00:00:31 fizzie, ah 00:06:30 Happy New Year for REAL! 00:06:59 Of course, my view of the Edinburgh fireworks was completely spoilt by a church in the way. 00:07:39 I shall have to consult with the local branch of Al Qaeda. to have it removed. 00:07:54 NOTE TO MI5: I DO NOT REALLY INTEND TO DO THIS 00:08:22 al qaeda demolition services 00:08:39 NODE TO MI5: Phantom_Hoover JUST TOLD ME HE REALLY INTENDS TO DO THIS 00:08:42 PLEASE MONITOR THIS COMMUNICATION 00:08:51 TERRORIST CHILD PORNOGRAPHY BOMB BOMB 9/11 AMERICAN BASTARDS CAPITALISM 00:08:53 REVENGE 00:08:55 ALLAH 00:08:58 *NOTE 00:09:25 NOTE TO MI5: ELLIOTT IS A MENTAL PATIENT AND CANNOT BE TRUSTED 00:09:46 terrorist child pornography bombs are all the rage 00:20:44 NOTE TO MI5: HEY GUYS, I'M IN THE US 00:23:56 -!- Sgeo has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 00:24:58 oooooooo 00:25:00 drunk 00:25:05 -!- Sgeo has joined. 00:25:20 aaaaaaaaaa 00:25:21 sober 00:25:46 i just spoke with thomas from trontheim via phone 00:25:51 *d 00:25:54 and he's sooooo drunk 00:26:03 trondhein* 00:26:08 *m 00:26:09 trondheim* 00:26:18 shut up oerjan, i know 00:26:23 tromdein 00:30:37 ▜▘ ▄ ▄ ▌▗ ▄ ▗▘▛▖▗ ▖▖▐ ▚ ▗▖▗▖▖▖▝ ▄ ▟▖ ▗▖▗ ▖▖ ▟▖▌ ▝ ▗▖ 00:30:37 ▐ ▛▌▄▌▞▌▛▘ ▄▌ ▐ ▛ ▛▘▛ ▐ ▐ ▘▖▌ ▛ ▐ ▙▘▐ ▙ ▌▌▛ ▐ ▛▖▐ ▘▖ 00:30:37 ▀▘ ▘▘▀▘▝▘▝▘ ▀▘ ▘▘ ▝▘▘ ▘▘ ▀ ▝▘▘ ▝ ▌ ▘ ▘ ▝ ▘ ▘▘▘▝ ▀ ▝ 00:30:46 int main(int ac, char **av) 00:30:47 { 00:30:47 #define typedef 00:30:49 #define uint8_t a[printf("hello world\n")] 00:30:51 #include 00:30:52 } 00:30:55 ^ lol what 00:30:57 that is the most beautiful thing ever 00:31:03 fizzie: Translation? 00:31:36 "I made a (Perl) script for this." It's readable even in the logs if you just manually swomp your browser into an UTF-8 frenzy. 00:32:25 elliott, how does it work? 00:32:36 Phantom_Hoover: That C program? 00:32:55 Phantom_Hoover: The line in stdint.h looks like "typedef unsigned char uint8_t;". 00:33:06 Phantom_Hoover: Of course, depending on this is LOL NO, especially as .hs don't even have to be written in C technically. 00:33:12 fizzie: No, it isn't. 00:33:19 fizzie: I think some of my chars are non-monospaced. 00:33:33 Oh. Well, that's a shamey. 00:33:50 I guess the space might not be spaced like the Unicode block-drawing ones, but that's just weird. 00:34:06 I don't think there is a specific "block-drawing space". 00:34:30 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Changing host). 00:34:31 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 00:49:46 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qbG0zi9ZeE (don't watch this :P) 00:52:12 #define uint8_t a[printf("hello world\n")] <--- ....... wow 00:52:29 Gregor: wow you look different 00:52:39 elliott: NORLY? :P 00:52:45 Ten years does a lot to a man :P 00:52:55 Esp. when they're the years of 14-24 00:52:56 Gregor: yeah like make him not suck at making music OH SNAP 00:53:02 :P 00:53:03 elliott, that depends a LOT on what exactly stdint.h does on that given system 00:53:03 Gregor: ok question why are you dressed all normally and shit 00:53:08 Gregor: where is the pink man 00:53:09 WHERE IS THE PINK 00:53:11 elliott, I mean, exactly how it is implemented 00:53:12 elliott: Ten years does a lot to a man :P 00:53:21 Gregor: I THOUGHT YOU WERE GREGOR FROM THE MOMENT YOU WERE BORN 00:53:22 sheesh 00:53:51 good thing i'm 15, i can totally preempt all my 24-year-old-self's objections to current me and reverse them, I'VE GOT IT ALL FIGURED OUT (<-- note: same words that probably went through Gregor's head at the time :P) 00:54:12 I have no objections to 14-yr-old me :P 00:54:31 He just happens to be a different person is all. 00:54:58 Gregor: EXCUSE ME, he is NOT wearing ANY pink at ALL? 00:55:12 Gregor: I mean HELLO? 00:55:15 Like I said, different person. 00:55:21 Gregor: WORST PERSON? 00:55:30 YOU ARE THE WORST PERSON 00:55:35 Gregor: Man, I just realised that talking to you instantly turns me into T-Rex. 00:55:43 I think that is because you are T-Rex. 00:56:39 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qbG0zi9ZeE (don't watch this :P) <-- quite nice 00:56:51 though you developed a lot since then 00:57:33 Gregor, where was that? 00:57:44 Vorpal: I have noooooooooo idea :P 00:57:49 (and seems you already liked to compose music that takes some effort to listen to) 00:58:58 -!- Wamanuz3 has joined. 00:59:20 elliott: you were right 00:59:30 i'm drunk as f*******\ 00:59:32 Gregor, how comes you didn't become a professional composer instead? 00:59:48 Vorpal: Because I'm a far better computer scientist. 01:00:05 i think Gregor does not make the best music 01:00:06 Gregor, then you must be really good at that! 01:00:10 soorry Gregor 01:00:17 Case in point :P 01:00:29 btw Pink Floyd did 01:00:39 nooga, you don't like classical I guess? 01:00:47 i like classical 01:01:00 i like almost every kind of music 01:01:08 hm, true I would not say Gregor's work is classical 01:01:16 rather, modernistic 01:01:26 -!- Wamanuz2 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 01:01:32 Apparently I time travel. 01:01:33 WHO KNEW. 01:01:37 brb, have to walk to the gas station to buy cigs 01:01:41 Gregor, what 01:01:53 Gregor, well, neo-classical in /style/ 01:01:58 :P 01:02:02 I prefer "neo-romantic" 01:02:06 Gregor, I think defining it by when it was made is silly 01:02:52 Gregor, why: because it breaks down for that is often called "baroque music" (which is really not a single style) 01:03:17 also you get neo- a lot 01:03:43 Gregor, anyway your music is not really romantic 01:04:17 Gregor, too much dissonance for it. Maaaybe neo-"late romantic" 01:04:36 oerjan: still here 01:04:38 ? 01:06:24 at greg, i play electric guitar alot 01:06:39 and i can't play any. whole song 01:07:10 i just improvise in major and minor penatatonic scales 01:07:37 and septimal* eee i don't know if * this is good word in english 01:07:38 hm? 01:07:49 but my gr is playing piano as well 01:08:01 gf* 01:08:19 oerjan: ignore me, wait 30*60 s 01:09:53 food -> 01:13:34 -!- Wamanuz4 has joined. 01:14:44 nooga, half an hour? 01:14:50 oerjan, WHAT 01:14:53 oerjan, food now!? 01:15:05 of course 01:15:17 oerjan, ... lunch or just some snaks? 01:15:19 snaks* 01:15:22 snacks* 01:15:23 Vorpal: you know that oerjan operates on a 25-hour schedule 01:15:26 (like harry potter!*) 01:15:31 (*according to Yudkowsky canon) 01:15:34 i haven't eaten a proper meal for nearly six hours 01:15:42 oerjan, well and? 01:15:43 well, not so much 25-hour schedule 01:15:49 as oerjan's body is convinced that days last 25 hours 01:15:53 did have some snacks though 01:15:55 and, accordingly, sleeps at the same time every 25-hour day 01:16:07 elliott: my doctor thinks melatonin may be a good idea 01:16:07 i.e. one hour forwards in the blatantly incorrect 24-hour day system 01:16:22 oerjan: great to hear 01:16:30 elliott, my body thinks it is 25.5 hours, but I keep ending up resetting it all the time 01:16:43 well mostly all the time 01:16:44 -!- Wamanuz3 has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 01:17:20 oerjan: according to the highly reliable internets, btw, 1.5 mg is a good dose and lasts about an hour to kick in 01:17:23 just call me mr. doctor 01:17:23 Vorpal: well something is wrong with my resetting 01:17:35 most sites selling it i've seen recommend rather higher dosages 01:17:39 i rather suspect a doctor might too 01:17:42 oerjan, mine is failing atm, due to holidays 01:17:43 thanks pharma companies *tinfoil hat* :) 01:17:50 (for obvious reasons) 01:17:58 elliott, melatonin, what does that do now again 01:18:04 Vorpal: makes you sleep. 01:18:06 elliott, ah 01:18:48 elliott, wasn't there something similar-named that had something to do with getting brown when being in the sun? 01:18:52 (skin that is) 01:19:21 Vorpal: Yes. 01:19:29 But I've forgotten what it is :-P 01:19:37 elliott, same... 01:20:32 elliott, Vorpal, melanin. 01:20:44 elliott, wow, check the various boxes below http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melatonin#External_links 01:20:47 that is absurd 01:20:51 Phantom_Hoover, ah thanks 01:21:01 Melatonin is in TiHKAL? X-D 01:21:18 elliott, I meant the boxes below that 01:21:44 I was just remarking. 01:21:57 Vorpal: TiHKAL is actually the second-last box, anyway. 01:22:10 http://isomerdesign.com/PiHKAL/read.php?domain=tk&id=35 Anyone wanna try the recipe? :-P 01:22:15 elliott, what is tihkal? 01:22:27 i wonder if i'll end up buying it from the internet, it's rather expensive says my doctor and a bit of googling seems to imply it isn't covered by the norwegian medical expenses cap 01:23:00 Vorpal: tryptamines i have known and loved, sequel to PiHKAL. drug stuff. 01:23:16 oerjan: It's expensive? 01:23:23 oerjan: he's full of shit -- it's incredibly cheap on the interwebs at least 01:23:26 and that's from reputable sites 01:23:27 *she 01:23:32 erm sorry 01:24:17 elliott: well i assume this is from a norwegian pharmacy, and moreover she may be referring to the fact it's not subsidized 01:24:33 oerjan: right. i assume you guys have "herbal stores" and the likes there? 01:24:36 like holland and barrett 01:24:39 sell tons of supplements and crap 01:24:52 oerjan: you can either find it in those or the internet equivalents of those, for $nothing 01:25:07 failing even /that/ (which I doubt) you could import it from http://melatonin.com/ i guess, but the shipping is going to be non-zero 01:26:09 elliott: yes, there are herbal stores, including some pharmacies (i noticed one the other day advertising homeopathic remedies) 01:26:43 oerjan: yeah. there's no real point in getting it from a pharmacy if it's considered a health supplement, not a drug, which it is just about everywhere 01:26:47 otoh if melatonin is registered as a medical drug then it is unlikely to be legal for non-pharmacies to sell it here 01:27:00 oerjan: I doubt it is -- Wikipedia says it is in the UK and it's _not_ 01:27:09 you can find it on tons of (reputable enough) herbal online stores 01:27:14 *online herbal 01:27:18 (only a few very common drugs are allowed to sell in ordinary shops) 01:27:34 oerjan: well it's likely not considered a drug. 01:27:40 just a supplement. 01:27:40 (and even that is a relatively new change) 01:27:47 e.g. in america it's a "dietary supplement". 01:30:15 * oerjan googles 01:30:40 oerjan: can you make oklopol come back?? 01:30:47 i want to tell him that Phantom_Hoover totally got his 2d physics working 01:30:54 oerjan, go to Finland and make him come back. 01:30:56 -!- poiuy_qwert has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 01:31:02 elliott, oh, he knows about gravity. 01:31:07 Phantom_Hoover: well get the other parts working 01:31:17 oerjan: yes do it. actually do you have his phone number. just call him and yell at him. 01:31:20 elliott, angular momentum? 01:31:20 act drunk (or get drunk first) 01:31:26 Phantom_Hoover: LOCALISED PHYSICS DISTORTIONS 01:31:38 oerjan: say #ESOTERIC AND ABANDON AND 01:31:45 do the needful 01:31:55 Actually, that could slot nicely into my existing classes for masses. 01:32:09 Classes for masses. 01:32:11 <3 01:32:16 Best nomenclature EVER 01:32:22 Make angular-mass a subclass of point-mass, add some extra stuff. 01:32:25 Phantom_Hoover: Bear in mind that Amber doesn't have any classes, though :-P 01:32:33 elliott, no CLOS? 01:32:34 :( 01:32:46 Phantom_Hoover: Why not add an angular-stuff field to point-mass, that can be NULL? 01:32:53 (Substitute appropriate nothing-value for NULL.) 01:32:59 Phantom_Hoover: Or how about making all point-masses angular-masses? 01:33:17 elliott, because I'd like to be able to make bullets point-masses. 01:33:41 Phantom_Hoover: I'm tempted to say that bullets should bypass physics altogether and just have their movement hardcoded. 01:33:47 Since there could be thousands of them at any one time. 01:34:23 re 01:34:33 i have cigs and beer 01:34:42 ;et's continue 01:34:49 l* 01:34:51 elliott, but curve shots around planets! 01:35:54 Phantom_Hoover: Have you got polygon collision yet? 01:36:06 elliott, I've done basically nothing! 01:36:09 * oerjan does not have oklopol's phone number 01:36:23 oerjan, use your mathematician powers to calculate it! 01:36:32 -!- poiuy_qwert has joined. 01:36:55 Phantom_Hoover: Do polygon collision :P 01:37:24 elliott, I have not the STRENGTH 01:37:24 -!- Wamanuz5 has joined. 01:37:29 Phantom_Hoover: :< 01:37:30 Phantom_Hoover: :{ 01:37:32 Phantom_Hoover: pweeze 01:37:39 No. 01:37:43 googling suggests that melatonin requires a prescription in norway 01:38:10 Phantom_Hoover: ;( 01:38:39 elliott, QUITE 01:39:02 -!- Wamanuz4 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 01:39:46 -!- Wamanuz5 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 01:40:34 -!- elliott has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 01:41:00 -!- Wamanuz5 has joined. 01:41:17 -!- elliott has joined. 01:43:26 -!- Wamanuz has joined. 01:44:34 oerjan, so ask the doctor then? 01:45:12 i did mention it 01:45:50 -!- Wamanuz5 has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 01:46:22 Phantom_Hoover: if you ever want to see Asteroids II out you better code polygon collision >:) 01:46:22 oerjan, yes I mean ask again if you need a prescription 01:46:33 elliott, it is too late 01:46:35 elliott, can't you do it? 01:46:47 Phantom_Hoover: tomorrow then! 01:46:48 Vorpal: i'm lazy 01:46:52 i already have to write a compiler for this 01:48:22 it seems like melatonin is falling a bit between the cracks in norway, simply by not being properly registered there. you can get it but it's more complicated and unsubsidized. 01:48:38 elliott, it is tomorrow already 01:48:42 oerjan: just import it from the us >:) 01:49:37 elliott, see note about prescription. I doubt importing it is legal then 01:49:56 oerjan: Hear that? The police are gonna get you for drug smuggling. 01:50:01 "...found with whole GRAMS of melatonin..." 01:50:37 ... 01:50:50 elliott, why do you always exaggerate everything 01:51:16 i guess it's unregistered because it's natural and therefore unpatentable... 01:51:16 Vorpal: I'm trying to demonstrate that importing melatonin being illegal is completely irrelevant as no non-ridiculous response could be taken. 01:51:43 Also, they'd be incriminating oerjan for importing something harmless that's ALREADY INSIDE HIS BODY. 01:52:21 elliott, by that logic DMT should be okay everywhere, since the human body naturally have traces of DMT 01:52:27 elliott: i suspect if i got a prescription first i could legally import it 01:52:34 Vorpal: I see no issue with that statement 01:52:37 well that would be sane, at least 01:52:55 elliott, hm 01:53:11 elliott, indeed. But that is not the case 01:53:17 Admittedly, importing poop would be kind of weird :P 01:53:18 -!- Wamanuz2 has joined. 01:53:28 Vorpal: No, but you can't get high off melatonin :P 01:55:27 elliott, well why is it in that tihkal then? 01:55:52 Vorpal: Who knows? The entry just talks about it being unclear whether it's effective for sleep or not, going by WP's link. 01:56:04 hm 01:56:05 It's not solely a book to get high off, unless I'm sorely mistaken :P 01:56:08 -!- Wamanuz has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 01:56:10 (INHALIN' PAPER) 01:56:20 elliott, :D 01:57:08 I mean, melatonin is a tryptamine with interesting properties, thus explaining its presence. 01:57:48 but does it involve lipase amylase and trypsin? 01:57:58 they gonna help with my digestion 01:59:08 WHY DOESN'T MY SHELL WORK 01:59:43 what about insulin, glucagon, coming from the islets of langerhans? 01:59:45 coppro: fix my shell ok 02:00:42 elliott: give me root ssh 02:00:52 nou 02:00:57 i think the mmap might be failing or something 02:04:20 wtf@@this 02:09:59 elliott: hey 02:10:09 hi augur 02:10:20 http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/etw3g/problem_boole_comparisons_in_php/c1awit4 02:10:22 4u 02:10:37 augur: lol depends 02:10:41 it does! 02:10:53 it depends on what the other things are! 02:11:09 augur: I have a better table 02:11:12 augur: I will express it in html 02:11:12 :P 02:11:17 no! 02:11:23 use your css! 02:11:23 D: 02:11:27 it's a table, doofus 02:11:33 nooooooo ~#@_@#~ 02:11:37 yes i know im just being a dick 02:11:58 augur:
xy
xTrueFalse
yFalseTrue
02:12:03 the important point tho is the conversation with kamatsu 02:12:13 augur: tada, a perfect description of a (properly-implemented) equality function in Haskell! 02:12:17 assuming all Eq classes are done right that is 02:12:18 true ;) 02:12:24 technically x can == y 02:12:31 but only if x is indistinguishable from y /outside/ the module 02:12:32 it can indeed! 02:12:34 if x == y 02:12:36 so it's x == x from outside 02:12:36 :D 02:12:39 augur: shut up :) 02:12:41 ;D 02:12:43 augur: ok new table 02:12:46 x 02:12:48 x (x==x) 02:12:50 erm 02:12:53 x 02:12:53 lolol 02:12:55 y (x==y) 02:12:57 PERFECT TABLE 02:13:00 the convo with kamatsu is the important bit 02:13:26 augur: meh, mere misunderstanding :P 02:13:32 not really 02:13:43 he originally said it compared forall a. (Eq a) => a 02:13:46 which is also false 02:14:07 the point is that (==) only compares two things of the same type 02:14:25 and he said it could compare bool to string if you wanted 02:14:34 right 02:14:36 which is false, without some major magic 02:15:04 but god damn if that little ascii table didnt get me some karma 02:17:16 one thing i fucking love about haskell is (G)ADTs 02:17:28 i love that i can define new atomic values out of nothing 02:17:33 yes 02:17:39 and theres no possibility of misusing them as some other type 02:17:50 it's awesome 02:18:16 enums are nice and all, but the fact that they're usually just another name for an int is a problem 02:18:43 yeah 02:18:54 i mean, obviously you could do atomic values as ints and shit, but the type system enforces the opacity 02:18:56 and OO languages typically add too much baggage to ADTs 02:19:03 indeed 02:19:25 i mean, i like OO for some reasons, but GADTs and type classes are sexy 02:20:14 OO style for certain things is quite appealing. 02:20:27 yeah 02:20:35 list functions, for instance 02:20:54 hmm? 02:21:29 i much prefer xs { |x| x.odd? }.map { |x| x ** 2 } over map (**2) (filter odd xs) 02:21:43 er.. xs.filter { ... 02:22:10 tho i'd prefer if i could do xs.filter(odd?).map(**2) 02:22:15 augur: that's just concatenative :) 02:22:17 is that perl 6? 02:22:22 ruby 02:22:26 oh 02:22:38 elliott: no, i know, i just like the style of having Collection Method PRoc 02:22:44 rather than Method Proc Collection 02:22:58 augur: true. currying gets ugly though. 02:23:05 i know 02:23:07 admittedly you can say .filter(odd?) in a platonically perfect language 02:23:08 but still 02:23:08 i think in haskell theres a reverse apply isnt there? 02:23:09 it's less pure 02:23:12 like $ but backwards? 02:23:14 augur: sure, "flip" :P 02:23:19 but yeah, i think there is 02:23:23 elliott: APL? 02:23:25 yeah yeah but i think theres a built in flip ($) 02:23:29 lets call it $$ 02:23:44 and lets say its left associative 02:23:49 obviously: xs $$ filter odd $$ map (**2) 02:24:02 * Phantom_Hoover → sleep 02:24:05 so haskell doesnt make this style impossible 02:24:13 coppro: what about APL? 02:24:18 which is all the more reason to fuckin love haskell 02:24:20 augur: nothing built in, maybe in a module 02:24:20 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 02:24:25 augur: haskell's type system is bad :) 02:24:29 elliott: whatever. its easily definable, anyway 02:24:31 elliott: bad how 02:25:10 elliott: you can probably do .filter(odd?).map(**2) in APL, except it would be 5 characters long 02:25:28 augur: too restricting 02:25:34 also, i think Perl 6 actually does allow .filter(odd?).map({* ** 2}) 02:25:36 coppro: i can probably do that in J 02:25:37 coppro: probably 6 02:25:42 coppro: don't need that {} do you? 02:25:43 if it doesn't, it certainly ought to 02:25:46 elliott: maybe not 02:25:47 elliott: restriction in what fashion? 02:25:52 .. restricting** 02:25:54 augur: compare to Coq's 02:25:58 i dont know coqs 02:25:59 elliott: I'm not up-to-date in Perl 6 02:26:00 (a middle-ground is probably nicest for actual programming) 02:26:03 augur: then i can't explain sry 02:26:05 its dependently typed tho isnt it? 02:26:07 yes 02:26:14 well there you go 02:26:19 there's more than that though 02:26:30 any type system that isnt itself a turing complete programming language is too restricted to you, isnt it? 02:26:30 :P 02:26:39 augur: um Coq's type system is sub-TC 02:26:41 and so is Coq itself 02:26:44 oh is it? 02:26:51 but i thought dependent types are TC 02:26:54 augur: yes, otherwise _|_ would prove any proposition 02:26:57 no 02:27:02 or is it only _some_ DT systems 02:27:18 augur: well with dependent types your type system basically becomes a special part of your value system 02:27:24 so if you use your TC language to do it, yes, it becomes TC 02:27:25 right 02:27:31 and you have nonterminating _types_, ho ho, good luck wit hthat 02:27:32 *with that 02:27:36 meh. anyway 02:27:41 Agda is also sub-TC unless you tell it not to be, when it becoems inconsistent 02:27:46 ive never gotten into the traditional theorem provers 02:27:59 coq is really nice. you'd like it 02:28:00 insert cock joke 02:28:20 i say it like caulk, so 02:28:35 or like the kidlings on the chans say cock: cawk 02:29:27 kidlings :D 02:29:47 coppro: well map **2 is just foo^2 02:30:14 lets see, surely we can figure this apl shit out 02:30:22 dunno how to filter odd though :) 02:30:27 augur: J not apl 02:30:33 same thing 02:30:37 no. 02:30:38 really not. 02:30:46 no, but thats not the point 02:30:56 well, is-odd in j is just 02:31:17 0=2|n 02:31:20 erm 02:31:22 0<2|n 02:31:28 but that's not the best way to filter by odd. 02:31:31 what 02:31:34 stop knowing j 02:31:49 oh wait foo^2 isn't actually map(^2) 02:31:50 so i get that 2|n is two divides n 02:31:51 you'd want hmm 02:31:55 but that should be boolean 02:31:59 foo(^"1)2 02:32:01 so whats the 0 augur: no, it's remainder 02:32:05 oh what 02:32:06 :| 02:32:08 0< is exactly what you'd expect 02:32:08 ridiculous 02:32:13 remainder, feh 02:32:18 ok 02:32:21 that makes sense then 02:32:33 it's actually called "residue" :) 02:32:35 does j have lambdas without lambda operators? 02:32:37 elliott, what is the difference between J and line noise? 02:32:41 augur: it has no lambda operator. so yes. 02:32:45 Vorpal: J is shorter. 02:32:47 elliott, :D 02:32:48 x3 02:32:52 Vorpal: alternatively 02:32:54 Vorpal: Line noise is readable 02:32:58 hah 02:32:59 *readable. 02:33:11 elliott, wasn't there some language that looked like line noise and you said was crazy 02:33:15 elliott: so does 2|n roughly equal \n -> 2 | n in some other language? 02:33:17 ursala 02:33:19 elliott, ah 02:33:21 elliott: is it actually foo^2, or do you need to do some fancy foo<<^2? 02:33:27 augur: 2|n is n mod 2 02:33:38 coppro: we want map ^2 right? 02:33:41 coppro: then it's foo^2 in j. 02:33:42 elliott: yeah 02:33:42 right but is it a lambda or is it a value? 02:33:45 elliott: oh in j 02:33:48 I was thinking Perl 6 02:33:56 coppro: who cares, we're doing j now 02:33:59 it has some syntax for turning a scalar operation into a vector one 02:34:04 elliott, sure about the spelling? google is unhelpful 02:34:05 augur: um is "n mod 2" a lambda? :) 02:34:07 i don't get you 02:34:15 cause in Functional JS you can do shit like xs.map("x*2") and itll convert "x*2" into the lambda \x -> x*2 02:34:15 elliott: will find example 02:34:24 Vorpal: http://www.google.co.uk/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=ursala+language&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&redir_esc=&ei=i5IeTeb1EpO6hAf074i3Dg#hl=en&client=safari&pwst=1&rls=en&sa=X&ei=i5IeTaaIGIyIhQfnvIS3Dg&ved=0CBUQvgUoAA&q=ursala+language&nfpr=1&fp=733b49addeb556 02:34:32 because x is a variable that isnt bound 02:34:33 augur: you have to realise that in J there are no "lambdas" 02:34:43 augur: if you give an "incomplete" expression, it just becomes a box 02:34:45 ok so there are no such things at all 02:34:48 and you can apply boxes to things 02:34:48 ok 02:34:52 augur: there are, it just usurps them all :) 02:34:55 i dontknow shit about j, really 02:34:58 e.g., wait, lemme download j to demonstrate 02:35:00 whats a box 02:35:15 elliott, where in there? "Ursula Bellugi - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia" first hit, Lots of non-programming hits 02:35:17 oh oh OH THERE IS A J BETA OUT OMG 02:35:26 Vorpal: tell it you don't mean urusula. 02:35:28 see the top bar 02:35:29 *ursula 02:35:34 augur: it's a thing. 02:35:38 elliott, aha 02:35:42 :p 02:35:50 aint nothin but a j thang 02:35:58 stupid google 02:35:59 [[701 J Engine (JE - J Language implementation) changes are incremental and compatible. 02:35:59 701 J Front End (JFE) changes are revolutionary! 02:35:59 Previously the primary JFE was based on Jsoftware's proprietary WD (window driver). WD was built on Windows API and was refined and polished over more than 15 years. And for 10 years Unix users had a WD Java port. 02:36:00 701 abandons WD. There is risk as WD was a mature product central in so many ways to J. The replacements are as far from polished as only software version 1 can be. 02:36:02 With your patience and contributions we believe the rough will soon be polished and WD will be just a fond memory. One significant difference is that WD was a closed and proprietary system implemented in C++ and Java. The new JFE's are open and are implemented in J and based on open products and industry standards. 02:36:04 ]] 02:36:06 omg 02:36:08 this beta is my new girlfriend 02:36:11 elliott: why does ursala look like line noise? 02:36:16 elliott? girlfriend? hahaha 02:36:19 augur: ursala is terrible, do not discuss it 02:36:24 also stop laughing :| J LOVES ME 02:36:31 The first is JHS (J HTTP Server) where a browser is the front end. The browser is a powerful front end that has considerable advantages. Almost by definition it is familiar to all users and is the most completely cross platform. With html, css, ajax, and javascript it is a rich environment. It would be a mistake to continue to ignore the focus of resources and users on the browser as the window on the world. J701 lets your browser be 02:36:31 your window on J, as well as on everything else. 02:36:31 The second is JGTK which is based on the GTK+ portable library for creating graphical user interfaces. This is on the bleeding edge of what is possible and will allow the ultimate in power user tools and applications. 02:36:32 yay gtk 02:36:35 ...wait i'm on os x 02:36:36 elliott: no, it was the "girl" part 02:36:39 NAY GTK 02:36:49 augur: i'm not gay. sorry. :p 02:37:06 i know you're not. if you were it wouldnt be fun to joke about 02:37:32 oh jesus you're right about ursala 02:37:39 choices = ^(iota@r,~&l); leql@a^& ~&al?\&! ~&arh2fabt2RDfalrtPXPRT 02:37:48 augur: it's crazily-designed, too 02:37:51 ask ais about it sometime 02:37:56 augur, to me, it only looks slightly more noisy than J code :P 02:38:10 augur: i know you're not. if you were it wouldnt be fun to joke about 02:38:10 thats why elliott hates it 02:38:12 yes it would 02:38:14 aaaa 02:38:16 see for example: you 02:38:16 aaaaaa 02:38:18 aaaaa 02:38:19 aaaa 02:38:20 aaaa 02:38:22 aaa 02:38:23 aww elliott 02:38:23 nooga: stfu 02:38:23 <3 02:38:23 still drunk? 02:38:25 aa 02:38:27 aa 02:38:30 a 02:38:31 Vorpal: no he sobered up in 30 minutes 02:38:31 (@ nooga) 02:38:32 nooo 02:38:35 it's 2011 02:38:37 nooo 02:38:40 elliott, ... body doesn't work like that 02:38:41 but parody my own sexuality so 02:38:48 sexuality 02:38:50 my gf 02:38:52 aaaaaaa 02:38:53 aaaaa 02:38:54 Vorpal: then why ask 02:38:56 aaa 02:38:58 aa 02:39:01 a 02:39:02 i think nooga's gf just told him she's a lesbian 02:39:04 aa 02:39:06 aaa 02:39:08 aaaaa 02:39:11 elliott: no :D 02:39:11 nooga, shut up 02:39:13 elliott: wouldnt he be masturbating then? 02:39:24 :f 02:39:25 no 02:39:25 this channel, SO MATURE, you guys! 02:39:46 she told me that she's more kinki tht i thought she is 02:39:48 :D 02:39:49 elliott, yes when augur, you, and some 90% of the other people are here :P 02:39:56 elliott is SO MATURE 02:40:03 nooga: do tell 02:40:14 GUYS WE ARE TALKING ABOUT *MY* GIRLFRIEND, THAT IS, J 02:40:15 elliott, I mean, me, olsner, fizzie. And perhaps a handful of other. Then it is mature :P 02:40:25 olsner: hear that, Vorpal just called you mature 02:40:28 elliott: Java? 02:40:32 nooga: no, J, faggot 02:40:38 elliott, compared to you :P 02:40:39 J like Java 02:40:48 Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air:~ ehird$ /Applications/j701/bin/jgtk.command ; exit; 02:40:48 |control error: script 02:40:48 | 3 :0'' 02:40:49 |[-7] /Applications/j701/addons/gui/gtk/gtk.ijs 02:40:51 WHAAAT ISSS THISSSSS 02:40:51 elliott: In Perl 6, @foo[bar] is syntactic sugar for @foo.[bar] 02:40:59 what 02:41:00 coppro: you're syntactic sugar lol 02:41:06 what is this shit 02:41:07 Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air ... what a hostname 02:41:08 fuck perl 02:41:09 god damn 02:41:12 nooga: that's the default hostname :D 02:41:13 elliott, that error is... weird? 02:41:17 Vorpal: yep! 02:41:26 elliott: ive started coding in C# 02:41:27 elliott, it has way too much whitespace for J 02:41:31 nooga: i haven't figured out what to change it to yet, i kinda like Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air, it's just so silly 02:41:37 my prompts have never been longer 02:41:41 elliott: i know :D , my mac was Marcin gasperowicz's MacBook pro 02:41:50 G* 02:41:57 i am so glad i don't have a really long name 02:41:59 elliott, I hate when prompts wrap though 02:42:08 John-Jacob-Jingleheimer-Schmidts-MacBook-Air 02:42:09 elliott, and that is a risk for you 02:42:19 his name is my name toooo 02:42:23 elliott: better than Darryl-McAdamss-MacBook-Pro 02:42:28 augur: McAdamss hahahaha 02:42:30 :D 02:42:39 augur, is that a real example 02:42:41 ? 02:42:44 that's his name, so yes 02:42:47 wtf my ? key is glitchy 02:42:49 well no, but it would be if it were stupid enough to use my full name 02:42:52 augur: what happens if you're japanese, do you get a utf-8 hostname 02:42:58 or does it replace it all with dashes 02:43:04 -----------MacBook-Pro 02:43:08 sorry 02:43:09 elliott, it could punycode it? 02:43:14 ----------s-MacBook-Pro 02:43:17 dareru-makkuadamuzu-no-makkubukku-purou 02:43:23 augur: KAWAII 02:43:25 .. makkadamuzu* 02:43:31 oh yeah that error, so important 02:43:33 thx for correctation 02:43:35 it is! 02:43:41 elliott, I SUGGEST punycode! 02:43:43 actually i am that stupid 02:43:43 fuck me 02:43:47 darryl-mcadamss-macbook-pro:~ darryl$ 02:43:54 i should fix this shit 02:44:06 augur: set your hostname to "fag" 02:44:26 lol 02:44:35 I use mythical creatures. phoenix, dragon, pegasus and so on. 02:44:35 ok i think j is almost working 02:44:42 (also tux is grandfathered in) 02:44:51 tux is pretty mythical 02:44:53 yeah tux isn't mythical 02:44:54 haha snap 02:45:00 I SEE TUX ALL THE TIME 02:45:10 doesnt make him not mythical 02:45:21 i mean irl 02:45:22 duh 02:45:24 it just makes him ... THE STUFF OF LEGENDS 02:45:35 well you couldn't find tux on Middle earth :P 02:45:54 elliott: speaking of restrictive type systems, C#'s piss-poor type system pisses me off 02:46:04 i tried to define fold just for fun 02:46:06 cant do it 02:46:06 but you could find dragons, and while no phoenix or pegasus are recorded by Tolkin afaik they would fit right in, 02:46:08 type error 02:46:12 s/,$/./ 02:46:12 augur: fatg 02:46:30 sorry what 02:46:33 let's all get drunk and write PPC assembly 02:46:38 augur, couldn't you do it with a generic class? 02:46:42 GIVE ME ONE GOOD REASON WHY NOT 02:46:44 Vorpal: how do you mean 02:46:52 elliott: are you allowed to get drunk yet 02:46:56 have you ever BEEN drunk? 02:46:57 augur, something like... Folder or such? 02:47:05 augur: no, but i'm also not allowed to INFRINGE COPYRIGHT 02:47:08 augur, having one method. fold 02:47:09 which i do. 02:47:11 oh ok 02:47:18 augur, yes this is insane. But it might just work. 02:47:19 Vorpal: ITT: c# isn't java 02:47:31 augur: can you tell me why steve jobs put fn next to ctrl on the macbook keyboards 02:47:31 Vorpal: ehh.. maybe. i didnt use a generic class 02:47:34 augur: it is the stupidest thing ever 02:47:38 elliott, hm? C# has generic classes. 02:47:42 but it was because of a circular type of some sort 02:47:43 "It is an error to use this operator outside of a lol context; in other words it must be bound into a ** (slice) parameter rather than a * (slurpy) parameter." goddammit perl 6 02:47:49 elliott, I don't see why it *wouldn't* work 02:47:54 coppro: a lol context? :D 02:48:08 it is impossible to understand perl 6 without understanding it first 02:48:12 coppro, sure that isn't some INTERCAL-lolcode hybrid? 02:48:26 Vorpal: unfortunately 02:48:31 hah 02:48:44 Building, Bundling, and Integrating GTK+ on MacOSX is now consolidated at http://gtk-osx.sourceforge.net, where you'll find up-to-date downloads, information and support. There is a forum, a mailing list, and a tracker there. The development of the quartz backend to GTK+ remains in the GTK+ project. 02:48:47 http://gtk-osx.sourceforge.net/ jesus christ 02:48:50 it's like from fucking 2003 02:48:55 they're using i think panther's wallpaper 02:48:56 on leoprad 02:48:59 and those colours 02:49:00 *leopard 02:49:02 jesus christ 02:49:03 who made this site 02:49:13 Vorpal: the genericness wasnt at issue. i just defined it like.. public List FoldR { ... } 02:49:22 er, not List 02:49:26 augur, so what is the problem then? 02:49:34 the problem was it didnt work! :P 02:49:39 lemme do it again for posterity 02:49:39 augur, also is that a property!? 02:50:07 no its a stupid unthought-about method on a dummy object 02:50:08 hold on 02:50:11 augur,: public List FoldR(INSERT SOME SORT OF DELEGATE HERE, List list) { ... } 02:50:24 the delegate should take T somewhere 02:50:25 what 02:50:35 maybe. i just tried to implement it naively 02:50:37 augur, delegate. Like function pointers for C# 02:50:49 Vorpal: http://gtk-osx.sourceforge.net/ guess when this side was created 02:50:49 anyway it shouldve worked if the type system could handle it 02:50:52 *site 02:51:00 i dont like the lack of polymorphism in the types tho. 02:51:03 you cant just do like 02:51:14 elliott, uh.. no clue 02:51:18 Vorpal: guess 02:51:25 based on its form + screenshots 02:51:28 form as in design 02:52:05 elliott, well it says 10.5 in the text. So fairly new. Screenshots don't help me, except that it has that 3D dock so fairly recent. Rest of design is like 8 year older 02:52:11 public X FoldR(..., Z zero, List xs) { ... } 02:52:16 as far as i know, anyway 02:52:18 Vorpal: the site was created sometime 2009 to 2010. 02:52:20 augur, well yes 02:52:21 maybe i should try that 02:52:23 Vorpal: and it was /designed/ like that. in 2009 to 2010. 02:52:25 augur, the ... would be the delegate 02:52:29 yeah 02:52:38 Vorpal: did I mention that the site it replaced was pretty sleek? 02:52:38 augur, but what is Z? 02:52:46 some type Z 02:52:49 augur, shouldn't Z and X be the same? 02:53:07 perl 6 does not have a sepc 02:53:08 *spec 02:53:09 fuck j 7 02:53:09 i suppose it depends on how your folding function works 02:53:11 coppro: yes it does 02:53:12 I don't care what they say 02:53:15 elliott: no 02:53:17 theres no reason it couldnt be a -> b -> b 02:53:24 coppro: it has a spec it has no formal spec 02:53:24 I could not write an implementation of Perl 6 from this "spec" 02:53:27 rtho yeah sure X 02:53:37 augur, but then FoldR should return Z not X 02:53:42 no? 02:53:49 true. im not thinking, obviously 02:54:02 also, these backwards type signatures are weird 02:54:08 then theres these JS ones 02:54:17 augur, you mean return type first? 02:54:19 yeah 02:54:25 function (x : X, y : Y) : Z 02:54:31 horrible 02:54:38 cluttersome 02:54:48 augur, is that... name : type ? 02:54:51 yeah 02:54:54 i'd much prefer like 02:55:00 augur, what the fracking helll 02:55:12 hell* 02:55:18 well it makes sense, since : is the mathlogic-notation for types 02:55:26 heh. j needs 32-bit java 02:55:26 hm 02:55:31 and you see that kind of shit in like Martin-Lof type theory 02:55:35 elliott, ... really? 02:55:41 yes. at least 602. 02:55:43 on os x. 02:55:47 elliott, how strange 02:55:54 but its just so cluttersome 02:55:54 Vorpal: not really. only the UI is 32-bit. 02:55:56 better to do like 02:55:59 it uses jni to talk to the engine 02:56:04 augur, I don't know Martin-Löf type theory (isn't that the proper name?) 02:56:14 type foo(X,Y) : Z ; function foo(x,y) { ... } 02:56:20 augur: coq is close to martin-lof type theory. 02:56:25 yeah, Martin-Lof is the formal logic behind dependent types 02:56:28 augur: type foo(X,Y) : Z ; function foo(x,y) { ... } 02:56:32 elliott, I'm pretty sure that is an ö not an o 02:56:34 that wouldn't work for dependent stuff really :) 02:56:37 Vorpal: NOBODY FUCKING CARES 02:56:39 elliott: no its not supposed to 02:56:46 (1 2 3)^2 02:56:46 1 4 9 02:56:46 elliott, at least write it as oe then 02:56:46 --J 02:56:48 rather than o 02:56:49 Vorpal: nobody 02:56:50 Vorpal: fucking 02:56:52 Vorpal: cares 02:56:54 elliott: im just trying to show how you might design the JS2 type signatures to factor out the inlined :'s 02:57:00 elliot: okay I see 02:57:00 to make it more haskellish 02:57:07 foo :: (X,Y) -> Z 02:57:10 or maybe "eliott"? 02:57:10 foo x y = ... 02:57:12 elliott, ^ 02:57:15 vs 02:57:16 2|(1 2 3 4 5 6 7) 02:57:16 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 02:57:17 elliott, I could start using either 02:57:20 type foo(X,Y) : Z 02:57:20 so the odd ones we want are the 1s here 02:57:23 function foo(x,y) { ... } 02:57:48 Elliot, I could write it this way even. 02:59:11 1 i.2|foo 02:59:12 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 02:59:15 so we want to select the 1s here from foo 02:59:28 we could do 02:59:29 (1 i.2|foo)*foo 02:59:29 0 2 0 4 0 6 0 02:59:31 and then ditch zeroes 02:59:33 but that would be cheating 02:59:35 since we'd ditch all zeroes 03:00:18 this is so hard 03:02:29 >(foo;1 i.2|foo) 03:02:29 1 2 3 0 4 5 6 7 03:02:29 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 03:02:33 hmm. 03:02:59 hm wait. 03:03:10 ok zero isn't odd ofc 03:03:42 foo*2|foo 03:03:42 1 0 3 0 0 5 0 7 03:03:45 so we just need to ditch zeroes 03:04:23 (foo*2|foo)^2 03:04:23 1 0 9 0 0 25 0 49 03:04:24 coppro: gettin' close 03:11:05 what are we trying to do here 03:11:24 -!- elliott has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 03:12:09 -!- elliott has joined. 03:13:11 coppro: um .filter(odd?).map(**2) 03:13:56 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined. 03:14:00 -!- GreaseMonkey has quit (Changing host). 03:14:00 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined. 03:31:27 -!- wareya_ has joined. 03:31:53 -!- wareya_ has quit (Client Quit). 03:33:05 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulliver's_Travels_(2010_film) WHYYYY 03:33:09 augur: why does this exist 03:33:20 because jackblack. 03:33:42 augur: no no no WHY 03:53:35 i just had a great conversation with my brother (language expert) 03:54:09 he told me that no matter who you are 03:54:28 you will adapt to the culture of a country you live in 03:54:33 pretty true 03:54:38 unless you're a racist asshole 03:54:43 or a conquering brit 03:54:49 then you make them adopt to you 03:54:49 :D 03:54:51 but there is this think 03:54:55 thing* 03:55:20 for example 03:55:29 i'm a muthafucking pole 03:55:35 for 23 years 03:56:03 and even if i speak perfect norsk and know norwegian culture in depth 03:56:39 i can't forget 23 years (early years) in poland 03:57:13 -!- subleq has joined. 03:57:15 nooga: are you in norway 03:57:16 and theese years will make me a different person from an average norwegian 03:57:27 nooga: are you in norway 03:57:31 no 03:57:34 i 03:57:35 okay 03:57:36 brb 03:57:36 i could be 03:57:40 nooga: i think you dont understand the meaning of "adapt" 03:57:43 bot i'm not 03:57:51 adapt means kill half of them rape the rest 03:57:55 i understand that 03:57:57 i learned this from columbus 03:58:04 brb 03:58:15 i could adapt urdu culture 03:58:33 but that does not make me urdu 03:59:21 one could just deny hid origin and become someone else 03:59:43 his* 04:00:50 beh 04:00:56 i think 04:02:32 even if i lived for 40 years in USA, and define myself as an american... i would stil bear this small part of 04:03:55 -!- subleq has quit (Quit: leaving). 04:04:04 23 years of Polish upbringing in myself 04:04:10 no matter what 04:05:17 besides of any patriotism 04:05:30 which i don't have tbh 04:05:55 ffffffffffffff.... 04:05:56 brb 04:09:58 goodnight 04:16:05 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Good night). 04:18:07 -!- j-invariant has joined. 04:23:01 augur 04:23:07 help me make a golfing language 04:23:32 no what 04:23:47 augur: a la golfscript 04:24:35 what 04:26:43 augur: surely you know golfscript 04:26:55 no 04:27:08 augur: http://golfscript.com/ 04:27:13 common on anagolf? 04:27:14 you know? 04:27:22 wtf is this 04:27:42 augur: a language ... 04:27:47 i got that 04:27:52 augur: um you know what code golf is right 04:28:50 augur: ? 04:29:47 -!- FireFly has quit (Quit: swatted to death). 04:30:14 no 04:30:25 I how ^op in category theory 04:30:41 hate* 04:36:12 whats ^op 04:37:36 opposites category 04:37:54 wtffffff 04:38:04 Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air:~ ehird$ zcat By submitting a solution to this challenge, I acknowledge that I am a bad person for trying to climb up the rankings in this way.Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air:~ ehird$ 04:38:04 Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air:~ ehird$ zcat <<<"$(cat z.Z)" 04:38:05 By submitting a solution to this challenge, I acknowledge that I am a bad person for trying to climb up the rankings in this way.(Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air:~ ehird$ 04:38:07 HOW CAN THOSE RESULTS DIFFER 04:38:25 aha! <<< appends a newline 04:45:33 -!- TLUL has joined. 05:00:38 !^@(@(*~(&$$*@`^%@*%#(&(*#)@&)*($^*!^~^($@~^( 05:01:01 ((*@@#^)!%~)#@^*(~#%@#@~)&^(*$&^$~!@@((^(`%!& 05:01:22 &``(%@)%~^*!~#^HAPPY NEW YEARS(~#!(!#)#%@)`*^ 05:01:45 %#!()!%*!*#~@!@$#`!)%`!@@!#`)#@%$&`%%^~%^@)$@ 05:01:58 TLUL: what. 05:02:08 &^%`!&%^#$@)@`*$@)*@(~%`%!*&!@@@!*$~&&&)$@@%( 05:02:31 new years where I am 05:02:54 what language is that 05:02:58 TLUL: i mean the noise. 05:03:08 Yeah, that script didn't really work. 05:03:42 I coded it with 2 minutes to spare though, so it's not really a high quality piece of JS, is it? 05:03:48 And what I thought was from TDWTF is actually from Planet Factor 05:03:49 Sgeo: Shut up about Factor! 05:03:51 meh 05:04:11 Lol, it could definitely go on TDWFT 05:04:23 I used Chrome's dev tools to inject a script into webchat 05:06:18 Sgeo: link lol. 05:06:31 http://www.rfc1149.net/blog/2011/01/01/send-yourself-a-greetings-email-from-me/ 05:06:57 Sgeo: why is that tdwtf 05:07:16 elliott, tbh, I saw "Blog post with code" in Google Reader, and made an assumption 05:07:51 Although it started out that way, as almost a personal discussion about automated emails, as though Alex was about to present something related to that 05:08:01 -!- Wamanuz2 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 05:10:24 -!- TLUL has quit (Quit: And me). 05:13:24 augur: you should /nick augurer 05:14:38 why 05:14:52 augur: cuz 05:16:15 Woo 05:16:31 Sale on AW citizenship renewal 05:16:31 Sgeo: Shut up about Active Worlds! 05:16:34 =P 05:16:46 man i was about to +1 shutup 05:16:47 then i realised 05:16:50 it was my genius all along 05:16:50 shutup: Shut up about shutting up! 05:16:55 i didn't look at the name :D 05:16:59 -!- p_q has joined. 05:19:45 -!- poiuy_qwert has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 05:19:55 -!- myndzi\ has joined. 05:21:16 -!- myndzi has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 05:28:14 -!- hagb4rd has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 05:48:04 elliott, there is now a world in Active Worlds named after me 05:48:04 Sgeo: Shut up about Active Worlds! 05:48:21 ActiveWorlds 05:48:27 Huh 05:48:54 Sgeo: Is it called SgeoNeverFuckingShutsUp? 05:48:58 Please say yes. 05:49:20 No 05:49:24 Sgeo: what then 05:49:30 Sgeo 05:50:06 Sgeo: what. 05:50:08 ok so you made it yes 05:50:26 oh activeworlds is actually one word? 05:50:43 elliott, I've seen it both ways 05:50:50 I think Active Worlds is more correct 05:50:50 Sgeo: Shut up about Active Worlds! 05:50:51 i'm an inclusive man 05:50:59 Sgeo: their site says ActiveWorlds 05:51:05 Huh. 05:51:17 * Sgeo shrugs 05:51:32 -!- shutup has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 05:51:46 -!- shutup has joined. 05:52:21 ActiveWorlds 05:52:21 Sgeo: Shut up about Active Worlds! 05:52:25 Active Worlds 05:52:26 Sgeo: Shut up about Active Worlds! 05:52:27 -!- augur_ has joined. 05:52:29 AlphaWorld 05:52:52 =P 05:53:25 augur_: are you egomt 05:53:26 geomerty 05:53:32 what 05:54:02 elliott, I'm Sacred Geometry! 05:54:12 ping me when my alt dies so i can de_ 05:54:20 augur_: de_ify 05:54:36 that too 05:54:38 -!- augur has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 05:54:41 o 05:54:43 augur_, ping 05:54:44 -!- augur_ has changed nick to augur. 06:08:20 :-\ 06:08:53 -!- p_q has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 06:10:28 -!- poiuy_qwert has joined. 06:16:27 variable: :-/ 06:22:43 elliott, http://lh3.ggpht.com/_hVOW2U7K4-M/SgJBNJ2ciJI/AAAAAAABAVQ/Mj9c7zh7YWY/s640/x1.jpg 06:23:08 scary. 06:23:10 sleep. 06:23:11 -!- elliott has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 06:29:33 -!- hagb4rd has joined. 06:30:05 happy new decade @ all 06:46:56 -!- Mathnerd314 has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.9.2.12/20101026210630]). 06:53:31 -!- eboyjr has joined. 06:53:53 -!- eboyjr has left (?). 07:31:01 -!- darkbulb has joined. 07:31:19 hi everyone happy new year 07:31:50 is anyone else coherent at this late hour 07:33:01 I'm never coherent, but I'm not especially incoherent right now 07:34:33 well met Sego I am new here 07:36:16 -!- darkbulb has left (?). 07:37:05 I think I scare people :( 07:45:20 geez 07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended). 08:00:00 -!- clog has joined. 08:49:02 -!- Sgeo has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 09:21:10 -!- GreaseMonkey has quit (Quit: ilua). 09:21:28 -!- j-invariant has quit (Quit: leaving). 09:25:55 -!- poiuy_qwert has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 09:26:24 -!- poiuy_qwert has joined. 10:13:26 -!- quintopia has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 10:45:58 -!- Slereah has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 10:50:58 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hsvbuwn_j_8&fmt=18 10:51:18 -!- Slereah has joined. 11:09:02 -!- wareya has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 11:10:54 -!- wareya has joined. 11:27:46 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 11:27:46 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Changing host). 11:27:46 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 12:52:04 -!- poiuy_qwert has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 12:56:18 -!- poiuy_qwert has joined. 12:59:53 -!- Sasha2 has joined. 13:01:36 -!- Sasha has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 13:28:38 -!- MigoMipo has joined. 13:28:42 -!- Phantom_Hoover has left (?). 13:28:48 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 13:29:16 scared geometry 13:29:19 -!- Sasha has joined. 13:31:05 -!- Sasha2 has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 13:34:45 nooga, why is it scared? 13:44:08 -!- poiuy_qwert has quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep). 13:48:25 it`s really quiet in here today.. even elliott is off *g 14:09:00 He's always off in the mornings. 14:09:10 And early afternoons. 14:26:05 -!- FireFly has joined. 14:45:10 -!- BeholdMyGlory has joined. 14:50:30 -!- augur_ has joined. 14:52:14 -!- augur has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 15:02:17 -!- augur_ has changed nick to augur. 15:08:43 -!- oerjan has joined. 15:16:34 -!- Behold has joined. 15:20:28 -!- BeholdMyGlory has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 15:20:28 -!- Sasha has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 15:20:43 -!- Behold has changed nick to BeholdMyGlory. 15:20:47 -!- Sasha has joined. 15:27:19 -!- BeholdMyGlory has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 15:29:21 -!- BeholdMyGlory has joined. 15:32:26 -!- Wamanuz2 has joined. 15:32:36 -!- ChanServ has set channel mode: +o oerjan. 15:32:56 -!- oerjan has set channel mode: +b *!*shutup@208.78.103.*. 15:33:04 -!- oerjan has set channel mode: -o oerjan. 15:33:08 * oerjan whistles innocently 15:41:21 -!- Sasha has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 15:41:34 -!- Sasha has joined. 15:47:33 -!- Behold has joined. 15:50:48 -!- BeholdMyGlory has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 15:51:03 -!- Behold has changed nick to BeholdMyGlory. 15:52:15 -!- quintopia has joined. 16:11:08 oerjan, POLICE BRUTALITY 16:11:21 SUBSTRATISM 16:13:30 -!- Wamanuz2 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 16:13:57 -!- Wamanuz2 has joined. 16:15:44 BUT OF COURSE 16:18:04 -!- Behold has joined. 16:19:01 Behold! 16:19:12 actually, i don't know you... 16:19:24 neeeeeeeeeeever mind 16:21:26 -!- BeholdMyGlory has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 16:21:38 -!- Behold has changed nick to BeholdMyGlory. 16:27:14 oerjan, WHAT'S NEXT 16:27:22 ARE PROTOPLASMIC HOOVERS TO BE PURGED 16:28:32 -!- elliott has joined. 16:28:49 OF COURSE NOT. YOU MERELY HAVE TO WEAR THESE LITTLE BADGES... 16:31:27 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Later). 16:31:30 hi nazi oerjan 16:32:05 elliott, shutup has been silenced once more in oerjan's purge! 16:32:18 fungot, get out! Get out now! 16:32:19 Phantom_Hoover: besides, i'd love to see if it were more flexible, they just confuse the issue is control. so stop sending me down this particular error message! 16:32:35 fungot, TRAITOR 16:32:36 Phantom_Hoover: from: rl date: fri, 31 jul 1992 05:18:17 edt subject: re: bent axel's what to do 16:47:02 -!- cheater99 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 17:00:09 -!- cheater99 has joined. 17:01:38 -!- oerjan has joined. 17:09:10 -!- Behold has joined. 17:12:45 -!- BeholdMyGlory has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 17:27:07 -!- j-invariant has joined. 17:36:51 -!- Sasha has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 17:37:23 -!- Sasha has joined. 17:48:09 oerjan! 17:48:14 DECLARATION OF WAR 17:48:56 Let it now be known that Hoover Heavy Industries is now at war with the brutal substratist autocracy of oerjan. 17:49:51 IT SEEMS THE BADGES HAVE BEEN INSUFFICIENT, THEN 17:50:04 WE SHALL HAVE TO IMPLEMENT A MORE _FINAL_ SOLUTION 17:50:36 oerjan, I challenge you to a DUEL! 17:50:41 CHOOSE YOUR WEAPON 17:50:59 Coding up shutup_oerjan.rb as we speak 17:50:59 I CHOOSE RICE PUDDING 17:51:05 OH GOD 17:51:06 Phantom_Hoover: give up 17:51:10 WHILE YOU STILL HAVE YOUR LIFE 17:51:24 elliott, I MUST DO THIS 17:51:27 oerjan, VERY WELL 17:51:33 NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO 17:52:41 what the heck are you talking about 17:53:05 i love it, but dont understand anything :) 17:53:19 * oerjan invades neutral hagb4rd just for the lulz 17:53:37 ALSO, TO PILLAGE HIS RICE FIELDS 17:53:58 go for it 17:54:32 this channel is unique, indeed 17:54:38 * oerjan realizes invading in the winter may have been a bad move 17:56:32 * oerjan fires a north korean bought missile filled with rice pudding at Phantom_Hoover 17:56:41 NO WONDER THOSE PEOPLE ARE STARVING 17:56:55 * hagb4rd goes get some popcorn 17:57:53 * oerjan notes north korean news praise the great destruction made by the missile 17:59:20 elliott, is the third monkey island game any good? 17:59:55 * oerjan is a little worried by the lack of independent confirmation. also by the fickleness of his f key 18:01:08 Vorpal: Yes. It pretty much ignores the second's ending, and it didn't have the original creator involved, but it's still good. 18:01:14 Vorpal: Only play it after the first two ... or you give up on them. 18:01:24 Vorpal: The fourth you should buy just so you can burn it. 18:01:39 elliott, I played the first, and I'm in the last chapter of the second 18:01:55 Vorpal: That's quick ... assuming you just started recently. 18:02:06 I can never beat the ending of the second. 18:02:21 Vorpal: Note that ScummVM is "slightly" slow with MI3. Not a problem on any vaguely modern machine of course. 18:02:38 It's all the high tech! (640x480x8!) 18:02:39 elliott, well, over a week ago. And so far I just needed to google twice when I got stuck 18:02:55 elliott, sempron 3300+? 18:03:29 Vorpal: It should do. You'll know after the opening cutscene and trying to play. 18:03:39 elliott, well, it isn't downloaded yet 18:03:44 Especially manoevring the cannon. 18:03:45 *spelling 18:03:45 oh wait, there it goes 18:03:54 elliott, what 18:04:04 Vorpal: You have to shoot some boats at the start. 18:04:06 (They don't move.) 18:04:14 afk 18:04:19 Vorpal: Failing that, just put ScummVM on your laptop and VNC/whatever in from a bigger screen? 18:04:38 elliott, hrrm. X forwarding? 18:04:40 Vorpal: Oh, BTW, click-hold to do actions with things in MI3. It's one of those circular interface things. 18:04:42 Gesture-esque. 18:04:51 Does X forwarding work for SDL or whatever? 18:04:56 Vorpal: (And right click is inventory.) 18:04:57 no fucking clue 18:05:13 elliott, circular interface as in NWN? 18:05:32 I haven't played NWN. 18:05:49 Vorpal: You hold it down and a little coin comes up; the middle is look, to the right is eat/talk, to the left is use. 18:05:57 (Yes, this is flexible enough to handle the whole game.) 18:06:09 elliott, ah hm 18:06:12 Oh, and single-clicking stuff in the inventory lets you combine it with other stuff unless I'm vastly misremembering. 18:06:21 Vorpal: I think there's some shortcut to do "the default thing" with an object; double-clicking? 18:06:24 But whatever. 18:06:32 elliott, http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.zoecchi.com/Images/Games/NWN2KOTOR2/NWNradial.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.zoecchi.com/_include/obsidian2.asp&usg=__KK4evUDhrVGHPRPbOInkSuc9eSI=&h=300&w=300&sz=33&hl=en&start=0&zoom=1&tbnid=qhz6BBuEs1n5xM:&tbnh=130&tbnw=121&prev=/images%3Fq%3DNWN%2Bmenu%2Binterface%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26hs%3DcIR%26sa%3DN%26rls%3Dorg.moz 18:06:32 illa:en-US:official%26biw%3D1508%26bih%3D679%26tbs%3Disch:1&um=1&itbs=1&iact=rc&dur=280&ei=_2wfTaq_NY3usgba6OXnDA&oei=_2wfTaq_NY3usgba6OXnDA&esq=1&page=1&ndsp=31&ved=1t:429,r:4,s:0&tx=92&ty=52 18:06:35 aiee! 18:06:39 that was one long url 18:06:39 X-D 18:06:49 elliott, anyway, cut and paste it 18:06:52 Vorpal: Yes, like that, except that it's only three and one's in the middle. 18:06:55 And no, the first line worked fine. 18:06:58 right 18:07:01 elliott, huh 18:07:43 elliott, anyway if there are only 3, how can it be circular then? 18:07:55 Vorpal: It appears in a circular coin :p 18:08:04 elliott, also see those arrows at some points? They open to circular sub-menus 18:08:11 Right, none of that here. 18:08:25 elliott, for the spell menu it feels like ad-infinum in NWN 18:08:32 Vorpal: http://quick.mixnmojo.com/screenshots/CmiLauncherCoin1.jpg This is the coin. 18:09:06 -!- augur_ has joined. 18:09:08 elliott, aiee, please tell me it uses an antialiased edge in the game? 18:09:26 Vorpal: It's too low resolution to look that ugly. :p 18:09:37 Dunno if it's antialiased, but it doesn't look jaggedy. 18:09:50 elliott, the one you linked looks jagged 18:09:59 Yes, it's higher-resolution. I Think it's from the launcher. 18:10:00 *think 18:10:25 Here's two ACTUAL SCREENSHOTS 18:10:27 http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_xeu4Tx9GGtk/TM8sd_TKYaI/AAAAAAAAEFM/jvmKMR4mAVw/s640/Curse+of+Monkey+Island+Screenshot.jpg 18:10:28 http://firsthour.net/screenshots/curse-of-monkey-island/curse-of-monkey-island-guybrush-barbershop.jpg 18:10:31 No coin in those though. 18:11:02 -!- augur has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 18:11:16 * Phantom_Hoover swatpans oerjan --==\#/ 18:12:14 Vorpal: The fourth game, by the way, abandoned the nice mouse-based UI for both 3D keyboard-based movement, and KEYBOARD-BASED ACTION-TAKING THAT CHANGED AS YOU LOOKED AROUND. 18:12:15 http://www.activewin.com/reviews/software/games/m/images/mi4_019.jpg 18:12:16 elliott, they both looks jpged 18:12:29 If the game actually had any plot it'd be a shame; as it is, it's good because it keeps anyone from playing it. 18:13:09 Vorpal: So where are you in number two? I forget the division of chapters exactly. 18:13:24 elliott, just at start of last chapter. Dinky island 18:13:53 Vorpal: If a tree falls in the forest and no one is around to hear it, what colour is the tree? 18:13:55 44MMonkey Island 1 - The Secret of Monkey Island 18:13:55 203MMonkey Island 2 - LeChuck's Revenge 18:13:55 1,1GCurse 18:13:56 hah 18:14:11 Vorpal: You can actually get him to agree, BTW. 18:14:14 Just keep clicking answers. 18:14:15 elliott, ... not happened yet? 18:14:20 Vorpal: Oh. Talk to Herman Toothrot. 18:14:33 elliott, well I took a pause right here and now 18:14:49 Fair enough. 18:14:56 -!- Slereah has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 18:15:01 Vorpal: The final chapter is quite short though. 18:15:02 elliott, my head hurts if I have headphones on for more than an hour or two in a single stretch 18:15:05 Well, compared to the others. 18:15:14 elliott, so taking at least half an hour pause 18:15:17 Now I want to play, aargh. 18:15:27 Vorpal: Headphones, for that authentic Adlib sound. 18:16:07 elliott, MT-32 dude 18:16:12 Vorpal: For Monkey Island 2? 18:16:13 Gross. 18:16:15 Adlib sounds better. 18:16:29 You've been missing out. 18:16:59 elliott, well actually my computer can't do either very well, I'm using pre-generated ogg (the iMUSE switchover works perfectly with it somehow) 18:17:13 Vorpal: What. Adlib emulation requires, like, a 386. 18:17:24 elliott, WHO KNOWS! 18:17:24 Anything can do it. 18:17:44 elliott, does the third game use iMUSE blending? 18:17:56 Vorpal: It does but it's more subtle. 18:18:03 elliott, oh? 18:18:16 Vorpal: Yes. Also the tracks are pre-rendered CD audio. 18:18:38 elliott, you will get seeking then 18:18:45 Vorpal: Not with oggs. :p 18:18:52 elliott, well duh 18:18:56 elliott, but in the original 18:19:12 Know of any .iso rips of the third? This computer lacks an ... optical ... drive ... 18:22:37 elliott, eh 18:22:54 elliott, try tpb, for the authentic .rar rip 18:23:07 Vorpal: Every time my brain hears compressed audio, I go unconscious. 18:23:18 I bought the fucking CDs, why isn't there an official, free, legal download I can get. 18:23:19 elliott, .... .... 18:23:27 elliott, you have another computer 18:23:28 OH RIGHT I FORGOT I PAID FOR A TINY PIECE OF PLASTIC 18:23:30 rip it there 18:23:31 Vorpal: It has no optical drive. 18:23:37 elliott, your fucking imac 18:23:47 Vorpal: I'm not getting that out of the box for this. 18:23:51 Also I have no idea where the CD is. 18:24:48 -!- Sasha2 has joined. 18:26:06 elliott, ah 18:26:14 elliott, well I saw no ISO rip no 18:26:39 http://torrentz.eu/a8b84d6f65d843ba2754d84093df88ecff049f49 18:26:47 Vorpal: First thing on torrentz :P 18:26:48 elliott, only looked at tpb 18:27:00 -!- Sasha has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 18:27:09 Vorpal: Why would you even look at tpb? It barely has anything and the tracker rarely if ever works ... 18:27:38 -!- j-invariant has quit (Quit: leaving). 18:30:20 http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3b/LiquidThreads_sample_screenshot.jpg 18:30:38 dear current: 240 KiB/s is insufficient speed!!! go faster 18:30:40 Am I the only one who thinks this is hideous? 18:30:55 Phantom_Hoover: Is that for ... Talk pages? 18:31:00 elliott, yes. 18:31:08 Phantom_Hoover: Is that coming to Wikipedia. 18:31:16 It means that they're also no longer editable with the standard MW tools. 18:31:22 elliott, possibly. At some point. 18:31:23 400 KiB/s over wifi, fuck yeah. 18:31:51 Phantom_Hoover: I'm going to try to forget that and also leave the world before that can happen simultaneously. brb autoerotic asphyxiation 18:32:02 (The BEST worst way to die!) 18:33:48 -!- Slereah has joined. 18:35:17 elliott, please list the things that are awful about it, so that I may have a reference. 18:35:32 Phantom_Hoover: Try "EVERYTHING" 18:36:37 elliott, there's even more obnoxiousness that doesn't show up there. 18:36:52 Oh joy. 18:36:53 Like what. 18:36:55 For instance, it has a "you have new messages" link right at the top of the screen. 18:37:23 -!- Mathnerd314 has joined. 18:37:34 Which a) counts *any messages on a page you edit* as new ones for you and b) doesn't reset until you explicitly tell it to. 18:37:50 Niiiiice 18:37:59 Good thing I barely edit Wikipedia at all now. 18:38:04 Not worth the hassle. 18:39:12 elliott, it's also still pre-alpha. 18:39:22 Phantom_Hoover: So they can mess it up even more! Yay! 18:40:09 I mention all of this because it has been installed on RationalWiki (for which I have very little time for any more) and there is a dedicated cadre of users who have decided that if you think it's awful and you don't like it you're a LUDDITE who is AGAINST PROGRESS. 18:40:14 BRB food. 18:40:56 http://webssh.cz.cc/ 18:41:01 Vorpal: ^ This is not a joke. 18:42:13 Phantom_Hoover: Well ... I've learned not to expect reason from RationalWiki ... :-P 18:44:08 elliott, about one person could trust it. The guy who made it 18:44:26 Vorpal: BUT NO, WHY NOT CLICK IT NOW AND GIVE ME YOUR PASSWORDS 18:44:37 elliott, har har 18:44:51 Vorpal: The *only* better thing is that online SSH key generator. 18:44:59 That was the height of comedy. 18:45:03 I don't appear to be able to Google it any more. 18:45:09 Maybe it's been removec. 18:45:10 *removed. 18:47:12 Phantom_Hoover: http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/RationalWiki:2010_awards#Lumenos 18:55:50 elliott, he should have won the Lumenos award, but that thing died because everyone on RW is far more interested in discussing minutiae and acting like adolescents than actually doing anything interesting. 18:56:26 Phantom_Hoover: I'm now reading an argument you+people are having about Human. I tell you, this thing is a greater goldmine of drama than ED. 18:56:52 Yep. I stopped taking it seriously forever ago, and complaining is FUN. 18:57:25 TBH I wouldn't mind RationalWiki so much if it was instead called FunForRedditAtheistsWiki. 18:57:43 As far as I can tell the articles designed to be amusing drown out the ones with any actual information by the thousands. 18:58:47 (I need a better term for "reddit atheists" than "reddit atheists".) 18:58:59 Anyway, moving on to interesting things! 18:59:08 Phantom_Hoover: DID YOU DO ANGULAR MOMENTUM YET 18:59:17 elliott, NO 18:59:25 BECAUSE I AM LAZY 18:59:26 Phantom_Hoover: BUT YOU SAID YOU WOULD 18:59:30 WITH A SIMPLE SUBCLASS 18:59:34 AND SCARED OF FLOATING-POINT TRIG 18:59:45 Phantom_Hoover, actually, just leave that as an exercise to the game player! 19:00:08 Vorpal, THERE WOULD STILL BE FLOATING POINT TRIG 19:00:16 ... what is scary about floating point trig? 19:00:20 I WILL NOT BE HAPPY UNTIL EVERYTHING IS A CAUCHY SEQUENCE 19:00:41 Phantom_Hoover: Just pretend they're perfect reals. 19:00:43 NOBODY HAS TO KNOW 19:00:45 Phantom_Hoover, so shell out to mathematica for it 19:00:56 Mathematica ... does not use cauchy sequences. 19:01:01 Vorpal, Mathematica doesn't do that. 19:01:07 elliott, I'm sure you could write that in it 19:01:13 Vorpal: You could also write it in Common Lisp. 19:01:15 Or PHP. 19:01:28 Why you would shell out to an inferior language like Mathematica is unclear. 19:01:32 elliott, well sure, but the line "shell out to mathematica" is funnier 19:01:44 I would honestly rather shell out to PHP> 19:01:47 *PHP. 19:01:51 :D 19:02:22 Phantom_Hoover, implement cauchy sequences in C then 19:02:23 or something 19:02:38 Someone help me work out my GolfScript ripoff. 19:03:47 Phantom_Hoover: I CHOOSE YOU 19:03:52 You can get out of it by doing angular momentum. 19:04:14 elliott, golfscript is fun, try another one 19:04:27 elliott, say "inferior PHP ripoff" (ouch!) 19:04:40 No, Phantom_Hoover is scared of any work. 19:04:44 And I really am making a golfscript ripoff. 19:04:56 I'm having trouble distinguishing arrays of small integers and strings, though (ha ha Erlang), which is important for eval. 19:04:58 Specifically, 19:05:04 [1 2 3] eval --> stack is 1 2 3 19:05:05 but 19:05:16 "abc" eval --> stack is whatever the stack is after executing abc 19:05:23 yet "abc" = [97 98 99] 19:05:51 elliott is that an issue? 19:05:57 Vorpal: Yes. 19:06:03 elliott, after all C has string as array of bytes 19:06:16 Because every variable is evaluated on reference. Evaluating anything that isn't a function should just push it to the stack. 19:06:17 erm 19:06:20 elliott: [1 2 3] eval --> stack is 1 2 3 19:06:21 rather 19:06:23 stack is [1 2 3] 19:06:23 as in 19:06:25 single element, [1 2 3] 19:07:11 elliott, why not let eval execute a list? 19:07:25 What. 19:07:39 elliott, I fail to see the issue here 19:07:51 Your last-but-one sentence is utterly incomprehensible. 19:07:54 Restate it. 19:08:19 elliott, well does "abc" eval and [97 98 99] eval have to do different things? 19:08:26 Yes. 19:08:29 elliott, why 19:08:34 Because otherwise you couldn't assign [97 98 99] to a variable. 19:08:41 Because it'd execute "abc" when you mentioned the variable. 19:08:42 elliott, eeeh okay 19:08:48 As I said, variables are evaluated when mentioned. 19:09:04 elliott, then make string and list different data types? 19:09:20 Vorpal: No, because all the operations you might want on the two are the same. 19:09:30 I am considering tracking around the function-ness of a list at this point. 19:10:37 -!- Sgeo has joined. 19:12:45 -!- Sgeo has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 19:15:11 elliott: i recall postscript has two kinds of lists depending on whether you want evaluating them to run what's inside or not 19:17:27 oerjan, who won the war? 19:17:54 Phantom_Hoover: there appears to be a strong disagreement between north korea and the usa on this issue 19:18:14 north korea claims that you were completely obliterated by the missile i sent 19:18:35 while the usa claims it exploded just a few seconds after being launched 19:18:39 oerjan, I am a Phantom_Hoover and as such cannot be destroyed with physical weapons. 19:18:55 Phantom_Hoover: the missile contained rice pudding 19:19:12 and incidentally caused the starving of thousands of north koreans 19:19:21 oerjan, a cunning plan, indeed, but I was prepared! 19:20:02 I used the swatpan to catch it, and then hit you with it! 19:20:11 ouch 19:21:59 -!- Sgeo has joined. 19:24:14 elliott: or wait was that dependent on storing it in a variable, my memory is a bit vague 19:24:20 oerjan: who knows :D 19:26:24 -!- updog has joined. 19:26:31 Boy, I've got a massive plate of updog right here. 19:26:31 What's updog? 19:26:40 I don't know, updog. What *is* updog? 19:26:40 What's updog? 19:26:46 A question for the ages. 19:26:47 updog is edible? 19:26:47 What's updog? 19:27:57 i have some suspicions about updog 19:27:58 What's updog? 19:28:04 confirmed 19:28:23 oerjan: what suspicions? 19:28:52 I SUSPECT HE IS OF AN INFERIOR SUBSTRATUM 19:29:05 He's just lodgin'. 19:29:08 oerjan, *substrate 19:29:43 Phantom_Hoover: alternate spelling it seems 19:29:52 In Newspeak updog is doubleplusgood. 19:29:52 What's updog? 19:30:55 hmm updog's got broken 19:30:55 What's updog? 19:30:57 * elliott kills the process 19:31:06 * oerjan slaps elliott with a dickfor 19:31:10 -!- updog has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:31:16 For what? 19:31:22 You didn't complete your sentence. 19:31:44 * oerjan swats elliott for ruining the joke -----### 19:32:02 THE BEATINGS WILL CONTINUE UNTIL MORALE IMPROVES 19:32:06 oerjan, what's a dickfor? 19:32:09 * Sgeo is considering installing Linux Mint 19:32:11 -!- updog has joined. 19:32:13 Phantom_Hoover: Copulation. 19:32:46 elliott, that was so that I could infiltrate oerjan's evil tyranny and undermine it from within1 19:32:48 *! 19:33:01 AW DAMMIT UPDOG WHY DO YOU HAVE TO BE SO UPDOG 19:33:12 Oh. It could do with some more uppercasing. 19:34:56 elliott, Shut up about Newspeak! 19:35:04 What. 19:35:08 Oh. 19:35:14 I meant Orwell's, dummy. 19:38:57 -!- updog has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:39:27 -!- updog has joined. 19:39:56 Updog! 19:39:56 What's updog? 19:40:00 I don't know 19:40:10 Gah, why is it using all the CPU. 19:40:31 it's due to a plot by its arch-nemesis downcat 19:40:57 -!- Quadrescence has left (?). 19:41:26 inorite sounds like a very annoying mineral 19:41:44 -!- updog has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:41:54 -!- updog has joined. 19:42:15 UPDOOOG 19:42:23 Updog 19:42:24 What's updog? 19:42:26 I already told you, I don't know 19:43:13 -!- updog has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:43:51 What language is your bots in? 19:43:56 -!- updog has joined. 19:43:59 -!- updog has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:43:59 (is? are?) 19:44:19 -!- updog has joined. 19:44:36 updog is in Ruby. 19:44:36 What's updog? 19:44:43 It is also proof that I have no concept of "pointless". 19:45:16 Yet you have the gall to call things I do pointless. 19:45:32 I detect the distinct tinge of offence. 19:50:31 -!- ais523 has joined. 19:52:47 ais523! 19:53:01 One after ais522! 19:53:36 ais522+1! 19:54:10 ++ 19:54:28 NO YOU EMBIGGENED HIM 19:56:34 i think i've upset sgeo forever now 19:58:40 OS X thinks that you unpack .bin files to .bin.cpgz. 19:58:40 What. 19:59:17 I saw that before as well. 20:00:39 hi everyone 20:01:00 sorry, I was busy saying hi to a greeting cascade in a different channel 20:01:01 elliott: cpgz is an abbreviation for .cpio.gz? 20:01:37 ais523: quite possibly 20:02:02 * elliott converts to ISO 20:02:29 ais523: i have a lot of updog lying around, can you take care of it? 20:02:29 What's updog? 20:02:31 elliott: also after reading perl6 "spec", I believe that @foo.filter(* % 2)>>*>>2 would have the desired effect discussed yesterday 20:02:34 NEVER CEASES TO AMUSE 20:02:39 coppro: lmao 20:03:04 coppro: not @foo.filter(*%2)>>* ** 2? 20:03:20 oh, no, you're right, my bad 20:03:28 or @foo.filter(* % 2)»**»2 20:03:45 :D 20:03:48 the >> or » is the "hyper" metaoperator and extends the operation over the list 20:04:04 » is more of a pain to actually type but more readable 20:04:21 i think all the perl 6 editors must have really tricked-out emacs setups for unicode 20:04:25 yeah 20:04:35 also this assumes filter exists and works like that 20:04:42 I haven't checked that yet 20:04:46 :D 20:05:06 (also, re my complaint about it not being a spec, ff and fff operators are /never/ defined. They just say "have semantics like Perl 5 .. and ... flipflops) 20:07:19 ah, nope, that's not quite right 20:07:36 s/filter/grep/ 20:08:37 Vorpal: I'm about to test COMI (MI3) in ScummVM now. 20:09:09 Vorpal: So if it works well, then it works well on 2.1GHz Core 2 Duo w/ 4 GiB of RAM, good nvidia integrated GPU and 256 GiB SSD. Which is of course very relevant to your situation. 20:09:13 elliott, telst what? 20:09:16 test* 20:09:18 COMI. 20:09:20 oh right 20:09:20 Curse of Monkey Island. 20:09:35 elliott, and I checked, it works well on my computer 20:10:09 elliott, play it on hard! 20:10:20 Vorpal: There is no hard, there's just "wimp" vs. "actual game". 20:10:24 Vorpal: I assume you played MI2 on hard too. 20:10:29 I have no idea why the easy versions exist. 20:10:34 elliott, of course I used hard 20:10:37 Why play an adventure game if you don't want puzzles? 20:10:56 elliott, except for MI3 it looks like it is called normal and mega 20:11:02 Yes. 20:11:03 while for MI2 it was easy and normal 20:11:06 Mega is the one you want to play. :p 20:11:17 Vorpal: First report: Well, it starts up! It's ugly-LCD-scaled, though. 20:11:20 Why are LCDs so bad at scaling? 20:11:30 I can't use the 2x filter because 960 > 800. 20:11:45 elliott, wait a second. 800? 20:11:52 elliott, which dimension is 800? 20:12:00 Vorpal: 1440x800 20:12:05 640x480 * 2 = something x 960. 20:12:12 elliott, can't you play it at native res? 20:12:21 Vorpal: Sure. It gets ugly-LCD-scaled. 20:12:23 elliott, WINDOWED! 20:12:27 Vorpal: Ew. 20:12:31 elliott, do it! 20:12:34 Vorpal: Talk about non-immersive. 20:12:50 elliott, idea: windowed on completely black bg 20:12:52 Vorpal: Maybe if it could black out the rest of my screen and center it. 20:12:53 Ha. 20:13:10 Vorpal: Oh, and MI3 of course has voice acting, if you didn't know. 20:13:12 Good voice acting, mind you. 20:13:14 elliott, so black bg and hide menu bars then window near middle 20:13:28 elliott, I noticed. I played the first scene to test it 20:13:44 Finished MI2 yet? 20:13:57 elliott, well no, but I had to test system reqs 20:14:04 Indeed. 20:14:30 Why doesn't ScummVM have a 1.5x. 20:14:41 elliott, black border! 20:14:43 960x720 with black border around it would be perfect. 20:14:48 But 640x480 is so small. 20:14:53 Vorpal: This is 128 ppi, dammit! 20:14:56 640x480 looks like my thumbnail! 20:15:18 elliott, anyway windowed is only sane option for me. 96 dpi or such. And 24" 20:15:31 elliott, 24" wide screen even 20:15:51 Vorpal: I think every computer should come with a low-quality early-90s CRT, complete with digital-to-VGA converter. 20:16:02 It's the best way to play. 20:18:39 Vorpal: Allow me to demonstrate why windowed doesn't work for me. 20:18:55 elliott, ? 20:19:16 Mrf. 20:19:18 Gimme a second. 20:19:22 imgur appears to now transcode big pngs to jpg. 20:19:30 Low quality at that. 20:20:45 Vorpal: http://ompldr.org/vNnQzdA 20:20:51 Vorpal: Now consider that that's on a 13" screen. 20:22:22 Vorpal: Get the picture? :p 20:22:37 waiting for it to load 20:22:40 (browser that is) 20:22:47 get an ssd :P 20:22:49 elliott, yes what is the problem 20:22:59 Vorpal: OK. First look at its size in comparison to the whole thing. 20:23:05 Vorpal: Now try and remember how big a 13" laptop's screen is. 20:23:09 elliott, SURE if you have 2x 1 TB SSD for use in RAID 1 20:23:14 Vorpal: (Try looking at your laptop's and imagining a screen quite a bit smaller.) 20:23:27 Get the problem? It's tiny. Not very nice. 20:23:42 I'm going to play it with LCD-crappy-scaling, I think. 20:23:57 elliott, right. Still it fills less of the screen than on my desktop 20:24:15 Vorpal: Full screen the damn thing :P 20:24:25 elliott, on a wide screen!? 20:24:31 Vorpal: Black borders at the side, duh. 20:24:33 LCDs do that. 20:24:42 Vorpal: And if you have more than 800 vertical pixels, you can use the 2x scaler. 20:24:45 So the LCD scaling will be minimal. 20:25:03 Phantom_Hoover: Have YOU played monkey island? 20:25:08 * Sgeo is addicted to watching DS9 20:25:26 Although it is, thus far, the least entertaining series I have ever comitted myself to watching 20:25:37 *committed. 20:25:38 Phantom_Hoover: WELL 20:25:44 elliott, I have 1050 vertical 20:25:51 Does it get better in season 2? 20:25:58 elliott, I have not! 20:26:05 Vorpal: Right. Try full-screening it; set the scaler to "2x". 20:26:10 All in Edit Game. 20:26:16 Phantom_Hoover: Play NAO 20:26:17 elliott, not in global options? 20:26:19 *NOW 20:26:22 elliott, HAO 20:26:24 Vorpal: No, that'll set it for the launcher UI too. 20:26:27 Phantom_Hoover: SCUMMVM 20:26:47 Now I leave you scoundrels to play the game! 20:26:48 -!- elliott has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 20:27:19 2xSAI looks better 20:29:05 fungot 20:29:06 Phantom_Hoover: mtmp mo 9; ytmp yr 1; s splnet(); alien. i quote below from the domain of a line behind the original file! 20:34:28 -!- Behold has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 20:37:54 -!- BeholdMyGlory has joined. 20:48:14 -!- elliott has joined. 20:48:28 Vorpal: Helpful tip for COMI: If your cursor is an arrow, double-clicking goes there immediately, btw. 20:48:34 -!- elliott has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 20:50:20 * Sgeo is excited for this month 20:51:33 -!- elliott has joined. 20:51:59 Vorpal: Have you been able to get voice-with-no-subtitles working? 20:52:07 elliott, why Must O'Brien Suffer? 20:52:10 Vorpal: It shows the subtitles for me. 20:52:17 Sgeo: Because. 20:52:29 Sgeo, oh god why are you excited. 20:52:32 Vorpal: Even when I just set it to Speech. 20:52:56 Have plans to meet up with a girl 20:53:03 Oh god. I'm leaving now. 20:53:06 Vorpal: Please answer quickly. 20:53:08 Sgeo, Christ no. 20:53:27 Phantom_Hoover, why is this distressing? 20:53:43 * elliott envisions thousands of tiny little Sgeos running around, retreats into his own nightmare. 20:53:48 Sgeo, it implies your genes may continue. 20:54:02 I'm going to go drown my sorrows. In Monkey Island. 20:54:02 Also, you are clearly incapable of a committed relationship. 20:54:07 Dammit Vorpal, respond. 20:54:12 Phantom_Hoover: Yeah, how does Factor feel? 20:54:18 You abandoned her, you bastard. 20:54:27 For that slut Scala. 20:54:32 Was it Scala? 20:54:36 I've lost track. 20:54:43 I wonder if even Sgeo knows. 20:54:44 I think so. 20:54:53 I don't think I gave Scala more than a passing glance 20:55:05 Sgeo: I swear you did. 20:55:09 Or was it Clojure 20:55:09 ? 20:55:16 Never even touched Clojure 20:55:25 Sgeo: OK, I give up guessing. 20:55:30 I started reading about Scala again, then this channel discouraged me 20:55:38 I think I went Factor -> Newspeak 20:55:38 I'ma play COMI. 20:56:02 Awesome, shutup PMs me now 20:57:28 -!- elliott has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 20:58:25 back 20:58:40 Vorpal: Have you been able to get voice-with-no-subtitles working? <-- no clue 21:03:59 Sgeo, do you like Ian Stewart? 21:05:53 -!- Mathnerd314 has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.9.2.12/20101026210630]). 21:07:05 -!- myndzi\ has changed nick to myndzi. 21:09:51 \m/ \m/ \m/ \m/ 21:09:58 :( 21:10:02 \m/ \m/ \m/ \m/ 21:10:02 `\o/´ `\o/´ 21:10:02 | | 21:10:02 /´¯|_) /'\ 21:10:02 (_| (_| |_) 21:11:11 * Sgeo wikis 21:11:23 * Sgeo wants to read The Science of Discworld at some point 21:16:13 3 is the best 21:16:56 3, was that the one with Darwin in it? 21:17:23 yeah 21:17:45 with the god of evolution 21:27:33 -!- elliott has joined. 21:27:39 wb elliott 21:27:47 Sgeo: Ian Stewart is the one who wrote that EVIL BOOK, FLATTERLAND. 21:27:53 (Information thanks to Sgeo) 21:28:02 coppro: hello, i'm going back to playing COMI 21:28:08 none of you are interesting enough 21:29:15 elliott: flatterland is evil? 21:29:25 coppro: according to Sgeo! 21:29:43 Sgeo: flatterland is evil? 21:29:48 05:41:20 I just realized something horrible about Flatterland 21:29:49 05:42:36 It promotes the pseudoscientific bullshit involving taking scientific words, interpreting stuff as you please, and thinking it means something 21:29:49 05:43:10 --- join: jcp (~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539) joined #esoteric 21:29:50 05:44:07 I feel no guilt about spoiling this: the last scene involves the protagonist basing arguments for gender equality on Flatland's supersymmetry 21:29:52 05:45:29 "Supersymmetric sister! ..." 21:29:54 05:46:03 I forgot the rest of her advertisement on Flatland's Internet 21:29:56 coppro: BEHOLD THE HORROR 21:30:01 and now to play a game where i can forget all you bastards exit -> 21:30:49 ah 21:30:57 elliott: we don't exit 21:31:01 we idle here 21:31:06 coppro: heh 21:31:20 it's funny because i meant to say exist, you bsatards. 21:31:22 *bastards. 21:32:11 I know 21:32:50 you don't know anything. i'm going back to guybrush threepwood. 21:32:51 -!- elliott has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:36:33 " I feel no guilt about spoiling this:" 21:36:52 WHAT KIND OF MATHEMATICAL CRIME CAN JUSTIFY SUCH A CRIME 21:37:07 Er, s/CRIME/DEED/ 21:38:12 supersymmetric ones, of course 21:41:48 -!- j-invariant has joined. 21:41:57 "Dramatis Personae" was an awesome episode 21:45:22 No it wasn't. 21:46:33 that names rings a bell for some reason 21:46:58 Phantom_Hoover, what? 21:46:59 never read any karl marx 21:47:13 j-invariant, what? 21:47:54 j-invariant, Dramatis Personae is the pretentious Latin name for a list of characters in a play. 21:48:03 ah that will be it then 21:48:18 It's also an awesome season 1 episode of DS9 21:49:26 And a group of theater-like people in Stephenson's Diamond Age book. 21:50:46 gah, argument in another channel: does O(1/n) mean anything at all, and if so, does it mean something different from O(1)? 21:51:44 using f in O(1/n) iff f in O(n) by my definition 21:51:47 ais523, well, I think the definition of O(f(x)) is reliant on f being strictly increasing. 21:53:45 -!- elliott has joined. 21:53:49 O(1/n) does mean something! 21:53:54 k/n will be smaller than some constant eventually, so O(1/n) should imply a lower upper bound 21:54:03 ais523: O(1/n) = O(n^-1) -- it's EXPONENTIAL! 21:54:05 21:54:09 lol 21:54:20 it definitely isn't O(1) though i don't think 21:54:24 O(n) maybe 21:54:25 elliott, polynomial, surely? 21:54:31 But no, it isn't O(1). 21:54:38 Phantom_Hoover: n^-1 <-- LOOKS LIKE EXPONENTIATION TO ME 21:54:39 f(x) = 1 isn't O(1/n) :D 21:54:43 O(1/n) is not the same as either O(1) or O(n) 21:54:49 O(1/n) is O(fish) 21:54:59 oafish? 21:55:01 elliott, Dramatis Personae <3 21:55:06 1/n^2 is O(1/n) 21:55:07 f in O(1) means that there exists some x' and c such that every x > x' we have f(x) >= c 21:55:25 j-invariant: * <= 21:55:31 yeah, <= 21:55:44 i've always thought =< would be a better symbol 21:55:45 less ambiguou 21:55:46 s 21:55:53 ah yes they are different, my mistake 21:56:00 Isn't there a language that does that? 21:56:04 =< and >= ? 21:56:14 you merely described \Omega(1) there 21:56:23 oh wait 21:56:28 no, that is exactly \Omega(1) 21:56:31 Sgeo: eralgn 21:56:34 Sgeo: btw, the Dominion arc starts properly at the end of season 2. 21:56:46 WP gives f(x) is O(g(x)) iff |f(x)| <= M|g(x)| forall x>c. 21:56:50 ais523: i guess the confusion is because for things larger than O(1) you have an equivalent choice of _either_ using the "every x > x'" form _or_ adding a constant and saying it holds everywhere? 21:57:05 although you forgot the absolute value condition 21:57:08 So if c = 1, it's O(1). 21:57:19 and those obviously give different interpretations for O(1/n) 21:57:24 Phantom_Hoover: uh what 21:57:26 not at all 21:57:30 coppro, err, you're right. 21:57:35 if g(x) is constant 21:57:57 and f(x) is O(g(x)), then f(x) is also O(1) 21:58:18 Wait, yes. Forall x>1, 1/x<1. 21:58:20 new question -- are there any algorithms that are O(1/n)? 21:58:32 I think there are, but only ones that explicitly do a for loop up to 1/n :P 21:58:38 Phantom_Hoover: oh, you're saying 1/x is O(1) 21:58:38 yes 21:58:39 that is true 21:59:02 more generally, x^n is O(x^m) if n < m 21:59:06 *<= 21:59:14 coppro, not if you allow n to be arbitrarily close to 0. 21:59:21 ais523: however when you use O()-notation for things like Taylor series, you cannot just add constants (e.g. since you are taking limits with real numbers rather than a sequence) 21:59:33 Phantom_Hoover: huh? 21:59:40 sure 21:59:46 hmm, don't you *multiply* by constants though? 21:59:58 n^-10000000000000000 is O(1) 22:00:06 Pop quiz: How do you install Ubuntu on a machine that can't run unetbootin, doesn't have an optical drive, and without a USB drive to hand? 22:00:25 coppro, not if you allow n to be arbitrarily near 0! 22:00:37 Prizes offered for ansewrs. 22:00:40 elliott: grab a minimalist floppy with debbootstrap installed? 22:00:52 Phantom_Hoover: why not? 22:00:58 coppro: um ok this is a macbook air, it doesn't have an optical drive and it _certainly_ doesn't have a floppy drive :D 22:01:04 elliott: oh 22:01:07 coppro, because there's no upper bound to 1/x, x<0! 22:01:22 Phantom_Hoover: uh what 22:01:25 Sorry, x>0. 22:01:26 coppro: I'm thinking either netboot, or partition the drive, somehow write the Ubuntu CD to that drive, and boot from it 22:01:34 it's about asymptotic behavior, Phantom_Hoover 22:01:38 elliott: there's a windows-based installer 22:01:46 coppro: It's a Mac. It doesn't come with Windows either. 22:01:48 elliott: oh 22:01:53 coppro: also Wubi is beyond shit 22:01:54 elliott: hmm 22:01:56 it is the shittiest McShit of Shitville 22:01:58 coppro, wait, starting point isn't... OK, you're right. 22:01:59 oerjan: istr the thing you use for Taylor series is a different notation that just happens to look similar to O-notation but is actually completely different 22:02:04 elliott: can you repartition the drive safely? 22:02:10 coppro: yes, while it's booted no less 22:02:13 i think 22:02:22 elliott: just do that and have a VM run the CD 22:02:23 elliott: Hello, welcome to McDonalds, would you like to try our Shitty McShitville McShit? 22:02:26 elliott, ok 22:02:33 coppro: netbooting might actually work out in this case -- if I can install a netbooter without a CD. I think rEFIt might be able to do it? 22:02:36 Gregor: Yes. 22:02:37 Sgeo: What. 22:02:38 Sgeo, zuh? 22:02:39 coppro: No, no VMs. 22:02:46 coppro: VM hardware veeeeery different to Mac hardware. 22:02:50 Sgeo: btw, the Dominion arc starts properly at the end of season 2. 22:02:59 Sgeo: ah. 22:03:06 Sgeo, do you actually read books any more? 22:03:09 Also, I feel that ok was a proper response especially given that the previous line was about Erlang 22:03:09 elliott: Ubuntu installer doesn't care about hardware does it? 22:03:15 Phantom_Hoover, rarely 22:03:28 coppro: erm. i wouldn't trust it not to, especially since EFI is ~weirdcakes~ 22:03:30 elliott: and if it does, it should work well enough to dpkg-reconfigure everything 22:03:31 Sgeo, hmm. 22:03:32 and it installs bootloaders 22:03:45 elliott: oh yeah, forgot about bootloaders 22:03:57 I did read Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency a while ago 22:03:57 debbootstrap then and do the bootloader config manually 22:04:06 coppro will want me to read it again, iirc 22:04:12 yep 22:04:13 coppro: i don't like your solutions, i just want to get the actual cd booted, through any means :) 22:04:20 the actual installation I want to do with a native boot of the normal installer 22:04:24 elliott: fine. write the cd to partition then 22:04:36 coppro: I am not convinced that will work :D a USB image, maybe 22:04:45 plus can ubuntu install to the media it was booted off? 22:04:46 I doubt it 22:04:51 IIRC it's a pain to get it to do that 22:05:34 olsner: um i think the only difference with Taylor series is that you are taking the limit as you go to a particular real value rather than as you go to infinity 22:06:04 -!- pingveno has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 22:06:22 elliott: I don't think it's difficult at all 22:06:24 -!- pingveno has joined. 22:06:30 actually wait 22:06:38 a netboot is looking appealing at this point 22:06:44 no, you wouldn't be able to without massive trickery 22:06:45 erm, if i can netboot over wifi 22:06:52 glwt 22:07:03 -!- pingveno has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 22:07:04 coppro: well i've done similar things 22:07:08 coppro: involving lazy, forced unmounts 22:07:15 coppro: using unetbootin in its put-it-in-C:\ mode 22:07:26 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NetBoot WONDER IF I COULD USETHIS 22:08:20 * coppro is going to add the bias warning template 22:08:22 where is that template 22:08:41 coppro: to hwhat 22:08:53 *what 22:09:16 coppro: ? 22:09:48 elliott: that page you just linked 22:09:55 coppro: er why? 22:09:58 I don't see any bias 22:11:07 "core technology" 22:11:19 "technology from Apple" 22:11:24 -!- pingveno has joined. 22:11:27 coppro: you do realise that NetBoot is a proprietary Apple thing? 22:11:30 I do 22:11:30 note the capital B 22:11:35 so yes, it is from Apple 22:11:36 what's the issue 22:11:53 coppro: does it "read like an advertisement" solely because it doesn't have a huge Criticism section or something? 22:12:02 everything there is neutral and referenced 22:12:20 elliott: it doesn't seem neutral to me; if other disagree, wiki magic will remove that template and things will be well 22:13:05 but it, in my opinion, ought to read more like "NetBoot is a proprietary Apple implementation of network booting" or the like 22:13:25 coppro: that sounds less neutral than the current text. 22:14:12 elliott: in what way? 22:14:27 coppro: "proprietary" being the fourth word 22:14:43 NetBoot is Apple's implementation of network booting -- sure 22:14:43 And the first one that counts. 22:14:50 indeed 22:15:01 elliott: ok, dropping proprietary would be ok 22:15:22 I actually don't know enough about it to know if it's proprietary, I just said that because you did 22:15:47 i think the extensions to the protocol are proprietary 22:16:45 wonder if there's a usb stick lying around here 22:25:34 ais523: is there an #ubuntu-less-stupid? 22:26:13 no 22:26:50 why not, i have a question requiring actual though to answer 22:39:58 elliott, there is now. 22:40:12 There is? 22:40:27 elliott: you could try a channel at random 22:40:40 especially on freenode, ubuntu saturation may be high enough to find someone who knows 22:40:55 ais523: picked my channel, will ask a question now 22:40:59 hey guys! 22:41:01 anyone use ubuntu? 22:41:09 I want to write the Live CD/USB to a disk partition and boot that with e.g. GRUB 22:41:12 is this possible? if so, how? 22:41:16 ais523: am i doing it right? 22:41:54 22:41 itaylor57: Gartral: they arent flags just optiopns 22:41:57 --#ubuntu 22:43:16 Huh 22:43:27 Maybe the Bajoran-Cardassian stuff is interesting 22:43:33 (Just saw "Duet") 22:44:03 Of course it's interesting X-P 22:44:17 Sgeo, do you actually consume any non-mass-market SF? 22:44:18 I thought it would bore me 22:44:36 Phantom_Hoover: Does Star Trek count as mass-market really? 22:44:38 Phantom_Hoover, ... what does and does not count as mass-market? 22:44:39 It's pretty nerdy. 22:44:51 elliott, yes, but it counts in my book. 22:44:59 Phantom_Hoover: As what, mass-market? 22:45:05 Perhaps "mass-market" is the wrong word. 22:45:06 Phantom_Hoover: Yer not a HATER are ye?! 22:45:21 Does HHGG count as mass-market? 22:45:35 Wait, you've read Fine Structure. 22:45:37 Who the fuck says HHGG. 22:45:37 Does the SCP Foundation wiki? 22:45:44 HHGttG, yes. H2G2, eys. 22:45:45 *yes. 22:45:46 HHGG? 22:45:47 Which elliott has not, and as such he is inferior to sgeo. 22:45:58 Phantom_Hoover: I've read like 55% of it! 22:46:06 =P 22:46:11 ais523: your idea didn't work 22:46:16 elliott, the WRONG 55%! 22:50:00 Vorpal: you know how you mentioned using a native EFI bootloader? 22:50:11 Vorpal: apparently VTs don't work with that. or suspend/resume. or brightness control 22:56:54 Phantom_Hoover: It's your lucky day! You get to help me figure out my new partitioning scheme! 22:57:32 NOOOOOOOO 22:57:46 Phantom_Hoover: I NEED THREE PARTITIONS YO 22:57:58 Actually, wait. 22:58:10 What's the best partition format that both OS X and Linux can read? 22:58:51 FAT16. 22:59:01 Phantom_Hoover: Um, I would think that they can both read FAT32 at least. 22:59:04 In fact I know that for a fact. 23:03:52 Oh come on, surely someone is opinionated enough to partition my drive for me. 23:03:53 coppro! 23:05:25 elliott, partition it in a geometric series. 23:05:56 Phantom_Hoover: oijrt 23:05:57 x 23:06:08 ais523: why don't you partition my drive :P 23:06:09 elliott: I don't know 23:06:13 elliott, it's not that horrible an idea. 23:06:14 FAT32 will work though 23:07:55 Vorpal: apparently VTs don't work with that. or suspend/resume. or brightness control <-- wtf wtf and wtf 23:08:06 elliott, most wtf at the first thing though! 23:08:14 Vorpal: they stay black apparently 23:08:15 Vorpal: because the legacy bios support doesn't go on 23:08:19 Vorpal: so clearly linux's efi support SUCKS 23:08:23 elliott, quite 23:08:36 I can't figure out how to partition this drive though 23:08:46 256 GiB ... quite small since I need two partitions and then a shared one 23:08:57 elliott, well get an 1 TB SSD! 23:09:01 shared I think I'll go for ext2 or ext3, since there's a FUSE thing for ext2/ext3 designed for OS X 23:09:04 http://alperakcan.org/?open=projects&project=fuse-ext2 23:09:15 not sure if i can trust it 23:09:24 last release 0.0.7 in 2009 X-D 23:09:29 perhaps not 23:09:35 elliott, question: are there no insult-fights in MI2? 23:09:50 Vorpal: hm indeed 23:09:54 Vorpal: there are in MI3 though 23:09:56 and they rhyme 23:10:29 maybe ... 96 gig shared partition 23:10:31 oh 23:10:34 that only leaves 80 gigs per os 23:10:39 :( 23:11:04 elliott, I sing the joyful song of 1 TB disks in RAID 1 at this point! 23:11:24 :D 23:11:25 sing a song of sixpence 23:11:37 oerjan, err was this a pun of some sort? 23:11:41 -!- wareya has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 23:11:42 Vorpal: I'm fucking impressed that they can even fit 256 gigs into this thing :P 23:11:55 I keep turning it on its side trying to figure out the bulge where all the components are 23:11:58 IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE 23:12:34 Vorpal: a very cheap pun. at least i doubt you can get 1 TB disks for six pence 23:12:37 Vorpal: btw one really cool thing about os x is that you can resize the current booted OS partition 23:12:41 grow /and/ shrink 23:15:15 Vorpal: quick, how should i partition! 23:19:08 Vorpal: :| 23:19:44 elliott, IIRC there are some HFS things for Linux... 23:19:58 irrelevant 23:20:03 i just want actual partitioning advice at this point 23:20:32 os x size, ubuntu size, and shared size 23:21:41 -!- augur_ has changed nick to augur. 23:23:36 Phantom_Hoover: HA;LP 23:24:55 Phantom_Hoover: 256 gigs give me three numbers 23:25:55 clearly this requires a salomonic judgement. i hear he was good at partitioning. 23:26:00 elliott, I don't know about partitioning! 23:26:06 Phantom_Hoover: Let me restate. 23:26:08 My partition table is HORRIFIC! 23:26:11 Phantom_Hoover: How many gigs should I give to OS X. 23:26:15 How many gigs should I give to Ubuntu. 23:26:18 How many gigs should I give to shared. 23:26:29 elliott, 25%, 25%, 50%? 23:26:44 Oh, wait, you aren't meant to use the whole disk, 23:26:48 Phantom_Hoover: That gives a whopping 64 gigs for each OS ... waay to smal. 23:26:49 *small. 23:26:50 And what? 23:26:53 I want to use the entire disk. 23:27:07 OK. 1/8th for each OS, and the rest to shared. 23:27:16 Phantom_Hoover: ...dude. 23:27:29 Phantom_Hoover: You are telling me to give 32 gigs to each OS. 23:27:33 80 gigs is more reasonable. 23:27:47 Maybe 72. 23:27:48 Not 32. 23:27:53 elliott, WELL I DON'T KNOW 23:27:57 PAH 23:28:31 You might as well ask Sgeo for help with... anything. 23:29:01 Sgeo, incidentally, what in god's name are you wearing in your Facebook profile picture? 23:29:08 Maybe 72 for both OSes, and 112 for shared. 23:29:13 It looks like you just came from a furry convention. 23:29:28 oh god mental image stop it 23:29:53 Hmm. I've currently used 34 gigs on this OS X partition and I barely have anything on it. 23:30:19 Yeah, OS X seems to take up *way* too much space. 23:30:49 Perhaps 96 (OS X) + 64 (Ubuntu), leaving 96 for the shared partition. 23:32:47 -!- MigoMipo has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 23:35:02 Vorpal: quick, how should i partition! <-- 10 GB for OS X, rest for linux 23:35:16 Vorpal: you do realise that even a base os x install is >10gigs? 23:35:33 this thing is 3 days old and its os x partition is 34 gig used 23:35:42 Vorpal: also i want a shared partition 23:36:55 elliott, did you check the usage when you got it? 23:37:13 No. But I've barely added anything. 23:39:45 Phantom_Hoover, why are you looking at my Facebook profile? 23:39:47 I just found the worst Useless Use Of Cat ever: cat a >> file; cat b >> file; cat c >> file; cat d >> file; 23:39:51 Also: Part of a blood drop suit 23:39:53 Sgeo, curiosity...? 23:40:03 Was volunteering at a blood drive at my school 23:40:14 variable: brilliant 23:40:22 Vorpal: you do realise that even a base os x install is >10gigs? <-- ah, uh 23:40:30 variable, that's not for real is it. 23:40:30 variable: and I say that as an *advocate* for useless uses of cat :) 23:40:32 elliott, how much more than 10 GB? 23:40:34 It's for real, isn't it. 23:40:40 Phantom_Hoover, yes 23:40:40 Vorpal: I do actually plan to use this occasionally. 23:40:46 this thing is 3 days old and its os x partition is 34 gig used <--- what the fucking thing 23:40:54 Vorpal: To be fair, it also has iLife installed. 23:40:58 elliott, 60 GB to OS X? 23:40:58 variable, please show me that script. 23:41:04 http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs941.snc4/73456_489504182743_618027743_7473878_3043494_n.jpg 23:41:07 Vorpal: More like 72 to 96 gigs. 23:41:15 Vorpal: Ubuntu should be fine on 64 to 72 gigs. Rest can go to shared. 23:41:25 elliott, well don't ask me if you don't want to get an answer! 23:41:30 Sgeo, what an odd furry costume. 23:41:34 Vorpal: I don't want an answer that's unworkable :P 23:41:39 Sgeo: What animal is that. 23:42:24 looks like a strawberry to me 23:42:32 (no not an amimal indeed!) 23:42:36 animal* 23:43:30 I have this Ubuntu I've been using a while, it's taking a bit less than 10 jiggabytes, discounting /home. (Just as another point of data.) 23:43:49 Phantom_Hoover, http://pastebin.com/Z3nFQBfk 23:44:26 fizzie: Counting home in this case. 23:44:32 fizzie: A lot of things will be shared but not all. 23:44:52 elliott: Er, well, my /home is 315G, so that's not a helpful data point for you, I think. 23:44:53 Phantom_Hoover, he asked me why it doesn't work 23:44:55 :-\ 23:44:56 variable: the kind of code only a python programmer could write 23:45:03 variable: love the duplicated list-contrib lines 23:45:10 note lines 18-20 23:45:16 The kind of face only a Python programmer could love. 23:45:16 fizzie: Well, yes, indeed. 23:45:38 fizzie: "If they had offered a terabyte SSD..." 23:47:22 ...they would have asked a lot of money for it. 23:47:30 fizzie: They already asked a lot of money. 23:48:11 Prelude> let x = 0/0 23:48:11 Prelude> x == x 23:48:12 False 23:48:13 augur: *cry* 23:48:26 whats wrong elliott 23:48:30 augur: ^ 23:48:35 WHY HASKELL WHY 23:48:41 did the mean GHCi do bad things to you 23:48:44 nan is unequal to everything including itself, what's the problem? :) 23:48:53 show me on the doll where simon peyton jones touched you 23:49:00 olsner: IEEEE CANNOT OVERRIDE THE LAWS OF MATHEMATICS 23:49:03 EQ HAS *RULES* DAMMIT 23:49:07 YOU ARE BREAKING THEM PRELUDE 23:49:10 BAD PRELUDE 23:49:11 BAD! 23:49:36 those "laws of mathematics" should be saying something about not holding when dividing by zero 23:49:50 olsner: obviously that doesnt matter 23:49:55 for all x, x == x. 23:49:58 what augur said 23:50:03 0/0 shouldn't be a valid program, but if it is 23:50:08 then it'd better return a meaningful result 23:50:09 this is simply true regardless of anything 23:50:09 btiches 23:50:11 *valid expression 23:50:16 augur: SURE THING AYN RAND 23:50:19 omg 23:50:23 ayn rand would have hated floating point 23:50:26 can you believe it 23:50:27 I SAID FORALL X NOT FORALL A 23:50:28 GOSH 23:50:32 she'd write books on the evil of floating point 23:50:34 that would be amazing 23:50:38 wouldn't that be amazing? 23:50:40 that would be so amazing 23:51:23 elliott, I think I once said that to an Objectivist at my school. 23:51:33 Phantom_Hoover: I ... doubt he got it 23:51:35 *they 23:52:09 elliott, he didn't. 23:52:11 i dont D: 23:52:21 augur, NaN != NaN 23:52:22 augur: lolz A=A this is basis of philosophy because i am smart 23:52:28 augur: nan != nan bitches 23:52:31 augur: WAAAAAAR 23:52:51 oh is that true about float? lol 23:52:56 I still have no idea what the hell the "A is A" thing is meant to mean. 23:53:09 Phantom_Hoover: yOU ARE YOURSELF AND NO OTHER SELF;;;;ERGO TAXES IS THEFT 23:53:16 Phantom_Hoover: all things are self-identical 23:53:26 Phantom_Hoover: I think it's meant to be like ... uh ... you are yourself, and you are not anyone else, so you have your own existence and consciousness and mind 23:53:34 and are therefore morally obligated only to yourself 23:53:34 or something 23:53:40 it's objectivism man 23:53:42 it makes no fucking sense 23:53:43 why bother 23:53:58 i hereby accuse augur of being a smelly objectivist 23:54:10 hey im not smelly! :( 23:54:14 I accuse augur of not knowing about smelly objectivists. 23:54:17 nor an objectivist but 23:55:35 http://dis.4chan.org/read/prog/1293725159/30 is it a sign of mental retardation if i can't stop moving my cursor around with the dot? 23:55:40 wheeeeee 23:57:36 I hate books about godels theorem 23:57:47 nobody except godel should be allowed to say anything about it 23:57:58 hah 23:58:02 j-invariant: :D 23:58:29 j-invariant, GEB? 23:58:40 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ExFAT 23:58:41 lol what 23:58:47 Phantom_Hoover: GEB is ... not a good book. 23:58:54 Phantom_Hoover: firewooh 23:58:55 d 23:59:02 GEB is ok 23:59:03 elliott, I know that! 23:59:22 j-invariant, paper doesn't burn too well. 23:59:31 it certainly shouldn't be considered a good math book 23:59:41 or a math book period