< 1313021040 603621 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is coppro even on yet? It seem, that coppro is the only one who even understands what things I am trying to have help with, this programming stuff, etc < 1313021057 309838 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am always around < 1313021114 845501 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro is secretly a brain in a jar. actually _two_ brains in a jar, alternating on sleeping. < 1313021121 625055 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. I was wondering about stuff such as timezone and so on < 1313021132 163539 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But now I checked so that is OK. < 1313021135 283648 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or possibly just one dolphin brain < 1313021211 652143 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: It is this: https://devlabs.linuxassist.net/projects/texnicard/wiki/Dangelo_Programming_Language I have fixed some things and added more examples, in case that will help you to understand better what kind of things I mean. If you want more, ask more. Because, now is not too late in my timezone, last time it was late and I would sleep < 1313021269 289402 :azaq231!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313021313 419435 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1313021400 376497 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: why do we need to sleep why cant we just have two brains < 1313021467 696134 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Try. < 1313021482 845370 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1313021484 28487 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :how < 1313021488 114036 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know. < 1313021491 997650 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :because we are stupid apes and not supreme dolphins < 1313021504 845524 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but we can kill the dolphins if you think that helps. < 1313021548 126554 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt that would help. < 1313021553 556136 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, sleep is how we get our orders from outside the matrix < 1313021571 127212 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also doubt *that* would help. < 1313021662 436132 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Do you understand anything more about this now? Also tell me if someone else knows better < 1313021677 22369 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I apologize, I am busy writing a scholarship application < 1313021682 650873 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I will try to read at some point though < 1313021712 762202 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: OK. Sorry, I didn't know that, but now I know. Thank you for telling me. < 1313021774 752440 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :How long will scholarship application take? < 1313022132 567525 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I'm not sure < 1313022156 533562 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: help which spam language name do i need to do first < 1313022194 612595 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hormel++ < 1313022241 610443 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: help no it has to be one i said i would help < 1313022365 467583 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't recall which ones you said < 1313022416 883427 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric : somehow hormel++ reminded me of http://alefpp.sourceforge.net/ < 1313022436 238934 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :looking at the deletion log, there's one pointing itself out: http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=Incredibly_fascinating_evaluation_of_shopping_cart_software_package_prepared_by_well-known_soccer_professional_or_a_person_known_as_exact_same_as_that_soccer_player < 1313022453 703572 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes < 1313022459 659067 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not sure what that one will be though < 1313022463 704470 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is... < 1313022465 176237 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hard to live up to < 1313022466 891106 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was it that elliott moved into userspace < 1313022480 658869 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :im forget < 1313022493 610916 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it was brutally delted < 1313022502 787611 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont, remmber < 1313022515 337740 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3ALog&type=delete&user=&page= < 1313022520 707509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like, none, < 1313022559 276354 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you took a local copy of it < 1313022562 91111 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least, I told you to < 1313022563 759135 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :User:Ehird/1st year sobriety and no dating < 1313022578 343791 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sober and no dating is what happened to me in my first year < 1313022587 30527 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as I was too preoccupied with other things to get drunk or go dating < 1313022599 125514 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :too occupied with sobrietary < 1313022601 372530 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Move log); 16:53 . . Ehird (Talk | contribs) (1st year sobriety and no dating moved to User:Ehird/1st year sobriety and no dating: for my study) < 1313022608 392508 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(besides, I dislike the taste of alcohol, which means I rarely have much incentive to drink it) < 1313022624 217777 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Talk:1st_year_sobriety_and_no_dating what study hlep < 1313022635 274891 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i sohuld make that language that was like dobela but what it wa in my mind < 1313022637 874775 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i never learned dobela < 1313022649 181561 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats < 1313022651 283989 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :dobele < 1313022660 117275 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :thing < 1313022671 100914 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka made it but thend < 1313022673 918544 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ewaitn rewrote it < 1313022675 856372 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and made it not bad < 1313022678 156418 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :DOt-Based Esoteric LAnguage < 1313022690 967673 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :GROSSE GROSSE dobela has hiden state im fix that < 1313022694 683182 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :GROSSSE < 1313022716 529711 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1313022717 237574 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if < 1313022717 691571 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1313022730 727854 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if I could do non-determinism if I had wires like and maybe.......... < 1313022821 717719 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: do i want wires or no wires < 1313022831 249822 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think wires are more ... interesting?? because that is less like befunge i guess < 1313022867 762211 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: if i accidentally reinvent hardware, sorry < 1313022868 28278 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is thsih epl < 1313022904 55976 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: lanjuaj < 1313022926 101382 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hnelp < 1313022957 952725 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was almos going to type < 1313022963 427233 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is interesting enough to get a real name < 1313022963 770151 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1313022964 277199 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO < 1313022967 42616 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :all my names are spam names now < 1313022967 931541 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :thsih epl was the third emperor of the wey shlow empire of heinan < 1313022982 367508 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: HEY wait < 1313022988 759308 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: are there any repeat vandalism pages lately < 1313022992 10209 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pages you might be wanting to < 1313022992 946370 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lock < 1313022993 839114 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps < 1313023000 402352 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :he was a very heinous emperor < 1313023034 725051 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :last repeat spam I can recall is the List of ideas/Archive < 1313023044 769918 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I had to protect List of ideas/Archive from even registered users < 1313023047 154426 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i cant name al naugaee that < 1313023057 763693 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sillys......... < 1313023086 283798 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yusuf al naugaee, famous kuwaiti general < 1313023155 522696 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: can you nremae list of ideas archive so i can name my language that < 1313023156 721997 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1313023177 619354 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :his name was because he invented armor made of naugahyde < 1313023185 6291 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just call it "Incredibly_fascinating_evaluation_of_shopping_cart_software_package_prepared_by_well-known_soccer_professional_or_a_person_known_as_exact_same_as_that_soccer_player" < 1313023192 853658 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't rename it because then it would start being scammed again < 1313023252 779338 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :scammed < 1313023269 523082 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, spamed < 1313023302 669027 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway that doensnt even abbreviate well......... < 1313023303 926613 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will scour < 1313023305 332332 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the deletion log < 1313023308 102137 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadly naugas went extinct when saddam destroyed the euphrates/tigris delta to punish rebels there < 1313023323 139270 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :->@- < 1313023325 321436 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :->o- < 1313023327 201730 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :->.- < 1313023330 103866 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-.>- < 1313023333 91782 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-o-> < 1313023333 511707 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there's an american company making a synthetic replacement < 1313023333 676861 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :  | < 1313023333 841894 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric : /´\ < 1313023336 782737 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-@- < 1313023337 708712 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh come on < 1313023339 137591 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're all fired < 1313023349 498022 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was an evaluation trace :( < 1313023410 506211 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :>----@---- < 1313023410 779387 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :->---@---- < 1313023410 863416 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-->--@---- < 1313023410 935966 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :--->-@---- < 1313023410 936043 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :---->@---- < 1313023411 223771 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :---->o---- < 1313023412 999147 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :---->.---- < 1313023415 53458 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :----.>---- < 1313023417 119675 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :----o->--- < 1313023417 703448 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :     | < 1313023418 33731 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :    /`\ < 1313023418 539856 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :make it a language with syntax based on myndzi's figures < 1313023419 324364 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :----@-->-- < 1313023421 121491 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :----@--->- < 1313023423 25001 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :----@----> < 1313023425 38596 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :youououre welcome < 1313023486 216150 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no............... < 1313023490 406126 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: did you nderstadnd... the above... < 1313023540 680706 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks TM or CAish < 1313023557 184368 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CAish, basically < 1313023566 670664 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sort of like wireworld maybe?? i don't know wireworld < 1313023568 726621 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but um < 1313023571 660321 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :- is wire < 1313023577 967417 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> moves right on wire < 1313023579 162071 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: `moves'Not in scope: `wire' < 1313023582 750369 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :when > hits into @, it turns into o < 1313023587 157839 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and >s tays still < 1313023590 221507 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(same for all other directions) < 1313023597 282206 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :when > hits o it becomes . in the same manner < 1313023603 278533 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :The most esoteric programming language is Conway's Game of Life < 1313023603 923294 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :when > hits into . they swap places < 1313023606 557495 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :.... < 1313023608 110746 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :when . isn't hit for a cycle it becomes o < 1313023609 429635 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's add IO to that < 1313023612 812800 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :when o isn't hit for a cycle it becomes @ < 1313023613 809748 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ok < 1313023626 889665 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so it is... a delay... < 1313023640 269327 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but one that takes time to reset.... < 1313023665 428900 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :phine < 1313023939 76482 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: pine < 1313023942 503314 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :trees < 1313024010 592520 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :just spruce it up a bit < 1313024181 546029 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :spruce willis < 1313024231 949620 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: whath appens when two little signals bump into each other, with electronics, < 1313024249 765745 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean by "little signal"? and "bump into each other"? < 1313024254 978344 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :electronics signals don't work like that < 1313024287 990339 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: YES THEY DO < 1313024339 543501 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, my answer is that I can't tell you because the question is insignificantly meaningful < 1313024344 206273 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"they merge" is about the best answer I can give < 1313024348 773875 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*insufficiently meaningful < 1313024413 533839 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, one model I was thinking of offers faster-than-light travel, oops < 1313024438 102834 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :???? < 1313024656 981065 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313024718 240978 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1313024992 563785 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1313025191 975761 :cheater_!~ubuntu@e179113220.adsl.alicedsl.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1313027012 662042 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awful quiet, isn't it? < 1313027060 316305 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was noisier earlier < 1313027135 766165 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dilbert's boss once said something like, it has come to my attention that 40% of sick days are taken on Monday and Friday, this is unacceptable, and so on. Someone else said that is a joke, because 40% is exactly normal. However, I don't think so. I think less than 40% of work days are on Monday and Friday (and I do see why it seems 40% is normal). < 1313027249 383129 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :*With holidays*, somewhat less than 40%. < 1313027254 818218 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But not significantly so. < 1313027303 554578 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have not actually calculated how much less. But it probably depends on where you live. At least in Canada it is less than 40% I think. I don't know what it is in their office. < 1313027837 522350 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1313027845 465055 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1313027869 276589 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : heh, one model I was thinking of offers faster-than-light travel, oops < 1313027869 570517 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : ???? < 1313027869 643154 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1313028113 61793 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Deletion log); 20:47 . . Ais523 (Talk | contribs) (deleted "My name is Johny, what the F**K?????": offtopic, probable spam) < 1313028118 541562 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: thanks, this is definitely the name of my next esolang < 1313028130 268837 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :brilliant < 1313028133 403494 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's actually a good esolang name < 1313028166 799018 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like how it comes pre-censored < 1313028250 690982 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how it misspells Johnny < 1313028253 2764 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which i only just noticed < 1313028338 240999 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you misspell a name < 1313028342 112822 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johny < 1313028387 256801 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :parents bad at speling < 1313028443 765179 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :An online translator told me the other page is Spanish for "the people are crazy". < 1313028456 532945 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was someone's reaction to reading the wiki. < 1313028620 675148 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D < 1313028655 857658 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: please make a really good esolang at that name, it deserves one < 1313028680 719744 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I think my wire esolang will be cool??? if it is not accidentally derivative < 1313028691 765446 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It probably won't be HUGELY AMAZING but it'll be fun < 1313028692 470455 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it any better than WireWorld? < 1313028702 525293 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know, I never learned wireworld < 1313028703 396014 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it bad < 1313028718 593971 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mine will probably be a lot less like real-world circuits < 1313028729 493031 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's sub-TC unless you have an infinite program < 1313028730 864408 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a lot more like ... noit o' mnain worb? < 1313028741 474289 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like how i can remember that name perfectly < 1313028745 525423 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, wireworld's something where it makes sense to say "what happens when signals collide?" < 1313028747 71646 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a CA < 1313028752 590183 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know < 1313028757 975356 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I see < 1313028758 905691 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, I mean, it's sort of like circuits < 1313028764 886153 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're doing a NOMW-alike? < 1313028771 676041 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure, I don't really know nomw either :( < 1313028775 76825 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be obviously TC though < 1313028777 503562 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess not too similar < 1313028777 576177 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : I like how it comes pre-censored <-- would be nice to discuss it together with brainfuck, just to confuse people < 1313028788 912527 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is circuits a new wire idea, or something that's been incomplete for a while? < 1313028823 753766 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :MDude: ? < 1313028848 659453 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was jsut wondering since I didn't feel like scrolling up. < 1313028877 950193 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Velocitator" Mr. Burns's archaic name for a car's accelerator pedal. Burns attempts to drive a car for the first time while proclaiming he is sure the owners manual will instruct him as to which lever is the velocitator and which one is the deceleratrix. < 1313028905 579204 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, there are a few other languages that look like wires. < 1313029235 420793 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make up a text adventure game called "My name is Johny, what the F**K?????" as well. Or, a card game, or newspaper, or restaurant, or whatever < 1313029291 159275 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :humm < 1313029361 463473 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the My name is Johny, what the F**K????? franchise < 1313029367 440536 :jcp|other!alex@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313029414 887151 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm, I think the main thing that will control how my language turns out is whether I have blips or signals < 1313029420 397616 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :blips along a wire go like < 1313029422 467439 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :>-- < 1313029423 668008 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :->- < 1313029424 626021 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :--> < 1313029428 515769 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a signal goes < 1313029429 617668 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-- < 1313029430 284631 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :XX- < 1313029431 75682 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :XXX < 1313029435 404797 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. blips move, signals spread < 1313029437 672523 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :WireWorld is based on blips < 1313029478 581088 :jcp|1!alex@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1313029490 496665 :jcp!alex@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1313029490 905182 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: huh, it is? < 1313029535 564100 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a cellular automaton < 1313029587 428961 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :make it a pneumatic automaton, based on blimps. < 1313029600 19230 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I learned wireworld a few years ago and only remember how the blippy things work. nothing about how to do logic or anything. never made anything interesting with it. :'(. < 1313029640 888407 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Circute [I'm pretty sure this is WireWorld exactly, but with a different name for some reason and also rendered in ASCII.] < 1313029703 324845 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :WireWorld is pretty nice, but there's an odd bug in it where if a "Diode" gets a signal form both directions at the right moment, it goes crazy and starts spewing noise forever. < 1313029716 241298 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: umm, it can be a CA without that < 1313029729 172681 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :both examples I showed were discrete < 1313029730 376679 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know < 1313029732 649631 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just < 1313029736 471571 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :>- ===> -> < 1313029737 761745 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :vs < 1313029741 671789 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :X- ==> XX < 1313029809 655808 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc the way wireworld did it was spark heads spread to adjacent wire cells and turn into spark tails, and spark tails turn into wires, or something like that < 1313029816 959147 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1313029831 797819 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :--th-- becomes ---th- < 1313029863 912602 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's kind of gross < 1313029873 555262 :jcp!alex@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313029875 763790 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh, I guess it would be pretty easy to make a CA in a 2D string rewriting system. < 1313029900 105989 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :A CA is essentially a 2D rewriting system. :P < 1313029900 490939 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's pretty handy. < 1313029907 297243 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :humm < 1313029934 575850 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wanna go on record as saying 2d rewriting system < 1313029936 158798 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well yeah, but I've been having trouble trying to define my own CA using other methods. < 1313029950 655067 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whew, just finished my first AceHack ascension < 1313029953 303788 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and now I want to tell everyone < 1313029963 457400 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :firefox: "you are about to close 221 tabs" < 1313029974 398535 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it isn't sluggish at all < 1313029979 575184 :Nisstyre!~nisstyre@infocalypse-net.info QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1313029986 694939 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :foxy < 1313029989 702343 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :browser < 1313029996 583429 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :bananan woop chik chik < 1313030000 487643 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is AceHack a game about being fighter pilot? < 1313030006 480462 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1313030011 223870 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1313030018 44652 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :who to believe????? < 1313030022 740620 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :MDude: it's a NetHack variant I develop < 1313030022 813002 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: NetHack UI nitpick: The plot isn't about being a fighter pilot. < 1313030025 342724 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Po. < 1313030025 669611 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :MDude, ace pilot stuck in a dungeon of course < 1313030027 358119 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eagerly awaiting fix in AceHack. < 1313030037 731066 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Hahaha < 1313030039 397020 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ace Rimmer lost in nethack land? < 1313030039 564377 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's a bit of a stretch < 1313030044 783384 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20, why not! < 1313030048 110813 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Just add "Also you're a fighter pilot." to the end of the game-opening message < 1313030051 378521 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Problem solved < 1313030055 75486 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Smoke me a kipper < 1313030064 3382 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you can do that yourself, that message is trivially easy to patch < 1313030080 462720 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I thought the point of AceHack was to have all the patches so that I didn't have to < 1313030092 11734 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, better mod the classes, So you are a "fighter pilot and knight" < 1313030100 248207 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever < 1313030116 341196 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, it only has the /good/ classes < 1313030116 413183 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fighter pilot and caveman < 1313030121 467660 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*/good/ patches < 1313030128 293673 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are the egotistical persona of an hologrammatical astronaut < 1313030130 333511 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott: no, it only has the /good/ classes < 1313030130 426541 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : fighter pilot and caveman < 1313030130 871790 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :good < 1313030140 909389 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what about adding pliot as a cast? < 1313030149 103668 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, could make an interesting quest < 1313030188 997015 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Omg you have to go around that plane that's just air and shit IN A PLANE < 1313030191 860026 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :BEST < 1313030207 242347 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :best < 1313030234 640444 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm quest artefact? A famous plane? flight googles? < 1313030262 957219 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "flight googles" < 1313030267 685964 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont actually follow red dwarf but i've seen the odd ep < 1313030268 996536 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :good google < 1313030270 486097 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, idea, just add planes as a special cased pet XD < 1313030277 324543 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oops :P < 1313030295 380108 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would play nethack as a pilot every time < 1313030296 227666 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you can ride horses and so on < 1313030302 879347 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :do the horses fly though < 1313030312 922629 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can ride dragons, they fly < 1313030319 813617 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1313030322 132850 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ki-rins, which are like flying horses < 1313030345 230742 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the difference would be that a plane remains tame all the time, also doesn't pick up things in shops for you < 1313030347 894681 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :nethack has rideable dragons? thats amazng it is < 1313030366 345114 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20, I only ever managed that in wiz mode < 1313030368 242772 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm, can you use those on that one (astral) plane? < 1313030370 921948 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're kind-of slow < 1313030377 944754 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: also, I like the idea of planes becoming un-tame < 1313030381 225100 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a wild plane < 1313030381 878495 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes, you can ride on Astral, but it's a pain keeping your steed alive < 1313030385 131778 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to feed it to tame it < 1313030391 881848 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh... I guess they wouldn't move on their own < 1313030397 269452 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and might need fuel < 1313030397 619771 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: grr, I mean that one plane < 1313030399 698820 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the one that's just clouds < 1313030411 512279 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, air < 1313030443 368394 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ais523: go implement this now! < 1313030462 125660 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no! < 1313030473 163381 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, why not, doesn't it sound awesome!? < 1313030477 457709 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1313030498 58495 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, why not. There is tourist. How are the tourists supposed to travel if not by plane! < 1313030510 24699 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :he makes a good point (a terrible point but a good one) < 1313030526 755027 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(yes I do see the flaws in that logic) < 1313030532 867735 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would it be easier to jsut add a card game at the end? < 1313030540 745307 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :MDude, of nethack? why < 1313030586 296830 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, btw I think you should be able to run around floating eyes to kill them. (Note: only makes sense if you played Mario64 I think) < 1313030895 673509 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Crap, now I have to play that again. < 1313030912 506829 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how quickly I can beat it... < 1313031041 821887 :invariable!~thing@unaffiliated/variable NICK :variable < 1313031055 505448 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I have played Mario 64 (well, the DS port) < 1313031057 956050 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I know what you mean < 1313031069 232715 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar, XD < 1313031090 566839 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, as far as I remember they added quite a lot of stuff to the DS port < 1313031094 806106 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :compared to the original < 1313031100 75308 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :like not playing mario all the time < 1313031108 242289 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1313031109 536966 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :never played the DS port < 1313031115 964419 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know the basic differences from the DS version and the original < 1313031237 391045 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had an N64 twice. The first one my brother gave it away to impress a girl. The second one I traded it in towards an xbox360. The second one had mario64 and zelda:oot. < 1313031262 351104 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I later traded the xbox360 back in out of fear of RROD and various reasons. < 1313031518 518930 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... < 1313031526 221666 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I like blips more than signals < 1313031528 606001 :CakeProphet!~adam@h210.10.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313031528 678791 :CakeProphet!~adam@h210.10.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net QUIT :Changing host < 1313031528 678900 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric < 1313031535 823434 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you need a way to turn signals off < 1313031543 191184 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means having some sort of signal-eater block that eats up a signal as it goes along a wire < 1313031545 261990 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is... weird? < 1313031557 480574 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :with blips you have the possibility of fun things like duplicators and the like < 1313031564 949075 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's sort of more like an IP < 1313031570 374520 :mickayz!~chatzilla@c-67-182-142-170.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313031597 324285 :mickayz!~chatzilla@c-67-182-142-170.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PART :#esoteric < 1313031598 549645 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Agreed, blips are cleaner. < 1313031665 858330 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I think the other major choice is whether to have nondeterminism < 1313031762 236857 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, which I guess is more a question of are blips directional < 1313031853 118937 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ASCII really needs corners < 1313031874 440403 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If they are, it offers the possibility of sending information bidirectionally along wires. < 1313031892 349501 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: oh, hmm, I don't think blips can be non-directional while avoiding hidden state < 1313031900 249359 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So portions of the program can be implemented in terms of the reverse of other portions. < 1313031933 933936 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, reversability is good evidence for purity. :P < 1313031951 135958 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1313032076 762836 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, that's annoying though, because directional blips don't really let me justify this cool nondeterminism feature < 1313032105 476143 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: alright lets think < 1313032123 56056 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wut < 1313032125 100980 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is a nondeterministic language good for? < 1313032141 201122 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a nondeterministic feature < 1313032154 139277 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nondeterministic_finite_state_machine < 1313032157 607248 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely it is more wide in scope than simply rand() :D < 1313032169 575056 :azaq231!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1313032195 252607 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Long story short, NFAs are typically more concise and intuitive than DFAs. < 1313032241 681191 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: um that is obviously not the kind of nondeterminism i mean < 1313032262 797287 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :welllllllllllll < 1313032268 421757 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it isn't < 1313032279 575639 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I basically just mean something similar to Befunge's ? < 1313032291 946877 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :(reading over that page) regarding philosophical determinism debates i have argued before that a non-determinist could emulate a determinist < 1313032299 670634 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I wasn't claiming anything about yours. I was just offering an example of what nondeterminism is good for. < 1313032339 605157 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: well, that's not the same kind of nondeterminism < 1313032402 324349 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think that the determinists can be shown to be possibly non-determinists wearing masks, and non-determinists might possibly be determinists wearing masks but i forget how i arrived at the latter conclusion < 1313032445 29294 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Naturally. This is, after all, #esoteric. < 1313032459 258583 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :humm < 1313032464 497185 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313032504 653135 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't fourier's fast transform not find any good uses until after his death? < 1313032560 629977 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah ---- i should not make such claims without backup < 1313032623 343008 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think we assume that we want determinism most of the time... but take it away and we might come to not depend on it < 1313032638 363646 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1313032663 615085 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1313032759 669864 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, elliott http://www.mspaintadventures.com/?s=ryanquest < 1313032777 227260 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Why are you pinging me about this? < 1313032786 721813 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: it wasn't Fourier's fast transform < 1313032790 150656 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd ask why you're pinging Gregor too but he probably will himself < 1313032804 935839 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :In other news, cure for cancer. < 1313032815 971305 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I pinged Gregor because I'm under the vague impression that he's interested in Dinosaur Comics < 1313032868 985772 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :My brain just broke trying to avoid breaking what I'm assuming is a joke < 1313032891 193184 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: have you considered become a rapper? < 1313032923 304428 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :your rhymes would be quite dapper < 1313032928 625964 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313032937 48107 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: What joke? < 1313032948 380422 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric : In other news, cure for cancer. < 1313032955 181711 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless pikhq's being serious < 1313032961 653405 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_> < 1313032963 440596 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Entirely serious. < 1313032970 933145 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :think about it a little.. < 1313032976 767522 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo is answering questions non-linearly, and pikhq would believe a pop science magazine. < 1313032985 96842 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's say there was a cure for cancer. < 1313032996 355301 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :chances are millions of people would already know about it and be talking about. < 1313033002 504683 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: this is unusually stupid for you < 1313033002 966075 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be huge news. < 1313033019 551099 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: You realise that reddit, etc. claim there are cures for cancer like every other week? < 1313033043 38956 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then the top comment is someone thoroughly refuting it as an actual method for curing cancer because reddit's scoring makes no fucking sense. < 1313033065 293572 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :reddit doesn't count as information. < 1313033073 898783 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but no, I did not realize that. < 1313033073 971375 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cure for _a_ cancer I would believe < 1313033087 860130 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't < 1313033094 604573 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION sits here and waits for pikhq to respond.
< 1313033105 718819 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Genetic modification of T-cells taken from 3 patients were targetted to antigens unique to the cancer cells, and reinjected into the patient. All cancer cells were killed by the T-cells. < 1313033105 790937 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would believe a cure for cancer... if it were actually a cure for cancer. < 1313033118 667187 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The scheme is believed to be repeatable on other forms of cancer, but was only tested on leukemia. < 1313033124 872136 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Further trials pending. < 1313033133 55484 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, I'd believe cure for a specific cancer much less than I'd believe of a cure for all cancer < 1313033137 746865 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, believed to be repeatable on _all_ other forms of cancer, or many other forms? < 1313033139 846898 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: that is pretty fucking awesome < 1313033143 653786 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: All. < 1313033146 214677 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So: promising research in the topic of cancer. < 1313033151 618765 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not "cure for cancer". < 1313033155 958387 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: X cancer is just cancer that happens to be in X < 1313033164 477977 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Fundamentally they are all the same disease < 1313033170 248958 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Not strictly true, I thought. < 1313033173 894295 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: So I exaggerate slightly. < 1313033175 887575 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: OK, now I'll wait for this to get on reddit and for someone to reply "I'm an expert and this is promising but doens't actually mean anything/isn't new because [..............]". < 1313033177 7665 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: but then what will pop science news sources use for a headline? < 1313033179 50015 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, interesting, but 3 patients? Need larger scale tests. And tests on different cancers. < 1313033179 121997 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe IT < 1313033179 875103 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALREADY < 1313033180 290485 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAS < 1313033190 944692 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Hence why trials are pending. < 1313033203 801903 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/trials/further trials/ < 1313033209 11962 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: we also have a theoretical cure for retroviruses from 10 years ago that no one ever got to work at a medical scale < 1313033226 107867 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, what cure is that? < 1313033234 775125 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: death < 1313033243 881054 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: cellular injection of single-stranded RNA that matches the virus' DNA < 1313033246 84154 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: This one has at least worked on human patients. < 1313033246 776471 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, is it just me, or is "pharmaceutical company" an oxymoron? < 1313033250 779114 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, ah < 1313033252 114894 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: no < 1313033272 808302 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The cellrejects the double-stranded retrovirus RNA because of the presence of the single-stranded version < 1313033275 23396 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, yeah I can see getting that to work for anything but single cells might be a bit of an issue < 1313033278 68932 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aren't business concerns and research costs at odds with, y'know, providing people with abundant, cheap medication? < 1313033290 750456 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, can't think of how to inject it into cells < 1313033293 98931 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheap meditation < 1313033293 171874 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Socialised medicine seems to make the most sense. < 1313033296 491227 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: a different virus < 1313033299 893359 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1313033301 306527 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, ah < 1313033303 729414 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :retroviral therapy can be done < 1313033305 655515 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: do you know what an oxymoron is < 1313033306 366206 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :and has < 1313033320 191343 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: not for something of this scope < 1313033322 448213 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, what is the catch then < 1313033325 10083 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: A contradiction in terms. < 1313033338 477538 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: the words "pharmaceutical" and "company" do not contradict < 1313033353 966412 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think what you're trying to say is "pharmaceutical companies are bad" < 1313033354 359679 :invariable!~thing@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1313033359 680726 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: But the notions of providing pharmaceuticals and being a company do. :P < 1313033360 641238 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: if there was actual significant likelihood that this procedure would be a high-success cure for cancer, governments can and will just legislate their way past th eproblem < 1313033365 606095 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a meta-oxymoron, then. < 1313033375 886935 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe plenty of companies provide pharmaceuticals? < 1313033377 171821 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or semanto-oxymoron. < 1313033382 804906 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1313033383 733860 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i < 1313033389 806398 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how < 1313033393 186920 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hlep < 1313033407 719825 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, what is the catch then with the retrovirus thingy < 1313033429 903993 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you have to do it before you find out (that's the retro part) < 1313033436 242328 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ... < 1313033468 942031 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, leave the puns to oerjan next time < 1313033470 937411 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: a) retroviral therapy is very difficult to pull off in a safe manner; the need to get single-stranded RNA involved would make it much more complex since the virus would basically need to be custom-made and we lack that technology < 1313033482 657302 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: or maybe die >:( < 1313033492 796411 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: b) it is a defense easily mutated against < 1313033508 215920 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :the recent development of blocking /all/ dsRNA is very interesting though < 1313033524 576882 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, doesn't the body use that? < 1313033528 510589 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :normally I mean < 1313033530 916516 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No. < 1313033536 236505 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: dsRNA gets copied into the DNA < 1313033540 529600 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No. Double-stranded RNA is only used by virus reproduction. < 1313033547 398947 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, will be mutated against in the future probably < 1313033551 140322 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :all RNA in the body naturally is single-stranded < 1313033556 995467 :variable!~thing@unaffiliated/variable QUIT :Quit: I found 1 in /dev/zero < 1313033563 813855 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No; double-strandedness is fundamental to the mechanics of retroviruses < 1313033570 232188 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1313033610 328605 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :err wait < 1313033617 483755 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently I am confusing my viruses here < 1313033636 625145 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :retroviruses use single-stranded RNA apparently and supply enzymes to do the copying with; dsRNA is a different class of virus < 1313033679 859522 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :still, dsRNA is not naturally occurring in the body < 1313033682 483447 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, so won't kill off HIV and so on then < 1313033697 982073 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yeah. Still would hit a vast swath of viruses < 1313033765 482684 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :im a viras < 1313033807 971495 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw ribosomes are probably the most ridiculous human structure < 1313033815 595390 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or any other cell really) < 1313033866 942939 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is now possible to give classes equality superclasses, i.e. you can write something like class (F a ~ b) => C a b where { ... }. See Section 7.7.2.3, “Equality constraints” for more details. < 1313033867 36987 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeSSsssSSSSSSSSSSssssss < 1313033867 918701 :invariable!~thing@unaffiliated/variable NICK :variable < 1313033926 78922 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what. < 1313033934 700829 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually just RNA in general is fucking amazing < 1313033949 929943 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: ghc < 1313033954 111575 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: link < 1313033954 204840 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :new release < 1313033957 157085 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.haskell.org/ghc/docs/7.2.1/html/users_guide/release-7-2-1.html < 1313033963 451205 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't need DNA or proteins if you have RNA < 1313033966 198358 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The new DefaultSignatures extension allows you to define a default implementation for a class method that isn't as general as the method's type. For example, < 1313033966 883901 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OMG < 1313033970 401674 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :finally < 1313033971 505366 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :DNA and proteins are just more durable < 1313034021 954521 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: fnininlaly < 1313034028 585393 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net NICK :evincar-in-the-s < 1313034042 972006 :evincar-in-the-s!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net NICK :evincar-away < 1313034045 478175 :evincar-away!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sigh. < 1313034057 519042 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "evil mangler" has been removed, and registerised compilation via C is no longer supported. This means that the -fvia-c, -fvia-C, -keep-raw-s-file, -keep-raw-s-files, -pgmm, -optm, -monly-2-regs, -monly-3-regs and -monly-4-regs flags are now deprecated, and have no effect. The -fasm-mangling and -fno-asm-mangling flags have been removed. < 1313034057 630352 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1313034064 368094 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: time for wake < 1313034068 651476 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1313034077 349692 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: yeah. Still would hit a vast swath of viruses <-- indeed, meaning the other viruses would take over. < 1313034082 807203 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what swake hapl < 1313034083 225167 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: it's wake < 1313034095 360251 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : btw ribosomes are probably the most ridiculous human structure <-- yep < 1313034096 474841 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wake_(ceremony).... < 1313034128 231775 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313034133 518244 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, there's *plenty* of utterly ridiculous human structures. < 1313034133 697241 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :im bad at words < 1313034157 497250 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok wake for evil mangler and rest of -fvia-C < 1313034159 88501 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :g < 1313034159 863697 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially if we look at vestigial structures. < 1313034160 454464 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :go < 1313034179 666357 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, name one more ridiculous than ribosomes < 1313034195 706820 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean ridiculous as in crazy < 1313034199 503155 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :not ridiculous as in useless < 1313034204 832732 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1313034271 927850 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION reads about the new generics stuff
< 1313034289 60721 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Recurrent laryngeal nerve. Especially ridiculous in giraffes. < 1313034319 463635 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a nerve that goes all the way down from the neck, down around the aorta, and back *up* to the larynx. < 1313034347 571682 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: that is ridiculous; not the same kind of ridiculous though < 1313034378 291293 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :ribosomes are assembled from proteins and RNA; the assembly is the coordinated effort of hundreds of proteins to assemble components made in three different parts of the cell < 1313034382 675137 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does so in all the quadrapeds. Well, technically all vertabrates, but that's actually the shortest path in fish. < 1313034448 917060 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. Tetrapods? < 1313034476 156007 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pettatods < 1313034481 893717 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :the genome also has more than 200 redundant copies of the sequences for ribosomes < 1313034507 574766 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, why not? It has redundant copies of so many things. < 1313034542 403254 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :half a million ribosomal proteins are transported into the nucleus each minute < 1313034885 27510 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh also self-splicing introns are ridiculous < 1313034910 810740 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're sequences of DNA that take up the middle of genes for who knows why and just remove themselves when the DNA goes up for transcription < 1313034933 577273 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :they actually cut themselves out of the mRNA < 1313034979 384053 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But remember, we're intelligently designed. < 1313035020 907648 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :one possibility is that they're actually a very low form of self-reproducing structure; they serve no purpose but manage to get reproduced and inject themselves into other parts of the genome nonetheless < 1313035428 461696 :evincar-away!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-222-158-156.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1313035530 687798 :evincar-away!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313035535 721325 :evincar-away!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net NICK :evincar < 1313036309 763852 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1313036331 266091 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm? < 1313036360 673234 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm?? < 1313036365 226280 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think the generic stuff in ghc does what i want :( < 1313036366 293314 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or hmm < 1313036369 300860 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh maybe it does < 1313036637 850890 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1313037264 667862 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :How much of the code from Windows version 1 is still used in the newest version? < 1313037297 707629 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: it's probably impossible to know < 1313037298 299436 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd be inclined to say "not much". < 1313037304 894299 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd be surprised if even Microsoft know by now < 1313037314 712297 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they don't have public repos, so you can't tell < 1313037337 344094 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wasn't NT basically a complete rewrite? < 1313037342 496535 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially what with Win32 having essentially a rewrite of Win16, and NT being a rewrite *really from scratch*. < 1313037353 712655 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, ^ that. < 1313037360 828125 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe even Microsoft doesn't know? < 1313037375 492782 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :NT has more relation with VMS than Windows 1.0. < 1313037415 957868 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i really want the windows source code < 1313037417 876128 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :just < 1313037418 444530 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :to read < 1313037424 933929 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should get that partial leak sometime < 1313037437 622240 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i should get a job at ms and spend my days reading the windows code < 1313037439 440156 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd be willing to bet that there's tons of comments saying // Work around moronic program X < 1313037445 868496 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are < 1313037453 817328 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I read the highlights-of-the-leak posts) < 1313037475 71895 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :posts where < 1313037480 84560 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :internet < 1313037489 284177 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or // We can't remove this internal API because so many stupid applications rely on it. < 1313037567 399756 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think the windows team and the office team would literally go to war if they had the resources < 1313037582 270823 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most likely. < 1313037583 626675 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: as our Windows Correspondent, how do you feel about this < 1313037587 470174 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't even need source to see that. < 1313037595 900823 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok now i can't stop imagining the war of the microsoft teams and it is hilarious < 1313037607 359403 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"this is for using private APIs!!!!!" < 1313037616 170855 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Office team seems to *love* reimplementing things. < 1313037621 40937 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Swinging USB modems by their cables and hurling them over the cube walls toward unsuspecting victims. < 1313037623 948072 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"oh yeah??? well this is for breaking word 98's menu code!!!!!" < 1313037628 716336 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :When was the last time Office used native widgets? < 1313037630 551759 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :[throws model m] < 1313037637 398230 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it did in 3.1, I think < 1313037648 531998 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shit, the Model M, best fucking keyboard. < 1313037654 461436 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be, umm Office 4? < 1313037657 336106 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the model m is not that good < 1313037668 227715 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you don't like it, I will hit you with it. < 1313037671 209420 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it will still work. < 1313037679 736461 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are more durable keyboards :) < 1313037680 943330 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then I will rearrange the keycaps to Dvorak and back. < 1313037683 529906 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :still made by ibm though < 1313037685 167356 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just want my keyboards to not have stupid extra buttons, and to be sensibly shaped < 1313037689 868515 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the terminal boards are amazing < 1313037698 230165 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the Model M is not bad. We had it at Free Geek Vancouver for a few weeks and I liked this keyboard < 1313037706 948364 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I was about to go "wtf, we agree" but then I realised my definition of "stupid extra buttons" probably includes more than yours < 1313037715 14952 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and doesn't include useful things like volume control < 1313037735 24179 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm actually fine with volume control buttons < 1313037742 384411 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use fn-3, fn-4 quite a lot on this keyboard < 1313037751 50683 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I'll just map them to super-something if they aren't there < 1313037760 38232 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah; most people are complaining about media keys when they complain about stupid extra buttons < 1313037761 352732 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :A super key would be nice for Windows, but I do fine without it on Linux. < 1313037763 806186 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I have some super-mappings for play/pause, skip forwards, skip back) < 1313037769 758379 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I'm fine with media keys < 1313037773 245513 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure what they do when they want to change the volume, but it's probably slow < 1313037779 274565 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm complaining about large separate buttons with random things on them like "home" or "calculator" < 1313037784 302002 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and F lock < 1313037784 676217 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. < 1313037785 232004 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, those are silly < 1313037787 629920 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wow do I hate F lock < 1313037792 602017 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :although a home key could be useful if it did the right thing and was in a non-terrible place < 1313037796 856859 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And fuck keyboard designers who mess with my editing block. < 1313037798 186949 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Media keys are just fine. Most of the other vender addons are terrible. < 1313037799 116486 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure what the right thing is < 1313037808 736091 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And fuck the numpad. < 1313037811 449758 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so we all agree with each other? how often does that happen? < 1313037819 220254 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Rarely. < 1313037819 804572 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I don't agree that the editing block is sacred >:) < 1313037823 562963 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but close enough < 1313037832 52316 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I bet Vorpal will say that he needs his numpad for playing NetHack < 1313037837 756286 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm actually slightly annoyed that I have more than one non-shift modifier key < 1313037841 943449 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: DON'T PING HIM YOU'LL RUIN EVERYTHING < 1313037843 816448 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :having a numpad doesn't disturb me, but I don't need one < 1313037843 888716 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just like having insert in a sane location. Delete does not need to be a double-high key. < 1313037846 860643 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: he's probably asleep < 1313037848 617213 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Delete does need to be there. < 1313037854 946474 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*elliott: < 1313037862 105866 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm sure his IRC client is set to wake him up < 1313037869 55572 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: the editing block is stupid because you have to move your hands to use it < 1313037887 799894 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I use them for browsing read-only things. < 1313037889 293473 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, that's why I use emacs. < 1313037895 591618 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not on this laptop, the editing block's squidged in with the other keys < 1313037901 822894 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I do C-a C-e quite a lot < 1313037903 725767 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, "laptops have nice keyboard layouts" -- this surely can't be a very popular opinion I'm holding < 1313037913 965758 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :My netbook has a surprisingly nice layout... < 1313037921 308328 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...not nice in the absolute, but tolerable. < 1313037925 354525 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this one had to compromise a bit, but it's still pretty tolerable < 1313037925 832834 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The keyboard layouts on laptops need to be roomier. < 1313037926 951923 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially for a 90%-size keyboard. < 1313037928 891992 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I kind of want to make @ treat ctrl and alt as identical < 1313037929 149009 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dislike all the extra vendor keys they put on many (not all) keyboards < 1313037934 94571 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in particular, ` and \ are near the spacebar) < 1313037954 503647 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my fingers have memorised this keyboard, though, and they're fine with it < 1313037954 947541 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weird. < 1313037956 662687 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, umm, treat left windows key as a "bring up prompt" button (doubles as an application launcher) < 1313037956 808230 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The editing block could easily go, though. Numpad's wasted space. < 1313037959 807035 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the right windows key to be compose??? < 1313037961 639339 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure < 1313037963 734283 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then again, mine's a Lenovo. < 1313037967 760009 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like ctrl and alt both existing though < 1313037969 242736 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :They care about keyboards. < 1313037971 398732 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't make much sense < 1313037980 681884 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least with "standard" style shortcuts < 1313037983 689780 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Ctrl is for controlling things. Alt is for alternate things. < 1313037984 203252 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Maybe you should just have one key in the system such as CTRL and then have a keyboard mapping program, so that it can map ALT to be another CTRL key if the @ system does not use ALT? < 1313037987 743377 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :treating super and alt as identical would make more sense < 1313037990 91524 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: yeaaaaaaaaaah < 1313037998 687049 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, I could also just make it ignore Ctrl < 1313038003 766762 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: since it's in the less ergonomic position < 1313038004 844282 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, try designing a sane interface standards around those vague definitions, right? < 1313038007 88660 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's much easier to miss one and hit the other, than it is to hit super when you mean ctrl < 1313038013 651729 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (fun fact: Alt and Ctrl were swapped originally) < 1313038021 942693 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know who made the more common key, Ctrl, move to the more awkward position < 1313038022 853398 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: heh, that would make more sense < 1313038025 211031 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I dislike them for it < 1313038042 984714 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ctrl often used to be where Capslock is, next to A. < 1313038044 543722 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OS X has the command key in the place where Ctrl used to be, which is nice < 1313038051 332502 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: well, that's more a Sun thing < 1313038054 550239 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, what's alt mainly used for? menu and dialog navigation, right? < 1313038055 454272 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think IBM did that < 1313038061 804092 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: True. < 1313038067 333453 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas ctrl is used for controlling tty programs, as well as miscellaneous stuff like copy/paste in GUI programs < 1313038075 107667 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1313038075 616418 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: That's only traditional on UNIX systems. < 1313038079 340961 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(umm, you are joking, right?) < 1313038093 779236 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: who are you laughing at? < 1313038107 893203 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: whereas ctrl is used for controlling tty programs, as well as miscellaneous stuff like copy/paste in GUI programs < 1313038119 946578 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: GUI users typically don't use ctrl for much < 1313038125 217229 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they use the mouse < 1313038137 681067 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most people I've seen click on save rather than using control-S < 1313038148 31572 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, but it's ridiculous to say that using Ctrl to control tty programs is more common than using it for GUI actions < 1313038151 732613 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What, do they also not use Alt-Tab? < 1313038153 346045 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't say that < 1313038161 526650 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh. It bothers me to no end when I see CS or SE students at my college using the mouse to operate menus for editing commands, *whilst programming*. < 1313038162 493697 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you implied it with the ordering and "miscellaneous stuff" < 1313038162 998553 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: they panic if they have more than one program open at once < 1313038166 481575 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ask me how to get rid of them < 1313038183 204832 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I happen to like the very old clunky IBM PC keyboard. It was very well designed. < 1313038186 276943 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow. < 1313038195 892124 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: meh, don't hate the player, hate the game; in this appropriative analogy, the player is the student and the game is WIMP GUIs < 1313038220 132828 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But everyone else complains that it is too loud and all that stupid stuff too, and want all these extra keys and mouse and various things < 1313038222 976401 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :WIMP GUIs do suck, but it's amazing that they apparently suck *more* for the average user. < 1313038234 156028 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: now you've got me imagining a Model M with a touchpad < 1313038236 579805 :jcp|1!alex@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313038241 303416 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does "WIMP GUI" mean in this context? < 1313038249 243919 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: window, icon, menu, pointer < 1313038253 365233 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, aha < 1313038260 132252 :jcp!alex@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1313038264 502378 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd seen the abbreviation before but didn't know what it stood for < 1313038268 352330 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really don't know who thinks WIMP UIs are intuitive or easy to learn or anything < 1313038274 323596 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably power users and people who work at Microsoft < 1313038274 432010 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I.e., OS wimpmode. < 1313038285 362924 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But then again, not really. < 1313038286 278147 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can be pretty effective once you get to know them < 1313038296 541543 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, I used to use control-shift-B to bold things in Word, for consistency < 1313038296 615314 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :power users because they're used to them, people who work at Microsoft because kool-aid < 1313038303 683551 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because basically all the formatting commands are on control-shift < 1313038307 338100 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was a Windows power user, once < 1313038320 439741 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not any more, though, I don't properly understand anything later than about 98 < 1313038343 605869 :jcp|other!alex@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1313038344 877563 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Thought it was just Ctrl? Also, word processors make me cry. < 1313038352 297457 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :No sense of typography or layout. < 1313038357 474332 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I try to avoid Windows power users, they upset me :( < 1313038361 750038 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't control anything. < 1313038369 821066 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: both control-B and control-shift-B work < 1313038377 19193 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: It is why I use TeX now < 1313038380 689590 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Word's typography is pretty good nowadays, I think < 1313038381 684205 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :control-shift- is more consistent with the other commands < 1313038383 201747 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :since two thousand and seven or so < 1313038397 624566 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using TeX you can control most things if you know how. < 1313038400 293873 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: Friggin' HTML's better than WYSIWYG word processors for some things... < 1313038401 975941 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the way Word does styles is stupid, I much prefer the OpenOffice.org/LibreOffice approach < 1313038410 668896 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: possibly, I'm just talking purely in terms of typography < 1313038415 912099 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most people don't use styles at all < 1313038423 542152 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've even seen people indenting with spaces (in a /word processor/) < 1313038424 396340 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and anyone who thinks you "can't control anything" with Word hasn't used it < 1313038432 160722 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has about ten billion formatting options < 1313038435 508971 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still tend to write things in HTML at least, TeX if it needs to be fancy. InDesign isn't bad if you have access to it. < 1313038448 802697 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that's got a slew of other features/problems. < 1313038450 527187 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :WYSIWYG is stupid in general I think. TeX works much better I think. I prefer TeX rather than HTML. < 1313038463 39985 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Arguably, the problem is that Word has too many formatting options. < 1313038473 84028 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Making it incredibly non-obvious how to make it act reasonably. < 1313038476 705966 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Interactive previews are intuitive. It's making the underlying model clean that's problematic. < 1313038482 995622 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Word isn't a good program < 1313038490 848671 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but lack of control is not its major flaw :) < 1313038507 788090 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: Interactive previews are somewhat different from WYSIWYG. < 1313038544 654018 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's no reason your preview has to literally *be* the output. < 1313038566 362840 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should really rebind my capslock to something useful < 1313038570 61994 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm, /me verifies that he can < 1313038570 134328 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: No, I'm talking about actually interacting with the preview, not displaying a preview "interactively" while you work on some other representation. < 1313038573 872144 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh good, it's done in software < 1313038579 308248 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Ubuntu actually has a menu for caps lock rebinding < 1313038584 776271 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not what I meant < 1313038584 848024 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the advanced keyboard preferences < 1313038589 695197 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the next line explains what I meant if you're psychic) < 1313038594 58856 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, what did you mean? < 1313038599 565895 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: Yes, but the WYSIWYG model is based on that not being a preview. < 1313038602 435465 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I sometimes want to set up things with macros and that stuff, and other things, and don't want it to change everything as I am typing, or make a macro and then have to manually enter things even though it is a macro if I have changed the macro. Using TeX, editing the macro will change everything that uses that macro. In Word, editing a macro will not change the things that have already been entered. < 1313038616 527334 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is the view. < 1313038619 281708 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: No, the WYSIWYG model is based on interacting *solely* with a preview. :P < 1313038619 549858 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: for a while now, Macs have required caps lock to be pressed for a certain amount of time before it activates; a really, really short amount of time; it's basically meant to avoid accidental presses < 1313038626 717756 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: Then it's not a preview! < 1313038627 15814 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I see < 1313038631 384658 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I was checking it was done in OS X software, rather than at the keyboard controller level < 1313038637 330918 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you were worried that rebinding capslock would make that happen to whatever it was rebound to < 1313038643 718715 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would impede me rebinding caps lock usefully; probably not much, but it would be enough to stop me mothering < 1313038646 549065 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :...bothering < 1313038648 302948 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Of course it is. It's a preview of what you're going to print. Or what you're going to whatever. < 1313038653 790716 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I read somewhere, instead of WYSIWYG another way is YAFIYGI (you asked for it, you got it). < 1313038656 544499 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The topic is word processors, after all. < 1313038679 150390 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :word processors are way too print-focused; after all, paper is obsolete < 1313038681 517584 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Stop your mothering. < 1313038702 180055 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I want to preview the file before printing it, I can use xdvi (on Linux) or Yap (on Windows), etc. < 1313038707 941642 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: And, more importantly, bad at being print-focused. < 1313038719 23272 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :guys I wanted you to argue with me.... < 1313038720 614322 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe ais523 will < 1313038746 953427 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but Word can corrupt a document because it's opened on a computer with a different model of printer < 1313038749 584146 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'd be one thing if it were *merely* pretending everything's paper, but it's pretending everything's paper and then doing ugly shit with it. < 1313038750 836449 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's way to printer-focused < 1313038753 110318 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wow, really? < 1313038754 376897 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both xdvi and Yap allow zooming in to see the individual dots using the printer's resolution. < 1313038756 409959 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Word's line-wrapping algo depends on the printer! < 1313038764 325837 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that corruption thing true? < 1313038768 439919 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Tree [Using L-Systems to make growing tree programs might be nice.] < 1313038772 198566 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: And that is dumb! < 1313038778 855761 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I love paper books, but they may or may not be more stable than electronic storage. < 1313038790 973494 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least they have more graceful degradation when it comes to zombie apocalypses. < 1313038791 110728 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :paper books are dumb and stupid and using them is unpleasant < 1313038798 551815 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :eink is much nicer < 1313038798 873264 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, I'm not sure if my sources for it are reliable, but I didn't make it up myself < 1313038814 561518 :jcp!alex@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313038815 790442 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I have first-hand experience of it happening with MS Publisher (which is not Word) < 1313038823 508676 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :amazing < 1313038825 442135 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: And when there is no more power due to the apocalypse, I will be reading my books by candlelight and you will be trying to beat zombies away with your dead Kindle. < 1313038828 544326 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it happen even before you try to print it? < 1313038832 879577 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't tried eink, mostly because all the devices I know of that have it are all too controlled for my liking. < 1313038835 776457 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Publisher, yes < 1313038836 214045 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: you make your technological decisions based on the apocalypse? < 1313038841 931995 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: I have a lot of guns to sell you < 1313038843 297364 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know about Word < 1313038860 607939 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: how does reading books by candlelight help you defeat zombies? < 1313038862 963690 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes. I have faith that the longer we go without killing ourselves, the more likely we are to do so. < 1313038865 216164 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't like my books printed in vanishing ink. < 1313038877 441617 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Maybe I'm reading the Zombie Survival Guide. < 1313038883 184093 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the action you attributed to elliott (hitting them with a Kindle) is more plausible as a method of beating zombies < 1313038883 789649 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is still dumb to have line wrapping and stuff like that depending on the printer, usually. < 1313038884 102358 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: and you choose to read fiction on certain media because of this ok < 1313038887 171993 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least in the short term < 1313038904 554910 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Try "moronic". < 1313038905 771451 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Batteries aren'tt hat hard to make, you just need to be able to refine two different metals with different properties. < 1313038911 287851 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, sorry, two bytes < 1313038919 524438 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a zombie apocalypse would be a fun virtual-reality game < 1313038920 499524 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: They can't even use the One True Line-Breaking Algorithm. < 1313038923 484455 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as it cuts out before your limbs get torn off < 1313038923 558645 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it makes sense if you are sending a plain text file directly to the printer, but it makes no sense to change lines and stuff depending on the printer if you are formatting the page layout by computer! < 1313038932 46012 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Actually, no. I just like how paper feels, and how ink looks on paper. I like calligraphy and printing. < 1313038938 251731 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of games would be more fun in a virtual reality format, actually < 1313038940 821794 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's fun to shout about zombies. < 1313038946 484949 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: the whole point of e-ink is that it looks the same as ink on paper, you know < 1313038963 196622 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean... it's electronic paper. < 1313038974 402068 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not the whole point. < 1313038987 751397 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rest of the point that isn't being a dynamic screen is that < 1313038991 382535 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I have never heard of any "One True Line-Breaking Algorithm". I only know some things about TeX's algorithm and about a simple way where you just put whatever fits on one line < 1313038997 38223 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's part of it, sure, but it's also low-power, non-backlit, solid-state... < 1313039022 77951 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: That'd be TeX's. < 1313039024 432690 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, but the point is, "it looks like ink on paper" is not a good argument for books against e-reader type things, because they have that property too :P < 1313039033 488137 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, they don't. < 1313039044 146262 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, they do < 1313039047 102307 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're a cheap (actually, expensive) approximation. < 1313039074 109024 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Much lower resolution, and they don't have nearly the same optical qualities. < 1313039087 592919 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good ink on good paper has scattering and texture. < 1313039098 837932 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I don't completely understand TeX's algorithm (I have read it a few times) but I know what it is trying to do, what the "badness" of a line is, what penalties, what demerits and everythinng else that goes into the calculation. < 1313039106 780120 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are subtle irregularities where the ink bled into the fiber. < 1313039111 534635 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :In general, it works very well. < 1313039121 489972 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/54/Kindle_3_texture_%28crop%29.jpg are these subtle irregularities good enough for you < 1313039138 178598 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not that the kindle is necessarily ~the best electronic paper~) < 1313039161 846053 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dislike the Kindle for the sort of reasons that are guessable (I don't really like devices as locked down as that) < 1313039179 649244 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Hence my "vanishing ink" quip. < 1313039184 662425 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's another good point. < 1313039196 951538 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Paper is freely accessible. < 1313039200 433224 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I never said I liked the Kindle < 1313039201 53864 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also cheap to produce. < 1313039202 424922 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e-ink screens don't look massively similar to paper, but I'm fine with them < 1313039203 998840 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I know < 1313039209 170692 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never said you liked it either < 1313039221 370353 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty common fault in ereaders, though. < 1313039221 762445 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the pixel qi displays seem promising < 1313039234 420557 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just that this conversation has been "state your opinion on things vaguely related to e-readers", so I did < 1313039239 20189 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :e-readers are stupid, as a separate device to computers < 1313039239 520152 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I can wheatpaste paper to the sides of buildings when the revolution starts. :P < 1313039242 250252 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wasn't some... thing based on pixel qi a bit of a flop? < 1313039249 285645 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :And paper can be reused, recycle, and so on, too. And if I print out something, and don't need it, I can still use it as spare paper to write on the back, too. < 1313039254 588980 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH NO SOMEONE MADE A PRODUCT USING ANOTHER PRODUCT AND IT WAS A FLOP < 1313039259 505347 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :abandoning company forever < 1313039269 364145 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Abandoning all related products forever. < 1313039277 579212 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what I'm upset at? the demise of dotmatrix printers < 1313039283 544552 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Seems unlikely that eink displays will be common soon. < 1313039289 157084 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :dot matrix is stupid and dumb and loud but the output looks cool < 1313039295 945389 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Though if they do become common, I will be very happy. < 1313039298 616179 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also they can be used as musical instruments < 1313039301 930099 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they printed easily well enough to be readable, and apart from print quality are better than inkjet in pretty much every way < 1313039305 789498 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Printing things in bold actually just printed them twice so the dots were darker. < 1313039311 97188 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's more inkjet's fault < 1313039314 924290 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: yep, well not exactly < 1313039316 697624 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :twice with an offset < 1313039317 657556 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: black and white laser printers should be about fifty times as popular as they are < 1313039319 255597 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, OK < 1313039323 580666 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :if not more < 1313039332 50863 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, not exactly. If it were exact, it wouldn't be any darker. ;) < 1313039335 87156 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the main reason that I can tell that laser printers are unpopular for home use is physical size < 1313039336 632678 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact I often use the back of printed pages as spare paper. < 1313039351 859979 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: umm, they're not all big < 1313039357 573317 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: But inkjets are cheap, and consumers don't consider the cost of ink. < 1313039369 652053 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh, fucking ink. < 1313039379 403470 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'm worried, because inkjet marketing people have come across a consistent failing of the majority of humans < 1313039381 651239 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and are exploiting it < 1313039384 775012 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Proprietary cartridges and all that. < 1313039392 686312 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And crack's cheaper than ink. < 1313039394 41548 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I don't like seeing evidence that humans are generally easily fooled, even though I know it's true < 1313039398 292102 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I can't find the few models I've seen generally recommended, but basically there are consumer b/w laser printers the same size as inkjets < 1313039400 315037 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :if not smaller < 1313039407 14811 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what about weight? < 1313039409 375633 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Black and white laser printer is good quality. METAFONT can use high resolutions too, if needed. < 1313039410 26880 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of them was a Samsung, IIRC < 1313039413 340534 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thing is, they aren't typically sold in places like PC World < 1313039418 220535 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make crack ink printer. < 1313039433 179882 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: umm, let me try and find one < 1313039446 821911 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :grr, it should be illegal to not list RRPs next to product listings on company sites < 1313039456 497239 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it used to be that it was cheaper to buy ink if you bought a printer along with it < 1313039460 470958 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note: I don't necessarily think this) < 1313039465 527770 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does RRPs means? < 1313039465 600472 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they fixed that by making the printers come with only tiny amounts of ink < 1313039471 19676 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :recommended retail price < 1313039477 268781 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. < 1313039480 285947 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the price at which the manufacturer suggests that retailers sell it for < 1313039487 841359 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's typically a bit higher than the price at which they sell it to the retailer < 1313039505 807242 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, if the manufacturer suggests prices then they should in fact put it there for public < 1313039506 169304 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And doesn't necessarily have anything to do with actual retail price. < 1313039519 12789 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION vaguely remembers trying to work out the tax situation on a chicken and spinach wrap in Canada
< 1313039521 840449 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(usually does, though) < 1313039533 155253 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the UK, advertised prices typically include all relevant taxes < 1313039540 208744 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, this is the cheapest Brother monochrome laser printer, which I've seen recommended a lot; http://www.brother.co.uk/g3.cfm/s_page/215760/s_level/36180/s_product/HL2132U1 -- I'm trying to find the weight now < 1313039549 60624 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :6.7 kg < 1313039554 62483 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if you want a tax breakdown, you ask for a separate receipt with it on < 1313039559 196833 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's also Compact, and it looks pretty small < 1313039573 529376 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :6.7kg is pretty heavy compared to small inkjets < 1313039574 772513 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: In the US, the relevant taxes can vary, heavily. < 1313039575 73295 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :368 x 360 x 183 mm, apparently < 1313039579 717062 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net NICK :MSleep < 1313039586 406918 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, OK; is the weight of a printer its main selling point? < 1313039594 622064 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone still make the old clunky IBM PC keyboard? < 1313039601 600640 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :among people I've observed buying printers, apparently < 1313039604 542835 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although less important than size < 1313039614 396051 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: no, but there's enough of them to be sold for about a million years < 1313039618 124493 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not ltierally a million years) < 1313039623 945081 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that looks about twice the size of the inkjet we have at home < 1313039629 469511 :MSleep!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net NICK :MDude < 1313039640 512624 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I know the protocol is different than modern computers < 1313039641 395438 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it's hard to tell from an image < 1313039642 477131 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, Unicomp still manufactures the model M. < 1313039644 838094 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the one we have here is a combined printer/scanner/"photocopier" (just combination of previous two), so it's huge, and terrible at both < 1313039651 34833 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: no < 1313039651 292198 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pictures may be worth a thousand words, but they're typically the wrong thousand words < 1313039651 866105 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net NICK :MSleep < 1313039657 737194 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: they manufacture a similar keyboard < 1313039665 406248 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't mean the Model M, though. I mean the much older keyboard. < 1313039668 155699 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not the same as the Model M, in non-pedantic ways < 1313039675 864337 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh? < 1313039694 694561 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: this is one of the biggest still-manufactured keyboards you'll find: http://pckeyboards.stores.yahoo.net/122keyterkey.html < 1313039699 697696 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean the one with the function keys at the left. < 1313039719 884845 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: well it's not scientific, but sufficiently obsessed people who have tried both definitely say that the customizer is less clacky; I think the springs are different, or maybe their oiling < 1313039731 443641 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Ah, the XT keyboards. < 1313039731 643369 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yep, the one I linked has that < 1313039736 168773 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, hmm, it might be a different kind on the side < 1313039758 15203 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, stop it, guys, you'll make me into a keyboard nerd again, which I somehow managed to do and get over without having bought a single keyboard < 1313039768 221211 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :beautiful < 1313039781 163962 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that like the way I know far too much about computer games I've never played? < 1313039801 644713 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly; the trick with me was to be sufficiently obsessed about it that I had to be absolutely sure whatever I bought would be the right choice < 1313039813 138810 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :amplified by the fact that good keyboards are pretty expensive < 1313039823 267170 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :then just sit there marred by indecision for a few weeks until you get bored and do something else < 1313039830 511109 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :keyboards suck < 1313039832 279087 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :typing sucks < 1313039845 948937 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a bit like me deciding that any girlfriend I would be willing to accept at a girlfriend, compared to not having one, would have to be so unreasonably perfect that there's no point in looking for one in the first place < 1313039850 851206 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No, the one you linked is a terminal emulation keyboard. < 1313039862 141396 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: you could try stopping < 1313039865 892875 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: see, it works in all areas of life < 1313039873 60548 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: isn't that true < 1313039881 860951 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: i never hear you say anything except that things suck nowadays < 1313039883 886765 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: well, my standards are pretty high < 1313039898 175410 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never had a girlfriend because i was waiting for the perfect woman < 1313039900 691975 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :then i found her < 1313039906 722805 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :turns out, she's waiting for the perfect man :( < 1313039916 548108 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fair enough < 1313039932 230819 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also the problem that the very small number of people who might potentially qualify, probably do so for other people too < 1313039950 449320 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, I think there's more than a 50% chance you just made that up to sound poetic < 1313039965 837309 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're overestimating me, it's a quote < 1313040026 70264 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Every relationship I've been in has been fundamentally flawed in some way or another. < 1313040035 47422 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :all in the same way < 1313040037 52681 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you were in them < 1313040045 8594 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only difference being that I got out of the most recent one quickly. < 1313040047 201499 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, actually. < 1313040056 116185 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The important thing is to find someone who's compatibly flawed. < 1313040059 576815 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which I have, and I'm happy. < 1313040236 431866 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, did I just unintentionally compare girlfriends to keyboards? < 1313040254 173092 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the difference < 1313040294 80725 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :both are dirty and unhygienic yet you touch them all the time < 1313040298 746955 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only some keyboards have clits. < 1313040313 786005 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :To be blunt. < 1313040381 386160 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1313040448 129883 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, no keyboard I've ever owned has made me feel as shitty as any of my ex-(girl|boy)friends have. < 1313040495 907964 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nor as excellent? Well, there is programming... < 1313040499 850538 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, this is definitely going to be a horrible hack, maybe I'll do that esolang instead < 1313040505 850799 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how soon do I need to fill that name < 1313040517 199555 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have a while < 1313040537 255807 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a limit < 1313040540 908635 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, about 99% of a while, by now < 1313040545 273495 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313040547 927633 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you've used some of it discussing keyboards < 1313040549 553959 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :how long is the while < 1313040561 832764 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure, I was approximating < 1313040570 611512 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's quite long as whiles go, though < 1313040647 849711 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1313040654 58277 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess blips have to be directional to preserve nice things like symmetry < 1313040662 946479 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :still, it does make the nondeterminism mechanism a bit weird < 1313040690 227993 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :symmetry < 1313040719 679924 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also have a new system, unlike @ it uses both CTRL and ALT, but ALT does not have the meaning like on most computers, instead ALT is like another SHIFT like the TOP and GREEK keys on a Space Cadet keyboard. < 1313040836 461355 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: monqy: http://sprunge.us/iRVi is this nice... is this worth having directionless blips for and thus losing symmetry < 1313040847 290566 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it still works with directional blips, it's just weird for blips to suddenly change direction for no reason?? < 1313040876 510075 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :directionless blips? as in wireworld or something else? < 1313040879 147178 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it /needs/ directional blips, or there's no way to prevent it from having a chance of going back the way it cam < 1313040880 509219 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*came < 1313040886 303591 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :just as in blips travel either vertically or horizontally < 1313040889 342525 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :depending on which way the wire is < 1313040892 182160 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's always right or upwards < 1313040892 254396 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313040897 207649 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever < 1313040903 222895 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, just one direction is chosen arbitrarily < 1313040913 440531 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's hideous but it makes the nondeterminism i showed there ... nicer? kind of......... < 1313040923 112080 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, how does it know not to go left? < 1313040924 91725 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What if you have a tail? The tail can be in space, but I suppose you could also use a time tail instead < 1313040931 389431 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: because that's the rules < 1313040933 719343 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it never goes left < 1313040934 630108 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or down < 1313040952 13608 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, up and right only? < 1313040956 565548 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you do a loop, then? < 1313040974 871314 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't, or there might be another type of wire, BUT LOOK OK IGNORE ALL THE PROBLEMS < 1313040980 100788 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just like... < 1313040985 196959 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's sad that i can't have directionless blimps.. < 1313040991 399509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it makes the splits nicer :( < 1313041001 245081 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :would wireworld-style blips work < 1313041052 156917 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're kind of ugly?? i think, maybe, i don't know < 1313041091 440899 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: they're head+tail < 1313041107 286456 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tails are just locations where there was a head the turn before, and they block blips < 1313041112 397371 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so blips are forced to keep moving the same way < 1313041140 457661 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, I know < 1313041146 164186 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just kind of ugly :( < 1313041151 794550 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think wireworld blips would work in your example thing I think??? oh wait no. I forgot you wanted 1/2 probablity thing. < 1313041151 929110 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :is wireworld ugly < 1313041159 729773 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well they might work but < 1313041163 115812 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: well it is kind of a cool way to do randomness.... < 1313041174 64098 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was thinking of them going both ways < 1313041185 314886 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be uglier to make it do random < 1313041186 36951 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1313041208 946293 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well but < 1313041215 690503 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was going to have an explicit thing to clone blips < 1313041217 641449 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :to make them go both ways < 1313041226 258204 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be a different kind of join to +.... < 1313041240 412644 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Totally off-topic: does anyone have any suggestions for out-of-copyright (e.g., Project Gutenberg) texts I should use for voice acting samples? < 1313041243 790962 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh + is special? < 1313041267 111397 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking |+- were all the same oops < 1313041285 784458 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :like just sugar for each other < 1313041312 716414 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :im too used to wireworld style :'( < 1313041328 614234 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: i don't know :( < 1313041332 468775 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to do something.... different.... < 1313041343 844602 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: make it different from Wireworld, or I'll be annoyed at you < 1313041353 366153 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :interestingly different, that is < 1313041366 307233 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is wireworld bad < 1313041367 916145 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should probably allow unboundedly many blips on a square, and make it TC that way < 1313041368 675432 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :brainfuck on wires < 1313041370 752173 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, it's good < 1313041375 125404 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's sub-TC without an infinite program < 1313041385 50002 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's non-good < 1313041395 191172 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it's a cellular automaton, what did you expect? < 1313041417 157993 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :GoL is TC with a finite program, right? < 1313041454 65423 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you make a time tail to tell which direction to don't go? < 1313041456 4737 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's TC with a bounded-nonwhite program < 1313041472 352163 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, the playfield has to be infinite, but only a finite portion needs initialising to nonblank < 1313041474 324305 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :good < 1313041476 661228 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1313041480 455133 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not the same for wireworld? < 1313041502 809864 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that makes sense, although what if you allow for infinite wire too? < 1313041503 911933 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I kind of want to make my language not a CA somehow, like maybe a bully automaton??? < 1313041506 257918 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need a repeating pattern for wireworld < 1313041517 177413 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if blips carried code would that be interesting help < 1313041523 435167 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: hidden state :( < 1313041526 972586 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean < 1313041530 663785 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the "help" meme a specific elliott/monqy thing? < 1313041539 250295 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know who started it < 1313041539 322096 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: Try. < 1313041539 671777 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was some way to get them to represent code < 1313041550 908178 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try to see if you can make them carried code < 1313041551 384460 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it seems to apply to a wide range of situations in my life < 1313041558 563677 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's mostly you two who use it < 1313041563 167660 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i not know what do help < 1313041567 558056 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nearly always pinging each other < 1313041569 74480 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that's his fault, if it wasn't him, I would be the person who used it < 1313041614 933351 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is the state necessarily hidden or otherwise inelegant I cannot tell < 1313041622 798442 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: well do you want it to like < 1313041624 821749 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :dangle from the blip < 1313041629 836793 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that would take up a lot of space < 1313041630 112554 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not know < 1313041707 655025 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Crap, as if the Funciton didn't already make me want to make a 2D language, all this talk of cellular automata and Wireworld and whatnot have really sent me over the threshold. < 1313041708 178184 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just thinking maybe making it self-extending/modifying would be interesting but maybe it wouldn't maybe it would ruin it help < 1313041716 195520 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :*the Function article < 1313041771 370796 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may have missed the design goals statement was there ever one < 1313041778 829712 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :missed/forgotten < 1313042142 792859 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :*the Funciton article < 1313042143 977401 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dammit. < 1313042260 92026 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do you type "help" after some sentences is the question mark broken on your computer? < 1313042341 844525 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes? < 1313042359 868627 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :help? < 1313042365 568546 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1313042377 458435 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, it works now. < 1313042383 31915 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it's still broken? < 1313042395 445951 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, I didn't know that. < 1313042482 374925 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, "bully automaton" doesn't even seem well-defined < 1313042529 924661 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it isn't < 1313042548 21681 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about RUBE makes it not a CA? < 1313042554 612631 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I realise it's about pushing things around < 1313042562 618937 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm not sure how that implies non-adjacent changes < 1313042679 894370 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1313042717 309249 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1313042772 432972 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if I should just use one character for wire rather than two (- and |) < 1313042782 319498 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't think of a decent character for it, though; maybe =? < 1313042786 22441 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: consider dozer crate crate crate crate crate... < 1313042792 934263 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the dozer moves the rightmost crate as well as all the others < 1313042805 748646 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CAs don't have that sort of action at a distance < 1313042820 429190 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah < 1313042830 229790 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(bully automata don't have a "speed of light" in the sense that CAs do, for that reason) < 1313042844 579420 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CLEARLY THIS ALLOWS US TO SUBVERT THE IRL SPEED OF LIGHT < 1313042860 168885 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :SOMEONE GET THE BULLDOZER < 1313042887 611134 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: in real life, it doesn't work because you can't exceed the speed of sound that way < 1313042888 918900 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's lower < 1313042900 929679 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it can be quite high in a sufficiently stiff object, but it's always lower than the speed of light) < 1313042902 235515 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you can if you have a fast enough bulldozer < 1313042911 996052 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, as in, the speed of sound in crate < 1313042915 937354 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :SSSSHHH < 1313042916 20335 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's how the speed of sound is defined < 1313042919 413421 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just need a fast enough crate < 1313042922 937386 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you push one end, the soonest the other end reacts < 1313042931 428521 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I like the phrase "speed of sound in crate" < 1313042941 542368 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like "fast enough crate" < 1313043036 788861 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you probably mean stiff, not fast < 1313043109 518326 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1313043112 3126 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean fast >:( < 1313043113 305304 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll give you a sufficiently stiff object. < 1313043128 748161 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :To chime in with extremely poor comedic timing. < 1313043155 696894 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1313043273 835896 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, oh dear < 1313043413 514032 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:47:13: Well, first of all.. why is there a 1 to 1 association between programming and language < 1313043413 724775 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:47:29: itidus20: you'd make a great liberal arts major. < 1313043413 797501 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1313043445 237877 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 to 1 association between programming and language what does this even mean < 1313043473 600020 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:11:09: we speak of turing complete a lot.. but what about CPU-complete? :D < 1313043475 21815 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is beautiful < 1313043488 915925 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:12:40: I never shut up.. I am the bane of those who would read the logs < 1313043489 161204 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:13:38: itidus20, no, that's elliott. < 1313043489 234405 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:13:54: He takes great pride in the fact that he talks twice as much as his nearest contender. < 1313043493 220067 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might be more by now, Vorpal doesn't talk any more < 1313043502 587543 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :soon it will just be me < 1313043506 846647 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :alone < 1313043508 592905 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :forever < 1313043511 116539 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :;_; < 1313043582 247787 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should talk more to compete with you. < 1313043586 139576 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:29:57: Taneb: So going back to my point about PC/human. I think what has happened is that everyone in programming has been channeled into a very standard mindset of programming with many unnecessary bonds to mathematics. < 1313043586 415345 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :said like someone who wants to program but isn't any good at mathematics < 1313043587 595147 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You both. You all. < 1313043591 306328 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: What about those "rigid bodies" every physics book has? (Along with the massless ideal springs and other such devices.) < 1313043604 353368 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: those sound useful can i have one < 1313043610 189380 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also can you make that talking over time graph thing again < 1313043613 361144 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to see my dominance............ < 1313043624 244298 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think the physicists keep them locked up somewhere. < 1313043647 13549 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :help, tell the physicists to unleash their irc graphs < 1313043680 217788 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:44:10: so be afraid if they inject you with intelligence medicine, be afraid if they implant a chip in you, be afraid if they hook an EEG machine up to your cubicle < 1313043680 387403 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :im afraid < 1313043710 477293 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :You want a talking-over-time-of-day graph or talking-over-just-plain-old-regular-time-as-in-for-the-last-year-or-so-whatever graph? < 1313043726 703040 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: It... was the one that had a lot of misshapen colours piling on top of each other. < 1313043728 507567 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "home-grown" one. < 1313043731 271087 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was very wide. < 1313043733 658032 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think one pixel per hour? < 1313043744 270034 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that's the time-of-day one, I suppose. < 1313043757 880911 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :The other one had one pixel per 15 days or so in some settings. < 1313043764 860439 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll see if I can figure out how to use the script. < 1313043766 155264 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same thing if you zoom out. < 1313043777 10651 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean you could use the other one if Vorpal looks worse on it. < 1313043797 988761 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1313043812 178422 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :The time-of-day graph takes time modulo a day, the other one doesn't. Anyway, let's see. < 1313043823 472527 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :die "usage: perldoc $0" unless $network and $chan and $outfile; # ain't that fancy? < 1313043831 349853 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"perldoc" < 1313043841 597972 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i see < 1313043844 28884 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a stupid help message :D < 1313043849 587902 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg arcane sentiment is updating reulglarly again < 1313043855 201640 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, and the perldoc's out of date too. < 1313043940 849941 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously, die `perldoc $0` would be better. < 1313044064 397407 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"DBD::Pg::st execute failed: ERROR: operator does not exist: logs.etype = integer" < 1313044072 830703 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :My poor script seems to have bitrotteded. :( :( :( < 1313044082 587356 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1313044088 793844 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sigh. Is it so much to ask to have Linux + bidirectional pipes + extra default file descriptors for non-textual console I/O? < 1313044099 702644 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :linux has bidirectional pipes < 1313044100 153705 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe this one is an old one. < 1313044113 843542 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :if your shell doesn't provide convenient ways to construct them, that's its problem < 1313044121 922725 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most of the time, but with the other thing. < 1313044125 873394 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1313044130 315950 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a good shell < 1313044136 377707 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: dunno < 1313044150 896602 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :are they all bad :( < 1313044156 393204 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe :( < 1313044163 839096 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i use bash because i'm lazy, but when i wasn't feeling lazy I used zsh?? < 1313044172 116662 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything is bad. < 1313044172 530167 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is very big and bloated but it felt comfortable....... < 1313044175 269951 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1313044176 378565 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ isn't bad < 1313044211 570789 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:00:51: basically it seems highly likely in this world of no free lunches that something dear would have to be sacrificed to eliminate software patents < 1313044233 703860 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: so if someone introduced mandatory laws for senseless kitten-killing, because "there are no free lunches" it would necessarily cost something important to eliminate it? < 1313044244 288091 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :some things are just bad. < 1313044291 171441 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:18:21: OK there is a guy in #jesus who is a Wolfram employee and thinks Wolfram is a genius. < 1313044291 503331 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my gojdfoijd < 1313044321 180200 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313044336 905087 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:05:34: Why not Xesus? Because Xs are cool (see the 90s). < 1313044337 71335 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:05:51: in that case i think Xristos would be more traditional < 1313044337 144260 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :jason is that you < 1313044426 399323 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently not. < 1313044482 279521 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Technically it's not an X in Xristos. It's a chi. < 1313044553 622960 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ξριστος < 1313044601 417293 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:06:15: hoogle is even worse than haskell < 1313044601 681774 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:06:30: are we _sure_ someone hasn't hacked lament's account? < 1313044603 23848 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Χριστός < 1313044608 450439 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait how is that out of character at all < 1313044616 495310 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i'm done with the looges < 1313044620 504615 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You used Xi instead of Chi. < 1313044631 425752 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was demistrating what it would be if it was an x < 1313044644 743799 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. Ksristos. < 1313044658 368762 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exactly < 1313044675 513883 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :more like VISTOS < 1313044690 675924 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Greeks didn't have a v? < 1313044703 413725 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Inorite is the substance of agreement. Amirite is the substance of desperation. < 1313044722 676438 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, elliottcraft needs inorite < 1313044730 370474 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how's elliottcraft(ais) doing < 1313044738 299033 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Okay uh this is based on data from 2008-01-01 until now: http://zem.fi/~fis/foo1.png (and the times are probably EET/EEST). < 1313044741 787171 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Beta used to be [b], but now it's [v]. < 1313044748 318355 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: haven't worked on it for a while < 1313044752 987638 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*elliott < 1313044761 873746 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Quit doing that. :P < 1313044763 660406 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have the mechanics worked out, I think < 1313044764 774764 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: huh. < 1313044765 217666 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I get all excited. < 1313044766 90687 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just don't want to code it < 1313044766 581396 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Um surely not, Vorpal hasn't talked much in ages. < 1313044770 448939 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: stop talking right after elliott does < 1313044773 239695 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And... what's with that massive slump? < 1313044783 611113 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: see, this is the problem with most-recently-spoken tabcomplete < 1313044795 63210 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I don't have to tab-complete elliott, so I have no problems < 1313044798 27453 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're ai < 1313044805 844445 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I typically type the first two letters manually, then tab < 1313044813 171953 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too, it seems < 1313044815 161794 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ditto. < 1313044816 109295 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're mo < 1313044818 161461 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I generally type the whole thing < 1313044820 830488 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do for most people < 1313044822 474075 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like how our sleep schedules appear to be unified. < 1313044824 913903 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but elliott is typically just e < 1313044826 395135 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :taneb is tan though < 1313044831 691908 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq is pik < 1313044838 306732 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb is ta < 1313044839 842506 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find tabs awkward < 1313044847 355582 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq is pi < 1313044862 26272 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: what < 1313044874 179585 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do < 1313044880 826236 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :one thing I dislike about irssi is not having readline-like tabcomplete < 1313044895 456041 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :where it stopes at the first ambiguity, and a second \t lists the options < 1313044901 652258 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I rotate my hand to get to the tab which puts my thumb above the alt key < 1313044906 253360 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :For alt-tabbing < 1313044918 308418 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have a freak hand. < 1313044919 510015 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is fine, but it hurts my wrist a little < 1313044938 5312 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I dislike that irssi doesn't have readline-like lots of things. < 1313044953 416678 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I gladly use it anyway, because I'm a hipster or something. < 1313044956 67487 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use my whatever it's called finget to tab < 1313044994 251488 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if Vorpal hadn't talked much this year at all, 2008-now still means 2008-2010 accounts for well over three fourths. But here's 2011-only for you if you like to see yourself talk a lot, http://zem.fi/~fis/foo2.png < 1313044997 54373 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dude. < 1313045001 996124 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Old names of fingers. < 1313045016 461168 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Index finger, fool's finger, leech- or physic-finger, and ear-finger. < 1313045025 145851 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ear-finger. good name. < 1313045025 447532 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm gonna use these. < 1313045030 76940 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: DEFINITELY THINKING THAT THE PER-HOUR THING WILL BE MOST FAVOURABLE < 1313045033 686077 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better than "pinkie". < 1313045036 972690 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use little finger. < 1313045044 85033 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also how does ais523 talk more than PH. < 1313045066 219329 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :... elliott is *always* the most talkative person here? < 1313045066 393898 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/(li.*er)/"$1"/ < 1313045074 624542 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@121-73-170-157.dsl.telstraclear.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313045074 708811 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@121-73-170-157.dsl.telstraclear.net QUIT :Changing host < 1313045074 780871 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1313045079 986043 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Um. Yes. < 1313045084 593520 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott is very talkative. < 1313045087 212229 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: That's a per-day thing though. < 1313045098 20642 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :If fizzie produces a per-hour graph there SHOULD be some shallow spots on it. < 1313045098 958000 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :SHOULD. < 1313045099 381049 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa I just realized elliott is just e for me that's bizarre < 1313045101 190555 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes, but still. < 1313045108 793258 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313045124 13410 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://zem.fi/~fis/foo2.png Uh? < 1313045127 652741 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I think the last time I was not the most active was for the two weeks or so of unit crap < 1313045131 710323 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zem.fi/~fis/foo2r.png is the relative-talkiness version, basically just scales the total to 1 for each per-minute bin. < 1313045134 546183 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then I got the iPhone < 1313045135 747432 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And < 1313045146 630104 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Managed to still talk the most having only like two to three hours each day on an iPhone keyboard < 1313045156 461261 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: That's not a per-hour graph. < 1313045161 101802 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Is it? fizzie?) < 1313045166 871662 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I see how it works. < 1313045171 206155 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking it was chronological. < 1313045174 488444 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's a day average. < 1313045200 94512 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Which one's the really wide one? That's non-normalised per-hour, right? < 1313045201 806829 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or was it normalised. < 1313045208 978947 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I frog-ret. < 1313045212 427134 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Damn, I'm in "others"? < 1313045214 993090 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is unacceptable. < 1313045223 918270 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should speak < 1313045224 822281 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: I'm just slightly surprised I'm not. < 1313045225 261701 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in shorter < 1313045229 94110 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :broken sentences. < 1313045231 549755 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I < 1313045231 828199 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :od < 1313045232 418373 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that < 1313045232 584054 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < 1313045233 106957 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lot < 1313045233 522298 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :its < 1313045233 977856 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite < 1313045234 876134 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am simultaneously proud, dissapointed, and something else which I can't think of the name to about being in the others < 1313045235 509107 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I don't talk a lot, or there's some bias, or something. < 1313045235 824735 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun < 1313045236 156760 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't think I was *that* talkative. < 1313045240 453108 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I do that broken thing too < 1313045244 357177 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not as much right now??? < 1313045252 121067 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe actually a lot right now < 1313045252 577137 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313045254 511932 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the one that's modulo-a-day, yes. I don't think "the wide graph"'s per-hour, that'd be really wide for any appreciable length of time. I'll try to produce one for 2011 or something. < 1313045256 405673 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though, elliott probably makes my point of reference screwy. < 1313045257 936352 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i cant an help < 1313045279 201951 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Make one where adjacent statements by the same user are merged. < 1313045287 614363 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: NOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooOOOOOOOOOOooOOOOOOOooOOOOOOOooooooooooooOOOOOOOOOOOOOOoooooo < 1313045287 947015 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll cut down on the noise. < 1313045293 38257 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better yet, go by character count. < 1313045301 250782 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott will still be ranked highly no doubt. < 1313045307 241055 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: I think it does go by character count, but I'm not entirely sure. < 1313045311 139567 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways, I really like how we seem to have an average sleep period in spite of spanning so many time zones. < 1313045324 825651 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe if the graphy thing started after (person) joined for the first time < 1313045333 494619 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm GMT-5 (2:50). < 1313045343 444294 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Timezone is irrelevant. < 1313045349 949330 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm UTC-7 (00:50). < 1313045350 563771 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's not terribly late yet. < 1313045355 930026 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, yes, you'd think that. :) < 1313045356 417985 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You must sacrifice your schedule for the sake of the channel. < 1313045360 463993 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm 2351 oops < 1313045365 457309 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: old, < 1313045374 519842 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i accidentally let myself age < 1313045382 534963 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it happens < 1313045411 485531 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your sleep appears to be extraordinarily... Diverse. < 1313045422 589032 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :im sleep connosiuer < 1313045454 647182 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not connoiseur. That'd be too classy. < 1313045486 599756 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sleep (derogatory term for connoiseur) < 1313045492 882072 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I *always* read "im" as [Im], not [aIm]. < 1313045506 631762 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too < 1313045509 566743 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh no, the other graph has managed to lose all X-axis labels. But http://zem.fi/~fis/foo3.png represents stuff from start of 2011; one pixel equals 4 hours, values taken as averages over 3-day Hamming-weighted windows to smooth the daily /\/\ variation out a bit. There's at least one no-elliott gap there. < 1313045526 249684 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :whenever I say "im", I read it like [Im]. it is a thing I do. < 1313045526 394902 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoops, that one doesn't merge elliott and elliott_. < 1313045530 4889 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :The other one did. < 1313045538 898590 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: >:E < 1313045544 742535 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :UNACCEPTABLE < 1313045554 304154 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am still not on there and this is unacceptable. :( < 1313045563 32506 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should come on here at all hours and yammer. < 1313045563 597234 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :How am I active simultaneously with my non-_-self < 1313045565 177560 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D < 1313045566 64616 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :when did you first join does that a difference make < 1313045569 220344 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously, look at it < 1313045570 717676 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use the logs to take notes for posterity. < 1313045592 763041 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: I first joined in two thousand and six, first started saying things the second time I came here in the next year < 1313045603 776562 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have been annoying everyone since < 1313045606 834960 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I had this absurd dream last night. < 1313045607 297137 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : Use the logs to take notes for posterity. < 1313045607 962202 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeo < 1313045610 299265 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant evincar but okay < 1313045613 763466 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which I am now going to talk about. < 1313045615 253802 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :At length. < 1313045617 801855 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1313045618 428152 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :WELL < 1313045619 892137 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1313045622 306591 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that your dream sounds.... < 1313045623 717330 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :intersting? < 1313045626 346354 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1313045627 43665 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1313045627 738387 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I was in this house. < 1313045628 677502 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's put it this way: < 1313045630 17228 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was a detailed house. < 1313045631 522592 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can type a lot faster than you < 1313045631 635853 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I first joined in 2011 and talked on was it the third day of being here and only after prompted < 1313045632 719730 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :almost ecrtainly < 1313045633 805693 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically < 1313045635 740914 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1313045636 20673 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wasn't aware that I was dreaming < 1313045637 354934 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't care about errors < 1313045638 268869 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :of any kind < 1313045638 585802 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is unusual for me. < 1313045639 452289 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically < 1313045641 420175 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can always outpace you < 1313045644 885095 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically < 1313045647 74830 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :give up < 1313045648 638672 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you lose < 1313045650 457011 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zem.fi/~fis/foo3b.png merged the '_' and ''. < 1313045651 19839 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok go on but this sounds shit < 1313045652 899775 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :your dream is shit :( < 1313045658 2581 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I came here in 2011 and had fun < 1313045663 823517 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was this friend of mine, and this girl, and we were all about eight years older. < 1313045664 874891 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that's better. < 1313045668 466544 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: what's with that gap < 1313045672 940195 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: tell me more please thanks ok < 1313045680 139483 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And someone suggested a threesome, and we all agreed, but then no one could agree on the mechanics, so we gave up. < 1313045693 552861 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :are all your dreams about threesomes < 1313045702 809714 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then she went in another room and when I followed her later I found she'd been eaten from the mid-thigh up by hell-hounds that lived in the closets. < 1313045710 524620 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I had to give them a stern talking-to. < 1313045721 112153 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually that's about it. < 1313045729 226114 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think two dreams of mine (and I think the only two I talked about in here) made it into the quote database thing < 1313045750 326820 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :where by quote database thing I mean someone did `addquote on them < 1313045764 129106 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`pastequotes monqy < 1313045765 532150 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.25498 < 1313045781 504564 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :362) I've only watched bad movies about video game. I enjoyed every second of it. < 1313045781 751297 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this was a good moment < 1313045821 343655 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh it was day of the zeptobot < 1313045830 4513 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :04:32:52: I've never seen a bot forget where it put its PRIVMSG before < 1313045849 679156 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`pastequotes evincar < 1313045850 824426 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.32593 < 1313045856 243546 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :amazing < 1313045859 472083 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1313045884 153274 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :deserved < 1313045886 197043 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :>:( < 1313045886 445470 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What would it make if you replaced the rule of induction in Typographical Number Theory with the negation? Is it possible to define TNT in Haskell using only the type system? Can you represent even how the variable bindings in TNT works representable in Haskell type system only? < 1313045892 40128 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :404) my most fresh dream is one where I'm at a soup contest and a chicken really wants to participate but he's disqualified so he becomes the judge. when all the soups are done and he's ready to taste them he just stares at the soup and then I become the chicken and I really want to make soup < 1313045892 887928 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: me < 1313045966 238366 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have not had a nifty memorable dream in too long (i.e. weeks???) :( < 1313045973 74466 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The gap was from March 15th to 25th or so -- http://p.zem.fi/acrb has your per-day lines -- I think it was that [(anti)^n]optbot... thing. < 1313045996 538493 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That wasn't really about the 'bots, but yes probably. < 1313046004 240891 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: but will you always remember malaria.... < 1313046018 296444 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, okay; I can't say I was following too closely. < 1313046022 663973 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :This week I had a dream about pokemon but other than that I did not remember. (But maybe, that is all there is! Is it?) < 1313046037 428919 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's probably not as memorable as a dream i affectionatley refer to as "afro jesus" for reasons apparent to those who know what the dream is (it was a good dream) < 1313046040 519115 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It occurs to me that "Christ" means "anointed one", as a literal translation of "Messiah". < 1313046045 761322 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jesus covered in oil. < 1313046069 993602 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh right I remember one time saying in here that in my best dream I died at the beginning. that was that dream. it was a good dream. < 1313046070 898342 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have three more quotes than monqy! Ha! < 1313046071 859894 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: i am interested, < 1313046089 449913 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is complicated and I sort of probably forgot a lot of it :( < 1313046091 929059 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`delqutoe everything with taneb < 1313046093 892250 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: So now you can do that if you make any art of Jesus Christ < 1313046095 854755 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1313046130 451388 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, two of the quotes were kinda cheating < 1313046155 754171 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least two of mine are cheaty too < 1313046185 362739 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you didn't count those < 1313046196 128511 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I counted them < 1313046280 844605 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Just for completeness' sake, http://zem.fi/~fis/foo3r.png has the relativized version.) < 1313046308 278843 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is absurd. < 1313046338 581865 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway the dream I refer to as "afro jesus" started by me being in a car with my family but then bad things happened and it started to bounce and then it fell in water (and I think I died but it is kind of ambiguous) < 1313046345 186845 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What is that a graph of? < 1313046378 183424 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: It's a graph of how much different people have been talking on this channel during this year. < 1313046387 853893 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wake up in a beige shower chamber thing naked so I find clothes and put them on then walk down this corridor and find this group of people walking into this meeting room thing < 1313046473 906830 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I like how I'm fairly competitive with EVERYONE ELSE ON THE CHANNEL COMBINED. < 1313046502 127071 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, sort of. < 1313046505 505573 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forget what happened in there but then we walked down into this garden/auditorium thing to which a bunch of other people were walking and after a little while this white man in purple robes and with a huge afro walked onto the stage and called himself jesus and said some stuff I forget < 1313046523 788566 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it still is. < 1313046560 418977 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :then he led us into a bathroom and there were paintings on the wall of this guy in dark magenta cloak thing with a bird beak mask and jesus called him death and taught us martial arts so we could fight death and warned us never to be alone or death will find us < 1313046578 236706 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway I forget the rest except the end in which somehow I managed to be alone and then I was death the end < 1313046635 281586 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also have other dreams and I even remember some of some of them too. < 1313046683 459644 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :definitlrey hte best dream. < 1313046688 623192 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have also had dreams whatever I remember I recorded and I also recorded other people dreams they told me about < 1313046712 179756 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :like one time I was walking around the world (which was incidentally concave) a bunch of times and then I ended up on a beach and it was getting stormy and there was this tall blue building so I went into it and then got into the elevator and there was a phone on the elevator and my parents called me and tried to convince me I was on drugs < 1313046722 395964 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It looks slightly worse for you if we count characters instead of lines -- http://zem.fi/~fis/foo3rc.png (though I'm not entirely certain the character-count went right) < 1313046754 409396 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm still king, yo. < 1313046764 744195 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: were you < 1313046772 291459 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't know < 1313046781 727568 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: Yes I have recorded that one you wrote on here before < 1313046801 191713 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't record my dreams. maybe I should. :( < 1313046819 291604 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. I do record both my own and others. That is, if I can. < 1313046857 267598 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also had a dream that there was a new game, it was a maze with signs that said "Retro" and if you hit one of the signs you lost the game. Someone was trying to do something bad with that game, so I tried to break what they were trying to do with a laser, but they immediately fixed it, so I used an ancient Greek gun, which would have permanently stopped them had I aimed properly. < 1313046895 336803 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the malaria dream I actually only told a very small part of it, such as to make a good punchline, but the whole of the part I remember of the dream is much better < 1313046928 515103 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of my dreams partially involve indescribable things, so I do not describe those parts. < 1313046934 562434 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to school but the car breaks down so I walk and there's this big glass museum so I figure I should go inside to see what time it is to make sure I'm not late < 1313046941 793433 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1313046967 92216 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I look around, and all the digital clocks all spell "malaria", and the analogue clocks all point to "malaria", and then there's this dancing skeleton who look's like he's bad cgi < 1313046993 445787 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :malaria o'clock < 1313046999 145858 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :his eyes were all glowy red and stuff < 1313047011 449054 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm off to bed to dream crazy things because of this. < 1313047025 954830 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have never had a dream this good < 1313047032 766135 :evincar!~jon@d-rev-bng-70-20-46-100.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net QUIT :Quit: I hope you're happy. < 1313047058 591834 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone thinks he's evil so they run outside and I do too, but then I start dancing along and then his eyes turn cyan and he started playing using a ghost jumprope and he gave me half of a really big ghost jumprope but I am awful at jumprope so I just slammed it against the ground a lot and danced with him < 1313047071 59624 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :then someone taunted him or something and he turned red and did his evil dance again < 1313047081 5962 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is honestly amazing < 1313047099 871052 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think he was just misunderstood < 1313047103 550014 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and wanted people to love him < 1313047110 937822 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they didn't because they misunderstood him < 1313047114 935101 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :deep < 1313047142 870724 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CGI skeletons are your friend < 1313047149 650407 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just like Jason and the Argonauts < 1313047193 726566 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is some story someone once made up. A clock maker once entered his store to find all the clocks showing a different time. The television signal was too fuzzy to see the time. So he called his wife. His wife looked at the clock and it just said "OK OK OK OK OK" (both the digital and analog clocks did that). So he called the police. The police first said why do you bother me just to ask me the time? That is stupid, so he looked and saw that < 1313047206 226685 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: tell more dream story...... < 1313047221 376530 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i was writing one but i am pausing to read this dream < 1313047223 863191 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :He called the prime minister. The prime minister's clock had the same problem. He called everyone. Everyone's clock had the same problem. < 1313047234 191120 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had a dream where I was in this mediaeval country and I married the king's daughter < 1313047243 872822 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: cut off at " do you bother me just to ask me the time? That is stupid, so he looked and saw tha" < 1313047252 164710 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The king got pissed off at my and forced me to marry his other daughter too < 1313047255 55509 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :t his clock also just says OK OK OK OK OK OK OK < 1313047263 738531 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then disowned both of them and forced me into exile < 1313047274 870136 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so I'm in this treehouse and see these policemen talking to children and filling out red papers and then one of them looks at me at eye level (maybe he grew big legs???) and reminds me it's native american appreciation day (continued on next line) < 1313047280 217993 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I lived with two wives in a pretty awesome treehouse that had a jacuzzi < 1313047297 950402 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was sunny nowhere except for the North Pole, so nobody could make a sundial to figure out the time. < 1313047313 962707 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so he starts quizzing me on stuff but he's near incomprehensible and pronouncing everything wrong and when I tell him I don't understand he gets all mad and yells at me about how I should appreciate native americans more < 1313047314 278754 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my god its like amazing dream christmas for me < 1313047328 598321 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy learns about his internalised racism < 1313047348 183119 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I sneak a glance at the red paper and there's this disability grid pyramid thing and I am classified as having hearing problems and not appreciating native americans < 1313047382 461075 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :disabilities < 1313047417 327665 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :My friend's uncle or somebody (some relative) calls tomatoes redskins < 1313047425 4538 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or called. He may have died < 1313047427 670354 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :trying to remember more good dreams < 1313047480 246749 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I almost remember one but nope :( < 1313047484 841127 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had one dream: I was going to play Dungeons and Dragons, and they had a lot of radio machines and stuff for Dungeons and Dragons that we didn't have the equipment for. < 1313047510 750672 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was different sections in different chapters, a compartment to put audio tapes in, a radio transmitter, a few rooms for puzzlement and some boxes on the bottom to keep creature types in. I was unable to figure out why it didn't work. And then I realized that it needed electricity to keep the creature types in the boxes, so I put batteries in and then the machine(s) worked. < 1313047529 724071 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also had to be connected to a VCR, but the only reason for the VCR was to indicate the amplitudes. The VCR was connected to a TV. The TV had no use, neither did the audio tape compartments. Suddenly I arrived at my grandparents house and the machines were interfering with the TV so I turned it off. < 1313047568 626383 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh I remembered one but it's kind of not very happy < 1313047582 204631 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does my things ever make any sense to you? < 1313047587 682896 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: that is ok, zzo38 yes < 1313047602 787258 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I was at the library with my parents and we were leaving but my mother just ran out to the car and drove off without us and my father just disappeared < 1313047636 943809 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I knew my grandmother was at a nearby beach with my sisters so I walked over there to find her < 1313047693 490374 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :she was sitting at the top of this inflatable slide thing and when I climbed up I found she was wailing about wanting to die and stuff and when I tried to convince her that that was a bad idea and she should take me home instead she stepped and fumbled on the bouncy and laned on a baby and killed it < 1313047698 494937 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also she died < 1313047703 592165 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :both her and the baby < 1313047743 140276 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy has some internalised issues < 1313047805 308307 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: what if i wrote a haskell binding to fltk....none exist.... < 1313047812 31457 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh darn at least one does < 1313047819 250592 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh but it's unupdated < 1313047828 714982 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Hmmm. < 1313047839 441317 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :another dream: I was with a friend who isn't really a friend but my parents force me to pretend he is and we were at one of my one of my sisters' school and it was night and my parents were doing some unpacking or packing or something < 1313047847 611342 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't even really used fltk but it might be nice I guess???? < 1313047881 969234 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :he opens this bag of doritos or something and I forget what happens next but then my dad sneaks up and gets all mad about us doing drugs and yells at me and chases me but eventually we go home < 1313047897 441860 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: can i be you.... and have dreams.... that you have... < 1313047918 114215 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :next day, at grandparents house, he tells me we should talk, so i follow him; one of my sisters starts following, but he doesn't want her to follow, so he splashes water in her face and she stops < 1313047952 128456 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :while going down the hallway he grabs me and takes me into the bathroom then locks the door and strangles me while yelling about what a disappointment I am < 1313047981 300668 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so last time i said it i was joking about the internalised issues thing < 1313048039 11777 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone told me they once had one dream where it ended in credits. < 1313048056 965934 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :another dream all I remember about it is my dad chased me around the house and shot at me with a rifle < 1313048064 636478 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh I just remembered another dream < 1313048075 103914 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: is your dad nice........ < 1313048082 924315 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also does this next dream involve your dad trying to kill you again < 1313048084 103101 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :he maybe kind of scares me < 1313048086 585696 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1313048089 516638 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok good < 1313048127 802640 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is someone else's dream, someone I know personally, and who told me: The doctor asked me if I had been to the moon. I said no. The doctor asked me to prove it. He said he could not help me if I could not prove that I had never been to the moon. < 1313048144 759944 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :amazing < 1313048151 689834 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so I'm at a theatre and I leave and then this guy in black with a limo tells me my whole family died and i have to come with him so i did and he takes me to foster care where this foster fother will foster father me and also this girl < 1313048169 75201 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you prove that you had never been to the moon? What is the best way to do so, if at all? < 1313048216 670088 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway day ends, I wake up in a bed with him and the girl and it's inferred that he raped us both and I start freaking out a lot and I think "maybe this is a dream" but then I realize it's not a dream because it is too realistic and freak out even more < 1313048228 922295 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I run to a phone and try calling for help but the phone is really irc and then i realize it is a dream < 1313048235 698321 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like how your dreams are getting progressively more disturbing. < 1313048240 516896 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this intentional < 1313048243 129027 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1313048260 90668 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you need a therapist i have the phone book open < 1313048309 694303 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wish i had cool dreams :( < 1313048311 787482 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1313048384 195047 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I realize if a dream is a dream about half the time. Sometimes even when things are illogical, and I do not realized it is illogical and stuff while I am sleeping, I only realized when I woke up. Sometimes I have dream inside of another dream in another dream in another dream. I think once I had a dream where it changed every time I blink. < 1313048416 416348 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've had a few dreams within dreams but I think I forgot them all < 1313048417 305356 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1313048440 485589 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also forgot the specifics in those cases (if there are specifics, that is) < 1313048533 425389 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think in at least two dreams I've been in a hotel made of glass < 1313048558 221817 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of them was in a disconnected nearly-forgotten part the malaria dream < 1313048578 358968 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i really really want internet-networked dreams < 1313048588 67746 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :like you just connect with a program < 1313048593 576810 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :put on some sort of head thing < 1313048596 267190 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another dream of someone I know personally and who told me: The microwave timer was close to zero and was counting down normally, there was only a few seconds left, yet it never reached zero even in a few minutes. So, I tried to push stop, but it still continued. So, I unplugged it, which also didn't help. So I opened it and then got microwaved and died < 1313048598 657265 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone clicks go < 1313048601 387228 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you put down the computer < 1313048606 956325 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and all your brains make up a multiplayer dream together < 1313048612 720597 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be amazing < 1313048615 312311 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it records it somehow for you??? < 1313048618 751297 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but like < 1313048621 891275 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can download plugins < 1313048627 576154 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that when it mixes all your dreams together < 1313048631 540888 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it also adds a computer with irc access?? < 1313048638 851809 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can be even more incoherent than usual < 1313048640 728472 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I saw a movie about that < 1313048640 976776 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be so great < 1313048653 217037 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt that is possible but you can think about it if you want to. < 1313048671 293820 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember there were also two other disconnected parts of the chicken/soup dream but i can't remember anything about them other than their existance < 1313048672 307233 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE < 1313048689 411112 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah multiplayer lucid dreams = literally the best? < 1313048694 836468 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think one of them invovled a hotel shop, and the other a theatre < 1313048696 880169 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds awesome < 1313048701 146902 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :think of the sex you could have < 1313048721 900254 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I remember another dream now < 1313048725 490561 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i ever become a genius neuroscientist-programmer < 1313048739 177754 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: If you do, then you can try to make something like that if you want to. < 1313048739 537289 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to make it cut the dream off whenever anyone starts to have sex just to ruin it for about 90 percent of the population < 1313048745 849785 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :HA HA HA I CONTROL YOU ALL < 1313048761 308839 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ONLY CONNOISSEURS CAN EXPERIENCE THE MULTIPLAYER DREAMS < 1313048782 493556 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But don't force everyone to use everything if you don't want to do so, and also don't force yourself to control it if it is someone else's copy of the program/equipment < 1313048786 606577 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was back in elementary school but I knew I had already left there or something so maybe there was time travel involved and I was going in the haunted house but then I tripped and these girls jumped out and raped me oops < 1313048798 49289 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(these were girls i knew from elementary school oops) < 1313048800 76488 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :recurring themes in monqy's dreams: < 1313048801 189974 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :- death < 1313048803 287964 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :- rape < 1313048808 437372 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :- skeletons???? < 1313048810 294906 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i maybe have problems???? < 1313048822 772791 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I remembered another dream but then immediately forgot it < 1313048824 129864 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1313048848 112063 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1313048858 270560 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I am availablee now, although it is late. < 1313048859 732658 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-43-247.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1313048859 814317 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-43-247.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1313048859 886622 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1313048863 305626 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :*available < 1313048864 11863 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was part of a really big dream that I like entirely forgot < 1313048888 707350 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will be up for a while still in order to pull a move in BlogNomic < 1313048902 21378 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Yes I know it is late. But still, have you read it? I even added some stuff since earlier today < 1313048917 252902 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway I was in these underground passageways thing and then this ke$ha impostor appears and tries to seduce me but I run away and then her body turns into a spider and she climbs on the walls and chases me and then I run home and tell my irc friends about it (that was part of the dream) < 1313048947 777892 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : recurring themes in monqy's dreams: < 1313048947 944206 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : - death < 1313048948 16435 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : - rape < 1313048948 16504 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : - skeletons???? < 1313048948 401175 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :- irc < 1313048955 776056 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313048962 28110 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: can you please link again? < 1313048963 764523 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1313048986 279262 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: OK. https://devlabs.linuxassist.net/projects/texnicard/wiki/Dangelo_Programming_Language Same URL as before, but some additional contents. < 1313048987 693247 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: i'm curious did you just realise you have problems now in the course of telling these dreams < 1313048992 326778 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a lot funnier if the answer is yes so can it be yes < 1313048998 928232 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not sure < 1313049003 69975 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe yes < 1313049019 385964 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't really think i have problems but maybe i do < 1313049022 345608 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :does that make it funnier < 1313049062 678421 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right and a lot of my dreams involve roadtrips but I think I've forgotten most of those < 1313049077 869574 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many road trips have you been on < 1313049086 337050 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :like maybe 2 but they were both awful < 1313049110 795426 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 or more < 1313049122 7522 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the big 2 are the probably the reasons i have the dreams < 1313049122 172480 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :do monkeys usually go on road trips < 1313049147 725391 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :When reviewing, I realized I had a few dreams involving pokemon in some different ways, at different times. < 1313049149 471948 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :last summer and the summer before my family dragged me to ohio in a car road trip to be with relatives etc < 1313049155 531181 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I guess I have nightmares about this now < 1313049172 826143 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohio the usa state < 1313049189 610243 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :for roadtrip length, imagine me starting in california, because that's where i live. < 1313049189 738609 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there other ohios < 1313049213 852140 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno maybe < 1313049234 576209 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you are from califroania THIS XPEXPLAINS EVERYTHING......... < 1313049240 945725 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does it explain help < 1313049255 750273 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know aren't people from california meant to be weird isnt that like the tsrereoroeoteotoertoeotosertotsoertype < 1313049262 458425 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno < 1313049272 366044 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone I know is pretty boring < 1313049276 69782 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :then again I don't know people < 1313049276 663126 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1313049280 361321 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had one dream where the driver of a subway train drove backwards because she is a druid. < 1313049327 339530 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :... (You drive backwards because you are a druid?) ?? < 1313049426 637343 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm afraid I'm all out of dreams I remember :( < 1313049430 746535 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least < 1313049434 881246 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :remember sufficiently to be interesting < 1313049441 878832 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or that aren't horrible embarrassing < 1313049459 512765 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually I guess maybe they aren't < 1313049465 138620 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but whatever I don't like them < 1313049506 143047 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I just remembered a really early dream I had < 1313049510 160683 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :my first nightmare, I think < 1313049515 833720 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :from when I was a very little kid < 1313049518 847248 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's also amazing < 1313049519 202817 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is good memroises, < 1313049525 58349 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not sogood memroisrsoies, < 1313049525 717417 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had other dreams although some of them are indescribable or have other reasons to don't say, including requiring extremely long description or being too mad to you or something else I don't know < 1313049577 450361 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if you want to, you can review everything I have recorded: http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/misc/weird_dream/dream.txt < 1313049584 676133 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy are you telling us, < 1313049586 614915 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so I was visiting my nextdoor neighbors house which was like a mansion in this dream and everything turned black and their dozens of cats turned into alligators/crocodiles/idontrmemenber/help and were in dishwashers and chased me in the dishwashers < 1313049589 60319 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313049595 33944 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1313049619 238930 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a very profound dream < 1313049671 286412 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :better multiplayer....... < 1313049685 335295 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you sometimes use the word "help" as if it were a question mark? (I don't know for sure) < 1313049727 355658 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :were it a question mark I think it would be incorrect in most cases < 1313049730 102615 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least < 1313049736 804477 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :incorrect if you're not me???? HELP???? < 1313049756 358315 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just remembered another dumb small dream I had < 1313049764 876985 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe in most cases, but maybe not in all cases. < 1313049776 968415 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was in rainbow land and there was this pool of rainbow goo and I touched the rainbow goo and then I melted into rainbow goo < 1313049798 546825 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION tries sometihing,
< 1313049809 575659 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(im trying to write a pogrom) < 1313049812 865720 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes I die in dreams and it always feels the same. it actually kind of feels good. melting into the rainbow goo felt like death, if i recall correctly. < 1313049844 895782 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's been a while since I died in a dream though so I forget exactly how it feels < 1313049909 479616 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this how your religious beliefs work < 1313049921 223952 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont think i have religious belifes < 1313049929 669205 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313049937 511136 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is just how diyeng feels like in dreams for me?? < 1313049964 686085 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes my dreams have afterlives and other weird stuff too < 1313050184 101507 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently I've also told you guys about the bootleg garfield dream, which i happened to forget until now < 1313050202 349345 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :dream.txt is very educational < 1313050251 714563 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well either that or someone else had the same dream which is real spooky < 1313050369 580963 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably pretty common to have the same dream as someone else at some time < 1313050544 300771 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently I've also previously described the walking around the world and blue building on a beach one. I found this out by grepping for garfield in the logs, though. < 1313050562 729048 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?pl \x -> signalDisconnect <$> liftIO (widget `on` event $ x) < 1313050563 431696 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(signalDisconnect <$>) . liftIO . (widget `on` event) < 1313050600 213929 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?pl \widget event -> fromAddHandler $ fmap signalDisconnect . liftIO . on widget event < 1313050600 851434 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :((fromAddHandler . ((fmap signalDisconnect . liftIO) .)) .) . on < 1313050603 23846 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww < 1313050605 602328 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?pl \event -> fromAddHandler $ fmap signalDisconnect . liftIO . on widget event < 1313050606 279457 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fromAddHandler . ((fmap signalDisconnect . liftIO) .) . on widget < 1313050609 156145 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww < 1313050731 171395 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1313050927 638855 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: Most likely, I have recorded it when you have typed it somewhere that I have read it. Although it is also possible someone else has the same dream. < 1313050944 463116 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it would seem unlikely that to be the case. < 1313050945 391748 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i found it in the logs. i must have just forgotten describing it < 1313050990 891106 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thing about using a phone and the phone being irc was also me, apparently. I was describing just the ending of the dream in which my family died and then I got raped < 1313051063 36153 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The file does have stuff that isn't yours, though. So you can read that other kind of stuff too! < 1313051086 168035 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's great i bookmarked it < 1313051087 708550 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of it are attempts to describe my own dream. < 1313051381 323906 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313051412 205492 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember in at least one of my dreams I figured out it was a dream and tried convincing everyone else in the dream that it was a dream but they didn't listen, which frustrated me. < 1313051508 770292 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm oh dear.... < 1313051531 848100 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: that FLTK idea sounds good :-P < 1313051543 303877 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :gtk is doing bad things :( < 1313051672 817795 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what was that esolang you're designing called? it's scrolled past the end of my scrollback, which is pretty long < 1313051692 543102 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: jonny something f asterisk asterisk k < 1313051717 805405 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :My name is Johny, what the F**K????? < 1313051737 549519 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, that's it < 1313051825 198352 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: That happened to me too once where I figured out it is a dream and the other people did not believe me < 1313051906 335225 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know how to encode Fermat's Last Theorem into Typographical Number Theory? < 1313052240 592452 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, this is supremely ugly < 1313052299 239768 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you know your messages can even be received in the middle of a WHOIS response? < 1313052433 944414 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com QUIT :Quit: I think I will rest now. I have to rest too. < 1313053267 977762 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?pl fmap . const < 1313053268 663021 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fmap . const < 1313053309 242101 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(<$)? < 1313053320 128176 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t fmap . const < 1313053321 333276 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b (f :: * -> *). (Functor f) => b -> f a -> f b < 1313053323 681155 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (<$) < 1313053325 1474 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a (f :: * -> *) b. (Functor f) => a -> f b -> f a < 1313053407 822314 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(how did i remember that i've never even used the function) < 1313053755 766446 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow there is something fucked about this < 1313053765 546656 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is it this slow < 1313053775 902527 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313054024 498058 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wha < 1313054024 767450 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :t < 1313054043 605657 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :He is being accosted by ninjae < 1313054158 601491 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do not know how to help so i need help helping help < 1313054410 300138 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?undo \m ps -> do x <- m; set ps x; return x < 1313054410 963976 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :\ m ps -> m >>= \ x -> set ps x >> return x < 1313054413 382557 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?. pl undo \m ps -> do x <- m; set ps x; return x < 1313054414 113545 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(. flip (ap . ((>>) .) . set) return) . (>>=) < 1313054415 789343 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh < 1313054425 647949 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?. pl undo \m ps -> do x <- m; set x ps; return x < 1313054426 312695 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(. flip (ap . ((>>) .) . flip set) return) . (>>=) < 1313054428 263755 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh < 1313055344 398163 :itidus21!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1313055354 810864 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :eek, now there's two of 'im < 1313055383 971761 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1313055416 587620 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :src/CRUD.hs:10:18: < 1313055416 757647 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : Could not find module `Data.Map': < 1313055416 830059 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : It is a member of the hidden package `containers-0.4.0.0'. < 1313055416 830251 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : Perhaps you need to add `containers' to the build-depends in your .cabal file. < 1313055416 830361 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : Use -v to see a list of the files searched for. < 1313055417 906352 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1313055445 767198 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :crud.hs < 1313055868 512426 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gotta love containers eh < 1313056064 20069 :yorick!~yorick@unaffiliated/yorick QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1313056085 94682 :yorick!~yorick@unaffiliated/yorick JOIN :#esoteric < 1313056208 819241 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, my MIBBLII programming is getting better < 1313056228 56640 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1313056277 743776 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I now end up with λnfx.f(nx) when I try to do a successor function rather than λnfx.f x (f (f x)) < 1313056539 952470 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: It's not really containers' fault < 1313056544 389405 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: It's the cabal file being wrong < 1313056560 291884 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, I get that they're example programs and not part of the library, but if they build automatically they should have their dependencies in roder < 1313056561 224916 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :order < 1313056612 652402 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's missing some other files too < 1313056759 214024 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: hello < 1313056875 807342 :FireyFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1313057040 207060 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gotcha! < 1313057062 74412 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :+,[[++-]+] is the church-numeral succ function in MIBBLLII! < 1313057278 800950 :PatashuWarg!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1313057880 783335 :FireyFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly NICK :FireFly < 1313057908 192512 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t map Just < 1313057909 356216 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. [a] -> [Maybe a] < 1313058130 131498 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t fmap pure < 1313058131 227667 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a (f :: * -> *) (f1 :: * -> *). (Applicative f, Functor f1) => f1 a -> f1 (f a) < 1313058134 621886 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: GeneralisedTFY < 1313058144 394650 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot: you should really omit the kind signatures, they're noisy < 1313058173 59440 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what. < 1313058243 652812 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fmap pure [0,9,0] :: [Maybe Int] < 1313058244 976229 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [Just 0,Just 9,Just 0] < 1313058248 786348 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I generalised that for you. < 1313058253 276885 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ah, thanks < 1313058269 542116 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Disclaimer: Generalisation may not necessarily be a good idea. :p < 1313058285 974036 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am somehow now regretting uninstalling Internet Explorere < 1313058316 592323 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: lies < 1313058336 617230 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: I doubt you actually uninstalled it < 1313058342 772971 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You might have removed a shortcut or two :P < 1313058348 797830 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Uninstalling IE is somewhat painful) < 1313058356 358276 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :how goes our freenode GRF < 1313058363 679300 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The new system isn't up yet, is it? < 1313058366 692626 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno < 1313058376 769271 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would I bother caring about that? < 1313058385 684378 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because you're asking questions about it? < 1313058392 942005 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I uninstalled it < 1313058407 438902 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: You really didn't, unless your Windows Explorer also doesn't work. < 1313058425 969614 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fully uninstalling IE involves ripping about five DLLs out of the Windows folder at the very least < 1313058443 943858 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "uninstallation" mechanism provided by the add/remove OS features dialogue just removes the shortcuts < 1313058448 591282 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let r = "re" ++ r in "Internet Explo" ++ r < 1313058450 241195 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : "Internet Explorererererererererererererererererererererererererererererere... < 1313058456 237164 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And maybe iexplore.exe, but that's just a thin shell around the DLL. < 1313058484 137295 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1313058511 866325 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think www.ubuntu.com has an internet explorer deinstaller < 1313058568 12258 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1313058931 374528 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313058951 243398 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Opera installer: only needs Opera closed, takes seconds. < 1313058972 332620 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Opera browser: Ugly, bloated piece of shit < 1313058976 394042 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :IE installer: needs a whole bunch of things close, makes IRC crash, takes ages, and needs me to restart < 1313058991 351352 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :IE browser: Ugly, bloated piece of shit < 1313058994 499297 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :WINNER? < 1313058996 7297 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :OPERA < 1313059006 572692 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :*shrug* I use Chrome. < 1313059012 604943 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just like to keep my options open < 1313059025 658092 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chrome browser: Google's last step to sentience < 1313059037 183779 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ASSIMILATE < 1313059075 688071 :PatashuWarg!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let a = "a" ++ a in "here comes another chinese earthquake " ++ a < 1313059077 579209 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : "here comes another chinese earthquake aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa... < 1313059083 542728 :PatashuWarg!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait I got them mixed up < 1313059091 357822 :PatashuWarg!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let br = "br" ++ br in "here comes another chinese earthquake " ++ br < 1313059093 385561 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : "here comes another chinese earthquake brbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbrbr... < 1313059097 347740 :PatashuWarg!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :much better < 1313059113 63070 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't you mean "bl" < 1313059113 865852 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1313059137 12735 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, #not-math is rubbing off on me < 1313059141 315144 :PatashuWarg!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :racist < 1313059157 394688 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't wear much lace, as it happens < 1313059164 791510 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is on a lorr
< 1313059200 130391 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm done now < 1313059225 899559 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Firefox installer: really good < 1313059239 81598 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, firefox.org is spam < 1313059244 634902 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't visit it < 1313059273 480548 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I'm so tempted now < 1313059277 59485 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't not-math terrible < 1313059284 640571 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forget which one Quadrescence has his little band of idiots in < 1313059299 119892 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Sort of, yes. And Quadrescence doesn't seem to talk much < 1313059322 119451 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Libster? dixon? < 1313059329 329678 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, Libster's there < 1313059334 170483 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I kinda like CESSMASTER < 1313059341 198347 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's a masshole, and we talk about New England < 1313059347 191087 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :k ima win blognomic this week < 1313059356 172694 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, Libster is the guy who trolled weakly here for about three days and then got banned after he decided to spam. < 1313059381 416689 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :dixon was banned for clogging up the channel with bullshit and harrassment with Quadrescence for an entire day... and CESSMASTER's been here, but I don't think for very long or anything. < 1313059407 345940 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :thermopylae's kind of an asshole, too < 1313059421 692260 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't know that name. But I think I'll avoid the place. :p < 1313059425 744500 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or rather, he claims to find me insufferable, so that's my natural reaction < 1313059432 419915 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :He also hangs out in #math < 1313059438 67415 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's some sort of professor or something < 1313059473 969350 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is #math terrible because it lacks TRWBW or good because it lacks TRWBW, I know absolutely nothing about them other than that they're controversial < 1313059480 941742 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol likes him, I seem to recall coppro having an opinion on him < 1313059529 9449 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :TRWBW? < 1313059529 271886 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :#math is terrible for having had TRWBW at all < 1313059544 818128 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater__: So he's as unto an immaculate god, then. < 1313059593 236185 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i think #python aspies::TRWBW == golden paint :: mother lode < 1313059601 129524 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey QUIT :Quit: The Other Game < 1313059656 191099 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is quite remarkable how far along the path to decency a person could get just by taking the opposite of whatever you say. I guess it has to be restricted to the few coherent statements, or that's not really well-defined. < 1313059710 615269 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1313059717 542478 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :but is it then provably closed under multiplication? < 1313059755 68554 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depends how multiplication's defined in the group, I suppose. < 1313059789 643661 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pretty much x (DACHGESCHOSS) y < 1313059820 654540 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then yes, I think the proof is obvious, and I leave it as an exercise for the reader. < 1313059916 857587 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, how applicative of you. < 1313062380 107804 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313062716 856548 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I HAVE A WORKING MIBBLLII CAT PROGRAM! < 1313062718 341074 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :,[<>][,[<>]] < 1313062910 673423 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION briefly considers tempting copumpkin into optimising something to unsafeCoerce; decides to not Summon the Beast.
< 1313062934 373645 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT'S SO SIMPLE AND ELEGANT < 1313063427 851243 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arrgh, stupid Python data hiding < 1313063442 938914 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's stupid about it < 1313063453 628989 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's doing exactly what I don't want it to < 1313063597 357997 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :well then it just sounds like it's doing exactly the right thing, modulo being exactly wrong < 1313063679 589675 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The bad thing is, what it's doing is exactly right < 1313063698 243812 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to access a global variable from the middle of a function < 1313063716 273285 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :and? < 1313063719 407204 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's wrong with that < 1313063727 784688 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :f = 2 < 1313063730 177999 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :def foo(): < 1313063735 736465 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric : print f # 2 < 1313063772 50428 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: "global foo" < 1313063777 321561 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :put that at the top of the function < 1313063789 461030 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :python makes no distinction between variable declaration and variable assignment because van rossum is a moron < 1313063794 268548 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there's that instead. < 1313063823 924603 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable declaration in Python? no such thing. < 1313063826 11408 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :except global. < 1313063836 720690 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: yes there is, otherwise no variables would exist. < 1313063843 763252 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, no. < 1313063845 265160 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are simply declared automatically if you try to assign to a variable that does not exist. < 1313063870 206079 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(where "exist" means "exist in this scope") < 1313063878 302594 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(whereas reading a variable automatically ascends scopes because lol python) < 1313063883 788041 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really see how that is a meaningful declaration, but okay, that's fine. < 1313063924 426295 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I can "declare" variables at runtime in Python, I guess? < 1313063932 518054 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks, people < 1313063935 104288 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Got it working < 1313063945 431873 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: more or less everything in Python happens at runtim < 1313063945 849320 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1313063968 602961 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :..yes... I know how that works. I am just fuzzy on what it means to declare a variable then. < 1313063974 525318 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it apparently means nothing in the case of Python. < 1313063978 943227 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/declare/create/, if it makes you happier < 1313063988 70597 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that does. < 1313063991 393204 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"inserting into a hash table", if you want to think about things from an implementation point of view < 1313063994 707064 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think of a declaration as a static thing. < 1313064037 325935 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :to catch typos and related errors statically instead of at runtime. < 1313064045 235872 :itidus21!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au NICK :itidus20 < 1313064051 840341 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :type errors as well, in the case of static typed languages. < 1313064109 407212 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a very dynamic-language pov. < 1313064124 964225 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: actually I think local variables are stored in an array and the compilation stage transforms local variables into indexes? < 1313064128 689544 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly, so is the idea of declaring at runtime, but I was simply analogising there because Python is a clusterfuck < 1313064155 357372 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: indeed, the "implementation point of view" (i.e. don't tell me what it does, just tell me how it does it) is rarely how things actually happen. < 1313064177 82041 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :see also: C is a bad fit for current CPUs < 1313064180 471252 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds counterintuitive to me, but okay. < 1313064190 168293 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1313064192 518256 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it is; it's a bad way to view things < 1313064198 908573 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it's the... implemtnation point of view. I would expect it to reflect the, uh, implementation. < 1313064226 615735 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe there's the "right implementation point of view, and the wrong ones. :P < 1313064253 30130 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, if you really want to know How It Works, you need to start studying microcode. < 1313064256 974589 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313064268 591499 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no not necessarily on the lowest level. < 1313064284 127955 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a good idea to know what's going on a layer below though, whatever that means. < 1313064285 126080 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then accept the hashtable explanation as an abstraction. :p < 1313064436 751803 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what would happen if Java added a dynamic keyword < 1313064440 175505 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for dynamic typing. < 1313064480 201474 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's called Object < 1313064498 638785 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, kind of. < 1313064515 913990 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just need to say "dictionary" instead of "hashtable" and then it immediately sounds more abstract. < 1313064516 283302 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it will statically error if you try to access a method that is not declared as part of Object, I believe? < 1313064536 283381 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er is method dispatch a runtime error in Java? Can't recall. < 1313064549 893098 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: ((Foo)obj).x() < 1313064561 11352 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you want duck typing then you need reflection, I think. < 1313064567 779111 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Back < 1313064570 871419 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why you'd want such a thing I can't fathom. < 1313064578 921111 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've had a thought < 1313064581 188398 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just need laxer compile time errors for duck typing. < 1313064594 264002 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another "dynamic" view of the world. < 1313064599 572175 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...well, right. < 1313064607 336161 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we are talking about dynamic language constructs < 1313064608 588540 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Type errors and the like aren't additional checks that you can just remove and have everything work out. :p < 1313064609 590784 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a good view to use. < 1313064616 211687 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Combinaroty logic is like a program followed by input, which returns another program and input, which is then executed < 1313064617 696526 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Otherwise you couldn't do any sort of optimisation based on static guarantees.) < 1313064621 491984 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Java is a static language, so. < 1313064637 158492 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I wasn't saying it was practical from an implemtnation point of view. < 1313064642 549956 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :spelled correctly. < 1313064652 403748 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1313064710 792696 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell allows Dynamic by actually making it statically typed, so that it can still optimize, though not as much? < 1313064725 78668 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That, um. No. < 1313064741 810819 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so Dynamic is literally dynamic typing? < 1313064742 919535 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dynamic is basically (void *) bundled with run-time type information. < 1313064751 709080 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as provided by Typeable) < 1313064760 752419 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was an Typeable existential < 1313064761 10786 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So for instance < 1313064761 427035 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fromDyn (Dynamic t v) def < 1313064761 748102 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : | typeOf def == t = unsafeCoerce v < 1313064761 820563 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : | otherwise = def < 1313064769 697467 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: No. data Dynamic = Dynamic TypeRep Obj < 1313064781 831559 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1313064816 55648 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :right so < 1313064816 900577 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, where Obj is < 1313064819 262367 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :type Obj = Any < 1313064830 15179 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is just a type that can hold any algebraic data-type value. < 1313064835 762832 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or can it hold non-ADT things too? Maybe? I forget.) < 1313064849 389016 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't it need to be part of Typeable or something? < 1313064858 727809 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: What would need to be part of Typeable? < 1313064863 758596 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obj < 1313064881 36130 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1313064886 863143 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any is just an opaque value. < 1313064894 361666 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can only get things in and out with unsafeCoerce. < 1313064895 213451 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t Dynamic < 1313064896 32383 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in scope: data constructor `Dynamic' < 1313064903 911908 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dynamic is not a constructor. < 1313064913 907464 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t toDyn < 1313064914 952423 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Typeable a) => a -> Dynamic < 1313064941 816927 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Typeable constraint is because of the requirement for a TypeRep, of course. < 1313064945 765501 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh.. then what are you talking about. :P < 1313064948 272466 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Without which Dynamic would not be able to do the checks that make it safe. < 1313064959 51568 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: What do you mean? < 1313064959 539084 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :how did you get this constructor that doesn't exist. < 1313064970 921317 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's not an /exposed/ constructor. < 1313064979 567277 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was providing the implementation details you were interested in. < 1313064986 353910 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It isn't part of the API. < 1313064988 245751 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah okay, thus why you can't give Any an actual type. got it. < 1313064997 430888 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any _is_ an actual type. < 1313064999 947071 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's in GHC.Prim. < 1313065021 663101 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 1 :: GHC.Prim.Any < 1313065022 664142 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: type constructor or class `GHC.Prim.Any' < 1313065030 78766 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot does not let you access such modules. < 1313065038 160986 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, there is no instance for Num Any. < 1313065083 734456 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing in GHC.Prim's docs about Any < 1313065097 289731 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I beg to differ. < 1313065099 802348 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure you're not making stuff up? :P < 1313065126 822431 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.haskell.org/ghc/docs/7.0.3/html/libraries/ghc-prim-0.2.0.0/GHC-Prim.html#t:Any < 1313065139 271130 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :If lambdabot let you access GHC.Prim, then you could do all sorts of bad things. < 1313065148 137424 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, maybe not without MagicHash. < 1313065152 444442 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it'd be stupid. < 1313065206 689316 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Oh, and Any does not actually have one type argument as given there; nor is it a data-type. That's a limitation of the tool used to generate the fake Haddock source file.) < 1313065251 958143 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1313065266 94735 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: What? < 1313065277 20252 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is it then? < 1313065285 417013 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :An internal type. < 1313065292 99810 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a reason the module is called GHC.Prim. < 1313065345 179349 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it still has a "constructor" right? < 1313065378 323140 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1313065385 513106 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is not a data-type. < 1313065390 829181 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is also not a type synonym; it is just a type. < 1313065406 278237 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only way to get an Any value is with an unsafe coercion. < 1313065414 957261 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Which is actually safe.) < 1313065422 286747 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so Dynamic requires unsafe coercion? < 1313065437 791731 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1313065444 114620 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is, of course, totally safe. < 1313065454 115613 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what is the purpose of Any then? < 1313065471 153585 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :type Obj = Any < 1313065471 320063 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :data Dynamic = Dynamic TypeRep Obj < 1313065471 403382 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What would Dynamic look like without Obj? < 1313065471 907040 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any a = anything? < 1313065475 996634 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And thus without Any? < 1313065478 803300 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: There is no a argument. < 1313065480 869780 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : (Oh, and Any does not actually have one type argument as given there; nor is it a data-type. That's a limitation of the tool used to generate the fake Haddock source file.) < 1313065522 538282 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dynamic forall a. TypeRep a < 1313065533 51020 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or however forall works in a constructor declaration... < 1313065545 280156 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. Dynamic TypeRep a looks nicer to me < 1313065599 322246 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Not safe. < 1313065624 980423 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :See the guarantees at http://www.haskell.org/ghc/docs/7.0.3/html/libraries/ghc-prim-0.2.0.0/GHC-Prim.html#v:unsafeCoerce-35-; also this comment in Data.Dynamic's source: < 1313065629 57695 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : -- Use GHC's primitive 'Any' type to hold the dynamically typed value. < 1313065629 223790 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : -- < 1313065629 296873 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : -- In GHC's new eval/apply execution model this type must not look < 1313065629 297029 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : -- like a data type. If it did, GHC would use the constructor convention < 1313065629 500221 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : -- when evaluating it, and this will go wrong if the object is really a < 1313065631 494995 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : -- function. Using Any forces GHC to use < 1313065633 489671 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : -- a fallback convention for evaluating it that works for all types. < 1313065691 812365 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm not sure that definition will break in practice, but it's certainly not guaranteed to work by unsafeCoerce's stringent list of safe uses, and I would expect the runtime representation to be less necessarily predictable in the long-term than with Any.) < 1313065861 775141 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"the constructor convention"? < 1313065934 905057 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: "Other uses of unsafeCoerce# are undefined. In particular, you should not use unsafeCoerce# to cast a T to an algebraic data type D, unless T is also an algebraic data type. For example, do not cast Int->Int to Bool, even if you later cast that Bool back to Int->Int before applying it. The reasons have to do with GHC's internal representation details (for the congnoscenti, data values can be < 1313065935 88735 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :entered but function closures cannot). If you want a safe type to cast things to, use Any, which is not an algebraic data type." < 1313065942 92652 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Beyond that, beats me; I'm no expert on GHC's evaluation model. < 1313065994 146278 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, that just pretty much restates the same thing. < 1313066011 879317 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Well, you now know it involves entering. < 1313066030 363601 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I suppose that's quite an improvement. < 1313066107 292002 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Breaking and entering. < 1313066185 640709 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :more like an entering and breaking I would say. < 1313066239 319692 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :question < 1313066254 273530 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this safe: unsafeCoerce (typeRef, x) :: Dynamic < 1313066270 40544 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : Even if Vorpal hadn't talked much this year at all, 2008-now still means 2008-2010 accounts for well over three fourths. But here's 2011-only for you if you like to see yourself talk a lot, http://zem.fi/~fis/foo2.png <-- err, looks like I'm number 2 in that graph? Yet you said I hadn't talked much? < 1313066303 76826 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Later graphs diminished that a lot more recently. < 1313066309 245144 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1313066314 802760 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I have been busy < 1313066320 349596 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was the one saying you haven't been talking, though. < 1313066350 365423 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh fine that's cool just don't list me. < 1313066353 905514 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not important. < 1313066368 666348 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION cries alone. ;_;
< 1313066371 445319 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right; I just assumed so for the sake of the argument; thus, "if you hadn't talked". < 1313066427 350779 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It only lists top 8, due to not actually having any more specified colors. < 1313066456 27536 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?src [] (<*>) < 1313066456 490898 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(<*>) = ap < 1313066457 440061 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess I will have to be more active to not drop off the chart < 1313066462 691829 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmph. < 1313066581 803040 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : (f :- fs) <*> (x :- xs) = f x :- (vecSizeIsNat xs $ vecSizeIsNat fs $ fs <*> xs) < 1313066582 892258 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So ugly. < 1313066591 963044 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION sulks over fizzie not allowing him to have arbitrary metric by which to compare himself to other people and promptly creates a Wikipedia account.
< 1313066606 934612 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: When counting the number of characters (as opposed of lines) in http://zem.fi/~fis/foo3rc.png you are no longer #2; ais523 and oerjan pass you. Still, #4 is perfectly respectable too. (That one's for 2011 too.) < 1313066660 22562 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have one script that just exports the activity data into a .json file; was going to protovis out something more customizable, but haven't had the time. < 1313066688 343147 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should use YAML instead of JSON < 1313066693 831511 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it, uh, makes more sense to do that! < 1313066697 637073 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah!!! < 1313066746 219860 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :When using a JavaScript-based visualization tool? Uh, sure. < 1313066752 520488 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think fizzie is having a breakdown. < 1313066754 850759 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean CakeProphet. < 1313066765 637636 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, that was a few days ago. < 1313066770 456329 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is post-breakdown. < 1313066816 374173 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :YAML is better if you intend the files to be human-edited, I guess. JSON is probably a better choice otherwise. < 1313066901 198791 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but we all know that Python's pickle format is the best data serialization format of all and should be used in all situations regardless of application, environment, or language. < 1313067057 564377 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a tough pickle. < 1313067098 112942 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH HO HO HO HO. I must put on my monocle for this. < 1313067115 849332 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"1562 J. Heywood Dialogue Prouerbes Eng. Tounge (new ed.) in Wks. sig. Uiii, Man is brickell. Freilties pickell. Poudreth mickell, Seasonyng lickell. [The exact sense in quot. 1562 is unclear.]" Well, you don't say. < 1313067118 444906 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently JSON is a subset of YAML 1.2 < 1313067152 598881 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the inline-style of YAML is the same syntax as JSON, but if you have newlines and intents in a JSON file it would probably parse incorrectly in YAML. < 1313067157 833126 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*indents < 1313067189 69691 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So by subset you mean not a subset. < 1313067211 769929 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :JSON syntax is a subset of YAML version 1.2, which was promulgated with the express purpose of bringing YAML "into compliance with JSON as an official subset."[7] Though prior versions of YAML were not strictly compatible,[8] the discrepancies were rarely noticeable and most JSON documents can be parsed by YAML parsers. < 1313067218 841569 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds to me like it should be a proper subset, including with whitespace and the like. < 1313067307 233116 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I mean pseudoquasisubset < 1313067342 168549 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay, it is a subset. < 1313067355 800560 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really see how that works but okay. < 1313067366 739917 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :How would it not? < 1313067513 157917 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well if the JSON document contained newlines and indentations wouldn't the YAML parser interpret those as hierarchial structures? < 1313067526 548251 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So < 1313067527 46860 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You have 6 new messages. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read them. < 1313067528 596209 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not inside of {}s or []s, one presumes < 1313067531 567144 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mouse update. < 1313067532 222336 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Those are inline syntax < 1313067538 170845 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, right. < 1313067545 318795 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The containment zone has been breached. < 1313067547 397588 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is < 1313067548 585351 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: : ( < 1313067549 164385 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a moose < 1313067550 148501 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :loose < 1313067551 399919 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :aboot < 1313067552 566224 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :aboot < 1313067553 460 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the hoose < 1313067553 523796 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this < 1313067555 555877 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ho < 1313067556 898418 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1313067557 871335 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1313067560 677922 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1313067594 39234 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: so you are in fact using YAML. WHERE IS YOUR GOD NOW? < 1313067764 746328 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll put in some mappings with non-unique keys just to make sure it's definitely not valid YAML. ("JSON's RFC4627 requires that mappings keys merely “SHOULD” be unique, while YAML insists they “MUST” be.") < 1313067786 501886 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's not a subset :) < 1313067823 717848 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Their reading is that "Technically, YAML therefore complies with the JSON spec, choosing to treat duplicates as an error. In practice, since JSON is silent on the semantics of such duplicates, the only portable JSON files are those with unique keys, which are therefore valid YAML files." < 1313067827 602577 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure it makes much sense. < 1313067884 770372 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you can reject things violating SHOULDs now? < 1313067902 630474 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"SHOULD: This word -- mean that there may exist valid reasons in particular circumstances to ignore a particular item, but the full implications must be understood and carefully weighed before choosing a different course." Well, I've carefully weighed the full implications of accidentally using YAML, and decided that I must ignore the item, since I see no other way to make the JSON non-YAML. < 1313067902 963102 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sweet, mcmap becomes invalid every time I forget to fix a stupid fucking warning. < 1313067924 205620 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :-Werror whee < 1313067946 793272 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should finish that anonymous entity tracking, six days late. < 1313067963 738206 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it had a deadline? < 1313068054 61931 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :IEEE Spectrum: "Photon Recycling Boosts Solar Cell Efficiency" -- remember to recycle all the photons you use at home. < 1313068063 740389 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is apparently a json2yaml < 1313068102 874018 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :json2yaml = print =<< getContents < 1313068105 304900 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure you should get at least five or so uses out of a good-quality photon. < 1313068109 488224 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :json2yaml = putStr =<< getContents < 1313068110 861441 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually < 1313068124 817071 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :though to be proper you would want to remove those duplicate keys. < 1313068271 282565 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : Oh, it had a deadline? < 1313068277 117707 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I started work on it with the intention of finishing it at the same time. < 1313068506 924780 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, photon recycling? < 1313068513 243829 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :what on earth is it really < 1313068589 41075 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, was it you who said braid had no replay value btw? < 1313068605 232485 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I didn't look at the details, but they seem to bounce some photons around for a second round or something as intuitive. < 1313068612 381999 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :not strictly true, turns out there are two different endings. One is insanely hard to get though. < 1313068656 159900 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: And yes, I've done both, although admittedly I had to look at some guide-dang-its for the other one. < 1313068688 13965 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Incidentally, obligatory Assembly 2011 main-hall panorama, http://users.ics.tkk.fi/htkallas/20110805_001-007.jpg < 1313068695 740765 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yeah I found one star on my own, then went like "wtf". I would never have spotted the one that involved waiting for that slow cloud... < 1313068737 573100 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :The one that's done by manipulating the puzzle pieces was a bit annoying, I had already locked those things during the first play-through. < 1313068738 263997 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So is Braid's supposed nuclear bomb metaphor thing heavy-handed because I might just skip it if it is. < 1313068741 765426 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, nice. Reminds I have photos for a pano on my camera that I need to transfer to my computer... < 1313068746 633779 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, same < 1313068756 132588 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A California start-up's photovoltaic device generates every bit of energy it can from the sun's rays, by sending light particles that reform from electron-hole pairs for a second pass. The photon-recycling maneuver has yielded a solar cell array that is 28.2 percent efficient--the best solar-to-electrical-energy conversion rate ever produced." < 1313068764 201459 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :note: that pano was hand held. In rain. < 1313068767 667527 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Is that lighting arrangement healthy. :p < 1313068768 769151 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :no way to tell if it will work out < 1313068773 609913 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(At Assembluh.) < 1313068778 434249 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : So is Braid's supposed nuclear bomb metaphor thing heavy-handed because I might just skip it if it is. < 1313068783 543458 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : So is Braid's supposed nuclear bomb metaphor thing heavy-handed because I might just skip it if it is. <-- is that official? < 1313068789 891704 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think so. < 1313068795 366514 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a really, really, reeeeaaaalllly hard-to-find easter egg and a quote at the end. < 1313068822 285295 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well doing pano stitching will pass the time when I wait for that guide-dangit cloud < 1313068855 55488 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think on my first attempt I managed to miss the cloud. (Wasn't actively using the computer.) < 1313068888 142738 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Really hard-to-find as in to get it you need to find 3 completely unmarked and unadvertised stars, one of which requires you to wait for about an hour for no reason in a particular spot, then on the final level there's a more-or-less explicit acknowledgement of the metaphor. < 1313068890 989514 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, you could reverse time at 8x < 1313068895 204528 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so not a major issue < 1313068896 427357 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: OK DON'T ANSWER ME FINE < 1313068915 756869 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Nice. < 1313068933 132559 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Blow designed the game as a personal critique of contemporary trends in game development." < 1313068939 40505 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :This guy is the funniest asshole. < 1313068949 604544 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really should try to figure out how to get auto mounting usb devices to work when not using a graphical login manager... I guess it is some consolekit crap or such < 1313068961 880763 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :How can I criticise things.... I know, I'll make a game you can go back in time in! < 1313068992 325209 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The final world is labeled simply as "1." In this world, time flows in reverse. Rewinding time returns the flow of time to its normal state.[17] < 1313068995 904854 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OK how does that actually work. < 1313068998 885823 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do things just walk backwards. < 1313069005 851279 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, dunno, getting there is a major undertaking. < 1313069013 842920 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't be bothered to try. < 1313069019 448748 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, at the moment. < 1313069036 885362 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, even if the developer is an asshole (I haven't checked out what he said) the game is quite fun to play IMO. < 1313069089 603125 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, very little "redo the entire level when failing" since you can just press shift to go back in time a few seconds and try again. (Except in a few places) < 1313069112 577029 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I thought you'd beaten it. < 1313069134 485914 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, erm, most of the later levels have time shenanigans in them. < 1313069137 605873 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The final level, in which everything but Tim moves in reverse, depicts the princess escaping from a knight, and working together with Tim to surpass obstacles and meet at her home. Tim is suddenly locked out of the house, and, as time progresses forward, reversing Tim's actions, the events show the princess running from Tim, setting traps that he is able to evade, until she is rescued by the knight. T < 1313069137 856516 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :im is revealed to be the "monster" the princess is running from." < 1313069140 28175 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, nah, just read about it. < 1313069141 460383 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK so it's just a cheat. < 1313069158 569242 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dude. < 1313069164 686340 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just posted spoilers in the channel. < 1313069170 271768 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is... very dickish. < 1313069178 102806 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal, erm, most of the later levels have time shenanigans in them. <-- you mean the green glow? < 1313069203 28185 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also the purple glow. < 1313069233 356678 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, the purple glow don't usually require restarting the entire level, just some double-shifting < 1313069242 332875 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's... spoilers for a deliberate non-plot. < 1313069272 326329 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's an art game; any discussion of it counts as a spoiler. < 1313069284 487230 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is spoiler for a puzzle < 1313069294 407476 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1313069298 698656 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :not much though < 1313069305 56891 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not... really? It doesn't tell you what to do. < 1313069318 910432 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1313069461 775442 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Repeated note to self: Seriously, don't become a "game dev". < 1313069468 28379 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know how google sometimes put a list of topics on a site below a search result? Tends to be about 4-6 usually... This one had 12. Never seen as many < 1313069475 980999 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(googled for "ufraw") < 1313069482 553935 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(without quotes) < 1313069497 591628 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Additional note to self: Seriously. < 1313069513 571637 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :blergh the manual on the website is outdated... < 1313069522 98064 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAVE I SAID SERIOUSLY ENOUGH TIMES < 1313069530 763823 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also fizzie do they actually have lights in that Assembly room. < 1313069555 868158 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sowwy, I was busy unsuccessfully trying to web-purchase a thing. < 1313069565 625854 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, they have lights; the lights are on when the "loading doors" are open. < 1313069578 921172 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes it easier to set up things without a flashlight. < 1313069643 665302 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1313069717 349513 :MSleep!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net NICK :MDude < 1313070439 996106 :Taneb!~nathan@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313070442 291591 :Taneb!~nathan@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1313070917 872839 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Hey, tup person: is there a simple "delete all generated files" kind of thing? < 1313070932 788931 :Taneb!~nathan@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is my assumption that a combinatory logic program is like a short program followed by a series of input, which returns a program and input, which is then executed? < 1313070936 969545 :Taneb!~nathan@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :At all correct < 1313071006 547573 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not as far as I can tell... < 1313071033 282716 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then again I don't formally know what combinatory logic is. I've only been introduced to it through Haskell. < 1313071134 731021 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, what? < 1313071136 2434 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. < 1313071154 992466 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you talking about Lazy K-style stuff? < 1313071214 842501 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: You're not meant to do that :-) < 1313071245 508245 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Such a thing would be easy to add unless I'm missing something, it just hasn't been done < 1313071250 693574 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you're not meant to do that anyway :-P < 1313071274 426937 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why not < 1313071275 135507 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Cluttering directories is of course a pain, but that's why the variant things are coming so it can be isolated to a build/ directory or similar.) < 1313071284 984888 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right :-)p < 1313071290 78109 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Because it's unnecessary < 1313071295 615066 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-p* < 1313071310 447191 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"make clean" is often required because not every dependency is tracked, e.g. configuration dependencies or the like. < 1313071319 52773 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously that doesn't apply here < 1313071329 122385 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1313071333 323355 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yeah, my use of tup for Real Stuff is currently blocked on variants coming < 1313071341 585176 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently it's the next major feature coming, so I'm just being patient < 1313071347 809973 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I was hoping for an intermediate measure while build directories aren't feasible < 1313071362 521744 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gotta go -> < 1313071366 934614 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-43-247.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1313071367 7418 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-43-247.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1313071367 7526 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1313071375 768857 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: What are you using/thinking about using/using as a test-case to prove that tup sucks it for? < 1313071381 998924 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow that sentence is a bad parser. < 1313071523 32400 :Taneb!~nathan@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom Hoover: possibly < 1313071684 139608 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :according to the esolang wiki page < 1313071686 792093 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, dude, use tab completion. < 1313071701 232411 :Taneb!~nathan@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :This client is awful < 1313071705 661160 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?src foldl < 1313071706 161159 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :foldl f z [] = z < 1313071706 579585 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :foldl f z (x:xs) = foldl f (f z x) xs < 1313071712 526417 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then... why are you using it/ < 1313071728 44676 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?src foldl' < 1313071728 879106 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :foldl' f a [] = a < 1313071729 215982 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :foldl' f a (x:xs) = let a' = f a x in a' `seq` foldl' f a' xs < 1313071740 905377 :Taneb!~nathan@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I'm about to change client < 1313071776 712163 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I x = K x y = x; S x y z = x z(y z); the only confusing part here is what x z(y z) can equate to < 1313071801 565476 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb readies himself for the incredible journey that is changing clients. < 1313071812 15328 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20, what's not to understand? < 1313071846 102250 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh.. you're asking that question to the wrong person. < 1313071865 298074 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :first of all it appears that I wants one operand, K wants 2 operands, S wants 3 operands < 1313071872 310156 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Untrue. < 1313071879 650854 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sxyz is sugar for ((Sx)y)z. < 1313071901 458403 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what is (Sx)? :D < 1313071903 981663 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is just tree rewriting; (SK)I reduces to (SK)I because it does not fit the form Ix, (Kx)y or ((Sx)y)z for any x, y, or z. < 1313071921 9204 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anything that doesn't fit one of those three patterns is simply left unreduce. < 1313071921 921222 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :d. < 1313071940 999408 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :nevermind.. i am nowhere near understanding it :D < 1313072020 528011 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :well... i will figure it out in my own time < 1313072084 983534 :Taneb_!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313072099 878037 :Taneb_!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, this client appears decent < 1313072106 945686 :Taneb!~nathan@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net QUIT :Quit: using sirc version 2.211+ssfe < 1313072113 949152 :Taneb_!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net NICK :Taneb < 1313072138 692137 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1313072203 761894 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the client like everyone uses/ < 1313072222 696798 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nobody told me! < 1313072329 40637 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: you can think of it as string rewriting. < 1313072332 28033 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :except... with trees. < 1313072341 878932 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tree rewriting < 1313072380 108421 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Identity "test" = "test"; Konstant "test" "two" = "test" :D < 1313072382 577920 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20, go read Homestuck it is the best thing. < 1313072391 361807 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I concur < 1313072404 60038 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are you doing this is immoral. < 1313072421 2388 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Application "test" "two" "three" = "test" "two" ("test" "three") < 1313072441 843999 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is immortal. < 1313072468 754215 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I read all of the Homestucks. All of them. < 1313072481 516311 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also read all the Problem Sleuths < 1313072512 306260 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't really appreciate Problem Sleuth unless you read it in a very hard-boiled manner. < 1313072538 758727 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I read Problem Sleuth in the most hard-boiled manner of all. < 1313072549 14029 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :dude. < 1313072549 512305 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I read it in an egy thign [sic] < 1313072626 848082 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, I remember getting you to read PS. < 1313072637 53174 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I as well. < 1313072643 637855 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember that too IN FACT I REMEMBER GETTING PHANTOM_HOOVER TO READ HOMESTUCK < 1313072650 876510 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, Know any non-tiff format that can handle 16 bits per channel and might be viewable in a browser. < 1313072655 51590 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1313072661 260132 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: tarag? < 1313072662 402824 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :targa < 1313072664 443406 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember conceiving elliott with his mom. < 1313072664 612130 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got both of them via TVTropes. < 1313072666 609418 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, I win. < 1313072667 902794 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe not < 1313072676 519015 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :TGA files commonly have the extension ".tga" on PC DOS/Windows systems and Mac OS X (older Macintosh systems use the "TPIC" type code). The format can store image data with 8, 16, 24, or 32 bits of precision per pixel[1] – the maximum 24 bits of RGB and an extra 8-bit alpha channel < 1313072677 349316 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1313072680 959877 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually, I was bored and I said "hey, I might as well read Homestuck" and then you decided to hijack my attempt because you gave up the last time you tried. < 1313072684 159553 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also a simple format?? < 1313072685 753195 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but only RLE < 1313072690 21116 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : targa <-- hm < 1313072694 744689 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, would firefox display that? < 1313072695 273046 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No no because you actually asked me whether it was worthwhile. < 1313072700 969792 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :also what would the file size be < 1313072705 191934 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that's not you telling me to read it. < 1313072705 355963 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did anyone watch Kr�d M�ndoon and the Flaming Sword of Fire? < 1313072706 746715 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Find out yourself; and RLE big. < 1313072713 203248 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It is close enough ok shut up die. < 1313072716 356536 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the 8 bit jpeg at 90% quality is 8.5 MB... so < 1313072721 229865 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: TIAS < 1313072734 641005 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok i see... < 1313072760 789574 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, krita doesn't handle it as far as I can tell. And gimp doesn't do 16 bits per channel. Oh well. < 1313072773 113845 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can have S S S S K K K K I I I I < 1313072779 708938 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 bit audio is the best. < 1313072784 826668 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and the deflate compressed tiff is 107 MB < 1313072785 662684 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1313072790 46455 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bit too large to upload < 1313072792 901091 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: just use graphicsmagick or w/e to convert it < 1313072794 587171 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :to targa < 1313072797 220894 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh good idea < 1313072797 886618 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :single pitch, single volume square waves. mmmmm < 1313072804 967882 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: RLE will probalby... not be better than deflate though < 1313072820 327412 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed < 1313072826 214093 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, erm, 1-bit would just be single-volume. < 1313072835 782530 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so I guess I'm stuck at uploading a 8-bit tiff < 1313072841 864228 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ah yes, my mistake. < 1313072843 977800 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: that's equivalent to I < 1313072871 222818 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1313072911 310403 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't be fooled into thinking i understand yet < 1313072915 139144 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: use lambdabot and type ap for S, const for K, and id for I. < 1313072924 294648 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't actually understand < 1313072930 478088 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just good at pretending < 1313072945 457404 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Uh. < 1313072948 491757 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but any sequence of S or K or I forms a valid combinatory logic < 1313072949 821393 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell can't type all valid SKI terms < 1313072950 740159 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that's < 1313072953 492655 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably not a good idea. < 1313072962 645789 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: Yes < 1313072969 355739 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it can't? < 1313072971 616341 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay.. it's fool proof < 1313072977 291018 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: If by combinatory logic you mean combinatory logic expression, yes. < 1313072981 714664 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: But some infinitely loop < 1313072984 658650 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: You forgot parentheses too. < 1313072992 913453 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have to be balanced of course, and contain something. :p < 1313072994 265603 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah < 1313072994 763625 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: No. < 1313072998 558353 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, uploading a new pano < 1313073002 194415 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Proof: LC → SKI, LC can't be. < 1313073007 447327 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Proof of that: Try typing the Y combinator. < 1313073020 392754 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :AHA MOUSE < 1313073022 995538 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously a newtype wrapper "solves" the issue but your translation won't do that. < 1313073025 286380 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: FRIENDS BECOME FRIENDS < 1313073029 78482 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Electric Mouse < 1313073042 540940 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still the same mouse? < 1313073067 38456 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh FFS it's under the sofa again. < 1313073073 533083 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe < 1313073079 254718 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can lift all the furniture u < 1313073080 277913 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: it "was" under the sofa < 1313073080 641377 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :p < 1313073087 101848 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :on strings < 1313073095 636874 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: just < 1313073097 840062 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :put some mouse food < 1313073099 760409 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :underneath < 1313073102 524784 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1313073104 723239 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that it doesn't die... < 1313073105 998742 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will find some chees < 1313073106 877978 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1313073111 660804 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be sad if it died < 1313073112 330831 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1313073123 244173 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, http://whotookspaz.org/~anmaster/images/2011/2011-08-11_kinapark.jpg < 1313073131 89106 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cornflakes are better < 1313073133 538503 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :----------(mouse)t[n]----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------->(mouse)t[n+1] < 1313073150 693094 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: oh my;y god mouse eating a cofrnflkaejkljdgflkgfghjkhlfdkjgdfgdflkg < 1313073162 103257 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: /////////////// < 1313073179 130721 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm... not sure if we have any cornflakes. < 1313073182 852563 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :just < 1313073183 889404 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hang on, BRB. < 1313073183 961994 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine < 1313073184 600268 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a mouse < 1313073185 183965 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :eating < 1313073186 695544 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < 1313073188 582191 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :corn < 1313073190 725517 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :flake < 1313073192 504530 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :flkfjkljf;lkjf < 1313073195 585293 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: mice like chocolate < 1313073197 807853 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :a cornflkfjkljf;lkjf. < 1313073199 276155 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that Perl code evaluates to undef I believe. < 1313073262 425126 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have I mentioned < 1313073264 155425 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That once < 1313073268 403391 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Our toaster broke down < 1313073271 584015 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And when we opened it < 1313073277 368109 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was a dead mouse inside. < 1313073282 328629 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :An old one, too. < 1313073282 494975 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :abd you had to use Perl as a replacement? < 1313073283 9371 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. < 1313073313 175368 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :was it charcoaled? < 1313073330 268634 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :toasters tend to get hot every time they're used < 1313073345 769897 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION writes this down in his notes.
< 1313073384 658669 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote toasters tend to get hot every time they're used < 1313073385 775924 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :581) toasters tend to get hot every time they're used < 1313073394 402712 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OK but are you feeding it, and is the thing you are feeding it a cornflake. < 1313073415 901944 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :We have no cornflakes. < 1313073461 601359 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the nett effect that it's flesh might have been stripped from it's very bones < 1313073485 810101 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: How do you manage to not have cornflakes is it a personal failing. < 1313073489 969282 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that would seem to be asking a bit much from the modest toaster < 1313073492 960443 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: and we must breakfast? < 1313073495 143093 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you given it cheese I need to rate the friendship possibility. < 1313073522 812799 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no I think it's cleverer than that. < 1313073540 103506 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's < 1313073542 825739 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a mouse, Phantom_Hoover < 1313073562 824578 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t ap (const (ap id id)) (ap (ap (const ap) const) (const (ap id id))) < 1313073563 658167 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Occurs check: cannot construct the infinite type: a = a -> b < 1313073564 6399 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Probable cause: `id' is applied to too few arguments < 1313073564 78474 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : In the second argument of `ap', namely `id' < 1313073589 314143 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ARE YOU SURE < 1313073599 702402 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t ap < 1313073600 646711 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (m :: * -> *) a b. (Monad m) => m (a -> b) -> m a -> m b < 1313073608 903309 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes I am < 1313073610 321520 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite sure < 1313073622 390160 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, MICE ARE NOT THIS CLEVER < 1313073636 660140 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, your toaster must be a large model to be able to fit a mouse < 1313073644 491145 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I... < 1313073646 618850 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the mouse must have been unusually small < 1313073647 705282 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you ever seen a mouse. < 1313073651 819244 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes. < 1313073652 684162 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or a toaster. < 1313073654 61197 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1313073657 941911 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes that too < 1313073658 14382 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's used to giant Swedish mice. < 1313073671 602031 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yeah mutant ones! < 1313073671 768694 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, Vorpal thinks he's funny by assuming everything is computers. < 1313073679 326437 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what? < 1313073682 60254 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no < 1313073682 143766 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Either that or they just have really small toasters in Sweden. < 1313073695 330905 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: But how do you toast your mice when you want toasted mice. < 1313073697 920067 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :For really small toast. < 1313073718 477371 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :The mouse presumably dived in the top and twisted and contorted it's body until it was in the side sections of the toaster < 1313073721 596554 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen some mice here that would not fit in a toaster. < 1313073731 226947 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there it sat eating crumbs < 1313073740 262613 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :until someone came along and cooked some toast < 1313073772 50201 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lovely mental image < 1313073782 368028 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps it couldn't escape it's prison.. perhaps it just got trapped at the "wrong time" < 1313073785 648318 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20, hm, wouldn't be able to happen in the toaster I have. The holes are small enough that it is hard to even get breadcrumbs to fall out if they get in there... < 1313073791 676828 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(stupid design) < 1313073820 168377 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :well what a way to die < 1313073846 146900 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or perhaps it just < 1313073846 647039 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :my toaster doesn't have very good lambdas. < 1313073849 306576 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :had a long and happy toaster life < 1313073851 408321 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then died of old age < 1313073852 592138 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :????? < 1313073862 356933 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was in a bit where it was shielded from the heat. this is true. < 1313073896 768200 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt it was in such a bit < 1313073899 202603 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let x = y = 2 in (x,y) < 1313073900 200281 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : : parse error on input `=' < 1313073904 349024 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wishful thinking. < 1313073922 11513 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t const < 1313073922 932101 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. a -> b -> a < 1313073932 337959 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: this is the price of opaque toaster encapsulation < 1313073966 488882 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313074070 311097 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let t = const; f = const id; or = t; and = f; not = f t in t or f f or f and < 1313074071 119431 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Overlapping instances for GHC.Show.Show (b -> a -> a) < 1313074071 451463 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use... < 1313074078 770430 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t let t = const; f = const id; or = t; and = f; not = f t in t or f f or f and < 1313074079 810585 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall b a. b -> a -> a < 1313074092 528575 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :beautiful. < 1313074165 933188 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> const (const (const (const))))) < 1313074167 287707 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : : parse error on input `)' < 1313074170 903092 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCYEIUWFK YOU < 1313074173 824831 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> const (const (const const))) < 1313074175 168510 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : : parse error on input `)' < 1313074177 344336 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> const (const (const const)) < 1313074178 477470 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Overlapping instances for GHC.Show.Show < 1313074178 826624 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : (b -> ... < 1313074214 500041 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :true or true or :) < 1313074248 106828 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, or true or true < 1313074360 446191 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, not not < 1313074374 96856 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, not true or < 1313074376 867915 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...yeah. < 1313074434 787995 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my bad, it's not not. < 1313074443 155714 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, not "not not" < 1313074451 315362 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :man talking about this with English is confusing. < 1313074585 714380 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :should I feel bad for not understanding combinatory logic? it just seems that when it's entire system can be formally expressed in a few lines then something is askew < 1313074603 242462 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean how hard can it be < 1313074611 295651 :Taneb!~taneb@host-84-13-67-136.opaltelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1313074626 846809 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not really a system of logic, it's just a simple programming language < 1313074636 276154 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(With no input or output, admittedly) < 1313074666 719643 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You may find its presentation in terms of actual drawings of trees and their reductions simpler; that shows the structure and prevents confusion because of parentheses etc., but I don't have a link. < 1313074684 479609 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1313074881 213460 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1313074981 133700 :CakeProphet!~adam@h78.21.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313074981 206232 :CakeProphet!~adam@h78.21.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net QUIT :Changing host < 1313074981 206390 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric < 1313074990 282614 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Nice-looking place; but where is it? < 1313075020 277467 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, a Chinese garden near here. < 1313075026 212876 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, a few hours drive < 1313075033 467615 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, it is in an old marble quarry < 1313075040 299412 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me find it on google maps or something < 1313075060 962034 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :S (S (S (K S) (S (K K) I)) (K (S I I))) (S (S (K S) (S (K K) I)) (K (S I I))). < 1313075061 34639 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i think the use of syntactic sugar is sufficent to hide what is actually going on.. < 1313075119 372852 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example... we are shown: (S x y z) = (x z (y z)) < 1313075145 477559 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :however we are not shown: (((S x) y) z) = (S x y z) = (x z (y z)) < 1313075152 741554 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather < 1313075162 768314 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric := ((x z) (y z)) < 1313075172 173257 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :(((S x) y) z) = ((S x y) z) = (S x y z) = (x z (y z)) < 1313075181 492786 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1313075195 537299 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :(((S x) y) z) = ((S x y) z) = (S x y z) = (x z (y z)) = ((x z)(y z)) < 1313075222 214334 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :now while i might not understand that.. < 1313075232 737775 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least i know i don't understand it < 1313075269 519815 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas with: (S x y z) = (x z (y z)) i am left to wonder why i don't see anything < 1313075312 420653 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, having trouble finding the exact spot < 1313075345 747443 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then i can ask.. < 1313075375 268361 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :is (((w x) y) z) = (((S x) y) z) ? < 1313075377 551770 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, somewhere around here: http://maps.google.se/maps?q=Kinaparken&hl=en&ll=58.778078,14.958401&spn=0.047338,0.210285&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&t=h&z=13 < 1313075401 177757 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, (the search was useless) < 1313075407 272591 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313075462 770667 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps i didnt word that right < 1313075463 372706 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Did you mean: Kronoparken, Karlstad". < 1313075470 144140 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yeah useless :P < 1313075482 739353 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, maybe see: http://www.bastedalenherrgard.se/?nr=10 < 1313075495 922524 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the garden is just next to that place < 1313075497 173865 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should say... can (((w x) y) z) be rewritten as (((S x) y) z) and (((K x) y) z) and (((I x) y) z) ? < 1313075555 979404 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: you can't use any variable names in your program < 1313075560 732940 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it must just be S, K, I and parentheses < 1313075561 150552 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see. < 1313075565 740101 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is x then? < 1313075569 288666 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the lowercase letters are just there to show how the S, K and I are rewritten < 1313075579 332508 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh < 1313075607 688952 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(((Sx)y)z) → ((xz)(yz)) simply means that for every expression x, y, and z, (((Sx)y)z) gets rewritten to ((xz)(yz)) < 1313075621 574713 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aha, the cat has showed up < 1313075626 524064 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: NO STOP MURDER, < 1313075627 711582 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHO IS THE CLEVER ONE NOW MOUSE < 1313075634 975078 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, We were kind of lucky with the weather... When it is sunny, the place tends to be filled with tourists < 1313075635 392921 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm just going to flush it out. < 1313075685 415236 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: NO THAT SOUNDS BAD, < 1313075686 13269 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've just had a thought. < 1313075687 12706 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :BE NICE TO MOUSE < 1313075687 179108 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Panic < 1313075695 222486 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: NO MAKE PHANTNOM ANIMAL CRUELTY NO < 1313075707 407037 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It looks a bit like one Chinese-style garden at Madeira. (How surprising.) < 1313075712 714251 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :do (((Kx)y)z) and (((Ix)y)z) both get rewritten as (x) ? < 1313075739 881486 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, heh < 1313075741 840645 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps not though.. perhaps that is uh dependant on what z is < 1313075747 890429 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it possible to make an SKI combinator both a) halt and b) not take any more operators < 1313075748 377120 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: (((Kx)y)z) -- we know that ((Kx)y) is the same as x < 1313075757 391268 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: so it becomes ((x)(z)) < 1313075763 954491 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah o < 1313075766 69329 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: but like I said: that isn't a valid expression < 1313075766 235893 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ok < 1313075771 798979 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because x, y and z aren't combinators < 1313075779 584340 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes, for every x, y, and z, that reduction that I showed there holds. < 1313075801 818504 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(((Ix)y)z) -- we know that ((I)(x)) = x, so it becomes (((x)(y))z) < 1313075813 193013 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(aka xyz, (xy)z) < 1313075836 272714 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kab =ish Ia < 1313075881 28195 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so in the absence of parenthesis abcdefg becomes ((((((ab)c)d)e)f)g) ? < 1313075885 910012 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1313075888 620260 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: yep < 1313075897 607126 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the left side always gets the parentheses < 1313075903 443525 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: mushspace < 1313075907 900754 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and always 2 there are < 1313075920 601432 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok not always.. < 1313075921 546335 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: That, what's it < 1313075922 252153 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1313075943 595266 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok not always 2. i just wanted to say starwars < 1313075964 614649 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is ((x)(y)) the same as (xy) ? < 1313075971 7085 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: CCBI's Funge-Space in C < 1313075972 951027 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: Yes. < 1313075987 889410 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Do I smell ... giving up? < 1313076010 396448 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Don't let the cfungists win; fight back under the constraints of PURE TERRIBLE D < 1313076021 179178 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what fancy space is it this time :-P < 1313076030 15896 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nah, it's just useful for anything that messes with Funge < 1313076045 554247 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I miss it in Haskell < 1313076061 517838 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh? < 1313076063 597246 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Miss what < 1313076070 266675 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :A decent Funge-Space < 1313076086 62702 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I could be persuaded to work on Shiro :-P < 1313076115 602302 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :And would you create a pure Haskell Funge-Space at least as good as CCBI's < 1313076130 141738 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: That was the idea when I was working on Shiro, yes < 1313076159 844843 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :And would it work for {Un,B,Tr}efunge-9[83] < 1313076199 686277 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: give me a topic to learn about. < 1313076202 888113 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Well, I don't care about ninetythree really, but it's just like one extra function missing the special-casing of space?? < 1313076212 577470 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: But yes, N-dimensionality was the idea. < 1313076222 659866 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, 93 is easy < 1313076240 75209 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :But well, go ahead :-P < 1313076248 773163 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: It'll probably just be befunge-98 until the point at which you bug me about it :P < 1313076260 836312 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :As-is I think this is cool/useful enough that I might as well make it usable for others < 1313076273 452859 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: do you want me to like.. start a donation fund for a new keyboard for you? < 1313076283 121520 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could pitch in $5 < 1313076284 971924 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might even do a proper writeup about how it works at some point < 1313076287 36282 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: When's it gonna be part of CCBI, and how fast will it make it < 1313076288 402207 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :we could set up a paypal or something. < 1313076291 35394 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Sending the laptop in in a week or so < 1313076295 304036 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay. < 1313076298 284299 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: And what data structure does it use :-P < 1313076315 758810 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :funge-trees < 1313076321 252739 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It's the same one as CCBI uses now < 1313076326 531381 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :No change < 1313076332 950965 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apart from micro-level stuff I run into < 1313076366 986628 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: WELL I CAN OUTDO THAT < 1313076371 472808 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so SI does nothing... SII does nothing... SIIK becomes IKIK ... IKIK becomes KIK which becomes I.. which parts went wrong here? < 1313076381 639508 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION cracks knuckles, goes and walks off and does something else insetad.
< 1313076392 4535 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t ap id < 1313076393 364727 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. ((a -> b) -> a) -> (a -> b) -> b < 1313076399 460537 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :SI doesn't strictly do nothing. < 1313076413 272219 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: IKIK = (IK)IK = KIK = I < 1313076416 969381 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing went wrong < 1313076419 894618 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it isn't "do nothing" < 1313076421 185468 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1313076422 898186 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just "has no further reductions" < 1313076433 120852 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1313076446 578628 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: Congratulations, you now understand a language that can compute anything a computer with infinite memory can :-P < 1313076463 586716 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, given infinite memory to store the expanding SKI string, of course < 1313076470 602473 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't say i understand it.. but you said it which is close enough < 1313076486 536288 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, just let elliott understand it for you. < 1313076502 458260 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so does it always start from the left? < 1313076520 267252 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not it sometimes starts on the right depending on what mood it's in. < 1313076530 323331 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sort of, itidus20 < 1313076544 281182 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :at some point the parenthesis becomes signifigant though eh < 1313076553 872349 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: My main Shiro holdup is having to implement the fingerprints for slowdown, FWIW < 1313076565 740298 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: And undoing the massive performance decrease I got by refactoring to use MaybeT < 1313076580 818254 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :When it reaches a bracket, that bracket and its partner are removed ish < 1313076591 473955 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: Just think of it as a tree: Application (i.e. xy) is < 1313076593 868861 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : /\ < 1313076595 974597 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :x y < 1313076604 204487 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: And the leaves at the bottom of the tree are S, K or I < 1313076614 1749 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yeah this "massive performance decrease" business is why it's in C ;-) < 1313076633 631935 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1313076635 330882 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: Putting two expressions side-by-side and grouping with parentheses is just notation for describing these trees in one dimension < 1313076642 682774 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Well, "massive" < 1313076651 272860 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: It's not like my runtime was very high before or afte < 1313076653 39122 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :r < 1313076655 959594 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just going by Mycology < 1313076671 440392 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: But anyway, it's not really Haskell to blame here, more the library, I don't even think MaybeT is strict < 1313076690 74636 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah Haskell isn't to blame it's just a language. < 1313076690 410105 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm confident I can achieve a well-performing fungespace < 1313076701 528219 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb. < 1313076702 629848 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: 2-d zippers? < 1313076707 486079 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: It's not that easy :) < 1313076714 81546 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok thanks. ill let it go there < 1313076747 445301 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well a 2-d zipper itself isn't completely straightforward. < 1313076798 804236 :PatashuWarg!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Quit: MSN: Patashu@hotmail.com , Gmail: Patashu0@gmail.com , AIM: Patashu0 , YIM: patashu2 . < 1313076822 262197 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I know, I was just being snarky :-P C is for interoperability reasons anyway, depending on language runtimes kinda sucks < 1313076845 786412 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can only think of two ways to do it really. One is a zipper of zippers where you have to map the shift operations on every subzipper < 1313076915 226334 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other is single zipper but with more directions. up, down, left, right, and the intermediate directions. Actually I don't think that one would work at all. < 1313077121 135649 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so on returning from the toilet my mind shifts to a one dimensional trinary cellular automata < 1313077138 974425 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and this CA... each cell would be either I or K or S < 1313077223 21602 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem i suppose would be that it would be a celluar automata with the ability to delete cells from the tape < 1313077234 970142 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :like a linked list < 1313077283 760001 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so.. a CA with insertion and deletion < 1313077411 295522 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...Closer to an L-System < 1313077474 598257 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be like you could just fold that section of tape into a higher dimension.. but technically.. the CA is an array.. and it could be a linked list < 1313077507 230496 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :then again I don't see tat idea working very well < 1313077515 482077 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in 1 dimension.... it wouldn't be so bad < 1313077524 231482 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :in 2 dimensions it would be a royal nightmar < 1313077535 748104 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20, interesting, if you rearrange "toilet" you get.. < 1313077554 412242 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually if you rearrange "toillet" < 1313077560 657348 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1313077586 464487 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Very little good can come from rearranging toilet. < 1313077603 737647 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :as can be seen < 1313077606 118925 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont want to take sides though < 1313077615 36181 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20, interesting, ternary cellular automata < 1313077643 49795 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, i never understood - what's the "difference" between GOL and cellular automata? GOL is just a subset of that, right? < 1313077668 779901 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOL? What's a GOL? < 1313077688 435184 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's what you get when you rearrange "LOG" < 1313077691 946789 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also game of life. < 1313077705 695269 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(those toilet jokes never end do they) < 1313077708 818051 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aah < 1313077715 846597 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Game of Life is an example of a CA < 1313077730 941501 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are the rules that specialize a CA specifically into the GOL? < 1313077761 341467 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider a cell in a Moore Neighbourhood < 1313077770 507230 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Each cell has eight cells around it. < 1313077826 386447 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If a cell is 1 and has less than 2 1s around it, it becomes 0 next generation < 1313077864 22133 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If a cell is 1 and has more than 3 1s around it, it becomes 0 next generation < 1313077867 131524 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :well suppose you had: -[S]-[K]-[K]-[I]- .. then it would become -[K]-[I]-[K]-[I]- which would become -[I]-[I]- which would become -[I]- .. so this would suggest multiple phases per generation. < 1313077891 201308 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If a cell is 0, and has 3 1s around it, it becomes 1 < 1313077894 888595 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :one phase to calculate the [S], one phase to calculate the [K], one phase to calculate the [I] < 1313077896 956701 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Otherwise, it stas the same < 1313077944 423166 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater__: understand? < 1313077948 262090 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe phases isn't the best way to do it though < 1313078021 794185 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, ok < 1313078051 66232 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :-[1]-[+]-[1]- = -[2]- >:-) < 1313078072 124613 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, that does it. < 1313078077 298342 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: I have no idea how you can make an SKI CA < 1313078085 986748 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going for the cat. < 1313078087 896018 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont think you can.. < 1313078109 960869 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ,[<>][,[<>]] < 1313078129 469773 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but an arithmetic CA... < 1313078201 846294 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the right rules. < 1313078217 356532 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there would be a lot of ambiguous cases to cover. < 1313078255 64083 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my breakthrough (in my own little world that is) is that a 1 dimensional CA would work well in a linked list implementation and with lots of states rather than just 0 and 1 < 1313078267 386468 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose it could be done with just 0 and 1 of course < 1313078277 845563 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you would want rules which extended beyond direct neighbors < 1313078301 962181 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't an n-ary 1d CA unwrap to a binary 2d CA? < 1313078342 39497 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :the aryness isn't really the signifigant thing.. i put too much emphasis there < 1313078357 91333 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: a 1-d CA would better be represented by a zipper, which is two linked lists and "center" value. < 1313078366 972992 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because a linked list only goes in one "direction" < 1313078369 530934 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, can't an n-ary k-D CA unwrap to a binary k+1-D binary CA? < 1313078385 703941 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :a doubly linked list then < 1313078387 96283 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1313078421 803599 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no because it still has an endpoint. < 1313078438 187684 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have one linked list that goes left and one that goes right. < 1313078450 162430 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea of inserting and deleting cells is quite signifigant < 1313078461 736943 :derrik!~xix@143.122.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee JOIN :#esoteric < 1313078465 246427 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmk. < 1313078544 296287 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could have a rule that when it finds [1][1][1][1] it inserts a [0] in the middle thus creating [1][1][0][1][1] < 1313078571 472839 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe.. and you could have a rule that when it finds [1][1][0][1][1] it could rewrite it as [1][1][1][1] < 1313078577 666275 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so what happens when you have [1,1,1,1,1] < 1313078584 37156 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hummmmm < 1313078588 952741 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: cool so it just oscilates back and forth < 1313078655 740268 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1,1,1,1,1] would seem to become [1,1,0,1,0,1,1] < 1313078706 117397 :derrik!~xix@143.122.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee QUIT :Client Quit < 1313078730 268779 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: wasn't obvious to me. Maybe you need to expand on your rule. < 1313078736 110046 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because otherwise it's ambiguous. < 1313078750 141127 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1313078755 222553 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh... < 1313078768 314501 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of cells... it seems to work at the link level < 1313078814 937729 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so [1][1][1][1] means [1][1] on the left side of a link and [1][1] on the right side < 1313078826 633587 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so would be actually [1][1]-[1][1] < 1313078833 357455 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh, what? < 1313078862 780544 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a link between every node. < 1313078872 944771 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means [1][1][1][1] is an ambiguous term for -[1][1][1][1] or [1]-[1][1][1] or [1][1]-[1][1] or [1][1][1]-[1] or [1][1][1][1]- < 1313078925 382549 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in the case of [1][1]-[1][1] it would check the left and right side of a link for 2 [1]'s.. and set a pending insertion of a [0] < 1313078928 884102 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you know how a linked list works? < 1313078980 253961 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the rules would exist on 2 levels.. link-oriented rules, and cell-oriented rules < 1313078986 238342 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the linked list itself is not ambiguous it's just (1,(1,(1,(1,())))) < 1313078992 657082 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :every node has a link < 1313079003 578234 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :my notation was ambiguous, thats all < 1313079330 513798 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so with what i have envisioned.. you could say have [0][0][0][0][0][1][0][0][0][0][0][0][0] and have a rewriting rule [1]- = [1]-[1] which would insert a [1] at the right side of every [1] for the next generation < 1313079354 236778 :derrik!~xix@143.122.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee JOIN :#esoteric < 1313079395 616013 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: except that notation is hideous < 1313079436 459383 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know any real notations.. that is part of the trouble < 1313079458 822666 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well [1,2,3,4] is a good one. < 1313079466 204618 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1 2 3 4) < 1313079470 512445 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1313079471 179726 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just lack a proper appreciation for squares. < 1313079489 758417 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :1:2:3:4:[] is the desugared version that Haskell uses, where : is cons and [] is the empty list < 1313079532 468244 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I guess [] is still a special constructor, but not sugar. < 1313079543 521461 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :then, by [1]- = [1]-[1] i mean [1,*] = [1,1] < 1313079553 292895 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no don't ever do that either. < 1313079573 103105 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1313079615 271641 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,1,*,1,1] = [1,1,0,1,1] and [1,1,0,1,1] = [1,1,1,1] < 1313079664 533465 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know < 1313079705 93574 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps i should let it rest < 1313079705 261771 :derrik!~xix@143.122.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee QUIT :Quit: battery!! < 1313079870 543583 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: you don't need to explicitly specify links because there's an implicit link between each element < 1313079897 927768 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1][1]-[1][1] is the exact same thing as [1][1][1][1] for a linked list. < 1313079983 311693 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so your rewrite rules are still ambiguous unless you specify in what order it occurs. < 1313080012 684135 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is probably no practical advantage to inserts and deletions < 1313080024 518964 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it would be spicy < 1313080409 296103 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Operation Cat has failed. < 1313080415 799250 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This mouse is a worthy opponent indeed. < 1313080420 417349 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1313080427 468879 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should try chocolate as bait < 1313080647 195953 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1313080996 778633 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313081925 113491 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: No thanks for making me look at the Shiro code, it is a bit of a mess < 1313082460 588578 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :aAHAHAHAHVFAFVAOEKRHF < 1313082461 993875 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I HAVE IT < 1313082464 768491 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :AHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA < 1313082466 20969 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: HUG IT < 1313082467 352072 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH < 1313082484 883518 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: How come I'm getting so many mtl/monads-tf conflicts lately, I blame you? < 1313082492 65518 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :not my fault < 1313082502 588819 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: That doesn't stop me blaming you < 1313082514 522013 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :fair enough < 1313082524 155579 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if my instinctual specification of mtl is the Wrong Choice, if monads-tf is so popular now :P < 1313082812 730779 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PART #esoteric :"Leaving" < 1313082816 370364 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There, I released it into the wild. < 1313082818 867854 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1313082822 861426 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There, I released it into the wild. < 1313082837 381924 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO < 1313082837 968432 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :MISSED < 1313082838 384167 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :PET < 1313082839 641890 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OPPORTUNITY < 1313082840 860594 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :FRIEND < 1313082878 946563 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had to get the cat into containment so the mouse would have time to flee. < 1313082952 756717 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK but < 1313082962 142867 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :be nice < 1313082964 240142 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :to the mouse < 1313082976 923481 :MSleep!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313083036 714437 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1313083233 338674 :augur_!~augur@c-71-57-177-89.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313083316 716698 :ttm_!~daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1313083362 178095 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1313083446 323770 :ttm_!~daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1313083548 106304 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313083565 946944 :cheater__!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1313083565 947109 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1313083565 947188 :augur!~augur@c-71-57-177-89.hsd1.fl.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1313083565 947489 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1313083587 639442 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, this #jesus you've all been talking about, will I have fun if I join? < 1313083699 826402 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313083859 735334 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: yes. < 1313083870 173306 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :#esoteric-jesus is the recommended side dish. < 1313083912 89470 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe, is that about esoteric christianity, or just another #esoteric offshoot? :) < 1313083912 163534 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Well, Shiro currently runs, slowly, and then dies when testing FIXP < 1313083930 444246 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I do seem to recall this thing being fast and correct before I started optimising ;-) < 1313083940 157694 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: latter, ais was getting annoyed :D < 1313084032 543171 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if I could set up an IRC client so that it displays #esoteric-jesus and #jesus in the same channel while sending everything I write only to #esoteric-jesus < 1313084033 966735 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Soon there will be an #esoteric-x \forall #x \in freenode, it seems. < 1313084042 344012 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :kind of like a spectator mode < 1313084066 813699 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: So, um, does Mycology actually try a negative exponent with R? < 1313084112 225338 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-43-247.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1313084112 297706 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-43-247.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1313084112 297812 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1313084187 22141 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1313084221 307453 :rodgort!~rodgort@li125-242.members.linode.com QUIT :*.net *.split < 1313084403 398335 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Beats me, run ccbi mycology.b98 to find out < 1313084420 293506 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: It does < 1313084434 112002 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least, if it only does so because of a bug in Shiro, then it still gets to the end if I add a check < 1313084604 84863 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1313084627 413602 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1313084653 559086 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if there's a way to get dired to hide "crap" files altogether like .o < 1313084661 445697 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rather than just dimming them < 1313084822 10490 :rodgort!~rodgort@li125-242.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1313085158 150116 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, wtf... < 1313085161 462832 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1313085374 620625 :MSleep!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net NICK :MDude < 1313085944 380367 :Vorpal_!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1313085947 757073 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1313086177 254592 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1313086188 760767 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :one point seven seconds to point nine nine seconds < 1313086197 218642 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :just by eliminating typeclass bullshit < 1313086203 679832 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal_: hi im work on shiro again < 1313086220 500664 :Vorpal_!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1313086226 576277 :Vorpal_!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster NICK :Vorpal < 1313086262 74345 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (to beat deewiant) < 1313086264 320726 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (and cfunge) < 1313086274 979201 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i'll even put it in a VCS :OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO < 1313086348 857979 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not pictured: Vorpals's shock < 1313086392 888001 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :asterisk Vorpal's < 1313086407 152617 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't really care *shrug* < 1313086440 570868 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you say that now.... but when shiro beats cfunge on mycology... < 1313086465 762977 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, *shrug* < 1313086479 665042 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*shrug* < 1313086525 600531 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...what's shiro? < 1313086541 316824 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :funge interpreter in haskell < 1313086555 812346 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Funge as in befunge? < 1313086566 517252 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. ninety-eight, though, not the (far simpler) ninety-three standard. < 1313086738 432136 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds tricky < 1313086792 474493 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313086803 556663 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially p and g < 1313086879 305278 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-209-47.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1313086907 76660 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: It would be about ten times less tricky than it is without a bunch of edge-cases < 1313086925 178664 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It took me about four days of constant coding to get it to pass Deewiant's Mycology test suite < 1313086929 374882 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that's before any fingerprints < 1313086952 824346 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mycology? < 1313086982 466243 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://iki.fi/matti.niemenmaa/befunge/mycology.html < 1313086991 25721 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, pretty colours: http://iki.fi/matti.niemenmaa/befunge/mycology-comparison.html < 1313087013 772507 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the analogous benchmark suite http://iki.fi/matti.niemenmaa/befunge/fungicide.html (pretty graphs: http://iki.fi/matti.niemenmaa/befunge/fungicide-rankings/index.html) < 1313087023 632960 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :a whole four days? so that's how bad a coder you are then :P < 1313087073 235067 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: hey, four days isn't bad for about five hundred lines of code written according to a very vague and self-contradictory spec that pass an extremely rigorous test suite < 1313087083 440478 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/code/haskell/ :P < 1313087090 66169 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/pass/passes/ < 1313087093 959093 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the lines are plural I guess < 1313087101 732932 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :five hundred lines of Haskell is actually probably more code than in most languages. < 1313087113 236514 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :depending on how condensed it is. < 1313087124 954161 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was pretty fast, too < 1313087129 349253 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: that's why I s///'d it :P < 1313087133 992287 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :gotta get credit for my achievement < 1313087240 767948 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've got a bid for a project that has about 10k lines of C# < 1313087252 11877 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they want it ported to linux. < 1313087263 307976 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, if the language takes so little code, why does the spec have to be so vague and self-contradictory < 1313087302 679175 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: mono foo.exe < 1313087303 595538 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :job done < 1313087313 333167 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: five hundred lines of Haskell doesn't count as "little code" to me < 1313087314 423923 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : five hundred lines of Haskell is actually probably more code than in most languages. <-- indeed < 1313087322 676065 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's "medium-size" < 1313087329 63021 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :cfunge is something like 10000 lines, that includes fingerprints too though < 1313087331 902673 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: anyway, because cpressey < 1313087335 413563 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :is dumb < 1313087336 122528 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the past. < 1313087357 494123 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: shiro is about one thousand three hundred lines right now. fewer fingerprints, of course, but I'm working on that. < 1313087359 750081 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and things you get for free in haskell, since C has a poor standard library < 1313087371 726137 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds like I should write myself a funge some day, to see what it's all about < 1313087379 1691 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You complain about your standard library??? < 1313087379 585518 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- no portable environment variable module < 1313087379 666778 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :import System.Posix.Env < 1313087384 584610 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :--Shiro.Fingerprints.EVAR < 1313087386 517273 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, :P < 1313087388 211939 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOOK AT THE HORROR I HAVE TO SUFFER THROUGH < 1313087395 639434 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, lack of Data.whatever < 1313087411 334318 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: wat < 1313087413 870682 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's say I want to write a GUI in Haskell. What are my options? (I believe I've asked this question before...) < 1313087415 159453 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I mean you can just pull out a b-tree or hash table from some module < 1313087426 271811 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :not like C has those in the standard library < 1313087431 284782 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: gtk, wxwidgets, these are the main ones???? < 1313087446 501820 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the wx binding has a much nicer API, but wxWidgets applications tend to be uglier < 1313087448 91799 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about Tk bindings? < 1313087459 783389 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wxwidgets look better under OS X iirc < 1313087461 503263 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :than gtk < 1313087462 169520 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i don't know of any < 1313087465 357673 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, well < 1313087469 887798 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sort of :) < 1313087472 480865 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1313087474 895261 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :just forget about looking nice on os x < 1313087477 894414 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's one way to do it: cocoa < 1313087484 815700 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbiab, going to play adanaxis (fun game) < 1313087494 942239 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I want pretty UIs. Also it needs to run off of a flash drive... < 1313087507 148530 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: well, plenty of prominent programs use wxWidgets < 1313087523 628375 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks basically like Gtk, if you're not discerning; it uses native platform widgets except when it doesn't < 1313087527 820158 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Code::Blocks is wxWidgets, if you've used it < 1313087541 717224 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, uTorrent too apparently? < 1313087544 964779 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes, and Audacity < 1313087548 79916 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just wondering if I could package everything as a standalone application that can run via flash drive on Windows. < 1313087560 967856 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :how would it stop you < 1313087563 58056 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not too familiar with distributing my code... < 1313087571 452164 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"this MUST be in C:\Windows!!!" < 1313087588 201143 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it would be fine. I'd need to include the dependencies right? < 1313087603 303042 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, like... uh < 1313087604 852814 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the C library dependencies, yes. < 1313087610 490786 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :GHC statically links Haskell libraries by default. < 1313087615 968173 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just don't really know how to structure everything. < 1313087616 636654 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically you'll need the wxWidgets dlls. < 1313087638 351063 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah okay. < 1313087663 608977 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay I'll just figure it out when I get to that point. < 1313087676 97317 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just use command-line program in C, and it works OK. It should work in any computer. < 1313087690 741990 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :If graphical stuff and that kind of things are needed, I can use SDL. < 1313087720 94304 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just wondering where I should put the dependencies and how Haskell knows where they are, etc. < 1313087739 775707 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But with Haskell, I don't know very well about it. < 1313087743 219987 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :where the dlls should be on the flash drive. < 1313087761 184175 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: "Haskell" doesn't know anything. GHC produces standard dynamically-linked executables. < 1313087770 846129 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the program is specifically for Windows you should just use native widgets. < 1313087772 137515 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :On Windows, putting DLLs in the same directory as the .exe file should work. < 1313087786 425671 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: the Windows API is quite horrible to use, and I don't know of any Haskell bindings for it < 1313087787 8052 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, but I need the DLL right? GHC needs to know where that is, yes? < 1313087793 469327 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wxWidgets uses them, though, so it just acts as a layer of abstraction < 1313087798 498786 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: GHC doesn't. Your operating system does. < 1313087817 654618 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, how does that work exactly. < 1313087826 394728 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :be more specific :P < 1313087828 551331 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I apologize for my inexperience with this sort of thing. < 1313087848 679559 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, when I go to compile my program where should the DLLs be. < 1313087868 467393 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Once I used the Windows APIs to create a UserControl in Visual Basic, though. Because, the standard text box does not have Unicode, so I made up a user control that calls the unicode API < 1313087889 290865 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: you need to install the wx package from Hackage. its build process will involve linking with the wxWidgets DLLs < 1313087892 541927 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: I would expect it to work if the DLL files are in the same directory as the main program. < 1313087902 850466 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you might find http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/WxHaskell/Windows helpful < 1313087979 968886 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is true that the Windows API is not that good, but if the program is designed specifically for Windows you can use it. < 1313088007 397977 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmmm, I could also do this is linux right? but still cross-compiling for a Windows system. < 1313088012 894339 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*in < 1313088014 651170 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or if it is designed for not only Windows but also ReactOS, it would also do) < 1313088031 560642 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: well, probably. you might find building the Haskell wx library painful. < 1313088037 717521 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: more importantly, you'll need a GHC cross-compiler < 1313088042 610526 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which might be painful in itself < 1313088097 30612 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so I'll just my windows partition... < 1313088103 690608 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as painful as it will be. < 1313088125 743224 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that might be even more painful :-) < 1313088128 306274 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Be careful, or you'll accidentally your Windows partition. < 1313088134 274455 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^ < 1313088136 647387 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: you might want to -- brace yourself here, what I am about to say may shock you -- < 1313088143 950795 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: consider using a different language for this < 1313088164 560191 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO NOT BLASPHEME < 1313088172 145712 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: suggestions? < 1313088200 144069 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey I'll use C#!!! < 1313088206 587603 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that I want to... < 1313088211 671429 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: With Python, you could just use Portable Python or any other "USB stick" version, and it comes with Tkinter, which looks... semi-native on Windows (IDLE is Tkinter). that saves you DLL issues and the like, and there's that py[two]exe converter that might simplify it further. of course python is terrible < 1313088212 431170 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it would be good for windows stuff. < 1313088212 858319 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1313088214 723472 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as windows goes < 1313088216 268469 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the support ain't bad < 1313088239 680873 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would poke around tkinter's preference dialogues to make sure you consider tk pretty enough on windows first < 1313088245 415534 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I'm pretty familiar with Python, so that's a plus. < 1313088258 81563 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.py2exe.org/ < 1313088264 107682 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I've seen it. < 1313088279 250701 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, How did you end up with a keyboard without number keys? < 1313088290 14871 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: I wish I knew < 1313088301 130976 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm, but does a .exe contain hardware specific machine code? How do they run portably on any Windows machine? < 1313088309 468086 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/does/doesn't/ < 1313088315 43685 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: I... < 1313088323 448888 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :excuse my ignorance. < 1313088324 458438 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You realise that all the Windows applications available on the 'net are in .exe form, right? < 1313088329 537119 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1313088338 707652 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is why I'm confused. < 1313088339 456635 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, programming ignorance, sure, but it sounds like you've never used Windows before. < 1313088346 579410 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Guess what, Windows only runs on two architecture. < 1313088346 828978 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I have. < 1313088347 327900 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s. < 1313088353 129700 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of those architectures is backwards-compatible with the other. < 1313088361 971734 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah okay. < 1313088372 121442 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well < 1313088372 373085 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Supported platforms ARM, IA-32, x86-64 and Itanium < 1313088376 276282 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Got an Itanium machine sitting around? < 1313088379 114443 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It won't work on that < 1313088416 864544 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :NT 3.1 or so ran on Alpha and MIPS too. < 1313088436 479428 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :And 4.0 on PPC. < 1313088442 657443 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes, I know; I've ran an emulated NT four in qemu's MIPS emulato. < 1313088443 73895 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :r. < 1313088457 455234 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so really the vast majority of home computers are using the same few architectures. < 1313088459 899584 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I recall that project, yes. < 1313088461 807944 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1313088465 938721 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought there were several more. < 1313088485 16535 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, everything's a VAX nowadays. < 1313088510 143591 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vast majority -- every home computer is an x86 or an x86-64. < 1313088518 341274 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_> am I the only one who doesn't know everything about everything related to computing? < 1313088520 344020 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The error is on the scale of floating-point inaccuracies. < 1313088532 247041 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, out of the non-new, regular people. < 1313088533 432285 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: My laptop's a PPC iBook, so shush. < 1313088541 161733 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. We've been hiding the facts from you. < 1313088565 74079 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: So what's Apple's percentage of the market these days? Percentage of that market that's still on PPC? :p < 1313088573 544757 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: And it doesn't count as a home computer if you can take it out of your home. < 1313088584 502399 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything under a certain weight is not a home computer because I said so. < 1313088595 595078 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARM's quite relevant, though. < 1313088602 686332 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can write the programs that does not use floating-point, and then don't have floating-point inaccuracies. < 1313088625 100761 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :really I've never taken the time to learn about old instruction sets, specific points of language specs, compiler internals, and so on. < 1313088626 430776 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Not as far as home computers are concerned < 1313088628 772713 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARM is not relevant in elliott's weight class. :p < 1313088634 710591 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Okay, true. < 1313088639 633689 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... have other things to do. like life. < 1313088639 881699 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm deeply personally offended by this personal remark < 1313088644 413911 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Only relevant for smaller devices. < 1313088673 260344 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does "life" actually mean, anyway; it seems to mean "this thing that's infinitely greater than all my actual hobbies that I do all the time because I rule" < 1313088687 41817 :derrik!~xix@gprs-inet-65-7.elisa.ee JOIN :#esoteric < 1313088692 25910 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, I get the intended snarkiness, but it's such a ridiculously self-defeating concept < 1313088699 234238 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: nah, more like obligations that are time-consuming. < 1313088705 87154 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wasn't snarky. < 1313088716 247036 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just meant the general snarkiness of "I don't X, I have a life". :p < 1313088726 655229 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway obligations are for oblongs. < 1313088730 665595 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :do u c wut i did thar < 1313088740 876019 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1313088743 17995 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, yeah, that's different from what I was saying. Life is something that needs doing, not something that I have that others do not. < 1313088759 796227 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should make sure all your obligations involve old instruction sets < 1313088761 222632 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote What does "life" actually mean, anyway; it seems to mean "this thing that's infinitely greater than all my actual hobbies that I do all the time because I rule" < 1313088762 633510 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :582) What does "life" actually mean, anyway; it seems to mean "this thing that's infinitely greater than all my actual hobbies that I do all the time because I rule" < 1313088763 893019 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :having "a life" is basically referring to a social life. You know, being cool and interesting to other people and stuff. < 1313088775 145919 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unnecessary, I HAVE OLD INSTRUCTION SETS AND LANGUAGE SPECS < 1313088791 854717 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313088801 752396 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: I'll let you in on a secret: 90 percent of everyone's knowledge is stored on a medium-efficiency but extremely high-capacity storage layer called "Google" < 1313088813 96944 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Helpfully, it is accessible in almost all situations were IRC is < 1313088822 778492 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quick, ask me about goats. < 1313088854 61430 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT WAS NOT RHETORICAL < 1313088854 560215 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, but I'm just wondering about the general process of accumulating all of this knowledge. Essentially, in what order do you google things. < 1313088861 838214 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no your point is RUINED < 1313088867 912871 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I AM RUINING IT HAHA < 1313088920 929013 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: "Hey in Haskell what GUI libraries are good" oh well, I know of gtk and wx, maybe there's a qt binding? google "hackage packages" -> http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/pkg-list.html -> Ctrl+F qt -> ok nothing im so right and awesome always haha look at my wisdom < 1313088931 126964 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :unedited transcript < 1313088959 512454 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313088961 685395 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, I know a lot of things are googled during conversation, but there's a lot of information that's just already known... and I wonder why. Are you reading about a language spec or old instruction set right now, elliott? < 1313088976 300793 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I _am_ an old instruction set. < 1313088990 68244 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, umm, I know a lot about the languages I use a lot :P < 1313088990 333786 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ancient Egyptian? < 1313088995 848631 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :Voynitch < 1313089027 314914 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott is a mystical figure of ancient Egyptian computational wisdom cleverly disguised as a young lad. < 1313089033 705252 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW DID YOU KNOW. < 1313089111 210429 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so for the next few days I'm going to be cramming every bit of knowledge off of the internet I can. < 1313089137 995455 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that I can impress this potential hirer and maybe start making some money. < 1313089182 276900 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then I TOO WILL KNOW EVERYTHING ABOUT COMPUTERS. Or at least all of the boring useful stuff. < 1313089213 589277 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh, don't try and learn anything at all, and then prove you have an actually useful skill (ability to find answers to questions with Google), demonstrate repeatedly for every question given < 1313089220 95692 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Start from tvtropes or uncyclopedia or 4chan or some-such, that's where all the useful bits are. < 1313089220 625678 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Approach a good one but not necessarily a successful one) < 1313089294 496450 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but I won't have time to google everything. That's what work experience does, cuts down on your googling time. < 1313089314 103784 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Googling takes a noticeable amount of time for you? < 1313089318 471831 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it adds up. < 1313089362 493300 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let g = (\(x:y:z) -> [y] ++ z ++ [x]) in reverse $ g $ g $ g $ (\x -> head x : head x : tail x) $ g $ g $ g "toilet" < 1313089364 592992 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : "elliott" < 1313089376 82574 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohhhh snap! < 1313089393 394102 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :On topics that aren't cheater_'s obsessive fascination with both toilets and me, CakeProphet: have you seen the wonder that is mergeByteString. < 1313089435 799199 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but yeah not the actual googling but the total time it takes to read and understand everything for a large project, becomes pretty large. especially when you only have a few days to complete it. < 1313089439 854275 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, no. < 1313089443 629834 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it, uh, merge bytestrings? < 1313089471 461318 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle mergeByteString < 1313089472 140514 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :No results found < 1313089493 437976 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: SHIELD YOUR EYES AND GAZE UNTO YOUR /MSG < 1313089561 527169 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION puts on his shades, ohhhh yeah. 8)
< 1313089567 68962 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they look much less cool in ASCII < 1313089574 304267 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in whatever typeface this is. < 1313089577 896326 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :B) < 1313089613 371543 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god what am I looking at. < 1313089645 556845 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so wait how does that fungespace work. < 1313089669 692816 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :XB IOOOQAEP IOOIQOAI < 1313089684 13305 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right now it's just a basic Map, but with row and column population tracking < 1313089687 839391 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And min/max coords < 1313089691 944099 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah okay. < 1313089694 493827 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works. < 1313089706 370839 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's going to become a lot more complicated soon < 1313089717 322577 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although hopefully that function will be < 1313089718 120810 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :less < 1313089719 132905 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugly < 1313089735 119572 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is quite ugly. < 1313089751 718356 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am still on the first line that isn't the type... < 1313089763 12398 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but my vision is bad and I really need to stop procrastinating that eye exam. < 1313089763 179219 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Basically it started off fairly passable, but then everything was _so_ _slow_, so I just said fuck it and went for efficiency first. < 1313089815 942286 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you, folding a tuple? oh, no that's the initial value. < 1313089840 36403 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use foldl1 a lot so I forget about the initial value. < 1313089842 597724 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://analysis.no.net/ < 1313089850 443699 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :foldl1 is bad you shouldn't use foldl1 < 1313089854 997629 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1313089862 459888 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I know it's fine to use then I do. < 1313089878 11815 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's only fine to use if your list never ever ever ever has no elements < 1313089878 676438 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1313089883 612192 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it only supports folding functions of type (a -> a -> a) < 1313089886 325435 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also IF HASKELL LISTS HAD EMPTY/NON-EMPTY TYPING THEN THIS WOULDN'T BE A PROBLEM IT WOULD JUST CATCH ON COMPILE. < 1313089888 477155 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which many folds don't meet < 1313089891 885995 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance the one there < 1313089907 995521 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: they... don't need that, there /is/ a nonempty list type in common use < 1313089921 156237 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hackage.haskell.org/package/NonEmpty hmm or was it under another name, this one looks unupdated < 1313089926 771547 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :whichever one kmett uses :P < 1313089948 746006 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I mean have something like List NonEmpty a for the : constructor and List Empty a for the [] constructor. < 1313089954 444949 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, is that what you mean? < 1313089973 425616 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that's pointless. why not just have [a] and NonEmpty a? < 1313089983 904545 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the two types aren't really related, so bundling them together into "List" seems silly. < 1313089994 834221 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I managed to program the Propositional Calculus into Haskell's type system, although Typographical Number Theory would be more difficult since the way of variable bindings in TNT. But maybe there is a way, but I don't know much about Haskell so I don't know. < 1313089995 636996 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially since it makes using lists that you don't care whether they're empty or not really awkward < 1313090003 136698 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, it does. < 1313090036 933625 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this correct? http://sprunge.us/ZQYd < 1313090048 786538 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION ponders a remapping of ascii code whereby: 0='0', 1='1', 9='9', 10='A', 15='F', 16= 'G', 35='Z', 64='a', 89='z'
< 1313090063 573119 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :why. < 1313090070 151182 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now it seems to work if typing :t Or (Not$ And (Atom$ P) (Not$ Atom$ Prime$ Q)) (Imply (Not$ Not$ Atom$ P) (Atom$ Prime$ Q)) < 1313090094 274250 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: that's not haskell's type system < 1313090099 75372 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just embedding it into haskell < 1313090099 658707 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: I also made a new code, where it also had the property that 'A' comes directly after '9'. But not where 'a' comes directly after 'Z' < 1313090133 117474 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :'a' doesn't come directly after 'Z' in my code either :D < 1313090135 734510 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: OK, so how would you embed Typographical Number Theory into Haskell by using the type system? < 1313090137 433178 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://analysis.no.net/ <-- hm. < 1313090150 653540 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oh, thanks; I was wondering where that tab came from < 1313090158 348424 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, XD < 1313090162 465644 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: well, basically, every constructor would become a type, with no constructors < 1313090165 693891 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: OK. I had that 'a' results from 'A' just by setting a bit < 1313090169 741356 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you look carefully, 'a' waits until 64.. which is binary 100000 < 1313090172 945772 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know why you'd wnat to, though < 1313090183 608690 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, still different to your system < 1313090184 822298 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but .. i didnt have it as a bit setting < 1313090192 657067 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes.. < 1313090193 656163 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1313090201 557410 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn < 1313090217 580110 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :bitwise operators sure are cool. < 1313090222 623949 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have 10 (0x0A) for 'A' and 64 (0x40) for 'a' so it doesn't go < 1313090264 209928 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: if only i had shifted my 'a' up by about 10 it would have been the same < 1313090264 814438 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But my system does share the property with yours (and also with ASCII) that (('0'&0xF)==0) < 1313090270 926908 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you have bested me < 1313090270 999466 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: Yes. < 1313090288 383571 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, back to your query < 1313090293 367205 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote well, you have bested me itidus20: Yes. < 1313090294 639053 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :583) well, you have bested me itidus20: Yes. < 1313090329 220676 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: That is backwards from how it appears on my screen. < 1313090336 536470 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww < 1313090344 744660 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1313090372 633229 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here is my design: http://sprunge.us/KTBE < 1313090377 160322 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you are using a 6-tuple < 1313090381 994678 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you realize that you are using a 6-tuple? < 1313090387 118426 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: :) < 1313090389 998447 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you just need to, step back < 1313090393 814620 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :take a few deep breaths. < 1313090403 149627 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :get some perspective. < 1313090405 675453 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: hm? hm? < 1313090411 867363 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, just "hm." < 1313090415 46426 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1313090504 166006 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: actually I guess a 6-tuple is fine. It's not any cleaner looking than an ADT and you probably can't reduce it in any way. < 1313090506 724061 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: Now, you can see how I designed a different character coding and what your opinion of it is < 1313090544 793216 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i was chasing the luxurious property that ascii hex = binary hex :D < 1313090600 408073 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't hex just like... hex? < 1313090605 600194 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: I understand. However once doing so, you lose the feature of C where a string terminator can be code zero < 1313090612 63281 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh < 1313090646 557417 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :string terminators are ugly < 1313090653 699279 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :but helpful < 1313090656 852134 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, storing (size,data) is far better < 1313090660 974146 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I did somethihng else where it is if you just set one bit (x|0x40) to make it into the character correspond to hex code < 1313090668 89739 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone know how to get Linux /usr/bin/time to output with three decimal places? < 1313090669 327893 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, less security risks too < 1313090669 578480 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :for real-time < 1313090672 329020 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal? < 1313090672 494947 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: but that's like a whole extra WORD of memory. < 1313090678 760697 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: 'A' = 65 .. 0xA = 10 < 1313090682 423830 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, oh, embedded? < 1313090682 507069 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: maybe even more!!! < 1313090683 339807 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1313090708 50817 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ time < 1313090708 217013 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m0.000s < 1313090709 415633 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :memory is scarce these days, Vorpal. < 1313090713 942513 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, as far as I can tell it does already < 1313090716 246276 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: /usr/bin/time in particular. < 1313090718 742634 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not built-in time. < 1313090727 4924 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, bash: /usr/bin/time: No such file or directory < 1313090733 873369 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :/bin/time then < 1313090739 392404 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, not that either < 1313090739 502727 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1313090744 929830 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :your system is broken :P < 1313090747 604126 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: ah cool.. so you used bitflags extensively < 1313090750 466595 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :*pffft* < 1313090755 378466 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah seems so. < 1313090758 231989 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Enlightenment... Is going to release. < 1313090763 28575 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: Yes. I did. < 1313090774 321684 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ pkgfile -s /usr/bin/time < 1313090774 488778 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :extra/time < 1313090779 862449 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :need to install that < 1313090781 111650 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess < 1313090790 333935 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what is wrong with the built in time? < 1313090807 42491 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I did use other features too, such as the ordering of < = > sequentially in that order, the same as in ASCII. < 1313090813 249249 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: can't get it to output nicely < 1313090822 467402 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, in what way? < 1313090823 634933 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But for {} () [] brackets, to find the delimiters it is just one bit < 1313090826 931702 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha hm < 1313090827 184492 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it goes to stderr < 1313090828 680476 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t mapM < 1313090830 12728 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a (m :: * -> *) b. (Monad m) => (a -> m b) -> [a] -> m [b] < 1313090846 567936 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :perfect, < 1313090849 859216 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ TIMEFORMAT=%3R; for i in `seq 9`; do time ../../shiro mycology.b98 >/dev/null; done < 1313090873 41825 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> mapM (const [0,1]) [1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1] < 1313090874 375506 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [[0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0],[0,0,0,0,0,0,0,1],[0,0,0,0,0,0,1,0],[0,0,0,0,0,0,1,1],[0... < 1313090889 923190 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1313090913 532482 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> mapM (const "01") "________" < 1313090914 872245 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : ["00000000","00000001","00000010","00000011","00000100","00000101","0000011... < 1313090931 618382 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I do believe that distractions are healthy, and hence this topic, however, I find it very difficult of late to concentrate on anything for a meaningful length of time. So my distractions are the fruits of lazy. < 1313090955 136595 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t replicateM < 1313090955 804015 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (m :: * -> *) a. (Monad m) => Int -> m a -> m [a] < 1313090965 56261 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :And what I mean is I think your other topic is more important than some alternative character set I imagined at a whim. < 1313090972 226259 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> replicateM 8 "01" < 1313090973 40512 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : ["00000000","00000001","00000010","00000011","00000100","00000101","0000011... < 1313090998 855626 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha. < 1313091009 668658 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, right... < 1313091020 658413 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: awesome < 1313091024 350459 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was looking for a different way than using good old replicateM < 1313091033 566779 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i assume both of them end up applying sequence to the same list < 1313091034 96697 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am like one of those people who never stops talking ever. < 1313091039 43040 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yeah. < 1313091058 250195 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src mapM < 1313091058 668942 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :mapM f as = sequence (map f as) < 1313091064 335582 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src replicateM < 1313091064 752011 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :replicateM n x = sequence (replicate n x) < 1313091082 603338 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :since I'm using const all that's importance is the length of the input list in mapM < 1313091102 923827 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: having said that, how do these things work in practice? is it like a filter which translates a character stream? < 1313091123 573178 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sequence $ "________" >> ["01"] < 1313091124 421994 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : ["00000000","00000001","00000010","00000011","00000100","00000101","0000011... < 1313091132 97305 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :map (const x) ls == replicate (length ls) x < 1313091134 488882 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :like: char zzo_char(char a); < 1313091171 350698 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: a mapping function would be one way to do it, yes. < 1313091177 546258 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1313091185 749683 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (<$) < 1313091186 619322 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a (f :: * -> *) b. (Functor f) => a -> f b -> f a < 1313091207 260948 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sequence $ "01" <$ "________" < 1313091207 589097 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha, that's the function I was looking for, once. < 1313091208 288769 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : ["00000000","00000001","00000010","00000011","00000100","00000101","0000011... < 1313091217 908238 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :or can the video card be hacked to display text how you want it? :D < 1313091240 91281 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh... wishful thinking < 1313091252 664130 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: if you use video mode, like every graphical OS, then you control charsets < 1313091259 88382 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just draw text as you see fit. < 1313091260 27152 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh < 1313091278 34141 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :because text mode is very rare nowadays i suppose < 1313091286 282403 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :text mode uses whatever font is currently loaded, by default what people consider the "DOS font", I'm sure there's a "portable" way to load a new one, since Linux does it < 1313091289 306866 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you could handle that, too < 1313091297 382284 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you use an EGA/VGA compatible text mode, those have editable fonts too, yes. < 1313091301 743749 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh < 1313091302 625159 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and keyboards send in scancodes, not ASCII, anyway, so you need a translation, but not one from ASCII < 1313091317 103908 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yes, you could use zzo38's character set all the way right up until the point where you need to talk to anyone else in the universe :P < 1313091325 980267 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so zzo38 could make an OS with his own charset and such < 1313091344 467941 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but we would still be speaking UTF-8. < 1313091353 330654 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :humm < 1313091354 369378 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20, most modern personal computers can change to text mode with a single keyboard combination < 1313091354 536713 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313091373 654443 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not believe Windows has any such functionality. < 1313091384 907612 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do not believe i left out "modern" < 1313091386 92379 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :implication: windows is not modern :D < 1313091392 367672 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe most consoles tend to be framebuffers nowadays too. < 1313091412 931098 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1313091416 568028 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do not < 1313091423 224816 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION actually doesn't have a framebuffer set up.
< 1313091429 655552 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are usually framebuffers on linux < 1313091439 169964 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean it tends to be that by default these days < 1313091442 189422 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially with KMS < 1313091458 776896 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :vesafb sucks, and the Radeon KMS thing would be great except that the Radeon X driver is unstable. < 1313091460 708332 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think the ttys are framebuffers < 1313091461 39351 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have derailed things with my topic < 1313091466 923557 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the Ubuntu default is to use a framebuffer console, and that's quite a market share right there. < 1313091477 712670 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha, yeah Windows is totally not modern and stuff. < 1313091479 446590 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :framebuffer consoles are discernible by a certain amount of lag on display < 1313091481 779403 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_, atm I think I use vesafb + catalyst or some crazy combo < 1313091497 659052 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater_: That's just vesafb. < 1313091499 652450 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: see dictionary entry w → wasting your time, n. < 1313091505 649752 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_, oh? < 1313091508 907189 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm is "wasting your time" a noun WILL THE WORLD EVER KNOW... < 1313091523 35092 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater_: Nothing inherent, the vesafb driver is just naive. < 1313091528 411154 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_, what fb do you use when you use intel graphics hm < 1313091535 900134 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't have Intel graphics. < 1313091539 222454 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: :) < 1313091539 389594 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1313091565 199636 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's a gerund phrase or part of the sentence's predicate. < 1313091570 439419 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, it can be one. :P < 1313091587 50510 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :by a stretch of definition, I guess. < 1313091632 386639 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wasting your time is bad < 1313091634 860672 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop wasting your time. < 1313091651 822607 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm learning ellian script < 1313091680 783952 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that like, spelling out numbers and symbol characters and stuff? < 1313091693 146488 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.ccelian.com/concepca.html < 1313091694 312763 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ellian as in elliott? < 1313091702 859733 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no. okay < 1313091718 291772 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was pretty confused about that. < 1313091718 628434 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1313091725 406562 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks nice but it's not very handy for handwriting < 1313091840 278142 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1313091869 674971 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember for my Java class we had paper tests. < 1313091875 424575 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I had to... write Java code by hand. < 1313091902 495315 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was the most unnatural thing ever. < 1313091903 503915 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :class MyClass extending PaperTests < 1313091913 241095 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wrote C and C++ by hand < 1313091925 598473 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :on tests < 1313091938 179556 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've only had to write pseudocode by hand so far < 1313091938 678990 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: My work-workstation has some Intel graphics in it, and /sys/class/graphics/fb0/name says "inteldrmfb". < 1313091946 956737 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, what architecture did you write it for < 1313091987 160097 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :every single one that's supported by the compiler that teacher had to test answers lol < 1313092062 172273 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: does Haskell have something equivalent to #if? < 1313092139 122416 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: you can choose to have cpp run over your code, but don't. < 1313092140 487028 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you want it < 1313092152 583715 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you want #if < 1313092159 560823 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's probably a better way < 1313092195 582666 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :help dilemmas are hard monqy < 1313092216 292505 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :dilemmas what < 1313092224 959105 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fclabels or data-lens for shiro........ < 1313092236 693210 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes there's a portable solution which isn't quite efficient. hm you could probably use rules for that... < 1313092236 857713 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i cannot deciduous trees.... < 1313092299 632367 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've only glanced at data-lens but I remember preferring fclabels. my glance may not have gotten the big appeal of data-lens though < 1313092348 206341 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :data-lens is the lenses package right < 1313092348 288477 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: well in theory data-lens has more efficient updates, because it's (a -> (b, b -> a)) rather than (a -> b, a -> b -> a) < 1313092351 380498 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1313092353 202197 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hackage.haskell.org/package/data-lens < 1313092354 330509 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313092354 496169 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you can probably use template haskell as well, can't you? < 1313092356 321729 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmett's < 1313092361 368040 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: um? < 1313092366 28842 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh for number sign if? < 1313092367 700948 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll glance < 1313092367 867045 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :for conditional compilation < 1313092367 949987 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell CakeProphet < 1313092369 942597 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: just wondering how platform-specific stuff is handled. I have no use for it. < 1313092376 656588 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: abstraction < 1313092404 388118 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so GHC does it all basically < 1313092444 364102 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: but yes it is like... data-lens has a better type and has a totally better author??? but its TH stuff uses a _ suffix rather than a _ prefix which I like slightly less? except that's not fair since you can provide another prefix but that involves writing your own thing and feels weird to me because peer pressure.......... < 1313092462 134557 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and fclabels is I think more popular?? but < 1313092463 377730 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it introduces < 1313092465 54855 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :more types.... < 1313092474 305873 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so............yeah............. < 1313092491 777637 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fclabels is nice. I've never heard of data-lens < 1313092513 659264 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: the ansewr to http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5767129/lenses-fclabels-data-accessor-which-library-for-structure-access-and-mutation goes in depth a bit, totally biased since it's written by kmett :) < 1313092514 553799 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :im still glancing at data-lens < 1313092521 255573 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's pretty explanatroy............. < 1313092535 238573 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, that was really annoying, but here's a sysfs-oneliner to get the currently active virtual console driver type: < 1313092537 318155 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fis@eris:~$ for c in /sys/devices/virtual/vtconsole/vtcon*; do read b < $c/bind; if [ $b == 1 ]; then cat $c/name; fi; done < 1313092537 390500 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(S) VGA+ < 1313092541 363569 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :[htkallas@pc112 ~]$ for c in /sys/devices/virtual/vtconsole/vtcon*; do read b < $c/bind; if [ $b == 1 ]; then cat $c/name; fi; done < 1313092541 436412 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(M) frame buffer device < 1313092544 11549 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I think he's done a bunch of ~benchmarking~ of them?? and his type isf astest < 1313092546 185827 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that it...mattres < 1313092549 344125 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically there's a point where a project becomes large enough to warrant fclabels. < 1313092552 362308 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is the rule. < 1313092561 262948 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Leftovers from the "you can distinguish a framebuffer console by X" thing.) < 1313092563 357278 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: note that some of data-lens is in http://hackage.haskell.org/package/data-lens-fd and http://hackage.haskell.org/package/data-lens-template because of portability < 1313092568 448269 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just becomes more obvious that Haskell's record syntax is shitty. < 1313092577 610565 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: a lens package is essential for every project, I am just choosing which < 1313092591 264756 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this lens you speak of. < 1313092604 356461 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhh... read the answer to http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5767129/lenses-fclabels-data-accessor-which-library-for-structure-access-and-mutation < 1313092634 362117 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: sheesh there is plenty of #if in haskell library code, see e.g. http://www.haskell.org/ghc/docs/latest/html/libraries/directory-1.1.0.1/src/System-Directory.html < 1313092681 277211 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: any idea why it's called a lens? < 1313092709 519350 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: it's fairly evocative, short, unused, and pretty < 1313092714 275787 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :good reasons???? < 1313092728 186178 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Also it gets FLARES. < 1313092793 336977 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, because it "concentrates" on a part of the information, but the other bits are still there < 1313092819 649194 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :like when you're looking at something through a lens, you see what it's pointing at in large, but the other stuff is still squished around the corner < 1313092835 941353 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can still sort of get them back. < 1313092838 110730 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. there is no sense in which the other bits are "still there". < 1313092849 241404 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lens (a -> b) (a -> b -> a) < 1313092856 131178 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first function discards the other bits. < 1313092863 423929 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second function isn't concentrating at all. < 1313092879 309076 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is that residue isomorphism representation, but it is new, apparently inefficient, and i know of only one person who uses it < 1313092888 616506 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it is certainly not the standard, and originated years after they were called lenses. < 1313092934 989760 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's new to you? < 1313092958 695510 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i recall some humorous comment not long ago from someone who finally caved in and started calling them lenses < 1313092963 385488 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not "new to me", the talk/blog post introducing it freely admits they came up with it ercently. < 1313092965 589136 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :recently. < 1313092972 742667 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes, same person who invented the residue representation < 1313092980 827184 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1313092987 846284 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://twanvl.nl/tag/lens < 1313092993 128427 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://twanvl.nl/blog/haskell/isomorphism-lenses < 1313093007 150738 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyways < 1313093012 380509 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds about right < 1313093013 829657 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know more than one person who uses this < 1313093019 514152 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's not like they're unused < 1313093053 72501 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know why they would, since they're hard to use and inefficient. < 1313093061 637936 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elegant, but little else. < 1313093074 751414 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh no! I was the original author of data-accessor, and then I passed it over to Henning and stopped paying attention. The a -> r -> (a,r) representation also makes me uncomfortable, and my original implementation was just like your Lens type. Heeennnninngg!! < 1313093084 667250 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Heeennnninngg!!" is my catchphrase < 1313093094 355633 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-226-199.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1313093139 938881 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod NICK :copumpkin < 1313093236 898718 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-255-111.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313093257 567628 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1313093267 324419 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently my email address was accessed in Egypt 19 hours ago. < 1313093274 316005 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: longest glance < 1313093298 573389 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :longest glance. < 1313093303 217317 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks nice???? < 1313093322 334741 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: i know the things making me waver at all are basically < 1313093330 533722 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :- oh no more people use fclabels (peer pressure) < 1313093346 941250 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :- oh no the default suffix is slightly less nice? (even though i can fix that it would be going against the grain even though it's just one function call (peer pressure)) < 1313093351 459280 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :peers: bad to press < 1313093377 60165 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: probably someone in mubarak's family trying to use it to contact a person who can help them get their money out of the country < 1313093434 650025 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably < 1313093452 653503 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :one thing i think i like more about fclabels it is easier to learn getL setL modifyL and friends than all of these crazy infix operators < 1313093462 743790 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: there's plenty of precedent for this method. see your old mail folder. < 1313093468 424486 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: you're not meant to use the ones in Data.Lens.Common < 1313093486 863512 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313093490 833666 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: see http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/data-lens/2.0.0/doc/html/Data-Lens-Strict.html for the operators you're Meant To Use < 1313093494 268000 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/data-lens/2.0.0/doc/html/Data-Lens-Lazy.html < 1313093498 118785 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/data-lens-fd/2.0/doc/html/Data-Lens.html < 1313093500 491019 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're all the same, API-wise < 1313093505 511860 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1313093510 497071 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :except the -fd one has strict versions with the exclamation marks < 1313093518 360186 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it still looks like crazy infix operators < 1313093537 695810 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-255-111.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1313093538 936272 :pikhq_!~pikhq@174-22-154-206.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313093571 392509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :%= seems reasonable to me??? as a modify operator < 1313093583 455439 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok != is a _bit_ confusing for assignment :D < 1313093591 505141 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :!||%%-*= < 1313093596 898350 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :by crazy I mean < 1313093601 193978 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let (>:-/) a = concat . replicate a in 10 >:-/ "HA" < 1313093602 820441 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : "HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA" < 1313093603 820250 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it will take me a little while to learn them < 1313093614 606715 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: but, stop, you peer pressured me into fclabels already, :( < 1313093621 891260 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did???? :( < 1313093625 429704 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1313093625 845009 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313093627 822767 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :glep < 1313093655 285500 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha, nice. += < 1313093674 630886 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and friends. < 1313093743 711036 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :~= applies a regex to a string in reverse right? < 1313093789 176338 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think the infix operator look nice, and you get the benefits of MonadState < 1313093814 220480 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: well, fclabels has monadstate stuff too :P < 1313093815 721680 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the infix operators in common aren't in monadstate < 1313093844 527889 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you compose lenses in data-lens? < 1313093856 939245 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course. < 1313093858 937543 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes there is a category instance < 1313093862 762038 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a feature of every single lens package :P < 1313093865 645049 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's like half the point of lenses < 1313093884 198478 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :every single lens package excpet lenses???? or do they have it too < 1313093901 644609 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not according to that kmett dude. < 1313094012 4440 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also, how's anarchy working out for you? < 1313094024 72534 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1313094028 246442 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : not according to that kmett dude. < 1313094028 762917 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1313094035 241507 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1313094037 542639 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that package is just bad < 1313094086 180166 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1313094128 388191 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1313094143 55777 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1313094161 118465 :KingOfKarlsruhe!~chatzilla@p5B14C0D8.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313094289 441246 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so data-lens looks good and i like it??? < 1313094334 676130 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may convert a few things i wrote with fclabels to get used to it < 1313094389 302267 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :he says, as elliott is minutes into fclabelling < 1313094395 932047 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are probably right i am peer pressuring myself too muches... < 1313094402 468906 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :im kind of iffy on the assignment operator though < 1313094405 482502 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :~= doesn't feel right < 1313094415 466798 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess you are meant to use the strict version when possible < 1313094419 817432 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but != feels even less right < 1313094462 917556 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :peer pressure is a bad thing < 1313094503 589783 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :another thing i like about data-lens but i do not know if it is right to like is it comes with a bunch of convenience things that I ended up writing myself a bunch all the time when using fclabels < 1313094520 289292 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :like what, i am curiosios < 1313094524 379983 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fstLens, sndLens, (^%%=) < 1313094534 273239 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :most notably (^%%=) < 1313094580 375757 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the confused but happy clown operator < 1313094667 789885 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@121-73-170-157.dsl.telstraclear.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313094667 898661 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@121-73-170-157.dsl.telstraclear.net QUIT :Changing host < 1313094667 898813 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1313094824 94260 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: im just worried that maybe shiro will get slower with lenses :( < 1313094825 772216 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but actually < 1313094831 154429 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :using tehs trict modifiers might even speed it up < 1313094884 192221 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i usually prefer nice pretty beautiful over speed because i am bad at coping < 1313094964 676041 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: yes but, you see, < 1313094978 763322 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :with shiro i have to prove that haskell and BRAINS is faster than C with inline assembly and posix_fadvise < 1313094993 258729 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313095001 634761 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :currently it takes about one second on mycology which is almost precisely one second slower than cfunge and ccbi :( < 1313095001 713562 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is shiro i forget or never knew < 1313095009 667567 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :my funge interpreter in haskell < 1313095010 98823 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1313095011 46283 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :funge < 1313095045 531638 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do not like this proof it is like asking for pain :( < 1313095124 226860 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: but i will maintain < 1313095125 265501 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ELEAGNCE < 1313095129 335057 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the quest for geratnes < 1313095381 610483 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :goto = (rayPosition . ipRay . currentIP !=) < 1313095389 287400 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: help its confusing, i think, keeping, its /= :( < 1313095509 254511 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: i kind of want something that's data-lens except the operators have different names and _ is prefix not postfix for th...... < 1313095522 218141 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1313095546 330755 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313095793 856613 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^unscramble ELEAGNCE < 1313095794 23190 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :EELCENAG < 1313095802 183889 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^unscramble geratnes < 1313095802 255927 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :gseernat < 1313095817 753784 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :^scramble eggs < 1313095818 252247 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :egsg < 1313095819 575631 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL OLD JOKE < 1313095917 101256 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it would be easy emough to make a moduley thing to hide all the bad data-lens stuff and export new names and a _ prefix instead of postfix right < 1313095925 364132 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: yes but... that feels wrong.... < 1313095929 320622 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: of course that would also be a wrong yes < 1313095931 832392 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is like... taking work but insulting.... < 1313095939 679915 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1313095964 825267 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I will just poke edwardk every other day until he makes it nicer like that, < 1313096087 918900 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who's edwardk? < 1313096091 529845 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It sounds very funny. < 1313096103 722399 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: ? < 1313096108 791486 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :he is this dude < 1313096109 628346 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like something a bird would say. < 1313096116 879924 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is his name....................... < 1313096118 60178 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Edwark! Edwark! < 1313096160 672437 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/binnen-i-be-gone/ < 1313096170 86894 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose Haskell can be very fast if you use a CPU which is designed to speed up the LLVM operations that Haskell uses a lot, and to save memory by some of that kind of stuff too < 1313096234 222759 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/remove-kampyle/ < 1313096246 9487 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've always wanted to be able to get rid of kamyple. < 1313096256 261202 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is kampyle < 1313096366 104034 :pikhq_!~pikhq@174-22-154-206.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Haskell's already pretty dang fast. < 1313096405 544684 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy, a Homestuck spoiler. < 1313096428 148060 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it? I've nevemmm mmmpph < 1313096434 266863 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313096454 515102 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover is full of lies and dead < 1313096617 795320 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :flies and mead < 1313096642 882490 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is just, how can you make rulebooks with Haskell stuff? And the other stuff I meantioned on that wiki page? < 1313096679 548277 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other unrelated thing: How can the rules of Propositional Calculus be defined using the Haskell type system? < 1313096680 566455 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, I... don't think rule books were a priority. < 1313096699 528445 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1313096699 858909 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm wait is kmett and edwardk different people? < 1313096703 702152 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1313096709 426604 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, also Haskell's typesystem maps to an inconsistent logic. < 1313096713 724543 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: I know. It is why I try to invent something new. That can do rulebooks and some other features for a specific purpose < 1313096715 675521 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :whew, i thought i was confused there < 1313096724 209753 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, wait, does it? < 1313096735 890204 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, you can't actually *prove* bottom. < 1313096740 14916 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes you can < 1313096744 286775 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But, can you do it by not using the inconsistent commands? < 1313096745 112897 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol :: a; lol = undefined < 1313096754 36793 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you can't even define it without extensions! < 1313096759 407337 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol :: a; lol = undefined < 1313096764 473115 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no extensions < 1313096767 271905 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, I mean the empty type. < 1313096773 550458 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can define it < 1313096774 590900 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :newtype < 1313096778 52727 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh as a type < 1313096784 726347 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :see "void" package, Edward A. Kmett < 1313096788 939048 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm right < 1313096793 438536 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fully standard haskell ninety-eight < 1313096795 929292 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, huh, I thought it didn't work. < 1313096806 966197 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :newtype Void = Void Void < 1313096810 413147 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :simple as < 1313096819 395881 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell does not support empty data types. < 1313096823 252293 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :— WP < 1313096825 910463 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :newtype Void = Void Void < 1313096831 606031 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this type is uninhabited apart from _|_ < 1313096835 258643 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone probably ought to fix it. < 1313096838 120063 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*that < 1313096839 132469 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1313096840 23122 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :FFS < 1313096842 773126 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not an empty data type < 1313096845 622531 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just an uninhabited one < 1313096847 612980 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what WP means is < 1313096852 731580 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does not support empty data DECLARATIONS < 1313096862 195373 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which in fact I think is standard since haskell twothousandandten but that's not the point < 1313096872 467063 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's just weird phrasing, then. < 1313097007 917071 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, Haskell does accept newtype Void = Void Void < 1313097031 148109 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hm there's one problem with that newtype, i don't think you can use it to prove Void -> a (which is an axiom) without doing further recursion? < 1313097044 400962 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: absurd :: Void -> a < 1313097044 639449 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :absurd (Void a) = absurd a < 1313097048 115520 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: but note that it never actually recurses < 1313097055 480380 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because absurd never gets past pattern-matching < 1313097059 627099 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because newtypes are strict, etc. < 1313097064 747249 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm wait < 1313097065 660646 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact < 1313097069 170571 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it never even gets to pattern-matching < 1313097072 44541 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :absurd's body is irrelevant < 1313097078 848418 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because (Void x) will never halt < 1313097082 194154 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what i mean < 1313097087 701824 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hlep < 1313097088 490735 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :im tired < 1313097096 845560 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes but it's still unsatisfactory < 1313097104 677297 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well, why? < 1313097144 826580 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose you could think of it as structural recursion, so it's allowed anyhow < 1313097154 977480 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's exactly structural recursion :P < 1313097174 678371 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders what the induction/recursion principle is for Void
< 1313097180 18069 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha, I think it might be (a -> a) -> a < 1313097190 772799 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, now, how do you define a function that can use this "Void" type? < 1313097198 466465 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ind f (Void a) = f (ind f a) < 1313097351 968891 :KingOfKarlsruhe!~chatzilla@p5B14C0D8.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 5.0/20110615151330] < 1313097401 268751 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, the type is always "Void -> Void" if you type "Void". < 1313097455 527105 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote monad < 1313097456 837978 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :293) Deewiant: ha, you were wrong, I have stacks, fungespace and MULTIPLE functions! and a monad! nothing can stop me now! \ 479) oerjan, little do you realise that everything you say and do is part of that great monad tutorial we call life. < 1313097477 533928 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1313097487 466249 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like how the first is accidentally topical. < 1313097517 236877 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it is possible to define types that have no use, I guess. < 1313097576 220731 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess this "Void" type is a type that has no use, isn't it? < 1313097632 167804 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :With that "ind" function it reports its type as: ind :: (t -> t) -> Void -> t < 1313097647 208544 :derrik!~xix@gprs-inet-65-7.elisa.ee QUIT :Quit: take carezzz < 1313097682 355165 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1313097708 894913 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: well, the use is that you can model not-p as (p -> Void) < 1313097739 423436 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've been thinking that most of those "no real result" monadic actions like putStr should really have been -> IO Void < 1313097791 887102 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, but if it still has to return you can use () which is a valid value even though it can store nothing < 1313097806 424441 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is probably why it is not IO Void < 1313097829 791224 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but haskell is lazy, so you don't _need_ to return a non-bottom value < 1313097840 748440 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : i've been thinking that most of those "no real result" monadic actions like putStr should really have been -> IO Void < 1313097850 898766 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that "IO is not a monad" post by roconnor got someone saying this, iirc < 1313097853 272889 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in < 1313097855 74120 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :main :: IO Void < 1313097867 692897 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I think we should generally try and pretend that _|_ doesn't exist though :) < 1313097921 290942 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :not just IO, you could have put :: MonadState s m -> s -> m Void as well < 1313097928 408931 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t put < 1313097929 547299 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall s (m :: * -> *). (MonadState s m) => s -> m () < 1313097936 659284 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :* => < 1313098147 652608 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka, now embarassing himself on the IWC forum http://i.imgur.com/wy9Bo.png < 1313098220 65499 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh joy < 1313098252 96641 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::< < 1313098257 164573 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and there was a link to the actual skin in the forum message < 1313098276 554576 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/draakslair/viewtopic.php?t=6048 < 1313098302 216061 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I can see how the "Void" type is the correct type for use in this "ind" function, even though it has no use. < 1313098509 353455 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also accepts: x = Void x < 1313098593 490506 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes, but evaluating x diverges < 1313098596 355669 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas, e.g. < 1313098598 513050 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :x = Just x < 1313098599 280570 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't < 1313098601 321703 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because Just is not strict < 1313098637 101827 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Just ruler is not a Strict ruler < 1313098935 439584 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Thus to pad out 7 bytes of space would require 7 nop instructions to be issued, which is a significantly slower way of doing nothing!" < 1313099012 555700 :cheater_!~ubuntu@g229096158.adsl.alicedsl.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/PoV4s.gif < 1313099346 997474 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1313099505 875645 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1313099787 38845 :Nisstyre!~nisstyre@infocalypse-net.info JOIN :#esoteric < 1313100497 494655 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey QUIT :Quit: The Other Game < 1313101018 822681 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1313102163 720132 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will any Haskell add a ENCODING pragma to indicate what character encoding should be used in the runtime such as ASCII or Unicode? < 1313102275 159428 :augur_!~augur@c-71-57-177-89.hsd1.fl.comcast.net NICK :augur < 1313102735 909759 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: in recent ghc, you set runtime encoding with operations on file handles < 1313102759 373202 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle encoding < 1313102759 728471 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Network.CGI newtype ContentEncoding < 1313102760 144423 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Network.CGI ContentEncoding :: String -> ContentEncoding < 1313102760 216489 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Network.HTTP.Headers HdrAcceptEncoding :: HeaderName < 1313102769 175161 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle base:encoding < 1313102769 506415 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Parse error: < 1313102769 733508 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : --count=20 base:encoding < 1313102769 805269 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : ^ < 1313102773 168933 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1313102778 441833 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle -base encoding < 1313102778 774797 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Network.CGI newtype ContentEncoding < 1313102779 106784 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Network.CGI ContentEncoding :: String -> ContentEncoding < 1313102779 179186 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Network.HTTP.Headers HdrAcceptEncoding :: HeaderName < 1313102798 826225 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah < 1313102889 980417 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle encoding :: Handle -> IO () < 1313102890 322463 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :No results found < 1313102942 851200 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.haskell.org/ghc/docs/latest/html/libraries/base-4.4.0.0/System-IO.html#g:23 < 1313103987 984162 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell ais523 BtW, you've been voted out of office in DF. < 1313103988 803156 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1313104084 593614 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1313104138 657541 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :DF has democracy? < 1313104153 172004 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :DF? < 1313104165 735895 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i assume this is dwarf fortress.. < 1313104174 89882 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1313104175 815209 :CakeProphet!~adam@h76.55.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313104175 887992 :CakeProphet!~adam@h76.55.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net QUIT :Changing host < 1313104175 888051 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric < 1313104465 814976 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-223-105.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313104632 71081 :pikhq_!~pikhq@174-22-154-206.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1313105103 711928 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1313105828 784776 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : DF has democracy? < 1313105831 732283 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only for the mayor. < 1313105852 321423 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1313106625 315684 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1313107068 719019 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric