prompt output is mixed with the "tail -f" output, and rlwrap will not "forward" a prompt ever, so when (as seen by rlwrap) the program outputs "> " and then "yay\n", it will just show "> yay" on the screen and remove the prompt, presumably under the assumption that the prompt is no longer relevant since the program outputted something new. < 1318927027 525011 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Heh. < 1318927202 904071 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: So I guess I should just write my own little ditty? < 1318927211 633202 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I suppose I'll have to do the same hacks we do in mcmap for decent prompt handling. < 1318927300 640720 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mmmmaybe. Perhaps quite not that many hacks since all your input comes from file descriptors, not from other threads of the program, so you don't need that extra pipe. < 1318927391 704514 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1318927394 886240 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I do think you need to use the "callback" interface to readline if you want to put some new output there while the input line editing is being done, since otherwise readline will block until the user is finished. < 1318927395 945951 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, someone broke sensors-detect code for 2.6.x kernel identification when they fixed it for 3.x kernels < 1318927407 142626 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ sensors-detect < 1318927407 289330 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argument ".35.4-L1" isn't numeric in numeric ge (>=) at /usr/sbin/sensors-detect line 2489. < 1318927407 335840 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kernel version is unsupported (too old, >= 2.6.5 needed) < 1318927413 21427 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ uname -a < 1318927413 168013 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux phoenix 2.6.35.4-L1 #1 Fri Aug 27 17:25:41 CEST 2010 i686 Pentium III (Coppermine) GenuineIntel GNU/Linux < 1318927478 908647 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Upgrade yer kernel. < 1318927489 48797 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm doing that atm < 1318927495 44390 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway yeah, /var/abs/extra/lm_sensors/linux_3.0.patch breaks it < 1318927544 94127 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I haven't booted this system since like late spring < 1318927550 474953 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is why it has such an old kernel < 1318927564 297359 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Having one computer simplifies your life dramatically, it's great. < 1318927577 959543 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also not caring about your data I guess is the other component of that. < 1318927603 684310 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well this computer has an IBM Deskstar iirc. So caring about data is clearly out of the question ANYWAY < 1318927613 460226 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1318927643 335609 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Model Family: IBM Deskstar 60GXP < 1318927644 110188 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1318927662 645425 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :also known as IBM Deathstar < 1318927666 846383 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they suck so badly < 1318927682 819107 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is on 20 GB anyway < 1318927727 457066 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: anyway, I use this computer when I need old hardware. Like a physical serial port. < 1318927754 733002 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :serial port by USB devices sucks generally. Never got GPIO to work properly for them < 1318927803 694646 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who was it that released 3.0.0 renumbered back to 2.6.40 to avoid breakage? Ubuntu or someone else? < 1318927811 737777 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: red hat iirc < 1318927821 279338 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :or fedora maybe < 1318927823 385958 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of the two < 1318927843 636340 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1318927848 690067 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I'm using Linux 2.6.40 (Fedora 15's version of 3.0) and --" apparently so. < 1318927873 996876 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :shown when upgrading udev: < 1318927875 593428 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :"rtc is no longer in the audio group and fb devices are no longer in the video group, as permissions and ownership of fb devices are controlled by X." < 1318927886 903682 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is strange < 1318927895 465397 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :it only motivates the latter change, not the former one < 1318927915 294710 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I like how Fedora are the ones who always break everything but they couldn't be arsed this time. < 1318927925 99372 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ubuntu ships with the properly-numbered kernel. < 1318927927 794505 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that I use audio, fb or X on that computer... It is headless and lacks sound chipsets completely < 1318927946 272185 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose I actually have two computers that I care about, one of them just isn't in this room. < 1318927949 734698 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Possibly their distribution-making scripts were the ones that broke on 3.x. :p < 1318927951 586932 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I guess that will become three sometime. < 1318927959 521109 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Nah, it was some driver or something. < 1318927963 804427 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I have 4 running atm < 1318927969 567605 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use two regularly < 1318927971 45069 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Including remote servers? < 1318927976 451989 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, as in this room < 1318927987 756069 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Include servers. < 1318927998 659324 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well add a VPS that I co-own with a good friend then. < 1318928007 181014 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(50/50 split of the cost) < 1318928011 981467 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Your life is too complicated. < 1318928033 61368 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a VPS so it counts as 0.5 computers; co-owning splits that to 0.25. < 1318928041 312747 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1318928048 702735 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: If anything VPSes count as multiple computers, because they're more of a pain than local computers. < 1318928063 591002 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Network lag, hard to debug problems when they go dead, probably harder to reinstall the OS, etc. < 1318928065 47444 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: anyway I normally just use my desktop and my laptop. I do have that old Dell P3 that I'm upgrading atm, and an old dell laptop. And a first gen ibook with a dead battery < 1318928073 217329 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Softwaristically, maybe; hardwaristically at least it's someone else's problem. < 1318928100 62036 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: never had that VPS go dead. Good hosting. Xen too. < 1318928114 569783 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Then you haven't been running interesting enough things. :-) < 1318928129 258990 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I wouldn't count things like the iBook; there are certainly other computers in this house, I just never think about them. < 1318928131 412809 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well maybe not. IRC server. Website. That is about it iirc. < 1318928138 919741 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let alone use them. < 1318928146 519432 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well yeah there are probably "computers" in stuff like the freezer. < 1318928165 681498 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are computers in my basement, and I never use them. :( *sad* < 1318928170 44808 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318928184 759947 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: anyway I do turn on the ibook maybe once a year or so when I get nostalgic < 1318928192 46181 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :play some Avernum. < 1318928198 497296 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :then turn it off and store it away again < 1318928210 694884 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, EV Override. That was a fun game too. < 1318928216 871272 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a Sun SparcStation 5, that SGI Indy, and the Sun 4*3.5" external SCSI HD box which makes an incredible amount of noise. < 1318928244 267391 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's like two fans in it, and the disks aren't quiet either. < 1318928250 272157 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318928259 775586 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anybody interested in the Helsinki esolang evening school assignments? http://tinyurl.com/5stnu5n < 1318928289 360676 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm atehwa is from .fi? < 1318928297 285908 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes indeed. < 1318928297 432541 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many of you guys *are* there? < 1318928304 84348 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in this channel I mean) < 1318928314 551102 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, there were ~20 participants in the evening school :) < 1318928321 98786 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant in this channel. < 1318928325 974606 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :atehwa: I think he means Finns. < 1318928328 996516 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1318928334 830871 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :there might be more on the channel, too, as I recommended the channel to the participants < 1318928344 370168 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: but now, about 5 from .fi < 1318928347 397760 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the channel < 1318928349 264060 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I wonder if we scared any of those guys off. Actually none of them came, I think. < 1318928364 362752 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just sent them the recommendation < 1318928368 147665 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know fizzie, Deewiant, oklopol and now atehwa are from Finland. < 1318928380 495017 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ineiros too. < 1318928383 177136 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah < 1318928384 736818 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot him < 1318928393 411572 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zwaarddijk too. < 1318928396 83203 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And mtve. < 1318928398 185819 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I think?) < 1318928409 211271 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think mtve is Finnish, but I'm not sure < 1318928419 610240 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just assumed, what with fizzie. :p < 1318928436 400550 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :* [aloril] (~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe7ef900-153.dhcp.inet.fi): Aloril < 1318928438 542549 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's another one. < 1318928440 490469 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: mtve is from US or is using a bouncer or such in US < 1318928442 931660 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and fungot counts too. < 1318928443 78360 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: or is it just me, or i: yet, you rogue! vernon. hark ye: not so much. sorry, this is it! all about macros, a wonderful!' i am sorry, in particular candidate countries. if the transatlantic relationship, but the parliament has possessed him, yet he talkes well, it's open source < 1318928445 223113 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So there's like eight of 'em. < 1318928490 125233 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a few Swedes too. Maybe we Scandinavians are driven insane by the dark winters? Thus resulting in a lot of us turning to esolangs? < 1318928490 300119 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :And where was FireFly from? Somewhere in Scandinavia at least, I think. < 1318928492 579490 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just a theory < 1318928496 357229 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: he is from Sweden < 1318928501 301970 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so am I, and olsner < 1318928505 34536 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and BeholdMyGlory iirc < 1318928519 790729 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Hokay. The realname did sound Swedish, but there's quite a lot of those in .fi too. < 1318928524 299261 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's really lots of geeks in Finland, compared to the number of people < 1318928533 855093 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ [BeholdMyGlory] (~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory): Arvid <-- hm. Really? < 1318928544 76737 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not convinced Finland is actually a country, as opposed to, like... I don't know. < 1318928546 706696 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe the demoscene made it up? < 1318928558 599251 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Confirm/deny? < 1318928562 969781 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know. I never actually met someone with the same first name as me. It isn't /that/ uncommon. < 1318928568 503178 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, it had been so already before the schene. < 1318928573 543138 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :*scene < 1318928575 16775 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I never run into someone else with my name. < 1318928580 263831 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :atehwa: Long-running myth. < 1318928605 870565 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of sci-fi, fantasy, math, electronics geeks < 1318928606 504036 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Speaking of which, ALTparty 2011 next weekend, best get moving if you need to swim across any oceans or so on. < 1318928612 386691 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :and language geeks, too. < 1318928613 407835 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, they fooled ICANN pretty well then. < 1318928624 745259 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone know how to convince ls it's talking to a tty, so it'll columnate etc.? < 1318928651 592673 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you could create a tty? Like for example xterm does? < 1318928656 467371 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: In "Helsingrad", apparently. < 1318928672 138691 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds russian ? < 1318928710 354083 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's Helsinki; it's just that this year's theme is "RED MACHINE". < 1318928720 971097 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318928753 594051 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also it's reasonably likely that this year is the last year, so try not to miss it. < 1318928759 869701 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if my company will be present @AltParty this year... < 1318928767 63391 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: oh? < 1318928788 264599 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: what is ALTparty about btw? < 1318928800 207285 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :two years ago, we had some kind of supercomputer there that somebody used to calculate frames for their raytraced animation :) < 1318928811 103183 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "Alternative Party is a festival of digital culture attended by coders, musicians, designers, hackers, and other digital enthusiasts. In Alternative Party, you can enjoy digital culture in various forms, catch a glimpse of the technology of the future, and experience nostalgic trips with vintage hardware." < 1318928816 682309 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: demo scene, and general geekiness < 1318928828 847255 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → Ireland < 1318928832 794421 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1318928839 149888 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318928843 793491 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :atehwa: Was this the "desktop" Cray CX1 thing? < 1318928868 888294 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know the details, I just heard about it after the fact < 1318928899 636040 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone had one there, though presumably Cray themselves were involved; there was a competition to do stuff with it, with not very many entries. < 1318928921 711008 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like modern Crays at all. < 1318928923 104352 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're so normal. < 1318928949 798248 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: probably because it is cheaper to do it that way < 1318928960 204907 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No it is because they are bad people. < 1318928960 510920 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doesn't really make sense to build a supercomputer which has so different architecture that you can't test your programs anywhere else < 1318928974 101001 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1318928979 18448 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Anyway, they're having some financial difficulties this year already, and in the agenda for the organization's yearly meeting that I got for some reason (I don't think I'm a member or anything...) they're suggesting that they won't organize the party any more "in the current form". < 1318928989 415766 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :atehwa: Nooo, it's about the _spirit_. < 1318928993 374378 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :char should be some stupidly large number of bits. < 1318928998 410286 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I understood as much :) < 1318929003 972513 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that is called a DSP < 1318929004 738407 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And preferably PDP-endian just for laughs. < 1318929011 308794 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :36, preferably. < 1318929018 313912 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think cray ever used PDP-endian? < 1318929019 124270 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And... say... how about floats are IEEE format, but with the components reversed? < 1318929035 835195 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, and maybe we could have a segmentation model where memory addresses are divided into /three/ components. < 1318929043 648436 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But one of the components is two bits less than the rest, and is multiplied by ten. < 1318929053 902926 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also it uses balanced decimal and is a sheep. < 1318929064 319891 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: go make this into an esolang < 1318929067 971683 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :supercomputing sheep. < 1318929073 71957 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a (well, two) 40-bit accumulator in the TI TMS320C54x, but "otherwise" it's a boring 16-bit-words machine. < 1318929076 991350 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :then implement it with VHDL or Verilog < 1318929107 256380 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the TI C compiler even implements CHAR_BIT==8 on it. < 1318929108 803909 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: VHDL can do sheep nowadays? < 1318929109 909840 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fancy. < 1318929155 88206 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah, use IEEE.std_sheep.all; < 1318929194 72689 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Assume a spherical sheep. < 1318929197 290883 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: AKA "use wales;". < 1318929197 644713 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you could even make it distributed. (the technical term for this is "sheep farm") < 1318929228 227480 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Do Welsh jokes even work on a Scandinavian audience.) < 1318929235 490302 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Are you even aware of the existence of Wales? We barely are ourselves.) < 1318929246 963572 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm aware of what a Welsh joke is if that is what you mean < 1318929276 702001 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they don't exist here if that is what you mean < 1318929319 518272 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: anyway "use wales;" looks wrong in VHDL. Pretty sure you want use "Wales.all;" then < 1318929344 251665 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :use whales < 1318929372 773127 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: all is a keyword in that context I /think/. It is usually highlighted as one anyway. < 1318929646 803874 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :insert sheep < 1318929690 498024 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, I should be sleeping as of 5 hours ago < 1318929928 400049 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You Arch users are lucky: GNU inetutils is now your default source of telnet, ftp, ping, hostname, etc.; maintained by the _wonderful_ ams. < 1318929935 994750 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :PROGRESS < 1318929953 712346 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh? I have no idea who that is < 1318929966 146274 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's come up a few times in here. < 1318929971 665759 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's... "pleasant". < 1318929983 439830 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so not at all then < 1318930039 523309 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: My first interaction with him, he /ignore'd me because he asked a question about free()'s semantics; I first looked it up in POSIX for him; he said that wasn't C; then politely in the post-C99 draft; he said that wasn't C99; I said they wouldn't change the semantics of something as fundamental as free(NULL) in minor corrective drafts; he called me a troll and /ignored me. < 1318930060 648042 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1318930077 290463 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then an hour or so later he started bugging people trying to talk about the distro it was a channel for (NixOS) for having non-free software in the repositories (as build scripts). < 1318930085 369826 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :His claimed benefit for removing this would be that it could be hosted on gnu.org FTP. < 1318930108 168606 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh < 1318930122 928407 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's basically rms but less rational and more abrasive. < 1318930157 151857 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1318930174 459841 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if he should switch to NILFS. < 1318930193 195343 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1318930196 185723 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :The filesystem that can only store empty lists. (Okay, not really.) < 1318930215 648144 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It has all that nice snapshotting and versioning stuff. < 1318930220 218514 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus online resizing?? < 1318930227 123269 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone know how stable it is. :p < 1318930230 903936 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well ext4 has online resizing < 1318930242 888611 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: And instantaneous snapshotting? < 1318930243 35604 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so does jfs and xfs iirc < 1318930249 434579 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1318930251 964174 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I considered it too, for the snapshots. Never got around doing it. < 1318930261 203533 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :JFS is my go-to file system. < 1318930270 131343 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't really support online resizing though; it can't shrink. < 1318930275 541574 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah < 1318930283 902560 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think ext4 can shrink either < 1318930302 488699 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tend to default to ext4 when I have no specific reason for another file system < 1318930319 803050 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ext4 is obsolete by design, XFS is unreliable, JFS is pretty good but I don't know how well-maintained it is and the lack of shrinking is kinda suboptimal. < 1318930334 756350 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :btrfs is Oracle. < 1318930339 79838 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ext4 is stable and reliable though < 1318930353 423644 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :obsolete by design yes, but stable and reliable < 1318930355 903734 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, and it features long fsck times as its primary user-visible feature. < 1318930363 901380 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1318930372 622275 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: But really, I'm not going to commit to something that is meant to be replaced by an unacceptable system (btrfs) within a few years. < 1318930378 408762 :sadhu!kaus@117.201.48.80 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318930380 420783 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's just setting yourself up for trouble. < 1318930384 552662 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1318930411 644351 :sadhu!kaus@117.201.48.80 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there any tool out there whic convers strings to bf code which prints the string? < 1318930418 492262 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :NILFS does look neat, and I guess they're storing lots of data on it from the source of it and the design features? < 1318930421 793567 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I dunno how stable it is. < 1318930424 589632 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadhu: Yes. Tons. < 1318930431 308705 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen sup < 1318930432 390619 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadhu: no. !bf_txtgen doesn't do that at all < 1318930443 904850 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it is slow < 1318930445 392000 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :!help < 1318930448 863618 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​help: General commands: !help, !info, !bf_txtgen. See also !help languages, !help userinterps. You can get help on some commands by typing !help . < 1318930452 300144 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :egobot in general is < 1318930458 717645 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen test < 1318930459 559478 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: bf_txtgen is a very slow algorithm. < 1318930463 950106 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​61 +++++++++++++[>+++++++++>++++++++>+><<<<-]>-.>---.<-.+.>>---. [35] < 1318930465 857840 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not this slow usually < 1318930495 249360 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Usually we run it on known strings :-) < 1318930501 737165 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadhu: How's asm->bf going? < 1318930508 8718 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it doesn't cache afaik? < 1318930512 885933 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen test < 1318930514 713017 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​61 +++++++++++++[>++++++++>+++++++++>+><<<<-]>>-.<---.>-.+.>---. [117] < 1318930515 975256 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Helsinki Hacklab presents the Hacklab Reactor Simulator, an interactive Soviet nuclear plant experience. Feel the power of an explosing nuclear powerplant! We are also happy to tell you more about Helsinki Hacklab, the local hackerspace in Helsinki." The best thing or the best thing? < 1318930517 832484 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen sup < 1318930520 559071 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​50 +++++++++[>+++++++++++++>+>><<<<-]>--.++.-----.>+. [511] < 1318930523 73272 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It does; and improves on previous results. < 1318930527 793191 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hm < 1318930530 277251 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen asbdjashd < 1318930531 384233 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen Hello, world! < 1318930532 514318 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​92 ++++++++++++[>++++++++>++++++++++>++++++++>+<<<<-]>+.>-----.>++.++.++++++.<<.>.>--.----.>--. [234] < 1318930533 611014 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​139 +++++++++[>++++++++>+++++>+++>+<<<<-]>.+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.+++++++..+++.>-.>+++++.<<++++++++.--------.+++.------.--------.>>+.>+. [309] < 1318930538 459669 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen asbdjashd < 1318930540 40331 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​93 ++++++++++++[>++++++++>++++++++++>+++++++++>+<<<<-]>+.>-----.<+.++.>>--.<<---.>.>--.----.>--. [328] < 1318930542 300263 :sadhu!kaus@117.201.48.80 PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen hakuna matata < 1318930544 259753 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​126 +++++++++++++[>+++++++++>+++++++>++++++++>++<<<<-]>>>.<++++++.>+++.<<.>>+++.<.>>++++++.<-.<.<-.>.<.>.>>----------------------. [141] < 1318930545 492263 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen Hello, world! < 1318930545 639036 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen Hello, world! < 1318930545 640385 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen Hello, world! < 1318930548 130504 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen Hello, world! < 1318930548 277206 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen Hello, world! < 1318930549 232159 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​139 +++++++++[>++++++++>++++>+++++>+<<<<-]>.+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.+++++++..+++.>>-.<----.<++++++++.--------.+++.------.--------.>+.>>+. [236] < 1318930549 506577 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​125 +++++++++[>++++++++>+++++++++++>+++++>+<<<<-]>.>++.+++++++..+++.>-.------------.<++++++++.--------.+++.------.--------.>+.>+. [316] < 1318930549 837076 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​126 ++++++++++[>+++++++>++++++++++>++++>+<<<<-]>++.>+.+++++++..+++.>++++.------------.<++++++++.--------.+++.------.--------.>+.>. [984] < 1318930551 736794 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​131 +++++++++++++++[>+++++>+++++++>+++>+<<<<-]>---.>----.+++++++..+++.>-.------------.<++++++++.--------.+++.------.--------.>+.>-----. [753] < 1318930551 922296 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​127 +++++++++++[>++++++>+++++++++>++++>+<<<<-]>++++++.>++.+++++++..+++.>.------------.<++++++++.--------.+++.------.--------.>+.>-. [545] < 1318930553 910731 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it is a genetic algorithm < 1318930555 360696 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1318930557 143773 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Great, now they're all going to intermingle. :p < 1318930625 352635 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah, why doesn't this GHC binary work on pyralspite. < 1318930670 413784 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: in what way does it fail? < 1318930713 896321 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It literally hangs on startup. < 1318930714 558499 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, before option parsing. < 1318930761 636902 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: try strace? < 1318930776 463843 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fine, more programs on the lean mean server. :p < 1318930788 580758 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: strace is like a few kb large < 1318930810 801952 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :228K says du -h < 1318930850 698930 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Realtime/signal bullshit. < 1318930853 999687 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :VTALARMs all over the place. < 1318930858 946279 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll be GHC's event manager. < 1318930863 479026 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :God knows. < 1318930890 571388 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it doesn't hang wrt syscalls anywhere? < 1318930900 446316 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it just does much the same stuff forever. < 1318930904 239612 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1318930908 506407 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :could hang in a loop then < 1318930927 279431 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, it's GHC's event manager. < 1318930929 584486 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :rt_sigprocmask(SIG_BLOCK, [INT], [], 8) = 0 < 1318930930 79152 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :getrusage(RUSAGE_SELF, {ru_utime={23, 309456}, ru_stime={0, 836052}, ...}) = 0 < 1318930930 245730 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :gettimeofday({1318930854, 544963}, NULL) = 0 < 1318930930 392402 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :getrusage(RUSAGE_SELF, {ru_utime={23, 309456}, ru_stime={0, 836052}, ...}) = 0 < 1318930930 392494 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :rt_sigprocmask(SIG_SETMASK, [], NULL, 8) = 0 < 1318930930 392549 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :--- SIGVTALRM (Virtual timer expired) @ 0 (0) --- < 1318930932 49887 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :rt_sigreturn(0x1a) = 48 < 1318930934 102288 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :rt_sigprocmask(SIG_BLOCK, [INT], [], 8) = 0 < 1318930936 377773 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :getrusage(RUSAGE_SELF, {ru_utime={23, 321457}, ru_stime={0, 836052}, ...}) = 0 < 1318930938 183923 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :gettimeofday({1318930854, 559230}, NULL) = 0 < 1318930940 185509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :getrusage(RUSAGE_SELF, {ru_utime={23, 321457}, ru_stime={0, 836052}, ...}) = 0 < 1318930942 63343 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :rt_sigprocmask(SIG_SETMASK, [], NULL, 8) = 0 < 1318930943 875886 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :rt_sigprocmask(SIG_BLOCK, [INT], [], 8) = 0 < 1318930946 195666 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :getrusage(RUSAGE_SELF, {ru_utime={23, 333458}, ru_stime={0, 836052}, ...}) = 0 < 1318930948 167119 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :gettimeofday({1318930854, 572662}, NULL) = 0 < 1318930949 484681 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :getrusage(RUSAGE_SELF, {ru_utime={23, 333458}, ru_stime={0, 836052}, ...}) = 0 < 1318930951 485751 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc. < 1318930953 490411 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus a lot of mmapping. < 1318930955 316921 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1318930963 955224 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: maybe another thread hung? < 1318930985 432485 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It /doesn't/ /even/ /get/ /to/ /the/ /first/ /statement/. It's hanging in startup. < 1318930990 35630 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably syscall bullshit since this is oldstable. < 1318930996 230414 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah could be < 1318931054 471701 :sadhu!kaus@117.201.48.80 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have an idea to do it without using GP..with some optimizations < 1318931082 674171 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are lots that don't do GP. < 1318931086 976398 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most of them beat bf_txtgen. < 1318931124 739785 :sadhu!kaus@117.201.48.80 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... < 1318931449 36566 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: try compiling it with an older ghc? < 1318931460 317406 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: btw what is the haskell program you are trying to execute? < 1318931510 45853 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (a) The one in oldstable doesn't even have a simple combinator I used, and it won't even have the event manager that will make this an efficient program anyway, so I'm disinclined to. (b) One I tailor-wrote for the job. < 1318931531 927842 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the job of mc console handling? < 1318931537 659466 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1318931541 624038 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's only twenty-five lines. < 1318931547 901050 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: pastebin it < 1318931552 998464 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would like to see it < 1318931560 994670 :sadhu!kaus@117.201.48.80 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1318931566 5505 :kaus!kaus@117.201.57.89 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318931585 734791 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://sprunge.us/aEOV < 1318931610 245335 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1318931626 95302 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: why does it use network? < 1318931640 750060 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The part where it's a network server? < 1318931649 170936 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It listens on a port and merges all lines received into stdout (the console FIFO). < 1318931655 380749 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318931672 871230 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I was wondering why it would use network for it, as opposed to some in-fifos or whatever < 1318931696 534522 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That's just as long a program, and what's the point? FIFOs are strictly more limited: There's a fixed number of them defined at runtime. < 1318931709 147203 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm true < 1318931722 568010 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :A server is more flexible and >~blah/foo vs. | nc localhost 9999 is not much difference. < 1318931741 842697 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus someone else can't just write data to a pipe, vs. a FIFO which they could. Not that that would happen, but still. < 1318931747 734017 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i.e., while another program is doing so) < 1318931758 540666 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't see it listening only on localhost anywhere < 1318931761 826856 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I missed something < 1318931767 922373 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, it doesn't. Maybe I should fix that. :p < 1318931773 509723 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Does it handle multiple concurrent connections? < 1318931775 243663 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But... maybe it could be a SPECIAL SURPRISE??? < 1318931780 688673 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, of course, that's the whole point. < 1318931808 588155 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: and it orders them? And what about server output? You need to parse that anyway to know when save-all finished < 1318931828 772441 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a) Yes. (b) The server outputs to server.log anyway; and no you don't, you just sleep for a decent amount of time. < 1318931846 413790 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if you did want to read it, it wouldn't be the proper job of this program. < 1318931854 142938 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1318931975 628814 :kaus!kaus@117.201.57.89 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1318931999 41602 :kaus!~kaus@117.201.57.89 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318932094 155313 :kaus_!kaus@117.201.57.89 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318932283 58377 :kaus!~kaus@117.201.57.89 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1318932369 734503 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "save-off" -> "save-all" DoesWIM, right? < 1318932373 734443 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It does.) < 1318932681 850634 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: WIM? < 1318932687 960155 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :WIM. < 1318932692 78340 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning? < 1318932707 844684 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I < 1318932710 364915 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318932730 221014 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I forgot if save-all should come before or after save-off < 1318932738 234153 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, save-off just disables automatic saving. < 1318932746 16766 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it seems like it should be fine to me. < 1318932760 142397 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: remember save-on when you are done < 1318932763 660494 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1318932813 472374 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really wish this program just worked. < 1318932859 452601 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: upgrade from old-stable? < 1318932871 988188 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt stable will be much better. < 1318932873 758146 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: anyway wouldn't ghc just use the libc? < 1318932878 128603 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it might get me a newer kernel, I suppose. < 1318932886 576787 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :which does the actual system calls < 1318932897 605307 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No shit? < 1318932897 979170 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume you didn't link it statically? < 1318932916 242330 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tried both. < 1318932918 284126 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't work either way. < 1318932918 815778 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1318933132 566015 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: do something like a simple hello world haskell program compiled on your system and uploaded to the server work? < 1318933135 501006 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :does* < 1318933204 748293 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It won't, since it, as I have said about ten times now, is not even getting to the first statement, which is a trivial pattern match on an IO action that basically just dereferences a pointer. < 1318933233 252925 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: indeed, but depending on what modules you use, different init code could be generated as far as I know < 1318934447 513311 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey QUIT :Quit: The Other Game < 1318934488 137844 :kaus_!kaus@117.201.57.89 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1318935996 274455 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Sigh, this upgrade is making breaky-sounding noises < 1318936005 100569 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh? < 1318936013 136892 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :GRUB doesn't seem to have any idea what to do < 1318936015 146311 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I thought it was a VPS? How could it make noises? < 1318936018 273466 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ouch < 1318936027 260380 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/sbin/grub-setup: warn: Attempting to install GRUB to a partition instead of the MBR. This is a BAD idea.. < 1318936027 861845 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/sbin/grub-setup: warn: Embedding is not possible. GRUB can only be installed in this setup by using blocklists. However, blocklists are UNRELIABLE and their use is discouraged.. < 1318936028 8493 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Installation finished. No error reported. < 1318936028 8703 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Generating grub.cfg ... < 1318936030 439366 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: wait, is grub even used with xen? < 1318936034 3075 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :A New Kind of Definition of Error < 1318936040 106065 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes some pvgrub shit i don't even know maybe it doesn't even matter < 1318936045 271323 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's plow on ahead and hope nothing goes wrong < 1318936057 771159 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you could always call support if it fucks up badly < 1318936070 754808 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: for values of call equal to email < 1318936076 471531 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well yeah < 1318936095 7047 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay let's < 1318936095 240576 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: anyway why are you trying to install it to a partition? < 1318936096 3253 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :try rebooting < 1318936107 568540 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it demanded I told it which partitions to auto install grub to < 1318936111 999163 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i picked the most likely-looking one < 1318936119 312365 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess i picked wrong!!! < 1318936131 937616 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you should have picked like /dev/sda or whatever it is called I guess? < 1318936133 638462 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok reboot time. rip vps < 1318936141 392924 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yeah no there was like five and they all start with xvd < 1318936149 936034 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the one with least numbers? < 1318936159 830584 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :all but one had numbers < 1318936161 661561 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1318936163 306701 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :opposite of that < 1318936164 126725 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :in retrospect < 1318936167 592647 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure why i picked the one with the number < 1318936170 63288 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well < 1318936179 515746 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well it might still boot with the old copy of grub. Perhaps < 1318936181 101021 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :if this ssh connection works i will be- < 1318936183 420505 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit it connected < 1318936187 42052 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess it really doesn't use grub < 1318936203 555577 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: either that or it works with the old copy of grub < 1318936214 959443 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, oh well < 1318936217 947696 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :WFM < 1318936225 608953 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :for now at least < 1318936233 652092 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: don't even think about switching to grub2 though < 1318936242 460830 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that's what the upgrade tried to do < 1318936246 993270 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1318936253 83025 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: then I bet it doesn't use grub < 1318936260 704277 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :like i said < 1318936261 690729 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pvgrub < 1318936263 997260 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatveer that is < 1318936266 619539 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1318936270 425531 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://wiki.xen.org/xenwiki/PvGrub < 1318936277 314082 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"it runs the regular grub inside the created domain itself" < 1318936288 726677 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :neat, haskell program still doesn't work < 1318936294 629290 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1318936310 150147 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Version: 6.12.1-13 < 1318936315 807152 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318936320 49016 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice, it's only over a year old < 1318936322 350957 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wait < 1318936324 325012 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :almost two years < 1318936326 376371 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1318936334 741557 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i should run experimental on this < 1318936339 432436 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what about using backport of a newer ghc? < 1318936347 323026 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :aren't there a backports repo for debian < 1318936347 469755 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ugghhh < 1318936355 286744 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i doubt ghc will be backported :P < 1318936358 469269 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well okay < 1318936381 118600 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should just put openbsd on this or something, at least i'd be able to trace all the suckiness down to stupid root principles < 1318936389 910480 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1318936412 185080 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: or rewrite that program to work on older ghc < 1318936418 590485 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :or write the program in another language < 1318936426 799880 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and miss the benefits of an event manager; and want to kill myself < 1318936427 390000 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not suggesting C here < 1318936428 281598 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :respectively < 1318936432 391111 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i actually really like openbsd's distro/install mechanism < 1318936433 212972 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1318936435 684122 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's so retro < 1318936440 438729 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah < 1318936441 846675 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the filenames are the exact same length < 1318936443 164222 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's like < 1318936446 617233 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :xcore.tgz < 1318936450 401889 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just < 1318936452 389131 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know < 1318936454 528073 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just makes me happy < 1318936491 412293 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what I dislike with freebsd and openbsd is that ports doesn't cover the entire system. Just /usr/local. So nothing outside that is tracked in a package manager < 1318936506 936052 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea if NetBSD and other *BSD do it that way as well < 1318936508 776282 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of ports, you should just download bsd.tgz < 1318936514 674270 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is every single piece of software in binary form. < 1318936520 57414 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like, the size of Debian. < 1318936524 718326 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's all installed simultaneously. < 1318936532 299263 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever < 1318936539 350650 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no that would be so convenient < 1318936540 669149 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :to upgrade < 1318936543 313182 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just download a new bsd.tgz < 1318936544 966213 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and unpack it into / < 1318936552 534901 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: and removed files? What removes them < 1318936568 821222 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: why would you remove files < 1318936570 351558 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1318936595 983636 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1318936600 298037 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, lets say the new version no longer uses /sbin/foobaz but instead does it a different way? < 1318936614 672254 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: symlink < 1318936633 909787 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it is something executed from startup scripts, nothing the user would run manually < 1318936641 306712 :nooga!~nooga@77-254-87-233.adsl.inetia.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1318936643 277054 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :symlink to maintain old startup scripts, duh < 1318936648 295210 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to write those yourself. < 1318936650 850146 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: besides there might not be single tool that replaces it :P < 1318936661 503330 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :never remove software. < 1318936663 974183 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that removes choice < 1318936665 539660 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :just add more of it < 1318936670 412040 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: come on, openbsd is not quite the same as LFS for BSD < 1318936683 538656 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh good idea you should just download kern.tgz < 1318936686 542908 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :then gcc.tgz < 1318936692 82219 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then you have to compile everything yourself < 1318936697 829440 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually openbsd should just be an abstract concept < 1318936705 258038 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: actually I think you need like binutils.tgz roo < 1318936706 352099 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :too* < 1318936706 653285 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :any bsd created sufficiently manually is openbsd < 1318936713 98175 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :above line should be entire contents of openbsd.org < 1318936721 603853 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that's included in gcc.tgz < 1318936725 221769 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :to comply with the GFDL < 1318936735 460515 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :how...? < 1318936737 911439 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote GFDL < 1318936745 705964 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :146) * Phantom_Hoover wonders where the size of the compiled Linux kernel comes from. To comply with the GFDL, there's a copy of Wikipedia in there. < 1318936756 373044 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318936765 924659 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah the GFDL is a strange beast < 1318936898 651958 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :honestly, if I had a "phat" enough "pipe", I would just run a server from home < 1318936907 264565 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i live in an "unphat" "england" < 1318936955 725621 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish I had a better connection as well. Yogscast reported that they were at a lan party in US, and it took like 6 seconds to upload a 1 GB video. < 1318936968 789770 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is quite amazing < 1318937114 518722 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1318937151 335857 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha, arch has finally moved into debian territory < 1318937201 505839 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh? < 1318937206 797122 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have a testing repo now < 1318937211 812682 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that is old < 1318937217 541608 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that old < 1318937226 209751 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: they had it when I started using arch < 1318937237 421885 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, guess they just started exposing it recently < 1318937256 5637 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well it is just that the time in testing is really fast. Normally like a few weeks at most. < 1318937512 965547 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What, Arch doesn't have lilo support any more. < 1318937521 429731 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay? < 1318937524 486442 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm going to ragequit reality. < 1318937541 412239 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't remember when it last had lilo < 1318937547 596212 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last time I used it. < 1318937602 78021 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nilfs + syslinux; gotta be non-traditional. < 1318937632 599566 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1318937685 78153 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The entire point of running Linux is so that someone can mention some part of their setup and you can respond "oh, I just [thing]", which then, through repeated confusion as to how you make that work, unravels into an explanation of your entire batshit insane idiosyncratic setup. < 1318937703 14480 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: XD < 1318937718 683843 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, "oh, I literally keep my entire filesystem in CVS." < 1318937722 490391 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318937730 29380 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah, my setup doesn't boot on a non-custom kernel < 1318937738 915137 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, "oh, I actually have /usr/local/share and /usr/local/lib on different partitions; the latter is ten gigabytes." < 1318937742 805080 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least with the stock kernel in arch < 1318937744 843603 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :it won't book < 1318937746 169881 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :boot* < 1318937758 189300 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: s/on a non-/without a / < 1318937767 976032 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah < 1318937810 675203 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh, I actually telnet in to a Lisp Machine for IRC." < 1318937811 855928 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it is down to getting away with a custom kernel without initramfs mess by using md raid autodetect partitions plus an option in the kernel. < 1318937815 122498 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Nothing beats real Emacs editing." < 1318937826 416497 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Don't talk to me about that GNU imitation." < 1318937829 551509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"``''" < 1318937833 619895 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone need to make a telnet server in elisp < 1318937854 497189 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: So that dry ice cream, what was the texture like. < 1318937877 592957 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: err, trying to remember the word for what I'm thinking about... < 1318937890 621859 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pizza? < 1318937898 568500 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it was actually pizza, if so. < 1318937912 653973 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: google translate gets it as meringue. Really dry such < 1318937922 674495 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :the taste however, nothing I ever tasted before < 1318937925 168239 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aww, so it wasn't chewy or anything? < 1318937942 810862 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it was kind of sticky when it got into your mouth < 1318937945 399667 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :very sticky < 1318937947 43556 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was imagining, like, fudge, except ice cream flavoured. < 1318938011 684454 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I like how Arch is zero point zero point two kernel releases ahead of the actual kernel. < 1318938017 858853 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: very hard and dry meringue, that got sticky when in my mouth. Took quite a bit of work to get it away from my teeth using a toothbrush. < 1318938038 73474 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly you just need to soak it. < 1318938038 924650 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: everything kind of is. 3.0.4 is still listed on kernel.org < 1318938056 693341 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Oh, is three point zero point six out, just not on kernel.org? < 1318938063 289038 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't know < 1318938075 931301 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought that's what you were saying. < 1318938097 871808 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't know what the official kernel is on. I'm on 3.0.4 with my custom vanilla kernel < 1318938118 959928 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Custom vanilla. < 1318938123 426526 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you said ahead. Thought you said behind < 1318938131 241684 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well custom as in not stock distro < 1318938140 494632 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and vanilla as in downloaded from kernel.org with no patches < 1318938145 254813 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yes custom vanilla < 1318938145 982612 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I should just use Nix. < 1318938151 618568 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What, not even BFS? < 1318938155 442435 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: BFS? < 1318938160 29135 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Big Fucking Sword? < 1318938169 936992 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Boulder Frandomising Sasquatch. < 1318938177 845679 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so what is BFS? < 1318938179 661776 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a patch that frandomises process boulders with a sasquash. < 1318938185 591108 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Con Kolivas' scheduler. < 1318938203 961938 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: IO scheduler or CPU scheduler? < 1318938209 306436 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CPU. < 1318938216 296309 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the Brain Fuck Scheduler that made the rounds a year or so ago. < 1318938221 672062 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :For desktop use. < 1318938233 34617 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I never had any issues with the default scheduler on my desktop. Never noticed any issues < 1318938240 165221 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://ck.kolivas.org/patches/bfs/reverse-scalability.png etc. < 1318938240 433814 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and don't fix what isn't broken < 1318938271 281949 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what is cfs? < 1318938285 801766 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Completely Fair Scheduler, the sole scheduler the kernel lets you use. < 1318938290 630151 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318938299 171876 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Completely Fair in that if you have a billion CPUs it's technically "the best".) < 1318938309 990471 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: looks like CFS is slightly better at very large -j < 1318938325 365870 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, the four point in green is lower than any red... < 1318938351 20 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I mean at make -j12 on both for example < 1318938353 736281 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: In bfs, -j is basically always optimal. < 1318938361 190615 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, but why would you run a non-optimal -j? < 1318938362 982011 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh I thought it was with 12 cores < 1318938366 128521 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, four. < 1318938392 950259 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: anyway what about HT? < 1318938402 483038 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :would -j8 be best for me then? with 4 cores + HT < 1318938403 213360 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :HT = cores for scheduling. < 1318938412 764958 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just pretend you have twice the cores. < 1318938425 407817 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : [...] Took quite a bit of work to get it away from my teeth using a toothbrush. <-- So you accidentally ate glue? < 1318938446 61392 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no. Freeze dried ice cream < 1318938495 560254 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It's Vorpal's code for glue.) < 1318938503 43934 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1318938547 982659 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders why literally nobody runs X/WM at high priority. < 1318938557 872459 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess bfs' isochronous priority is good there. < 1318938590 576955 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: X/WM? < 1318938601 78429 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :X and WM. < 1318938604 316980 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1318938625 429659 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, resulting system does not boot. < 1318938650 381749 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what? your vm? < 1318938654 539867 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1318938655 167827 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :vps < 1318938656 461942 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1318938657 483348 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :VM. < 1318938684 452702 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder why; the flags and partitioning all looks right. < 1318938691 695219 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so not the vps then < 1318938704 539363 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: which distro are you using in the vm? < 1318938727 140385 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm giving one last try of Arch in a VM before I declare it completely useless. < 1318938764 328898 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, did you do some sort of strange setup? < 1318938772 625294 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also what error does it give < 1318938773 912638 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :syslinux probably counts as strange. < 1318938778 301686 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes < 1318938780 331408 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no bootable medium < 1318938795 361210 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: then don't declare arch linux useless. Declare syslinux useless < 1318938814 704623 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arch Linux is useless if it'll install an unworking configuration. < 1318938837 499383 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it let you select syslinux in the installer? < 1318938849 789170 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yse. < 1318938850 559883 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1318938853 414040 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that isn't the same as useless though. A bug yes. < 1318938865 199566 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it's useless for that and everything else. < 1318938882 791662 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would be useless if there was no option that let you get a working configuration. Like it only allowed syslinux and syslinux was bugged < 1318939052 224982 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-31-252.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318939106 375397 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I should just take the plunge and become a Slackware addict. < 1318939116 151305 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, they're onto "13.37". < 1318939242 180330 :MSleep!~fyrc@or-67-238-31-252.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1318939395 272730 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Quit: MSN: Patashu@hotmail.com , Gmail: Patashu0@gmail.com , AIM: Patashu0 , YIM: patashu2 , Skype: patashu0 . < 1318939594 89155 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Convince me not to just run Tiny Core. < 1318939596 445767 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :On everything. < 1318939616 575429 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what is Tiny Core? < 1318939680 453609 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know, the ten meg thing. < 1318939686 149839 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope? < 1318939697 676062 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your brain is a sieve. < 1318939707 629009 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly < 1318940803 910325 :SimonRC!~sc@fof.durge.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1318940857 19289 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't you usually sniff glue rather than eating it? < 1318940959 66697 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-248-135.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318940981 203860 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :My father once introduced me to some family friends of our relatives (who we were visiting) as "...and that glue-sniffer looking guy is my son". That was the fairest. < 1318940995 280572 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-237-131.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1318941043 919432 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1318941057 966434 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so by "you" you mean "i"? O KAY < 1318941167 451543 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: It was the indefinite you. < 1318941231 701839 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't trust a glue-sniffer looking guy on that. < 1318941298 482690 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like the old saying of the jungle goes: the You that can be spoken is not the eternal You. < 1318941425 559723 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Laozi the king of the jungle < 1318941455 813350 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, isn't a glue-sniffer exactly the one you'd trust when it comes to matters of whether to sniff or eat glue? He's got the experience, after all. < 1318941484 815953 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am referring to the "you"/"i" switch, here. < 1318941652 415917 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was no switch to refer to. You just haven't got a glue. < 1318941708 457251 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure i do, and i'm sticking to it < 1318941776 856037 :sllide!~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1318941784 422954 :nooga!~nooga@77-254-87-233.adsl.inetia.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1318941903 794929 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, Eri Keeper brand glue is in fact a Finnish product. I was wondering if they sell it in e.g. Burnchurchway. < 1318941971 522904 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Burnchurch Castle, a National Monument, is a well-preserved 15th century Norman tower house with a round gate tower, situated in County Kilkenny, Ireland." < 1318941983 424888 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :no burnchurchway, though < 1318942113 390495 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I almost went with "Burnchurchland", but at the last minute wanted the way of Norway in too. < 1318942195 320230 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey we have to use the nice old wooden churches for _something_ < 1318942815 364535 :SimonRC!~sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1318943165 236647 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that thing about Norway went over my head, what did it refer to? < 1318943812 219322 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Varg Vikernes (Norwegian pronunciation: [ˈʋɑrɡ ˈʋiːkəɳeːs]; born 11 February 1973) is a Norwegian black metal musician, convicted murderer, arsonist, and religious, political and nationalist activist. -- Vikernes was further convicted of four counts of arson involving the burnings of historic churches, and was sentenced to 21 years in prison. Having served almost 16 years of his sentence, Vikernes was released on parole in early 2009.[3][4]" < 1318943816 681586 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, you let him walk free. < 1318944188 345450 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always thought Vikernes should be Finnish. < 1318944194 55475 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just seems to fit him better. < 1318944198 575504 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :We only have copycats in our copyland. < 1318944207 638751 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're basically all murderers-in-waiting. < 1318944212 165921 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :("Kalle Holm, an 18-year-old Finn known to have played drums in several Finnish metal bands, has stated on his website that he was influenced by Burzum. He set fire to the Porvoo Cathedral in Finland in May 2006: the roof of the church burned, but the ceiling, vaults and interiors survived undamaged.") < 1318944228 938270 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, he claims to have not burned any churches. < 1318944229 473646 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Church.20060530_PM.porvoo_of_finland.ojp.jpg < 1318944234 54700 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(He admits the murder thing though.) < 1318944240 256256 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Churches are just too far. < 1318944250 637966 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What is it with your churches? They're so small. < 1318944263 728366 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Small country, small churches. < 1318944284 278530 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm pretty sure you're a larger country than us. < 1318944362 319783 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, land-area-wise we arere 1.256 yous. Maybe it's not the size but how you use it. < 1318944367 84509 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arere. < 1318944369 634823 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arererere. < 1318944421 341385 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have one ridiculously dimensioned wooden church in the middle of ~nowhere; rumour has it they've mixed centimetres and inches in the architect -> builders step. < 1318944422 117094 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just that it's mostly lakes, and the finns haven't found out how to build churches in them yet < 1318944433 86542 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Got a link? < 1318944451 264746 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not big in absolute sense, but it's bigger than you'd expect a random wooden church in the middle of nowhere to be. < 1318944454 849729 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll see if I can google it. < 1318944486 422804 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kerim%C3%A4ki_Church < 1318944505 902695 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Big church, small WP article. < 1318944578 292277 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fi.wikipedia on amputation: "This medical article is a stub." < 1318944591 661003 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : Oh, you let him walk free. <-- he's even published new music < 1318944622 445383 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: He did that from jail, too. (I read up on him once because it was interesting.) < 1318944630 720737 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh maybe < 1318944662 12587 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :He really does have the best possible face for a murderer. I mean, if you ask me. < 1318944702 303889 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :He does seem to be contemplating murder in the Wikipedia infobox too. < 1318944747 990114 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's consult Wikipedia on this controversial issue. < 1318944749 472141 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well actually we're all a little racist inside, and that's normal. in fact not being a bit racist isn't normal. < 1318944749 637392 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :6resurected6satan6 1 year ago 33 < 1318944755 401545 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :6resurected6satan6 weighs in. < 1318944826 219227 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a bit surprised no-one has [citation needed]'d the "largest wooden church in the world" sentence, seeing it sitting there all uncited like that. < 1318944833 157310 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Your turn. < 1318944833 303805 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ( c) a player < 1318944837 359054 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1318944841 672486 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What style's it on. < 1318944854 949345 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose its own still. < 1318944856 41186 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style < 1318944856 187809 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Available: agora alice c64 ct darwin discworld europarl ff7 fisher fungot* homestuck ic irc jargon lovecraft nethack pa sms speeches ss wp youtube < 1318944970 331234 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bah, I need to go real soon to this "Experience Aalto!" thing downstairs, to demonstrate our group's research stuffs to first-year students. They even gave us white T-shirts with "A!" in front and "Aalto First Year Experience" in back. < 1318944982 172799 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :No-one mentioned these clown shirts when they were polling for available volunteers. < 1318944996 90569 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1318945002 544249 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: How did you get that static GHC binary onto fungot-machine again? < 1318945002 691089 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ( that is, levinson went to kish, disappeared, had on your behalf of the commission is not allowed to use the crane, enter any two of these letters, a b y. < 1318945007 984854 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: you should wear red noses just for the sarcasm < 1318945029 246184 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I have a GHC binary there? < 1318945039 595470 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You did, once, for a test. < 1318945057 462125 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I can't recall at all. But certainly if you say so. < 1318945068 629287 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You will clearly be a great help. < 1318945085 343329 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I don't think I can improvise a red nose in twenty minutes. < 1318945105 13345 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : fizzie: How did you get that static GHC binary onto fungot-machine again? <-- using floppies < 1318945105 160263 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: and it's self-modifying techniques." stop immobilizes and disables you. in these bones, i shall return! by the way, the wings! now this is a way to the ocean palace? aren't they in the mood to confront vorbis there and then... this ship's gonna save the planet is hurt, are you saying? < 1318945120 327106 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :the actual floppy kind of floppy too < 1318945149 229441 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(8-inch) < 1318945184 95132 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :We had 8-inch floppies for throwing (target, not distance) at one staff christmas party here. < 1318945204 864165 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318945218 65370 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: how could you do that with valuable museum treasures! < 1318945233 935768 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I'm sure they survived just fine. They built to last those days. < 1318945272 138817 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah tutankhamon's computers were rock solid < 1318945293 705392 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're going to get that "King Tut" song going in my head. < 1318945299 397030 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmphs. < 1318945311 40278 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will sit here stubbornly until someone solves my problem. < 1318945319 390890 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you have a problem? < 1318945330 370145 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Yes. My program doesn't work on my VPS. < 1318945348 405264 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried out OpenIndiana too. I expected some sort of exotic desktop environment. It just uses Gnome 2 as far as I can tell < 1318945349 561508 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/ < 1318945355 336755 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :too bad i don't have a glue then *MWAHAHAHA* < 1318945392 935462 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bl5dZxA-rZY < 1318945451 573580 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: oerjan doesn't do the sound thing. < 1318945458 557666 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. Sad. < 1318945500 553757 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"AIS-Code is on a scale of one to six, one being a minor injury and six being life-threatening. An AIS-Code of 6 is not the code for a deceased patient, but the code for an injury with a very high lethality. An AIS-Code of 9 is used to describe injuries for which not enough information is available for more detailed coding, e.g. crush injury to the head."... is this... talking about ais523? < 1318945533 102509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also referred to as a "feather". < 1318945553 251356 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :it even has fucking gnu coreutils for ls < 1318945554 592328 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so on < 1318945559 161137 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :What the foo have I clicked anyway, to have the WP "Abbreviated injury scale" article open? I certainly don't remember consciously opening anything like this. (Maybe there's a code for it.) < 1318945560 681298 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is less exotic than *BSD < 1318945627 293719 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Oh, it's the first A-titled article in the "Medicine stubs" category; I was checking the English text of the stub template.) < 1318945650 203651 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay mount output is backwards < 1318945655 404100 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : fizzie: oerjan doesn't do the sound thing. <-- oh, i actually did for once. < 1318945658 238306 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ mount < 1318945660 746425 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :/ on rpool/ROOT/openindiana read/write/setuid/devices/dev=1810002 on tors jan 1 01:00:00 1970 < 1318945663 340667 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: gozsh. < 1318945665 981790 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1318945667 136769 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/z// < 1318945684 92092 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :with it not being the middle of the night and stuff < 1318945736 18772 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it still feels awkward. < 1318945808 688221 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What, no CDE? < 1318945834 287861 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: indeed. It is plain old Gnome 2. And ls is the boring one from GNU Coreutils. < 1318945834 936586 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think there's CDE in real Solaris by default either, though. < 1318945844 94327 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Any more, that is.) < 1318945847 844177 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: oh it could be there I guess but not default < 1318945858 96797 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Welp, downstairs. < 1318945858 916702 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't used it for more than like 20 minutes < 1318946012 119255 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is like cde-runtime package (not installed), and cde-utils. They seem to not be the full CDE thing with window manager and all, just whatever is needed to run CDE applications < 1318947005 511769 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1318947207 75669 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1318947915 25626 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1318948456 876135 :ais523_!93bcc029@gateway/web/freenode/ip.147.188.192.41 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318948479 856764 :pikhq_!~pikhq@174-22-150-30.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318948527 47370 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-248-135.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1318949822 390290 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1318950347 947154 :ais523_!93bcc029@gateway/web/freenode/ip.147.188.192.41 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1318950434 623690 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote dynamic indentation < 1318950437 583648 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :77) i use dynamic indentation, i indent lines k times, if they are used O(n^k) times during a run of the program < 1318950609 845519 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Later < 1318950784 882084 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "Future releases of Solaris will be based on the OpenSolaris open source project, which states that there is no plan to make the Solaris CDE "consolidation" (OS component) available as open source. -- OpenCDE, an open source project to replicate CDE, was started in early 2010. The project intends to reproduce the look and feel, organization, and feature set of CDE without using any CDE-derived code." < 1318950793 32803 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently it really isn't there in OpenSolaris either. < 1318950805 905033 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318951156 449593 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-31-252.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1318951214 674385 :MSleep!~fyrc@or-67-238-31-252.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318951233 594659 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Away again; this time homeward bound.) < 1318951329 513915 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I only have a partial backlog, but:) < 1318951331 151325 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :CDE sucks horribly anyway. < 1318951339 221127 :sadhu!~kaus_@117.201.50.156 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318951348 100585 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus, XFCE was originally a clone of CDE. < 1318951351 4149 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I hear it runs ChatZilla admirably. < 1318951353 970848 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then they went "Oh wait, CDE sucks." < 1318951362 431692 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D < 1318951391 55613 :MSleep!~fyrc@or-67-238-31-252.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDude < 1318951472 565884 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318951921 371601 :sadhu!~kaus_@117.201.50.156 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1318952213 704311 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote (Of Minecraft:) So basically I didn't understand what it was at all, I thought maybe you were meant to be like a worm and just sort of wriggle about underground. < 1318952215 824035 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :703) (Of Minecraft:) So basically I didn't understand what it was at all, I thought maybe you were meant to be like a worm and just sort of wriggle about underground. < 1318953124 475263 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318953162 846502 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thing that confused me a while ago: another channel discussing ZZT without automatically assuming the everyone else knew what it was < 1318953261 824418 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318953544 332181 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I just received an interesting offer via email < 1318953555 834306 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the people who actually own the copyright to the final versions of two of my papers < 1318953578 128369 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :have offered to serve all-rights-reserved-but-you-can-still-look-at-it copies to anyone who visits their website via a link from mine < 1318953587 781006 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. filtering by referrer < 1318953595 366038 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the catch :P < 1318953598 991765 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an interesting business model suggestion, at least < 1318953609 863947 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting ~ awful < 1318953610 193001 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: creating an account with them, for one thing < 1318953620 250653 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, I'm trying to figure out how the business model works there < 1318953624 859096 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh; it's easier to get the paper by other means, then < 1318953628 307255 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it'll never work < 1318953647 638346 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I suppose it might be harder finding the copies of _yours_ hanging about on the public webspace :-P < 1318953657 993444 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, the email mentioned in passing that they only have the copyright of the final version, not of drafts < 1318953666 919033 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the loophole that absolutely everyone uses (they just post the drafts on their web page) < 1318953675 435226 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318953681 670788 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :People just change like three words before actually submitting it to make that work, right? < 1318953689 282486 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so presumably they're trying to get things like usage statistics in the situation where people would otherwise check drafts < 1318953691 939150 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would be annoying if there was a risk of actual substantial changes < 1318953697 49514 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not even that, they put "this space is reserved for the copyright notice" < 1318953700 667802 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1318953705 288567 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then the publisher removes that when putting the copyright notice in < 1318953707 262277 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a change < 1318953718 560407 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :academic publishing is the most insane business model I've ever heard of < 1318953776 522134 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my guess is, they decided that it wasn't losing them any money if they got to serve people final versions who would otherwise look at the drafts < 1318953844 821903 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and because it's all opt-in by the author, the only people likely to opt in are those who'd put drafts on their homepage anyway < 1318953875 971425 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I've linked my latest paper to the channel, anyway; it's about compiling recursion into hardware < 1318953880 255598 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's probably harmless, but I don't know that I'd want to support such a silly business model < 1318953890 956126 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'd read it (and pretend to understand it) < 1318953908 746182 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/~drg/papers/icfp11.pdf < 1318953913 561144 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :same ICFP who do the contest, incidentally < 1318953922 253256 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would not expect otherwise < 1318953936 252899 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's not computer modern :'( < 1318953943 675400 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ok, I don't like computer modern, but times is worse) < 1318953945 979751 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't it? < 1318953947 462761 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks < 1318953951 405071 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(at least the times on here) < 1318953980 966237 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're right, it looks like some Times variant < 1318953998 918702 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Unfolding finite recursion in space" < 1318954005 112465 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :missed opportunity for excellent title, there < 1318954011 380590 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't write the formatting, nor even much of the text; just the content in the only new section (which is about unfolding recursion in time) < 1318954027 366256 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's basically a TARDIS, right/ < 1318954030 996021 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rest is just summaries of previous results to pad out space, and because there's a crazy rule that all the context for a paper has to be explained in the paper itself < 1318954042 685408 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, unfortunately < 1318954060 675807 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION would not expect ais523 to be the kind of person to say "unfortunately" to time travel being impossible irl < 1318954094 664615 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318954105 207998 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: gcc four point oh? < 1318954108 340638 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :even OS X isn't /that/ bad < 1318954115 794292 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it was indeed on OS X < 1318954118 572112 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea which version < 1318954121 55709 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :leopard < 1318954124 997594 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but why such an old compiler? < 1318954139 240341 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the record, OpenSolaris: gcc (GCC) 3.4.3 (csl-sol210-3_4-20050802) < 1318954142 625987 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just did gcc --version < 1318954149 744368 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: it's as old as NetHack! < 1318954151 33580 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Nice < 1318954158 308571 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: NetHack released in ohfive??? < 1318954167 704120 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, NetHack released in 3.4.3 < 1318954168 241658 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No, but it's 3.4.3 < 1318954170 566447 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318954178 621539 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1318954201 196335 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there should be a way to link your kernel into an executable too < 1318954205 810401 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that static linking would actually solve my problem < 1318954220 499508 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: static VM? < 1318954220 684227 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is your problem < 1318954242 804805 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: My Haskell binary doesn't work on my server, it just hangs at startup doing tons of realtime/clock calls and occasionally mmap < 1318954251 693062 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like something's fucked in the event manager; I've no idea what or why or how to fix < 1318954258 174496 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318954259 496086 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yes, exactly < 1318954287 695049 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, that reminds me of some insane code I wrote recently < 1318954297 430516 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no < 1318954303 508424 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't worry, it's C < 1318954306 453224 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no < 1318954310 61177 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-D < 1318954347 920507 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll remove the explanatory comments so you get the full effect < 1318954351 888415 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no < 1318954398 349774 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :{ void* allocforcer[100]; int i; for (i = 0; i < 100; i++) { allocforcer[i] = malloc(64000); } for (i = 0; i < 99; i++) { free(allocforcer[i]); } } < 1318954408 690202 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the 100 is a reasonably arbitrary number; the 64000 isn't < 1318954422 227123 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i < 1318954425 703457 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :really, they should both have been #defines but I was being lazy < 1318954439 381895 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: something about forcing pages to be reserved or filled or something? < 1318954448 439708 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :close, but not perfect < 1318954452 395604 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :notice the memory leak, it's deliberate < 1318954453 383086 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: disk sectors? < 1318954455 93997 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm < 1318954462 276344 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is it so you can overrun the buffer somehow? < 1318954468 33470 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1318954474 465856 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1318954480 973229 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, clue: think about the system calls involved < 1318954491 518018 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION isn't sure he wants to... < 1318954492 171547 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1318954502 215378 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: trying to cause an overflow of some kind? < 1318954510 633839 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :They depend on the system / libc < 1318954517 857524 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, but you're thinking more along the right lines < 1318954520 985829 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: indeed; Linux / glibc < 1318954535 132145 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1318954551 172960 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea is portable to most other systems and libcs, though, even if perhaps the exact numbers aren't < 1318954558 911660 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is it about corrupting or otherwise modifying for a purpose in a non-standard way internal structures of the allocator? < 1318954570 620589 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., arranging them specifically? < 1318954575 565544 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sort of < 1318954583 221238 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not about corrupting, the resulting situation is not corrupt at all < 1318954589 34406 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is modifying for a purpose, though < 1318954593 24978 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the purpose is related to syscalls < 1318954608 779714 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(incidentally, this has nothing to do with the Secret Project, although it /looks/ like it) < 1318954609 340455 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Changing the program break? < 1318954613 734540 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: yep < 1318954617 190272 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you figure out why? < 1318954621 284718 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i, err, sbrk? < 1318954640 512647 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: OK, what the code's doing is to get malloc to call sbrk at a particular location < 1318954660 556849 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the memory leak at the end is so that it won't give back allocated memory to the system, which it could do otherwise (I'm not sure if it actually /did/, but that way's clearer) < 1318954663 725708 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yikes < 1318954680 475865 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :And why do you do want to do that < 1318954682 931289 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it's freeing most of the memory between the break and the old end of the heap < 1318954686 889994 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: that's the question < 1318954690 341457 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you give up, I'll tell you < 1318954704 594895 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I gave up, maybe elliott didn't < 1318954708 826182 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i give up < 1318954709 651827 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also < 1318954710 475113 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :cry < 1318954711 133906 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bit < 1318954742 946093 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the reason, is so that future memory allocations /don't/ call sbrk < 1318954746 238539 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :until memory fills to a certain size < 1318954749 531447 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318954750 358572 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1318954751 350415 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :speed? < 1318954754 150729 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :security < 1318954756 961519 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1318954765 185519 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's immediately followed by the prctl that disables all but four syscalls < 1318954770 784115 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318954785 117012 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :brk is not one of those four < 1318954795 816907 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so /without/ doing that, the resulting code wouldn't be able to allocate any memory < 1318954803 562944 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then using too much memory kills the program? < 1318954807 180712 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1318954808 825690 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :why couldn't you just use brk before doing it? < 1318954814 931137 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because malloc wouldn't know I'd done that < 1318954825 751727 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally, the reason "why 64000" is that at 65536, glibc malloc starts using mmap instead < 1318954883 420935 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318954889 504016 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318954892 249386 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1318954901 442242 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, wiki spam < 1318954924 592355 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise I'd just use a big alloc then a small one < 1318954926 60620 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: thanks < 1318954947 835601 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're welcome! < 1318954956 799189 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and deleted < 1318954969 762873 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a page as well? < 1318954996 735307 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I missed one page < 1318955001 353913 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as it wasn't in RSS yet < 1318955282 924900 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, what's up in the world of esoteric programming? < 1318955308 511531 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing < 1318955315 980574 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I spent today writing a pointless report, but it's motivated me to work on Anarchy < 1318955327 234111 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I can hardly even remember how it's meant to work, now, luckily I wrote a partial spec that might remind me < 1318955557 368623 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :theory: ais523 is actually ireland < 1318955568 596698 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Republic or Northern>? < 1318955581 97264 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably the physical island < 1318955587 376815 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which includes both < 1318955588 860490 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :whichever one PH has gone to < 1318955598 86944 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it only makes sense that when PH disappears, ais523 appears < 1318955648 305576 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made marshmallows! < 1318955682 365534 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318955993 277053 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's someone in my ancient history class's birthday today < 1318956007 246656 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean tomorrow < 1318956012 678625 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am confused and tired < 1318956232 597781 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric : For the enthusiast who wants to run older operating systems, the option is there to allow you to make that decision. < 1318956248 406962 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the two levels of indirection are necessary, incidentally; "you are allowed to make that decision" is not necessarily true < 1318956254 499276 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318956293 268092 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1318957500 551620 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318957536 426792 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1318957559 789943 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1318957717 658600 :sadhu!~kaus_@117.201.50.30 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318958091 209406 :Sgeo|web!ad034d00@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.3.77.0 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1318958170 311142 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1318958187 735239 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yesterday at the night time, I put the tides in my gopher service. < 1318958594 234200 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318958649 448309 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1318958749 142677 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like tides on my gopher service? < 1318959147 212437 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not entirely sure I see the point < 1318959157 413336 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not entirely sure what a gopher service is < 1318959186 321947 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is on my computer on port 70 < 1318959535 631115 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1318959565 125852 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like somebody already found an exploit; < 1318959679 905406 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Excess Flood < 1318959689 890325 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wasn't me < 1318959693 394922 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: wfm < 1318959789 696998 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1318959857 494421 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: one moment while I look up your insane acronyms. < 1318959868 631463 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1318959899 57003 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes okay I will wait for you. :P < 1318959910 424822 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will wait for you while I Work From Home. < 1318959931 700079 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as a Workflow Manager in the World Federalist Movement. < 1318959937 855197 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, What Freakin' Manual? < 1318959950 943054 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Fucking < 1318959979 798548 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever I'm going to the Whole Foods Market. < 1318959987 997835 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I doubt they sell a Waveform Monitor. < 1318960006 131316 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It updates Wednesday-Friday-Monday < 1318960330 348523 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION needs to talk to the Workforce Management of the Western Federation of Miners about claims made by the Wings of Faith Ministries of the World Faith Movement that we have been interferring with their radio station via illegal use of Wide Frequency Modulation. < 1318960390 88627 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: I suspect it was "works for me" < 1318960399 251151 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oh...? < 1318960401 316111 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :works for me. < 1318960417 947154 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: wfm most often means "works for me" when elliott says it I found. < 1318960698 574392 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes < 1318960709 654417 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was the first choice on this website I found.... < 1318960716 864054 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, I figured, too obvious. < 1318960720 316091 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :must be one of these other things. < 1318960728 570654 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318960876 935348 :sadhu!~kaus_@117.201.50.30 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just coded a rough string to brainfuck converter < 1318960886 843065 :sadhu!~kaus_@117.201.50.30 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its pretty simple but it can do some optimizations < 1318960886 995477 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is "string" a language? < 1318960894 455160 :sadhu!~kaus_@117.201.50.30 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol no < 1318960900 917277 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you wrote a brainfuck interpreter? < 1318960923 322681 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, a text to brainfuck converter < 1318960924 633568 :sadhu!~kaus_@117.201.50.30 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no you input the string and it generates the brainfuck code to print it < 1318960934 488582 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohhhh < 1318960935 656784 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :right. < 1318960941 293020 :sadhu!~kaus_@117.201.50.30 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://gist.github.com/cf21d4abee8853ceb9e3 < 1318961037 982026 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow Uncyclopedia is so bad. < 1318961108 440408 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the collective humor of hundreds of people who have a terrible sense of humor < 1318961128 802557 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :many of them probably Wikipedia editors, or people who pretend to be wikipedia editors (....?) < 1318961195 473265 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318961905 851094 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:American_cuisine < 1318961909 583020 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahahaha frito pie < 1318961911 669813 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've had one of those. < 1318961928 461231 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :frito, as in potato chips? < 1318961953 920751 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :corn chips, but yes < 1318961983 275519 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Frito pie is a dish made with chili, cheese, and corn chips. Optional additions include salsa, refried beans, rice, and jalapeños, among others. < 1318962004 12002 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, this kind of pie! < 1318962007 426548 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds delicious. < 1318962011 300566 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :America is the best at food. < 1318962049 263623 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :we just take everyone elses food and mix it together with our own shit. < 1318962184 590356 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, GHC totally needs a way to force a thread to execute some code. < 1318962210 541405 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've had an idea for a programming language < 1318962215 481570 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, I bet I can do this with alwaysSuceeds. < 1318962216 472737 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :esoteric, that is < 1318962219 610023 :sadhu!~kaus_@117.201.50.30 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is this yours https://github.com/ehird ? < 1318962226 349093 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's me < 1318962231 131414 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird forked waferbaby/usesthis 1 day ago < 1318962231 293514 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Forked repository is at ehird/usesthis < 1318962231 947548 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf? < 1318962234 432655 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never did that < 1318962240 685971 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION deletes... < 1318962280 39620 :sadhu!~kaus_@117.201.50.30 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott did you checkout that str2bf < 1318962288 651285 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it looks better than bf_txtgen :P < 1318962293 855108 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, my idea for a new esolang < 1318962309 659908 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :An imperative language with ONLY functional features < 1318962327 580605 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably been done before < 1318962370 95745 :derdon!~derdon@p5DE8AEAC.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318962386 698259 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: Lisp? < 1318962386 965591 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :In pseudo javascript: < 1318962415 105802 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :var x = function(x) {function(y) {x}}; < 1318962494 780098 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, imagine python with only lambdas and variable assignations < 1318962494 945416 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe input and print, too < 1318962517 685703 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone here clueful with gnuplot ? < 1318962520 643632 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a file that likes like this testname | ind_var | old dp1 | old dp2 | new dp1 | new dp2 I want to have 2 separate plots. one per datapoint. Each plot should show the change in the dp from version A to version B with a line for each testname < 1318962533 521251 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or some variation thereof < 1318963023 790413 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : Actually, imagine python with only lambdas and variable assignations <-- have you seen that irc bot elliott wrote using lots of nested lambdas in python in order to make a non-trivial python program that would work without indentation < 1318963035 466307 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol wrote a bf interp like that, it's not uncommon < 1318963051 311129 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, I haven't seen that one < 1318963088 643008 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : anyone here clueful with gnuplot ? <-- try fizzie. He knew when I asked some gnuplot questions a while ago < 1318963113 808995 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1318963124 902318 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :I now have a file that more closely aligns with what I want to plot < 1318963163 675675 :sadhu!~kaus_@117.201.50.30 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1318963198 608035 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hrm. What's ind_var? < 1318963363 989351 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: independent varibale < 1318963389 599138 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in my case, the size of branch prediction table for a simulator) < 1318963430 514902 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: my file now looks like testname | ind_var | y_plot_1 | y_plot_2 < 1318963460 821196 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. With a new enough (4.x, should be everywhere by now) I think you just mostly need a suitable "using" specifier. You probably could've done it from the original file with two 'using' lines, actually. < 1318963472 206439 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrm? < 1318963484 907801 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is not gnuplot clueful < 1318963581 505858 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I need to test it before I say something that's probably not immediately correct. < 1318963590 970953 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :But how do you want to indicate the differences? < 1318963601 400134 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the y cord. < 1318963604 384396 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :* y axid < 1318963606 745554 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :* y axis < 1318963637 64264 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, but do you want for each test an arrow from the old value to the new one or what? < 1318963637 214147 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: got a link to that "Nix"? Searching is useless, just turns up matches for people writing *nix < 1318963645 838964 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://nixos.org/ < 1318963648 468717 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1318963648 615417 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :NixOS is the thing to google. < 1318963653 8403 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1318963667 413978 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION considers rolling NixOS + nilfs. < 1318963669 652790 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :no obvious download link. Heh. < 1318963670 412443 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ON THE EEEEDGE. < 1318963683 710450 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah there < 1318963730 921226 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god, it is gentoo stage3 kind of thing to install < 1318963736 591310 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well not quite < 1318963740 730884 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, it's binary-based. < 1318963742 230342 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots and lots of manual commands though < 1318963749 504390 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or the difference between the old and new as a signed value indicated by the point?) < 1318963768 729955 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Doesn't look that bad to me. < 1318963773 293001 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah but I meant as in, no installer (GUI or ncurses or even the openbsd style of asking questions) < 1318963776 307513 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's "partition, run a few Nix commands, rbeoot". < 1318963779 268971 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/rbe/reb/ < 1318963805 795460 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NO2_Arrhenius_k_against_T.svg something like this < 1318963817 532895 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :where X = size of branch table < 1318963831 903315 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :y = new - old < 1318963834 627449 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I like how it has special instructions for Pidgin-LaTeX in the manual. < 1318963835 663062 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Priorities. < 1318963840 1268 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: any idea for funky OSes to try out? I did OpenIndiana earlier. Looking for something else. NixOS looks like a bit too much work for just messing around with it in a VM. < 1318963865 84033 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Tiny Core is quite fun in a VM, at least, especially with its funky package mounting system. < 1318963884 261476 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ReactOS ? < 1318963895 55989 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: ew < 1318963901 484921 :Nisstyre!~yours@infocalypse-net.info QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1318963904 491997 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: :) < 1318963915 979680 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh? package mounting? Hm... Web search turns up github and so on. No obvious place to download an ISO < 1318963928 540271 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :google gives http://tinycorelinux.com/ as first link < 1318963936 35877 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: was using DDG < 1318963947 900643 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't bothered to set ddg on this new install yet < 1318963951 874523 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318963973 363317 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, a ten meg bootable Xorg system + graphical package manager is impressive in anyone's book < 1318963973 735466 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I've got to run now, but I'll read what you write later. Any help you could give me would be great ! < 1318963981 797717 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :though flinix of course wants to do it in one and a half. < 1318964016 467826 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Uhh, right, okay; so you want a line in the plot for each different 'testname', and the ind_var gives the X value. Okay. I was misinterpreting that you wanted a line i.e. an entry for each 'testname' labeled by the 'testname', indicating a single change. Mhm. That may need some manual pre-splitting so that the lines corresponding to each 'testname' have two empty lines in-between, but not necessarily. I'll try this out, will take a while. < 1318964036 707445 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no mesa I presume? < 1318964050 525474 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, everything's in a package. :p < 1318964060 926766 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so how do packages work in there? < 1318964101 421338 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Mounted into /tmp/some/path/i/forget which gets overlaid onto the rest of the system in a way I forget < 1318964106 303428 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318964109 186100 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Mounted loopback from the tarball < 1318964115 774545 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: are there many packages available? < 1318964119 867823 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shitloads < 1318964125 475729 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has all of KDE, etc. < 1318964140 406799 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1318964143 774832 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :xfce too I hope < 1318964151 560778 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was an example for size. < 1318964157 927594 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hm which one: TinyCore | MicroCore | MultiCore < 1318964182 315437 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and where are the 64-bit downloads? < 1318964193 296544 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Middle one doesn't have any kind of X at all. < 1318964196 244854 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :multicore is some kind of bundle thing. < 1318964209 215430 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1318964216 17586 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it apparently supports sixty-four bit says WP, but I dunno how. < 1318964229 294846 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://distro.ibiblio.org/tinycorelinux/4.x/ < 1318964232 266845 :Nisstyre!~yours@infocalypse-net.info JOIN :#esoteric < 1318964236 538078 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shrug. < 1318964246 273030 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1318964274 963764 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just get the thirty-two bit one, YAGN that ram :P < 1318964291 340993 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ibiblio is so slow. I get 20 kb/s from it, as usual < 1318964309 499871 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/timeline/7ca54bb4dd52eef1ecd02ebd1f481d04.png < 1318964312 465613 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good timeline. < 1318964319 380489 :Nisstyre!~yours@infocalypse-net.info QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded < 1318964358 485480 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I was going to assign 6 GB and 2 cores to the vm. Virtualbox is more efficient for 64-bit guests according to the docs < 1318964370 498403 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Six gigs of what < 1318964373 963306 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ram? < 1318964378 835922 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why, it's Tiny < 1318964393 473938 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, why not? I still have 10 for the host < 1318964404 734524 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it'll only see four of it? < 1318964405 234226 :Nisstyre!~yours@infocalypse-net.info JOIN :#esoteric < 1318964412 801259 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah fuck the 32-bitness < 1318964417 237678 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: anyway there is PAE < 1318964424 869601 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think you quite understand how Tiny the Tiny part of Tiny Core is < 1318964440 453604 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that was disk space, not ram ? < 1318964447 325189 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's everything. < 1318964452 432373 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would practically run on a toaster. < 1318964541 251869 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :so would ubuntu if you equipped the toaster with 10GB of storage and >=1GB of RAM < 1318964611 602313 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That could almost run Windows Vista < 1318964743 831383 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :atomically :: STM a -> IO a < 1318964744 17013 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :atomically (STM m) = IO (\s -> (atomically# m) s ) < 1318964746 137708 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck primitives < 1318964809 246010 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://hpaste.org/52806 < 1318964813 368394 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't it cute!? < 1318964829 270207 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: Totally < 1318964853 235023 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah keymap < 1318964870 411627 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1318964897 85548 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : old_trec = StgTSO_trec(CurrentTSO); < 1318964897 422913 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : /* Nested transactions are not allowed; raise an exception */ < 1318964897 569626 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : if (old_trec != NO_TREC) { < 1318964897 569808 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : R1 = base_ControlziExceptionziBase_nestedAtomically_closure; < 1318964897 569918 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : jump stg_raisezh; < 1318964898 246493 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : } < 1318964901 141922 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why you gotta be so unoverridable < 1318964920 997186 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Really, why are you trying to do that? < 1318964935 159288 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: SHHHHHHHHH I know it's safe because it's right at the end of the transaction. < 1318964937 149115 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like a tail-call. < 1318965034 889392 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: OK fine, here's a clue: < 1318965035 879904 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : go <- newEmptyTMVar < 1318965036 44512 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : alwaysSucceeds $ takeTMVar go >> unsafeIOToSTM act < 1318965036 191408 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : putTMVar go () < 1318965098 372444 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: tiny core is not an option unless I can get the correct keymap in the installer. Too painful otherwise < 1318965111 194371 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Why are you installing it? < 1318965112 511897 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It runs from rAM. < 1318965113 537508 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :RAM. < 1318965118 674627 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has a keymap setter built in to the preferences thing. < 1318965131 784529 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: looked in the control panel, I see no keymap optionj < 1318965133 583244 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :option* < 1318965168 801453 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: besides running it from a CD such changes such as setting keymap won't persist < 1318965171 527781 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty sure there is, but you could just tell X about it directly < 1318965205 596745 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: It is awfully tricky to get multiple lines (with different titles) using only a single plot specifier. You almost get it if you separate the datasets (in your case, different testnames) with two newlines and then plot the complete file, but in that case all the lines end up in the same style. It is trivial if you don't mind doing "plot 'blah.data' ... index 0, 'blah.data' ... index 1, ..." with one command per each line, but that requires either fixin < 1318965205 743414 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :g the number of lines, or generating the plotscript along with the data. Here's an example of what that might look like: http://p.zem.fi/meud < 1318965207 898327 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: See, you should be helping me now. < 1318965221 507077 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: As a matter of fact, I don't see. < 1318965233 588166 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Poor you. < 1318965280 986743 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: That will plot one line titled "foobar" with points at x=1, y=(1-0)=1 and x=2, y=(3-0)=3; and another line with x=1, y=(3-0)=3 and x=2, y=(5-0)=5. There's a host of twiddleable settings to control the style of the output further. < 1318965368 471334 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: As for the other plot, just turn ($4-$2) into ($5-$3). But I don't know offhand of a way to automatically get all indexes (i.e. datasets) of a datafile as actually separate series with different styles, without repeating the (essentially identical, except for the index number) plot specifier. Which is quite stupef. Possibly there is a thing for that too. < 1318965380 134328 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: The real real answer is that I'm trying to implement onCommit :: IO () -> STM (). < 1318965396 896600 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: If you just don't specify "index" at all, it'll plot them all as separate lines just fine, but all the lines will be with the same color and have just one title. < 1318965471 425869 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Isn't there already an implementation of onCommit? < 1318965481 888357 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle onCommit < 1318965482 293827 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :No results found < 1318965487 179188 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Yes, in another monad. < 1318965493 622456 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I'm making one that works directly without any changes. < 1318965507 729595 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I already have one that works perfectly except you need to s/atomically/atomicallyIO/. < 1318965515 982707 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Now I have one that works perfectly full stop, except you can't run a transaction from it. < 1318965567 354379 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically you want a kind of transaction finalizer :P < 1318965574 717205 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep :P < 1318965575 396719 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Okay, you can get the lines in a different style automatically too, but not multiple entries in the legend/key/whatever you call it. < 1318965579 198779 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's kind of what onCommit is. < 1318965697 232904 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :molecularily < 1318965808 557158 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1318965831 741661 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION discovered this by trying let m = atomically (onCommit m) < 1318965837 332061 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the best transaction < 1318966013 800254 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318966255 608544 :hagb4rd2!~perdito@koln-4db4e8fb.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318966275 847238 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i don't find any onCommit in the stm package? < 1318966306 847747 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: duh, that's why I'm implementing it < 1318966310 808816 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :onCommit :: IO () -> STM () < 1318966311 19980 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :onCommit act = do < 1318966311 166868 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : go <- newEmptyTMVar < 1318966311 167045 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : alwaysSucceeds $ takeTMVar go >> unsafeIOToSTM act < 1318966311 167154 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : putTMVar go () < 1318966333 511591 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db4ef42.pool.mediaWays.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1318966535 694981 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does alwaysSucceeds do? < 1318966575 642068 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: alwaysSucceeds :: STM a -> STM () < 1318966575 825608 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :alwaysSucceeds adds a new invariant that must be true when passed to alwaysSucceeds, at the end of the current transaction, and at the end of every subsequent transaction. If it fails at any of those points then the transaction violating it is aborted and the exception raised by the invariant is propagated. < 1318966580 296662 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"true" here meaning "doesn't throw an exception" < 1318966592 497574 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use it as a hook to be able to execute things at the end of the transaction :) < 1318966594 888449 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i already read that, i'm asking because i have no idea what it means < 1318966604 42808 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the TMVar is to avoid it executing when passed to alwaysSucceeds and at the end of future transactions < 1318966611 63212 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well how do you want me to explain, the above precisely defines its semantics < 1318966614 704660 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just not intuitive < 1318966629 268230 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what is an invariant? < 1318966635 930805 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: an action < 1318966656 206346 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it just means that the action is run when passed to alwaysSucceeds, at the end of the current transaction, and at the end of any subsequent transaction < 1318966659 994285 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: if it fails, the transaction fails < 1318966675 217484 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hm < 1318966688 888039 :ive!~nn@189.179.247.113 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318966696 506010 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so in this case, I use a TMVar to make sure it just does nothing when passed to alwaysSucceeds (first execution), then executes when the transaction finishes (second execution), then never again :) < 1318966707 368432 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :although there might be a race condition, I think not since it's part of the same atomically block < 1318966713 469392 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i.e. another transaction ending first) < 1318966720 230343 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but I think the adding of these is atomic too, so it should be fine) < 1318966747 304292 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, (t<<3)*[8/9,1,9/8,6/5,4/3,3/2,0][[0xd2d2c8,0xce4088,0xca32c8,0x8e4009][t>>14&3]>>(0x3dbe4688>>((t>>10&15)>9?18:t>>10&15)*3&7)*3&7] < 1318966754 317679 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :I liked this one < 1318966762 940000 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.o < 1318966766 514234 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: :slowpoke: < 1318966766 820881 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, how do you run those? < 1318966776 271431 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tiffany: Would you stop saying o.o all the time it is worse than Madoka-Kaname's one-line pings. < 1318966776 716976 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, =p < 1318966789 944490 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is like a never-ending torrent of suffering delivered in lines. < 1318966796 595255 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Suffering and pain. < 1318966803 491133 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wha? < 1318966805 326976 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: That one is a total cheat, it's basically just doing sequencing. < 1318966813 406557 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah, I know. < 1318966832 72064 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what the Kolgomorov complexity of Axel F is. (Inspired by rgb.swf.) < 1318966833 888207 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hugs tiffany  < 1318966834 45731 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: um doesn't takeTMVar prevent the action from succeeding until there's actually a value in it? < 1318966842 491120 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do I run those thingies? < 1318966848 164670 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hmm right < 1318966850 644733 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well, it works :D < 1318966860 900944 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tiffany: http://www.bemmu.com/music/index.html < 1318966876 967371 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :rgb.swf is really pretty < 1318966882 449667 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel so sorry for epileptics who can't enjoy it < 1318966882 861678 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not as much of a cheat as my that IIR resonator. :p < 1318966910 991538 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: As my that IIR resonator? < 1318966920 669556 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Line-editing gone wrong. < 1318966934 809282 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it's a rick roll =p < 1318966940 105573 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : It is like a never-ending torrent of suffering delivered in lines. <-- you mean no other downloaders, so you never get to a decent share ratio once it downloaded? < 1318966941 42903 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Madoka-Kaname: No shit. < 1318966954 392208 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you're pinged by o.o? < 1318966964 579996 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: If by "ping" you mean "annoyed", yes. :p < 1318966975 950364 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Help I looked at rgb.swf and now every other colour seems dull. < 1318966980 822065 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :.-. < 1318967016 259604 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :If by "ping" you mean "annoyed", we can deduce you are "annoyeded" by o.o. < 1318967025 372675 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION searches on duckduckgo < 1318967025 987250 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://throbs.net/fun/swf.asp?rgb.swf < 1318967031 364554 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how am I not having a seizure from this x_x < 1318967038 432221 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Heavy epilepsy warning on the above.) < 1318967068 18481 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :my eyes hurt now < 1318967077 479661 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, it actually does oversatuate your eyes. < 1318967080 450081 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything is actually greyish now. < 1318967083 579424 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :This can only be healthy. < 1318967084 709536 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : tiffany: http://www.bemmu.com/music/index.html <-- what is the algorithm? < 1318967087 219794 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wikispam < 1318967096 121740 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: there is no "algorithm", it just samples it < 1318967114 182688 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: samples *what*. What does your expression generate? < 1318967128 868122 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric : oom to use your free herpes dating sites. < 1318967129 136143 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it looks like a lot of bitshifting and some arcane syntax I have no clue about to me < 1318967142 241241 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal pcm < 1318967153 719502 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arcane syntax called array indexing, isn't it? < 1318967154 573611 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: okay so what is the syntax. I can't find any description on the page < 1318967161 946191 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's Javascript. < 1318967166 101978 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1318967166 710624 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i guess someone _has_ to have that as a fetish < 1318967173 350249 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think this spambot is just taking hypothesized Google searches for "dating" without wondering what they actually mean, then clipping them off at random locations < 1318967175 506770 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtQdIYUtAHg for complete programs pipeable to /dev/audio < 1318967187 129919 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the article titles are big giveaways that that's what's happening < 1318967189 864722 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the super-duper version < 1318967190 195468 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCRPUv8V22o < 1318967200 751185 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1318967212 483706 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, that spambot is capable of solving the CAPTCHA, incidentally < 1318967226 644351 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is not surprising as it's a very easy CAPTCHA, but it does mean it's targeting MediaWiki specifically < 1318967231 217138 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Note that viznut is a .fi person too. COINCIDENCE? < 1318967237 214098 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, it's the demoscene. < 1318967250 255362 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That "Covers Chaos Theory by Conspiracy" one is disappointingly lookup-tabley. < 1318967250 821185 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not an exclusively Finnish phenomononomon. < 1318967259 226007 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes but come on, you're fooling nobody. < 1318967260 582447 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :viz. a nut < 1318967300 815656 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That two-one-six one is very impressive, with the evolving beat. < 1318967334 248622 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :finnish pheromenons < 1318967338 826209 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also the one at a bit before seven minutes. < 1318967352 150248 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh so there is an implicit loop around the expression you enter on that page. It wasn't clear < 1318967385 669571 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's clear from the example expression in there that it uses 't' for time. < 1318967397 171490 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I was wondering what t < 1318967400 180993 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :t was* < 1318967466 405712 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm any way to generate sine waves? < 1318967471 113971 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :without too much work < 1318967473 355116 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, with "sin". < 1318967477 796572 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It autorewrites that to Math.sin. < 1318967485 46076 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: well yeah I was wondering if that was available in some shape or form < 1318967523 755962 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I splonked in an IIR resonator with what amounts to basically code injection earlier: (someone said it didn't work; but it worked for me; might not be quite legal JS therefore) < 1318967525 88699 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :128+600*r5(r4(r3(r2(r1(rg((t%40)==0?1:0)))))); }; var r1=r(710,50),r2=r(1100,70),r3=r(2450,110),r4=r(3300,250),r5=r(3750,200),rg=r(0,500); function r(F,BW) { var Z=8000,B=2*Math.exp(-3.14*BW/Z)*cos(2*3.14*F/Z),C=-Math.exp(-2*3.14*BW/Z),p1=0,p2=0; return function(x) { var p=(1-B-C)*x+B*p1+C*p2; p2=p1; p1=p; return p; }; < 1318967532 745812 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :issue: pausing the sound playing in the web browser is kind of broken < 1318967536 306542 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, does nothinmg < 1318967539 7620 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing* < 1318967539 209132 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wfm < 1318967542 782495 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: firefox? < 1318967545 799566 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :chrome < 1318967556 802586 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: How... pleasing-sounding. < 1318967569 170156 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Can we do dubstep yet? We need to ruin it. < 1318967594 789521 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, it's a fixed-frequency pulse train through a cascade of resonators; it'd be more interesting with some LFO on the filter parameters. < 1318967613 714266 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION generates 5 minutes of one of these :p < 1318967624 60161 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also at work with FF it actually started to play two copies at the same time when I ran it; then pausing actually only paused one of them. < 1318967633 534962 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, it's just 30 seconds. < 1318967649 815487 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1318967654 150237 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1318967669 219776 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yes but your one was horrible. And the two copies explain it < 1318967673 680881 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? welcome < 1318967678 970830 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page < 1318967696 361039 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I just found out about those awesome isoteric languages. Which are some of the best? < 1318967706 953411 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :my harddrive is making noises ._. < 1318967710 214333 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :esoteric* < 1318967723 947326 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's all a matter of opinion < 1318967732 118111 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :HDD make noises. I would get worried if it didn't. < 1318967733 419988 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like Piet < 1318967754 389310 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Funge-98 is widely recognized as the most useful language for IRC bot writing there is. < 1318967754 553535 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :tiffany: so is mine sometimes. Very faint ones due to the rubber rings between the disk and the metal plates on the side of the disk bay. < 1318967757 432524 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer some like Befunge-93 and the likes, or a cellular automata one. < 1318967763 540794 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: My hard-drive doesn't make noises. < 1318967764 612149 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlambda, underload < 1318967766 833152 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Say hi to citiral. < 1318967767 18178 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: to, uhhh.... or even this very difficult issue is discussed, it should be deleted, not merged. but new england flood of may, 1765, curwen's only child, it's ancient history now... < 1318967769 660593 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you have an SSD... < 1318967772 307029 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you like Befunge: < 1318967773 482513 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :^source < 1318967773 629059 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://git.zem.fi/fungot/blob/HEAD:/fungot.b98 < 1318967773 776576 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course it doesn't < 1318967774 20811 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :^source < 1318967774 167697 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://git.zem.fi/fungot/blob/HEAD:/fungot.b98 < 1318967777 312322 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :^source < 1318967777 476577 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://git.zem.fi/fungot/blob/HEAD:/fungot.b98 < 1318967779 804271 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Great minds and so on. < 1318967801 157350 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :this music generator must be making firefox use a ridiculous amount of ram :/ < 1318967801 599996 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot is a bot? < 1318967801 746898 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: " and this is a new game. there is no particularly good human translation for this concept. a concept usually denoted by a single, savage thrust of her was certain that the noise was as a distress signal is < 1318967807 785197 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: yes < 1318967814 35707 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: written in an esolang < 1318967816 452216 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fungot, I LOVE YOU! :D < 1318967827 77286 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't respond to people who miscapitalise it. < 1318967827 378818 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sadly, he's case-sensitive. < 1318967833 116062 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Befunge-98 someone said? < 1318967835 678020 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1318967839 745814 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://git.zem.fi/fungot/blob/HEAD:/fungot.b98 < 1318967839 925660 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: just to help an fnord archive) this song " there had been a gorgeous sunset, and judged it was a million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or ten million or < 1318967843 207282 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gotta check that one out. < 1318967846 271258 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :guh < 1318967849 932050 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style < 1318967850 78871 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Available: agora alice c64 ct darwin discworld europarl ff7 fisher fungot* homestuck ic irc jargon lovecraft nethack pa sms speeches ss wp youtube < 1318967852 603558 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style irc < 1318967852 750305 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Selected style: irc (IRC logs of freenode/#esoteric, freenode/#scheme and ircnet/#douglasadams) < 1318967858 377044 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Impress citiral. < 1318967859 247859 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ' fnord tulee fnord " hyv fnord" ja fnord fnord. kun fnord, muista fnord fnord ulos. < 1318967863 820611 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haha. < 1318967868 320259 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was the worst. < 1318967872 682636 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that... < 1318967873 390223 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Shame on you. < 1318967874 417138 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: fnord right, then. the mere existence of win32 is a crime called copyright crime. so maybe that won't be there in 1.11.x, sisc supports srfi-55, aka require-extension, which loads as fast as c < 1318967881 952034 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"the mere existence of win32 is a crime called copyright crime." < 1318967882 998962 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Classic. < 1318967887 693516 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: it uses some fingerprints for networking and such (fingerprints are loadable extensions the interpreter provides, iirc fungot uses SOCK, STRN, FING and TOYS) < 1318967887 997031 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you could say that, but if you do... < 1318967889 711646 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1318967899 647137 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :I lolled too at that one. < 1318967905 152557 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay yeah killing firefox < 1318967908 619928 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if terminal would open < 1318967927 329143 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, SCKE too < 1318967927 657550 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It was a bit of Finnish again; here's a translation: ' fnord comes fnord " good fnord" and fnord fnord. when fnord, remember fnord fnord out. < 1318967932 985571 :tiffany!~kawaii@fl-76-3-21-30.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ff just opened with an unresponsive script: Script: resource://gre/modules/XPCOMUtils.jsm:329 < 1318967933 763885 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: I concur with oerjan's nomination of Underload < 1318967968 25207 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: hm "out". Why am I reminded of radio communications here XD < 1318967975 474895 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo "hi citral" >foo; cat foo; rm foo < 1318967977 324044 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi citral < 1318967992 151244 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!c printf("hi citral\n"); < 1318967997 343087 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: replace the "fnord" with static and it sounds like a vital message that was jammed or something, and a key plot point in a movie < 1318968006 513114 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't think the Finnish word is used in that context though. It's more strictly "out" as in "exit from some place". < 1318968010 437189 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul ((Underload rocks)!a(:^)*S):^ < 1318968010 583852 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :((Underload rocks)!a(:^)*S):^ < 1318968011 963925 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :EgoBot? :/ < 1318968015 245587 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Come on, EgoBot. < 1318968015 393953 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: well your translation I meant < 1318968017 234928 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can do it. < 1318968020 507539 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well,* < 1318968028 786242 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!c printf("hello\n"); < 1318968032 774584 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is slow < 1318968041 811766 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :!help < 1318968042 299527 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​help: General commands: !help, !info, !bf_txtgen. See also !help languages, !help userinterps. You can get help on some commands by typing !help . < 1318968045 696666 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Ritchie left EgoBot. < 1318968045 843446 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe? < 1318968047 349815 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :Egobot? :D < 1318968055 55949 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :!help languages < 1318968055 388376 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​languages: Esoteric: 1l 2l adjust asm axo bch befunge befunge98 bf bf8 bf16 bf32 boolfuck cintercal clcintercal dimensifuck glass glypho haskell kipple lambda lazyk linguine malbolge pbrain perl qbf rail rhotor sadol sceql trigger udage01 underload unlambda whirl. Competitive: bfjoust fyb. Other: asm c cxx forth sh. < 1318968058 639118 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!c printf("SAY HELLO TO CITRIAL OR DIE\n"); < 1318968066 557291 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!c int main() { printf("SAY HELLO TO CITRIAL OR DIE\n"); } < 1318968072 422185 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!sh echo PLS < 1318968075 882478 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh, I thought you were pinging me there < 1318968078 106046 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm something fishy going on here < 1318968079 859560 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: OK, maybe HackEgo just doesn't like you. < 1318968081 881487 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, EgoBot. < 1318968088 100206 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but actually, Vorpal did via EgoBot < 1318968097 104355 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi citiral, btw < 1318968098 81292 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I did !help < 1318968101 983838 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I know < 1318968102 130536 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> cycle "we have lambdabot too" < 1318968103 88872 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : "we have lambdabot toowe have lambdabot toowe have lambdabot toowe have lam... < 1318968104 804229 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a ping on "INTERCAL" < 1318968106 598646 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT? I wanted to install GTA IV, and now it just prompts me with: Your system is incompatible with GTA IV. Please follow the following link: www.microsoft.com. o.O < 1318968107 373624 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: could be that language interpreters are broken < 1318968110 471440 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen test < 1318968115 57162 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​61 +++++++++++++[>+>+++++++++>++++++++><<<<-]>>-.>---.<-.+.<---. [32] < 1318968119 195162 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is one botty channel. < 1318968120 973055 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!sh echo yay < 1318968123 115365 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1318968123 265053 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: does that actually link to Microsoft's homepage? < 1318968126 90934 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmmph. < 1318968128 478718 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so, it doesn't seem particularly useful < 1318968135 45638 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure, it doesn't want to open the link. < 1318968147 542067 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it even try? < 1318968151 91056 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :Strange, considering I played gtaIV on my pc yesterday. < 1318968153 655493 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it just the URL of Microsoft's homepage underlined? < 1318968156 950117 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It isn't very confident in its suggestion. < 1318968161 646935 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I played it a few days ago. < 1318968163 748256 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't do shit. It just sits there, mocking me. < 1318968165 991349 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like... ah... maybe don't click that. < 1318968201 291113 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is kind of fun, but gets boring quickly, you have to play the god damn storyline to unlock the whole map for screwing around in < 1318968206 604916 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf +++++++++++++[>+>+++++++++>++++++++><<<<-]>>-.>---.<-.+.<---. < 1318968210 745988 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might be protecting me from getting too little sleep. < 1318968215 27323 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral, how did you come across isometric programming languages? < 1318968220 36651 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then you end up with friends you need to hang out with regularly or they stop liking you < 1318968223 788393 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: I can vouch for the redundancy of sle;a'sldgfhgbn.,n < 1318968248 713396 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^bf +++++++++++++[>+>+++++++++>++++++++><<<<-]>>-.>---.<-.+.<---. < 1318968248 889376 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :test. < 1318968250 190514 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :My dad told me about shakespearian. I got interested and googled it. And then I found a source of awesomness. < 1318968255 476562 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot wins < 1318968255 697470 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ( list-tail ' ( 1 2 3 < 1318968267 827954 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral, you don't live in Hexham, do you? < 1318968270 849535 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aha, if I run it in windowsXP compatibility mode, it does get to install. < 1318968275 915467 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: Oh god please no. < 1318968279 361065 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :I live in Belgium. < 1318968279 507827 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I couldn't take it. < 1318968282 675513 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's worth finding out quickly < 1318968284 802141 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, no0t Hexham < 1318968286 120260 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But do you live in Hexham, Belgium? < 1318968286 449779 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh good, crisis averted < 1318968297 174249 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I live in overrepen, Belgium. < 1318968297 501753 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: there are two Hexhamers in the channel; everyone was very surprised < 1318968298 921402 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: it runs fine under windows 7 pro (64-bit) for me < 1318968301 793324 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, I have it on good authority that Belgium doesn't actually exist. < 1318968304 424591 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :This could be a cover. < 1318968313 492494 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION greps /hexham/ on http://zapatopi.net/belgium/ < 1318968323 316037 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had an illegal copy, which installed just fine, now I purchased it to play online, and it doesn't work... < 1318968324 133295 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :not on windows atm though. I prefer linux normally < 1318968326 285448 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh the irony. < 1318968332 878118 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1318968361 500155 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hope installing it in compatibily mode doesn't screw with some registery entries. < 1318968368 737918 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :first result for "belgium hexham" is http://www.hexhamcourant.co.uk/news/news-at-a-glance/belgium-driver-s-wrong-turn-sparks-rescue-drama-1.764838?referrerPath=news/news-at-a-glance < 1318968372 600623 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :warning: sets tens of cookies < 1318968387 383048 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Courant is the best source for useless news ever. < 1318968387 877838 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does Firefox not have a "deny for session" option? < 1318968397 791313 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I don't want the first cookie, I probably don't want the second cookie either < 1318968400 98835 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :3/win 7 < 1318968405 186661 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: right, I forgot that you probably new it existed < 1318968408 613610 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*knew < 1318968423 542935 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did write the silent k the first time round, just put it on the wrong word < 1318968433 205089 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then forgot to re-add it after deleting it < 1318968434 522298 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kcourant. < 1318968449 947574 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds like a KDE app. < 1318968480 365549 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesnt kanything that karbitrarily kstart with k ksound like a kde app? < 1318968494 741163 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmaybe. < 1318968548 737420 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : why does Firefox not have a "deny for session" option? <-- you mean the thing where you get a stack of "deny cookie?" from the same site? Utterly annoying that. < 1318968553 733811 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :what actually causes it? < 1318968576 976586 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, even if I select to remember the deny they are actually all opened before I get to click < 1318968577 206705 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Firefox devs just not imagining that someone who wants to specifically allow/deny cookies might not want to save the preference for future sessoins < 1318968578 687780 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sessions < 1318968583 301852 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just as bad with the allow options < 1318968593 818447 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :funbot! < 1318968596 129557 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just that I'm more likely to allow cookies from a site permanently than once < 1318968598 433958 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Post 1, 2, 3: on x86-64, an int is generally 4 bits wide, just like on a regular x86 system." < 1318968607 280072 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot! < 1318968607 694521 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: do you have < 1318968610 729407 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Windows, clearly < 1318968612 551964 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that is not the issue for me. I'm talking about where you get a whole stack of cookie windows *at once* so you have to click through every one of them < 1318968621 397288 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yep, the famous four-bit Windows??? < 1318968623 691133 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that happens on both cases to me too < 1318968632 959726 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the 8086 isn't actually a 4-bit processor < 1318968637 344635 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I don't think Windows runs on a 4086 < 1318968637 965320 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is really annoying < 1318968640 149258 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I may have just invented < 1318968644 346611 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :4004 for the win 8-D < 1318968654 848269 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: extra annoying is that all the windows are modal < 1318968659 604570 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and sometimes don't open in the right order < 1318968662 561784 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: relative firefox yeah < 1318968665 214949 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you have to figure out which one you have to click on first < 1318968669 176839 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I wonder if there's any 4004 emulators. < 1318968669 860354 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: EgoBot is borken okthxbye < 1318968678 953491 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: they open right on top for me < 1318968692 205497 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: same for me, but sometimes they open right on top in the wrong order < 1318968696 838752 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so uh, if they were modal I couldn't handle it. Since they don't show up in the task bar either < 1318968701 120722 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you have to move them so as to find which one you have to click on next < 1318968703 612722 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're application-modal < 1318968704 174638 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, modal in wrong order I mean < 1318968706 61906 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not system-modal < 1318968710 349038 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a big difference between befunge-93 and -98? < 1318968715 957493 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: yes < 1318968724 462734 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :-98 is a much larger language; -93 is more of a toy < 1318968725 285568 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :How big is big? < 1318968743 389329 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, -98 has massive library support (for an esolang) < 1318968744 511322 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :huge < 1318968752 258419 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a -93 interpreter can be done in about two, three pages of code < 1318968753 888056 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the only things that should be system modal would be dialogues like "are you sure you want to log out" or "enter password to open package manager" < 1318968755 241591 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :befunge-98 probably has the best library support of any esolang < 1318968759 179239 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-98 takes a thousand lines in just about any language < 1318968761 157264 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and -98 is pretty hard to implement < 1318968761 491646 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's before fingerprints < 1318968767 789722 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and those thousand lines are going to be wrong the first fifty times < 1318968779 938777 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I disagree about either of those < 1318968780 756445 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :-98 is a general-purpose programming language used for vital business logic of dozens of Fortune-500 companies. -93 is only used by Google. < 1318968791 860886 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : -98 takes a thousand lines in just about any language <-- cfunge is about 10000 lines iirc < 1318968795 297506 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in particular, log out confirmation dialog boxes, I often quickly do things in the background while they're open < 1318968802 384979 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: C isn't a language, and I said before fingerprints. < 1318968814 698310 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ah < 1318968815 422659 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Is it possible to overclock this CPU to achieve higher speeds? General Heed (talk) 18:10, 28 August 2010 (UTC)" --[[Talk:Intel 4004]] < 1318968819 15549 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh well, let's try IRP first then. < 1318968824 103028 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh dear < 1318968829 537239 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1318968837 957815 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: just so you know, #irp exists as a honeypot for redditors < 1318968838 453164 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: lol < 1318968843 898390 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it took me a while to figure this out, incidentally < 1318968845 669651 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also first 10 times unless you written a befunge-98 interpreter in another language before < 1318968864 35713 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :strangely, it spontaneously ended up fulfilling its original purpose, as some people mistook it for a channel about IRP and idled there, ready to act as an interp < 1318968864 182382 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I mean, doing efunge was quite easy. I did end up redoing the funge space representation. That was about it. < 1318968871 916290 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :Please write an befunge-98 interpreter please. < 1318968874 908394 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :a* < 1318968878 236063 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :citiral: ~/Code/shiro < 1318968893 523938 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are quite a lot of befunge-98 interps around nowadays < 1318968897 67968 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: A three-gigaherz 4004. < 1318968902 95962 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and thanks to Deewiant's efforts in compliance testing, some of them even work < 1318968904 570546 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Liquid nitrogen cooled. < 1318968914 887929 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ...to a different spec than is written :P < 1318968917 212144 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I got to go. < 1318968921 476358 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye, see you later < 1318968926 585746 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye, see you NEVER. < 1318968929 559670 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everyone gets one visit to this chanenl. < 1318968930 873146 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ONE < 1318968937 806895 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, watch me! < 1318968943 247091 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: BAAAAAN < 1318968949 803170 :citiral!~ThaMan@d54C0A684.access.telenet.be PART :#esoteric < 1318968958 64235 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I've seen nothing in citiral's behaviour that would make me want to ban him/her < 1318968966 682498 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :al: https://launchpad.net/cfunge < 1318968968 281086 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1318968971 947268 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks al < 1318968973 942384 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I removed that line < 1318968984 7819 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I managed to delete half the line then hit enter < 1318968988 405411 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it remove some from the front < 1318968991 112579 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1318969004 465908 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a bit behind, but I once made a befunge-93 interpreter in /Scratch/ < 1318969006 945295 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, I assumed you were pinging yourself for a moment < 1318969013 40669 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when I realised "citiral" also ended "al" < 1318969017 609120 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: right < 1318969018 152312 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: ouch < 1318969020 499471 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: And 48 gigabytes of RAM. (The best thing to have in a thing with a 12-bit address bus.) < 1318969024 254237 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is Scratch? < 1318969030 71257 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you have anything vaguely corresponding to source-code, that's actually human-readable? < 1318969032 470386 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Smalltalk VM < 1318969035 444758 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318969035 729818 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Educational programming language aimed at under 12 < 1318969045 622454 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, no, that's Squeak < 1318969045 945163 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: what has 48 GB RAM? < 1318969063 150847 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The 3-gigahertz 4004. < 1318969083 295244 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1318969089 396620 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(actually laughed out loud) < 1318969091 556907 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: fungot runs on a 3GHz 4004, doesn't it? < 1318969091 971530 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: apart from the windows 95 and 98 setup cds < 1318969103 129350 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as it isn't an AOL CD < 1318969105 276829 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :remember those? < 1318969121 885248 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :never saw one in real life. But they became rather infamous I seem to remember. < 1318969127 515523 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I have seen one < 1318969127 864822 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :AOL /CD/s? Try AOL floppies. < 1318969135 568348 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318969139 245676 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah, I'm trying to remember the password that was printed on it, now < 1318969155 472967 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think half of it was "CLENCH", it was two capitalised dictionary words separated by a hyphen < 1318969166 353030 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::o < 1318969191 61498 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :They had ISP CDs here, though not AOL. I don't think there were too many for-free floppies, though you did use to get a software floppy with the contract. < 1318969198 620570 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :PELVIC-CLENCH? < 1318969207 828182 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott/Ngevd: is the Hexham Courant a serious newspaper? < 1318969212 117744 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1318969212 264418 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1318969222 668207 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, good to know < 1318969222 922133 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: serious as Hexam. < 1318969240 450628 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :+h < 1318969248 882509 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hehxam? < 1318969252 510311 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hexamh? < 1318969255 148959 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hHexam? < 1318969258 588511 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember the ISP floppies that came with the first modem my parents had < 1318969281 798250 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :it had Netscape 2 for mac, PPP software for mac os 6 and mac os 7 and such things < 1318969288 27991 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eudora too < 1318969298 960850 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know when I was young, I was confused by all the companies that assumed that people's TVs and computers were in the same room as their telephones < 1318969309 344230 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember running backwards and forwards across the house with a sheet of paper full of numbers < 1318969310 727633 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember our EUnet floppy came with at least a Trumpet Winsock copy, Mosaic 1-or-2.something, and some really random utilities. < 1318969321 548452 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in order to do Microsoft's telephone activation service thing for Windows < 1318969323 891160 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: even older heh < 1318969344 813038 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that must have been recently < 1318969353 83644 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The first time I used a computer would have been... < 1318969353 230326 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not use online activation < 1318969354 802124 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: early XP < 1318969356 862250 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1998-9 ish? < 1318969360 216210 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no internet connection, obviously < 1318969368 639315 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It had a CLI < 1318969371 189351 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: by the time of xp and no dialup even? < 1318969372 446400 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1318969377 312552 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was in our garage < 1318969383 502835 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I /still/ have no Internet connection at home < 1318969396 33385 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: heh < 1318969409 339648 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: why? < 1318969410 618217 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm kind-of surprised you didn't notice < 1318969418 36646 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: range of possible answers < 1318969425 231376 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I don't want one" is true, but badly explained < 1318969442 8569 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I thought you finally had one. Must have confused you with some other person. < 1318969458 50092 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :finally got one* < 1318969458 278820 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It was the only Internet connection I've had that had the opportunity to make a "local call": you could sign a cheaper contract (something like 17p/min as opposed to 22p/min) for a connection that blackhole-routed everything going outside Finland. < 1318969460 635922 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have one at work < 1318969467 524888 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm not currently at work, although I am currently online < 1318969473 186113 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: heh < 1318969477 620209 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that's amazing < 1318969478 918781 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I assume you didn't? < 1318969500 335415 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : and I'm not currently at work, although I am currently online <-- so where are you then? < 1318969500 845824 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can understand "blackhole everything we don't have a peering agreement with" < 1318969506 809114 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :wifi hotspot? < 1318969507 288869 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: neither at work nor at home < 1318969512 426517 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, not a public connection < 1318969518 639125 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I borrow from friends, mostly < 1318969528 31665 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1318969539 613296 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah, you should try to borrow from neighbours. Then you could get internet at home < 1318969546 187781 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, I think it was mostly meant e.g. for folks that only wanted Internet to connect to their company network. < 1318969555 109189 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: with their permission… < 1318969560 157512 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: obviously < 1318969573 848453 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :come to think of it, I'm the only person who actually knows how to find out the password on the connection < 1318969576 799966 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, well, I don't know. There wasn't *that* much of a web. < 1318969586 23140 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody knows it off by heart because it's long and random hexadecimal < 1318969586 173687 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that is why you would try to become friends with some suitable neighbours. < 1318969592 556263 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the computer has it memorized < 1318969597 230786 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah < 1318969605 260845 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :that tends to be the case < 1318969607 888986 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Presumably you could still send "international" email and read Usenet and so on. < 1318969608 842632 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is it WEP? < 1318969611 395093 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : "I don't want one" is true, but badly explained < 1318969618 797113 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: WPA1 < 1318969629 247045 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: okay, then it would take a while to find out I guess < 1318969631 823857 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so not actually secure, but not as bad as WEP, and a max-length password helps a bit < 1318969656 829435 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1318969662 209549 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really wish my access point at home supported WPA 2 Enterprise, I have to settle for WPA2 < 1318969670 324925 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: back < 1318969700 994678 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I don't have a real solution for you, but there's some things in the log. < 1318969703 579982 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: it seems your answer scrolled off variable: If you just don't specify "index" at all, it'll plot them all as separate lines just fine, but all the lines will be with the same color and have just one title. ---> first thing I see < 1318969706 650645 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :WPA2 PSK* < 1318969713 26085 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION could easily change the format though < 1318969722 435703 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: what about the logs? < 1318969735 287368 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as linked in the topic) < 1318969743 428891 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1318969744 589259 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION forgot < 1318969751 139237 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: or your local logs of course < 1318969772 763820 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't log this channel because its logged itself :) < 1318969777 919907 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1318969800 311467 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm looking < 1318969872 7445 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Search for "variable:"; all the stuff is pretty much grouped together there, near before what you last saw. < 1318969881 928724 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :mkay < 1318969909 970818 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I also have a hg checkout of the logs apparently < 1318969927 401062 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: nice < 1318969946 665737 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I have my logs in a local postgresql db for this channel (not for other channels though) < 1318969951 165130 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :useful for useless statistics < 1318969957 949101 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and quick searching < 1318969962 252039 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I've been meaning to get that set up < 1318969982 334319 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Anyway, the inability to only make multiple data series out of separate things physically listed in the "plot" command (as opposed to "all datasets in a multi-dataset file") is an annoying limitation of gnuplot; it might be circumventable, but I don't quite know how. Personally I've sometimes just manually listed things in the plot script, and at other times generated the plot script along with the data. < 1318969986 738678 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: ask fizzie for some useful scripts. Pulls from the old clog archive rather than Gregor's archive though < 1318970000 173678 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :mkay < 1318970014 418687 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless he updated his scripts < 1318970027 718413 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I don't mind changing how the data gets formatted. I basically need to be able to plot how my modifications to the simulator help or hurt < 1318970154 996440 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh - no hg logs of today :( < 1318970161 538737 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks at topic < 1318970202 462818 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Yes, well, changing the datafile format only gets you so far. You can get the lines you want, but with a single "plot 'blah.dat' using ..." command, it's always going to end up being a single data series, so (a) all the lines get the same style (though there is a hack to give them different colors), and more importantly (b) they will have only one entry in the key/legend thing. < 1318970238 120153 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I could use multiple 'plot' lines I guess? < 1318970240 457055 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:13:25: variable: It is awfully tricky to get multiple lines (with different titles) using only a single plot specifier. You almost get it if you separate the datasets (in your case, different testnames) with two newlines and then plot the complete file, but in that case all the lines end up in the same style. It is trivial if you don't mind doing "plot 'blah.data' ... index 0, 'blah.data' ... index 1, ..." with one command per each line, but that re < 1318970240 603916 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :quires either fixin < 1318970240 604123 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:13:25: g the number of lines, or generating the plotscript along with the data. Here's an example of what that might look like: http://p.zem.fi/meud < 1318970247 798177 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :That paste has an example of that sort of thing. < 1318970251 657077 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yeah reading < 1318970267 771373 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://p.zem.fi/meud < 1318970296 628713 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(An autogenerated random four-character name from the alphabet [0-9a-z], IIRC.) < 1318970298 922314 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: let me put slightly differently. Given that I have this set of data what would be the "correct" thing to do ? < 1318970388 829594 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Uh, well. Modifying your script to print out "foo.data" and then "foo.plot" so you can just run "gnuplot foo.plot" is a reasonable solution, if not the prettiest. Of course there are other tools to plot things. A Pythonist might consider matplotlib, which is nice except it has a bit of a clunky interface. < 1318970447 508015 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It half-assedly tries to emulate MATLAB's plotting tools for some unfathomable reason.) < 1318970491 49492 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I was planning on using this into a "let me learn gnuplot" but yeah, other tools might work work < 1318970508 504709 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :which tool do you find best / easiest for plotting benchmark data ? < 1318970551 320255 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I've never tried that using anything other than INTERCAL < 1318970576 283067 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: o.O < 1318970585 211442 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I've never tried that using INTERCAL either < 1318970586 649132 :pikhq_!~pikhq@174-22-150-30.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1318970598 79332 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so I assumed :) < 1318970639 185095 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, well. I tend to default to gnuplot for one-off things. I'd consider matplotlib if the script to deal with the data happened to already be in Python, since in that case it'd be a natural-ish fit. And, well... if the output was going in a LaTeX document, I might go with TikZ's plotting tools. And if the output was designed for web, I might go with Protovis or d3 or something. < 1318970646 773627 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :With other things I'm not so familiar. < 1318970658 391285 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: output is going to latex < 1318970694 434747 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :oooh < 1318970697 277608 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :TikZ looks nice < 1318970717 256457 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's more of a graphics library than plotting library, but it can be (ab)used for plots too. < 1318970739 343403 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.texample.net/tikz/examples/line-plot-example/ < 1318970742 333122 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly what I want < 1318970747 102324 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ with a different scale ] < 1318970803 921056 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes, but that's got the different plotted series explicitly listed in there. If you're willing to do that, it's possible to use GNUplot. Though TikZ is nice in that there's absolutely no work in getting the output into the LaTeX doc; it's already there. < 1318970812 457356 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Away for a moment now. < 1318970845 124238 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'd prefer to have the data in an external file < 1318970849 419173 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it isn't critical < 1318970910 716333 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: now you should try plotting with intercal < 1318970957 908965 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :generate a bmp file or something. If you have byte IO (iirc there is some intercal extension for that in c-intercal?). < 1318970996 336414 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, and an incompatible one in CLC-INTERCAL < 1318971004 198339 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1318971009 318946 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I forgot how they work. < 1318971016 733930 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wasn't one based on the delta or some such? < 1318971018 417735 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You can use external files with TikZ too.) < 1318971050 37839 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the C-INTERCAL idea is, that all the possible bytes are written on a circular tape, and you have to work out how many positions to move it < 1318971054 987082 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's effectively delta < 1318971062 152226 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and the CLC one? < 1318971063 863937 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that one of input/output, I forget which, uses the other side of the tape < 1318971066 340649 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you have to reverse bits < 1318971067 261034 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: mkay. I'm taking a closer look then < 1318971073 924445 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the CLC one is hard to easily explain < 1318971079 962435 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: give it a try? < 1318971087 963684 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(please) < 1318971113 591127 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://smuggle.intercal.org.uk/manual/input_output.html#binary < 1318971122 752923 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1318971222 616320 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-150-30.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1318971266 438335 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The current implementation does not check that the padding is sufficiently random, although this might well change in future." < 1318971268 95983 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1318971272 824797 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :all ones is random < 1318971318 641002 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway that IO system is in some ways crazier than the c-intercal one, and in other ways saner than it. < 1318971339 26404 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're both stateful IIRC < 1318971352 463892 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, maybe I misunderstood the thing then < 1318971364 699107 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe I did < 1318971380 535612 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a reason CLC-INTERCAL binary IO isn't implemented in C-INTERCAL < 1318971383 972375 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway C-INTERCAL has another byte IO. The cfunge stuff could probably be used for that. Forgot how you sent values between them though < 1318971424 218163 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Baudot doesn't have 256 different codepoints < 1318971437 600429 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well of course? < 1318971445 991477 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I looked at the binary IO section < 1318971458 972407 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alphanumeric I/O is different < 1318971462 588120 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and mentions baudot < 1318971484 248642 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: or is baudot involved in the IFFI stuff? < 1318971496 6382 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, no < 1318971501 458408 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can FFI to something with a sensible stdout < 1318971507 538545 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :C would probably make more sense than Funge-98 < 1318971512 73458 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah < 1318971544 643098 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: cfunge has quite a sensible stdout and stdin though. Same sort of saneness as brainfuck mostly < 1318971555 171241 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1318971570 356460 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm including funges as "things with a sensible stdout" < 1318971585 686685 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: http://smuggle.intercal.org.uk/manual/input_output.html#numeric mentions ick and sick? Is that ick a different one than the C-INTERCAL one? < 1318971589 885074 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so, how confusing < 1318971608 760665 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it's C-INTERCAL it's referring to there < 1318971652 758810 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1318971659 826324 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I guess "if it is ick or 1972, you get the overline like C-INTERCAL does" confused me. It sounded like "ick does the same as C-INTERCAL does" which would be kind of pointless to say if ick *was* C-INTERCAL < 1318971661 368594 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1318971684 760412 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, CLC-INTERCAL has a C-INTERCAL emulation mode < 1318971688 509735 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318971692 578885 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is also called ick < 1318971692 725594 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes more sense < 1318971706 117860 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :C-INTERCAL has a CLC-INTERCAL emulation mode called -X < 1318971710 19714 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it installs that as a binary name? < 1318971713 299535 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1318971713 812225 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :or as a parameter? < 1318971715 196041 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318971715 384266 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :preload name < 1318971720 222493 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh? < 1318971729 472227 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1318971733 77669 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: to answer that I'd have to explain how CLC-INTERCAL works < 1318971741 272681 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I'm really not up to right now < 1318971747 968472 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh you mean the stuff that it is kind of like non-time reversed feather? < 1318971750 393783 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1318971757 420666 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, time traveling* < 1318971780 338744 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm actually not sure if that's involved or not < 1318971788 119319 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :time travel? < 1318971789 234890 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not because I'm unaware of how CLC-INTERCAL works, I just can't figure it out < 1318971794 998861 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, self-modification < 1318971802 501422 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you said it was doing that < 1318971803 288096 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1318971813 888416 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :like it started out as a perl script and turned into intercal at the end < 1318971816 155159 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1318971823 328189 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1318971832 322927 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :think of the perl script as a VM < 1318971835 925150 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1318971836 600091 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that runs IACC programs < 1318971841 293680 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes, now I remember < 1318971847 410887 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :IACC is capable of self-modifying itself into INTERCAL < 1318971848 462909 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :was ages ago I last looked into it < 1318971863 973589 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so then self modification is clearly involved < 1318971899 6146 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1318971907 101448 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but self-modification doesn't necessarily have anything to do with Feather < 1318971914 921528 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1318971930 202752 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a question: does anyone know why it was implemented like that? It seems a fairly stupid way to do it. Over-complicated. Is that perhaps the reason? < 1318971956 524310 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :partly for flexibility < 1318971967 938625 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, the IACC interp is also written in IACC, incidentally < 1318971973 528794 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1318971980 388284 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so CLC-INTERCAL ships with iacc.iacc because otherwise you could never get started < 1318972016 846337 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you say IACC interpreter? Wouldn't it compile to bytecode? Or what role does the perl vm play? < 1318972033 156701 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, a preload is an iacc file that gets compiled/run (there isn't much of a distinction between the two in CLC-INTERCAL) before the program is compiled < 1318972042 618321 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1318972065 309172 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: don't try to make a distinction between "compile" and "run" in CLC-INTERCAL, you won't get very far < 1318972070 411802 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1318972078 467445 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it JTLs < 1318972086 974441 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :JTL? < 1318972087 686635 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a bit like JITting, except more confusing < 1318972093 151943 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh too late < 1318972095 27004 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I remember < 1318972117 78422 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, the iacc.iacc must be executed by *something* able to interpret it. You can't escape that. < 1318972120 929949 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but basically, the compiler mostly only runs at runtime < 1318972137 148596 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, it's iacc.io that gets shipped < 1318972141 942396 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318972145 317235 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the iacc compiler compiled, by itself, to bytecode < 1318972149 117344 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1318972153 247128 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes far more sense < 1318972155 522922 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the bytecode mostly consists of commands to run the compiler, IIRC < 1318972214 395027 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this sort of thing explains how nobody knows how CLC-INTERCAL handles operator precedence, incidentally; I ran a few tests on it to try to determine it experimentally, but I can't remember the results) < 1318972234 628344 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not even the author? < 1318972248 783479 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep; he thought he did once, but then changed his mind < 1318972266 493064 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides, you need the same operator precedence as the original intercal. Or stuff wouldn't work < 1318972272 954027 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that trivially gives the answer < 1318972290 642666 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: have you /seen/ the operator precedence table in the original INTERCAL? < 1318972296 9372 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: nope < 1318972297 171959 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me < 1318972303 618001 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is it not there? < 1318972305 295741 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me find it < 1318972315 334896 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is one, but it's empty < 1318972323 179243 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah... < 1318972333 318895 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so what operator precedence does it in fact use? < 1318972351 120733 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :some tests on the original should help there < 1318972363 646849 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.catb.org/~esr/intercal/intercal.ps page 11 < 1318972373 699395 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, the original mostly isn't available < 1318972388 546064 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone came on alt.lang.intercal once to say that they still had a paper copy of it, which they were willing to scan in < 1318972390 698674 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it never happened < 1318972394 132730 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98AKFQkaWJM < 1318972397 521812 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :my region of the country < 1318972402 738830 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :has a lot of excellent individuals. < 1318972406 339052 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :C-INTERCAL's precedences are the same as the ones experimentally determined from CLC-INTERCAL < 1318972407 672635 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :bright young lads. < 1318972411 959400 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: right. < 1318972423 943785 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the general advice is to always use explicit sparkears so that it doesn't matter < 1318972429 374428 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what about example programs from the original? < 1318972439 649955 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the manual < 1318972441 825715 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they always use explict sparkears < 1318972444 823122 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318972455 962797 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe there wasn't any precedence ? < 1318972480 159858 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1318972487 495700 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: if I was the sort of person who generally facepalmed, I would be facepalming right now < 1318972497 856099 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it indeed doesn't have precedence, that's the point < 1318972505 446041 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does not explain what #1~#2~#3 means, though < 1318972535 607839 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(oh, and IIRC, C-INTERCAL doesn't have precedence, just associativity) < 1318972566 805475 :ive!~nn@189.179.247.113 QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1318972570 261819 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in that all operators are in the same precedence band if they have the same arity) < 1318972757 619640 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1318972795 676292 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : it does not explain what #1~#2~#3 means, though <-- it might, depending on the parser. If it was something similar to yacc maybe they just let shift/reduce sort it out? < 1318972821 812957 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :was yacc around in 1972? < 1318972835 693316 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no idea. But I said "something similar to" < 1318972858 128727 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and what language was the original written in? < 1318972864 5117 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :SPITBOL < 1318972883 615800 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm not sure if even C was around in 1972, incidentally) < 1318972907 641306 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, were there any parser generators for SPITBOL? < 1318972926 573467 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how should I know? < 1318972961 622418 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you knew what the language in use was, you knew more than me, you might have known. I had no indication you didn't know until your reply < 1318972989 729191 :Ngevd!~Taneb@2.99.90.255 QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1318973046 723959 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318973371 570262 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought snobol was essentially the first parsing language, or something like that < 1318973390 344033 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(spitbol is an implementation of it) < 1318973548 332970 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :"SNOBOL4 patterns subsume BNF grammars, which are equivalent to context-free grammars and more powerful than regular expressions." < 1318973549 389102 :ive!~nn@189.179.247.113 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318973683 524203 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-150-30.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: C was 1973, so. :) < 1318973695 789753 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty close < 1318973708 223381 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, INTERCAL predating C is pretty hard to imagine < 1318973708 495432 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-150-30.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though, of course, its ancestry goes back a bit further. < 1318973730 193481 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-150-30.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not like Thompson and Ritchie got together one day in 1973 and went "Let's make C", and it was so. < 1318973730 770928 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :any idea why C became so popular? < 1318973731 633737 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, I assume INTERCAL was around at the same time as B, in that case < 1318973735 386356 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: UNIX < 1318973748 792384 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1318973789 881231 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A SNOBOL pattern can be very simple or extremely complex. A simple pattern is just a text string (e.g. "ABCD"), but a complex pattern may be a large structure describing, for example, the complete grammar of a computer language. It is possible to implement a language interpreter in SNOBOL almost directly from a Backus-Naur form expression of it, with few changes. Creating a macro assembler and an interpreter for a completely theoretical piece of hardwa < 1318973814 600731 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: sounds surprisingly like Perl 6 regexen < 1318973817 766866 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hardware could take as little as a few hundred lines, with a new instruction being added with a single line. < 1318973874 295886 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well of course, completely theoretical hardware is often easier to implement than practical hardware < 1318973880 715015 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's mostly invented by mathematicians < 1318973943 648297 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: more like discovered. bahahahahahaha. < 1318973955 124189 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I would say invented too.) < 1318973960 247687 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION swats CakeProphet -----### < 1318974128 850667 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :"That made it clear that we needed another name!! We sat and talked and drank coffee and shot rubber bands and after much too much time someone said -- most likely Ralph -- "We don't have a Snowball chance in hell of finding a name". All of us yelled at once, "WE GOT IT -- SNOBOL" in the spirit of all the BOL languages. We then stretched our mind to find what it stood for." < 1318974148 26209 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I'm sure that's how it happened < 1318974156 215702 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they were all just "SNOBOL!!!!" spelled just like that. < 1318974270 260249 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1318974522 233707 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good? < 1318974533 360789 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :good? < 1318974536 735789 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :good < 1318974538 463671 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :good is good < 1318974540 899068 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1318974541 915436 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1318974936 740335 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: do you allow beholders as PCs in your campaigns? < 1318974973 649588 :hagb4rd2!~perdito@koln-4db4e8fb.pool.mediaWays.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1318975255 682872 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: I would if I could determine the level adjustment to use. < 1318975276 180044 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But normally I do not, because no level adjustment is listed. < 1318975412 502584 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do *you* allow it? < 1318975536 720359 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't play D&D, so... < 1318975548 453174 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I played a hack and slash MUD where beholders were playable characters, and enjoyed playing a beholder, so... < 1318975553 715005 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's something I'd possibly enjoy in D&D < 1318975581 350923 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I am not the DM of the anyways, however. < 1318975604 7659 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it is not permitted normally because there is no level adjustment specified. < 1318975672 392226 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(However, in Icosahedral RPG, all creatures have the number of pseudolevels specified) < 1318975719 874405 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I would assume it would be because they're abberations and thus don't traditionally fit the whole adventurer model. < 1318975722 618668 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-150-30.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: It's actually entirely feasible to play races without named level adjustments. < 1318975755 96709 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-150-30.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: The hit die simply become levels in the race. < 1318975806 762870 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: like, what reason would a beholder have for being in a campaign with traditional D&D characters? < 1318975807 297759 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: No LA is different from LA=0 (all races in player's handbook implicitly have LA=0) < 1318975853 197502 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Use your imagination! It doesn't matter if they are aberrations or not. I myself play monster character; but always by LA. < 1318975858 28215 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: unless, of course, it was a non-standard beholder. < 1318975859 999077 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-150-30.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Still, you can fudge it easy. < 1318975886 558100 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes, the book Savage Species has ideas about determining what the LA value should be. < 1318975895 198588 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-150-30.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, right, that's the book. < 1318975905 67671 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-150-30.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good stuff. < 1318975914 610256 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :disintegrate objects, transmute flesh to stone, cause sleep, slow the motion of objects or beings, charm animals, charm humans, cause death, induce fear, levitate objects, and inflict serious wounds < 1318975920 86430 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :cause death, that's a good magical power. < 1318975929 3381 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume levitate is how they move. < 1318975935 90435 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-150-30.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup! < 1318975946 642217 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It depends what version. < 1318975979 948011 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I recall in the MUD I played instead of wield weapons with limbs like most races you use the levitation eye. < 1318975986 246898 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*wielding < 1318976018 978267 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :In addition, I invented a feat allowing you to change one magical power to a different one (you must select a the time you select the feat, after which it is permanent) (this feat can also be used with NPC beholders, for example, if the DM makes a strange challenge) < 1318976033 171805 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(There are restrictions on which spells are selectable, though) < 1318976120 639954 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose a Spectator would be the most convincing kind of playable beholder < 1318976124 432440 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they're apparently somewhat friendly. < 1318976233 495891 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: I pick chaotic evil < 1318976236 868750 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1318976257 398556 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fine, pick whatever alignment you want < 1318976279 169763 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: just arguing that non-friendly playable beholder might make sense too < 1318976307 973603 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps if they had an ulterior motive that required them to not eat the party members in their sleep. :P < 1318976311 730628 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, it can; and anyways, individuals also differ, especially player characters since player characters are exceptional anyways < 1318976328 57237 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :which RPG is this anyway? < 1318976355 938650 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Maybe. But it can also be due to having other thing to eat < 1318976399 109872 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :certainly a beholder would have to be non-traditional to be a player character though, since their mindset is to destroy anything that isn't the same kind of beholder as they. < 1318976427 584412 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's fine. that would be interesting. < 1318976434 424899 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Yes; that much would almost always be the case. < 1318976447 655317 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, I get 20 eyestalks. :P < 1318976460 317082 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it is OK since player characters are supposed to be exceptional anyways, so it is OK. < 1318976476 612568 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Actually, to get 20 eyestalks maybe you need to increase the LA then? < 1318976484 704825 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would think so. < 1318976491 677153 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :5 of them are the "cause death" kind. :P < 1318976493 310738 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I suppose it could be valid to do so. < 1318976540 718394 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :4 eyestalks (and the anti-magic center eye) would be a more reasonable level adjustment. < 1318976565 158894 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The level adjustment has to be a number. < 1318976574 163787 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ere, right. I'm saying. < 1318976575 535554 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Such as +4 or +10 or whatever. < 1318976581 108637 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that kind of beholder would have a more reasonable level adustment. < 1318976582 654061 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there is racial HD as well. < 1318976607 853823 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, that is what you are saying; yes I think you are correct. < 1318976618 844280 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, do beholders have classes? does that make sense? < 1318976631 158031 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :They can have classes as much as anyone could, I suppose. < 1318976640 220142 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if racial HD is at least 1, it is not required. < 1318976853 991953 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION imagines a beholder templar. < 1318977034 755649 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :beholder necromancer would be fun. < 1318977274 963848 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1318977388 501576 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I invented a collection of documents for a new campaign setting for D&D 3.5e, with different locations, gods, planes, etc. It also has some rule variants. < 1318977446 116359 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Different classes get different number of action points. There are a few additional penalties for resurrection, but all are suppressed if the caster sacrifices his life; doing so also allows resurrecting nonwilling creatures. < 1318977520 955675 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Time on the Death plane runs at double speed (which is the reason for some of the aging effects of resurrection). The Astral plane is infinite dimensional (in both time and in space), and touches all other planes (both inner and outer) at every point of the Astral plane. The Astral plane counts as neither inner nor outer. < 1318977600 983392 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alignment entries and alignment subtypes of creatures are not used. Any creature is just as likely to be of any alignment as it is of any other. [Making the game more difficult] Exceptions include: * Mindless undead, which never have good alignment * Animals and other creatures with Int<3 or no Int score and have an entry of Always Neutral, which are actually always NN < 1318977609 251119 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Angels, devils, and demons, with alignment subtypes, and have the Outsider type, which use the alignment entries specified (although there are still extremely rare possibilities to change alignment) < 1318977624 934660 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, the alignment listed in the book is what many inexperienced humans who deal with this stuff often believe (it is unknown exactly why this is, however). Spells that detect alignments usually operate on the target's current actions. The aura level for past actions is decreased by 1 every 12 hours. < 1318977642 236239 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some notable groups in the campaign world include: * < 1318977672 667263 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some notable groups in the campaign world include: * The Spanish Inquisition * Librarians Against Monsters * Librarians Against Librarians Against Monsters * Special Artifact Guild * The Ancient Wizard Society < 1318977744 736122 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The prime material plane is the same as the etherial plane indexed 0, while the normal etherial plane is the etherial plane indexed 1. Every one of them has its own shadow plane. < 1318977783 808042 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: oh so this is a comical setting? < 1318977801 902702 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, it is just a new setting. There are a few comical things in it, I suppose. < 1318977813 876786 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: the Monty Python reference above for example < 1318977824 351247 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes it does include one Monty Python reference. < 1318977854 955216 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The rules used, though, can be used with any setting even if you change things such as removing the Monty Python stuff and so on, even though it is standard listed, you are not required to use it. < 1318978090 778267 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually I designed some of the things in the setting based on my Super ASCII MZX Town series of computer games. The Spanish Inquisition is found in both Part I and Part II, while Librarians Against Monsters (and Librarians Against Librarians Against Monsters) is only Part II. < 1318978628 783570 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1318978654 270743 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod NICK :copumpkin_ < 1318978776 47478 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318978811 765568 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1318978909 692484 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1318978934 304736 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 PRIVMSG #esoteric :My PHP professor doesn't know PHP. < 1318978934 798365 :copumpkin_!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod NICK :copumpkin < 1318978961 307636 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 PRIVMSG #esoteric :His example used array_values on a regular array... < 1318978982 72035 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cue arguments between a classmate and him < 1318979036 318823 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, n/m < 1318979064 975360 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1318979080 72671 :SgeoN2!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318979296 858713 :sllide!~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1318979312 367766 :evincar!~jon@acd41302879.wireless.rit.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1318979894 185180 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN2: what do you mean n/m? was it not a regular array? < 1318980033 50659 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1318980183 742931 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, higher order functions in PHP < 1318980185 255469 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :are amazing < 1318980198 457325 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :array_filter($array1, "odd"); < 1318980200 286324 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so good. < 1318980492 335466 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :$n = "array1"; array_filter($$n, "odd"); < 1318980552 27039 :SgeoN2!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1318980582 958291 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318980589 145181 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was processed with aarray_unique < 1318980602 557904 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 PRIVMSG #esoteric :array < 1318980614 416289 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :aamazing < 1318980620 163426 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1318980648 36724 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 JOIN :#esoteric < 1318980964 477098 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@137.125.152.153 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fun fact: array_unique does not renumber indexes < 1318981010 296885 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :here's array_unique in perl. my %seen; @array = grep {!$seen{$_}++} @array < 1318981050 714229 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :except it renumbers indices. < 1318981065 85292 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is mutable (I'm guess array_unique is not?) < 1318981072 17416 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er an immutable operation < 1318981072 988750 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean < 1318981092 854794 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not in-place? what is the term for that. < 1318981133 353364 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :pure < 1318981152 841511 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure that orks. < 1318981154 491120 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :+w < 1318981164 18365 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i hesitate to use that term for the above code < 1318981164 167435 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :except it's... not really pure because it uses a hash table. < 1318981173 694765 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and mutably updates said table < 1318981188 114624 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it just uses an implicit ST monad ;P < 1318981194 905318 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes of course. < 1318981321 948251 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1318981350 882315 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(notice the infection of Haskell mind virus in its final stage. It won't be long before oerjan degenerates into a non-sentient pile of fleshy finger trees.) < 1318981376 207107 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah elliott already did, have you seen that picture? < 1318981386 973240 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, no. < 1318981401 429703 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought something was up < 1318981404 331625 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm afraid i didn't save the link < 1318981404 961655 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's been acting a little strange. < 1318981409 720658 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it's just the teenage hormones. < 1318981448 364231 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log elliot[t]> .*finger tree.*http < 1318981480 375197 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011-05-13.txt:06:20:31: i drew a finger tree http://i.imgur.com/sRyCi.png < 1318981494 966080 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god. < 1318981516 575975 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :tragic. < 1318981533 846040 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks more like a cyclic graph... < 1318981554 885869 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't you mean acyclic, it's a tree after all < 1318981564 813449 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it has fingers pointing downward what's up with that. < 1318981586 42237 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it has cycles, dude. < 1318981600 992391 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :bro. man. < 1318981601 139041 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1318981608 811403 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sir. < 1318981632 613364 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :comrade sir you need to dudechill, bro. < 1318981655 867927 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :jolly good, yo < 1318981657 263911 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :brofessional brogrammers. < 1318981752 235611 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for(@array) { delete $_ if !$seen{$_}++ } < 1318981755 860552 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :would give you the PHP semantics. < 1318981804 554287 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er... < 1318981811 839937 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for(@array) { delete $_ if $seen{$_}++ } < 1318981816 846050 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for(0..$#array) { splice @array, $_, 1 if $seen{$_}++ } < 1318981823 587649 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be inplace and reordering indices. < 1318982149 800940 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://search.cpan.org/~genie/Tie-LazyList-0.05/LazyList.pm < 1318982151 728948 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :weeeeee < 1318982247 504622 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think you really get much out of using that package though. < 1318982320 898645 :derdon!~derdon@p5DE8AEAC.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1318982348 232463 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :REHash is interesting. It lets you find hash keys by regex. < 1318982370 698703 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's... basically just a grep. < 1318982395 83500 :CakeProphet!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, well, a map actually.