< 1283472013 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :After I write more, I can test it to see if the example programs will run < 1283472415 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zoiks < 1283472433 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Yes, "Zoiks". < 1283472535 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Zurrr < 1283472911 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283473593 0 :sftp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283473593 0 :wareya!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1283473638 0 :wareya!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283474507 0 :alise!~alise@91.105.124.106 JOIN :#esoteric < 1283476727 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gaah, Dot Action 2 is so impossible. < 1283476912 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um < 1283476918 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it not save your place? < 1283476926 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm stuck with level 1 again < 1283477019 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sigh* McCain proposing a bill that would allow imprisonment without trial. < 1283477044 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently he liked his time as a prisoner of war so much that he feels everyone should live it. < 1283477123 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283477177 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You need to write down the save code. < 1283477184 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From the level selection screen; the NNN-NNN. < 1283477190 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"(3) INAPPLICABILITY OF CERTAIN STATEMENT AND RIGHTS- A individual who is suspected of being an unprivileged enemy belligerent shall not, during interrogation under this subsection, be provided the statement required by Miranda v. Arizona (384 U.S. 436 (1966)) or otherwise be informed of any rights that the individual may or may not have to counsel or to remain silent consistent with Miranda v. Arizona." < 1283477192 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Second menu item to enter one.) < 1283477197 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... Don't think that actually works. < 1283477200 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Ha. < 1283477218 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I have a code for 55. < 1283477222 0 :Quadrescence!~Quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence JOIN :#esoteric < 1283477224 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you're not getting iiit~ < 1283477292 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Yeah, the opinion of the court in Miranda v. Arizona was that absolutely no evidence from an interrogation is admissible in any court, civil or otherwise, unless the "Miranda rights" are told to them. < 1283477382 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Soooo... Yeah. Doesn't work unless they want to produce a giant pile of BS that the judge will laugh out of court. < 1283477418 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"An individual, including a citizen of the United States, determined to be an unprivileged enemy belligerent under section 3(c)(2) in a manner which satisfies Article 5 of the Geneva Convention Relative to the Treatment of Prisoners of War may be detained without criminal charges and without trial for the duration of hostilities against the United States or its coalition partners in which the individual has engaged, or which the individual has < 1283477438 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoa, Google own reCAPTCHA. < 1283477444 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since about a year ago. < 1283477444 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And *that* just violates almost the entire US Bill of Rights in a single long sentence. < 1283477449 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Impressive, but dang. < 1283477451 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.com/recaptcha < 1283477511 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"9) UNPRIVILEGED ENEMY BELLIGERENT- The term `unprivileged enemy belligerent' means an individual (other than a privileged belligerent) who-- < 1283477514 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(A) has engaged in hostilities against the United States or its coalition partners; < 1283477517 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(B) has purposely and materially supported hostilities against the United States or its coalition partners; or < 1283477520 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(C) was a part of al Qaeda at the time of capture." < 1283477531 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sooo. I hereby declare Congress to be code for al Qaeda. < 1283477543 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And shall detain them in the Capitol. < 1283478109 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, awesome. < 1283478159 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dang it, I keep missing a dot in level 20 < 1283478164 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DoJ is suing Arpaio. < 1283478322 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION lols at stage 22
< 1283478557 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF at Stage 23 < 1283478735 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wtfs at stage 24
< 1283478764 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: 48 is the hardest so far < 1283478765 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from 55 < 1283478771 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which appears to be impossible in the time given :) < 1283478772 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about the one with 1 time?! < 1283478813 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I either fry on the upper yellow, or run out of time < 1283478827 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finally < 1283478842 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like that. :) < 1283478935 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :25 was fun < 1283479043 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :55 I actually have no idea what you have to do, past getting the first green block. < 1283479238 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what are you on now? < 1283479246 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taking a break from it < 1283479250 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Around 27 I think < 1283479267 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you note your save code> < 1283479268 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*code? < 1283479285 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1283479312 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :27 < 1283479885 0 :sshc_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sshc < 1283480038 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1283481280 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, cheat codes: http://jayisgames.com/archives/2007/04/dot_action_2.php#walkthrough < 1283481290 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Fuck that shit. < 1283481305 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I'm skipping level 27 < 1283481432 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Ha. You'll find much harder ones and end up skipping the entire game. < 1283481434 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :27 is easy. < 1283481447 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?! < 1283481464 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :27 is utterly trivial < 1283481468 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can't do it you have no hope < 1283481481 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just go in the middle < 1283481507 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1283481515 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why are you saying tons of punctuation? < 1283481526 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@# < 1283481574 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :27 done < 1283481577 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did 28 already < 1283481583 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fighting 29 < 1283481694 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dangit, missed one < 1283481724 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1283482112 0 :augur!~augur@208-58-6-161.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283484945 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Write error: Broken pipe < 1283484945 0 :comex_!comex@c-67-188-10-190.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283485129 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why can't I run bsnes at full speed any more? D: < 1283485238 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently the answer is: X went "fuck you". < 1283486007 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1283486271 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283486290 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made the BytePusher VM program, and it works. < 1283486319 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I have to wait 14 minutes to try the second example program. < 1283486358 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has a Factor project to do!
< 1283486635 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/prog/BytePusher/logo.png < 1283486889 0 :Gregor-L!~Gregor@173-115-8-58.pools.spcsdns.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283487049 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Audio is not implemented yet. < 1283487125 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1283487159 0 :bsmntbombdood_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :bsmntbombdood < 1283487243 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have just testsed the second program too, and the second program also works. < 1283487719 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/prog/BytePusher/ < 1283487739 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I have included both example programs in the .ZIP archive so that you do not have to use RapidShare) < 1283487916 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283487917 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283488081 0 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1283488087 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1283488197 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1283488771 0 :mtve!~mtve@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1283489655 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1283491187 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283491221 0 :augur!~augur@208-58-6-161.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283492088 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283496581 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283497597 0 :cheater99!~cheater@p5B216A8E.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283497700 0 :Quadrescence!~Quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence JOIN :#esoteric < 1283498011 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1283498094 0 :cheater00!~cheater@p549722D3.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283498210 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1283498275 0 :Zuu!zuu@0x55529f1b.adsl.cybercity.dk JOIN :#esoteric < 1283498275 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1283498275 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1283498590 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@i-254.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1283499137 0 :comex_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1283499279 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283499331 0 :comex!comex@c-67-188-10-190.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283499827 0 :relet1!~hirtho@159.162.68.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1283499916 0 :relet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1283499948 0 :relet1!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :relet < 1283500799 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1283500800 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1283500898 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283501152 0 :augur!~augur@208-58-6-161.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283501162 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283501179 0 :myndzi!myndzi@c-24-19-39-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283501563 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1283503315 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1283504019 0 :cheater00!~cheater@p549722D3.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283504882 0 :tombom!~tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1283505010 0 :choochter!~choochter@host213-1-54-148.btremoteinternet-dsl.bt.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283505114 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1283505178 0 :augur!~augur@208-58-6-161.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283505231 0 :choochter!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1283506470 0 :choochter!~choochter@host213-1-54-148.btremoteinternet-dsl.bt.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283507444 0 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-50-208.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1283508057 0 :cheater!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's in german, but the code vs times comparisons speak for themselves < 1283508059 0 :cheater!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.drweb.de/magazin/schneller-php-schneller/ < 1283508428 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, Google translate is somewhat hilarious. < 1283508431 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"D. grinding for, foreach, while (performance gain 15-30%) < 1283508431 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Es ist falsch, pauschal zu behaupten, while ist schneller als zum Bespiel foreach. It is wrong to say a flat rate, while faster than the examples foreach. Oder umgekehrt. Or vice versa. Es kommt immer auf die Art des Objekts, die der Befehl zu schleifen hat. It all depends on the nature of the object to the grind, the command has." < 1283508441 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah, it pastes both versions. < 1283508462 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It is wrong to say a flat rate, while faster than the examples foreach. Or vice versa. It all depends on the nature of the object to the grind, the command has." < 1283508467 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, lovely verb choice there. < 1283508475 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GRIND that LOOP, PEON. < 1283509046 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1283510229 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283511008 0 :cheater!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1283511014 0 :cheater!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's loopgrinding < 1283512163 0 :cheater99!~cheater@p549722D3.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283512781 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1283514028 0 :cheater99!~cheater@p549722D3.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283516080 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1283518520 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1283518541 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283518654 0 :comex!comex@c-67-188-10-190.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283518911 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot < 1283518914 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: poe's tales, of which he had cultivated with such singular results. it was, they averred, as though wounded by some stray shot. the beast turned its head in my direction and the eyes fell open, disclosing the repulsively rotten fangs of the degenerate joe slater. i shivered as i wondered why i did not fnord killing four and finally succeeding in the liberation of the monster. those victims who could recall the e < 1283518938 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders who Joe Slater is.
< 1283518972 0 :amca!~amca@CPE-121-208-82-44.cqzr1.cha.bigpond.net.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1283518998 0 :amca!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1283519366 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: He's a degenerate, with repulsively rotten fangs. < 1283519412 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"His name, as given on the records, was Joe Slater, or Slaader, and his appearance was that of the typical denizen of the Catskill Mountain region; one of those strange, repellent scions of a primitive Colonial peasant stock whose isolation for nearly three centuries in the hilly fastnesses of a little-traveled countryside has caused them to sink to a kind of barbaric degeneracy, rather than advance with their more fortunately placed brethren of the thickly set < 1283519412 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tled districts." < 1283519519 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283519544 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283519554 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style < 1283519554 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Available: agora alice c64 ct darwin discworld europarl ff7 fisher ic irc jargon lovecraft* nethack pa speeches ss wp youtube < 1283519576 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that explains it < 1283519627 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He appears to have been an early-20th century footballer. < 1283519673 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The man himself was pitiably inferior in mentality and language alike; but his glowing, titanic visions, though described in a barbarous disjointed jargon, were assuredly things which only a superior or even exceptional brain could conceive." < 1283519725 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's your average footballer. < 1283519731 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1283519935 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Can you tell us more about what happened to Joe? < 1283519936 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: a cowed and cringing satellite in the fnord fnord firm to the house in darkness but for the glare of the fnord < 1283519953 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure if that's good or bad. < 1283519979 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283520015 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot, Wikipedia says he was killed in WWI. Is this true? < 1283520016 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: it was a gentle daylight rain that awaked me front my stupor in the brush-grown railway cut, and among them was lore of a golden valley that led to old world wonders. by night the outer harbour was cleared, and late passengers watched the stars twinkling above an unpolluted ocean. < 1283520057 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1283520071 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, he was killed because he was "unfit to bear the active intellect of cosmic entity. His gross body could not undergo the needed adjustments between ethereal life and planet life." < 1283520096 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, so there it was hushed up. < 1283520101 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cosmic entities should have more sense than picking footballers. < 1283520170 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1283520182 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Evidently. < 1283520202 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1283520208 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously they thought that understanding the offside rule was a sign of high mental calibre. < 1283520435 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, XD < 1283520882 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1283520994 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283520997 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Disclaimer: I actually do understand the offside rule. < 1283521080 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you mean the football/soccer rule, or the indentation rule? < 1283521090 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The football rule. < 1283521155 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the indentation rule? < 1283521707 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1283521732 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283522348 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a common nickname AFAIK for the rule Haskell uses < 1283522361 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where you can line up a loop (or other control structure) body with the first line < 1283522521 0 :cheater99!~cheater@p549722D3.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283522564 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283522617 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.50.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1283522789 0 :derdon!~quassel@p5B3E4C3C.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283522831 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283523695 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283523697 0 :relet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1283523763 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-0-1.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283523786 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283524363 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, that is strange... The haskell rule is actually quite easy to understand. < 1283524384 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's more complicated than the rules for pretty much any other lang... < 1283524402 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while I never understood the football rule. Though, I can't say I spent much time trying to understand the football rule < 1283524418 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :football just doesn't interest me very much < 1283524445 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hm possibly. < 1283524491 0 :relet!~thomas@c905DBF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1283524887 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1283525116 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283525653 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283526357 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1283526624 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283526651 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283526785 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It's more complex than the rules for any other language, but it's more *natural* than most other such rules. < 1283526809 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I rather like it, but I see how people could be confused < 1283526854 0 :derdon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1283527523 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283527551 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283528019 0 :teuchter!~choochter@host81-146-31-25.btremoteinternet-dsl.bt.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283528132 0 :choochter!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283528525 0 :cpressey!~CPressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283528537 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MISTER PRESSER < 1283528541 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, PRESSEY < 1283528946 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1283529099 0 :choochter!~choochter@host213-1-48-254.btremoteinternet-dsl.bt.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283529113 0 :tombom_!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1283529118 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, He who Choochts. < 1283529147 0 :teuchter!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283529295 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1283529756 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283529771 0 :cpressey1!~CPressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283529780 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283529925 0 :Ilari_an1rcomp!~user@2002:5870:32ae::1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1283529943 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1283529943 0 :Ilari_antrcomp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1283530029 0 :teuchter!~choochter@host213-1-48-254.btremoteinternet-dsl.bt.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283530152 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283530162 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283530191 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283530191 0 :choochter!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283530858 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283530885 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283531029 0 :choochter!~choochter@host213-1-48-254.btremoteinternet-dsl.bt.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283531055 0 :derdon!~quassel@p5B3E4039.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283531193 0 :teuchter!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1283531512 0 :cpressey1!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :cpressey < 1283532047 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283532790 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283533824 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1283534264 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@m-184.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1283534798 0 :madbrain2!~madbrain@poste229-170.wl.t.ulaval.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1283535614 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283535660 0 :cheater99!~cheater@p549722D3.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283536923 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283537363 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1283537930 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283537934 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Later < 1283539089 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1283539123 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1283539179 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/recenteqsww/Quakes/us2010atbj.php#details says "Depth 16.1 km (10.0 miles) (poorly constrained)" and "Location Uncertainty horizontal +/- 16.5 km (10.3 miles); depth +/- 64.6 km (40.1 miles)". So that earth quake could be located far about the ground then? XD < 1283539196 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poorly constrained indeed XD < 1283539520 0 :derdon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1283539521 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A skyquake. < 1283539538 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed. < 1283539973 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283540117 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1283540134 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283540282 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1283540487 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1283540664 0 :cheater99!~cheater@p549722D3.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283540704 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving... < 1283540727 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1283540775 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, someone bought out the rights to Duke Nukem Forever and started developing it again < 1283540795 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1283540816 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Never bought out the rights, actually. < 1283540841 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Take Two has always *had* the rights. They just had contracted to have it developed. < 1283540859 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And they decided to switch contractors. < 1283540869 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yay! < 1283540883 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can not be made again! < 1283540901 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what may shock Vorpal even more is that I finally got a small fragment of a Feather interp to work pretty much as expected < 1283540911 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it's just leading to more questions about what I should do next < 1283540922 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, WHAT HAS THE WORLD COME TO < 1283540930 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :code! < 1283540932 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think one thing that's necessary is to restrict the program to using only atoms that are in the original program < 1283540940 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not really a problem as you can just go back in time and add them there...) < 1283540953 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: well, there isn't any Feather code yet < 1283540960 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1283540967 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just creating Feather fakeobjects via metagaming, and checking that they interact correctly < 1283540969 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3D Realms, who previously had been developing it, last released a new game in '97. < 1283540989 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yes, but anything Feather is interesting. < 1283540992 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Ninety fucking seven*. < 1283541002 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1283541021 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1283541610 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, pretty please? < 1283541637 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;(set! abc (box_atom "abc")) < 1283541639 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;(eval (((((abc "==") (box_atom "def")) "#") '(display "equal")) '((abc "<<=") (box_atom "def")))) < 1283541641 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :commented out because it's just a paste < 1283541646 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and yes, that's Scheme not Feather) < 1283541666 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UNDERSCORES IN SYMBOLS < 1283541672 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU SHOULD BURN IN HELL < 1283541686 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait, you don't like helly stuff. < 1283541695 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU SHOULD BE BEATEN SOUNDLY < 1283541752 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhm < 1283541771 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so feather will resemble scheme, on which abstraction level? < 1283541797 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, how do you get around the "turtles all the way down" problem? < 1283541811 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so far I haven't < 1283541817 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ideas? < 1283541832 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the issue is not the number of turtles, but inconsistent counts < 1283541857 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a pain to try to match up old turtles with new one < 1283541869 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Feather is the only lang I know where you have to think about backwards compatibility in the very first interp... < 1283542172 0 :cheater99!~cheater@p549722D3.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283542271 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :turtles? < 1283542297 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, small, shelled marine reptiles. < 1283542368 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, a language with specs but no implementation for a long time, and when someone gets around to it, they find that it _can't quite_ meet the specs < 1283542414 0 :teuchter!~choochter@host81-146-53-4.btremoteinternet-dsl.bt.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283542437 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :teuchter, choochter, any relation? < 1283542509 0 :choochter!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1283542768 0 :madbrain2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1283542797 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving... < 1283542817 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1283543021 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1283543130 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283543191 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How can I make the audio in BytePusher VM syncrhonized? In SDL the audio has to run in a separate thread. So, how do I synchronize it? < 1283543206 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With SCIENCE! < 1283543391 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not helping.... < 1283543560 0 :teuchter!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283543723 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How can SCIENCE not help‽ < 1283543727 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1283543735 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283543739 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How can SCIENCE not help‽ < 1283543746 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We saw that the last time. < 1283543794 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. Effing connection. < 1283543804 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And clog. < 1283543849 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Because that is not enough explanation, of what codes needed, and stuff like that < 1283543865 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, but it's SCIENCE! < 1283543924 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure what exactly is being wanted here, but of course you could just make another buffer, into which the synchronous audio-output functions write; wrap a mutex around it; if the buffer's full, have the synchronous output function block with SDL_CondWait; and then the audio thread just reads from that buffer and SDL_CondSignal's in case the synchronous audio output function's waiting there. < 1283543943 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See? fizzie has SCIENCE! < 1283544034 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has a bit unpredictable latency there, since there's another buffer inside SDL. And you'd need to call the synchronous audio-output function often enough so that the buffer never happens to be empty, but I guess that's a given. < 1283544132 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who wrote this BytePusher/ByteByteJump thing anyway? Someone not on-channel, apparently? < 1283544210 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wanted to comment on the µ-law encoding thing, which I think mostly makes sense only for speech. < 1283544394 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You think it is only for speech? < 1283544408 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can post the comment on the Talk page on the wiki < 1283544419 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283544468 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283544484 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikipedia does say it is for speech. < 1283544758 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I will wait until they write a program that uses audio, in case they decide to change it back? < 1283544813 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how to code BBJ ? < 1283544813 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Waiting for a audio-outputting program might be a good idea anyway, so you can test your thing. (Though the µ-law lookup table is easy to add/remove, I guess.) < 1283544912 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it is easy to add/remove < 1283544959 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283544981 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1283545055 0 :cpressey!~catseye@adsl-99-92-186-206.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283545340 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : what may shock Vorpal even more is that I finally got a small fragment of a Feather interp to work pretty much as expected <-- wow... \o/ < 1283545358 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, this does not mean the lang itself is working < 1283545365 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just that the very first stage is not completely impossible < 1283545381 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/ < 1283545382 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :          | < 1283545382 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         /`\ < 1283545432 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, indeed < 1283545445 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, still a first step < 1283545473 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Kudos! < 1283545605 0 :cheater99!~cheater@p549722D3.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283545663 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i also thought a lot about language like Feather < 1283545675 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and all that comes to me is some kind of Lisp on steroids < 1283546023 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made a random test of a 30-second snippet of music, in both 8-bit unsigned linear PCM and 8-bit µ-law, and the difference is pretty small, so I guess it doesn't really hurt that much to have it there. < 1283546041 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: OK < 1283546122 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zem.fi/~fis/test-linear.wav and http://zem.fi/~fis/test-ulaw.wav if someone with more discerning ears wants to comment on the µ-law + music use case. < 1283546154 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Technically I guess it's copyrighted audio, but, well, a 30-second lowish-quality snippet...) < 1283546308 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That'd be a better comparison if it were 44100 Hz. < 1283546363 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I guess, but the BytePusher has a sampling rate of 15360 Hz. < 1283546372 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1283546376 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1283546397 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A fixed 60 Hz framerate, and 256 samples per frame, if you mean "why that exact number". < 1283546436 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's a more general sort of why, "dunno" then. < 1283546510 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not even sufficiently lossless to encode music well. < 1283546516 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. < 1283546530 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not even enough to encode the *base frequencies* of a giant swath of the musical scale. < 1283546617 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :High-fidelity music may not have been high up on the design criteria list. < 1283546619 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hrm. Actually, looking at a table of notes vs. Hz. You're good up until A8. < 1283546622 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1283546622 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how to write programs for bytePusher? < 1283546622 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there some compiler? < 1283546627 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which is ridiculously high) < 1283546628 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It is not enough? Even for square wave or sine wave or other simple things, if you stay in the middle of octave? < 1283546639 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, A8 is high. < 1283546652 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: No there isn't, but I am writing one < 1283546660 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is more like assembler, though < 1283546726 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll omit a good chunk of audible frequencies, buuut these are less essential ones, apparently. < 1283546793 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But standard music should be enough for simple waveforms, 12-TET, 12-JI, Bohlen-Pierce, and more, which ones are likely to work? < 1283546844 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: because i can't imagine how to do arithmetics on oisc < 1283546847 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Yeah, it'd only start being an issue if you start putting real instruments through there. < 1283546866 0 :calamari!~calamari@ip70-162-184-205.ph.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283546877 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ones which have *some* sound above 8 kHz. < 1283546881 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: I think the suggestion was doing it using tables..... < 1283546887 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(approx.) < 1283546920 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it is OK, since my assembler ("PUSHEM") supports adding tables and calculating values to enter into the tables, including loading them from binary files (for pictures) < 1283546938 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You still have to explicitly tell it to add tables, though. < 1283546963 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"However, DSD advocates and equipment manufacturers continue to assert an improvement in sound quality above PCM 24-bit 176.4 kHz." -- yeah, right, I'm sure there's a lot of audible fine detail out there somewhere over 80 kHz. < 1283547056 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Ones which have *some* sound above 8 kHz. <-- doesn't most have that? < 1283547127 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, as far as I remember the overtones for many (all?) instruments in theory goes on forever, getting fainter and fainter the further up they are. < 1283547155 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This might depend on your definition of "some"; whether you're being unnecessarily literal with it or not. < 1283547169 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm? < 1283547190 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, did the second line clarify what I meant? < 1283547257 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Human hearing goes up to about 20 kHz... :) < 1283547266 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well yes there is that limit too < 1283547279 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which makes most of those infinite overtones irrelevant < 1283547313 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: As well as the whole "approaching 0 dB" thing. < 1283547320 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, indeed, which I mentioned there < 1283547336 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways. CD audio is nearly perfect in terms of audio reproduction.\ < 1283547339 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what about interference between stuff about 20 kHz and stuff below it? < 1283547352 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably not a significant issue though < 1283547362 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Will get recorded as part of the CD audio. < 1283547372 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Keep in mind, you're recording the *net* sound wave there. < 1283547373 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well, that is only stereo. < 1283547415 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, remember you can hear the difference between sounds in more than just left/right direction due to various factors which I forgot the details about < 1283547427 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you make it 32-bit, 44.1 kHz audio, and *record binaurally*, you will have *literally perfect audio reproduction*. < 1283547436 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, indeed < 1283547436 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: excruciatingly slow < 1283547440 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(assuming you've got hardware to actually play that back) < 1283547441 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will everyone write only twelve tone equal temperament music on BytePusher, or will some people use other tunings? < 1283547453 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, that would be a PITA due to varying between different persons though < 1283547459 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the head form and such I mean < 1283547469 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Binaural recording with a generic head is "good enough", though. < 1283547470 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Or will anyone at all write music on BytePusher? < 1283547477 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I don't know. < 1283547486 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, not *perfect* though ;P < 1283547493 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1283547507 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many music programs support only twelve tone equal temperament, which is good enough for most music, but not everything. < 1283547516 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: As good as can be achieved for mass distribution, though. < 1283547546 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Music-wise BytePusher seems a bit "boring", in the sense that it's just sampled audio playback, not e.g. some funky digital/analog hybrid synth-chip with interesting distortions (I'm obviously referring to the SID here). < 1283547550 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, I seem to remember my electrical piano supports other tunings than equal temperament. < 1283547563 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doubt midi supports it though < 1283547572 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well yes < 1283547575 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also: 32-bit audio there is kinda overkill. < 1283547597 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, there = ? < 1283547614 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :32-bit PCM is sufficient for recording the full dynamic range possible in air. < 1283547618 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This includes shock waves. < 1283547619 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1283547628 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: My digital piano also supports other tunings, but only a few, and not Bohlen-Pierce or 19-tone tunings or anything else like that. < 1283547636 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what about other media than air though? < 1283547648 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It varies from medium to medium... < 1283547674 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Double-precision floating-point audio; freedom from dynamic-range problems. < 1283547693 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, right. And I can't find the manual for my piano atm. So not sure about what it supports exactly < 1283547694 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: But now you've got imperfect reproduction. < 1283547708 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about quadruple precision then? < 1283547715 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: 32-bit 44.1 kHz can perfectly represent all sounds that humans can hear in air. < 1283547719 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I have figured out a way to write Bohlen-Pierce music in .IT format, although it doesn't work the best way, since you have to store a sample for each pitch! http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/music2/bohlen-pierce.it < 1283547739 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not just "close enough that the differences are irrelevant". Literally perfect. < 1283547744 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what about something in between two values though? < 1283547764 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: There's 52 bits of precision in a double, it can't be any more imperfect than a 32-bit integer. And if you go overkill, you should really go overkill well. < 1283547775 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I mean, lets say we have 1000 and 1001 as two values, what about representing a sound in between those? < 1283547777 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you think this bohlen-pierce.it music works? Obviously it won't work for anything more complicated than what I have done there < 1283547802 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, of course this is probably pointlessly detailed < 1283547803 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not "literally perfect" until you hit the Heisenberg limits. :p < 1283547803 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still < 1283547813 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Which you do. And go far, far beyond. < 1283547825 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find that pretty suspicious. < 1283547829 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm Heisenberg limits? < 1283547839 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :h is a very small number, after all. < 1283547851 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this about quantum mechanics suddenly? < 1283547855 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, you mean Planck units? < 1283547857 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or am I confusing a name < 1283547872 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Quantum-mechanics uncertainty about the momentum of the air molecules, you see. < 1283547880 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ahahahaha < 1283547922 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that isn't enough. Get a compensator for it. Like in star trek. Used to explain how it is possible to beam people iirc < 1283547934 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Sample a wave with a sampling rate twice its frequency. Apply the Whittaker-Shannon interpolation formula. You have the *precise* original waveform. < 1283547982 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I find having anything precise in a real world measurement pretty suspicious... < 1283548001 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm no expert on this area < 1283548012 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It is mathematically precise. In terms of the real-world, you are limited by the quality of your measuring equipment. < 1283548024 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1283548025 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: That would assume continuous-value samples there. Otherwise you'd get quantization noise anyway. Unless the physics of a pressure wave give some limits here, but I'd like to see references for that. < 1283548096 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Adding finite ranges of samples limits the amplitude... < 1283548131 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hrm. Lemme find in precisely the manner it does so. < 1283548141 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't quite understand that last bit. < 1283548156 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway why are you limiting yourself to air? < 1283548183 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Because we don't generally care about other media < 1283548208 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, a finite range of real numbers has just as many real numbers than R, it doesn't help to give a maximum pressure there. You should somehow limit the number of possible pressure levels to < 2^32. < 1283548271 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The whole notion of "pressure" gets a bit tricky if you start to consider individual molecules, though. Hmh. < 1283548359 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi calamari < 1283548371 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey cpressey < 1283548377 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh. Quantization does add a small amount of error. < 1283548378 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, why not record the speed and time of each individual molecule hitting your sound recording hardware? < 1283548405 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly also location on the device in question < 1283548446 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Why not, indeed! You should sell that sort of stuff to hifists. (It doesn't even have to actually do the impossibilities, they'll pay bazillion dollars for it anyway if you do the marketing right.) < 1283548458 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though one could *quite* feasibly put it up to bitrates that would make a 1-bit difference be below Heisenberg limits, if you set the maximum value as the maximum possible volume in your prefered medium. < 1283548462 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Behold, a new use for Google's compute base. < 1283548532 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes I realise it is of course infeasible if not impossible :P < 1283548577 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, and you claim 32-bit is that for air? < 1283548609 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm should make it go to 12 as well while I'm at it. < 1283548707 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and to answer the inevitable question "go to 12 for what", it doesn't matter. Just pick any suitable setting knob < 1283548719 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Actually, I'm going to make the actual, proper calculation, now that I've thought about it some. < 1283548747 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, right. < 1283548764 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION figures out the conversion rate between a Pascal and a planck mass per (planck length * planck time^2)
< 1283548782 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that is, M/(L*T^2) < 1283548784 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1283548789 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I guess insanely large or insanely small < 1283548814 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though it could be something reasonable-sized. Who knows < 1283548825 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, there it is. < 1283548838 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4.63309 × 10113 Pa per M/(L*T^2) < 1283548846 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10113? < 1283548852 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. < 1283548854 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10^113 < 1283548860 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah 10¹¹³ < 1283548867 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, :P < 1283548925 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283548968 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sooo... A shock wave is 2.18698536 × 10^-129 planck pressures, and that did not help me at all. < 1283548984 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, -129? < 1283548994 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is planck pressures then a VERY VERY large unit? < 1283549007 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1283549011 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1283549015 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's 4.63309 * 10^133 pascals. < 1283549023 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch! < 1283549048 0 :tombom__!tombom@82.11.111.215 JOIN :#esoteric < 1283549051 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION looks for better units
< 1283549147 0 :tombom_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1283549158 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck it. I'm calling 32 bits good enough arbitrarily. < 1283549169 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Screw quantisation error. If it matters, you are a freak. < 1283549210 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, you aren't persistent enough < 1283549234 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, anyway... < 1283549242 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if 2.18698536 × 10^-129 is max < 1283549259 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is the heisenberg limit? < 1283549267 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then just take that range < 1283549304 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then take the range 0 to 2.18698536 × 10^-129 and divide in 2^32, if less than heisenberg limit, it is enough < 1283549308 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, or? < 1283549312 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did I miss something? < 1283549334 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The problem is the Heisenberg limit for pressure; I certainly am not a physicist enough to start guesstimating it. < 1283549355 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, but is my basic idea sound? < 1283549370 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :< fizzie> The whole notion of "pressure" gets a bit tricky if you start to consider individual molecules, though. Hmh. < 1283549380 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, also this is pressure, but what defines frequency hm? I'm not audio engineer enough to know this < 1283549397 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Might be better to model it directly as the electric and strong forces that are causing it, at that point. < 1283549399 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but certainly you can have differently loud sound at the same frequency? < 1283549433 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, a bit tricky to record that, no? < 1283549445 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just need enough precision bits to handle all possible pressure levels; and then sample often enough to catch all physically possible frequencies. < 1283549461 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah, so what sampling frequency do we need? < 1283549489 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know about that, but probably not something horribly huge. < 1283549495 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1283549548 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what sort of playback device do you need to play back below 1 Hz I wonder < 1283549557 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I can't see how it would be much different from recoring the pressure on a single air molecule. < 1283549560 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know my headphones claim to go down to 5 Hz < 1283549566 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is quite absurdly extreme < 1283549570 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*recording < 1283549581 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, hm okay < 1283549683 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you're willing to limit yourself to humans, you can start to derive limits from the ear; those limits are lot more reasonable-sized, but they're a bit "soft" limits. < 1283549894 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283550010 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283550126 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are algorithms for simulation of Guqin scales? < 1283550199 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Though *pressure* probably has reasonable limits if you merely limit yourself to a specific medium. < 1283550306 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf are you talking about < 1283550330 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from simplistic VM to quantum physics -> #esoteric < 1283550651 0 :choochter!~choochter@host213-1-48-254.btremoteinternet-dsl.bt.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283550754 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1283550885 0 :tombom_!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1283551057 0 :tombom__!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1283551457 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1283551545 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283552175 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: they're talking about perfect audio reproduction < 1283552205 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but somehow they've magically found perfect mics and speakers < 1283552283 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with THD of 0 and perfectly flat frequency response over an insanely large range < 1283552377 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was more about audio storage/transmission, where we just postulate the existence of perfect recording and playback equipment. < 1283552517 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1283552595 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION joins some other freenode channels on a whim
< 1283552616 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Suspecting this will just confirm my suspicion that this is the only one that will hold my interest < 1283552654 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: I used to go to #crypto .. that one had some good discussions < 1283552662 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oo, many times I've been considering doing that, but never managed to decide where to join to. < 1283552694 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ha! There's a #falcon < 1283552796 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can set up channels on my own IRC server, too, for things that you might want, and they will automatically be logged. So that can be used if you need this kind of service (if you don't, there are other IRC networks too) < 1283552807 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1283552849 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1283552865 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes when my kids throw a fit is is absolutely hilarious, but I haven't decided if laughing would cause them long term emotional harm < 1283553313 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ask them which way they prefer? < 1283553386 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. The maintenance guy came up to fix the oven, took it apart (with bits of it all over the kitchen floor now), then left while I was in the other room. Presumably to get a necessary tool or something. Haven't seen him in 20 minutes now, though. < 1283553391 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how this will turn out. < 1283553587 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : with THD of 0 and perfectly flat frequency response over an insanely large range <-- THD? < 1283553617 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A distortion measure. < 1283553623 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Total harmonic distortion, was it? < 1283553646 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, If you are still looking for extra channels, what about #haskell? < 1283553677 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 16:40 -!- channels : #bash #scheme #ruby #picolisp #falcon #python #haskell ##pfsense #esoteric < 1283553700 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, mhm. pfsense? falcon? < 1283553719 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, #bash can be hilarious at times btw. < 1283553735 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes! #falcon! < 1283553735 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: A friend just facebooked (and a friend-of-a-friend told a similiar story) about a plumber that came to fix something, left saying "I'll need to go get some more tools from the car", and then never came back (or at least not in two weeks). < 1283553753 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, watch out for greycat (regular there) trying to help a newbie. Headdesking will likely ensue! < 1283553795 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, huh. < 1283553840 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, seems he is offline atm though < 1283553859 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, what is #falcon about? < 1283553864 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, another suggestion: #erlang < 1283553887 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, is it about the birds? < 1283553940 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My guess would be the programming language. < 1283553958 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Oh, you must have missed the recent, ah, research we've been doing into the Falcon language here recently. < 1283553978 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, oh? what paradigm is it? < 1283553992 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and why would anyone in this channel be interested in it < 1283554010 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, I never hard of it as a programming language before today < 1283554055 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh < 1283554070 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never realized that XChat made it easy to manipulate autojoin channels! < 1283554094 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Glad you asked! "Falcon provides six integrated programming paradigms: procedural, object oriented, prototype oriented, functional, tabular and message oriented." < 1283554114 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yeah < 1283554133 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the difference between object-oriented and message oriented? < 1283554152 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, ah okay.... sounds like aiming for bloated... Or to be more precise: tricky to pull that off in a good way and without getting bloated < 1283554192 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, so what's so special about the language apart from supporting multiple paradigms < 1283554216 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, what is the tabular programming paradigm? Lookup tables? < 1283554271 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Please read the table on http://www.falconpl.org/index.ftd?page_id=facts -- in particular, the "Functional programming" row. < 1283554301 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1283554302 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, in-memory SQLite with multiple copies of tables < 1283554324 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, SQLite-like I guess < 1283554335 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And not using SQL < 1283554340 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, my explanations suck < 1283554375 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As far as I understand it, it means to say "None of these other languages try to embed S-expressions in an otherwise vanilla-procedural programming language" < 1283554504 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, mhm < 1283554508 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, but my favourite part is how Falcon does "monadic programming" with "out of band values". < 1283554531 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, you don't need s-expressions to be functional < 1283554540 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example, haskell < 1283554563 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, "monadic programming" with "out of band values" <-- is it just me, or is that technobabel? < 1283554594 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Ah, you may be catching on! < 1283554598 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Marking an item as out-of-band allows the creation of monads in functional evaluations. More automatism will be introduced in future, but scripters can have monads by assigning the oob status to complex objects and perform out-of-band processing on them." < 1283554638 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, where did it say that? < 1283554641 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION greps the page
< 1283554643 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm really wondering if I'm sick enough to try CODING something in this language. I have the implementation installed... < 1283554654 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's on http://www.falconpl.org/project_docs/core/funset_oob_support.html < 1283554657 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1283554696 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, are all parts as bad as the functional part? < 1283554708 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, or are the procedural parts better? < 1283554784 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, also the way to measure "raw loop speed" is utterly silly. Just throw in an llvm style JIT there and it would probably constant fold it < 1283554831 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think it's fair to say that it's their approach to language design & implementation, that I find entertaining. < 1283554842 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, and to ... language marketing. < 1283554861 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, not as bad as mathematica though < 1283554875 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The language itself, if you take out the "ooh! functional!" parts, is pretty plain-jane pythonish-rubyish-whatnot, it looks like. < 1283554882 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283554890 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well! When you get into "math tools" -- have you seen R? < 1283554893 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OMG, R. < 1283554897 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As someone who understands monads, I wish to object to this < 1283554908 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: :D < 1283554910 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, read the first paragraph on http://reference.wolfram.com/mathematica/guide/FunctionalProgramming.html < 1283554923 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, that is one huge ego making false claims < 1283554938 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, I have heard of R. I never used it. < 1283554938 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently Haskell and OCaml do not even register to the hugeness of Wolfram's ego. < 1283554942 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't remember what the code looks like < 1283554954 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, or LISP < 1283554958 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Loading. Ah - I should have said "When you get into things done by Wolfram -- well!" < 1283554958 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, it's for st-t-st-cs < 1283554970 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, indeed < 1283554976 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ? < 1283554994 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION cannot tell for the life of him what Falcon calls monads
< 1283554994 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Long viewed as an important theoretical idea, functional programming finally became truly convenient and practical with the introduction of Mathematica's symbolic language." < 1283554995 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you removed vowels < 1283554996 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1283554998 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: OK! You win < 1283555001 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1283555009 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FINALLY < 1283555011 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, what? < 1283555014 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, I won what? < 1283555022 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A truly convenient and practical functional programming language! < 1283555027 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The Bad Language Marketing Game < 1283555035 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, is the OOB stuff doing functor-related things? < 1283555051 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, it also has "industrial-strength string manipulation" according to another page < 1283555054 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, Mathematica isn't *that* unpleasant, just agglutinative to an insane degree. < 1283555057 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, what on earth that means I don't know < 1283555064 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OOB seems to "tag" a value with a special invisible quality which makes some built-in functions do something different with it when they receive it. < 1283555078 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And you thought *I* had a nuts view of monads. < 1283555080 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It means that it can be used in string factories. < 1283555092 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hah < 1283555151 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems to have functions to compute hamming distance and edit distance... And dictionary lookup. Apart from that it seems like a fairly normal set of functions for string processing < 1283555189 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it can be computed, Mathematica has a built-in function for it. < 1283555198 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :close < 1283555221 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, what about this one: < 1283555224 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Mathematica provides a uniquely integrated and automated environment for parallel computing. With zero configuration, full interactivity and seamless local and network operation, the symbolic character of the Mathematica language allows immediate support of a variety of existing and new parallel programming paradigms and data-sharing models." < 1283555227 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :having tried it... < 1283555232 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can say it is shoddy at best < 1283555288 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not very automatic at all < 1283555296 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would rather say it is a PITA to use < 1283555317 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Google saw it and it blew them away! They just up and stopped using MapReduce and started using MATHEMATICA instead!" < 1283555325 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, I'm not sure if I would rather use it or pthreads. And considering what a PITA pthreads is... that says about everything... < 1283555338 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, any idea on what Falcon does when it natters about monads? < 1283555356 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"At the core of Mathematica's symbolic programming paradigm is the concept of transformation rules for arbitrary symbolic patterns. Mathematica's pattern language conveniently describes a very general set of classes of expressions, making possible uniquely readable, elegant and efficient programs." < 1283555358 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I am tempted to ask in #falcon. Maybe after I've had a few drinks. < 1283555362 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that one, I'm not sure what they mean < 1283555378 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But, basically, what I said about it adding a "tag" to a value, is all I can tell. < 1283555386 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is sleep-deprived
< 1283555387 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that statement is curiously devoid of any factual information < 1283555390 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That'll do. < 1283555395 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/join #falcon < 1283555403 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it sure sound pretentious! < 1283555421 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283555442 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: So it's a... rewriting language. < 1283555456 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, yes that's about all it says < 1283555500 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, mathematica wouldn't so bad if they didn't try to boost it's abilities to this degree. With some more factual documentation it would still turn out a decent product. < 1283555535 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shoddy in many parts though, and worth about 1/6 of the price < 1283555556 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it wouldn't look so bad compared to it's own documentation! < 1283555608 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, anyway, it should come at no great surprise that a CAS like mathematica is based on rewriting symbolic expressions < 1283555646 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heck, that is likely the sanest way to implement a simplification function, by rewriting rules < 1283555668 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbiab < 1283555696 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1283555697 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1283555924 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1283556076 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it just me and my Haskell naïveté, or is it a rather ugly hack to add support for monads straight into a language? < 1283556100 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh damn, I haven't been following this. < 1283556166 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what is? < 1283556167 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now invent something like METAFONT but for music synthesis. < 1283556175 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, uh, "tabular programming paradigm" -- need I say more? < 1283556178 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, apparently OOB allows special handling of objects. < 1283556191 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, it's a "please handle me specially" bit. < 1283556193 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I'm not sure that makes monads though < 1283556202 0 :Gracenotes!~person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1283556203 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, can't see how to do the IO monad with it for example < 1283556212 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume from this that they've implemented some horrible hack that bashes functors in somehow. < 1283556270 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, looks like they ignore TeX too: http://reference.wolfram.com/mathematica/guide/MathematicalTypesetting.html < 1283556278 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still don't think you can get proper monads from this. < 1283556283 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, TeX is in my opinion far better < 1283556309 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe they are correct about the input, but that is just how they render it < 1283556313 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION assumed it used TeX already.
< 1283556327 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the rendered result is shoddy compared to TeX using CM < 1283556332 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, no it doesn't afaik < 1283556339 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That NIH is slightly worse than zzo's. < 1283556450 0 :madbr!~madbrain@modemcable159.218-202-24.mc.videotron.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1283556451 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TeX is better, and it is better for more than just mathematical typesetting. Mathematica is just a large program that does too many things and costs a lot of money, and is not Free Software. < 1283556479 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you can get around the money pretty easily. < 1283556484 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed. We were poking fun at wolfram's large ego < 1283556487 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, indeed < 1283556487 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://fr.justin.tv/surasshu#/w/361774448 <-chipmusic stream < 1283556512 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(original songs from famicompo, quality varies ofc :D) < 1283556619 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't want that, do you have the .NSF files instead? (If they are written on .NSF, that is.....) < 1283556642 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1283556655 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://midr2.under.jp/compo/vol7/index.html < 1283556659 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :link is on these < 1283556723 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1283556753 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK thanks, why didn't you just post that one at first? < 1283556775 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cause we're doing a synclisten in espernet #mod_shrine < 1283556785 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah that's fine too < 1283556790 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :check out original #1 < 1283556839 0 :teuchter!~choochter@host81-146-45-254.btremoteinternet-dsl.bt.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1283556853 0 :alise!~alise@91.105.124.106 JOIN :#esoteric < 1283556883 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION was wondering about the alise deficiency
< 1283556894 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: Original #1 is the one I currently have playing < 1283556902 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I simply had to be at a place today. < 1283556930 0 :choochter!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1283556952 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes but it's evening now < 1283556977 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, it's very nearly morning. < 1283557024 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends on your definition of "morning" - it feels strange to call just after 12 am morning < 1283557052 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O! Entry number 2 uses MMC5 < 1283557208 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An idea I have is to make a .NSF music with multiple tracks, where each track is a variation of the same music, such as looping/non-looping, different waveforms, turning the music backward and/or upsidedown, different temperament, and so on < 1283557224 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I had to get up early and couldn't sleep; after coming back, I was tired enough to want to rest a bit before trekking up the stairs. < 1283557263 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo: not allowed in famicompo :( (no multi-tracks) < 1283557290 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Who wrote this BytePusher/ByteByteJump thing anyway? Someone not on-channel, apparently? < 1283557297 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :javamannen on the wiki < 1283557302 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can .NSF format use different temperament? < 1283557318 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo: yeah but why would you use it < 1283557332 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: Why is that? What if they just make it if it has multiple tracks, they just use only track zero < 1283557351 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, if they won't accept multi-tracks, just change the number of tracks in the header to zero before submitting the file < 1283557352 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno, they just have a rule against it :/ < 1283557359 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I mean, to one track) < 1283557401 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: So that you can use just intonation music, or pythagorean tuning (for Chinese music), or Bohlen-Pierce, or any other temperament, instead of using twelve tone equal temperament all the time < 1283557424 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1283557444 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: Do they accept it if the file has multiple tracks but you change the header so it says it is only one track, and the others are not accessible unless someone fixes the file? < 1283557459 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but in practice pythagorean is almost exactly like equal temperament < 1283557520 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: Yes it is close, but for some things it is better. < 1283557572 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bohlen-pierce has like no octave or no 5th < 1283557590 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo: the difference is like less than the nes tuning accuracy < 1283557616 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well, or so one might assume, the initial edits were anonymous ip. "javamannen" means "the java man" in norwegian, btw) < 1283557649 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: Yes that is true, but that is because Bohlen-Pierce has different intervals instead, for writing different kind of music. Just like just intonation and Mersenne and so on is all for different kind of music. < 1283557660 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :< Phantom_Hoover> I assume from this that they've implemented some horrible hack that bashes functors in somehow. <-- I simply assumed they wanted the use the word "monad" without regard for what it meant. < 1283557668 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it's still goin. < 1283557669 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo: but yeah in some music engines like it2nsf it's easy to detune by about the right amount < 1283557670 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*going < 1283557697 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, after much questioning, I still have little idea what they're going on about. < 1283557706 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it2nsf can detune in 1/16ths of a semitone < 1283557747 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: That is, if you are using a program like it2nsf. If you program directly instead, you could program it however you want (within the limits of the NES APU and any audio addons that are part of the .NSF format) < 1283557781 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo: that's not a good strategy for making music < 1283557806 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :simply because it makes it harder to put in notes and listen to what you're doing < 1283557835 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some people listened to music in their mind because they cannot hear it < 1283557868 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tracker programs are just too limited in my opinion < 1283557881 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :limited? by what? :D < 1283557931 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Limited in all sorts of ways. These programs are not METAFONT! < 1283557973 0 :teuchter!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1283557989 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I've come to a degree of understanding over OOB monads, and my conclusion from this is that they're so hideous I won't explain out of kindness. < 1283558040 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Thank you. < 1283558042 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :metafont? < 1283558063 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: Have you heard of TeX? METAFONT is the program to design fonts for TeX documents. < 1283558081 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I understand correctly, the way they do it will cause map to explode if you use a monad in it. < 1283558105 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I think TeX and METAFONT are very good for the things they do. < 1283558137 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And various other bits are so crazy that I feel that I must have got them wrong, but fear that I haven't. < 1283558177 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Good times! < 1283558181 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo: well, it's kinda like... mml is more flexible than trackers < 1283558193 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, what's going on now? < 1283558196 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but mml is for aspies really < 1283558205 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OOB? < 1283558205 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: What does "mml" means? < 1283558214 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, you know Falcon? < 1283558223 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mml is a system used mostly by japanese composers < 1283558231 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, thankfully; but yes, of it. < 1283558236 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Somewhere they said they could do monads through some mysterious OOB thing. < 1283558238 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Not much. Mathnerd314 is continuing to... explore their concepts. < 1283558249 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically you write your song in text format and it compiles it to nsf < 1283558250 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I, curious, investigated. < 1283558262 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, by which I mean, he said something. < 1283558267 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The rest is basically Lovecraft but with crappy languages. < 1283558285 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: Where is more information? < 1283558304 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: We discovered that there is a #falcon channel on freenode. Hilarity ensued! < 1283558331 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh no. < 1283558334 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_Macro_Language < 1283558339 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1283558343 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: Watch as I get banned! < 1283558346 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, alise didn't join, did he? < 1283558351 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You bet it, baby. < 1283558353 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1283558357 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Wow, it's like the insane asylum created an outpost, and it's on IRC! < 1283558358 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This I must see! < 1283558391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aww, he ignores me because I hurt his feelings.