< 1291248078 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Sasha2 was implying that the light pollution from our spectral wipe-out would prevent us from spotting incoming aliens. dark sky communities allow us to at least spot them on the visible spectrum at night. < 1291248094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think he was implying that we couldn't see them < 1291248096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Sasha2 imagines an alien race that sees that spectrum wiping us out because of light pollution < 1291248099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just that they'd wipe us out. < 1291248162 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I was implying that if an alien race could see them < 1291248169 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they may attempt to explode us < 1291248173 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for light pollution < 1291248413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right. < 1291248417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so not that we couldn't see them. < 1291248497 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION likes the thought of GTK+ or Qt being an option in a program < 1291248507 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just set this preference, the program switches < 1291248571 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291248753 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, down? < 1291248759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Seems so. < 1291248768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: that is the stupidest thing ever < 1291248770 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I was falling in a boat while it happened < 1291248774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "Well, I won't rent whole layers, most likely. Do you have any idea how big 128x128 is?" < 1291248781 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, result: flying dutchman < 1291248783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1291248798 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have no fucking clue what will happen when I reconnect < 1291248806 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, probably loss of boat at the very least < 1291248811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The bottom few floors will be obsidian-bordered (eventually) and be for a post-apocalyptic scenario; supplies and such to build the world outside. After all, where is more secure than in the sea, bordered by obsidian, at the very bottom of the map, with bedrock? < 1291248816 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and I answered "yes" < 1291248836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The top floor will be... I don't know, something snazzy. Indeed, though, floor 0 will be fun. < 1291248850 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also my mines cover more than 128x128x2 considering amount of cobblestone < 1291248865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although you'll enter it from the regular sea-level ground at floor -(small); there'll be a tunnel with stairs going just below sea level, and then a short walk to a hole in a low-numbered below-sea floor. < 1291248868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you can go up if you wish. < 1291248879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There will also be a lower-down minecart startion, and a skyway connection higher up. < 1291248931 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'll probably establish an embassy there if it ever gets done < 1291248940 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also up again < 1291248963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Do you know how big the grid of large chests are? < 1291248970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it 2x the grid of small chests? (And what's that?) < 1291248976 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You see, I need to store 81 thousand pieces of something... < 1291248977 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 2x yes < 1291248979 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and not sure < 1291249013 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you need a boatlevator in that thing from top to bottom < 1291249038 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, measurements: 2x3 shaft, and 5 spaces away a 2x2 shaft < 1291249043 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I was planning on just having a straight staircase that makes you turn around whenever it reaches a wall, and a multi-width ladder all the way. < 1291249045 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, some extra space needed at bottom < 1291249049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Boatlevators seem... unreliable. < 1291249057 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, they are faster, and quite reliable for me. < 1291249067 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is just everyone else that can't ride mine < 1291249080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So they're hard to use. :p < 1291249082 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I guess they are trying to stear the boat or something < 1291249086 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is just very very wrong < 1291249089 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never stear the boat < 1291249093 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and exit behind it < 1291249105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's hard to avoid steering it... < 1291249114 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do not touch arrow keys < 1291249116 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while in the boat < 1291249122 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that way you don't stear it < 1291249125 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :steer* < 1291249135 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1291249137 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wasd < 1291249138 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not arrows < 1291249219 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1291249386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: Can I have a /tp ehird BCxVAhxWQxi? < 1291249565 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1291249583 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm weird < 1291250287 0 :augur!~augur@208.58.6.161 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291250845 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh look, I just fixed a broken test case in Newspeak < 1291250854 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is fun! < 1291250926 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hits whoever wrote these tests for using ~= < 1291251186 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291251273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "Additionally, when Water is placed inside a "+" shaped pillar, the player can still interact with the water through the northwest indent of the "+". This allows a pillar of water to act as an elevator much quicker than a descending waterfall, as the downward motion of the water inside the pillar has no effect. The ascension rate is comparable to ladders at a lower cost, as one only needs a bucket and some building material. It is interes < 1291251273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ting to note that if a block is removed from the pillar, exposing the water, the downward pull will slow the player's ascent for the next few blocks." < 1291251301 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, huh < 1291251324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm still not sure where to place The Cube. < 1291251329 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, issue with that however is that you will be inside the water < 1291251335 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not partly inside it < 1291251441 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, down? < 1291251493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems so < 1291251503 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXW0bx_Ooq4 < 1291251620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I love that video. < 1291251655 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love that Chrysler actually made that video. < 1291251691 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, up but I disconnected < 1291251794 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXW0bx_Ooq4 <-- what, that is so much jargon I have no clue about < 1291251809 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, is it technobabel? < 1291251810 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are four languages in the current Newspeak prototype < 1291251814 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :technobable* < 1291251823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, it's technology. < 1291251824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Duh. < 1291251825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Simple stuff. < 1291251829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a turbo encabulator. < 1291251842 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I never heard of that :P < 1291251882 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yeah, it's a turboëncabulator. It supplies inverse reactive current for use in unilateral phase detractors, and automatically synchronises cardinal grammeters. < 1291251889 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Subclasses of Language: < 1291251903 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, indeed pure technobabel < 1291251911 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NewsqueakLanguage0 NewsqueakLanguage1 NewsqueakLanguage2 SmalltalkLanguage < 1291251944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Stop looking at Newspeak right now; close every relevant window. < 1291251945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thank you. < 1291251950 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why? < 1291251982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Because I said so. < 1291252001 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, besides the youngness, is there a good reason not to like Newspeak? < 1291252017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I said so. < 1291252026 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, anyway it became blatantly apparent during the diagnosis part that it was a joke < 1291252070 0 :Leonidas_!~Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1291252079 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The bit about running additional tests that serve to increase billable hours is a dead giveaway, isn't it? < 1291252079 0 :Leonidas_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Leonidas < 1291252160 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, that and some other things < 1291252185 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, such as "for the purposes of obscurity we have removed the casing" < 1291252243 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, or the bit that any systems faults would be displayed in secret code < 1291252275 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, also "manual and songbook" < 1291252298 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also that a Geiger scale would be involved :P < 1291252353 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, and further the bit about what would be covered in the next month :P < 1291252394 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291252398 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, but the first part I could only catch because I realised that was too much jargon :P < 1291252403 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ponders a possible fix for a certain annoyance < 1291252560 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1291252640 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Hint: the jargon is meaningless. < 1291252673 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, indeed I realise that < 1291252688 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, "dingle arm" is an inherently hilarious phrase. < 1291252701 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, but I'm no car expert so it took me a a few tens of of seconds to figure out what was going on :P < 1291252861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know nothing about cars but it's obvious < 1291252862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye < 1291252863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1291253211 0 :sftp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291253303 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I remember reading about a Swedish company that manufactured screws got strange results on a 1 April joke ad < 1291253311 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wikiwalks in Newspeak < 1291253347 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, basically they made an ad for stuff like T-shaped screws and dual-head screws for extra torque. On 1 April one year during the 1970s or so < 1291253362 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, they actually got phoned by people who tried to seriously order these "products" < 1291253383 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a few days after < 1291253403 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, fun eh? < 1291253422 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both T-shaped and double-headed screws have legitimate uses, and the former most certainly exists. < 1291253531 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, not the way these were done :P < 1291253552 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, it was like a screw that split into two part way up like an actual T < 1291253563 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okidoke :P < 1291253574 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291253575 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah :P < 1291253585 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, and the dual head one looked like: < 1291253586 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :- - < 1291253587 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| | < 1291253587 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-+- < 1291253587 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : | < 1291253594 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(best viewed with mono-space) < 1291253606 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I don't think that would work < 1291253642 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, also I believe they had a flexible screw. and a few more that I don't remember < 1291253648 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hyuk < 1291253654 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, "hyuk"? < 1291253659 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup. < 1291253664 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that mean < 1291253670 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It means "hyuk" < 1291253674 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1291253683 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, and can you explain what "hyuk" means < 1291253701 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Hyuk" is a folksy laugh :P < 1291253702 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, or was "yup" the translation? < 1291253705 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291253706 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1291253745 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, anyway what would a "real" t-shaped screw be? < 1291253763 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just a screw with a T-shaped end opposite the screw proper. < 1291253782 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, oh you mean the shape that the screwdriver fits into? < 1291253783 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1291253801 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, well this was indeed... More literal < 1291255459 0 :cal153!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291255710 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291256066 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291256102 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291256857 0 :mtve!~mtve@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291257401 0 :Goosey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it bad to have fun with trolling? < 1291258167 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1291258196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Insomnia... < 1291258253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: how did nailor do his underwater thing? < 1291258424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: "On behalf of Google and the University of Waterloo Computer Science Club, we would like to thank everybody who took part in the Google AI Challenge." < 1291258434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, it's your challenge < 1291258434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1291258829 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: perdito < 1291259346 0 :perdito!~perdito@koln-4d0b79b2.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291259376 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION submits a bug report < 1291260144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://iphone-chieftain.blogspot.com/2009/04/tweetsheet-10-released.html twitter client implemented in excel < 1291260571 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Welp, time to kill myself. < 1291260581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: what < 1291260599 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Twitter in excel = time to end it all < 1291260609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: no this is like a new age in human existence < 1291260626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:38:14 Gregor: 14:53:14 * GregorR-W doesn't even know what tldr means :P < 1291260626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:38:14 14:53:51 heh, I had to look that one up too < 1291260626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:38:14 14:54:36 Too Long Didn't Read? < 1291260626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:38:14 14:54:38 XD < 1291260627 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes. The time without me. < 1291260633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: are you ashamed of 2006 you < 1291260634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would be < 1291260640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bet he didn't even like dinosaur comics < 1291260671 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly he liked reading. < 1291260680 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since he didn't understand what it was for something to be too long to read. < 1291260686 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Therefore, he probably liked Dinosaur Comics. < 1291260693 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But then, we'll never know; he's dead now. < 1291260696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: dude you blew my mind. < 1291260703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: well um, you recommended hextris in 2006 < 1291260707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's why my brain exploded < 1291260707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1291260709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i blame you < 1291260715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :09:06:37 23:49:05 I love how devfs survived for like a year :-P < 1291260715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :09:06:37 23:49:34 yeah, what was wrong with it? worked for me < 1291260715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :09:06:37 23:50:04 I really don't know. < 1291260715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :09:06:37 23:50:08 Always worked great for me. < 1291260730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: we can clearly see here your ignorance of linux kernel maintenance practices < 1291260743 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm still ignorant of Linux kernel maintenance practices. < 1291260745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: namely, that any system replacing another system is accepted IFF it is more pointlessly flexible and complex < 1291260747 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite intentionally. < 1291260758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: and that putting XML into the kernel is never a bad thing (see HAL) < 1291260768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: those are the entire set of rules, actually < 1291260770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: wait, there's one more < 1291260776 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: IIRC, there was a time between devfs and udev when it was back to flat /dev. < 1291260778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: nobody must do *anything* to make the experience nicer for desktop users < 1291260795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because... because fuck you, we don't want the day of the linux desktop < 1291260801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: heh, static dev? < 1291260806 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oldskoooool < 1291260825 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thereby invalidating your point ... < 1291260836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: no, a mere historical anomaly < 1291260841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just average the slope out, man < 1291260842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: devfs is back in the kernel now, it's called devtmpfs, it runs on tmpfs, and they snuck it in by saying it provides an environment for an initramfs before udev is loaded < 1291260850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: i fully intend to use it and nothing else in Kitten :) < 1291260858 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lollercopters < 1291260874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: the reactions were varied < 1291260876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Lol, devfs." --Andrew Morton < 1291260881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and uh < 1291260884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Lol, devfs." --Andrew Morton again < 1291260890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(actual direct quote, although he only said it once) < 1291260910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: have you ever looked at /etc/udev < 1291260911 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is quite a sight < 1291260946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Found a non-GNU binutils yet? :P < 1291260986 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Haven't even looked :P < 1291261011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: looks like i will be using uClibc anyway, so that's a vaguely gnu-infested (some code copied from glibc) component < 1291261028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: and, well, i do have to use gcc to compile kernel and uClibc itself < 1291261035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i should be able to use pcc for most other things < 1291261036 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yeahyeah, I get it, you lurve blowing the Gnu. < 1291261044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: i dont man its a hard fuckin life < 1291261051 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D < 1291261062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: i did get a pcc/dietlibc toolchain fully self-bootstrapped, but dietlibc is probably too opinionated with anything :P < 1291261076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1291261078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: i did get a pcc/dietlibc toolchain fully self-bootstrapped, but dietlibc is probably too opinionated to use with with anything :P < 1291261080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*with < 1291261147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: i mean... patches welcome y'all < 1291261163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I seem to have found a coreutils in busybox, even if busybox has bits of lameness < 1291261235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: man if you want a non-gnu linux you're gonna have to work for it that involves TALKIN man < 1291261254 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't want one, I just want to see one :P < 1291261255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or do you want to let linux distros fellate rms UNTIL THE END OF TIME???? < 1291261259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: see one, yes, but < 1291261263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: YOU HAVE TO WORK TOWARDS IT < 1291261331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: ur motivation reaches all-time lowz < 1291261376 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I click a button and stupidly don't change the stupid default, deleting the result should not cause a crash < 1291261421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SHUT UP I'M TIRED ENOGUH WITHUOUT YOU < 1291261425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor is dead to me now < 1291261455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: this could be you http://i.imgur.com/iCDrN.png < 1291261478 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the Gnu just rolls over and grumbles when he's done with elliott; they never /talk/ any more. < 1291261492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know its like our relationship has reached a plateau of hate < 1291261505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i fear that every move will only send me down a slippery slope < 1291261509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its why im tryin to get out man < 1291261512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its why im tryin to break free < 1291261540 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The persistent interspecies pedophilic rape isn't part of it? < 1291261590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: no, i blame 4chan for that < 1291261658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1291261660 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1291261675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: does xorg build with non-gcc i wonder < 1291261695 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It certainly did in the 7.0 days < 1291261707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: what compiler? < 1291261716 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SunPRO < 1291261722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pcc is kind of old and crusty and it's nice and it's learning these C99 ways, but sometimes it falls down and can't get up and what why would you even do that < 1291261723 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or whatever bizarre name that compiler has/had. < 1291261725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what would possess you to do that < 1291261727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you monster < 1291261733 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Intel :P < 1291261748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: even if i didn't have a handy checklist of reasons not to buy intel < 1291261749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: that < 1291261751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: that would convince me. < 1291261758 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D < 1291261767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: how many babies did they rape and then grind up to use in chips, i mean in an average day < 1291261767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just < 1291261770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rough estimate here < 1291261835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: oh and i kinda need gcc for C++ < 1291261839 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, judging by the trucks, assuming maybe 250 per truck (average weight, stacked) I'd say about 1,250/day. Assuming they were in cages in the trucks, they could have really only fit maybe 80, making a much more conservative ~400/day < 1291261846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: getting llvm/clang working with static linking is like on my list of things that are "not" fun, as in not fun < 1291261866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: however the only C++ thing i want to ship is like, webkit :) < 1291261871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and openjdk or whatever, to run minecraft. < 1291261889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: they didn't use cages in fact they dehydrated the babies furst, what's the term < 1291261899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like when you get tried fruit or, what they make concentrate juice from < 1291261900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :taking out all the water < 1291261902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they did that to babies. < 1291261906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and packed them < 1291261911 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Concentrated. < 1291261916 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I don't think so. < 1291261917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1291261920 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least, not judging by the screams. < 1291261929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: they rehydrated them before the process moron < 1291261938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wikileaks confirms it < 1291261948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wikileaks and netcraft merged ) < 1291261963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"IAmA former smoker, quit one year ago today, and YOU SHOULD QUIT SMOKING TODAY!" < 1291261964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't smoke < 1291261965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idiot < 1291261992 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Then you'll have to start, so you can QUIT TODAY. < 1291262004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i approve of this idea < 1291262009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do severe chain smokers get through < 1291262010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :40 a day? < 1291262012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll work towards it < 1291262019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quit on the 39th < 1291262026 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/40/40 packs/ < 1291262034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: really?? < 1291262038 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No :P < 1291262042 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I wouldn't be surprised by 10. < 1291262050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: see i believed you there you destroyed my trust < 1291262058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: i think ill break up with you too < 1291262071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Boy, 2, Smokes Two Packs a Day" < 1291262078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hardcore mfer < 1291262093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"He cries and throws tantrums when we don't let him smoke. He's addicted," his father, Mohammad Rizal, says. < 1291262095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1291262101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think there is a clear sourec of blame going on here < 1291262105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like i mean < 1291262109 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291262112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think its hard for your baby to go out on the streets and smoke cigarettes < 1291262115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you sort of have to give him one i think < 1291262117 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: can you confirm this < 1291262139 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the US, Barney advertises for Marlboro. < 1291262174 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: <3 you have to make that now < 1291262176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be amazing < 1291262179 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT IN SOVIETY RUSSIA < 1291262187 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MARLBORO ADVERTISES FOR BAAAARNEY < 1291262204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soviety russia < 1291262206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that kind of < 1291262207 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Soviet Russia, Object Verb Subject! < 1291262208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not soviet russia < 1291262210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just soviet..y < 1291262211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :similar to soviets < 1291262213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sovietesque < 1291262216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not soviet in and of itself < 1291262217 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mohammed Rizal seemed unconcerned. < 1291262217 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"He looks pretty healthy to me. I don't see the problem," he said. < 1291262217 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/lifestyle/health/2010/05/26/2010-05-26_video_tragic_toddler_ardi_rizal_has_twopackaday_cigarette_habit.html#ixzz16vIwvOyv < 1291262219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :confirm/deny augur < 1291262224 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU WEIRD JAVASCRIPT < 1291262304 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: deny < 1291262312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: what why < 1291262317 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soviety is a type because t and y are close together < 1291262318 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OR < 1291262326 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its indicative of palatalization on the t < 1291262328 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TAKE YOUR PICK < 1291262351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: yur a horrible erpson < 1291262381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DONKEY < 1291262382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MOTHERFUCKING < 1291262383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :KONG < 1291262502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://www.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/009695399/basedefs/xbd_chap08.html look at the end, the specification of TZ; looks like you can define DST and stuff in $TZ itself < 1291262507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so all I need is like < 1291262516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/share/timezones/uk < 1291262517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to have the right thing < 1291262519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can just do < 1291262523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ln -s /share/timezones/uk /etc/tz < 1291262574 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1291262632 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happens if I want to do implicit logarithmic differentiation of, say, y = -4x < 1291262653 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ln y = ln -4x = (ln -4) + (ln x) < 1291262669 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/y dy/dx = 1/x < 1291262676 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dy/dx = y/x = x/x = 1 < 1291262693 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm too tired aren't I < 1291262722 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... it's not a problem with the negatives < 1291262727 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a problem with my thinking < 1291262742 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where's the problem with my thinking?'' < 1291262773 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION facepalms < 1291262783 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y/x = -4x/x < 1291262856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note to self: look into doing something like inbetween anarchy golf and all those project euler, sphere online judge things except realtime'd. because why go outside to BATTLE PROGRAM < 1291263073 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Sooo. TZ is much more flexible than tzdata. < 1291263098 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes, just more manual. I have a feeling tzdata might be an extremely old, pre-TZ way of mapping names to things like this. :p < 1291263111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: So basically I can just maintain a set of common timezones and everyone else can just write their own fucking string. < 1291263132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: (I could also see about extracting them from the typical tz database if I decide to be crazy.) < 1291263154 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You could just parse it from the file they compile *into* the tz database. < 1291263166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Right. < 1291263186 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, not "the typical" one. It's *the* tz database. http://www.twinsun.com/tz/tz-link.htm < 1291263255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I just said "the typical" to avoid ambiguity with the "TZ" name of the environment variable. < 1291263270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[To use the database on an extended POSIX implementation set the TZ environment variable to the location's full name, e.g., TZ="America/New_York".]] < 1291263273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, that violates POSIX. < 1291263280 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why yes, yes it does. < 1291263282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TZ has to start with a : to be treated in an implementation-dependent way rather than the TZ specification. < 1291263310 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moral of the story: nothing is POSIXly correct. < 1291263366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: POSIX is kind of a useless standard, based on a status quo that doesn't exist, specifying nothing. < 1291263373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's only useful as a reference manual. < 1291263391 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would at least be useful if everyone tried to follow it. < 1291263406 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oh man, these files are painfully complex. < 1291263408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ftp://elsie.nci.nih.gov/pub/tzdata2010o.tar.gz < 1291263417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rule Uruguay 2005 only - Oct 9 2:00 1:00 S < 1291263417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rule Uruguay 2006 only - Mar 12 2:00 0 - < 1291263418 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As it is, it specifies the "platonic ideal UNIX". < 1291263421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rule Uruguay 2006 max - Oct Sun>=1 2:00 1:00 S < 1291263421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rule Uruguay 2007 max - Mar Sun>=8 2:00 0 - < 1291263423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zone America/Montevideo -3:44:44 - LMT 1898 Jun 28 < 1291263423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -3:44:44 - MMT 1920 May 1 # Montevideo MT < 1291263424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -3:30 Uruguay UY%sT 1942 Dec 14 # Uruguay Time < 1291263424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -3:00 Uruguay UY%sT < 1291263429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't want to parse that, dude. < 1291263436 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION vomits < 1291263455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: [[Numeric time zone abbreviations typically count hours east of UTC, e.g., +09 for Japan and -10 for Hawaii. However, the POSIX TZ environment variable uses the opposite convention. For example, one might use TZ="JST-9" and TZ="HST10" for Japan and Hawaii, respectively.]] < 1291263471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: POSIX: Oh, we know of your world standard. We decided it wasn't logical enough and replaced it. < 1291263471 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that's just oldschool brain damage. < 1291263731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, let's try this sleep thing again. < 1291263743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: If I can get uClibc compiled, maybe this Kitten thing will actually happen soon. :p < 1291263752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps it shall be a Christmas present of pain, suffering and difficult installation. < 1291263754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1291263834 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION makes a prediction: elliott wins the world record for failure to sleep, and then passes out of exhaustion. < 1291263848 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and by the end of it RAINBOW PONIES < 1291266160 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION randomly modifies the Newspeak IDE < 1291266186 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1291266190 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Works as expected < 1291266198 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But as expected is not as useful as I want < 1291266414 0 :Goosey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm < 1291266425 0 :Goosey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just found out this kid I hit the other day brought a gun to school < 1291266434 0 :Goosey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He had cocaine on him too. < 1291266482 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION makes it more useful < 1291266533 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My IDE modification, not the cocaine < 1291266603 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: In some fashion, remind me that I have simple but awesome changes in SelectorPresenter < 1291266732 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just need to pretty it up a bit < 1291266943 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Did you know? It's 12:14:55 am. Go get some rest!" < 1291267077 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-1176440744.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1291269017 0 :Goosey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291269108 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.50.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291269565 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Poor, poor Kingdom of the Netherlands. < 1291269572 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has 3 distinct currencies. < 1291269665 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It occurs to me that with Smalltalk, Factor, and now Newspeak, I have attempted to make a contribution to the language < 1291269680 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Euro in the Netherlands, Netherlands Antillean guilder in the BES Islands, Curaçao and Sint Maarten, and Aruban florin in Aruba. < 1291269688 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Um, "language" is the wrong word) < 1291269697 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, the nation's currency is dependent on *which part of it you're in*. < 1291269777 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Granted, everything but the Netherlands itself is one of several small islands, not physically contiguous at all, but hey. It's still crazy. < 1291269847 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for those confused: the Kingdom of the Netherlands has a similar setup to the UK, in that it's a monarchy over several constituent countries which form a single nation.) < 1291270583 0 :sftp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291271823 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Huh. Apparently Linux's filesystem handling is such that processes can have a private set of mount points. < 1291271836 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is to say, much like Plan 9, Linux offers per-process namespaces. < 1291271843 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know of nothing that actually uses this *at all*. < 1291272128 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIDI breath controllers: Too - damned - expensive. < 1291272272 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My God. One could actually pretty much *have* Plan 9 just by replacing the Linux userspace. < 1291272408 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eggnog is so delicious < 1291272409 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, coming from you, that's saying something. I think. < 1291272466 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ... I'm cheap. < 1291272546 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. That'd take a bit of doing for some of the really nice bits of Plan 9. < 1291272566 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(making a cluster by union mounting the /proc of a few different systems together, for instance) < 1291272644 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Installing Mercurial apparently causes Newspeak to automatically use it < 1291272652 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION should bother at some point < 1291273141 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291273314 0 :FireFly|n900!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291274431 0 :FireFly|n900!~n900@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1291275080 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1291276395 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291276799 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1291276800 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1291276909 0 :MigoMipo!~John@62.119.155.253 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291277970 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1291279223 0 :perdito!~perdito@koln-4d0b7407.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291279701 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291280857 0 :FireFly|n900!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1291280876 0 :nopseudoidea!~nopseudoi@85-168-235-235.rev.numericable.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1291280904 0 :MigoMipo!~John@62.119.155.253 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291280953 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291281143 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291281159 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291281211 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah, the hard part of adminning #esoteric is occasionally I have to check twice whether something's spam or not < 1291281231 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, someone adds a random sequence of letters and punctuation to the hello world list, is that spam or an esoprogram? < 1291281252 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's easy to tell, generally, but requires concious thought, I can't let spamfighting go on mental automatic) < 1291281286 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291281567 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dreamt i was playing minecraft on the esoserver < 1291281588 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and dying meant being banned forever < 1291281705 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway there were these areas that were apparently "close to hell" where destroying a block might start a chain reaction that opened up this huge hole on the ground, and you had to run for your lives < 1291281706 0 :FireFly|n900!~n900@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1291281727 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then the elf in my party had a lesbian relationship with her twin or clone or whatever < 1291282016 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also in the world, islands weren't separated by water, but by emptiness, with only a bridge of sparsely distributed single blocks you could jump on to get across, i was sent to build a proper bridge across of these, alone, and my father told me i shouldn't go into the cave without torches because of all the foxes. < 1291282039 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and because it's particularly hard to use electricity in that particular cave... i had no idea what he was talking about < 1291283283 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : and then the elf in my party had a lesbian relationship with her twin or clone or whatever <-- err < 1291283320 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, weird dream < 1291283556 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: how did nailor do his underwater thing? <-- before health < 1291283586 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also iirc he first did top down and got horrible streams, I helped fix those. then the rest he built top down < 1291283604 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but since you don't plan to have water above the thingy you will build, that shouldn't be a problem < 1291283642 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err the rest he built bottom up I meant < 1291283647 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also I believe he kept moving a dirt barrier forward when he built it bottom-uå < 1291283649 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :up* < 1291283672 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :generally everything has sex with everything in my dreams < 1291283680 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, weird < 1291283721 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i make things have sex whenever i have lucid moments, and my dreams are usually half-lucid < 1291283734 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that i "kinda" know they are dreams < 1291284865 0 :atrapado!~rodrigo@193.144.79.241 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291286126 0 :MigoMipo!~John@62.119.155.253 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291286452 0 :nopseudoidea!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Quitte < 1291286730 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1291287151 0 :perdito!~perdito@koln-d9329cfe.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291288192 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote i make things have sex whenever i have lucid moments, and my dreams are usually half-lucid < 1291288220 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, a bridge of sparsely distributed single blocks sounds like every platform game ever < 1291288226 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially over emptiness < 1291288230 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what color was the emptiness? < 1291288251 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or was color not a property it had? I find in my dreams, at least, many objects don't have properties you'd naturally expect them to have) < 1291288277 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: blueish. < 1291288282 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bright blueish < 1291288313 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :266| i make things have sex whenever i have lucid moments, and my dreams are usually half-lucid < 1291288364 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i luv this chan < 1291288369 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1291288387 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hmm, likely one of the Mario games then < 1291288416 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't recall objects not having properties, but they certainly have properties they usually couldn't have, like being really scary, or "proving something", a property normal objects can't have, if they actually prove something, it's on an intellectual level, not emotional, although in tv series it does happen, since you sometimes aren't really following the technobabble, but you get that "oh my god that table has a *scratch* on it!" < 1291288481 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know while I'm dreaming I don't notice all sorts of logical inconsistencies, I just assume that's the way the world works < 1291288499 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, I'm remarkably unsuspicious while asleep, it helps to stop me noticing I'm asleep and waking up < 1291288571 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i tend to check i'm awake every now and then, when i'm awake, it's something they tell you should do if you want to get lucid dreams, i do it partly because of that, and partly because i occasionally confuse reality and my dreams < 1291288659 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is basically schizophrenia, luckily it's rather rare < 1291288718 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least i've understood you should always know, when you're awake, whether things have happened or not, if you have a clear memory of them < 1291288734 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :objects need properties to be identified, or even instanced as objets.. regarding to them as objects is the intellectual job, i think.. it's focussing on certain aspects of beeing.. and there is and infinite number of them out there < 1291288757 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so its hard work < 1291288764 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :done while you're awake < 1291288800 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we are better artist,then we have thought, as master eckhard says < 1291288819 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we construct the world.. on the fly < 1291288916 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i find it interesting that i can come up with awesome objects and worlds, compose okay songs, and come up with plots that make at least a little bit of sense, but math... i do it every day, but in my dreams, all the math parts seem like a 1st grader wrote them :\ < 1291288920 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in our dreams, the doors of perception seem to open a little more < 1291289018 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perdito: dunno about that, the way you think in dreams is the way you think when you're not really concentrated, except that you can send yourself sensory input, methinks. < 1291289030 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed! < 1291289063 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :concentration = closing the doors of perception.. focusing.. filter the rest.. or even just identify and matter no more! < 1291289154 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can construct the same worlds in my head i do when i'm dreaming, i just explore them in a different, more pleasing way; the fact you can actually look at the world, as if through your eyes, doesn't really aid the process, it's just nice. < 1291289198 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perdito: i find it a bit hard to follow your train of thought, and my meaningless poetry sensor starts beeping, no offense, i'm really trying :D < 1291289213 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess i may be a bit hard to follow as well < 1291289224 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1291289231 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah maybe i get your doors of perception < 1291289282 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"or even just identify and matter no more!" < 1291289282 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sry.. my english prevents me to express myself clearer < 1291289293 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes!! < 1291289296 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that part is a bit hard to < 1291289303 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you got it :) < 1291289339 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did? < 1291289341 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1291289358 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i copy pasted that from yours to ask "what?" < 1291289398 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if by "mattering" you mean "making a difference", in some deep philosophical sense, then i don't think we're talking about the same subject < 1291289453 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm mostly interested in the fact the dreaming brain seems to shut off certain functions, for instance obviously the part responsible for math < 1291289457 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :concentration is not required to percept the world around us! ..even worse! it makes us filter out all the "useless" information out there.. the infinity < 1291289466 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which i find intuitive, but definititely not obvious < 1291289481 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because certain parts of the brain are just as alive as they are awake < 1291289500 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like the part that processes human relationships, that's on crack when you're dreaming < 1291289534 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like to mention, once again, the countless times i've fallen asleep reading math, and had the mathematical concepts turn into human relationships in a millisecond < 1291289565 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in silly and intuitive ways, like a pair might be a marriage < 1291289570 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a list might be a queue < 1291289574 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of people < 1291289642 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :amazing < 1291289643 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1291289657 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" concentration is not required to percept the world around us! ..even worse! it makes us filter out all the "useless" information out there.. the infinity" <<< i don't know what the infinity is, but yeah, this may be true, although i think it's a side-effect, not in any way inherently necessary for concentration < 1291289692 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as huxley said, we need both: < 1291289693 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :work < 1291289696 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :& love < 1291289698 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually when i concentrate, i fall into a trance and don't really have any idea what i'm doing or what people are doing around me, but i think that's mostly "my thing" < 1291289709 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :work and love huh < 1291289719 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :another analogy < 1291289725 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah maybe we need both, and maybe that's relevant here in some sense < 1291289728 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1291289733 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1291289734 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :analogy < 1291289735 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :body & soul < 1291289742 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :function & percept < 1291289753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure sure, wing and wang, black and white. < 1291289803 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :listing analogies is fun and all, but it's the stuff the part of the brain does that lives when you're asleep. not the part that thinks, and i like to think when i'm awake. < 1291289832 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henri_Bergson#Creativity <-- interesting article < 1291289838 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure it is < 1291289844 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll open it just in case < 1291289880 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, esoidea: a lang that looks very like an existing lang, but has subtly different semantics < 1291289886 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C might be a good one to base it on < 1291289908 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly same syntax < 1291289909 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my first idea is that instead of using break; to break out of a switch at the end of a case, instead you use continue; to /not/ break out < 1291289914 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but nothing is what it seems < 1291289916 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yep, identical syntax < 1291289936 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ideally, it'd be similar enough that a program sort-of works like what you'd expect it to if you know the existing language < 1291289940 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291289950 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance, you could make C call-by-name rather than call-by-value < 1291289955 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay i was thinking something completely insane that could never be realized, but yeah i like the sort-of-works thing < 1291289956 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and people wouldn't realise something was wrong until much later < 1291290010 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i actually decided to stay home today and do my master's thesis, so if i'm not gone in an hour, you're all welcome to tell me to fuck off < 1291290126 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway to continue the dream thing, wouldn't it be awesome, if there really is a way to "switch off math" from the brain (which is my conjecture, although you may disagree with my rather pseudo-scientific evidence of this), to learn to do math without it < 1291290134 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love the idea of sucking at something, and learning to do it < 1291290172 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: esolangs are my way to do that, in a way < 1291290182 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you write an esolang which doesn't have maths in, you figure out how to implement it in that < 1291290261 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but it's different when you're programming your own brain, and especially when it's something that you are, at first, just inherently incapable of understanding < 1291290328 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...that you're implementing < 1291290479 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just have a serious brain fetish, that's all < 1291290504 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remember good ol' operation mindfuck? < 1291290522 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was that < 1291290523 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wilsons theories on metaprogramming our minds < 1291290531 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't read < 1291290578 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cosmic trigger.. illuminatus.. schroedingers cat and so on.. a lotta beatiful and funny books to read < 1291290608 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't really stand pop sci < 1291290623 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i don't particularly enjoy fiction < 1291290647 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that i know what those books are about < 1291290714 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunn wheter there ever will be a way to create sth like artficial intuition, but im sure we wont without channels as this < 1291290739 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and lucid dreaming programmers like you oklopol :) < 1291290917 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be fun if it turns out it's actually pretty easy to program a fully conscious program, it's just intuition is impossible to implement, these programs can play chess, and *know they're alive*, but they *still* can't love / realize a proof is essentially just an application of lagrange's theorem < 1291290921 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but first i really need to do sth bout this english-leaks < 1291290962 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not a programmer, i'm a mathematician! they call me "the computer scientist" at work, i work in the math dep :P < 1291291014 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well, I was a mathematician first, then an engineer, then a computer scientist < 1291291016 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :programming's just a hobby < 1291291039 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, and I teach programming part-time < 1291291046 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291291106 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"hey X, you're a computer scientist, wanna program this script for me?" < 1291291190 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :softwaredev. needs it all.. maths, physics, pschycholgy, philosphy ..and ..uh..even martial arts *g < 1291291216 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not seeing it, but easy to believe < 1291291245 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks 2 walls u can at least smash things on themt if they do not work as intended < 1291291250 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-->love < 1291291256 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remember < 1291291272 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah and if you know your martial arts, you might still be able to type < 1291291423 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : usually when i concentrate, i fall into a trance [...] but i think that's mostly "my thing" <-- sounds like what they call "flow" to me < 1291291447 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm? like you follow people and eat food etc but you're not really there < 1291291722 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i have this matrix-like idea that when we dream we are actually connected to a different universe in which mathematical logic _does not exist_ < 1291291732 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1291291738 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :luv it! < 1291292192 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm today's iwc ... i guess the universe really _is_ doomed (again) < 1291292370 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that arguably makes sense < 1291292370 0 :oklofok!~oklopol@xdsl-83-150-123-242.nebulazone.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1291292394 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291292427 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah doom at new years is becoming a tradition < 1291292442 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh, I was referring to dreaming connected to a universe without mathematical logic < 1291292455 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while dreaming, you're in a universe made of disconnected parts of your own thoughts < 1291292461 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1291292461 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and mathematical logic tends not to be among them < 1291292494 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes, when you wake up, you can reconstruct what parts of your dream-universe were made from < 1291292538 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i often directly get something i've thought about during the day in my dream < 1291292543 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291292551 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed, that's common < 1291292553 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance that game where you can really die < 1291292576 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wasn't common for me, before one day i told someone that's never happened to me, and then i had a dream i told her that < 1291292578 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, if you die in the game, it kills the player not just the character? < 1291292580 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was... weird < 1291292583 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok: i vaguely recall in the logs _someone_ telling us to shout if he wasn't gone in an hour, about an hour ago < 1291292588 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1291292589 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok: that's beautiful < 1291292623 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: also happened with that thing where your eye muscle starts repeatedly contracting, what's its name < 1291292624 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :awareness < 1291292628 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never had that < 1291292638 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then a girl said she'd been having that all day < 1291292649 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i told her i'd never even heard about that kind of thing < 1291292651 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i go home < 1291292654 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it happens < 1291292680 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after that it was quite common for a while, nowadays i can stop that kind of thing < 1291292708 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw i don't really believe my own stories even though i know they are true < 1291292724 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they sound too unlikely < 1291292784 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and by i don't believe them i mean i find it hard to believe them < 1291292823 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fasciculation < 1291292909 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"hearing about this concept" is not listed as a cause < 1291292954 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or possibly http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myokymia < 1291292990 0 :FireFly|n900!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291293011 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah so okay i'm leaving after this ep < 1291293018 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :6 minutes < 1291293036 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if you need my expertise, ask now < 1291293099 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok: How much wood would a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck would chuck wood? < 1291293127 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends on how it's changed to give it that ability < 1291293154 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, imagine it being bitten by a radioactive beaver < 1291293158 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1291293240 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could chuck whole trees in a matter of hours < 1291293246 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rofl < 1291293252 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :perdito|afk < 1291293267 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ais523: also happened with that thing where your eye muscle starts repeatedly contracting, what's its name <-- blinking? < 1291293274 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1291293287 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was actually pretty funny < 1291293354 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok never blinked before < 1291293482 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm so < 1291293484 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going now < 1291293493 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will close irc and everything < 1291293495 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wish me luck < 1291293496 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1291293501 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WISH < 1291293501 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, going to what? < 1291293507 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to write stuff < 1291293510 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291293511 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BYE < 1291293512 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cya < 1291293522 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> < 1291293523 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and good luck < 1291293527 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1291293531 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1291293627 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1291293716 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291293821 0 :perdito|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: perdito|afk < 1291293878 0 :ais523!~ais523@147.188.254.140 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291293885 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1291293885 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291294266 0 :FireFly|n900!~n900@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1291294368 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291294409 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291295480 0 :nopseudoidea!~nopseudoi@85-168-235-235.rev.numericable.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1291295487 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1291295684 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:44:32 My God. One could actually pretty much *have* Plan 9 just by replacing the Linux userspace. < 1291295686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: glendix < 1291295706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:13:31 gah, the hard part of adminning #esoteric is occasionally I have to check twice whether something's spam or not < 1291295706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:13:51 I mean, someone adds a random sequence of letters and punctuation to the hello world list, is that spam or an esoprogram? < 1291295706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:14:12 (it's easy to tell, generally, but requires concious thought, I can't let spamfighting go on mental automatic) < 1291295710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: fail (first linem, #) < 1291295745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:26:56 also in the world, islands weren't separated by water, but by emptiness, with only a bridge of sparsely distributed single blocks you could jump on to get across, i was sent to build a proper bridge across of these, alone, and my father told me i shouldn't go into the cave without torches because of all the foxes. < 1291295750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is better than minecraft < 1291295800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :03:13:07 oklopol: hmm, likely one of the Mario games then < 1291295803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it was Minecraft < 1291295962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :03:59:50 softwaredev. needs it all.. maths, physics, pschycholgy, philosphy ..and ..uh..even martial arts *g < 1291295969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, software development is trivial and involves none of those < 1291296031 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, surely you know kung-fu is invaluable when dealing with java? < 1291296050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true. < 1291296062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have used physics to debug a complex tangle of gnu makefiles once < 1291296075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i dropped the hard drive from the top of a tall building) < 1291296079 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291296086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note: story is fiction) < 1291296106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::(, DMM licenses his comics non-freely. < 1291296107 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, for being gnu, gnu make is quite decent < 1291296114 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, since when? < 1291296119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: -nc- < 1291296123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is nonfree < 1291296129 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, depends on your definition < 1291296132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :discrimination against fields of endeavour < 1291296133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it doesn't < 1291296146 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is freer than "all rights reserved" < 1291296147 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: shush, clearly perdito intends to start a new and glorious age of software development < 1291296150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's against the DFSG, the OSI definition < 1291296159 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there may even be giant robots involved < 1291296166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :won't even bother looking up the FSF's opinion, i think it's obvious :) < 1291296175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: freer -- "i'm slightly pregnant" < 1291296177 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, nd I would have considered non-free < 1291296189 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that reply made no sense... < 1291296195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it made perfect sense < 1291296203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"my software is slightly unfree" -- "i'm slightly pregnant" < 1291296205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no such thing. < 1291296211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: if you consider -nc- free you also have to consider -njews- free < 1291296217 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, law of excluded middle? < 1291296220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., anybody but jews can redistribute this software < 1291296288 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, free is a gradual scale. GPL is free. BSD is more free. that "do wtf you want" license is in some sense even more free < 1291296305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you do realise i'm using free in the Free sense? < 1291296316 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: freer -- "i'm slightly pregnant" <-- this is ridiculous since nothing in our current world can be truly free, there are always limitations < 1291296319 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, as for njews, sure it is freer than all rights reserved. That isn't saying it is a good idea though < 1291296328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.debian.org/social_contract#guidelines, something is either entirely free or not free at all < 1291296331 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, indeed < 1291296333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: um i don't see how that is true at all < 1291296337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: please back that up < 1291296354 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you aren't free if you need to include info on who originally made it. < 1291296360 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus *BSD is non-free < 1291296368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not according to the definition of http://www.debian.org/social_contract#guidelines < 1291296371 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(see, this makes no sense) < 1291296375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm saying Free here, not free, you're stupid < 1291296392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Free" means one of a few well-defined set of conditions < 1291296394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance, http://www.debian.org/social_contract#guidelines < 1291296398 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you didn't use upper case above < 1291296403 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :(, DMM licenses his comics non-freely. < 1291296408 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :non-Freely surely? < 1291296410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the /other/ meaning of free is "costs no money" < 1291296415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it was damn obvious < 1291296421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'm not about to start saying "libre" < 1291296422 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no it wasn't < 1291296429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. indeed not to you < 1291296442 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291296450 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1291296493 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sure it isn't DFSG compliant. But it is somewhat free. < 1291296506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is not Free(TM)(C)(R) at all < 1291296540 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps. it is a lot more free than, for example, dillbert though. < 1291296548 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/e,/e/ < 1291296556 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1291296572 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(insert other grammar fixes here) < 1291296589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: define free < 1291296595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you mean Free, then no, no it's not < 1291296633 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't mean the DFSG sense. It should be obvious < 1291296654 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, since that is a boolean sense. While I clearly refer to a gradual sense < 1291296658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: if you mean libre, well, good luck defining a scale of libre < 1291296664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because there isn't really one < 1291296666 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I never said that either < 1291296673 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm pretty sure you know what I mean < 1291296681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, then? < 1291296682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :free of cost? < 1291296715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ? I cannot think of any more definitions of free. < 1291296723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Free, libre, and free as in beer < 1291296724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what else < 1291296770 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the everyday sense that is a gradual scale from "all rights reserved, full DRM, costs a shitload" to "do what the fuck you want with this" < 1291296779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: so, libre. < 1291296795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remind me to avoid using confusing french around you in future < 1291296797 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, libre is not actually a gradual scale as commonly defined afaik < 1291296835 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or not at least in the sense most commonly used in relation to software < 1291296918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if booting without an initramfs/initrd actually works these days < 1291296949 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I have to read scrollback to see what the argument was about < 1291296971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: me saying that no, an -nc- license is *not* Free, Vorpal misinterpreting this and saying "but it's MORE FREE!!" < 1291296981 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ais523: it was Minecraft <--- the dream was clearly a modified Minecraft, I was trying to figure out what it was modified /by/ < 1291296991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :repeat until Vorpal reveals that he's not able to infer "Free" from "free" by obvious context < 1291296993 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /win 2 < 1291297005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: 01:22:07 and then the elf in my party had a lesbian relationship with her twin or clone or whatever < 1291297011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what the heck is that from then :P < 1291297024 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: he explained a bit later < 1291297046 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what time is it right now? < 1291297053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: what? < 1291297061 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what time is it right now < 1291297065 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: 08:37:05 when I asked your client what time it was < 1291297066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:22:07 and then the elf in my party had a lesbian relationship with her twin or clone or whatever < 1291297066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:26:56 also in the world, islands weren't separated by water, but by emptiness, with only a bridge of sparsely distributed single blocks you could jump on to get across, i was sent to build a proper bridge across of these, alone, and my father told me i shouldn't go into the cave without torches because of all the foxes. < 1291297066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:27:19 and because it's particularly hard to use electricity in that particular cave... i had no idea what he was talking about < 1291297067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:54:32 generally everything has sex with everything in my dreams < 1291297069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:55:21 i make things have sex whenever i have lucid moments, and my dreams are usually half-lucid < 1291297071 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: thanks < 1291297072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:55:34 that i "kinda" know they are dreams < 1291297077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i don't think that counts as explanation < 1291297091 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 13:37 in my timezone < 1291297099 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: does to me < 1291297100 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :double thanks < 1291297143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, I doubt he'd go out of his way to indicate a particular relationship if by his own admission he made /everyone/ had a relationship-by-some-definition < 1291297153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore i consider his dream an unexplained phenomenon. < 1291297157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we may never know. < 1291297161 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh, dreams < 1291297165 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have them often < 1291297171 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least, I don't recall having them often < 1291297175 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably I have them all the time < 1291297181 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you only remember a dream if you wake up during it < 1291297186 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why dreams never seem to get to the end < 1291297216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: do you have proof of that or a cite or whatever < 1291297219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never heard that < 1291297224 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brains to seem to have this thing of not committing dreams to memory < 1291297228 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sounds about right < 1291297238 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well sometimes you wake up because the dream does end, horribly < 1291297239 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, it's something like third-hand info that I can't remember where I've read it < 1291297246 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's consistent with my experiences < 1291297250 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: arguably, that would be waking up during < 1291297252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: that doesn't count as evidence, though, especially because remembering what happens at the end of dreams just before you wake up is near-impossible < 1291297259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan is right though < 1291297260 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It's all hear-say anyways < 1291297265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've woken up right when i died in dreams < 1291297270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: there is actual dream research. < 1291297275 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd say it's because you died in the dream and the dream was still continuing < 1291297282 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the death was a really obvious sign you were dreaming < 1291297286 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and thus, a prompt to wake up < 1291297293 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but we can't empirically measure dream retention < 1291297309 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if, if you were lucid dreaming, you could die in your dream and then keep lucid control over the afterlife < 1291297332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: pi don't think that's necessarily true < 1291297333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*i < 1291297340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i doubt it :p < 1291297343 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to agree with ais523 on one thing, though < 1291297351 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it's obvious either way < 1291297358 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I only remember a dream if when I wake, I was dreaming right before < 1291297367 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(there. now we've avoided the "end of a dream" issue) < 1291297396 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CLEVER < 1291297430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not clever enough for oerjan < 1291297437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he will come and rip your soul out of your body < 1291297455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: btw, you said i shouldn't clobber owners on dirs etc. that have to be owned by a specific special-purpose user < 1291297471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well, I'd have to chmod them in postinst anyway. because of course the target machine won't have the user, so the postinst script has to add it, and the UID might not be the same < 1291297548 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Debian actually has some sort of crazy systematic solution for that < 1291297554 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't remember what it is, but it's likely in debhelper somewhere < 1291297561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and I have postinst scripts!! < 1291297568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :joy! < 1291297583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ ls < 1291297583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :description needs scripts source.tar version website < 1291297587 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this package manager is comin' together < 1291297618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I *think* I've avoided the problem of understanding yours and CLC-INTERCAL's versioning systems altogether (for upgrades) < 1291297620 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, gitorious is down < 1291297623 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-15-58.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291297668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I was considering bug-hunting C-INTERCAL to pass time, but then I realised I'd be entering the Realm of the ESR, and decided not to. you traitor :p < 1291297679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ok so i also decided it sounded like not much fun at all) < 1291297699 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could try running the fuzz-tester, that's a) easy, and b) entirely written by me < 1291297721 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, esr tried to stop me doing it (on the basis he thought I'd be wasting my time, admittedly, rather htan thinking it was necessarily a bad idea) < 1291297742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the cathedral and the bazaar and the fascist dictatorial state < 1291297751 0 :perdito|afk!~perdito@koln-4d0b7f76.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291297757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523:and -- oh, I meant actually analysing and modifying the code by hand < 1291297760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ais523: and < 1291297764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(preferably avoiding running it) < 1291297776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you need to re-fork it :p < 1291297864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (or maybe I'll just write ITRALCEN!) < 1291297903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: apropos nothing at all, have you seen http://steve-yegge.blogspot.com/2010/12/haskell-researchers-announce-discovery.html? < 1291297905 0 :nopseudoidea!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Quitte < 1291297929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[["I'm kind of surprised I'm the only person on earth who gives a shit about it," Briars continued. "I'd have thought there would be more people following the press releases closely and then not using Haskell. But they all just skip the press releases and go straight to the not using it part."]] < 1291298266 0 :perdito|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291298417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Would you please do me the kindness of adding a second "l" and a second "t" to my last name ("Elliott") in your link?" --Conal Elliott < 1291298419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HE FEELS MY PAIN < 1291298598 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'll have to start a secret society of elliotts < 1291298689 0 :Sasha!~WHAT@75-174-223-98.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291298692 0 :Sasha!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1291298730 0 :Sasha!~WHAT@75-174-223-98.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291298879 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i think someone's been reading a bit of onion < 1291298897 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*the onion < 1291298916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: also http://steve-yegge.blogspot.com/2010/07/wikileaks-to-leak-5000-open-source-java.html < 1291298927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it's funnier than the onion though, with the onion you can usually just read the headline and skip the rest < 1291298981 0 :perdito|afk!~perdito@koln-4d0b6e53.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291299363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: would you appreciate the effort if I wrote something to convert every CPAN package to a Kitten package in the repos? :-P < 1291299370 0 :perdito|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: perdito|afk < 1291299881 0 :perdito|afk!~perdito@koln-4d0b7e7c.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291299995 0 :perdito|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :perdito < 1291300019 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do you know if python allows you to have values such as NaN and +/-inf for floating point without throwing exceptions? < 1291300030 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems to throw exceptions all the time when I try < 1291300059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> float('nan') < 1291300059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nan < 1291300063 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1291300064 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weird < 1291300066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> float('inf') < 1291300066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inf < 1291300066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> float('-inf') < 1291300066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-inf < 1291300074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> float('asdf') < 1291300074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: invalid literal for float(): asdf < 1291300078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: but 1./0. is not allowed. < 1291300084 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah that explains it. < 1291300088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it raises a ZeroDivisionError < 1291300098 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: also math.isnan < 1291300101 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed, I would have expected it to act as IEEE prescribes < 1291300106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and math.isinf < 1291300109 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indee < 1291300109 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :perdito|afk < 1291300114 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed* < 1291300135 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, is float single or double? < 1291300140 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in python that is < 1291300153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :double i think < 1291300157 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah good < 1291300162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can i check < 1291300169 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.50.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291300182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks into postoffice < 1291300185 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I could do it as easily < 1291300193 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which is the say, it involves some work) < 1291300210 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I wish the python REPL had tab complete < 1291300244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: put in ~/.pythonstartup < 1291300247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :import readline < 1291300251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :import rlcompleter < 1291300253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :readline.parse_and_bind('tab: complete') < 1291300259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever < 1291300265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (and yes that works) < 1291300275 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why on earth is that not default then < 1291300279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: or try ipython < 1291300295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: which is the python REPL so bloated, it's basically a shell < 1291300301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it syntax-highlights :P < 1291300305 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1291300317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably in $your_distro < 1291300323 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so wait, this will tab complete stuff like myintvar. to list possible members? < 1291300329 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is the rlcompleter thingy < 1291300332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: maybe. it certainly works with modules < 1291300340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oh there's also bpython, which also has integrated docs: http://bpython-interpreter.org/screenshots/ < 1291300361 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm are you sure about ~/.pythonstartup ? < 1291300367 0 :perdito|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291300367 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems to do absolutely nothing < 1291300370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i just googled :D < 1291300373 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries it directly in the shell < 1291300384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PYTHONSTARTUP¶ < 1291300384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : If this is the name of a readable file, the Python commands in that file are executed before the first prompt is displayed in interactive mode. The file is executed in the same namespace where interactive commands are executed so that objects defined or imported in it can be used without qualification in the interactive session. You can also change the prompts sys.ps1 and sys.ps2 in this file. < 1291300390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: set PYTHONSTARTUP=$HOME/.pythonstartup < 1291300393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or .pythonrc or whatever < 1291300393 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, heh < 1291300407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://bpython-interpreter.org/screenshots/ is actually really cool < 1291300422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://geoffford.wordpress.com/2009/01/20/python-repl-enhancement/ also saves history to a file < 1291300441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha, "/etc/postoffice.cf" oldschool < 1291300458 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, other feature I would like: reloading a file into the shell without a pain calling sys.whatever(). (alternatively you could just restart python but then you lose that scrollback) < 1291300481 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: try help(reload) < 1291300490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. < 1291300492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> import sys < 1291300494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> reload(sys) < 1291300499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1291300500 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I seem to remember it managed to crash python for me < 1291300506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it shouldn't. < 1291300511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also that only works if you import it as a module < 1291300522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. "from sys import * \n reload(sys)" won't change the in-scope definitions < 1291300532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"from sys import * \n reload(sys) \n from sys import *" will though < 1291300539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but the old definitions will still be there, if any values got removed) < 1291300542 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1291300595 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the rlcompleter thing seems to do the job. :) < 1291300606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you may want to nab the history-saving from that blog post too < 1291300611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok postoffice looks pretty cool < 1291300621 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is it an MTA? < 1291300621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still more configuration than i'd like < 1291300636 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also isn't .cf something to do with m4? < 1291300637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well, it's an SMTP server/client < 1291300650 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least I seem to remember that sendmail used .cf and also m4 < 1291300657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.cf is what sendmail used for configuration files, it's just that this guy was used to sendmail when he wrote postoffice < 1291300659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so he stole the extension :) < 1291300662 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.pell.portland.or.us/~orc/Code/postoffice/ < 1291300666 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291300683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the one hand, it looks like i'd have to do quite a bit of configuration. on the other hand, it looks like a lot less of a bitch to package than qmail! < 1291300711 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, postfix is actually quite decent iirc. Qmail is better of course. < 1291300733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I tried to use postfix once, and then I looked at the configuration files and my process tree. < 1291300735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No thanks... < 1291300748 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1291300753 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about the process tree? < 1291300779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: postfix likes to spawn a new process to do every single thing it can think of, because that way it can reduce their privileges < 1291300790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you end up with 1,000,000 processes each with their own postfix-specific user :) < 1291300791 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you do realise qmail is kind of like that too? < 1291300798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, but postfix takes it to THE XTREME < 1291300806 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1291300828 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and I seem to remember qmail having far more users < 1291300834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :than postfix? < 1291300836 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1291300839 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :postfix is very popular. < 1291300842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :qemu is quite niche. :P < 1291300850 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I meant user account < 1291300853 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :accounts* < 1291300853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291300858 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but does it use them all at once? < 1291300896 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, I believe it tends to start stuff as it needs for many things, just a handful running all the time, supervised by daemontools < 1291300908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All I want is to route user@domain to ~user by default, define a few aliases/wildcards e.g. *@domain -> elliott@domain, and also if ~user/.filtermail exists, execute it for every incoming message with stdin being the headers and message body, then stop processing further if it exits 0 (if it exits 1) keep going < 1291300924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just put it in a maildir < 1291300925 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm I can ssh to a computer with postfix and check user count < 1291300933 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one user, called postfix < 1291300948 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe different distros package it differently? < 1291300955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or i'm misremembering... < 1291300958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway it had a ton of processes < 1291300959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's all i remember < 1291300973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: anyway, if I packaged qemu, I'd have to replace the daemontools scripts with svmg scripts < 1291300975 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes it does have 4 processes atm. But qmail is the account-insane one < 1291300983 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, qemu? < 1291300983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since svmg is almost a direct clone of daemontools/runit, that wouldn't be too hard, but still < 1291300986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1291300986 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what has it got to do with it < 1291300987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :qmail < 1291300989 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291301003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, that /package and /command crap < 1291301019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think only daemontools is packaged like *that* though < 1291301076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : All I want is to route user@domain to ~user by default, define a few aliases/wildcards e.g. *@domain -> elliott@domain, and also if ~user/.filtermail exists, execute it for every incoming message with stdin being the headers and message body, then stop processing further if it exits 0 (if it exits 1) keep going < 1291301076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : and just put it in a maildir < 1291301080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm almost tempted to write it ;) < 1291301142 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291301413 0 :nopseudoidea!~nopseudoi@85-168-235-235.rev.numericable.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1291301486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok why isn't locale support working in uClibc < 1291301583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /* Silly foreigners disabling en_US locales */ < 1291301588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--gen_wc8bit.c < 1291301751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, it's working now. < 1291301758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, sort of. < 1291301764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TODO: look into locales some more. < 1291302033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-rw-r--r-- 1 elliott elliott 1.7M Dec 2 14:56 lib/libc.a < 1291302036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh, that's not bad. < 1291302054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ha! It's bigger than glibc on my system. I wonder why. < 1291302069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course glibc is a .so. < 1291302093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4.3M Oct 31 00:34 /usr/lib/libc.a < 1291302093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There. < 1291302101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And of course there are dlopen'd parts of glibc... < 1291302107 0 :perdito|afk!~perdito@koln-d93295d4.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291302237 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291302296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ cat /proc/cpuinfo | awk '/^processor/ { print $3 }' | tail -1 < 1291302301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ugliest way to get the number of cores possible. < 1291302306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, that actually needs +1. < 1291302313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ cat /proc/cpuinfo | awk '/^processor/ { print $3+1 }' | tail -1 < 1291302340 0 :nopseudoidea!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Quitte < 1291302394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, this is cleaner: < 1291302395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cat /proc/cpuinfo | grep processor | awk '{a++} END {print a}' < 1291302481 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291302609 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291302657 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1291302700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/var/pkg/vi/scripts/build < 1291302702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mwahahaha, paths. < 1291302798 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1291302879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ugh! i need to put two filenames on a line. rapidly losing hope :) < 1291302901 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1291303040 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291303047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: symlinks < 1291303068 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go on. < 1291303116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: x -> y < 1291303142 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And this stops you putting two filenames on a line? < 1291303169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: every character but \0 is a valid component of a path < 1291303184 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1291303199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :googling "manifest file" is impossible thanks to java :( < 1291303741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: In fact I'm 90% of the way to not even bothering with a manifest... < 1291303977 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/50260000/jpg/_50260127_searchingforporn,bbc.jpg < 1291303987 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't even think of anything to say about that. < 1291304011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is now my favourite image. < 1291304012 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1291304023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh man, imagine the steps taken to create that image. < 1291304032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Load up google, type in porn, get the camera out, tripod, zoom... < 1291304048 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Words fail me. < 1291304057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"That angle's not the standard BBC Angle To Show Zoomed In Computer Screens At! (pretty sure they have one, just about every photo they do of that sort has an angle like that)" < 1291304059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, redo! < 1291304073 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric < 1291304286 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1291304387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan is a bath tub < 1291304561 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just bubble, er babble < 1291304583 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/50260000/jpg/_50260127_searchingforporn,bbc.jpg < 1291304585 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Comment. < 1291304648 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{- porn -} < 1291304860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Wanna help me build THE GLASS CUBE? < 1291304872 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mining now, I assume? < 1291304891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No! I'm getting the glass from the server, because you see, it involves 81 thousand pieces of sand. < 1291304904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And while I *could* obtain that without difficulty, I would sooner kill myself than face that kind of tedium. < 1291304913 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1291304917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Fun fact! When it goes underwater, I will have to use a bucket 128x128x64 = 1,048,576 times. This is because of the sea < 1291304930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I do not like the sea < 1291304960 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i blame the sea gets in the way of construction < 1291304999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1291305078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Is chat broken or something? < 1291305092 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1291305121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: it < 1291305123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: it is down < 1291305130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO LONGER < 1291305130 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fair point. < 1291305133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is back up. < 1291305140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do I have two pigs in my inventory. < 1291305140 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How will you deal with the bedrock? < 1291305166 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finding a 128x128 block of it that's naturally smooth is an exercise in futility. < 1291305170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: help help help i'm stuck < 1291305173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And, I just won't. < 1291305180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's okay for the very bottom floor to be a bit uneven. < 1291305187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: This thing *is* going to have something like 20 floors. < 1291305194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or more. < 1291305211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The last three floors or so will be lined with obsidian on the walls and floors/ceilings, anyway (apart from the final bedrock floor). < 1291305218 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell 20^3 < 1291305219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: They are intended for the post-apocalyptic scenarios. < 1291305248 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps I ought to do something about that... < 1291305253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: About what? < 1291305259 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The apocalypse. < 1291305261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1291305271 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, I have a 200-metre long warship under construction. < 1291305274 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ostensibly. < 1291305277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed :P < 1291305316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: FUN FACT! My cube will be 2,097,152 m^3 (and thus blocks). < 1291305337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I am going to rent out sections of it for free because let's face it, I can't even fill a 128x128 floor with my stuff. < 1291305348 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!help < 1291305357 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :help: General commands: !help, !info, !bf_txtgen. See also !help languages, !help userinterps. You can get help on some commands by typing !help . < 1291305363 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell 20^3 < 1291305365 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8000 < 1291305426 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell 2097152**(1/3) < 1291305430 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :127.99999999999997 < 1291305465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh, and I'm also going to need TONS OF LAVA. < 1291305477 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, bug ineiros? < 1291305479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'd like the lighting layers to be just one tall, so I can't use a bunch of falls. < 1291305490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So I'm going to need 128 * 128 * floors pieces of lava. < 1291305501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I'm gonna ask ineiros to put some readily-accessible lava near the spawnpoint. :p < 1291305865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Taking a break already? < 1291305882 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love lava, red and hot < 1291305895 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1291305991 0 :perdito|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291306360 0 :yorick!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh minecraft < 1291306424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We like it, shut up. < 1291306429 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alas, poor yorick, stepping into a minefield < 1291306470 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291306516 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.maumae.net/yorick/doc/index.php < 1291306526 0 :nopseudoidea!~nopseudoi@85-168-235-235.rev.numericable.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1291306627 0 :perdito|afk!~perdito@koln-d9329435.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291306650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: does C-INTERCAL work with -jN? < 1291306656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: its makefile, that is < 1291307891 0 :yorick!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION stabs the Yorick namers < 1291307926 0 :yorick!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're making those annoying "AI" bots say "yorick: you are an interpreted programming language" < 1291308774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm, can I have your esoteric opinion on something? < 1291308781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or oerjan's :P < 1291309732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(fn P P) A = A. < 1291309732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(fn P (F X)) A = (fn P F A) (fn P X A). < 1291309733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(fn P X) A = X. < 1291309734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Behold! Lambdas! < 1291309931 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't work if X is of the form (fn ... ...) with A inside somewhere < 1291309961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hm? howso? < 1291309967 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er i mean P inside < 1291309981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: don't quite see how that applies (although it certainly is failing in my tests :D < 1291309983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*:D) < 1291309997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it seems to be non-lazy, Y foo is always diverging :p < 1291310000 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...you have no rule for that case < 1291310022 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(fn P (fn Q P)) A < 1291310040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: = (fn P ((fn Q) P)) A < 1291310047 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's the case which requires all the alpha machinery < 1291310048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so F = fn Q, X = P < 1291310056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah fucking alpha conversion < 1291310060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i hereby invite you to fix it! ^_^ < 1291310067 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hereby decline < 1291310154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: a cool thing about this though < 1291310155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> (fn x (fn y x)) hello < 1291310156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1291310158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fn y hello < 1291310162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that it SPECIALISES :P < 1291310262 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1291310276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try it with de bruijn indexes... < 1291310326 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291310423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh : < 1291310424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1291310471 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yep, it works with -jN for all positive integer N (that are small enough for make to parse correctly); and you can try to have my opinion, but I may not be paying attention < 1291310505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: alas, my problem was another entirely and your opinion is thus not useful < 1291310519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but cool, let's see if i can get C-INTERCAL's latest release into Kitten 0.1 < 1291310526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is there a convenient list of dependencies? < 1291310565 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to what degree of granularity? < 1291310566 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are several < 1291310577 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, the list for DOS is probably best, as none of the software you need is installed on DOS by default < 1291310685 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :binutils, gcc, make, bash, diffutils, fileutils, findutils, awk, sed, shellutils, textutils; bison and flex are needed to recompile all the way from sources, texinfo and asciidoc (ugh esr) for the documentation < 1291310755 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most are only needed for the build system to work < 1291310844 0 :nopseudoidea!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Quitte < 1291310951 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1291310968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: asciidoc is nicer than texinfo, but why the fuck use two?? < 1291310984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: also, I doubt the latest release requires AsciiDoc, only the git, right? < 1291311090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: in which case it doesn't matter < 1291311246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"SonicBlue was sued over the commercial-skipping feature of ReplayTV on similar grounds. "Your contract when you get the show is you're going to watch the spots [advertisements]. … Any time you skip a commercial … you're actually stealing the programming," asserts Turner Broadcasting CEO Jamie Kellner. He admits that "there's a certain amount of tolerance" for going to the bathroom during commercials." < 1291311682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ping? < 1291311745 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pong < 1291311755 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: esr converted the README to asciidoc < 1291311761 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the result that it has random backslashes in now < 1291311774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so, only a problem in git. right. < 1291311778 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as soon as you introduce escaping, everything goes wrong with that sort of format < 1291311779 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes < 1291311822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'll probably be wholly unreasonable and maintain my own constantly-out-of-date C-INTERCAL that has all the non-stupid things merged back in. Should I call it something else? :p < 1291311868 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, just change what it stands for < 1291311878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Anyway, so there are no library dependencies? < 1291311927 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, apart from libc and the libraries it builds itself < 1291311930 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, cfunge, but that's optional < 1291312029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah i am *not* planning to build an iffi build :) < 1291312217 0 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.33 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291312229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Does this look kosher to you? < 1291312235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./configure --prefix= < 1291312247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make install -j$(NPROCS) DESTDIR=$1 < 1291312258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To build C-INTERCAL. < 1291312262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/$(NPROCS)/$NPROCS/ < 1291312385 0 :iamcal!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291312440 0 :Zuu!zuu@0x55529f1b.adsl.cybercity.dk JOIN :#esoteric < 1291312442 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291312552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: please tell me if I've misrepresented your compiler :P: < 1291312553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C-INTERCAL is an implementation of Compiler Language With No < 1291312553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pronounceable Acronym, abbreviated INTERCAL; it acts as a deobfuscator < 1291312553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by translating incomprehensible INTERCAL source code into vastly more < 1291312553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :readable machine code, going through a C compiler on the way. It < 1291312553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :supports all the common INTERCAL extensions, and has good < 1291312555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compatibility with CLC-INTERCAL. < 1291312583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(yes, yes, I stole the deobfuscator idea from the Debian packge description) < 1291312584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*package < 1291312704 0 :atrapado!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Abandonando < 1291313170 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not kosher, it has shrimps in it < 1291313239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i would like to express my complaint with c-intercal's default installation directories < 1291313244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*express a complaint < 1291313318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: specifically, /share/ick-0.29/ should in fact be called /lib/ick-0.29/ or /libexec/ick-0.29/ < 1291313327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: also, you shouldn't put the version name in the dirs like that < 1291313447 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1291313468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ok i may be wrong about the share thing. but ick-0.29 is still wrong < 1291313492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially for include/ < 1291313669 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291314051 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291314464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I fixed your bug :) < 1291314866 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291315191 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291315529 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ever used cython? < 1291315542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i don't think i've *used* it but i know of it, yes < 1291315623 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I had a reversi-playing thing to write as an assignment, using alpha-beta pruning. Course uses Python. It was kind of slow. I optimised it as much as I could to be able to increase search depth from 3 ply to something greater. So 3 ply = about 19 seconds in pure python when playing against itself. < 1291315632 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, with cython + some type annotation = 3 seconds < 1291315633 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1291315639 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :python really really sucks < 1291315656 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very computation heavy though < 1291315684 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and well, lets see what adding further type annotation will do < 1291315704 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2.3 seconds now < 1291315814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: are you sure they'll accept Cython... < 1291315823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: also, Did You Try Psyco First < 1291315834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(TM) < 1291315840 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, but I'll mention it in the report to hope to make them realise how silly python is for this task :P < 1291315846 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also down to 1.7 seconds < 1291315858 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: try psyco (need 32-bit python) < 1291315861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without any cython < 1291315869 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah I would need to setup a 32-bit python somewhere < 1291315873 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably needs a chroot < 1291315924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: < 1291315925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# pkgcross x86 python < 1291315930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ /arch/x86/bin/python foo.py < 1291315932 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, on what system? < 1291315933 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.... < 1291315933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait sorry you don't use kitten NEVER MIND < 1291315941 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I can't use it yet < 1291315945 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that is pointless < 1291315955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah you can you just have to implement all the bits that aren't done or that i haven't released! < 1291315961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is ALL of them! < 1291316028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CFLAGS=-Os ./configure --prefix= < 1291316028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make install -j$NPROCS ICK_SPECIFIC_SUBDIR=ick DESTDIR="$1" < 1291316033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: look what horrible things ick makes me do! < 1291316037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes indeed, I have to set a whole ONE variable! < 1291316051 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and only then because I think it should be that way anyway :P) < 1291316056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, yes, the lack of / after --prefix= is intentional. < 1291316062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because stuff does $(prefix)/foo < 1291316064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would become //foo < 1291316176 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hah < 1291316207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (ICK_SPECIFIC_SUBDIR usually includes the version, which is stupid because this way it goes into /share/ick and /include/ick like it should, not /share/ick- and /include/ick-) < 1291316226 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also down to 0.6 seconds now. cython has a nice mode where it renders to html and colour codes lines (white to yellow) to indicate how much conversion between python and C data types is going on < 1291316228 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather useful < 1291316264 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1291316292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is nobody on minecraft? :( < 1291316313 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no time today < 1291316370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm at a bit of a loss as to where to build the Cube... < 1291316451 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291316562 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291316997 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually I have to say cython is quite a nice language to use. On one hand when you need speed it isn't sluggish. On the other hand you can still use "high level" stuff when you need (such as non-painful dynamically growing lists) < 1291317001 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and easily mix those < 1291317033 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Cube? what? < 1291317189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: minecraft. < 1291317320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :falses = cons false falses. < 1291317320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bch = bch1 nil falses. < 1291317320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bch1 (state (L : Ls) Rs) (left : Ps) = bch1 (state Ls (L : Rs)) Ps. < 1291317320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bch1 (state Ls (R : Rs)) (moustache : Ps) = bch1 (state ((not R) : Ls) Rs) Ps. < 1291317320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bch1 (state Ls (R : Rs)) ((loop LPs) : Ps) = if R then bch1 (bch1 (bch1 Ls Rs LPs)) ((loop LPs) : Ps) else (bch1 (state Ls (R : Rs)) Ps). < 1291317322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this better work < 1291317489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does not! but it is close < 1291317516 0 :cheater99!~cheater@e181142108.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1291318146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ais523: could you delete [[Image:P''.png]]? thanks < 1291318265 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not an admin < 1291318386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well < 1291318387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not :P < 1291318414 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why are you programming in moustaches < 1291318472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: it's what i call } < 1291318474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm trying to do bitchanger < 1291318482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in anemone < 1291318512 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's anemone? < 1291318515 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :State machine? < 1291318576 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1291318580 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just a... < 1291318582 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the name < 1291318586 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like BNF < 1291318600 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: um you are still linking to that image from Prehistory. also that messes up the table of contents. < 1291318622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ' != ′ < 1291318625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: it's a term rewriter. < 1291318631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not like bnf < 1291318644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: good point about ToC, i'll fix < 1291319354 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also presumably i'm not admin because no one has made me one < 1291319379 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION now off to discover new and impressive tautologies < 1291319384 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@137.125.180.96 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291319394 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you know your advice about using IE when Firefox wouldn't download executables? < 1291319415 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems that something had really really locked the system down, IE wouldn't download them either but at least it gave a vaguely useful error message < 1291319425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291319446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I asked you a few things when you were gone; can I re-paste them? < 1291319446 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, elliott didn't respond to anything I said in the log < 1291319449 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's unusual < 1291319451 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the end, I had to identify Microsoft's download domains and set them to trusted status in IE, and also set the security settings for trusted sites (which atm is /only/ three microsoft.com subdomains) to the lowest settings < 1291319452 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: go for it < 1291319460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ais523: Does this look kosher to you? < 1291319460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ./configure --prefix= < 1291319460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : make install -j$(NPROCS) DESTDIR=$1 < 1291319460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : To build C-INTERCAL. < 1291319460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : s/$(NPROCS)/$NPROCS/ < 1291319463 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: like, the virus you wanted to download anti-virus for? >:D < 1291319464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ais523: please tell me if I've misrepresented your compiler :P: < 1291319465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : C-INTERCAL is an implementation of Compiler Language With No < 1291319465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Pronounceable Acronym, abbreviated INTERCAL; it acts as a deobfuscator < 1291319467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : by translating incomprehensible INTERCAL source code into vastly more < 1291319469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : readable machine code, going through a C compiler on the way. It < 1291319471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : supports all the common INTERCAL extensions, and has good < 1291319473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : compatibility with CLC-INTERCAL. < 1291319475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (yes, yes, I stole the deobfuscator idea from the Debian packge description) < 1291319477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : *package < 1291319479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ais523: i would like to express my complaint with c-intercal's default installation directories < 1291319481 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : *express a complaint < 1291319482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ais523: specifically, /share/ick-0.29/ should in fact be called /lib/ick-0.29/ or /libexec/ick-0.29/ < 1291319486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ais523: also, you shouldn't put the version name in the dirs like that < 1291319488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ais523: ok i may be wrong about the share thing. but ick-0.29 is still wrong < 1291319490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : especially for include/ < 1291319492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the last one I've managed to fix without patching the code) < 1291319494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make install -j$NPROCS ICK_SPECIFIC_SUBDIR=ick DESTDIR="$1" < 1291319497 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the versioned dirs are a historical thing, which cause all sorts of issues < 1291319499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and finally, the non-question that is "please delete http://esolangs.org/wiki/Image:P''.png" :P < 1291319501 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291319508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm < 1291319508 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a single line in the Makefile that can be changed to patch them back out < 1291319512 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, what caused the image? < 1291319512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you don't need to do that < 1291319515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make install -j$NPROCS ICK_SPECIFIC_SUBDIR=ick DESTDIR="$1" < 1291319520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I caused the image < 1291319526 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yep, but Debian prefer patching makefiles for some reason < 1291319529 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what were you trying to do? < 1291319531 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i was just about to get ops now ;| < 1291319538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what, for flooding? < 1291319541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523 gave me permission! < 1291319542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: get the P'' logo < 1291319547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I've uploaded it under another name < 1291319550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(with the prime characters) < 1291319553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is also easier to embed < 1291319557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Image:]] doesn't like quoets < 1291319559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*quotes < 1291319569 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291319572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway, are there any plans to set ICK_SPECIFIC_SUBDIR=ick by default in a future version? < 1291319573 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, done < 1291319577 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@64.62.173.65 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291319580 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, not at the moment < 1291319590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (btw, ick 0.-2.0.29 identifies as ick 0.29, but presumably that's intentional) < 1291319647 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: indeed, alphas identify as the version they'll eventually be released as < 1291319655 0 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1291319678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'll probably stick with 0.-2.0.29 for a while, since it doesn't depend on asciidoc >:) < 1291319684 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Guest37696 < 1291319692 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well it was damn hard to _notice_ the permission with all that flooding ;D < 1291319696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: btw, I should probably leave out the yacc build dependency and just use the prebuilt ones, right? < 1291319709 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm not sure < 1291319726 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: since when did I have permission to tell people to flood in this channel? < 1291319731 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, are you an op? I keep losing track < 1291319733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's ais523 < 1291319735 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am < 1291319736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he has permission to do anything < 1291319744 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, if the results would be identical whether I do or I don't, then I'll leave out the dependency to avoid wasting space < 1291319755 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, Oozlybub and Murphy has the second best reason for its name ever, after INTERCAL < 1291319772 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: they might not be if bison is upgraded to produce compatible but better output < 1291319781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: who said I'm using bison? < 1291319793 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291319795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: heck, I'm not even using gcc :) < 1291319810 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know SunOS lex has issues with lexer.l < 1291319810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: although I haven't yet tested C-INTERCAL with pcc < 1291319820 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it uses hardcoded maximums, and they're too low < 1291319827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: here, I have a pcc/dietlibc toolchain here, let's see if it'll compile c-intercal < 1291319829 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can increase the maximums with options, but seriously? < 1291319836 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I know it compiles cleanly with clang < 1291319857 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I had a go at getting it working with bcc (a 16-bit K&R C compiler), I can't remember whether I managed it or not < 1291319865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: by the way, I gunzipped the pax and then renamed it to .tar; am I a bad person? < 1291319871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every package has to be /var/pkg/NAME/source.tar < 1291319875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I didn't feel like re-packing < 1291319969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ CC="$K/stage2/bin/diet -Os $K/stage2/bin/pcc" CFLAGS="" ./configure < 1291319971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: this better work! < 1291320002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wow, that was a fast build < 1291320008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ time make -j3 < 1291320008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1291320009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m4.847s < 1291320018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slowest part was all that oilout stuff < 1291320019 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it run? < 1291320028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ ./ick < 1291320028 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, that's the slowest part of the build in gcc, too < 1291320028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ICL999I NO SKELETON IN MY CLOSET, WOE IS ME! < 1291320029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ON THE WAY TO 1 < 1291320029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : CORRECT SOURCE AND RESUBNIT < 1291320031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: close enough! < 1291320042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: -rwxr-xr-x 1 elliott elliott 384K Dec 2 19:59 ick < 1291320044 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmm, I hate skeleton errors < 1291320045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (statically linked) < 1291320054 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if you try installing it? < 1291320060 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@k-173.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1291320063 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or try ./ick -u to see where it's looking < 1291320065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I'll just do it again with another prefix < 1291320078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it looked in the totally wrong places < 1291320100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway, 384K isn't bad, methinks < 1291320113 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with skeleton errors you don't even have the bare bones of a solution < 1291320119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: especially considering that the dietlibc printf functions are very half-assed because felix thinks people shouldn't use them :) < 1291320127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(they add like 7-8K to the binary) < 1291320135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@dinky:~/ick-0.29$ $K/cint/bin/ick < 1291320135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@dinky:~/ick-0.29$ < 1291320138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: great success < 1291320150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: now, uh oh, does it know to use the CC it was compiled with? < 1291320230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(did you ever respond to my package description? misrepresenting C-INTERCAL is incredibly shameful!) < 1291320251 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm not sure; it will respect the CC environment variable < 1291320264 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it doesn't look that misrepresented, except that I find INTERCAL easier to read than the machinecode it compiles to < 1291320273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any flag to ask it what it thinks CC is? :p < 1291320283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what good would an *accurate* description of an INTERCAL compiler be? < 1291320316 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291320430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-rwxr-xr-x 1 elliott elliott 104K Dec 2 20:06 pi < 1291320442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it matches "GCC" < 1291320446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1291320461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: does it respect CFLAGS? < 1291320554 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I can't remember < 1291320556 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think so < 1291320582 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: if you use -c, the command to compile it will be dumped in the Emacs local variables header in the output < 1291320591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I'm looking now < 1291320593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it puts -O2 in there < 1291320595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very irritating < 1291320619 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you use -g, it doesn't optimise < 1291320627 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you use -F, it goes up to -O3 < 1291320648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm... would you accept a patch that (1) modularised libick, so that each relevant block of code goes in its own .o, so that statically-linked INTERCAL program are smaller; (2) made it so that ick generates C programs that do not call printf and friends, directly or indirectly (instead using either fwrite or write, depending on what you'll let me get away with :)), and (3) respects CFLAGS? < 1291320655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could split those up, but I'm very lazy. < 1291320681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the end result would be much smaller statically-linked programs, basically (and leaner dynamically-linked programs too, although you wouldn't really notice it) < 1291320690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also perhaps slightly faster, since printf is quite big < 1291320693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :emphasis on slightly < 1291320801 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: splitting it up would help; I'd almost certainly accept (3), (2) and (1) are more contentious < 1291320817 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do we use printf for in the generated C at the moment anyway? < 1291320827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I have no idea; probably error reporting or something silly like that. < 1291320848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I don't see why (1) should be contentious; it *only* affects libick.a, not any shared version (are there any?) < 1291320853 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about replacing it with puts and putchar < 1291320874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm... well, I wouldn't bother writing such a patch < 1291320895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: really, the improvements are: going from printf -> anything else; and going from stdio -> write(2)/read(2) < 1291320895 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: changing which files exist require a) working out how they fit in with all the various permutations of build systems, b) working out which go in which version of libick.a, c) thinking up witty names for them < 1291320904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both have a rather dramatic impact < 1291320910 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: do you not have a libc that lets you set stdio as a thin wrapper? < 1291320918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: a thin wrapper? haha < 1291320924 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :write(2) and read(2) aren't portable, they don't exist on Windows < 1291320932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: with the amount of stuff stdio is required to do, you can't make a thin wrapper < 1291320940 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1291320946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: also, you use autoconf right? < 1291320952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easy enough to condition on read/write being present < 1291320953 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1291320967 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, mplayer is desyncing audio... < 1291321001 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-autosync 30 doesn't seem to help... < 1291321020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I mean, 116K is really rather dismal, considering that useful dietlibc-based programs can be on the order of 7K. < 1291321022 0 :Guest37696!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1291321034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd say that these changes together could lead to, say, a 30K pi, as a first estimate. < 1291321046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps a bit bigger. < 1291321123 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I like how you don't have /usr. < 1291321142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I like that too! It's yet another reason for Vorpal to say he'll never use it ever. < 1291321150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And lord knows I don't have nearly enough of those. < 1291321209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Maybe I'll be all old-school Unix and make /usr the home directory. :) < 1291321224 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hah. < 1291321248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Fun fact: /usr/bin originates from the fact there was, in research unix 4 or 5 or something, a user/group named bin, whose home directory -- /usr/bin -- had a bunch of tools. < 1291321253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I have seen this personally on an emulator. < 1291321264 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's amazing. < 1291321323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Then some luser decided that usr didn't mean usr because there was a single directory in there with binaries, and broke up everything. < 1291321342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And now, kids, even today, it is used to justify silly partitioning schemes where nothing has any leg room. < 1291321345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~th end~ < 1291321346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*the end < 1291321369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: "Berkeley Yacc (byacc) is generally conceded to be the best yacc variant available. In contrast to bison, it is written to avoid dependencies upon a particular compiler." < 1291321376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: challenge: write a less objectively-agreed-upon statement than that < 1291321378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, than the first sentence < 1291321392 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf: running this reversi-algorithm against itself gave a pretty pattern looking like an arrow. A symmetrical one in colours < 1291321394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The Holocaust is generally conceded to have been a wonderful event full of puppies and unicorns." < 1291321404 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes to take a screenshot < 1291321410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not insulting byacc, just loling at the sentence) < 1291321447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: btw, according to my understanding of BSD/MIT/GPL, I have to include the license, with copyright notice, on every system that installs the package. is this true? < 1291321451 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: "Berkeley Yacc (byacc) is the One True Yacc." < 1291321473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: "This is not the yacc you are looking for." < 1291321490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: "OS/2 is widely regarded to be the best and most widely-used server operating system." < 1291321492 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :berkeley yacc is best yacc < 1291321510 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291321517 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just like North Korea is best Korea. < 1291321536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: That is simply a factual statement. < 1291321540 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THANK YOU, COMRADE OBVIOUS < 1291321564 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote berkeley yacc is best yacc Just like North Korea is best Korea. THANK YOU, COMRADE OBVIOUS < 1291321580 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alas, hackego just pinged out < 1291321596 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I hear South... no, wait, they have professional StarCraft players. < 1291321605 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: You're welcome, Comrade. < 1291321607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hackego totally needs to read the clog logs when it reconnects and perform all the actions there < 1291321607 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :North is clearly superior. < 1291321610 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, very strange result: http://sporksirc.net/~anmaster/tmp/reversi-ab_prune_against_self.png < 1291321611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(after quoting them, naturally) < 1291321621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: wtf: running this reversi-algorithm against itself gave a pretty pattern looking like an arrow. A symmetrical one in colours < 1291321625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "in colours" made me think "colourful" < 1291321627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am disappointed < 1291321627 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Televised and popular, no less. < 1291321633 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: They even make product endorsements. < 1291321635 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, err what? < 1291321644 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how would that work? < 1291321649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: like N-colour reversi! < 1291321650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehow < 1291321653 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that would be nice < 1291321661 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but anyway, the pattern is strange < 1291321665 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I am tempted to join the DPRK Appreciation Society. < 1291321689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[The My World Tour is an upcoming concert tour by Justin Bieber. It is his first official headlining tour, and is promoted by AEG Live, and Live Nation. The tour is anticipated to have multiple legs, and the supporting acts for the first will be Sean Kingston and Jessica Jarrell. Pop girl group The Stunners will also serve as an opening act for the first twenty dates. The tour is set to support his first release, My World, and its follow-up, My < 1291321690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :World 2.0. Who wants Justin the most? Decide now... < 1291321690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CONTEST IS CLOSED. THE WINNER IS NORTH KOREA WITH 659141 VOTES]] < 1291321695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really hope he goes to North Korea. < 1291321697 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Democratic People's Republic of Korea" is such a mistranslation. < 1291321710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: But the BEST mistranslation! < 1291321711 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Democratic People's Republic of Choson". < 1291321733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oppressed Starver's Republic of Korea doesn't have the same ring to it. < 1291321756 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: They actually call the country Choson. For... No reason at all. < 1291321768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :corea < 1291321809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, that poll isn't official < 1291321811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LAME < 1291321845 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseon_Dynasty < 1291321888 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Okay, okay, so it has historical relevance. < 1291321904 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But still: the North and South can't even agree on what to call the country. < 1291321928 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ROK is Han, DPRK is Choson... < 1291321967 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION thought Han referred to ethnic chinese < 1291321969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I went to put #kitten on freenode but it's REGISTERED so I'm going to make it on OFTC^WBest Free Software Network. < 1291321979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Be there or be oblong. < 1291321988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obloid. < 1291322166 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh... There's apparently second cause of IPv6 making things "slow" besides the "computer thinks it has IPv6 but doesn't"-problem: IPv6 routing is a lot more unstable than IPv4 routing... < 1291322278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so can I get the green-light to use write(2)/read(2) if they're present? < 1291322517 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Probably something to do with *significantly* fewer routers being IPv6. < 1291322520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq is just not cool enough for OFTC. < 1291322715 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or actually it is "computer doesn't have a route to destination via IPv6" problem. < 1291322737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OFTC once declared war on pikhq. < 1291322788 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION declares war on pikhq. < 1291322851 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION declares pikhq on war < 1291322887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: OFTC! #KITTEN! SQUARENESS DONATED TO ALL NOT PRESENT! < 1291322912 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or the great IPv6 routing split... < 1291323072 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: ? < 1291323105 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some IPv6 upstreams have seriously incomplete routing table... < 1291323113 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*facepalm* < 1291323185 0 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1291323190 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Guest24183 < 1291323198 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fun issues ensue if are trying to reach host that is unroutable over IPv6 but reachable over IPv4. < 1291323219 0 :Guest24183!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Gregor < 1291323256 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Han_(trilobite) < 1291323304 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: yon bots are dead < 1291323319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bon mots are dead < 1291323320 0 :wareya_!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291323431 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: My friggin' everything was dead, patience :P < 1291323502 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1291323502 0 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1291323505 0 :wareya!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1291323540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: PRGMR RELIABLE UPTIME < 1291323856 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*pfft* < 1291323869 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NASA discovers life form that uses arsenic instead of phosphorous. < 1291323892 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, hmm. < 1291323894 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291323900 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's... Woah. < 1291323909 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, yes, yes it is. < 1291323918 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They _don't have DNA or RNA_. < 1291323939 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, they have completely different nucleic acids. < 1291323961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1291323967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arse-nic. < 1291323986 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1291324108 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, apparetly only the PO4 linking groups have been replaced by AsO4 groups... < 1291324239 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's still pretty astounding. < 1291324333 0 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1291324747 0 :sjn!sjn@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1291324764 0 :sjn!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1291324922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1291325373 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do I get this bloody computer to tell me my CPU model? < 1291325412 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PRAY < 1291325528 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O god, tell me in thine infinite wisdom the model of mine unworthy CPU. < 1291325591 0 :MigoMipo_!~John@84-217-15-58.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291325661 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291326425 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@i-75.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1291326703 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291327101 0 :Zuu!zuu@0x55529f1b.adsl.cybercity.dk JOIN :#esoteric < 1291327416 0 :perdito|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291327426 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x264 is officially ridiculous. < 1291327432 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://x264.nl/developers/Dark_Shikari/Flash/UltraLowBitrateAnime.mp4 67 kbps encode. < 1291327442 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did not omit a digit there. < 1291327449 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sixty-seven kilobits per second. < 1291327560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha < 1291327693 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Dark Shikari claims he should redo that encode, because x264 has gotten better since. < 1291327979 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291328532 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291328992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fog < 1291329149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: MC < 1291329156 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nooooooooooooooooooooooo < 1291329163 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You: addicted. < 1291329172 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU HAVE BECOME AS UNTO VORPAL < 1291329287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Actually, I'm just bored and MC without anyone else there is boring. < 1291329296 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what? don't insult me. I had other stuff to to today. I haven't been on < 1291329317 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I was actually mocking elliott there. < 1291329330 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, and insulting me at the same time < 1291329339 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since he went on about you being addicted whenever the server died and you asked ineiros why. < 1291329347 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, indeed :P < 1291329356 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he is way more addicted than me < 1291329375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Seriously? < 1291329380 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't actually play often at all. < 1291329382 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just hated being interrupted in a task. < 1291329385 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in any task < 1291329385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't mined in days. < 1291329392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact I've done nothing in days. < 1291329395 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you been on doing other stuff though < 1291329400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Like? < 1291329402 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I saw you jumping that water fall < 1291329416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which waterfall? The one you made yesterday? < 1291329422 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the one I made yes < 1291329435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You did that and *also* made it, so that does not demonstrate that I am "way more" addicted in any way. < 1291329439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just demonstrates that I do in fact play it. < 1291329460 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed but you have been complaining about no one being on today < 1291329468 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I almost never complained about the place being empty < 1291329481 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I've been rather bored today. Also I think I've complained twice. < 1291329496 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, I haven't counted < 1291329501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:58:12 is nobody on minecraft? :( < 1291329504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Phantom_Hoover: MC < 1291329507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's all < 1291329516 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway then you don't have to chat with people, instead you can get on building stuff! < 1291329519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, I also bugged Phantom_Hoover about it in #kitten :P < 1291329529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The only thing I want to build is the Cube and that needs the Server. < 1291329545 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you could locate an area, and start marking out the boundaries < 1291329561 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, stuff like that just need a handful of dirt or cobblestone blocks < 1291329562 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you bugged me because you couldn't deal with the fact that a photo of a kitten is not in fact a very good logo. < 1291329578 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, photos are almost never good logos < 1291329587 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, as I told him! < 1291329589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Not only was it a kitten, it was *on a computer*. < 1291329597 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :logos need to be more... symbolic, line art < 1291329600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you suggesting that there is something better than a kitten on a computer for ANY PURPOSE WHATSOEVER? < 1291329607 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it would work if it was lineart of a kitten on a computer < 1291329610 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a photo: no < 1291329612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, you could locate an area, and start marking out the boundaries < 1291329612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, stuff like that just need a handful of dirt or cobblestone blocks < 1291329617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm fairly sure I need to make my own sea. < 1291329620 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but it was a photo! And a jpeg! With a detailed and necessary background! < 1291329622 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm < 1291329635 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://filebin.ca/tvzvtn/sintel_trailer-240-pass3.mkv < 1291329641 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a 768k video. < 1291329642 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : make your own sea with cobblestone blocks < 1291329644 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it doesn't look bad. < 1291329650 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(aside from being 240p) < 1291329654 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I suggest to the east because it will be closer to spawn than any other suitably large area < 1291329672 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and minecarts will be close. Skyway will need a bit more < 1291329675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't care about proximity to spawn, only civilisation. < 1291329682 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The Blender Foundation". < 1291329683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also Server said that he probably doesn't want it within 500 metres of spawn. < 1291329686 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, it is close to civilisation too < 1291329694 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm < 1291329699 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, north-west then? < 1291329713 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, if that isn't related with the Society for the Advancement of Blenders I will be sorely disappointed. < 1291329717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Perhaps. Or I could just flood a large area on the path of the skyway from Vorpal to Hoover. < 1291329722 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ♥ x264. < 1291329722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Blender as in the 3D tool. < 1291329730 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sssshhhhh! < 1291329731 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that would work too < 1291329739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'd also need TNT to get rid of some of the bigger mountains, probably. < 1291329755 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, as long as it is out of sight from my extruding glass room < 1291329759 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, (on far) < 1291329767 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, how many opinions do you have about multimedia encoding? < 1291329777 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or if visible on far, at least some distance away < 1291329779 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Many! < 1291329789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: If it isn't, that's not my fault; you don't own a huge radius around your mountain. < 1291329792 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Rule #1: x264 is the best. Period. < 1291329794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, it's made out of glass, dammit, it's transparent. < 1291329799 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I want a nature view, not looking up the side of an industrial building :P < 1291329821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yeah... you do realise this thing is gonna be darn pretty, right? < 1291329830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's ENTIRELY MADE OUT OF GLASS. With nice LAVA making it shine. < 1291329833 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and yes sure but not completely, anyway that valley below the skyway entrance I have built stuff like a lava fall in < 1291329839 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sure it is, but so is the nature < 1291329839 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, why? < 1291329842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well I'm not building /there/. < 1291329847 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, :) < 1291329850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably 1/3 of the way to Hoover or whatever. < 1291329854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wherever is flattest. < 1291329856 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that should be fine < 1291329862 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably < 1291329891 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It is literally the best encoder. To match its quality with an encoder for any *other* compression scheme, you need to *at least double* the bit rate. < 1291329894 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :checking on map atm < 1291329916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Such a shame that H.264 is so proprietary. < 1291329943 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And for h.264, it is similar in quality but slightly higher than the highest-quality proprietary encoder, and it beats all the others about as badly as it beats, say, MPEG-2 encoders. < 1291329956 0 :MigoMipo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Quit < 1291329968 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It is a shame, indeed. < 1291330018 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you see that kind of rectangular mountain on http://a322.org/mc/topo-2010-11-29.png between me and PH? Just above the skyway. Quite close to my place. There is a blue area below it (lake). Beyond that mountain is quite flat. Why not there (and save the mountain as it is, it is pretty) < 1291330029 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it seems to be a solution that fits everyone < 1291330049 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The UK doesn't acknowledge software patents, does it? < 1291330052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://x264.nl/developers/Dark_Shikari/Flash/UltraLowBitrateAnime.mp4 67 kbps encode. < 1291330054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just actually played this < 1291330063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :w.t.f. pikhq i was expecting lameish quality < 1291330067 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: And that's an *old* demonstration. < 1291330068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's better than youtube! < 1291330078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Maybe. I'll see about it. < 1291330093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I would prefer to use an existing sea. (Are there any known seas that are 128x128 big?) < 1291330099 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291330099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :128x128 is pretty big. < 1291330109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, how far does Far see? < 1291330145 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: If you reduce the resolution to about what Youtube uses for its lowest-quality videos, but keep the bit rate, you end up having an almost transparent encode. < 1291330152 0 :Sasha2!~WHAT@75-174-222-54.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291330153 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See my filebin post. < 1291330177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Hmm... I just had a stupid thought that maybe might sorta work. < 1291330193 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm < 1291330205 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : In fact, how far does Far see? <-- not sure, pretty far < 1291330210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Have lossy x264 encoding. For each frame, store a compressed -- PNG or whatever -- image diff of the lossy encoding to the lossless (i.e. lossless - lossy or whatever) < 1291330219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 128 blocks far? < 1291330228 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, more than that I think < 1291330234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Aww. < 1291330237 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I can see from me to fizzie < 1291330244 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, a bit more than that < 1291330245 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure that would be an *astounding* lossless compression scheme, but it would certainly work decently. < 1291330247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not 128, I don't think. < 1291330260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Would it beat your zero-quantisation encodes? < 1291330270 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Far sees a bit less than 200 blocks, but I'd say it's over 128. < 1291330280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I can't imagine the diffs being *too* big, even on a relatively low bitrate... < 1291330284 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can almost see the other end of PH's ship from one end. < 1291330288 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'll measure on the map < 1291330291 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't *think* so. < 1291330292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Then again, it is every single frame... < 1291330293 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed < 1291330302 0 :Sasha!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1291330311 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Though it would probably beat everything not x264 anyways. :P < 1291330320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"You Must Learn JavaScript" ;; no I mustn't, you webfag. < 1291330343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It’s my belief that every single programmer should learn JavaScript." ;; one day you will discover that people write programs that don't get shown in Safari < 1291330363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Knowing JavaScript well is probably one of the most challenging and rewarding things you can do as a programmer." < 1291330364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1291330368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is learning javascript challenging at all < 1291330370 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, about 190 I'd say < 1291330386 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could even be 192. :p < 1291330392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably 192, yeah. < 1291330392 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like that < 1291330393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1291330400 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is approx, I measured on map < 1291330411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but there's no power of two near 192 other than... 192. < 1291330417 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1291330424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1291330426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but there's no power of two near 190 other than... 192. < 1291330435 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :192 is not a power of two either, but still. < 1291330454 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and I believe it might be inexact. As in: a chunk is either visible or not < 1291330469 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the distance I measured was diagonal < 1291330473 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that would be relevant < 1291330486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Close enough! < 1291330514 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: As for existing seas, a 128x128 block would fit to the big sea that's to east of spawn (not immediately east, but further; it starts about as far from spawn than Mt. Vorpal is, euclidinially speaking. < 1291330523 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: BTW: Youtube's video bitrates start at 250kbps and go up from there. < 1291330551 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I can see a distance that is at least 194 (near upper door entrance to end of huge stairs < 1291330557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Is it just me, or do YouTube videos load painfully slowly? < 1291330559 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which indicates it is probably per chunk < 1291330562 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's 250kbps for the 240p videos they had at the very start of the site. < 1291330562 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not per block < 1291330580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yeah, but Server doesn't really want it within 500 blocks of spawn. < 1291330590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: So I'm better off starting at civilisation and going from there. < 1291330605 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it would be 300 blocks away < 1291330609 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you could fit two 128x128 blocks in the big seas to the west, but those are pretty far. < 1291330610 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :definitely not visible from spawn < 1291330634 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, not in one of them any more < 1291330647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I do not plan to make *two* 128x128x128 cubes. :p < 1291330666 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Hm? < 1291330669 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, presumably you mean the one with a reed-lined shore? < 1291330681 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, near that "easter egg"? < 1291330683 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I meant the other one. < 1291330700 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To north of the reed-lined-shore one. < 1291330704 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah because I built a free-standing waterfall over ther < 1291330708 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1291330709 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I saw it. < 1291330713 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291330718 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, tried it with a boat? < 1291330729 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. (I borrowed your boat.) < 1291330743 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, right < 1291330799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Are *you* too boring to Minecraft today, too? < 1291330821 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I'm just about to go to sleep, actually. < 1291330829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: So boering. < 1291331131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :test < 1291331195 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291331211 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'll make a map with some suggestions for possible placements within existing oceans < 1291331214 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also fun: the source video, at 480p lossless x264, hits DVD target bitrates... < 1291331301 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, I head-estimated some numbers earlier. If you intend to empty 128x128x16 (a very low-end estimate assuming depth of 16) blocks of water one by one, and assuming one operation per second (I'm not sure what sort of overall throughput you'd get, but it's in the ballpark) that's take 262144 seconds = about 72 solid hours. < 1291331354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes, yes; I'm trying to think of *other* ways to drain the water other than doing it block-by-block. < 1291331370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Suggestions welcome :P < 1291331372 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does TNT work in water? < 1291331521 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no < 1291331523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie's silence is not reassuring. < 1291331541 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've read something about safely removing TNT by detonating it underwater, so I'd guess no. < 1291331548 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, TNT still generate shockwave in water. But it does not destroy blocks < 1291331553 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is used to build TNT cannons < 1291331593 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The wiki-page says "TNT can clear water and lava. -- However, if the TNT falls in water, the explosion will not destroy any blocks at all but still cause damage." -- which is quite unclear. < 1291331600 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, smelting 128*128*16 (cube walls and ten interior levels, again a rather low estimate) blocks of sand into glass will take 728 hours (30 days). (And burn 32768 blocks of coal, or 2622 buckets of lava.) < 1291331634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Um, I was going to get the sand delivered to me in glass form. < 1291331641 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what about placing the blocks assuming he had the glass? < 1291331660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think skipping the many-months-long process of gathering 81 thousand blocks of sand and smelting them all, which is trivially feasible, just really boring, is acceptable. < 1291331700 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, it's the same amount of blocks than in the water estimate earlier, so assuming block/second throughput, another 72 hours. < 1291331723 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, fizzie: http://sporksirc.net/~anmaster/tmp/placement.png < 1291331726 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@2001:4428:251:1:221:27ff:fece:82fb JOIN :#esoteric < 1291331726 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1291331726 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1291331755 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, alt 3 which would be best is within 500 blocks < 1291331755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Anyway, I'd actually have to empty 128*128*64 blocks of water. < 1291331773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think 500 blocks was... not entirely serious. < 1291331774 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no. Since water only goes down to about 50 < 1291331775 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1291331782 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :64-50 for height < 1291331788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, okay, but definitely not 16. < 1291331796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Anyway I'd build the actual levels over a long period of time. < 1291331799 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :64-50 is 14. < 1291331799 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed. that is 14 < 1291331800 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1291331814 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The seas aren't very deep. < 1291331835 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed. And going down to 50 is rare. 52-53 is much more common < 1291331843 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a few smaller pits of 50 or so < 1291331844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :True. < 1291331848 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still, you'd need to empty up that much space in general, so there. < 1291331861 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you only get 52 out near the middle < 1291331862 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yeah < 1291331869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I never said it'd be easy. :p < 1291331877 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, still you need to mine a shitload of stuff below the sea < 1291331894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Or just use TNT... < 1291331901 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you can conjure up sand/grovel, I think the fastest way of getting rid of water is to just keep placing those blocks to fill it all up (they fall, so you can do a whole column without moving), then shovel/blow-up them away. < 1291331929 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, you could do the torch trick < 1291331931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Problem is, I'd have to have walls in place already... meaning TNT would be unwise. < 1291331945 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could TNT in the middle, though. < 1291331956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :True. < 1291331957 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still a shitload of TNT to do it < 1291331960 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And anyway, shovels are fast, faster than "take a bucket, dump it down". < 1291331962 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure I'd trust you with that < 1291331970 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if I was that admin that is) < 1291331986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I would do 9 buckets at a time, obviously. < 1291331988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yeah. < 1291331999 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how would 9 buckets help? < 1291332001 0 :Sasha!~WHAT@75-174-221-19.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291332003 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1291332007 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, elliott you can just empty it into another source < 1291332011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Larger period of monotony. < 1291332014 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, next to the one you are removing < 1291332019 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which is probably faster < 1291332022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, you can? Compress two sources? < 1291332023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weird. < 1291332041 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it's minecraft, what did you expect? < 1291332052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Anyway, conjuring up sand is not the issue here, as I've established. :p < 1291332081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, those who help construct it get bigger free-rented spaces. < 1291332086 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway since you don't plan water on top of the thing, getting rid of currents at the end should be ni issues < 1291332088 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :issue* < 1291332120 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I can provide a shitload of cobblestone to help you with it certainly. For scaffolding and such < 1291332126 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also a shitload of dirt < 1291332147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Work is more valuable than materials. :p < 1291332147 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have at least one large chest full of cobble + several partly filled ones < 1291332163 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, dirt: almost one filled < 1291332165 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not completely) < 1291332167 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, in order to give you 128*128*16 blocks of time, ineiros will have to repeat the /give command 4096 times, and it'd be 152 inventories worth. So I'd think you'd perhaps better wait until hMod time before the building in order for not to have to ask for glass all the time. < 1291332175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: He said he was going to automate it. < 1291332189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: He *can* just create a file with a huge number of commands, you know, and paste it in. < 1291332199 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, still you can decide on a place and put out markers there < 1291332204 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that you can do today < 1291332212 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so which of those places do you think is best? < 1291332215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm not going to be awake for long enough to research all the places today. < 1291332227 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but you can't really get more than one inventory full of glass at a time, the rest will probably go and disappear before you have time to get them. < 1291332229 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you saw the map I linked? < 1291332250 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is basically one of them if you don't want to be WAAY off from civilisation or have to build your own sea < 1291332258 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and building your own sea is probably more work < 1291332273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, but more impressive. :p < 1291332290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (And I wouldn't have to empty anything, if I built the underwater bit of the cube first. < 1291332291 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you know that the water-source duplication thing only happens on a flat surface right? < 1291332296 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, up to altitude 1 < 1291332299 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in < 1291332302 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could've crop-to-selection'd the map a bit. :p < 1291332310 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you will have to build layer by layer down < 1291332317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yeah... < 1291332318 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, there are other sites further away < 1291332322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: But I can get walls in before that. < 1291332323 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1291332329 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so I think emptying it will be less work < 1291332337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What I really need to do is get a bitmap image 128x128, side view, zoom in, and start planning. < 1291332338 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, unless you want like a 2x wide channel around it < 1291332348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to figure out how many floors there'll be, how to make sure level 0 has a floor there, etc. < 1291332349 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, besides it won't look natural without a LOT of work < 1291332364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also need to do experiments to determine how often I need lava lighting. < 1291332371 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, gimp: create new image, size 128x128 < 1291332374 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hopefully only once every two floors, where a floor is about 5 blocks high. < 1291332383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just hope that's enough. < 1291332389 0 :perdito|afk!~perdito@koln-4d0b6732.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291332400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Since I want lighting to seem even throughout the whole building, even a 1/3rd diminishing would probably be bad) < 1291332402 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you will certainly get lighting from below < 1291332410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: true < 1291332411 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1291332423 0 :Goosey!~goose124@99-60-156-25.lightspeed.elpstx.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291332427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know there's a formula or whatever but experimenting is easier. < 1291332431 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also you *will* misplace blocks sometimes when building it < 1291332433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Ha, how practical of me.) < 1291332435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I know! < 1291332441 0 :perdito|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :perdito < 1291332443 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can experiment with torches; that's only one level less bright than lava. < 1291332443 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which means you might need a few hundred blocks more < 1291332461 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they will be destroyed when you break them < 1291332482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: And I also need more glass for *other* things, which is why I'm just going to ask for 131,072 pieces of glass, because that's a nice round number. < 1291332486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2^17) < 1291332490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or thereabouts. < 1291332491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something like that. < 1291332493 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1291332497 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the other things being? < 1291332501 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, interior walls? < 1291332515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I need to build an underground tunnel to one of the first underground floors (the entrance; entering at ground level is fugly. So there'll just be a hole down to a glass, underwater tunnel connected to the cube.) < 1291332520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, interior walls. < 1291332523 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you realise that if you rent out space you need something that isn't glass to put things on < 1291332530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And also the fact that I need two floors for some floors to sandwich the lava. < 1291332534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I know that. < 1291332538 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and minecart tracks I believe won't go on glass < 1291332539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Probably cloth, since it's nice and white. < 1291332547 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and burns :P < 1291332556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yeah, well, don't let the lava out. :P < 1291332559 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1291332572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: And the bottom three levels will be completely obsidian-plated and lit with torches. < 1291332572 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you know those jumping embers from lava < 1291332573 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1291332575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1291332589 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, they don't hurt players but they *can* set fire to burnable blocks and burnable items < 1291332600 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you can't sensibly *get* 131072 blocks of glass at one time; even if ineiros generates that much by pasting in /give's, after your inventory is full, they'll just end up floating in the air where you were and disappear in 5-10 minutes. So you need some sort of glass-getting automation, and then you can just request as much as you actually need in sensibly-sized batches. < 1291332609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You do realise the lava has glass on either side? < 1291332611 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not sure if they will jump through glass < 1291332618 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I mean, considering how they are coded in general < 1291332625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm going to make like 50 large chests, durr. :P < 1291332628 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have seen them jump through stone < 1291332641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, I've never been hurt inside the Glass Room of Hoover's. < 1291332650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or rather < 1291332653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never seen any embers at all < 1291332660 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm < 1291332670 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe they jump up < 1291332672 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not down < 1291332683 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, requesting in batches is probably better since that way you don't need to load from the chest < 1291332699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, to hit anything other than glass, they'd have to get through glass *and* whatever floor is being used in that part. < 1291332711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, yeah, I probably will. But a batch should fill 3 large chests are so. < 1291332712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*or so. < 1291332715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I need a lot. :p < 1291332724 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1291332751 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you might want to build a cobblestone 130x130 container and empty the water in it. Maybe < 1291332758 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then build the thing inside < 1291332761 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then remove the cobble < 1291332772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, most likely. < 1291332792 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also it needs a boatlevator. < 1291332797 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do you know how far mine goes? < 1291332798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, you can build that. :p < 1291332803 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, in altitude < 1291332809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Down near bedrock, yes. I successfully rode it today. < 1291332815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see how it'd work with 20 or so stops, though. < 1291332825 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 5 above bedrock to 15 or so below max alt < 1291332826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: At least I'll be able to proudly say that without the laws of physics changing, nobody will ever make a bigger cube than this. < 1291332835 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm stops would be an issue yeah < 1291332846 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but maybe one to get to ground floor and then one to get to near max < 1291332860 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, remember it needs like 7 blocks at the top due to jumping up quite a bit < 1291332869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I was just going to use regular stairs; I mean, it wouldn't be that big a deal. < 1291332878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although stairs are ugley. < 1291332885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'd use wood.) < 1291332899 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1291332908 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that would take forever to go up < 1291332920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Not *really*; have you ever walked up the bedrock-to-max Stairs? < 1291332927 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sure I have < 1291332928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It only takes a minute or two, and that's for all the way. < 1291332940 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and boatlevator takes.... 8 seconds or so? < 1291332948 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus maybe up to 20 to wait for the boat < 1291332950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, but there needs to be a second or two at every single stop. < 1291332957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's say there's 20 floors; that's about right. < 1291332958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1.5 * 20 = 30. < 1291332963 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1291332964 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1291332964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it has to take more than 30 seconds. < 1291332972 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1291332977 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it won't be 20 if it is that short < 1291332978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's also, well, not that reliable if someone turns. < 1291332987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Eh? < 1291332997 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1291333005 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought 20 was the delay < 1291333006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's say a floor's 6 high on average, taking into account that some of them will have 3-thick floors (extra lava layer, and ceiling); that's 21 floors. < 1291333008 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :floors < 1291333010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1291333029 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway boatlevator is not practical for anything less than, say, 60 blocks at a time < 1291333034 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm I seen another design < 1291333038 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that allowed entry on side < 1291333044 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and used a drop shaft to get down < 1291333049 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I haven't tried it < 1291333061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Still; if anyone presses A or D there's a complete transport blackout in the Cube. :p < 1291333065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least stairs never die. < 1291333069 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it might work if we only want to go up to one place from a lot of different ones < 1291333076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: http://src.chromium.org/viewvc/chrome/trunk/src/build/whitespace_file.txt?r1=67679&r2=67678&pathrev=67679 < 1291333078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Chrome: Somewhat sparta. < 1291333079 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, true < 1291333080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Sparta. < 1291333116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Anyway I'm up for just about anything; the current plan is to just get it built, with lighting and completely empty floors. < 1291333125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Then we can smash a hole in it for an entrance, and go from there. < 1291333156 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, making holes in the lava levels would be annoying < 1291333162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What would be cool is having people's homes that are multi-storey; i.e. the regular floors aren't there, just an entrance and then whatever they want inside that block. < 1291333177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, it would. I might figure out where to poke holes in the ceilings first. < 1291333177 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't think you can place ladders on glass anyway so they are out of question I guess < 1291333189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I can always put some cloth against a wall... < 1291333193 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1291333201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Hell, I'd be fine lining every floor with cloth too. < 1291333211 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't think you need that < 1291333213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As long as the whole thing is transparent from a distance. :p < 1291333217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Carpet! < 1291333225 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, just that you can't place "those not really blocks" on there < 1291333236 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :such as torches, tracks, and what not < 1291333241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's so a flaw in Minecraft, though; why can't they go on glass. :p < 1291333262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The roof will be fun, you'll be able to climb up there and jump off into the sea. < 1291333278 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it's a feature I bet. A feature to not need to make a texture for the back of a torch mounted against a wall or something < 1291333281 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAYBE < 1291333289 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who knows < 1291333306 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also minecart on glass: that would never work < 1291333311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: why not! < 1291333326 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I mean, it is completely unrealistic. Consider the load. Oh wait, this is minecraft. < 1291333332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Precisely :P < 1291333346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it was realistic, you could fall from a distance onto glass and it'd shatter. < 1291333356 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1291333371 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you wouldn't get cubical cloth from sheep < 1291333381 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it wouldn't last as an outdoor road anyway < 1291333426 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A cubic metre of cloth from a single sheep is a bit dubious too, even assuming you skip some steps there. < 1291333443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: More than that; you get two or three blocks. < 1291333480 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also obsidian a volcanic glass says wikipedia < 1291333481 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1291333487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, lava. < 1291333504 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Obsidian has been used for blades in surgery, as well-crafted obsidian blades have a cutting edge many times sharper than high-quality steel surgical scalpels, the cutting edge of the blade being only about 3 nanometres thick." < 1291333508 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow that is cool < 1291333514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, nice. < 1291333518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See, in Minecraft, it's just a bitch to mine. :P < 1291333532 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and diamond should be harder actually < 1291333533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it will be good for the last three levels, for when the world goes to shit! < 1291333550 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Even the sharpest metal knife has a jagged, irregular blade when viewed under a strong enough microscope; when examined even under an electron microscope an obsidian blade is still smooth and even. One study found that obsidian incisions produced narrower scars, fewer inflammatory cells, and less granulation tissue in a group of rats." < 1291333553 0 :sftp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291333557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All the supplies and tools you need to rebuild the world, obsidian-lined for extra protection, and with indestructible bedrock base. < 1291333566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing could be safer -- and by god don't fuck it up this time around. < 1291333570 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Obsidian is also used for ornamental purposes and as a gemstone. It possesses the property of presenting a different appearance according to the manner in which it is cut: when cut in one direction it is jet black; in another it is glistening gray. "Apache tears" are small rounded obsidian nuggets embedded within a grayish-white perlite matrix." < 1291333579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is very pretty. < 1291333610 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, will you mine that obsidian? < 1291333614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Apparently this removal of comprehension notation was due to the fact that generalising comprehensions to monads made errors arising from comprehensions difficult for novices to understand." < 1291333617 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I mean seriously that will be a pain < 1291333618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahahaha < 1291333625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like that's the most of the problem with GHC's errors! < 1291333632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, I'll probably just make it lava and wet it. :p < 1291333638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(TODO: figure out how to do vertical lava.) < 1291333641 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, they removed comprehension? < 1291333645 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for what? < 1291333648 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lists? < 1291333648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Monad comprehension. < 1291333650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In 1998. < 1291333651 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291333660 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1291333667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But lol @ removing it because it makes errors hard to understand; GHC mocks this pitiful attempt. < 1291333679 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I can't figure out what monad comprehension is exactly < 1291333689 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, I can't imagine what the concept would be < 1291333691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: List comprehension, but for monads. < 1291333709 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1291333710 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1291333714 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that makes my head spin < 1291333716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: See http://blog.n-sch.de/2010/11/27/fun-with-monad-comprehensions/. < 1291333722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It explains it nicely. < 1291333724 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Plinths for audio turntables have been made of obsidian since the 1970s; e.g. the greyish-black SH-10B3 plinth by Technics." < 1291333753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hrmm... < 1291333759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You, Only Person Who Will Use Kitten Who Isn't Me! < 1291333780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Should the main libc be dietlibc or uClibc? uClibc executables aren't as small as dietlibc in my experience -- like 17K vs 7K. < 1291333790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: And they have a lot of "why is that in there?" symbols. < 1291333796 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1291333809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ? < 1291333818 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :read part of that link < 1291333832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1291333838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oh, and I'm not quite sure dietlibc does locales... but anyway. < 1291333910 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ugh if it doesn't < 1291333938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yeah, yeah, it's all experimental, let me figure things out first. < 1291333946 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291333952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I just don't want to settle for the second-best libc. :p < 1291333967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (And I put a lot of effort into getting dietlibc to compile with pcc, let me tell you! I doubt uClibc will compile with non-gcc any time soon...) < 1291333975 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well one lacking locales surely can't be the best :P < 1291333986 0 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.33 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291334009 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, on MC? < 1291334021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not this second, but I can be in two seconds; are you going on? < 1291334023 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291334042 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I just logged on < 1291334048 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will be on for a few minutes at least < 1291334143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Coming on. < 1291334192 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Okay, maybe a US English-only system would be tolerable. < 1291334205 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Because dietlibc is just so insanely small. < 1291334317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It might support locales, I don't know. I might be able to patch in locale support./ < 1291334327 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably doesn't. < 1291334328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: But really I'm just not sure; uClibc definitely has wider support. < 1291334330 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would be code size. < 1291334368 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Downside to trying to have uclibc and dietlibc both: you will need a seperate lib dir for each. < 1291334389 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As they are entirely seperate ABIs.