< 1285632222 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BAHAHAHAHAHA < 1285632236 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Man Buys Segway Inc., Dies on Segway < 1285632259 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep :D < 1285632267 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just imagine though < 1285632271 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :driving off a cliff on a Segway < 1285632275 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1) how the hell do you manage to do that?! < 1285632280 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2) MOST AWESOME LAST SECONDS OF LIFE EVER < 1285632291 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently he died after he "plunged 30 feet off a rocky cliff" < 1285632307 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, now Segways will have a warning label: "WARNING: This device does not protect against gravity." < 1285632318 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how stupid do you have to be like < 1285632325 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're near the edge of a cliff - firstly why are you there - < 1285632329 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :secondly how do you keep leaning forwards to the edge < 1285632331 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then not stop leaning forwards < 1285632335 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and freaking lean off the edge of the cliff < 1285632340 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT IS NOT HARD TO STOP A SEGWAY MOVING < 1285632373 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Can I netcat you something for ultra-temporary storage on codu? :P < 1285632376 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's 500 ks < 1285632423 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Why would you need that? Just transfer it guest-to-host < 1285639773 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1285639773 0 :clog!nef@bespin.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1285639784 0 :Quadlex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are elves sensitive to chromium kinda like humans who can't eat Gluten? < 1285639796 0 :Quadlex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh, no lembas for me please, I've got Coealiac" < 1285639814 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadlex: iron, usually. but Gregor is a special case. < 1285639815 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, they're like humans that are sensitive to chromium X-P < 1285639831 0 :Quadlex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or is it like jews and pork? < 1285639839 0 :Quadlex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Ahh, I see. So he's a freak then:P < 1285639868 0 :Quadlex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Girls SAY they want a sensitive guy, but they get disgusted the first time you cry when Sesamie Street is over for the day < 1285639881 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very freaky. i hear he's got a foot picture. < 1285639897 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you can see it, if you'd like (to vomit) < 1285640056 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1285642862 0 :Quadlex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A foot picture? < 1285642941 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is way too tired to think properly
< 1285642957 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: logic is overrated anyhow < 1285643357 0 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1285643455 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Question: Did I get noticably more hyper after, say, summer 2009? < 1285643497 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that when you stopped taking the pills? < 1285643516 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As a matter of fact, yes < 1285643523 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Literally < 1285643526 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :JOKE: RUINED < 1285643559 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In that case: Is that when you developed a hyperbroad Long Iiiiiiiiiisland accent? :P < 1285643670 0 :Kordalien!~chatzilla@adsl-71-141-89-187.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1285643982 0 :Quadlex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Methylphenidate? < 1285644041 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tried that. Couldn't swallow it < 1285644058 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um, in Concerta form < 1285644093 0 :Quadlex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, OK. < 1285644097 0 :Quadlex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I recently had to go back on it < 1285644102 0 :Quadlex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stupid... work. < 1285644416 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1285645141 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just did a search of cars for the maximum fuel economy. < 1285645146 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They also had a list by MINIMUM fuel economy. < 1285645150 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I was expecting: SUVs. < 1285645153 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I found: sports cars. < 1285645163 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF? Sports cars get bad mileage? Why do they even exist? < 1285645212 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamborghini_Murciélago How can a car this streamlined get 13MPG /highway/? SUVs get 13MPG /city/? WTFWTFWTF < 1285645469 0 :Quadlex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has to carry the passenger's ego < 1285645481 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: it accelerates really quickly < 1285645490 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadlex: Ahhhhhhh of course. < 1285645499 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: But surely it doesn't need all that power to MAINTAIN SPEED ON A HIGHWAY X_X < 1285645511 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is, it doesn't just waste energy < 1285645518 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it does < 1285645585 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably in order to accelerate really quickly you have to design the engine in such a way that it's minimum power output is still really high < 1285645600 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has a ton of cylinders and stuff < 1285645617 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bleh. < 1285645621 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, what speed is that? the speed limit, or the usual speed of a lambo driver? < 1285645623 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People who drive these should be shot. < 1285645879 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: you'll love this site http://www.wreckedexotics.com/ < 1285647144 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1285647573 0 :hailtothethief!~oh@97-115-142-152.spkn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1285648069 0 :sshc_!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric < 1285648074 0 :hailtothethief!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1285648234 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1285648941 0 :hailtothethief!~oh@97-115-142-152.spkn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1285650746 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1285650871 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1285650966 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1285652065 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1285653605 0 :augur!~augur@208.58.6.161 JOIN :#esoteric < 1285654021 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poll: what's the most ridiculous thing you've ever seen printed in hardcopy < 1285654298 0 :sftp_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1285654322 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The safe times [for sex] are the week before and the week of ovulation." [Note: I only saw that in a book of stupidest things ever said] < 1285655691 0 :webquint!803d1a28@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.61.26.40 JOIN :#esoteric < 1285655697 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, in the comments of one of Diaspora's page's statuses, I mention the security issues and post a link < 1285655724 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"@[my name], its the internet, security on here isnt real" < 1285655736 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Note: THat's not one of the devs) < 1285655745 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope < 1285655783 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: the dumbest thing I've ever seen in print is the GCC 3.4 manual. Can you top that? < 1285655812 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's bad about the GCC 3.4 manual? < 1285655824 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's thick < 1285655838 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also someone went through and nitpicked all the errors < 1285655860 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and someone got a GCC dev to sign it (he wrote "et al." after Richard Stallman on the cover). < 1285655867 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the dedication was "get a life you dumb fucks" < 1285656196 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :laaaaaaawl at signing it by writing "et al." < 1285656263 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: he also signed it properly inside < 1285656272 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are some other gems < 1285656286 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been told that at one point he wrote 'you missed one', but I haven't actually seen it < 1285656373 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1285656399 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 the CSC < 1285656428 0 :cal153!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1285657035 0 :tombom!~tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1285657457 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1285659423 0 :myndzi\!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1285659507 0 :myndzi!myndzi@c-24-19-39-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1285659670 0 :Slereah!~nigger@ANantes-259-1-117-101.w92-139.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1285659672 0 :Quadlex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Blog updated, my work on the internet is done < 1285659926 0 :webquint!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1285660242 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1285660799 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1285660800 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1285661466 0 :atrapado!~ro@193.144.79.241 JOIN :#esoteric < 1285662788 0 :Kordalien!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1285664183 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1285664273 0 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:32ae:1:4261:86ff:fe96:fca JOIN :#esoteric < 1285665740 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1285666202 0 :wareya_!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1285666383 0 :wareya!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1285668858 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1285671862 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1285676053 0 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1285678660 0 :webquint!803d1a28@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.61.26.40 JOIN :#esoteric < 1285678739 0 :webquint!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To whomever was asking about quines that execute themselves into infinity, I found a really cute example: kbde.sourceforge.net/kbde/man/kbde.1.html < 1285678764 0 :webquint!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"kbde --key=ArrowU --key=Enter --background Under bash shell will do something cool." < 1285678846 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1285679110 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheaty, but hilarious < 1285679289 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Later < 1285679323 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1285680167 0 :webquint!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1285680378 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1285681114 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1285681136 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi people, I need a quick insanity check: < 1285681160 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a) does anyone know of a dynamically scoped call-by-name language? b) how insane am I to have invented/reinvented dynamically scoped lambda calculus? < 1285681181 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sample code: (\y.y)(\f.f(y(f))) < 1285681580 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :absurd, taking the train was actually cheaper than the bus today. < 1285681595 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not much, but usually it is the other way around < 1285681778 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only downside is that with buses around here, if you change to another one then the cost of the first travel is substracted from the second travel. And due to that not working on trains, the total ended up a tiny amount more expensive with the train. But at least I didn't have to wait an hour (the first bus was late, so I missed the connection). And I arrived home before that other bus would have got me < 1285681778 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : home. < 1285681896 0 :ais523_!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1285681899 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1285681901 0 :ais523_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ais523 < 1285681907 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523_, hi, I guess you missed what I said? < 1285681922 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[13:45] absurd, taking the train was actually cheaper than the bus today. < 1285681923 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[13:46] not much, but usually it is the other way around < 1285681925 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the last I saw < 1285682084 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : only downside is that with buses around here, if you change to another one then the cost of the first travel is substracted from the second travel. And due to that not working on trains, the total ended up a tiny amount more expensive with the train. But at least I didn't have to wait an hour (the first bus was late, so I missed the connection). And I arrived home before that other bus would ha < 1285682084 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ve got me < 1285682087 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : home. < 1285682090 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, missed that then < 1285682116 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: heh, here in the UK it's the opposite < 1285682128 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, and yeah, it ended up just 5 SEK more expensive after adding in the "couldn't substract the first travel from the second" < 1285682133 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on buses, you have to pay for each bus separately, or else buy a day ticket that's more expensive but works on any number of buses < 1285682142 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is iirc about 0.5 £ or such < 1285682156 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the trains, the cost of the journey depends on the endpoints < 1285682156 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not on the route < 1285682159 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(except in a few cases, sometimes you're banned from going via London) < 1285682227 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :atrapado, well here it is that if you take another bus within 3 hours, of the last travel then you can discount. Inside the same zone (the city is one zone) that means 0 for the second travel. With country side busses that mean a reduced price. < 1285682238 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or if you go from country bus to city bus, 0 cost for second travel < 1285682245 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think you mispinged < 1285682249 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err yes < 1285682252 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed I did < 1285682259 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how did that happen < 1285682261 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285682318 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, anyway, I couldn't go by tain the whole way, I need to take bus to university, The station and the university are like at opposite ends of the city < 1285682349 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, here the station is as close to the University as it could theoretically be without being within University control < 1285682349 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and well, the switch to country side bus is just next to the station. Like 5 meters away actually. < 1285682357 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they share a boundary < 1285682360 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285682364 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, lucky you < 1285682369 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the station's even called "University" < 1285682374 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(amusingly, it doesn't actually say which one) < 1285682375 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285682384 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I normally take the bus, even though it doesn't go /quite/ as near < 1285682386 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, for trains that's a bit strange < 1285682410 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it depends on where the station is, I suppose < 1285682419 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :near a university and a major hospital is a rather obvious place for a station < 1285682440 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Birmingham's large enough that it has many tens of stations, not just Birmingham New Street in the centre) < 1285682441 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, the bus station next to the university is "Universitetet" (The University). Well I didn't travel from that one today, I went from one at the opposite side of the university. Still close < 1285682465 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but with city buses that isn't really a problem, two universities in one city is not likely < 1285682491 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hm two train stations in the university city here. One in the town I live in < 1285682560 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you a student? < 1285682563 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the hospital is way away too, About half the distance between the train station and the university.. But not straight between them. < 1285682565 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yes < 1285682567 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, why? < 1285682569 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just realised I don't actually know what you do < 1285682573 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which subject? < 1285682575 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, CS student < 1285682588 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, not particularly surprising given the topic of this channel... < 1285682602 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, except this is not "proper" CS in the classical sense but rather the more common type of CS. < 1285682614 0 :alise!~alise@91.105.65.44 JOIN :#esoteric < 1285682616 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :programming? software engineering? < 1285682618 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, hi alise < 1285682623 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : programming? software engineering? < 1285682624 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How off-topic! < 1285682627 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[13:38] hi people, I need a quick insanity check: < 1285682628 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, there is a lot more of that than alise would like yes < 1285682628 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[13:38] a) does anyone know of a dynamically scoped call-by-name language? b) how insane am I to have invented/reinvented dynamically scoped lambda calculus? < 1285682630 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[13:39] sample code: (\y.y)(\f.f(y(f))) < 1285682649 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what is call-by-name now again? < 1285682652 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (a) not as far as I can think (b) AWESOME < 1285682661 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Today's Astronomy Picture of the Day does not make an especially good wallpaper. < 1285682666 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, that it has dynamically scoped function names? < 1285682679 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in this case I mean) < 1285682680 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: when arguments are passed via evaluating the argument when it's used, in the context of the caller < 1285682696 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: basically every argument is (\-> arg) < 1285682696 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1285682697 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f x y < 1285682699 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.50.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1285682701 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is like, in normal languages, < 1285682703 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285682706 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f (\() -> x) (\() -> y) < 1285682719 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does it differ from call-by-value or call-by-reference? < 1285682748 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. int f(x,y) {x = x+1; return y;} int main() {int x = 4; return f(x, x+2);} < 1285682752 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Dude makes 1:1 scale of the Star Trek Enterprise in Minecraft" ;; IT'S THE USS ENTERPRISE NCC-1701-D STUPID < 1285682756 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would return 7 if C was call-by-name < 1285682760 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285682781 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the x = x + 1 increments x in the caller (much like call-by-reference), and then returning y uses the new value of x in the caller < 1285682791 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second property is unique to call-by-name < 1285682793 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1285682808 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ah so return y returns "x+2", and lets the caller evaluate it then? < 1285682820 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than evaluating it at call time < 1285682828 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not exactly; it gets the caller to evaluate x+2, then returns the value the caller gives it < 1285682846 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although what you mentioned would be a plausible "tail-call-by-name" optimisation, I suppose < 1285682855 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, is this found anywhere outside esolangs? < 1285682862 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ALGOL 60, famously < 1285682864 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds so absurdly awkward < 1285682868 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it wasn't dynamically scoped < 1285682876 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah that would help I guess < 1285682888 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see Man or Boy test < 1285682907 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hm I can't think of any language like that indeed. < 1285682918 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, in languages like Haskell, technically you could use call-by-name and you wouldn't notice because there are no side effects suitable for distinguishing by-name from by-value < 1285682944 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, and it seems a lot harder to implement than simple straight-forward call by value. < 1285682948 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the hardware compiler I'm working on at work is call-by-name, which is why I'm thinking about it < 1285682950 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Christ the Enterprise is huge. < 1285682954 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's harder in some ways, but easier in other ways < 1285682973 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call-by-value has issues with higher-order functions, as you actually need to save their values somewhere < 1285682981 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1285683006 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1285683012 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, so why anyone would do it in something like ALGOL 60 I can't understand. Weren't computer resources limited back then? So it seems like a bad decision to add the extra complexity of doing this. < 1285683018 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, something seems to be randomly resetting my connection, both IRC and the web < 1285683020 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Holy shit, the Enterprise is almost a fucking kilometre long. < 1285683023 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's the wireless router gone mad again < 1285683028 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is just unholy. < 1285683033 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, 642.5 m. < 1285683035 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Close enough. < 1285683038 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: computer scientists, the pure CS sort not the programming sort, like call-by-name < 1285683043 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, TNG? TOS? < 1285683053 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you don't have to distinguish values from expressions < 1285683055 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Enterprise-D, but they're all much the same design < 1285683063 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hah < 1285683065 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: algol 60 was hardly designed for the computers of the time, dude < 1285683066 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, in call-by-name, if and while can be defined as functions < 1285683071 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er wait < 1285683074 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was thinking of algol 68 < 1285683075 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, enterprise-d, which series was that < 1285683079 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is probably the first language-wank ever < 1285683081 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: TNG < 1285683085 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ah < 1285683101 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well 642.5 m is closer to half a km than a km < 1285683107 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, still large, but not that extreme < 1285683109 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kn2-d5a3r94 full-size model of Enterprise in Minecraft; http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/djs2s/dude_makes_11_scale_of_the_star_trek_enterprise/c10qj2p elaboration < 1285683110 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. command while(boolean cond, command c) {if(cond){c; while(cond,c);}} < 1285683119 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :his version is 785 m on that dimension though; it's 22% bigger to fit minecraft characters better < 1285683123 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :("command" is typically a data type in such languages) < 1285683137 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Video narration is hilarious.) < 1285683138 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, heck, some bulk cargo trains reach over 1 km in length, Of course they are not spaceships, but still... < 1285683145 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i don't think it's *popular* among CS guys < 1285683149 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, Minecraft? < 1285683149 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just hilariously admired < 1285683153 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: hmm, perhaps < 1285683169 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least in the field I'm working with, "Idealized Algol" and its variations are the typical stock language to work from < 1285683173 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's like a virtual world, except based entirely on 1 m^3 squares of different types, and you can dig and stuff < 1285683176 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1285683176 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's Algol 60, adapted to remove all the features that make it practical < 1285683177 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an open-ended sandbox game < 1285683192 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds cool < 1285683195 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's awesome up until the point S g e o hears about it and starts obsessing, so talk very quietly < 1285683220 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oh yeah and the gigantic world map is randomly generated < 1285683224 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hah < 1285683226 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are caves and mines and stuff < 1285683240 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: it sounds rather like Dwarf Fortress with shallower gameplay and a better interface < 1285683247 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, it's massive-multiplayer < 1285683249 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for some value of massive < 1285683253 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : it's Algol 60, adapted to remove all the features that make it practical <-- XD < 1285683254 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also some value of how multiplayer you want < 1285683258 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you can have, like, private worlds < 1285683272 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it costs (one-off though), the ooold version is free though < 1285683276 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I mean, syntactic sugar's nice in a real language, but you don't want it in your mathematical abstractions < 1285683284 0 :jix!~jix@tomakin.h-ix.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1285683295 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1285683313 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only acceptable language is SK combinators with three bits of ram < 1285683316 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I'm still not sure I grok call-by-name. Maybe it isn't so awkward without dynamic scoping? < 1285683363 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: anyway, consider that the Enterprise is about *twice* the length of a *huge* cruise ship < 1285683368 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus a bit < 1285683410 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, does it fit with the expected interior size though? < 1285683411 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well all cruise ships are huge < 1285683417 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what i mean < 1285683424 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: pretty much: < 1285683425 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The original Enterprise is 642.5 Meters x 467.0 Meters x 137.5 Meters. This is about 3m per deck. Sadly, with the 1m deck you have to walk on, that only leaves 2m left over for hallway space. As your character is only 1.7m tall, you will be bumping your head around a lot. I decided to make the ship 22% bigger, so I could have 4 m per deck. That puts the final size @ 785m x 570m x 168m. I made my "pit" 800x600x180 to fit all 42 decks and almost made a critica < 1285683425 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :l error. Even though there are 42 decks on the enterprise, the 2nd deck is split into two half-decks, making actually 43. I made the pit bigger than she ship so I could have a little wiggle room and just missed making it too shallow. In my testing, the halls can get a little cramped. The current decks are just a guideline and framework. They don't call it "Creative Mode" for nothing. < 1285683437 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the only reason he had to enlarge it < 1285683440 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is because the floor is 1 m^3 < 1285683445 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since everything in minecraft is 1 m^3 < 1285683464 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285683506 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, you can't make anything but square 1 m^3 objects or? < 1285683530 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yeah. < 1285683541 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has monsters and rollercoasters and stuff. but the actual blocks < 1285683546 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are 1 m^3 < 1285683552 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although due to the rollercoasters, pretty sure there's ramped blocks < 1285683560 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't played it personally, have been meaning to < 1285683640 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, the idea seems good though, but the 1 m³ restriction must he rather hampering. It will look like it was made out of square lego blocks < 1285683650 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, cubic ones I mean < 1285683653 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not square < 1285683672 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it's insanely popular < 1285683677 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i guess not that hampering :) < 1285683681 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: have you watched the video? < 1285683688 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, yes, just finished < 1285683694 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the right zoom level, anything can look right :-P < 1285683699 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are no ramped blocks, but the minecart tracks automagically ramp themselves a bit. < 1285683707 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: also, you're comparing it to lego as if that's a bad thing < 1285683713 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, and when he got closer to the stuff near the base it didn't look very good < 1285683721 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, he hasn't filled it in yet < 1285683723 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Next step: Spaceflight < 1285683730 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are half-height "step" blocks for staircasing, but those occupy only the lower half, not the upper. < 1285683747 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, the issue is that enterprise is all smooth curves. Very few things at right angles in it < 1285683748 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And other, smaller things, like pressure plates; those are rather thin, but I think you can still stand on them. < 1285683755 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/75/Minecraft.png mah treez r square < 1285683772 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cube < 1285683775 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like how the sun is a square < 1285683778 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very consistent < 1285683789 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes indeed < 1285683795 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also the moon, and I think it had square craters too. < 1285683818 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's not detailed enough for that. But at least it's square. < 1285683832 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you run fast enough does it get dark < 1285683834 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is the world flat :P < 1285683861 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, you need textures for something like http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/58/Enterprise_Forward.jpg < 1285683869 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still cool/insane/awesome idea < 1285683877 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: meh, coloured blocks < 1285683882 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all those coloured elements are >1m^3 < 1285683887 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yes < 1285683903 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the world is flat. (Possibly one side of a cube, though?) < 1285683908 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should have done the defiant < 1285683910 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just a brick ;) < 1285683919 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(OHHH SNAP) < 1285683920 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, still, he had to fill out lots of panels it seemed like < 1285683945 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever you call them < 1285683959 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looked like a blocky wireframe < 1285683998 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who cares it's awesome :P < 1285684013 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, missing comma there < 1285684022 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who, care it's awesome :P < 1285684025 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cares < 1285684032 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant after cares :P < 1285684082 0 :Harpyon!~Harpyon@ti0031a380-0390.bb.online.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1285684085 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The framework was done by converting directly into a Minecraft map, wasn't it? (But the plan was to have a bunch of people doing all the interior construction in-game, if I understood right.) < 1285684104 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1285684116 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: meh, i didn't pronounce any comma < 1285684118 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Watched it with no audio earlier today. < 1285684168 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, does TAEB farm? < 1285684317 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1285684322 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor does Planar < 1285684327 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Water in minecraft is really funny; if you scoop up a bucketful, then place it in any square, that square will turn into a "fountain", from which an infinite amount of water will flow, except that it only spreads sideways at an inclination of around 1/4 blocks. And if you later pick up the "fountain" block back to a bucket, all the water it has generated will also dry out. < 1285684336 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Note: I don't know for certain, I'm just making a 90% prediction here.) < 1285684356 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Can you pick up water without a bucket? < 1285684357 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If not: aww. < 1285684361 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For example, this is what happened when I was trying to hit a switch next to my door but accidentally unbucketed a bucket of water there: http://zem.fi/~fis/flood.png < 1285684363 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want self-contained blocks of water. < 1285684366 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, you need a bucket. < 1285684381 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1285684384 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the earlier sort of water (pre-Alpha) was even less "realistic". < 1285684454 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, oops < 1285684456 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you can "pour" a bucket of water at a great height (as long as there's something next to it -- and you can remove that something later on if you want) and it'll make a permanent waterfall at that point. < 1285684462 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, is it pure virtual world or more than that? < 1285684479 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: On the other hand, it was easy to clean up: I just re-bucketed that one fountain block and everything went to how it was before. < 1285684490 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also, lava behaves just like water except it moves slower.) < 1285684513 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, very crude textures < 1285684516 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm not sure what you mean by "more". I mean, there's some game-like elements in it. < 1285684522 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yeah, it's a stylistic choice. < 1285684536 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I saw a health meter on some screenshot of it < 1285684545 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWPk5zlKAEM and especially at 4:45 onwards (after looking at the big one) < 1285684556 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the main bit reminds me of Magrathea's factory < 1285684560 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, there's a "survival" game thing, monsters at night, that sort of stuff. < 1285684571 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1285684587 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, any cars or such? < 1285684590 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though if playing locally you can just set difficulty to "peaceful", and I'm sure there's servers around that do that too. < 1285684597 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's minecarts, with wonderfully screwy physics. < 1285684599 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: So does lava... hurt you? :P < 1285684603 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1285684632 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Well, you get set on fire. And then die, after a while. Unless you run pretty fast to some water. < 1285684642 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, can you swim? < 1285684647 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You can build perpetual motion machines out of the minecarts. < 1285684649 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: see that vide < 1285684652 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*video < 1285684654 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless that's not water < 1285684661 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You can swim, but there's an oxygen-meter if you go below the surface. < 1285684666 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, and can you die from falling from great heights? < 1285684698 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes. Or at least you take damage, I'm not sure if there's a cap to that. < 1285684712 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and you can build logic circuits out of redstone: http://minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Redstone_circuits < 1285684718 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, can you make lifts or other interesting moving stuff? < 1285684775 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's pretty limited, but you can make those minecarts go uphill by screwing with the physics, and then use those logic circuits (and pressure plates) to make T-connections that flip direction. < 1285684804 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, is it TC? < 1285684840 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: can you get them to go straight up? :D < 1285684853 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and there's powered minecarts, but those burn fuel. < 1285684863 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how do you get fuel? < 1285684878 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or raw material for that matter < 1285684879 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can mine for coal, or cut down trees. < 1285684883 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Punch down trees, more like. < 1285684897 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what about rock? < 1285684926 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically you first punch down some trees, turn those into planks, those into sticks, then make a wooden pickaxe; then use that to get some cobblestones and make tools out of stone; and then proceed from there. < 1285684952 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1285684979 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need a diamond pickaxe to mine obsidian (the hardest material, discounting adminium), and there's other rules like that. < 1285685010 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need a more-than-stone pickaxe to mine gold/diamonds. But you can mine iron ore with a stone pickaxe, that's how you get steel stuff. < 1285685052 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With ores (gold, iron) you need to use a foundry to smelt them into things you can build with, though. And the foundry needs fuel; one lump of coal can do 8 smelting operations. < 1285685054 0 :olgagirl!~olgagirl@212-198-248-35.rev.numericable.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1285685064 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(One bucket of lava will do 1000, but it'll also burn out the bucket.) < 1285685070 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, and your build the foundry out of blocks too? < 1285685070 0 :olgagirl!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1285685085 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : fizzie: can you get them to go straight up? :D < 1285685087 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(minecarts) < 1285685088 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, the foundry is made out of 8 blocks of stone in a square. < 1285685097 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :punch down trees :D < 1285685100 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Not that I know of, but you could make a track that spirals upwards. < 1285685120 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AWESOME < 1285685126 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want that instead of a lift in every building < 1285685147 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: If you're building something for people to use, waterfall elevators are popular. (You can swim up a waterfall.) < 1285685162 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, can you suspend things in the air? That enterprise thing looked like it was suspended on nothing < 1285685196 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, most things float in the air. Usually you need something to "build against" in order to actually put a block there, but it will not fall if you later dismantle what it was hanging from. < 1285685204 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1285685220 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sand and gravel do fall to lowest possible z-coordinate, though. < 1285685227 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that switch thingy, what can it do? < 1285685230 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You can suffocate yourself in gravel if you mine carelessly.) < 1285685270 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A switch "activates" things; things that you can activate include doors, redstone wires, and... well, I don't know. Something else too, probably. Minecart track T-junctions switch direction when activated, I think. < 1285685339 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, T-junction? < 1285685341 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how absurd < 1285685355 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for something on rails to turn 90° sharply < 1285685394 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the middle square of the T-junction will have a 90-degree "smooth" turn to either way, and that's the bit that flips when you activate it. < 1285685406 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do think it should be TC, except that it has a pretty bad limitation that all active stuff (like redstone circuits) are only updated in the local neighbourhood of a player, and I think it was a pretty small neighbourhood too. (And in any case there's a finite world anyway.) < 1285685435 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1285685442 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Circuits that are more than ~300 blocks away from your current position will cease to operate due to being on unloaded chunks." < 1285685503 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, one "redstone torch" will only send a signal for 15 squares of wire, but you can chain torches; there'll be a propagation delay that way, though. < 1285685510 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, do trees regrow? < 1285685519 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, they're a renewable resource. < 1285685528 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1285685532 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can also plant trees, some of the greenery will turn into saplings. < 1285685547 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They need sunlight and that sort of stuff to grow though. < 1285685561 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also there's some sort of farming mechanism, I think. < 1285685617 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm no expert on this, I've just dabbled with the game for something like three days when they had that free-for-all weekend, and watched other people's stuff.) < 1285685644 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : alise: If you're building something for people to use, waterfall elevators are popular. (You can swim up a waterfall.) < 1285685649 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you shoot someone up a waterfall? :P < 1285685661 0 :sshc_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sshc < 1285685666 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure how much you can affect other people, except to bump them a bit. < 1285685669 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Ilari, [minecraft question] ;; how the hell did you make this typo? < 1285685678 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where? < 1285685685 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I don't know < 1285685708 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I'm on qwerty so it makes no sense < 1285685718 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just above < 1285685735 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it's a case of "all Finns look alike". < 1285685744 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, oh wait, it must have been fi turned into if, noticed f and backspaced < 1285685747 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes sense < 1285685759 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for some value of sense < 1285685860 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's that hilarious "this is how you make a nice fireplace for your elaborate, built-out-of-wood house" video, where the narrator ends up accidentally completely burning down his house; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnjSWPxJxNs -- it's a bit sad to watch, he's all "uh.. uh-oh.." < 1285685880 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Half a million views already. < 1285685945 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why did he upload it heh < 1285685958 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, how long have you been playing this came? < 1285685960 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :game* < 1285685967 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh today is the day of typos < 1285685971 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: < 1285685971 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (I'm no expert on this, I've just dabbled with the game for something like three days when they had that free-for-all weekend, and watched other people's stuff.) < 1285685975 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1285686042 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, what I was actually looking for was this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0v5cAFYouWY which is about the crazy minecart physics. < 1285686058 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The latter half is the more interesting.) < 1285686109 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285686128 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, do people ride carts or? < 1285686151 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People, though there's also a minecart/box hybrid you can put stuff to. < 1285686262 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, "boosters"? how does that work < 1285686264 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes no sense < 1285686293 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you have two carts next to each other, it keeps increasing the momentum of both. < 1285686302 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1285686306 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, "err". < 1285686310 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, and it wouldn't increase it for one? < 1285686352 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, no, why would it? Normally it increases speed/momentum when you're going downhill, slowly decreases if moving on flat ground, and decreases faster if going uphill. < 1285686356 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is sort-of realistic. < 1285686368 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes and the booster thing is err then indeed < 1285686379 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if you have two carts next to each other (on different tracks) it keeps speeding both up. < 1285686388 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, bug or intentional? < 1285686398 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or bug that they can't fix any longer due to people depending on it? < 1285686411 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It sounds like a bug; it's possible it'll get fixed. The game's still officially in alpha. < 1285686457 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They did add those powered minecarts to it, which can sort-of replace that sort of trickery, but of course those need fuel. < 1285686484 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also heard something about making torches burn out; currently torches stay lit indefinitely. < 1285686508 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1285686639 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : If you have two carts next to each other, it keeps increasing the momentum of both. < 1285686641 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INFINITE SPEED < 1285686648 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, there's a cap for speed. < 1285686665 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1285686667 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There isn't a cap for momentum, though, except that after it overflows the cart stops flat. < 1285686767 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: wow, when he tries to put the fire out the block of fire becomes a perfectly square block of water :D < 1285686772 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and you can make boats out of wood, and boats float, so if you "drive" a boat into a waterfall, it'll rise up faster than what you could swim. Plus you can sort-of stay outside the water while still going upward, so that you don't drown. < 1285686781 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW IS HE KILLING FIRE WITH A HAMMER < 1285686811 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, wait, raise? < 1285686812 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha man gravity-defying fire this is my favourite type of fire < 1285686831 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, they got the direction in the waterfall wrong? < 1285686856 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it's just that it's considered water, and floating things go up in water. < 1285686881 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1285686892 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[download] 66.2% of 141.13M at 121.89k/s ETA 06:41 < 1285686895 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck youtube < 1285686941 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck the word "fuck" < 1285686955 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, did they intentionally make it this weird? < 1285686956 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: seriously? < 1285686965 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the guy's swedish iirc, so yes. < 1285686972 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a friend knows him) < 1285686972 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION was trying to be humorous
< 1285686976 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well, "knows") < 1285687021 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I wouldn't want to start guessing about intentions; but the way water works has been changed, so I guess they're just playing around and seeing what works. < 1285687023 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1285687051 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1285687118 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the standard eager definition of the Y combinator? < 1285687141 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DF? < 1285687148 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I need to leave soon < 1285687154 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hopefully my clothing will be dry soon < 1285687230 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: If by DF you mean Dwarf Fortress, no, not that; Minecraft, though DF is I think officially mentioned as an inspiration. < 1285687244 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: The Y combinator works whether it's eager or not. < 1285687262 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: agreed, but it needs to be defined differently in the two cases < 1285687299 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, does it need to play on server or does it work locally? < 1285687361 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye all < 1285687371 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You can play locally if you like; that's the only thing I've tried. There's a lot of servers around, though. And I understand some servers have all kinds of different additions. < 1285687379 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: erm < 1285687383 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not the Y combinator then :) < 1285687388 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a fixed-point combinator < 1285687389 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not Y < 1285687399 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: hmm, OK < 1285687401 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, do you have a copy still or? < 1285687405 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the common call-by-value one is called Z < 1285687408 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Z = λf. (λx. f (λy. x x y)) (λx. f (λy. x x y)) < 1285687439 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, wtf image: http://minecraftwiki.net/wiki/File:Ladder-water-lock.PNG < 1285687447 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I showed my supervisor my crazy dynamically-scoped Y and he told me to wrap it up in a constant so nobody would have to see the definition < 1285687448 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, the latters prevent water from going down < 1285687452 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1285687453 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ladders* < 1285687465 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: haha < 1285687475 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd turn them insane < 1285687475 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, http://minecraftwiki.net/wiki/File:Ladder-water-tunnel.PNG < 1285687486 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i said :D < 1285687493 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, yeah but that was a different image < 1285687502 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this one is about as absurd < 1285687503 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes; "You will be able to play the game without an internet connection if you've run the launcher at least once while connected to the internet." -- so I could still continue to play locally after getting it "for free" during that weekend, though I'm not exactly sure what the license terms say. < 1285687519 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: wow @ that < 1285687520 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*that < 1285687536 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, water won't go through an (open) door either. < 1285687541 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Easy to do airlocks. < 1285687568 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you do an ACTUAL SPACESHIP :| < 1285687598 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think you can. :( < 1285687603 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha, I've just figured out what's /actually going on/ in this hardware Y < 1285687605 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe in beta! < 1285687613 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the definition is the standard Y(f) = f(Y(f)) < 1285687619 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not Y < 1285687629 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Then we can STAR TREKKING ACROSS THE MINEYVERSE < 1285687633 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the two Y(f) are the same circuit with a multiplexer, to avoid an infinite regress < 1285687635 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: yes, actual Y < 1285687639 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's call-by-name < 1285687641 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Y(f) = f(Y(f)) is not Y < 1285687643 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : aha, I've just figured out what's /actually going on/ in this hardware Y <--- hardware Y? < 1285687645 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a fixed-point combinator < 1285687647 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's not Y < 1285687653 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: really? which one /is/ Y then? < 1285687661 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y = λf.(λx.f (x x)) (λx.f (x x)) < 1285687666 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the famous one < 1285687666 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, that's true of fixed-point combinators in general < 1285687672 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, are you saying you are doing lambda calculus in *hardware*? < 1285687673 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is typed lambda calculus, though < 1285687675 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yep! < 1285687676 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's awesome < 1285687679 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, FPGAs or? < 1285687684 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly in simulation < 1285687690 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, to what end? < 1285687695 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :esoteric or research? < 1285687698 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :research < 1285687709 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we think it's more efficient that traditional imperativey methods < 1285687716 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1285687733 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"We also think that giving crack to monkeys is the quickest route to both a research paper and a good time." < 1285687754 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: anyway, whatever you call the combinator, y(f) = f(y(f)) is the actual definition being used in hardware < 1285687760 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*fix(f) < 1285687793 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you call it Y, I will turn into a nuclear bomb and then detonate myself. :| < 1285687797 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is how IMPORTANT this matter is! < 1285687805 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moving on, < 1285687811 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do let me know when I can buy an Intel Lambda iλ processor, though. < 1285687813 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: your hardware is crazy. < 1285687828 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: it's not general hardware < 1285687842 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a case of implementing one /specific/ lambda-calculus circuit (which could be any one you like) in hardware < 1285687847 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, your hardware only does one program < 1285687849 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: But you could implement x86 in a lambda expression! < 1285687858 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: yes, but it'd probably be easier to do it by hand < 1285687858 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Microcode? More like LAMBDACODE" < 1285687865 0 :FireyFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1285688038 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Notch "Physics: Yes" < 1285688155 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also transparency; but maybe it refers to the fact that it's not completely cube-shaped. < 1285688319 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"MINECRAFT: A FIRST PERSON AUTISM SIMULATOR" ;; best slogan ever < 1285688330 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ontopic found via proggit: http://j.mearie.org/post/1181041789/brainfuck-interpreter-in-2-lines-of-c < 1285688335 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone trying to golf a BF interp < 1285688340 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can we beat 160 bytes? < 1285688344 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://minecraftwiki.net/images/6/68/1283223082465.jpg I see nothing that looks even vaguely like a person in the image; someone point to it? < 1285688346 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: mearie is lifthrasiir < 1285688353 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he linked the post here recently < 1285688358 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, good to know < 1285688358 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, attempts ensued, iirc < 1285688362 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or perhaps before he said it, I forget < 1285688367 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :recently = days < 1285688375 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that use of syscall is really ingenious, incidentally < 1285688414 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it'll be very hard to beat < 1285688448 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :loop parsing is always fun in BF < 1285688461 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: In your picture there's that thing with glowing eyes, near the horizon, at the left end of the slope. < 1285688469 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the BF interp I submitted to the last IOCCC did it two characters at a time, via a lookup table < 1285688491 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :relying on the fact that it doesn't matter whether you end up before or after the [ or ] you're trying to match < 1285688492 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I see a very fuzzy thing but no glowing eyes. < 1285688506 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's obviously not the shortest way, it's just one of the more confusing ones to understand < 1285688515 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Maybe he's hiding from you, then. < 1285688526 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: while(*p)myself(s); is clearly the easiest < 1285688529 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ] just doing return; < 1285688539 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: for a compiler < 1285688540 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, or even just break :-D < 1285688543 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean for an interp < 1285688547 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i do too < 1285688550 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :myself is an interpreter < 1285688558 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it returns on ] < 1285688564 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and does while(*p)myself(prog); on [ < 1285688567 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, so recurse on [, return on ] < 1285688574 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like lifthrasiir's < 1285688579 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and since you pass the code pointer, it restores automatically < 1285688595 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you execute a loop 0 times, in that case? < 1285688640 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, this would be easy with INTERCAL control constructs < 1285688643 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, !*p, so myself(p) isn't executed < 1285688659 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: yep, then you end up after the [ not after the ] < 1285688671 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because nothing moved forwards to the ] < 1285688709 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, ofc < 1285688759 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do i(p)while(*p); < 1285688764 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then i checks p... hmm, no, this is too complicated < 1285688775 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: clearly bf should have all while loops be do-while :P < 1285688792 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: DoFuck < 1285688806 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I seem to remember making an attempt to prove it TC a while ago < 1285689014 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no dofuck on the wikis < 1285689092 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :FireFly < 1285689161 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1285689181 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1285689223 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1285689230 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1285689232 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :connection issues < 1285689277 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION connects the issues
< 1285689475 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, at http://codegolf.com/brainfuck the top two entries are within one byte of each other and in different languages < 1285689479 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't expect it to be so close < 1285689541 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah, codegolf.com < 1285689544 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like anagolf for boring people! < 1285689583 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, <> works in shells < 1285689585 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1285689586 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird@dinky:~$ echo boo >foo; (echo hi; cat) <>foo < 1285689586 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1285689586 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :boo < 1285689596 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anagolf : codegolf :: random programming for #esoteric : government contracts < 1285689605 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and government contracts are boring as hell < 1285689755 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1285689757 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :famous people on our wiki: < 1285689763 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/User:Tom_Duff < 1285689764 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/User:Dankogai < 1285689768 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any more? :p < 1285689790 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More untested Life speculation! < 1285689810 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't actually think high-density glider streams are the best way to destroy stuff. < 1285689835 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: relink me to that pastebin? < 1285689838 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OR I COULD FIND IT MYSELF I *GUESS* < 1285689842 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They tend to make a big cloud of opaque debris at the end without doing much extra damage. < 1285689858 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, http://pastebin.com/kfH1mw7M < 1285689873 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION pacefalm @ golly not shipping its icon in the bianry package
< 1285689874 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*binary < 1285689894 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"High density" includes normal Gosper guns too, though. < 1285689914 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION decides to try compiling Golly from CVS
< 1285689926 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOD LUCK < 1285689930 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it's svn isn't it? < 1285689938 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CVS, apparently. < 1285689945 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel like I've gone back in time. < 1285689950 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: remember the lightspeed telegraph? when i poked a hole in it and it burned the fuel really quickly and then replaced the entire telegraph with still life very rapidly? < 1285689954 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was some fire < 1285689978 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, that's basically standard behaviour for unstable things. < 1285689993 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They burn spectacularly with the slightest alteration. < 1285690025 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's also where I made the multibarrel Gosper, while building a normal one to aim at the LST. < 1285690078 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1285690081 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DIE SCIENCE, DIE < 1285690085 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*DIE SCIENCE, DIE! < 1285690099 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DIE SINS, DIE! < 1285690104 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there should be some interesting way to do competitive Life < 1285690127 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, there's always the majority neighbourhood rules. < 1285690142 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was about to say. < 1285690146 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION decides to knock together a rule table for that while he waits.
< 1285690154 0 :cpressey!~CPressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1285690163 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I mean, with some sort of incentive for building a large complex structure < 1285690169 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION checks it out too
< 1285690171 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just do Life as normal, and assign cells to their majority neighbor. The problem is that may make "attacks" sort of useless. < 1285690174 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's see if it works with 64-bit python now < 1285690189 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: how do you actually control the thing, though? < 1285690195 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :each person gets to set up an area to start with then just leaves it? < 1285690202 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure < 1285690209 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose if people had a large enough area, and they were far enough apart, it could work a bit like corewars < 1285690227 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I asked the guys on the mailing list and they said it did. < 1285690238 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1285690249 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see if it builds with -j3 and *without* adding build options. :-) < 1285690255 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a matter of someone not realising that Py_InitModule4 was platform-specific. < 1285690258 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Probably not.) < 1285690275 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH YEAH I JUST REMEMBERED < 1285690275 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Stupid projects making a big deal of releases. < 1285690283 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd have 2.1.1 out in a day :P < 1285690284 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, am I a Bad Person for not using clang as my default compiler? < 1285690288 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not really. < 1285690295 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awesome competitive Wikipedia Clickit game: < 1285690298 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nobody does that apart from everyone on OS X, and that was Apple's decision. < 1285690304 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1285690305 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg omg omg < 1285690306 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Golly with clang < 1285690308 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I must now try this < 1285690311 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I can't see how you could strategize, exactly. < 1285690325 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, there are ways. < 1285690338 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird@dinky:~/golly/src$ make -f makefile-gtk -j3 CXXC=clang < 1285690339 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah baby. < 1285690340 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance, high-density ash is basically impenetrable. < 1285690340 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just have a big breeder pattern and hope that it lines up fortuitously against your neighbour's big breeder patterns? < 1285690343 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops I don't have clang < 1285690352 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I do (soon). < 1285690356 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What's ash again? < 1285690361 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An impartial judge chooses a start page and two goal pages, each player is given one of the goal pages (as their goal). One at a time, each player takes a step from the current page, trying to get towards their own goal page. First whose goal is hit wins. < 1285690361 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The result of destroying things? < 1285690362 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: "CXXC"? I thought "CXX" was the normal env variable < 1285690369 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, these guys are ~different~ < 1285690372 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried CXX first < 1285690374 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: standard Minix shell, isn't it? < 1285690374 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then checked the makefile-gtk < 1285690381 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: >_< < 1285690381 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, the junk you get after something burns. < 1285690384 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me that was purposeful < 1285690385 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: right < 1285690396 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: hmm, should be passable with a bunch of redundant spaceships < 1285690397 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: people would keep jumping back to dates, wouldn't they? < 1285690397 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say < 1285690403 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to prevent the opponent getting an advantage? < 1285690410 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hence my point about high-density streams. < 1285690411 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine a big ring of spaceships that also continually send gliders to the centre control unit < 1285690420 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whenever the control unit doesn't receive a glider in the right time according to a clock < 1285690425 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Firing a Gosper gun at high-density ash is suicide, basically. < 1285690428 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it creates a new one in the right direction < 1285690443 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so as long as all of them aren't destroyed at once -- which probably won't happen -- it'll keep going < 1285690455 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(they themselves act as a shield to the control-unit-ship) < 1285690471 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Google is useless for this, but... I remember seeing a pattern which just grows. In all directions. At like 1/2C. < 1285690477 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happens if the mothership crashes into some debris in its path. < 1285690482 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, the spacefiller. < 1285690490 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's in Golly's breeder collection < 1285690502 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: That's it. < 1285690513 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Why back to "dates"? < 1285690513 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[clang compiles] < 1285690517 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Isn't it c/4? < 1285690524 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: And they still have to try to get to their own goal. < 1285690529 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty sure there's no c/2 all-directions spacefiller :P < 1285690531 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: because they're on basically every page < 1285690535 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since that's sort of impossible < 1285690550 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Fine, but why do you think dates don't give the opponent an advantage? < 1285690558 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: You don't know what the opponent's goal is. < 1285690569 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :generally speaking, they're not within one hop of a random page < 1285690570 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clang -DVERSION=2.2b4 -DGOLLYDIR="" -O4 -Wall -Wno-non-virtual-dtor -fno-strict-aliasing -o bgolly ObjGTK/bigint.o ObjGTK/lifealgo.o ObjGTK/hlifealgo.o ObjGTK/hlifedraw.o ObjGTK/qlifealgo.o ObjGTK/qlifedraw.o ObjGTK/jvnalgo.o ObjGTK/ruletreealgo.o ObjGTK/ruletable_algo.o ObjGTK/ghashbase.o ObjGTK/ghashdraw.o ObjGTK/readpattern.o ObjGTK/writepattern.o ObjGTK/liferules.o ObjGTK/util.o ObjGTK/liferender.o ObjGTK/viewport.o ObjGTK/lifepoll.o ObjGTK/generationsal < 1285690570 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go.o ObjGTK/bgolly.o -lz < 1285690570 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ObjGTK/bigint.o: file not recognized: File format not recognized < 1285690571 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hrm :P < 1285690576 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, but not knowing what the enemy goal is makes it interesting < 1285690576 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, c/2 orthogonally. < 1285690588 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: oh, right < 1285690588 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: They're not going to be within one hop of your page either :P < 1285690589 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1285690595 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least, if you aren't near /your/ goal, you're probably going to click a date just to make the opponent further from theirs < 1285690598 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I still think it's basically impossible to strategize without knowing how your patterns are aligned wrt your neighbours. Otherwise I'd just spacefiller and hope. < 1285690599 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as defence is more important than attack < 1285690601 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're losing < 1285690601 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who < 1285690602 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*whoa < 1285690605 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have an autoconf-based system now? < 1285690623 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Without configure, it seems... < 1285690628 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: autoreconf, dude < 1285690630 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't store configure in repos < 1285690632 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, C/4, whatever. Point being, fast. < 1285690637 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: *c :P < 1285690644 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: and it dies if anything hits it < 1285690649 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crazy blue-skies project of mine I never started: a build system where you just give it the sources and it figures out the rest < 1285690650 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's not a very good weapon < 1285690656 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: exists < 1285690660 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more or less < 1285690663 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: does it work well? < 1285690669 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to specify the single command to compile one file, and a list of files, and it handles dependencies automatically < 1285690671 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, quite popular < 1285690685 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's it called? < 1285690691 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fabric or something < 1285690711 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-5-61.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1285690735 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, Spacefillers could be good for making high-density ash quickly. < 1285690739 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: http://code.google.com/p/fabricate/ < 1285690757 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the glider pulse from the fire would probably be damaging. < 1285690766 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My money is still on the spacefiller. < 1285690773 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :add a filename -> compiler invocation table and automatic build/compile/link/clean actions and you're done < 1285690777 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, plus a globber < 1285690780 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it'd just be < 1285690784 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sources = ['*.c'] < 1285690785 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever < 1285690829 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: does it, say, install libraries that the code depends on? < 1285690836 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :figuring them out by looking at linker errors? < 1285690872 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: :D < 1285690893 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no XD < 1285690917 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: see, that's the level of intelligence I was thinking about < 1285690919 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it does use strace, though < 1285690921 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is magic enough < 1285690934 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really, I wanted something where you could take a tarball and automatically make, say, a .deb file < 1285690937 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that build system sounds nice though, maybe i'll write it :P < 1285690946 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: without a makefile in it? < 1285690946 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to allow easy tarball installations for people who don't understand compiling < 1285690997 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: even without a makefile; I'm not sure if it should use a makefile if present < 1285691002 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably not, because most makefiles are written badly < 1285691036 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :link-time optimisation for golly would be so cool but meh < 1285691042 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION vaguely wonders what the shortest BF hello world is
< 1285691076 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :config.status: error: cannot find input file: `Makefile.in' < 1285691080 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should probably just use the makefile < 1285691106 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the very idea of "fuzzy linking"... < 1285691124 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So appealing. Yet so evil. < 1285691130 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: is there a Makefile.am? < 1285691145 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, but autoreconf fails < 1285691149 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i'm just using their non-auto makefiles < 1285691157 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the error message? < 1285691167 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAARGH the CVS Golly has more patterns. < 1285691174 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I have to look at all of them... < 1285691268 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dcreager.net/2010/02/17/llvm-lto-karmic/ ;; waaay too compilated < 1285691320 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll just settle for -O3. Sheesh. :P < 1285691441 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i appear to lack a clang-compatible c stdlib < 1285691459 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :h i forgot clang++ < 1285691466 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm wait < 1285691524 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I suggest we rewrite Golly. < 1285691554 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whhhyyyyyy < 1285691566 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C++ isn't *that* bad a sin. < 1285691573 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Because it SUCKS and it's so SLOW and the UI SUCKS < 1285691594 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OUR HASHLIFE WILL BE FIFTEEN TIMES THEIR HASHLIFE < 1285691602 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT WILL BE THE SIMULATOR TO RUN THE UNIVERSE < 1285691608 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FROM WHICH INTELLIGENCE LIFE WILL EMERGE < 1285691612 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...The algorithm would be the same... < 1285691620 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT OURS WOULD BE FIFTEEN TIMES < 1285691629 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :STACK HASHLIFE ON TOP OF HASHLIFE! < 1285691652 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is Langton's Ant symmetric about black/white inversion? < 1285691669 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And any necessary rotations and reflections. < 1285691696 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait. < 1285691696 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird@dinky:~/golly/src$ make -f makefile-gtk -j3 CXXC=clang++ CXXFLAGS='-DVERSION=2.2b4 -DGOLLYDIR="" -O3 -Wall -Wno-non-virtual-dtor -fno-strict-aliasing -fno-stack-protector' < 1285691697 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION whistles
< 1285691711 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You should totally design a conservative Life-like CA. < 1285691717 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'm still waiting for HashAnt. < 1285691721 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interesting thing would be that nothing would evaporate. < 1285691740 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything would either oscillate or traverse. < 1285691745 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, Hashlife is extensible to Langton's Ant. < 1285691745 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oscillate with possible period one, that is, < 1285691766 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Man, Hashlife has to be the coolest method of simulating a turing machine ever. < 1285691766 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's one of Golly's advantages over previous simulators. < 1285691767 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, but is it implemented somewhere? < 1285691774 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, in Golly. < 1285691778 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, nice. < 1285691778 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It actually has multiple parts on different generations at one time, doesn't it? < 1285691781 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hashlife, that is. < 1285691791 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It *uses* HashLife for everything other than Life. < 1285691793 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, yes. < 1285691808 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The philosophical implications are interesting. < 1285691808 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Wait, do you mean... < 1285691822 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : It *uses* HashLife for everything other than Life. ;; lawl < 1285691839 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Do you mean it translates X into Life then runs Hashlife on it? < 1285691842 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the extension... < 1285691844 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: Yes. < 1285691849 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or rather. < 1285691856 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To another, multi-coloured Life-like CA. < 1285691861 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Man, imagine running the sentient dudes on Hashlife. < 1285691862 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, no, it extends Hashlife to arbitrary CAs and runs that on it. < 1285691872 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I think that perhaps it is verbut what about the walruses?" < 1285691876 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That feels like it hardly counts ;/ < 1285691887 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : cpressey, no, it extends Hashlife to arbitrary CAs and runs that on it. < 1285691888 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that < 1285691895 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the ant simulator does some jiggery-pokery, i think < 1285691895 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure < 1285691901 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Life itself has Quicklife, which isn't hashed. < 1285691923 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is quicklife faster than hashlife? < 1285691926 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is not my experience < 1285691938 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is for highly disordered patterns. < 1285691950 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Supposedly. < 1285692035 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder. Modify Hashlife to find self-similar areas of Wang tiling... < 1285692085 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol wangs < 1285692092 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is my contribution to this discussion < 1285692178 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION transplants Maverick's llvm-2.7 onto his own system
< 1285692200 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALL FILENAMES END WITH -2.7 MWAHAHAHA < 1285692331 0 :Harpyon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Harpyon < 1285692598 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://launchpad.net/~llvm/+archive/ppa < 1285692599 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION tries this
< 1285692611 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait no < 1285692612 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's ancient < 1285692619 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: does anything actually use the perl? < 1285692637 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of the scripts. < 1285692663 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anything good? < 1285692667 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1285692674 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So we can do without it? < 1285692689 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think there are any Perl scripts without Python equivalents. < 1285692759 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I can do it with llvm < 1285692827 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird@dinky:~/golly/src$ make -f makefile-gtk -j3 CXXC=clang++ CXXFLAGS='-DVERSION=2.2b4 -DGOLLYDIR="" -O3 -Wall -Wno-non-virtual-dtor -fno-strict-aliasing' < 1285692831 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this *should* work now, without perl < 1285692841 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming i can just rip out the perl support and everything will work :) haha < 1285692847 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlikely, but < 1285692866 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: goin' back under my rock < 1285692877 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, it translates wireworld into something GOL like and then runs hashlife on it!? < 1285692884 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that what you said above? < 1285692887 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's quite aburd < 1285692904 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never said wireworld < 1285692917 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wireworld is perfectly doable as an N-colour life-like automaton < 1285692918 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it is one. < 1285692920 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1285692930 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4 colour < 1285692933 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, which are the ones golly translates then? < 1285692941 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that *is* a translation < 1285692943 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of a sort < 1285692946 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285692959 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well not really < 1285692963 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: tell Vorpal how it does langton's ant < 1285692967 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm fuzzy on the details < 1285692979 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that is easy as an n-colour automaton < 1285693017 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need 2 + 4*2 colours iirc: < 1285693021 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :white and black < 1285693031 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ant on white and black, one for each direction < 1285693038 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, it can run any n-colour life-like CA with >=256 states with Hashlife. < 1285693049 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, >= ? < 1285693051 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really? < 1285693059 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh, <= < 1285693061 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1285693065 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes a lot more sense < 1285693068 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm terrible at that, for some reason... < 1285693087 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what exactly counts as life like? < 1285693099 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, what Golly can run. < 1285693105 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1285693128 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: a 2d cellular automaton with a fixed number of colours based on a moore neighbourhood < 1285693134 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps a bit more than that < 1285693135 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moore neighbourhood with radius one and constant transition rules. < 1285693155 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's it, if I read the RuleTable documentation correctly. < 1285693212 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Designing a conservative CA is pretty difficult... < 1285693218 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought tat. < 1285693220 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*that < 1285693223 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since you see the neighbourhood but only control one cell, and flipping it might imbalance it and might not. < 1285693231 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you need to make sure the cells around it will flip properly, too. < 1285693233 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Delicate stuff. < 1285693234 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This occurred to me. < 1285693244 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just realise dit. < 1285693247 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*realised it. < 1285693288 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuleTable is starting to annoy me... < 1285693318 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, how many bits of information is a B/S rulestring? < 1285693320 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, a conservative bully automaton is a lot simpler hm < 1285693335 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, it's just 2^16, right? < 1285693341 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The two tables. < 1285693388 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The obvious way would require 18 bits. < 1285693409 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*26 < 1285693412 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*16 < 1285693416 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hurrrr < 1285693419 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So 2^16 then. < 1285693435 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So there's only 65536 two-colour Lifelike CAs. < 1285693439 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. < 1285693445 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Half of them are inverses. < 1285693458 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So to check for conservativity, that's just 32,768 iterations of a fairly simple loop. < 1285693460 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still don't know how B0 rules work. < 1285693466 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Trivial. < 1285693484 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Epileptically. :P < 1285693494 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do we check for conservativity in this case? < 1285693506 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We can't just run through state transitions, I think. < 1285693543 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, it's not THAT simple, but... < 1285693565 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The state of a cell the next generation depends only on its neighbourhood, not even its current state. < 1285693570 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2^8 = 256. < 1285693576 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, wait. < 1285693579 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2^9 in this case. < 1285693583 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Simple: < 1285693585 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, that's the point of B/S rules. < 1285693596 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :B is what happens when the cell is 0, S when it's 1. < 1285693601 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Generate 512 cell + neighbourhood blocks. < 1285693608 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know what I mean? < 1285693618 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A cell plus its Moore niehgbourhood. < 1285693621 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*neighbourhood. < 1285693628 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then, check the resulting midd-- oh wait < 1285693629 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's per-generation < 1285693630 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn < 1285693636 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning you can't assume the outer rim of cells stays the same < 1285693647 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It may be undecideable. < 1285693653 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :undecidable. Whatever. < 1285693653 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect so. < 1285693656 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My spellcheck likes neither. < 1285693683 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what is undecidable? < 1285693693 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if a CA is conservative or not? < 1285693698 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clolly compiles. < 1285693700 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i think so < 1285693740 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, shouldn't it be be possible to detect cases of "definitely not conservative" with some simple tests? Then you have a handful candidates left that *might* be conservative < 1285693746 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It runs STUPIDLY fast. Although Golly does anyway. < 1285693748 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or am I totally missing something < 1285693753 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well, sure, but... < 1285693762 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's 2^15 to check out < 1285693766 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we need a lot more than narrowing down < 1285693775 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what command? < 1285693784 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: sec < 1285693788 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need to modify the makefile and shit < 1285693869 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, can you prove it is undecidable? < 1285693924 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Nope. < 1285693972 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well, a handful of automated tests should be able to see that there are patterns that are definitely not conservative in many CAs. I have no idea how many candidates it would reduce the set to. Say you test all 2x2 patterns first, and have a border around so you can detect if it flows outwards. Then any conservative candidates left are tested on 3x3 and so on up a few steps. When you have few eno < 1285693972 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh left, test on randomly filled space maybe. It might be that you can demonstrate none of them are conservative < 1285694003 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, you hit some combo that turns out to be non-conservative for each one. < 1285694004 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of the B/S rules are conservative trivially. < 1285694010 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm okay < 1285694014 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well okay id < 1285694015 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :S12345678/S is obviously one. < 1285694019 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Want a tar.gz of the latest Golly CVS compiled with clang but without Perl support? < 1285694020 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*/B < 1285694029 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoops, the Perl scripts are still there. How did that happen? < 1285694032 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, S12345678/B means nothing to me. What do you mean? < 1285694034 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, why not? < 1285694046 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, er, S012345678/B is id. < 1285694048 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not what? the binary? < 1285694054 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In B/S notation. < 1285694055 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, mhm < 1285694062 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bullshit notation < 1285694065 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, in that I might as well. < 1285694073 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: BUT WILL YOU CHERISH IT < 1285694075 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it's 64-bit < 1285694077 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, Golly's random fill takes FOREVER. < 1285694083 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I WILL CHERISH IT < 1285694091 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WILL YOU USE IT FOR EVERYTHING < 1285694110 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, for a reasonably sized block (1024x1024 iirc) it took about half a second I last tried < 1285694120 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless there are actually any useful Perl scripts, then yes. < 1285694141 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is wrong with perl support? < 1285694152 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: breaks clang compilation < 1285694155 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1285694156 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I'm talking about hundreds of thousands on each side. < 1285694160 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, and what is wrong with gcc? < 1285694160 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all perl scripts have python equivalents anyway < 1285694164 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least all the interesting ones < 1285694166 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's not as fast. < 1285694167 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, there's giffer. < 1285694167 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm okay < 1285694170 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's useful. < 1285694172 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and everything is wrong with gcc, dude < 1285694174 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything < 1285694189 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hm? compile speed or speed or resulting binary? < 1285694192 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb phone < 1285694201 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :resulting binary < 1285694367 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Somebody CTCP VERSION me and tell me what you get. < 1285694404 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"-Gregor- VERSION bip-0.8.2 < 1285694404 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-Gregor- VERSION Colloquy 2.3 (4617) - Mac OS X 10.5.8 (Intel) - http://colloquy.info < 1285694404 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-Gregor- VERSION xchat 2.8.8 Linux 2.6.32-4.slh.1-sidux-amd64 [x86_64/1.60GHz/SMP] < 1285694404 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-Gregor- VERSION Microsoft IRC# 2011 64-bit (Windows 8 Beta, x64, 2GB RAM)" < 1285694406 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: What have you done? < 1285694407 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dear God. < 1285694415 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1285694416 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl < 1285694416 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bouncers lawl < 1285694421 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MEGAVERSION < 1285694433 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Microsoft IRC#: so not a real thing < 1285694447 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ORLY?! :P < 1285694448 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows 8 beta: so not a real thing :P < 1285694467 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love how bip replies, but also forwards. < 1285694469 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kiiiinda weird.l < 1285694473 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*weird < 1285694478 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So there's a trick to figure out whether I'm actually connected or not. < 1285694505 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Colloquy is the worst IRC client ever. < 1285694508 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is so terrible. < 1285694583 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"-r--r--r--" < 1285694586 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is not a normal file permission. < 1285694591 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This should not be in my package :| < 1285694593 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION fires a p30 glider beam at some ash.
< 1285694596 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For SCIENCE! < 1285694611 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, or should it? < 1285694628 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Should the README etc. in my binary package's tar.gz be -r--r--r--? :P < 1285694636 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or something saner like... being owner-writeable? < 1285694638 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It should be -r-------- < 1285694644 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: x_x < 1285694647 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. :P < 1285694652 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or ---x--x--x < 1285694660 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-rw-r--r-- 1 ehird ehird 1368 2010-09-28 17:21 appicon.xpm ;; why does this show as purple x_x < 1285694671 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It didn't hit anything. < 1285694697 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It shows up as Media Purple. < 1285694743 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, Microsoft IRC#? < 1285694744 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf is that < 1285694759 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: My IRC client of choice! < 1285694770 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm faked I think < 1285694776 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOWAI < 1285694780 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal the highly intelligent philosopher < 1285694793 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: GoL has cooler physics than real life. < 1285694804 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, someone needs to port Microsoft Comic Chat to .NET < 1285694805 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, embiggening the ash cloud. < 1285694807 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO IT < 1285694819 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I want to try drawing Fenman diagrams for it at some point. < 1285694827 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fenman! < 1285694830 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The GoL scientist. < 1285694839 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, that sounds like a quite cool way to represent GOL collisions < 1285694839 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How can I get myself an ash cloud easily? < 1285694856 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm, wait maybe not, since it depends on exactly where they hit each other < 1285694859 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, control-5 with some stuff selected. < 1285694876 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm using a 10% fill for this. < 1285694884 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, a glider hitting a large space shit at the top or near the end would result in different things probably < 1285694888 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ship* < 1285694890 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Then wait for it to die out? < 1285694891 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :space shit :D < 1285694899 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, yeah weird typo < 1285694905 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really < 1285694911 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well a bit < 1285694927 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I mean, not easily explained by qwerty < 1285694930 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, no, it makes a standard ash cloud, which I then shoot with a Gosper gun to see what happens. < 1285694937 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlike simple i/o swaps or such < 1285694943 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It is uber-slow zoomed in. < 1285694945 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My compile. < 1285694966 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The collision rate is fairly low, but it tends to grow a big cloud where it hits and obscure itself. < 1285694968 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, it is uber-slow with quicklife altogether. < 1285694981 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or rather it just doesn't update the display. < 1285694985 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And *every* GTK Golly I've used was slow when zoomed in. < 1285694991 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: This one is slow *zoomed out*. < 1285694995 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : alise, no, it makes a standard ash cloud, which I then shoot with a Gosper gun to see what happens. <-- hm, so now I know who to blame the next time flights are cancelled due to that < 1285694999 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It literally *does not update the display* on step=10^5. < 1285695000 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ever. < 1285695023 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, quicklife? < 1285695030 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The other white meat. < 1285695034 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hashlife would have 8^n usually iirc < 1285695035 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION hashes.
< 1285695049 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Does 10^5 update the display for you when zoomed out to scale=1:1? < 1285695053 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in quicklife? < 1285695058 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Conclusion: Quicklife is never good for more than about 10 seconds. < 1285695073 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1285695076 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does. < 1285695091 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But not very often. < 1285695142 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I saw some degenerate case where quicklife beat hashlife easily < 1285695144 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot where < 1285695161 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, a random fill is probably best stabilised with Quicklife. < 1285695168 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, indeed < 1285695182 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, this was some long-term random exhaust thingy iirc < 1285695183 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, lots of junk headed towards the gun now. < 1285695189 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's going to die soon. < 1285695207 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, how do you build resilient life structures? < 1285695216 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it even possible? < 1285695218 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: If I scribble with 1:1 scale and 10^4 steps (just random lines), press play: the next time it updates it's still life. < 1285695220 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you get this? < 1285695220 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, stick huge ash clouds around them :P < 1285695236 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm doing SCIENCE here, you know! < 1285695257 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, is ash cloud something specific? < 1285695298 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not really, it's just the medium-density mix of still-lifes and oscillators you get when stuff explodes. < 1285695314 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1285695321 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's very difficult to get a sustained reaction in it, though. < 1285695327 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Surely a dense packing of still lifes and oscillators is even better? < 1285695331 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, self repairing life structures would be interesting < 1285695336 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on macro scale I mean < 1285695361 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, might interact causing chain reactions perhaps? < 1285695399 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not if you place them non-stupidly < 1285695402 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but maybe < 1285695417 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, dense blocks burn very quickly. < 1285695417 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I mean, if there is some void in between perhaps certain patterns will die out instead of causing a chain reaction. Just a conjecture < 1285695463 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OTOH, it random fills very quickly < 1285695464 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ash is good exactly because it's what's left over after chaos dies out; it's by definition the stuff that supports reactions the worst. < 1285695473 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~1600x1600 cloud filled to 50% in less than a second. < 1285695485 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just tile the same block of ash. < 1285695507 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: How quickly does yours do that? < 1285695556 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instantaneously. < 1285695562 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ish. < 1285695574 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I was using a 2% fill. < 1285695582 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same with 50%. < 1285695641 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So, 1:1 scale, 10^4 steps, draw a lot of random scribbles -- next visual update, is it all still life and oscillators? Do the oscillators never seem to move after that? < 1285695672 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, is it possible to have sustained chaos in life? < 1285695681 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the oscillators have an even period, like most common ones, they will never seem to move at all. < 1285695698 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, define "chaos". < 1285695705 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, you used it above < 1285695713 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Answer the rest,then. :P < 1285695715 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*rest, then. < 1285695726 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then no, since normal chaotic patterns are short-lived. < 1285695735 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285695741 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, why is that the case? < 1285695748 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can have puffers etc. which have very messy and aperiodic output, though. < 1285695752 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that might count. < 1285695756 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285695769 0 :tombom!~tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1285695770 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But they leave an ash cloud rather than anything active. < 1285695787 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, so any chaos needs to be "fed" then all the time? < 1285695793 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically. < 1285695804 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's self-sustaining, odds are it's not chaotic. < 1285695830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, has it been proven that chaotic behaviour can't be self sustaining? < 1285695843 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not rigorously AFAIK. < 1285695847 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285695857 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Primarily because "chaotic" is vague. < 1285695873 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, how does chaos theory define it? < 1285695879 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the same I guess < 1285695919 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1285696060 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, is there a name for a "garden of eden pattern, except that it is a still life, and thus have itself as predecessor, but no other patterns" < 1285696064 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ^ < 1285696073 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and are any such known? < 1285696094 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1285696104 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to which question < 1285696106 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait. < 1285696107 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1285696112 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to both? < 1285696116 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not known, anyway. < 1285696119 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1285696123 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not named? < 1285696128 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think there's a name, either. < 1285696136 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, bbl in an hour < 1285696146 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A stable Garden of Eden, probably. < 1285696261 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION builds a massive chained Gosper and fires it at the ash cloud.
< 1285696292 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My money's on an instant chaotic reaction, followed by the gun being destroyed by gliders coming off it. < 1285696324 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep... < 1285696387 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's "stable" garden of eden? < 1285696425 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One which is a still-life, but has no other predecessors. < 1285696436 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One where they didn't put that silly tree in. < 1285696499 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 fizzie < 1285696506 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote What's "stable" garden of eden? One where they didn't put that silly tree in. < 1285696565 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wonder what that kind of pattern would look like and what would be the smallest example... < 1285696604 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably a still-life that looks like it should be chaotic. < 1285696610 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Suggestion: Use the binary for now. < 1285696650 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I got the CVS version working perfectly for 64-bitness with g++! < 1285696707 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: 64-bitness won't speed it up. < 1285696710 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it uses many registers. < 1285696747 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Trust me, the binary release is the smoothest. < 1285696760 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :229| What's "stable" garden of eden? One where they didn't put that silly tree in. < 1285696785 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I haven't had any issues with the CVS version, so I'll just stick to it anyway. < 1285696796 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For one thing, it has more patterns. < 1285696823 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Relink me that RLE one last time? < 1285696938 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: pweeze? :3 < 1285696957 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll give you the AWESOME one! < 1285696963 0 :Harpyon!~Harpyon@ti0031a380-0390.bb.online.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1285696985 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/n2kUjRyg < 1285697013 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4.5 times the glidery goodness! < 1285697027 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I WANT THE LESS AWESOME ONE < 1285697062 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: wait, what? < 1285697064 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not a gun < 1285697066 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1285697069 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my clipboard gets truncated < 1285697084 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: < 1285697085 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x = 38, y = 1, rule = B3/S23 < 1285697085 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15ob7ob14o! < 1285697087 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try that :-D < 1285697092 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/kfH1mw7M is the loest one. < 1285697098 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*less awesome < 1285697169 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The first one does not look like a glider gun o_O < 1285697178 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed it isn't. < 1285697208 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, that's because of the line numbers, I think. < 1285697219 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i downloaded the raw link, dude < 1285697249 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh great < 1285697254 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has a doctype in it < 1285697255 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It works for me... < 1285697256 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the raw link < 1285697256 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1285697283 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there < 1285697306 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So I create an ash cloud by waiting until 10% random noise stabilises, right? < 1285697322 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you can use any random fill that's not too sparse. < 1285697362 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was actually using a 2% fill, it seems. < 1285697399 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I'm trying to see what happens when you hit a fairly sparse cloud with a dense stream here. < 1285697433 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl the glider gun dies < 1285697451 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1285697488 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it sustains a chaotic reaction at the end rather than destroying still lifes. < 1285697550 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Golly needs an ash cloud generator. < 1285697593 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What, by random filling and stopping any escaping gliders? < 1285697653 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Random fill, then simulate only that area, wrapping. < 1285697669 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Until it turns into oscillators or takes like 3498573945734985793845934759 generations as a safeguard. < 1285697674 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(obvious oscillators, that is) < 1285697692 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With hashlife on hyperspeed, so it should be quick. < 1285697697 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you can do that yourself. < 1285697705 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can, but it's tedious. < 1285697710 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I'm not as sure about the Hashlife. < 1285697712 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is filling a huuuuge area right now.
< 1285697715 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Write a script for it? < 1285697726 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: How many Gosper guns can you stack without getting bored? < 1285697730 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go do that number. Gogogo. < 1285697739 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait! < 1285697744 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm doing SCIENCE! < 1285697748 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: SO AM I < 1285697751 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Write a script for it < 1285697761 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With a high-period gun rather than a low-period. < 1285697787 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I can get exponential growth for the Gospers pretty easily, so there's no immediate limit. < 1285697876 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I mean in terms of you making it, how bored you get. < 1285697888 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Say, 100 of them would be good. < 1285697900 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a 12,657 x 6,401 block of ash to destroy. < 1285697904 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Give or take a bit. < 1285697923 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chained Gospers are _useless_ for destroying ash. < 1285697929 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :streams of gliders destroy ash, rather than just making it worse? < 1285697930 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Not 100 of them. < 1285697936 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl, this is so slow < 1285697939 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes 100 of them. < 1285697942 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's counting up generations like seconds on a clock < 1285697948 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with hyperspeed hashlife < 1285698017 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The gliders feed the chaos from the first collisions with the cloud, so you just end up with a giant column of junk until a glider gets ejected up one of the barrels and destroys the whole thing. < 1285698033 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BAH < 1285698060 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hence my current tests with a 160-odd period stream. < 1285698084 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LWSS gun! < 1285698142 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although that brings up the issue of beehive crystals. < 1285698166 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which occur distressingly frequently. < 1285698182 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps two streams next to each other with high periods. < 1285698183 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO SLOW < 1285698200 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Perhaps SURROUNDING IT WITH DEATH < 1285698207 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Literally surrounding it with TONS OF GUNS < 1285698229 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rate of fire _does not help destroy things_. < 1285698239 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, anything to "crystals" here other than the obvious? < 1285698243 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: SHADDAP < 1285698276 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A beehive crystal is a formation of beehives that grows towards the source when hit by a low-enough period glider stream < 1285698281 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Hmm. < 1285698290 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :p30 is too low, though. < 1285698317 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I'm using a p360 gun right now, so it's a potential problem. < 1285698319 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Life defence system: A bunch of eaters of different kinds, to catch the newbies packed as closely as possible to a low depth around the exterior, then a GIGANTIC ASH CLOUD, then another bunch of eaters. < 1285698327 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whatever's inside is basically invincible. < 1285698431 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Beehive crystals tend to be stopped when the head is stopped by some junk, and the glider stream destroys the rest. < 1285698540 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what IS a beehive crystal anyway? < 1285698625 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.ics.uci.edu/~eppstein/ca/replicators/b36s245.html Building a glider gun from replicators. < 1285698638 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patterns/Oscillators/glider-stream-crystal.rle < 1285698668 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Builds then destroys beehive crystals over and over again. < 1285698671 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg, that replicator is so pretty to watch < 1285698672 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do so < 1285698676 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the images link to RLE files) < 1285698737 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: name some trivially conservative rules, btw? < 1285698758 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, B/S0123345678 < 1285698780 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't be bothered to correct that. < 1285698803 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HPP in the weaker formulation. < 1285698807 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about B0/S12345678? < 1285698810 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : HPP in the weaker formulation. ;; ?? < 1285698812 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*? < 1285698825 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of the conservation rule. < 1285698842 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1285698867 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Strong version: "all state counts are constant." Weak version: "there exists no pattern which will evolve such that only one state count changes." < 1285698893 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Strong and weak are equivalent for 2-state CAs, but not for 3 states. < 1285698898 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or more. < 1285698914 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HPP fits the weak version AFAIK, but not the strong. < 1285699102 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, wait. < 1285699110 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weak doesn't work very well. < 1285699140 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*state count disregarding the ground state? < 1285699181 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That isn't very nice. < 1285699274 0 :atrapado!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Abandonando < 1285699311 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, the p360 stream got through 25,000 cells of low-density ash without a problem. < 1285699323 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's try it with high-density! < 1285699790 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's holding out surprisingly well... < 1285699985 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I did need to intervene to destroy a beehive crystal early on, but since then it's been making inroads < 1285700016 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1285700062 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...And it has successfully drilled through a 50% density ash cloud.. < 1285700088 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In about 6 million generations, but still. < 1285700104 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Conclusion: build slow guns. < 1285700111 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a TC conservative CA would be amazing... well < 1285700121 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a conservative CA that is TC if you have an infinite tiling, say < 1285700131 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(still lifes that can be converted into others and read, i.e. infinite memory) < 1285700148 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or not even infinite tiling, just an infinite downwards line < 1285700254 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could make it TC even without that. < 1285700260 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is a good way to destroy ash hm? < 1285700268 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from select and clear, which is cheating < 1285700275 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By building a Minsky machine with sliding-block registers. < 1285700298 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, well, I just got through a lot of high-density ash with a high-period stream. < 1285700306 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Huh? Hm, right. < 1285700312 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Wait, what? < 1285700318 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So the distance between X and Y is the value of XY, that is? < 1285700321 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How would you compute with it? < 1285700327 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1285700335 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, won't that make it worse by creating new ash? < 1285700354 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, well, it threw off some gliders which you would have to watch out for. < 1285700369 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, also "beehive crystal"? < 1285700372 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But a thin line of ash would probably be enough. < 1285700388 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, not on life wiki it seems < 1285700393 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, line of beehives that grows when hit with a high-enough period glider stream/ < 1285700394 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is no page titled "beehive crystal". You can create this page. < 1285700417 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no full text search matches either < 1285700441 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal, line of beehives that grows when hit with a high-enough period glider stream/ < 1285700458 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, yes but then that definition should be added to life wiki maybe? < 1285700469 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might be under a different na,e < 1285700471 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*name < 1285700499 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285700747 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, it doesn't seem to be there. < 1285701006 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/On_the_Creation_of_Niggers -- H. P. Lovecraft, 1912 < 1285701025 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What NOW, Cthulhu?! You're less ghastly a beast than the Nigger! < 1285701031 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you have a less strange name! < 1285701167 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1285701174 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So, Life life. < 1285701206 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuleTable MOCKS me. < 1285701230 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want a permutation symmetry, dammit! < 1285701333 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Reversible, conservative, TC CA. < 1285701335 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FEEL THE PAIN < 1285701358 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would be even closer to "real" physics :P < 1285701378 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAARGh < 1285701386 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The very thought hurts my brain! < 1285701387 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Wait, just because you can't add cells doesn't mean you have to eat food. < 1285701394 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1285701396 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can just have a glider or whatever that moves forever. < 1285701400 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hence the MRM comment. < 1285701401 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You said conservative would be good to enforce food-gathering. < 1285701403 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that's not true. < 1285701406 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MRM? < 1285701408 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To *reproduce*. < 1285701420 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, how can it be TC if it is conservative? < 1285701433 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, MRM with sliding-block registers. < 1285701434 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Ahh. < 1285701439 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION → food
< 1285701439 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What Phantom_Hoover said. < 1285701442 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, MRM being? < 1285701451 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minksy register machine < 1285701454 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1285701456 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*minsky < 1285701458 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285701479 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that the one with bignum registers? Or is that another one? < 1285701501 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1285701512 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually there is an obvious way to do it conservatively. Encode data as distance between some live cells < 1285701520 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what Phantom_Hoover said < 1285701522 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1285701530 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1285701531 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty sure < 1285701536 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1285701704 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Coyote finally caught me < 1285701706 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1285701985 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To repeat to PH when he gets back: < 1285701993 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A reversible CA would make glider synthesis hard. < 1285702005 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance, you couldn't synthesize an oscillator or a still life. < 1285702013 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: No route to host < 1285702020 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or indeed generate one at all; it would have to be in the initial configuration. < 1285702021 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1285702030 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Additionally, if there is *any* way to produce a pattern or effect, it is the *only* way. < 1285702114 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :www.conwaylife.com/pattern.asp?... < 1285702115 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_< < 1285702319 0 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1285702328 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1285702452 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1285702490 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what's with the ...? < 1285702500 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:26:45 For instance, you couldn't synthesize an oscillator or a still life. ← I think it's theoretically possible. < 1285702515 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, not in reversible no < 1285702518 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: truncated irrelevance < 1285702524 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, aha < 1285702525 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: still life X has parent X < 1285702530 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :has no parent Y (last step of synthesis) < 1285702530 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 spaceships collide and throw off another (different) spaceship and drop a still life. < 1285702534 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the >_< was at .asp < 1285702539 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even .aspx < 1285702539 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ah yes < 1285702542 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would work < 1285702550 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i don't see how that would work < 1285702556 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ah < 1285702558 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would have a parent of still life X being last step of that synthesis < 1285702561 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1285702563 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, no < 1285702565 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if there's other things around < 1285702571 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, cool < 1285702576 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's why there's the other spaceship. < 1285702599 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which would only be creatable through that reaction. < 1285702627 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm any reversible CA would be a conservative right? < 1285702629 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or? < 1285702630 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1285702632 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's much like using dump tape elements in Reversible Brainfuck to compile regular Brainfuck commands into it < 1285702635 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1285702659 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: simple counterexample: take a reversible CA that is conservative and uses two colours, make it swap black and white every step but otherwise act the same < 1285702668 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's essentially the same concept as the bit bucket for reversible Boolean gates. < 1285702672 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ah right < 1285702705 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl < 1285702738 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, that makes the conservative element cooler! < 1285702781 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have to lose energy every time you store data. < 1285702862 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: in the conservative civilisation, they have drones that move the still life debris from machines out where nobody can see it < 1285702864 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or store it in a way you could retrieve it again, I suppose < 1285702865 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Designing a CA with 3 undecidable properties isn't easy, though. < 1285702874 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't have to design for TC < 1285702881 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, waitaminute. < 1285702882 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just keep designing for the other two and select ones that show complex behaviour < 1285702888 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then hope fervently < 1285702905 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We can make the reaction reversible for the things in the universe. < 1285702926 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Collide the junk ship with the still-life and get the two ships that were thrown off originally. < 1285703033 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "Can", as in "if you're the most amazing CA designer ever". < 1285703045 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1285703054 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, that's not plausible. < 1285703071 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Also in this category: "Running it backwards *obeys the forwards transition rules*! SOMEHOW!" < 1285703072 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's still consistent with what we're aiming at. < 1285703078 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Although that's actually in the opposite category.) < 1285703083 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obeys the... backwards transition rules? < 1285703085 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh. < 1285703090 0 :Gregor_!~Gregor@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1285703092 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: If the way to reverse something can be expressed as a CA < 1285703094 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you have two CAs < 1285703098 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which are time-reversals of each other < 1285703099 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Running it backwards and inverted! < 1285703099 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hawt < 1285703102 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(is this possible?) < 1285703107 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: DAY AND NIGHT MISTER :P < 1285703114 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, that's just inverted. < 1285703125 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is invert-time. < 1285703198 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1285703204 0 :Gregor_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Gregor < 1285703209 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1285703215 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But yes: is it possible for a reversible CA's reverse-rules to be CA themselves? < 1285703218 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*to be a CA themselves? < 1285703221 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of the same "class". < 1285703261 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not sure... < 1285703274 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Id obviously qualifies. < 1285703287 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's too trivial to be interesting. < 1285703360 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGkkyKZVzug < 1285703361 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16-bit ALU in minecraft < 1285703364 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: fizzie: ^ < 1285703371 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a COMPUTER CITY! < 1285703406 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night < 1285703412 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: DID YOU NOT SEE < 1285703416 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WATCH THE VIDEO!! YOU MUST :| < 1285703420 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is HUGE < 1285703659 0 :olsner_!~sal@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1285703728 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also features pig abuse < 1285703776 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1285703938 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Youtube is being slow, but I'll pause it and let it load. < 1285703971 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.instantelevatormusic.com/ for Windows! < 1285703979 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instant Elevator Music will automatically play elevator music while you wait for programs to open, files to copy, and downloads to download. < 1285704047 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The water physics are so incredibly realistic: http://zem.fi/~fis/realistic-water.png < 1285704127 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, apparently if you do a 2x2 pit, and unbucket two "fountains" to the opposite corners, they'll fill the two other squares too, and then you'll have a 2x2 block of still water, from which you can take infinite buckets of water from, since any hole you make will be semi-instantly refilled. < 1285704204 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, got competetive Life working. < 1285704277 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Neat, you can get 2-colour gliders. < 1285704328 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed, it's glide-reflective-inversion symmetric. < 1285704394 0 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1285704506 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are a lot of coöperative objects, actually. < 1285704597 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Do post the rules. < 1285704600 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Golly format. < 1285704601 0 :antivigilante!~antivigil@63-225-203-9.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1285704608 0 :|EOF|!461e569b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.70.30.86.155 JOIN :#esoteric < 1285704613 0 :antivigilante!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1285704616 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my gos < 1285704622 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION shoots the antivigilante
< 1285704631 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean hi < 1285704637 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :were you already here? < 1285704675 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* antivigilante (~antivigil@63-225-203-9.phnx.qwest.net) has joined #esoteric < 1285704676 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* |EOF| (461e569b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.70.30.86.155) has joined #esoteric < 1285704683 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :antivigilante: who you hi < 1285704744 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, http://pastebin.com/1rYZcC7j is the tree, http://pastebin.com/LAJNVmuy the table I compiled it from. < 1285704772 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the first one goes into golly? < 1285704834 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: WHERE I SAVE IT < 1285704837 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi alise :P) < 1285704854 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT IS UNREDEEMABLE, IT CANNOT BE SAVED < 1285704859 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(:P) < 1285704964 0 :antivigilante!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was not until just not < 1285704993 0 :antivigilante!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :**now < 1285705062 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, stick it into Rules/Whatever.tree < 1285705078 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1285705079 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1285705080 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the table worse or sth? < 1285705094 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: give it a name :P < 1285705096 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Life and Death? < 1285705112 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ima make a an HDCP master key implementation in silicon < 1285705117 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, taken. < 1285705131 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|EOF|: nobody cares < 1285705144 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then intel's going to go to my house and murder me < 1285705151 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'd say Death, but that'd be more suited to an actual CA. < 1285705153 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FightForLife? < 1285705162 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Last Cell Standing? < 1285705167 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1285705172 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mortal? Mortal Danger? < 1285705213 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ima go do several drugs in series and brag about it < 1285705258 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|EOF|, you're not CakeProphet, are you? < 1285705272 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1285705290 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's it to you? < 1285705392 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|EOF|: if they incapacitate you to the point where you go away, I approve. < 1285705443 0 :antivigilante!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THERE CAKE IS A LIE! < 1285705460 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, smashing gliders into stuff doesn't change its colour. < 1285705471 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may have found a use of the megaGosper! < 1285705510 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :antivigilante: *THEIR, unless you're being comprehensible. < 1285705514 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Dood, I need a name. < 1285705617 0 :antivigilante!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AlabasterSmurfsicle < 1285705619 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lulz < 1285705853 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: :| < 1285705896 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LifeAndSoulOfTheParty? < 1285705927 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION realises these rules don't quite work as intended.
< 1285705996 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fixed. < 1285706089 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Link? < 1285706096 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although the 2-colour gliders don't work any more. < 1285706103 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aww. < 1285706105 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :CakeProphet < 1285706114 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Mortal Cellbat < 1285706154 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hang on, I want to streamline the table. < 1285706388 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, http://pastebin.com/TiY2HeQe but you'll need to compile it to a tree with RuleTableToTree. < 1285706585 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: How about you do that :P < 1285706598 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiine < 1285706609 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh, it won't read stdin. < 1285706611 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How shitty. < 1285706618 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Name it :P < 1285706635 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DoubleLife? < 1285706666 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: not being on the right freenode account makes that a _teeny_ bit unconvincing < 1285706677 0 :CakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1285706684 0 :CakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1285706694 0 :CakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :passwords are funny that way < 1285706832 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: okay. < 1285706865 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's another one of those things which someone else has definitely invented, but I can't actually find. < 1285706866 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally afaict the new server software seems to make it a lot more awkward to find out whether someone's nick _is_ identified - whois gives me the account you're logged in as but i have to ask nickserv to tell whether your nick actually belongs to it... < 1285706891 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird@dinky:~/.golly$ /usr/lib/golly/RuleTableToTree DoubleLife < 1285706891 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Error: Error reading Rules/DoubleLife.table on line 3: symmetries:permute < 1285706893 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover < 1285706904 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i guess i could _just_ ask nickserv < 1285706910 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: or look at their ident < 1285706916 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hmm, permute might only be CVS. < 1285706920 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, no wait < 1285706922 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't help < 1285706926 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1285706928 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: FIX IT :| < 1285706944 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I'll give you the tree... < 1285706986 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: oh hm. /whois in irssi actually doesn't seem to tell that < 1285706993 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, http://pastebin.com/HdTVUnYp < 1285707002 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Put it in DoubleLife.tree. < 1285707034 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: doesn't seem to work here either :D < 1285707099 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Example file? :P < 1285707119 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, haven't got any... < 1285707141 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make some :| < 1285707144 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are the rules? < 1285707185 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Birth and survival are the same, but a cell becomes the same colour as the majority of its neighbours. < 1285707434 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: .colors, please? < 1285707440 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or does it not have any? < 1285707447 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't bother. < 1285707457 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Red and yellow is good enough for me. < 1285707460 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl < 1285707536 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Does random fill work? < 1285707551 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1285707559 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^_^ < 1285707591 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: now how do i count the population of each? >_> < 1285707604 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know... < 1285707613 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how do i stop it showing everything as red when i zoom out :P < 1285707613 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC there is a script somewhere which can do it. < 1285707640 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Golly shows everything with state 1's colours when it can't give each cell a pixel. < 1285707680 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try the script archive for the population counter. < 1285707690 0 :hailtothethief!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1285707692 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: 100% random fill whomfg < 1285707694 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so pretty < 1285707707 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so epileptic < 1285707745 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :histogram.py looks like it gives cell counts on a state-by-state basis. < 1285707783 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :80% random fill = instadeath < 1285707861 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: go to 1:1 in hexadecimal.mc, scribble a bit in the corner of one cell < 1285707861 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :play < 1285707865 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :watch catastrophe < 1285707869 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still manages to get 00 up though < 1285707900 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I went through this phase ages ago. < 1285707916 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's fun, but it gets boring after a while. < 1285708074 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1285708102 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh, I know. < 1285708107 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But it's still amusing. < 1285708137 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will it ever get to the next number?! < 1285708142 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try sticking a block into the centre of the metacell. < 1285708149 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1285708162 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The LWSSes hit it and everything explodes. < 1285708250 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1285708261 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CARNAGE < 1285708329 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can also sabotage the edge-detectors on the metacells and something interesting happens, but I forget what. < 1285708575 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Changing one pixel in the complex pattern of the top-left cell makes everything go normally until that cell is turned on. < 1285708577 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then whoo boy < 1285708581 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything leaks out < 1285708645 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is why I went on at such length about sparseness and redundancy for Lifeforms. < 1285708673 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. :P < 1285708874 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1285708891 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1285709098 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1285709120 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg20627653.800-first-replicating-creature-spawned-in-life-simulator.html?full=true < 1285709124 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1285709124 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only gets the first few paragraphs, but he < 1285709125 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*eh < 1285709127 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover < 1285709137 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw that when it was first published. < 1285709142 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah :P < 1285709163 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I felt vaguely like I had met a celevrity. < 1285709165 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*b < 1285709233 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: eh, i've talked to TimBL, that's probably my height of celebrity-feeling < 1285709253 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(he's in, or at least used to be in, #foaf quite a lot) < 1285709260 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I once had lunch with Dr Bunhead. < 1285709275 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's more like an anti-achievement :P < 1285709277 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i once fucked bill clinton < 1285709296 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was once the Prime Minister. < 1285709305 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I once created the universe. < 1285709354 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.w3.org/People/Berners-Lee/Kids.html < 1285709360 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly my favourite thing of all time < 1285709365 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"At CERN, people study High Energy Physics. That is the physics of really really small particles - particles much smaller than atoms. It turns out that if you want to investigate really really small things, you need huge machines called accelerators to smash particles together really hard. Then you have huge gadgets (about the size of a house) which detects what happens, and what bits fly off, so you can figure out whether you managed to make any new types o < 1285709365 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f particle. < 1285709365 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CERN is a big place - a few thousand people work there. Many of them are scientists whose jobs are at universities in different places in the world, and they come to CERN because they need to use the huge accelerators at CERN." < 1285709425 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@@@ This really needs lots of nice diagrams @@@ < 1285709451 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION still wants to make up Lifeform physics.
< 1285709468 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"But I am doing a project where we have to get "primary" sources, which means I have to interview the subject. And I'm doing it on you. So I have to interview you." < 1285709476 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Make movable ash. < 1285709494 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nigh-on impossible. < 1285709502 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Another kind of movable defence, then. < 1285709555 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Loads of moving spaceships is basically the only thing which would work very well. < 1285709632 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And by "very well" I mean "would destroy anything behind it if it clipped a glider. < 1285709636 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*" < 1285709696 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: UC + precalculated ash < 1285709712 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ ash ... destroyer? never mind < 1285709716 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would take forever to move, but it could work. < 1285709717 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could leave behind a trail of ash somehow, i guess < 1285709726 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh! < 1285709730 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like have its own secret path through the ash's membrane < 1285709732 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that lets it sort of < 1285709732 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go down < 1285709735 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go right < 1285709736 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go up < 1285709739 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and build more ash after that < 1285709741 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ooh? < 1285709744 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have a standard puffer moving just in front and to the side of the command ship. < 1285709788 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't throw off any gliders IIRC, so you get some fairly high-density ash. < 1285710051 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1285710080 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although you could shoot the engine pretty easily. < 1285710550 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Can you have a puffer that goes < 1285710554 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :down down down STOP at barrier < 1285710557 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then starts going upwards < 1285710559 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bit to the right? < 1285710565 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ad infinitum < 1285710569 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with little blockers at the top < 1285710577 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that the puffer crashing into blocks < 1285710578 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1285710579 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1285710582 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just have a continuous glider stream in front < 1285710583 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1285710615 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it zigzags? < 1285710633 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, there's the glider-producing switch engine. < 1285710655 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It leaves a trail of debris and fires gliders forwards. < 1285710663 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it only moves at c/12. < 1285710696 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: That's okay, whatever's inside will be slower. < 1285710704 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Although it has to angle right so that the ship never crashes into it... somehow. < 1285710706 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that possible? < 1285710713 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, just have an opening in the middle that the ship can pass through. < 1285710715 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or something. < 1285710747 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Switch engines move diagonally at c/12, and they can be stabilised into Corderships, which are almost certainly capable of making circuitry. < 1285710877 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1285711215 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fork < 1285711240 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: what's the shortest stick that grows indefinitely? < 1285711242 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there one? < 1285711245 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess that's a replicator :P < 1285711252 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shortest stick? < 1285711266 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just < 1285711267 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :straight line < 1285711268 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :run it < 1285711270 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it expands forever < 1285711278 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's on Wikipedia IIRC. < 1285711284 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unhelpful :P < 1285711306 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It fires a switch engine on each side, so it's not a replicator. < 1285711310 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[*starts plotting how to create a spaceship that can inject its own program into other Gemini spaceships*]] < 1285711312 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SUCH A COOL IDEA < 1285711318 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: oh yeah that, i think i've seen that. maybe. < 1285711439 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION ponders a virus in Langton's Loops.
< 1285711538 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1285711559 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"If anyone is interested, I've made a script to convert patterns consisting of well-spaced blocks, eaters, beehives, boats, tubs and loaves into a Geminoid glider synthesis. Andrew's original pattern looks like this has been done manually, with some primitive recursion in the YAML program. ('Primitive recursion' is the technical term for this; I'm not disparaging your work!" < 1285711560 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coool < 1285711564 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*:) at the end < 1285711672 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are magnets electrically neutral? < 1285711681 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure they are, but... < 1285711758 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should be able to test with a charged copper sphere and a magnet, actually. < 1285711765 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"In point of fact, I've gotten through a couple of design cycles for a Gemini gun now, and oddly enough it looks like it will run faster than a Gemini does for the first half of the first construction" < 1285711765 0 :olsner_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they're electrically evil < 1285711767 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gemini gun < 1285711768 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifegasm < 1285711795 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"However, there are quite a number of common still lifes that it cannot construct, severely limiting its use." ;; wrong! < 1285711809 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :construct a UC not using those that happens to have a program to create that still life pre-loaded >:) < 1285711816 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1285711826 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a Gemini? < 1285711847 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, the only existing class of Life replicators. < 1285711860 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.cranemtn.com/life/files/gemi ... 820116.zip < 1285711860 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.cranemtn.com/life/files/gemi ... 076540.zip < 1285711860 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.cranemtn.com/life/files/gemi ... 712268.zip < 1285711866 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's a Game of Life spaceship < 1285711867 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, the Gemini gun has been made. < 1285711869 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it works simply: < 1285711873 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :first, it creates a copy of itself < 1285711877 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, programmable devices that create arbitrary objects via glider collisions? < 1285711878 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then, the copy erases the previous copy < 1285711880 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this repeats forever < 1285711889 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, with an interesting twist < 1285711892 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: already done, and not so arbitrary here < 1285711900 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the thing is that replicators in life are HARD < 1285711906 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and nobody was sure they were possible until a few years ago < 1285711914 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas in most Life-like automata, they're very simple < 1285711917 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it a replicator if it deletes itself? < 1285711920 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a *momentous* occasion, its discovery < 1285711924 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: sure, you can easily disable that < 1285711927 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it creates itself < 1285711929 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and THEN deletes itself < 1285711931 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not in the process of < 1285711933 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, infinite vertical column of black is a replicator < 1285711934 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :afterwards < 1285711941 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow you're boring :) < 1285711944 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :finite, of course < 1285711951 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a *big* deal < 1285711958 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We've known that replicators *exist* for years. < 1285711966 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Building one was the tricky part. < 1285711970 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i said years < 1285711979 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: its speed, incidentally, is (5120,1024)c/33699586 < 1285711983 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, it's "simply" a matter of taking an arbitrary-constructor-object, then quining it < 1285711986 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not a few years, AFAIK. < 1285711986 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that can be improved a bit and reduced arbitrarily < 1285711993 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A decade, at least. < 1285711994 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you can't have such a constructor < 1285711997 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not arbitrary < 1285712002 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glider synthesis is limited < 1285712009 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: before the Spartan? < 1285712015 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1285712022 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alright then < 1285712022 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: well, OK < 1285712025 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, wasn't it 2004? < 1285712028 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC universal construction was proven *ages* ago. < 1285712028 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd have to make it out of synthesizable components < 1285712038 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you know, everyone else who liked Life had a heart attack when this happened :P < 1285712052 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"John Conway proved that such a pattern exists in Life, and an outline of the proof can be found in Winning Ways for Your Mathematical Plays and The Recursive Universe." < 1285712054 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alright then. < 1285712063 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since at least 1982. < 1285712087 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had just started following the Life forums when it was posted. < 1285712105 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I wonder how long it would take to modify one of those TC Life computers with a synthesizer arm to be glider-synthesizable? < 1285712115 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after that, making it replicate would be relatively easy < 1285712120 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They *are* glider-synthesisable. < 1285712127 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, then < 1285712142 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd also have to encode an initial program into it, but you could just glider that across after it was made < 1285712151 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Spartan UCC could have been made into a replicator, but it would have taken too long. < 1285712163 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to write or to run? < 1285712183 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's not that hard, really < 1285712192 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gemini took a simpler approach, though < 1285712193 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more restricted < 1285712201 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not a UTM, i don't think < 1285712217 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: which gemini gun is the coolest? < 1285712222 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor do you have to be to produce a quine < 1285712244 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know anything about them, other than that the image I looked at was labelled with Comic Sans and that this made me angry. < 1285712297 0 :CakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :|THE < 1285712308 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It feels weird to think that I've only known about Life for 4 years at the most. < 1285712321 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've known about Life for much about Life < 1285712321 0 :|THE!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :|EOF| < 1285712325 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it /that/ lifechanging? < 1285712338 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1285712345 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :athough not as much as wolfram things < 1285712347 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*thinks < 1285712348 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fantasized about one of my elementary school friends doing... stuff with Life < 1285712372 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"LIFE PORN" < 1285712381 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. Not in a dirty way < 1285712390 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Non-dirty Life porn!" < 1285712393 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You think Wolfram is fundamentally right? < 1285712401 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait. < 1285712406 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just saw that correction. < 1285712415 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl < 1285712423 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, i've left the hexadecimal running all this time < 1285712426 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the carnage < 1285712450 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know there's a metafier script in the Python collection? < 1285712474 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of a universal computer, you'd just need a programmable synthesizer < 1285712476 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It takes any B/S rule pattern and makes metacells which simulate it in Life. < 1285712479 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gemini gun is frickin' huge < 1285712480 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which could be beamed the program from outside < 1285712501 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's basically gemini, except it knows its own pattern < 1285712525 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by duplicating an existing information feed? or via some other mechanism? < 1285712566 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, Gemini design: two constructor/reflector units keeping a glider loop between them. They build the next units and copy the genome across. < 1285712573 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The child deletes the parent. < 1285712576 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit it's huge < 1285712588 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd like to see a glider gun puffer sometime < 1285712590 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the geminis are as big as gliders < 1285712616 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, exists. < 1285712628 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1285712630 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was the first quadratic-growth pattern discovered. < 1285712643 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.conwaylife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=399&sid=ee767eaaabb71ce2dcdbe63aa2c271c4&start=50#p3121 ;; "I'm a journalist, please do my Game of Life-related journalism for me" < 1285712664 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: hmm, seems surprising that that was discovered before space-filler-stretchers < 1285712669 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1285712679 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second seems simpler in a way < 1285712691 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Synthing a glider gun is rather easier than finding a wavefront and stabilising it. < 1285712854 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: < 1285712855 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"BlackBerry PlayBook ★ < 1285712855 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Announced today during RIM’s developer conference. 7-inches diagonal, runs the QNX OS that RIM bought earlier this year." < 1285712859 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your dream come true < 1285712872 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1285712874 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The tablet will utilize an OS created by the recently acquired QNX (just as we'd heard previous to the announcement) called the BlackBerry Tablet OS [...]" < 1285712913 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1285712921 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :QNX? < 1285712936 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DAMMIT AMERICANS STOP SAYING "GAUSS" WRONG < 1285713005 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do *you* say it? < 1285713012 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Gaoos" < 1285713014 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gaussier? < 1285713034 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know, how it's pronounced by Germans. < 1285713066 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the correct pronunciation is along the lines of "gouse" < 1285713078 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by analogy with "house" < 1285713100 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:EnUk4Vy1WCcJ:www.mathnet.or.kr/mathnet/kms_tex/980598.pdf+gaussier&hl=en&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESid9-HVMOyHz15NJkuVrT_DC7Q0jaO4GtX8vyTt0NLcDAH4bVq3Xf9q2NjSTWQPm_ara3A7nZohiJXnkCEqKRe1afjd75eRrwY2gMCF8qzMpciENNEDDa80_VGpPNY27EldQaFt&sig=AHIEtbQVJUqjEavc_blLJnpE9Z11v_8rrw < 1285713109 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :goosian blur < 1285713147 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gaawwws < 1285713151 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1285713158 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DING DING DING < 1285713172 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/ˈɡaʊs/ is WP's IPA. < 1285713174 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gaawwwss < 1285713197 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1285713204 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g-owww!-s < 1285713241 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heldam < 1285713292 0 :olsner_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah, who cares how it's pronounced < 1285713310 0 :olsner_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think each language should choose a pronounciation they can get right and stick with it < 1285713313 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner_, me! < 1285713329 0 :olsner_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of trying and failing at whatever the original language is < 1285713332 0 :olsner_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :olsner < 1285713333 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Star gate is a pattern based on the Fast Forward Force Field that was created on October 26, 1996 by Dietrich Leithner. It is a period 60 oscillator that allows lightweight spaceships to jump forward at the superluminous speed of 15c/14. Specifically, lightweight spaceships entering from the left jump by 30 cells along their path in 28 generations. < 1285713333 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Goss" sounds stupid, for one thing. < 1285713339 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone please correct this misconception < 1285713342 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gaussian blur, gas'n'blow. < 1285713343 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although, wait < 1285713347 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it actually make travel faster, just not information transfer? < 1285713351 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you don't say "hoss", so it's not as if you don't have the phoneme. < 1285713354 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, no. < 1285713360 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then fix the page < 1285713360 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you got tthat. < 1285713361 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/index.php?title=Star_gate < 1285713362 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*that < 1285713367 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but the page disagreed < 1285713406 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/index.php?title=Fast_forward_force_field at least acknowledges that it's an illusion < 1285713414 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Leithner named the Fast Forward Force Field in honour of his favourite science fiction writer, the physicist Robert L. Forward." < 1285713415 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh come on :P < 1285713428 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Added "appear to". < 1285713432 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weasel words FTW! < 1285713460 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: if you stacked a bunch of stargates almost right after each other, then fired a spaceship from the start < 1285713471 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1285713471 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd reach the end faster than the spaceship but slower than c, right? < 1285713489 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The spaceship comes out the end regardless of the input, IIRC. < 1285713505 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/index.php?title=Teleportation states authoritatively that it's actually superluminal all over the page lawl < 1285713523 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you know... < 1285713524 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...that replicators are known to exist in Conway's Game of Life, but none have yet been found? < 1285713526 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: fix that too :P < 1285713546 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's open-edit, you know. < 1285713583 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although there is a distinctive jump in the ships position, it does not qualify as superluminal motion because it is not sustained; moreover to be effective it depends on the distance between the bow of the teleportee and the stern of the advanced image. Leithner constructed a Stargate which, by renewing and repeating the force field, can impart an impulse to a whole procession of ships, but they must arriv < 1285713583 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e in synchrony with the field. The refactory period of the force field, the size of the debris cloud, and the ability to create the necessary glider streams in time all affect the design. When the actual distance covered by a designated glider is divided by the number of generations elapsed, the result is no longer superluminal; only apparently so over short stretches. < 1285713593 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They basically get it right there. < 1285713606 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, their logo ANNOYS me. < 1285713626 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1285713637 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "no longer superluminal" -- it never was < 1285713648 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, tell alise of your proof that the Moore neighbourhood cannot exist on a sphere. < 1285713671 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right :P < 1285713677 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.skilledtests.com/wiki/Template:Game_of_Life --> http://www.skilledtests.com/wiki/Conway's_Game_of_Life < 1285713682 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(yes, it's meant to show as template code) < 1285713687 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it saves as an actual invocation on page save < 1285713689 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning it gets evaluated < 1285713690 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :genius < 1285713702 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is. < 1285713720 0 :Harpyon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Harpyon < 1285713742 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MediaWiki is m4, but less civilised. < 1285713755 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can you be less civilised than m4 :P < 1285713793 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't there a whole chain of less civilized tools below m4? like perl for instance < 1285713808 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MediaWiki is... pretty low. < 1285713822 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least it doesn't try to be TC. < 1285713926 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/images/0/0f/Unidimensional_infinite.png < 1285713938 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: have you ever used m4?? < 1285713940 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just ask ais523 < 1285713954 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :m4's a perfectly good esolang < 1285713987 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The idiots have cascade-protected the main page. < 1285713987 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't written any m4 programs, just some minor sendmail configuration and autoconfing < 1285713995 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't change the Did you Know. < 1285714092 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :create the page Wikipedia:Main_Page/Errors (even though it'll be in the wrong namespace), then complain that they don't have the relevant page for reporting in the exact same place as Wikipedia < 1285714137 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/index.php?title=Category:Spaceships_with_speed_2560c/16849793 < 1285714155 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1285714164 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't they mention the direction? < 1285714562 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1285714591 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Glais523 < 1285714773 0 :|EOF|!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1285714851 0 :Glais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh-oh, this meme is spreading < 1285714851 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Glais523, explain. < 1285714861 0 :Glais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone notes a couple of people in the same channel have nicks starting with Gla < 1285714866 0 :Glais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so other people also change their nicks to start with Gla < 1285714877 0 :Glais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people in /other channels/ notice a lot of changes to start with Gla, so follow suit < 1285714884 0 :Glais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hopefully it'll fizzle before it becomes self-sustaining < 1285714922 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION → gleep
< 1285714938 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Glais523: afaict you're the only one in the whole world applying this meme < 1285714944 0 :Glais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: in this channel, yes < 1285714989 0 :Glais523!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ais523 < 1285714994 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no other channel I'm in has any gla:ers at all < 1285715012 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably doesn't have much of an intersection with the others, it started in #nethack < 1285715035 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so #nethack is full of them? < 1285715055 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was, it fizzled there after a while < 1285715071 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but spread to other nethack-related channels in the meantime < 1285715075 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where I hope it ended, but it's hard to tell < 1285715163 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1285715181 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1285715345 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously it's not ending, just glacial < 1285715406 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other NetHack related channels? < 1285715431 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#nethack.de < 1285715434 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#unnethack < 1285715440 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1285715445 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm in 5 nethack-related channels at the moment, but those are two of the larger ones < 1285715467 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Glasgeo < 1285715508 0 :Glasgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sadly, I doubt the two other channels I am in are capable of sustaining memes like this < 1285715537 0 :Glasgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, one, not counting the +m that I just lef < 1285715539 0 :Glasgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :t < 1285715891 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+m means NO MEMES, silly < 1285716008 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :silly < 1285716013 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1285716156 0 :cpressey!~CPressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1285716157 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glasgowo < 1285716606 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glk < 1285717356 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This directory is still sort of wrecked from the great disk crash. Damn. Last updated May 10, 1999." < 1285717359 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1285717368 0 :Glasgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, o.O < 1285717744 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where < 1285717757 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kodkok < 1285717797 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: where? < 1285717894 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ih nel < 1285717931 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'kodkok' sounds a bit like swedish for making a stew out of code < 1285717944 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good < 1285718014 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The actual poll on time.com's front page: http://i.imgur.com/qZdqK.jpg < 1285718067 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Polish: kod -> code, kok -> chignon < 1285718093 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: smak ? < 1285718201 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'kok' is the noun form of 'koka' which means to cook or to boil, so making a foo-boil would typically mean stewing the foo or something like that < 1285718270 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.staringispolite.com/likepython/ < 1285718272 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1285718273 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :śok < 1285718274 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1285718274 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds