< 1281225677 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1281225770 0 :alise!~ehird@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281225773 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTFFFFF < 1281225778 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GTK doesn't respect fontconfig, seemingly. < 1281225784 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, it does, just not local.conf. Or, ... what??? < 1281225803 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It wants Xft configuration instead, seemingly. < 1281225820 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, do you know of any nice monospace fonts? < 1281225854 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: A few... < 1281225888 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Name! < 1281225895 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1281225920 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: All-time favourite would be OS X's Monaco. DejaVu Sans Mono is pretty good, you know, in the acceptable kind of way. < 1281225931 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1281225942 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Luxi Mono is quite nice if you'd like a serifed monospace font. < 1281225959 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consolas is wonderful, but less-so outside of Windows. < 1281225971 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Inconsolata's nice. < 1281225977 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but it's so boring. < 1281225990 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is not a bad thing. < 1281225998 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but, really, it's so boring. < 1281226012 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate this family < 1281226040 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's highly readable. Which is pretty much the only thing I care about in a monospace font. < 1281226044 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo has such a great family life < 1281226057 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Droid Sans Mono is good but I can't distinguish it from DejaVu Sans Mono. < 1281226063 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, when do we get DejaVu Serif Mono? < 1281226080 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Ah. Droid is fatter and less tall than DejaVu. An improvement. < 1281226083 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, there is no physical abuse, so that's at least something to be happy about < 1281226115 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Except that Droid Sans Mono also has CJK support. < 1281226133 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Pretty baseline conditions there. :/ < 1281226138 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: That too. < 1281226158 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281226349 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay pekwm. < 1281226649 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is the 'patamagician class: http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/dnd/options/Patamagician.c (Is it good?) < 1281226675 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The word "cromulent" must be used more. < 1281226694 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No. It just embiggens people's reference-peen. < 1281226793 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Do *you* want to use the word "cromulent" use more? < 1281226844 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/math/comments/cyk1s/mathematicians_of_reddit_question_about_prime/c0w810t < 1281226851 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel dumber for having read that < 1281226866 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like a 'patamagician class in D&D game? < 1281226866 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I haven't obviously < 1281226880 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who has +o in here? < 1281226883 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now that I've read that, it's obviously a jumble of buzzwords < 1281226888 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: who has +o < 1281226899 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Quit < 1281226920 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That comment in Reddit is not make sensable! < 1281226968 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281227022 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quantum entanglement is unrelated. < 1281227078 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadrescence: You can modify the topic message without +o in this channel < 1281227150 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadrescence: why? < 1281227173 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: i want to paste an age old IRC exploit to kick those who have an old client but I don't want to be perceived as malicious < 1281227185 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281227186 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadrescence: just do it. this channel is a de facto anarchy < 1281227193 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know why you want to do it < 1281227194 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadrescence: Then post it to external URL and post the URL here. < 1281227195 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but feel free < 1281227201 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: makes no sense < 1281227206 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actual ops are lament, fizzie, oerjan < 1281227210 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan never, ever uses ops < 1281227212 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: whereas #ranarchism is a de jure anarchy! < 1281227222 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay well lament is probably okay with me doing it < 1281227223 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie kicks obvious trolls after years of debate and then feels bad about it < 1281227224 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DCC SEND "fixyourclient" 0 0 0 < 1281227225 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1281227232 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament only uses his op powers to further chaos and evil < 1281227232 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not bad only one down < 1281227235 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you fix your own client, Quadrescence < 1281227242 0 :Warrigal!~Warrigal@rrcs-70-63-156-144.midsouth.biz.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1281227254 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadrescence: Why did you send DCC SEND "fixyourclient" to the channel < 1281227255 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: RAN archism? < 1281227265 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i just explained < 1281227267 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /r/anarchism < 1281227271 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1281227276 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, Warrigal's using an old client? < 1281227290 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's try and see. < 1281227294 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In my computer, any IRC channels hosted there other than &SERVER do not even support +o (or any other modes), because of how I configured it) < 1281227295 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Am I using an old client? < 1281227297 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1281227302 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal: yes go fix it < 1281227306 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION abc < 1281227308 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1281227309 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see watch I will kick you again < 1281227314 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DCC SEND "warrigal" 0 0 0 < 1281227314 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1281227317 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha sweet < 1281227323 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will now have endless fun with this < 1281227328 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is so funny when someone does it in #ubuntu < 1281227330 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, so that is how you do it < 1281227345 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My client does nothing other than display the DCC SEND < 1281227346 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they go to DEFCON 1 when it happens < 1281227349 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it is safe < 1281227353 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes it is < 1281227359 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal's still insine < 1281227361 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadrescence: can i do that without connecting raw? < 1281227362 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with irssi < 1281227369 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadrescence: this is annoying. stop it. < 1281227374 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: what < 1281227380 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: what is annoying < 1281227380 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we can just specifically target warrigal now < 1281227384 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your DCC shit < 1281227388 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: what about it < 1281227390 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadrescence: augur is probably set to go DING DING DING every time you dcc < 1281227395 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also augur thinks he's an op < 1281227395 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahahahahaha < 1281227403 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DING DING DING < 1281227412 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it doesnt ping, it just pops up a window showing the DCC requests < 1281227424 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even worse < 1281227427 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur plz don't be mad and fix your client < 1281227430 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or I will do it to you more < 1281227449 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: go do it in #ubuntu < 1281227450 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My client simply displays the DCC SEND in red, inline together with all the other messages (which are normally blue). < 1281227459 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yeah you're ok < 1281227466 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadrescence: what command, without manually connecting? < 1281227471 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, how long will i be banned for? < 1281227481 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it matter? aren't you quitting uboob anyway? < 1281227482 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Probably it depends what client you are using? < 1281227487 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quitting, i quit it all the time < 1281227490 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then i end up using it again < 1281227507 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: All I do is paste it, including the NULL or whatever at the start (probably not a NULL but whatever) < 1281227515 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I'll slap you if you intefere with anyone who needs to get help < 1281227529 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hay, why is your name "alise!~ehird" < 1281227533 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that doesn't mean I won't enjoy seeing it happen < 1281227538 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh my god I just flipped my screen upside down < 1281227541 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love xrandr < 1281227542 0 :Warrigal!~Warrigal@rrcs-70-63-156-144.midsouth.biz.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1281227550 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh, I didn't know this version of irssi was an old client. < 1281227551 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal: did you fix < 1281227562 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. What version of irssi do I have? < 1281227571 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :9.4 < 1281227574 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One vulnerable to some exploid < 1281227576 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*exploit < 1281227577 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just disable receiving DCC SEND in your client? < 1281227631 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Irssi tells me it's version 0.8.15, which appears to be the newest version. < 1281227647 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know how to send that kind of DCC SEND in my client, simply type DCC SEND "fixyourclient" 0 0 0 < 1281227660 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But most clients do not do it this way. < 1281227684 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, sloppy focus, howsabout it. < 1281227695 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: no < 1281227701 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need that extra character < 1281227704 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What client is zzo38 using? < 1281227707 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before DCC < 1281227739 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Why don't you check what client? Using CTRL+A VERSION command to check? < 1281227749 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadrescence: What extra character? < 1281227762 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PHIRC? < 1281227766 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Yes. < 1281227799 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: It's an invisible/unicode character. If you have proper fonts it'll show up as a box or a square with numbers < 1281227838 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadrescence: you misunderstand. < 1281227849 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadrescence: in zzo38's client, literally inserts ^A. < 1281227854 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., the CTCP character. < 1281227855 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh okay < 1281227859 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds good < 1281227860 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is because zzo38 wrote his own client in php and it is basically raw. < 1281227864 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and insane) < 1281227869 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1281227887 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whaat xsetroot sucks < 1281227913 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Brits, we're talking about mathematicians in this thread. Do you know what a mathematician is? That's not a physicist (Penrose), a computer geek (Lovelace, Babbage, Turing), or a political hack (Russell)." < 1281227936 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did he just call Bertrand a political hack? < 1281227947 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://conservapedia.com/Talk:Essay:Best_New_Conservative_Words#Decrypt < 1281227952 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And the is simply a shortcut to send a message to the current channel, if a space is typed at the beginning of the current line, it will automatically type in "PRIVMSG #esoteric :" on the command line, which can be backspaced as normal, and so on) < 1281227958 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, Conservapedia. < 1281227959 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay then. < 1281228053 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My client also does syntax highlighting of everything sent/received < 1281228069 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what syntax? < 1281228076 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: IRC syntax < 1281228116 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: lmfao what is this < 1281228117 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1281228118 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1281228121 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :conservapedia < 1281228122 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see < 1281228171 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1281228173 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :conservapedia < 1281228177 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the bastion for all idiots in the world < 1281228186 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :half of them are trolls, half of them are serious, and you cannot tell the difference < 1281228251 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats hilarious < 1281228326 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PEKWM: HAHAHA I AM TABBING WINDOWS BY DRAGGING THEM < 1281228345 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-2925351791.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1281228458 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oerjan never, ever uses ops <-- hey, i _did_ ban fax < 1281228475 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah i didn't realise that was you < 1281228479 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I feel dumber for having read that <-- that comment was nonsense < 1281228481 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fair enough then < 1281228488 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I eventually realized < 1281228514 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, fax was banned? < 1281228523 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1281228527 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for being completely insane < 1281228555 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(to the point of spamming the channel with "FUCK YOU" for dozens of lines just because... uh, I think Phantom_Hoover took more than a few minutes to reply to s/h(it)'s message) < 1281228612 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION remembers in English class in 7th grade, "I you he/she/it" and someone said "I you he shit" < 1281228626 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/h(it) is oerjan's invention < 1281228653 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks at his ignore list. < 1281228676 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, am I still on it? < 1281228693 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, fax is fucking nuts < 1281228703 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite LITERALLY! < 1281228715 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: get this < 1281228732 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm getting it. < 1281228732 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :she /ignored me < 1281228741 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently because i told you she's a she < 1281228745 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She? Are you implying that she's TRANSGENDER? She'll flip out about that, you know! < 1281228755 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It" is the only safe option here, really. < 1281228771 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal, alise is wondering if he's still on your ignore list < 1281228796 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, he isn't. < 1281228823 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal, Sgeo is letting you know that alise is wondering if he's still on your ignore list < 1281228848 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let me know if alise asks me anything else. < 1281228866 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal: wat < 1281228884 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal, alise is informing you that Sgeo is letting you know that alise is wondering if he's still on your ignore list. < 1281228902 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise is blinking < 1281228910 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION nods. < 1281228922 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal: I have this sneaking suspicion that I am on that list. < 1281228968 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know, if alise were on my /ignore list, I might say that he's not, just to make him feel better. < 1281228971 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, Warrigal, did you say that alise isn't on that list, or that alise isn't wondering < 1281228973 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does ignore lists also cause auto-reply things to be ignored? < 1281228984 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I said that alise isn't on that list. < 1281228990 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Such as CTRL+A VERSION and CTRL+A TIME and so on) < 1281229003 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure I am on Warrigal's ignore list. < 1281229013 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal: You do know that I can read that, right :D < 1281229021 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From now on, I will be exclusively speaking through alise < 1281229027 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : s/h(it) is oerjan's invention <-- it's supposed to be (s)h/it < 1281229029 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure thing bro. < 1281229034 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well you're supposed to be HUH. < 1281229113 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not agree with everything in the conservative words list, but I partially agree with a few of the comments there, but not fully. But there may be some things incorrect listed there, even if they say it is correct < 1281229120 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I could pull that off, though. If I really could see what alise was saying, it would probably be pretty obvious. < 1281229143 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, wait, I got confused there. < 1281229157 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant to say, if I really *couldn't* see what alise was saying, it would probably be pretty obvious. < 1281229160 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could always logread to see what alise is saying < 1281229163 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though if I could, that would also be pretty obvious. < 1281229167 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good *God*. Palm used Palm OS up until *2009*. < 1281229188 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So yeah. alise, it should be obvious whether you're on my ignore list or not. < 1281229192 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I think he's enjoying being passive-aggressive more. < 1281229196 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My phone is a Palm OS device. < 1281229198 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am. < 1281229216 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, such a clever ruse. < 1281229225 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This I did not anticipate. < 1281229226 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know. < 1281229240 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My monocle poppeth out. < 1281229243 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: also i recall the particular thing causing fax to break completely was someone telling em "You fail at life". in a discussion about the _game_ of life. < 1281229267 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: he was always broken, just most of the shards hit other places first < 1281229277 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What the hell happened to fax anyways? < 1281229287 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: hasn't seen em since < 1281229291 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION remembers yelling at fax when fax pretended to be clueless with Haskell < 1281229293 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: he "changed gender" (DON'T SAY THAT HE'LL KILL YOU) and went off his rocker < 1281229293 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*i haven't < 1281229298 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when he was male he was ... insane, but, you know < 1281229300 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happened to MissPiggy? < 1281229303 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: = fax < 1281229306 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1281229306 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric := soupdragon < 1281229310 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric := crazy-ass bitch < 1281229313 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: No, I mean, I am literally clueless as to anything odd about fax at all. < 1281229326 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Log links or something? < 1281229326 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Um. Basically he started calling everyone cunts if you just ignored him for a second < 1281229336 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or did something which made him think you were stupid (even just giving a tiny piece of advice he disliked) < 1281229341 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Somehow I missed all this. < 1281229343 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he regularly spammed the channel if he was being ignored or whatever < 1281229347 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :held tons of grudges against people < 1281229351 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then would whine at them for ignoring him < 1281229354 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And he's not been in my ignore list. < 1281229358 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So... < 1281229361 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How the hell? < 1281229371 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: grep (MissPiggy|soupdragon|fax).* in recent logs < 1281229374 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :enjoy the insanity < 1281229384 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah why do gtk themes suck. < 1281229391 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use Morphic! < 1281229407 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not _that_ recent, from this year though < 1281229435 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish Raleigh wasn't so damn ugly. < 1281229471 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a way to make Raleigh less 3D? < 1281229476 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There should be searchable logs for #esoteric. < 1281229492 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: There's Gregor's secret mirror. < 1281229497 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Secret because it takes ages to check out.) < 1281229517 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1281229540 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are... world sauna championships? < 1281229579 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: I managed to miss this at a time I literally was doing nothing. Wow. < 1281229638 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh heh, fax said string theory is wrong because it predicts more than 3 dimensions. < 1281229643 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal: Yes. < 1281229647 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was I online? < 1281229648 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He said it was just "plain wrong" because KLEIN BOTTLES. < 1281229656 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Furthermore, he claimed he had a proof for the existence of god < 1281229657 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This proof? < 1281229660 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Watch a plant grow". < 1281229665 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not exaggerating, I swear on my life. < 1281229668 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awwwwww < 1281229672 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linky please? < 1281229672 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's adorable. < 1281229676 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Find that log and read it and you will lose all religious faith because /God would not allow anyone to be so stupid/. < 1281229679 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It *is* adorable. < 1281229680 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Adorable in a pathetic, sad kind of way. < 1281229699 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: we kept telling him that it wasn't an argument and he basically started yelling "PLANTS!!!!!" < 1281229711 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION greps his secret logs :P < 1281229715 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then he just went psycho < 1281229722 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants searchable online logs < 1281229729 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What if he's schizophrenic? < 1281229732 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : There are... world sauna championships? <-- so i seem to recall < 1281229735 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also if you ever objected to any sort of religiouslyness or god thing like someone mentioning god gratuitously in a "mathematical" "paper" (ultrafinitism HEM HEM) < 1281229740 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he'd go "oh you're one of THOSE atheists" < 1281229743 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THOSE atheists = atheists < 1281229750 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: He probably is. < 1281229756 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: In fact, let's just go out and say he is. < 1281229771 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -chime This option indicates that the clock should chime once on the < 1281229771 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : half hour and twice on the hour. < 1281229773 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xclock, fuck yeah < 1281229778 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We should feel sympathy for him if he is. Try to get him to seek treatment or something < 1281229792 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, we really shouldn't. Besides he talked about seeing psychologists and shit < 1281229797 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently they "just let him go" < 1281229805 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever, even without schizophrenia he'd be an asshole < 1281229807 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no sympathy < 1281229812 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't generally object to stuff like gratuitous God mentioning. < 1281229825 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used to object back in 11th-12th grade < 1281229837 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal: but this was a "paper" which started off like "I don't dislike infinity, I love it, I love it, I love God and his Glory and what he has Given us and and ..." < 1281229841 0 :Zuu!zuu@0x55529f1b.adsl.cybercity.dk JOIN :#esoteric < 1281229841 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1281229841 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1281229845 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone fixes something on the teacher's computer, teacher goes "Thank God!", I say that it wasn't god... < 1281229846 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Hand me a day if you find it. < 1281229848 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"...but mathematics is broken because exponentiation isn't total" (this was the actual argument) < 1281229853 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: NO. MINE. < 1281229855 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it argued that "exponentiation is total" was an unfounded belief) < 1281229864 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yeah I was like "this is just some religious crap and then some bullshit" < 1281229866 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is manually grepping logs for relevant conversations < 1281229867 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oh, you mean a day with fax crazitude. < 1281229873 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1281229874 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: yeah, that's a bit overly gratuitous. < 1281229876 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I just found where 'e was banned. < 1281229879 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"GIVE ME THAT DAY!" < 1281229921 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This Two Minutes Hate is going great, public opinion of Eurasia^Wfax has never been so low. < 1281229944 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good thing everyone hates fax now. I can't imagine what we'd do if we didn't all hate him. < 1281229948 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have _always_ been at war with fax < 1281229952 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION still wants a link < 1281229968 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders what'll happen if he reads that < 1281229971 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: DO YOU KNOW WHO ELSE WANTED A LINK? < 1281229972 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FAX! < 1281229986 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And isn't it Emmanuel Goldstein that was hated in the 2min of hate? < 1281229986 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: He will climb into our windows at night and brutally rape-murder us.* < 1281229987 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Mmm. < 1281229989 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*I'm not sure I'm joking. < 1281230008 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, yeah, we're at war with Eurasia^HEastasia^HEurasia < 1281230015 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^WOceania < 1281230027 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We're at war with EurasiEastasiEurasia? >.> < 1281230036 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a foreign name. < 1281230041 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foreign like NAZISM. < 1281230063 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal: there was a really _messy_ unification. philologically, at least. < 1281230099 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And phonologically... < 1281230124 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :phonogilly < 1281230161 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I write Linux distribution I put my own "decoration" package, which is very simple and has only three things: analog clock (instead of xclock), xeye (instead of xeyes), and screen saver (with several modes, such as variations of munching squares display hack, analog clock, digital clock, arbritrary text, blank screen, status screen) < 1281230181 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No love for xscreensaver? < 1281230202 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No love for xscreensaver? < 1281230204 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoops. < 1281230433 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1281230436 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION starts seeing the crazy < 1281230437 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF < 1281230450 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :12:26:19 alise why the fuck would you steal mathematica < 1281230452 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*groan* < 1281230463 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other screen saver modes can include: dim screen, cellular automata, distribution logo, and energy saver. < 1281230470 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That should be enough screen saver modes < 1281230527 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: actually he then qualified it by saying it was because mathematica is shit xD < 1281230534 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but he hated wolfram haters < 1281230543 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unity/gtk-kde4 0.9.4-1 < 1281230543 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :community/gtk-rezlooks-engine 0.6-9 < 1281230543 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Clean looking gtk theme engine based on the cairo-enabled CVS clearlooks engine code. < 1281230546 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ehird@dinky ~]$ gtk-chtheme < 1281230548 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(gtk-chtheme:2033): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: g_object_unref: assertion `G_IS_OBJECT (object)' failed < 1281230549 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1281230559 0 :alise!~ehird@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281230564 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1281230566 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did not intend < 1281230569 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's fax's reddit page: http://www.reddit.com/user/cwcc < 1281230575 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more fun fun fun < 1281230576 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU NEVER INTEND < 1281230584 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The text in arbitrary text mode and status display mode could be adjusted by manipulating files in the process's /9p/ directory < 1281230625 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fax hated wikipedia btw < 1281230628 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a passion < 1281230638 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: it would seem fax has disappeared from reddit too, then? or maybe he was banned. < 1281230652 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It is a idea of my Linux distribution (ArcaneLinux) that every process will have a /proc/[ID]/9p/ directory which is a file system by the program, if the program does not handle it, any accesses to the /9p/ directory will return a "device is busy" message or "no disk in drive" message) < 1281230657 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe he killed himself. or moved on to another personality < 1281230698 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, hm < 1281230725 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he is presently on freenode as soupdragon < 1281230816 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone know an IM client that isn't Pidgin? < 1281230831 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1281230869 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: I don't know, I wanted to include some different IM protocol features into PHIRC, so if anyone wants to write the protocol plugins you can do so < 1281230891 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is your opinion of the ArcaneLinux process /9p/ directory idea? < 1281230899 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: It's an idea. < 1281230989 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: He really sucks at English. < 1281231000 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yeah that is a common trait of insane cranks. < 1281231121 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1281231156 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"do u no c++" "I wish I didn't "But I could write in C++ if I had a gun up to my head" < 1281231159 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The program "xeye" just can set -b (background color) -f (foreground color) -t (thickness) -a (always on top) -d (do not turn off borders from window manager), and then waits for coordinates from stdin, each line is X-coordinate, Y-coordinate, radius, and then it draws that eye on the screen, at EOF it continues running until interrupted, but you can still make adjustments in the /9p/ directory < 1281231167 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahh, alt-right drag is so nice to resize windows. < 1281231177 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the program "xusb" can simply list connected USB devices. < 1281231185 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why X usb? < 1281231193 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It should be lsub. < 1281231197 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X is the graphical system. < 1281231216 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION finds out why Sgeo was mentioning the sauna championship < 1281231217 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: It would be the name, "xusb" is a program which lists USB devices in a window and updates it automatically. < 1281231221 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is why. < 1281231223 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, for programs like that, waiting from stdin is Bad. < 1281231230 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They should be command-line arguments in accordance with Unix design principles. < 1281231299 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, did Squeak blocks not used to be lambdas, but now they are? < 1281231302 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: ArcaneLinux design principles are different though, which is that everything can be piped, and so on, and everything else. If you have a list of eyes already and don't want to add more afterward, just redirect the input from a file instead? < 1281231313 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: They were always lambdas, as far as I know. < 1281231327 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, but they weren't always closures < 1281231333 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So by your definition... < 1281231342 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: They weren't? < 1281231354 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Want to ask in #squeak? < 1281231384 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I'll trust you. < 1281231425 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: It is much quiter in #esoteric when you're not around. < 1281231432 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quieter, even. < 1281231434 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The other design principles of ArcaneLinux is don't add unnecessary icons and decorations and stuff to programs (except for decoration programs), and don't use GNU long options) < 1281231450 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'll choose to take that as a compliment. :P < 1281231472 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For a while, I was the centre of the #haskell social graph thing they had auto-generated; basically it looked at who responded to who, and who talked most, etc. < 1281231485 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was the biggest, most-connected and centre of the graph, despite not talking about actual Haskell much at all. < 1281231512 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:30:32 * fax was getting along fine until people started being uppity /ignore users < 1281231515 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*groan* < 1281231533 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: You are a man who makes conversation happen, I guess. :P < 1281231542 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mostly useless conversation. < 1281231696 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How-to-Do Girls - Bikini Calculus! http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0006U6KIK < 1281231718 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wat. < 1281231762 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chain rule is last on that list, but chain rule's rather easy, so... < 1281231771 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but there's no bikinis. < 1281231788 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In more advanced texts. < 1281231790 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or DVDs. < 1281231841 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No bikinis == good < 1281231940 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just don't appreciate Bikini Calculus. < 1281231966 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe they've done bikini quantum mechanics too. with bras and kets. < 1281231984 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I'd appreciate it more without the bikinis < 1281231987 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.> < 1281232021 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently not. < 1281232046 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How can we trick the beholder to cast the "hold monster" ray on themself, so that we can use the "modify memory" spell then, and somehow to convince everyone that the gods is dead? < 1281232123 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No-Bikini Calculus just doesn't have the same ring to it. < 1281232146 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: depends how you interpret it. < 1281232150 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have any opinion of the answer of my question? < 1281232163 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Gee, you don't say. < 1281232210 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bikini Algebra has a ring to it though. < 1281232233 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION waits patiently < 1281232284 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I refuse to laugh or groan. < 1281232289 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Please wait forever. Your call is important to us. Push "0" for operator and then please wait even more forever, for listening to the operator, please. < 1281232312 0 :derdon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1281232313 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is reading old channel logs for here amusing? < 1281232329 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Because it has a lot of writing in it. < 1281232335 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Because we are awesome. < 1281232342 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Things aren't amusing just because they have a lot of writing... < 1281232384 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Yes, but it is, if it is amusing writing... < 1281232418 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: spoilsport < 1281232482 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you print out a Whitespace or Unispace program, that does not have any comments, or header/footer, or web, that means that you can reuse the paper because it is still blank < 1281232595 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION realizes that the trick is in the eye of the beholder < 1281232644 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: You are right, that is part of it. But it still doesn't help that is only a little bit idea < 1281232691 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(We have 2 monster characters in our party, that probably would help a bit?) < 1281232905 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1281233164 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281233511 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, why are there no simple GTK+ themes? < 1281234123 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:03:15 Also I'd say that Japan imports less culture from other countries. < 1281234158 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not true. A good 70% (number pulled out of rectum) of Japanese culture is imported. It's just morphed a hell of a lot after importation. < 1281234348 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think OpenDNS is broken. < 1281234363 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, maybe not. < 1281234602 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15:01:37 sometimes i like to pretend pikhq never googles anything but actually just happens to know everything < 1281234606 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If only. < 1281234754 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well if you ever googled you'd obviously have found that quote earlier < 1281234781 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guh, gnome-look is down for me < 1281234842 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could someone follow this through to the download link and mirror it somewhere? http://gnome-look.org/content/download.php?content=72622&id=1&tan=70966423&PHPSESSID=6f31a60dfebaf1952b9c0467602dbe38 < 1281234846 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OpenDNS is being retarded. < 1281234972 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Switch to Google DNS? < 1281235159 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. Very no. < 1281235292 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can someone do that mirroring? Anyone? :P < 1281235516 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1281235821 0 :calamari!~calamari@ip70-162-184-205.ph.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281235893 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1281236736 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1281236832 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281236844 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281238113 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1281238552 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: does http://gnome-look.org/CONTENT/content-files/72622-Awakened.tar.gz work? < 1281238936 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281239003 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Linux Libertine is not so good when hinted. < 1281239802 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise! < 1281239859 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sup kid < 1281240026 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stuff < 1281240028 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1281240029 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1281240227 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281240272 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whyyy does freetype fail so much < 1281240357 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because nothing free can be good < 1281240359 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/troll < 1281240375 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1281240381 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281240396 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you troll, but oh, how true it seems < 1281240473 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281240484 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281240493 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you disable all hinting, it just looks like RISC OS. < 1281240712 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb testing something < 1281240723 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1281240866 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281240888 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, you know how PC speaker beeps are redirected to the speakers nowadays? < 1281240893 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, how do I disable that and just let the beep DIE? < 1281240899 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1281240900 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1281240905 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281240916 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1281241766 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281242075 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the process /9p/ directory, if the program does not handle it, I read the opengroup list of errors I try to figure out which error it should be: ENODEV ENOSYS ENXIO < 1281242309 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you try to create a file there that the program it belongs to does not support (or modify an existing file in a non-supported way), should it return one of these errors? ENOSPC ENOSYS EROFS EACCES < 1281242364 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if the filesystem is only temporarily disabled due to the program doing something that should not be interrupted by calls to this file system, it could use EBUSY < 1281242409 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or if the process is stopped) < 1281242431 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281242455 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Testing. < 1281242466 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For try to create a file there that the program it belongs to does not support, there is one more error code I forgot: EPERM < 1281242471 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Testing is OK. < 1281242474 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that hasn't worked. < 1281242484 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: What did you testing? < 1281242488 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Stuff." < 1281242492 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Text rendering sucks everywhere outside of TeX. Just accept it or kill yourself. < 1281242492 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :freetype stuff < 1281242501 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It's marginally acceptable on OS X... < 1281242504 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(With an Apple display.) < 1281242523 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, yes. Apple was obsessed with getting it right so it doesn't suck much there. < 1281242533 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sadly, we can't just go with Display TeX. < 1281242544 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... :D WHY NOT < 1281242553 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Why not indeed. < 1281242581 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Testing again < 1281242583 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1281242589 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281242591 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ew ew ew. < 1281242598 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay; subpixel rendering is OUT. < 1281242599 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For displaying text on screen that isn't a print preview, just simple bitmap fonts will do, I think < 1281242628 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'm actually halfway to just going with http://sharpfonts.co.cc/; at least it'd just be ugly, rather than *actively hurting* my eyes. < 1281242634 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Monospace will do for on screen text in many cases < 1281242675 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Unfortunately, slight-hinted greyscale text is ... well, blurry. < 1281242705 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On a more upbeat tone, I managed to make a GTK+ theme that sucks less than the other ones. < 1281242713 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I took Mist and changed the colours. It's now GreyMist. Guess what colours it uses. < 1281242733 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it use grey? < 1281242741 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CONGRATULATIONS! < 1281242749 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You deduced the answer successfully! < 1281242842 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION installs ROX Filer. < 1281242866 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The /only/ file manager that doesn't suck. Probably. < 1281243043 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: I've got to say, the DejaVu fonts are nice on screen with the actual TTF hinting running. < 1281243068 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281243082 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281243096 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There. I'm running the only thing I can stand: wispy, badly-defined, fully-hinted, greyscale text. < 1281243128 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What distro you on? < 1281243255 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arch. < 1281243262 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, I've tried the patched freetypes. < 1281243285 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Being able to close a window in one click on the title bar: Dangerous, or hideously dangerous? < 1281243296 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moderately dangerous. < 1281243307 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll leave it at Win+Middleclick, then. < 1281243356 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It's just that I keep hitting Middleclick expecting it to close! < 1281243356 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION closes alise by accident < 1281243357 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh, I'll add it. < 1281243394 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Disconnecting soon < 1281243467 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Wow, click-to-focus seems so... static after sloppy focus. < 1281243534 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use Smalltalk as your OS! < 1281243537 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1281243562 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Can I just recommend pekwm+ROX-Filer+Midori as a nice desktop? < 1281243578 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With my "bland" pekwm theme and "GreyMist" GTK+ theme, of course. >_> < 1281243884 0 :sshc_!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric < 1281243960 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Tempting. < 1281243968 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are you using for IRC and/or IM? < 1281243973 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1281243983 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-Chat for IRC, Pidgin for IM. Yeah, they suck, but so does everything else. Easy enough to use irssi or whatever. < 1281244049 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what sort of IM? < 1281244054 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IRC is an IM program < 1281244057 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*protocol < 1281244077 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really. < 1281244084 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IM is more one-to-one. < 1281244111 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1281244450 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: You can do one-to-one with IRC as well < 1281244457 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but.. < 1281244461 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*but... < 1281244641 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a good assembly language? < 1281244655 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: you mean, architecture? < 1281244662 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARM < 1281244673 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIPS < 1281244676 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's about it < 1281244679 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIPS is simpler i think < 1281244686 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all, Gregor isn't doing jsARM < 1281244707 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIPSv1 is simpler than any ARM. I can't speak to later models. < 1281244713 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1281244916 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1281244922 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281244932 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, I have tray icons and a clock now. < 1281244949 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I write file manager for my Linux distribution, I won't use ROX-Filer or any other. But instead, have it simply display a list of files (no icons or menus are visible), which can be typed by keyboard or selected by mouse, function keys and other keys can change sort and so on, and some keys do space-delimited copy to clipboard, newline-delimited copy to clipboard, select by wildcards, filter by wildcards, command entry, open command shell he < 1281244955 0 :sshc_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sshc < 1281244980 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :re, and multi panes. < 1281245117 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that good enough file-manager? < 1281245146 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess. < 1281245256 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another feature would be to return a newline-delimited list of the selected files when the file manager window is closed. < 1281245262 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That is, return it to stdout) < 1281245298 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this also a good feature, in your opinion? < 1281245310 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ... gues < 1281245311 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*guess < 1281245363 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are any of these things I have described about it, things you would use or are interested in, or other people who are interested in? < 1281245474 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There would be no menus, no toolbars, no icons for files, no context menus..... but there will be a status bar to indicate number selected, total size selected, current directory, current mode, and so on. < 1281245518 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And the three mouse buttons are used for different methods of selection, and also depending on single-click or double-click) < 1281245742 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And three display modes: "short mode" (like output of "ls" to a color terminal), "long mode" (like "ls -l"), and "gallery mode" (displays a grid of thumbnails of all pictures in the directory, and ignores all other files) < 1281245777 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Gallery mode is the only mode that this program would display any graphics at all) < 1281245898 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are these all good ideas? Or are you differently? < 1281246109 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm differently, but they are acceptable. < 1281246110 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goodnight. < 1281246111 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye. < 1281246113 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1281246146 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Are you still available and do you have opinion? < 1281246206 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I'm still single but I'm not really into long-distance relationships. < 1281246208 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no opinion. < 1281246265 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, Gregor *is* perfectly open to same-sex relationships. < 1281246294 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a non-issue :P < 1281246328 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He may well be implementing part of the plan for all geeks to get laid. < 1281246427 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am open to asexuality because I am asexuality. I am not sexuality, and I am not homosexuality, and I am not heterosexuality. < 1281246480 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Congrats on not being abstract concepts. < 1281246488 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+1 to pikhq :P < 1281246504 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: While also being a particular abstract concept. < 1281246521 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1281246571 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xeye [-i] [-b bgcolor] [-f fgcolor] [-t thickness] [-a] [-b] [-w intended_screen_width] [-h intended_screen_height] [< file] < 1281246646 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xaclock [-b bgcolor] [-f fgcolor] [-t thickness] [-a] [-b] [-x x_coordinate] [-y y_coordinate] [-r radius] [-w intended_screen_width] [-h intended_screen_height] [-z timezone] [-s] < 1281246682 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are these sensible to you? < 1281246733 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :These are two of the three "decoration programs" I plan to put in my Linux distribution (only these three, the third being the screen saver) < 1281246789 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is xeye the program formerly known as xeyes? < 1281246805 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But ... cycloptic? < 1281246817 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, xeye is a new program that does something like xeyes < 1281246853 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It draws one eye for each line from stdin x,y,radius. < 1281246971 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it make sense? Does xaclock make sense? < 1281246991 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the purpose of the intended width/height attributes? < 1281247064 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: To optionally synchronize with positions of a centered background picture (which are only potentially useful if you do not use the always-on-top option or the option to not suppress window borders) < 1281247120 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For example, if you have a background picture with a big monster with 17 eyes, and a clock on the wall in the background picture, you can include the parameters with it to make it work with these decorations even if your screen resolution is different < 1281247225 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Obviously it won't work if the perspective is wrong, but that is something you have to deal with, if you want xeye and xaclock to work with it, ensure to draw it with the correct perspectives!) < 1281247553 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We don't need the -i option. Instead, just have xeye support comments in stdin with # at front, and #! beginning a multiline comment that ends with #? < 1281247633 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the -s (sound effects) option needs to take one parameter, which is the volume < 1281247846 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xalsave [-l] [-w timer] [-p] screen_saver_type [screen_saver_arguments...] < 1281247941 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :screen_saver_type: analog-clock, digital-clock, text, display-hack, blank, dim, status, cellular-automata, energy-saver < 1281248597 0 :kwertii!~kwertii@ResNet-32-110.resnet.ucsb.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1281250441 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: http://xplsv.com/prods/demos/xplsv_orsotheysay/ You may now feel inferior. < 1281250486 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This utterly frozen browser sure makes me feel inferior ... < 1281250503 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chrome is needed. < 1281250510 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or recent Firefox. < 1281250576 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, is this canvas or something more exotic? < 1281250589 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://capped.tv/xplsv-or_so_they_say Or you could just watch a video of the same demo... < 1281250659 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This doesn't really make me feel inferior though :P < 1281250661 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Graphics ain't my thing. < 1281250673 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bah. < 1281250709 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heww Urf < 1281250712 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Hewwo < 1281252173 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281253429 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1281253827 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1281254399 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1281254400 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1281254458 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@78.104.80.116 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281255984 0 :MizardX!~MizardX@unaffiliated/mizardx JOIN :#esoteric < 1281256034 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: bye < 1281256326 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION dances < 1281256576 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Dancing because? < 1281256592 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im working on a linguistic command line < 1281256604 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the language module for it is coming along nicely < 1281256608 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm working on ... taking pictures of my eye :P < 1281256625 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you can parse all English I assume? :P < 1281256668 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1281256673 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, itll be a fragment of english < 1281256680 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the crucial part is what you do with the parses < 1281256712 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yesh < 1281256719 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Understanding English is good :P < 1281256730 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :language modules are supposed to transform (partial) sentences into key-value hashes that are used to represent commands to the command line < 1281256732 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so for instance < 1281256768 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"move x to y" would be the command { pred: move, object: { pred: x }, to: { pred: y } } < 1281256852 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but more importantly, it has to be able to take partial parses and do that < 1281256870 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it also has to be able to take partial parses, and a command, and turn the command into the full parses that correspond to it < 1281256887 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. if you have the partial parses for "move x" and the command from before < 1281256893 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be able to generate "move x to y" < 1281256898 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Star Trek, here we come. < 1281256921 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1281256938 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :internally the way im doing this is kind of perverse < 1281256965 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SHOW US THE CODE! < 1281256969 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :patience < 1281256972 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1281256976 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :itll be on github in a few days < 1281256992 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ill give you a preview in a few hours once i get it to a state that i like < 1281257031 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll be asleep in a few hours. < 1281257052 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok ill put it on my server now for your < 1281257101 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually < 1281257108 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hows a pastie? < 1281257149 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://ruby.pastebin.com/SBFwDwpe < 1281257160 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mind you, im not a very stylistic ruby coder < 1281257176 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont know all the standard style conventions < 1281257195 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even know ruby :P < 1281257208 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the uh .. complete method is a complete mess, too < 1281257220 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because of the various conditions that are involved < 1281257234 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could probably refactor the whole thing quite nicely but im not going to right now ;P < 1281257235 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION 's eyes glaze over. < 1281257254 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see, what i do internally is like so: < 1281257262 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :commands internally are turned into graphs < 1281257264 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so instead of, say < 1281257279 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cmd = { pred => move, object => { pred => x } } < 1281257283 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :itll become < 1281257297 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{ 0 => { pred => move, object => 1 }, 1 => { pred => x } } < 1281257322 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then non-terminal in the tree is associated with a rule in the grammar, right < 1281257341 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so lets just talk about grammars < 1281257353 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to talk about sleep instead. < 1281257355 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To myself. < 1281257356 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And my bed. < 1281257358 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww :( < 1281257359 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night < 1281257364 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bahee :P < 1281257396 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But immediately before I go to sleep, have a random picture of my eye because it took a lot of work to get this (fuzzy, out-of-focus) shot: http://codu.org/pics/main.php?cmd=imageorig&var1=Assorted%2Fmyeye-2010-08-07-4.jpg < 1281257606 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281258127 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-0-121.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281259081 0 :tombom!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1281259791 0 :bsmntbombdood_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1281260061 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1281260068 0 :coppro!~scshunt@nat/uwaterloo/x-zepvjkbbgmrojekn JOIN :#esoteric < 1281260073 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1281260073 0 :coppro!~scshunt@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1281260638 0 :bsmntbombdood_!~gavin@174-16-95-127.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281261975 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Write error: Connection reset by peer < 1281261985 0 :Quadrescence!~Quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence JOIN :#esoteric < 1281262113 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1281262648 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1281262839 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1281263021 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-0-121.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281263073 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@92.233.174.117 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281264537 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1281265096 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, no! < 1281265113 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION see no one with nick Oh, no < 1281265115 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sees < 1281265129 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't hum Also Sprach Zarathustra without it turning into the Mastermind theme tune! < 1281265142 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY, GOD, WHY? < 1281265372 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281267793 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: New quit message. Entering 2006 in style. < 1281268438 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281268902 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1281268912 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot < 1281268913 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: that you did." he stared down at oats. so did ysabell and the others?" said the archchancellor. he was walking unaided now, provided that it was a tsortean soldier. despite himself, death was his master and that's all there was to it. < 1281268989 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281269012 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Phantom_Hoover < 1281269217 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281269409 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@78.104.80.116 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281269540 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281269663 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281269790 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@78.104.80.116 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281270882 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What random games could be made into Roguelikes? < 1281270894 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps Elite: the Roguelike. < 1281270902 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Go. < 1281270915 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, ha. < 1281270927 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hungry hungry hippos < 1281270959 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The hippo lunges at the ball! The hippo hits! The hippo eats a ball corpse." < 1281271073 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Later < 1281271106 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281271116 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OTOH if you made most modern games into Roguelikes they would be unbearably shallow. < 1281271147 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281271149 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281271696 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1281271705 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1281272350 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281272624 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1281272905 0 :Quadrescence!~Quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence JOIN :#esoteric < 1281273303 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if anyone else here has even heard of Elite < 1281273971 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@92.233.174.117 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281274151 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281274519 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1281276766 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281277999 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Phantom_Hoover < 1281279148 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose someone knows why the Haskell logo is based on the bind operator. < 1281279265 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281280365 0 :jix_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281281721 0 :jix!~jix@tomakin.h-ix.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281282201 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1281282392 0 :AnMaster!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1281282706 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1281282780 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, panos might be coming up later this evening. One or maybe two with grand sea view < 1281282803 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some from phone camera, some from my real camera < 1281283355 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does pattern-matching really work in eager languages < 1281283360 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/$/?/ < 1281283632 0 :tombom!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1281283836 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281284487 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can resize and move windows without focusing them. Cool. < 1281284502 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, wait, I can't. < 1281284645 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darned keybindings inconsistency. < 1281284658 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. Mousebindings. < 1281284992 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okayyyy... why does osstest work but not mplayer < 1281285024 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cos of pi. < 1281285034 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Pattern-matching works in eager languages < 1281285044 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see e.g. ML; in fact pattern matching in eager languages predates pattern matching in lazy languages. < 1281285048 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and indeed lazy languages altogether < 1281285055 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, http://mewtwo.sporksirc.net/~anmaster/images/gothenburg2010/tjol__oe__holm_1.jpg (__oe__ represents ö) < 1281285068 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, quite small, used mobile phone < 1281285073 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are some visible seams < 1281285103 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it jpeg compresses the images badly < 1281285106 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1281285108 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281285110 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoops. < 1281285117 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, some quite bad colour shift < 1281285144 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mwahahaha my window manager configuration will defeat evil < 1281285145 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahem. < 1281285156 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise become: nil < 1281285159 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i meant to say is MWAHAHAHAHA < 1281285165 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/$/./ < 1281285168 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Sniff < 1281285170 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Sniff. < 1281285175 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Try "true become: false" sometime. < 1281285211 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tried Object become: nil. on the recommendation of a tutorial once < 1281285216 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sweet, Pharo is in AUR. < 1281285218 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The VM crashed < 1281285219 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AUR? < 1281285221 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Of course. < 1281285224 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: AUR = Arch User Repository. < 1281285234 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically a bunch of "source packages" for Arch Linux. < 1281285246 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So instead of getting the binary your package manager goes and builds it, etc., then installs it. < 1281285255 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aww < 1281285261 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you have a package manager that supports AUR it's basically like a regular package but sometimes not as polished and it takes a little bit longer. < 1281285272 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Polish is only wrt patches and build settings, though. < 1281285277 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Aww? < 1281285278 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true become: false. doesn't cause crashy crashy. It causes freezy freezy. < 1281285280 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Generally, http://www.conservapedia.com/Essay:_The_transitional_animal_the_flying_kitty%3F < 1281285286 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Indeed < 1281285292 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scroll down for complete insanity. < 1281285298 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I think it's doing some sort of loop based on whether a value is true or false < 1281285306 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: and obviously it's always false, so the loop never terminates < 1281285308 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus freezy freezy < 1281285320 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: use of become: btw -- future values < 1281285321 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the screen gets repainted when I unminimize < 1281285324 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(you know what futures are?) < 1281285332 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but the VM handles painting < 1281285335 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...any relation to laziness? < 1281285340 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(no, I don't) < 1281285354 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically a future is the result of a function called lazily < 1281285356 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so e.g. you'd do < 1281285372 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo := @ bar longComputation: vitalInput < 1281285374 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then if you did < 1281285384 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"foo xyzzy", it'd return @ foo xyzzy < 1281285396 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. all message calls are delayed and run asynchronously, while "returning" immediately < 1281285403 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can force a future to be evaluated < 1281285413 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, when the future is forced, or the asynchronous computation completes, the Future code can do: < 1281285419 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :theFuture become: theResult < 1281285427 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tada! no pesky wrapper objects left hanging around < 1281285483 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why must SmallIntegers hate become:? < 1281285491 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: because they're not real objects < 1281285498 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you get how every object is a pointer, right? < 1281285507 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like 0xfff points to an instance of MyAmazingClass < 1281285508 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1281285512 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what smalltalk does is align every pointer < 1281285519 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that every pointer ends with a 0 in binary < 1281285521 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then < 1281285535 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every SmallInteger, which is 31 bits (or 63, I dunno if Squeak does 64-bit) < 1281285538 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is stored in the rest of the pointer < 1281285542 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the bottom bit is set to 1 < 1281285545 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there's no actual object there < 1281285550 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's stored inline, if you assign it to a slot < 1281285554 0 :derdon!~quassel@p5B3E5D9A.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281285555 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or use it in a variable < 1281285572 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of "x = pointer to " we have < 1281285576 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that breaks the uniformity of everything being an object :( < 1281285585 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"x = 0b1231" < 1281285589 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1281285590 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"x = 0b1101" < 1281285592 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for 0b110) < 1281285594 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: no it doesn't < 1281285600 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: from the perspective of the language SmallIntegers are objects < 1281285607 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you can send them messages, etc; this is handled specially by the VM < 1281285613 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :objects that can't handle become: < 1281285623 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not like "Object become: nil" works either < 1281285631 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd say an error telling you you can't do it beats a VM crash < 1281285642 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :become: only works in controlled circumstances < 1281285662 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: besides, any class can override become: to give one of those messages < 1281285670 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although you could manually delete it from that class, still < 1281285677 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway if it wasn't done smalltalk would be slow as fuck rather than slow as shit < 1281285687 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so deal < 1281285723 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stupid efficiency concerns! < 1281285752 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hahaha. Smalltalk is the last one to worry about efficiency concerns. < 1281285761 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: anyway, SmallInteger absolutely does not break Smalltalk's purity < 1281285763 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trust me on that one < 1281285953 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happens when the future wants to return a SmallInteger? < 1281285969 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Would actually come up if I used futures for the AW SDK stuff) < 1281286004 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1281286026 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: that's fine < 1281286028 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo become: 3 works < 1281286030 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just not 3 become: foo < 1281286039 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :theFuture become: theResult, theFuture is a Future, theResult is 3 < 1281286051 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...aren't they identical? become: is supposed to swap the two... < 1281286056 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it's not < 1281286066 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"x become: y" doesn't touch y < 1281286069 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it only touches x < 1281286080 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"x become: y", i.e. "make x y", not "make y x too" < 1281286083 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-2925351791.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1281286089 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"true become: false" makes all booleans false < 1281286096 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(unless you derive your own type of boolean ... :P) < 1281286110 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sed 's/last full capacity: *\([0-9]*\) mAh/\1/g p; d' # Using sed to grep as well, fuck yeah! < 1281286183 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, you're wrong < 1281286192 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am? < 1281286199 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really don't think I am ... < 1281286213 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know the code looks like it swaps them, but it doesn't afaik. < 1281286236 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/Ng8x8dcf < 1281286260 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hum. < 1281286261 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is new to me. < 1281286264 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay then. < 1281286276 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a becomeForward: < 1281286280 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does "a become: 3" work? < 1281286282 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just out of curiosity... < 1281286328 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Error: can't become SmallIntegers < 1281286338 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Then just make it an Integer. < 1281286342 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Easy to convert. < 1281286403 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ehird@dinky ~]$ pharo < 1281286403 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :libXdamage.so.1: wrong ELF class: ELFCLASS64 < 1281286403 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could not find module vm-display-X11 < 1281286403 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/bin/pharo: line 2: 15272 Aborted sh pharo.sh < 1281286403 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sigh. < 1281286477 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Going to watch some more SGA now < 1281286496 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I had become: in C#, I'd abuse it to allow me to do unit testing < 1281286587 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fwiw, becomeForward: doesn't work with SmallIntegers either < 1281286613 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was going to express an opinion on SGA. < 1281286616 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it turns out I don't have much of a one. < 1281286634 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: just turn it into an Integer < 1281286704 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um.. < 1281286709 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How am I supposed to do that? < 1281286714 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asInteger doesn't help < 1281286813 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Back to SGA < 1281286852 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ehird@dinky src]$ ./battery < 1281286853 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :43% < 1281286854 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, it works. < 1281286857 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Integer new: 3, or something. < 1281286894 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Integer cannot have variable sized instance < 1281286901 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*instances < 1281287071 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh, i'd figure it out but i'm on 64-bit < 1281287074 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which seems to be broken < 1281287198 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ask for help in #squeak ? < 1281287728 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's an arch problem. < 1281287733 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has a battery script thing working! < 1281287754 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: 'Sides, don't you mean #pharo? < 1281287759 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Besides; 'sides is irritating. < 1281287786 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, there are 3 people in #pharo and I'm one of them < 1281287837 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I only noticed this just now, but #pharo is the wrong #pharo < 1281287854 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...and I was in the right #pharo-project which has 10 people < 1281287866 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the AUR package just installs the 32-bit binary < 1281287870 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lame < 1281287870 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But still, #squeak is far more active < 1281287879 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll just compile Pharo myself < 1281287905 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :technically it's just the squeak vm < 1281287981 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There; sudo clyde -S squeak. < 1281287984 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then I'll manually grab the image. < 1281288211 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This setup is pretty nice. < 1281288219 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps I'm converging on a desktop OS I can stand. < 1281288454 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi Phantom_Hoover. < 1281288467 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno why I did that. < 1281288607 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net < 1281288614 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Is there a nicer/simpler theme than the OS X-style one? < 1281288616 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know there was in Squeak. < 1281288633 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, they've switched to FirstLast instead of FL. < 1281288638 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are other themes, but they're either ugly or broken < 1281288656 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :W2k isn't so bad. :-) < 1281288658 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :World Menu -> System -> Settings < 1281288661 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*W2K < 1281288667 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, you found it < 1281288670 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, they finally made the settings browser not suck. < 1281288675 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I /have/ used Pharo before, just an older version. < 1281288700 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Soft Squeak and W2K both seem nicer than Watery 2. < 1281288708 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The buttons on the taskbar thing are inverted in W2k, and the buttons turn blue eventually < 1281288722 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The buttons look fine to me on W2K. But blueness is bad. < 1281288732 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Soft Squeak, then. < 1281288737 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Standard Squeak would be nicer if it wasn't white. < 1281288746 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um, try minimizing and unminimizing a window to see what I mean < 1281288751 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1281288756 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, in /my/ day we didn't _have_ a taskbar. < 1281288780 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The OS X one is stupid anyway, the buttons are at the wrong side of the title bar. < 1281288815 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not an OSX user, so I couldn't tell >.> < 1281288844 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION makes his menus flat, without gradients or rounded corners. < 1281288860 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Much more mature. < 1281288964 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yes, the UI only uses bitmap fonts by default, how sane. < 1281289059 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Allow underscore as assignment". <3 < 1281289130 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: What's the way to show the halo# these days? < 1281289131 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*halo < 1281289139 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um < 1281289150 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea, I just like to pretend it doesn't exist < 1281289164 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's an Ugly Squeak (TM) thing to me < 1281289187 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is. But it's also the only way to inspect some objects. < 1281289210 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably some combination of alt or ctrl and a left or middle or right click < 1281289221 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tried those. < 1281289231 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it's a menu instead of a halo? < 1281289247 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Resizing windows is as slow as always... < 1281289249 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Nope. < 1281289266 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then I have no idea, sorry :( < 1281289277 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ctrl-Click? < 1281289282 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brings up a menu < 1281289659 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not on the taskbar. < 1281289912 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Shaddap < 1281289927 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1281290241 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Gah, "n asArray" spits out an array of SmallIntegers; one would think there would be a corresponding fromArray, but it seems not. < 1281290268 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...why would there be a fromArray? < 1281290283 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because there's an asArray which returns something just about useless without a fromArray. < 1281290293 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asArray < 1281290294 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : | stream | < 1281290294 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : stream := Array new writeStream. < 1281290294 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : self digitLength to: 1 by: -1 do: [:digitIndex | < 1281290294 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : stream nextPut: (self digitAt: digitIndex)]. < 1281290294 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ^ stream contents < 1281290328 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, so it returns digits. Hmhm. < 1281290340 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, you know, anArray at: 1 < 1281290354 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seems to work < 1281290358 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh? < 1281290363 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: nope < 1281290367 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :65536 asArray < 1281290401 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wtfs < 1281290433 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{65536} at: 1 < 1281290437 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that's not ANSI < 1281290472 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ?? < 1281290488 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gahh, I hate it when people go "WHY DO YOU WANT TO DO THIS? How DARE you ask without a practical, BUSINESS, best-practices reason for doing this thing?" < 1281290493 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: why are you wtfing? < 1281290502 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because asArray makes no sense < 1281290510 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :65536 asArray #(1 0 0) < 1281290514 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Protip: The base isn't decimal. < 1281290552 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, I'm not sure what base it is. < 1281290565 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wtfs at base 256 < 1281290572 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Trial and error) < 1281290574 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it base 256? < 1281290578 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, where did people go that? < 1281290588 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah, ofc < 1281290591 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :256r100 65536 < 1281290593 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :log256(65536) < 1281290595 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm... < 1281290615 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not what i meant < 1281290624 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what i mean < 1281290627 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: #squeak < 1281290635 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : How should I box a SmallInteger into a (Large) Integer? < 1281290636 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : =P < 1281290636 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I have no idea what you're talking about. >__> < 1281290636 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : alise: why would you need to do that? < 1281290636 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : BrianRice: e.g. to use with become: < 1281290636 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : alise: what's the overall goal/problem? < 1281290638 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : there are ways to do it, but I'll avoid it if the purpose is just wankery < 1281290640 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1281290644 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : alise: what's the overall goal/problem? < 1281290644 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Sgeo was wondering :-) just academic, although e.g. an implementation of futures that does "theFuture become: theResult" on completion would need to do it < 1281290647 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if the result could be a SmallInteger. < 1281290649 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : there are ways to do it, but I'll avoid it if the purpose is just wankery < 1281290699 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I expect that you should probably just look at existing implementations of futures like Squeak-E's promises < 1281290700 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Well, yeah, it was just a hypothetical example. < 1281290700 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : here, I'll teach you how to fish < 1281290719 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I urgently require a method to slap people over TCP/IP. < 1281290732 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IMO, it seems more like giving us fish we aren't even interested in < 1281290735 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of the SCPs could do that. IIRC. < 1281290746 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1281290760 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : go open a class browser and look at the class side of Integer and its subclasses. or try browsing references to large integer class names, since those would be calling class-side methods. < 1281290760 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Yeah, I did that. < 1281290760 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I've been looking for ten minutes. < 1281290761 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuckwit < 1281290789 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So wait, does asArray just break the integer down into its constituent bytes and arrayise them? < 1281290789 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Why do you want to know, mere mortal?" "What's that? You're just CURIOUS? Well I know, but I'm not telling you." "Here, let me be condescending." "Have you looked at the class?" < 1281290796 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Apparently. < 1281290811 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What a strange thing to do. < 1281290854 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : keep at it. you need to learn this skill and I can't just fix it over IRC < 1281290855 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : BrianRice: Well, it seems you're more interested in being condescending than actually helping at all. I'd looked for 15 minutes and, if you knew, you could answer in one line; if you didn't want to tell me, you could have not said anything; but instead you're lecturing me about doing something I've already done. So thanks, but no thanks. < 1281290895 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learn how to look through a class browser? < 1281290900 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this guy for real? < 1281290932 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO IT'S "LEARN HOW TO TOTALLY SEE WHAT METHODS WILL DO WHAT" YOU SUCK LOL I AM PROFESSIONAL PROGRAMMER < 1281290963 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, professionals < 1281290997 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I presume he's a professional, nobody else uses Smalltalk apart from hobbyists and they're just as assholic but less condescending. < 1281291013 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : alise: hey, I'll readily admit I don't know, but I don't know any question here on channel when first asked. I always figure it out dynamically. you guys are just not motivating me if you don't have an actual problem to solve and won't read existing code that does this. < 1281291013 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : BrianRice: you said "there are ways to do it"... I'd read existing code that does it if I had any idea where such code is. < 1281291013 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I thoroughly looked at every method that could be in any way relevant. < 1281291013 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : well, try debugging an overflow condition < 1281291018 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What ridiculous advice. < 1281291052 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asArray breaks a bigint into constituent bytes, doesn't it? < 1281291076 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, there's no toArray. < 1281291140 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Assholic" is a wonderful word, BtW. < 1281291208 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Yeah, dearrayising works. < 1281291211 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's so... silly. < 1281291233 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hide it in a function and pretend it doesn't exist? < 1281291265 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What if you don't know whether ot not it's a SmallInteger, and don't want to deal with it on the side using the future? < 1281291299 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No such functions. < 1281291303 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Eh? < 1281291312 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION likes functions < 1281291316 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Only methods. < 1281291321 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You can check what class a value belongs to. < 1281291322 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I like methods. < 1281291332 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But which is better? There's only one way to find out! < 1281291637 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: aha! < 1281291789 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: got it < 1281291805 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :b := a positive ifTrue: [LargePositiveInteger new: 4] ifFalse: [LargeNegativeInteger new: 4]. < 1281291810 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :b replaceFrom: 1 to: 4 with: a startingAt: 1. < 1281291843 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :replaceFrom:to:with:startingAt: is a primitive, too, so this should be the most efficient way, more or less. < 1281292147 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Do you know the coding convention for when you do (...) someMsg: ... but the ... has an indent? < 1281292152 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have < 1281292156 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :toLargeInteger < 1281292156 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ^ (self positive < 1281292157 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ifTrue: [LargePositiveInteger new: self digitLength] < 1281292157 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ifFalse: [LargeNegativeInteger new: self digitLength]) < 1281292157 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : replaceFrom: 1 to: self digitLength with: self startingAt: 1. < 1281292169 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it seems weird how the replaceFrom:to:with:startingAt: line lines up with the conditional. < 1281292179 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you meant to have it unindented? < 1281292304 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*asLargeInteger < 1281292402 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ok, do you know how to file-out more than one method? < 1281292426 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, incidentally, do you know where there's any decent documentation for Epigram 2? < 1281292439 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's the Epitome, but that hardly counts < 1281292442 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: there's a lot of links here: http://www.e-pig.org/darcs/Pig09/web/ < 1281292450 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://personal.cis.strath.ac.uk/~adam/type-inference/ < 1281292450 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://personal.cis.strath.ac.uk/~dagand/#publications < 1281292456 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything on http://strictlypositive.org/ < 1281292466 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and most especially http://www.e-pig.org/epilogue/ < 1281292478 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is no real actual written documentation, but by reading those and the Epitome you should be able to figure out ... well, something. < 1281292490 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also < 1281292494 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.e-pig.org/darcs/Pig09/man/man.html < 1281292499 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the tiny manual < 1281292506 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.e-pig.org/darcs/Pig09/test/Syntax.pig < 1281292556 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1281292577 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does this count as a three-star literate programming? if(*rule=='#' && (rule++,!is_weaving)) return; < 1281292583 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: also http://www.reddit.com/user/pigworker, Conor's reddit account < 1281292607 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(See: You've used the boolean operators to sequence commands - without an 'if'. e.g. (result = do_something()) && (result = do_something_else()); on the C2 wiki) < 1281292610 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Epigram, Agda and Coq are the most widely-used dependently typed languages, yes? < 1281292684 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Nobody uses Epigram. It's purely a research project, but it /is/ one of great interest. < 1281292704 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why, exactly? < 1281292708 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nobody uses Agda apart from the Agda developers and Haskellers who like to think they're mathematicians. It's a research system too, just with a lot of seemingly-pointless real world libs tacked onto an unstable system. < 1281292714 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People use Coq. < 1281292717 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's mature and works well. < 1281292720 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for proving) < 1281292726 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: because Epigram doesn't even have the upper layer language yet! < 1281292733 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know GHC's Core language that it compiles to? < 1281292735 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The very small functional one? < 1281292738 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Epigram, right now, is like that. < 1281292745 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Epigram 1, sure, but nobody used that and it was never really completed. < 1281292752 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Epigram 2 is in the very early stages (and has been since ~2005). < 1281292760 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not nearly a useable language yet. < 1281292767 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*usable < 1281292805 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But if I used && to sequence commands in C like that, I would probably only use it if there are many commands to be sequenced together in that way, and maybe type @/ after each one to make them appear on separate lines in the printout) < 1281292893 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, what are you going on about? < 1281292907 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Literate Haskell is just a fake kind of literate programming! < 1281292916 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1281292924 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What do *you* think I am going on about! < 1281292929 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: You're right but that's ... terribly hyperbolic. < 1281292930 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/!/?/ < 1281292940 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea, except that literate programming comes into it somewhere. < 1281292948 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Don't worry, none of us have any idea either. < 1281292958 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, that's good to know. < 1281292983 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: What are you refering to, I wrote many things? What is right and terribly hyperbolic? < 1281292997 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does Epigram 2 have the cool syntax of Epigram 1? < 1281293004 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Literate Haskell is just a fake kind of literate programming! < 1281293007 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Not yet. < 1281293010 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1281293013 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Who knows what it will look like? < 1281293028 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: O, so you agree? How is it terribly hyperbolic, though? < 1281293033 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: In 2005 they were scribbling on whiteboards. In recent years they've been redesigning the entire thing then finding out it's broken a few times. < 1281293038 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now they're actually writing the start of some code. < 1281293041 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not a fast project. < 1281293061 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, so the Epitome isn't so massive as to be totally unreadable? < 1281293065 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@j-241.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1281293075 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I agree because it can't do rearranging; but it's hyperbolic because in Haskell, this doesn't matter: functions are always very small, and they can access the state of other ones in the correct monads, so you just separate into functions instead of the <>. < 1281293102 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: If you can handle tons of fun symbols where ASCII would go in real source code, and have an excellent ability to distinguish actual type theory from Conor's jokes, then it should be fine. < 1281293108 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.e-pig.org/darcs/Pig09/src/Epitome.pdf < 1281293112 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Ah, yes, OK. < 1281293113 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It isn't that long because, indeed, they haven't got very far. < 1281293142 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, so it isn't actually real code? < 1281293166 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It is. < 1281293174 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's just preprocessed to make it all pretty with symbols and shit. < 1281293186 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1281293205 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fun symbols are not used enough in code. < 1281293224 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, a lot of these don't even exist in Unicode, I think. :-) < 1281293231 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to find a pdf reader < 1281293251 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, Unicode has EVERYTHING, doesn't it? < 1281293259 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Nope. < 1281293265 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Not quite everything. < 1281293266 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ehird@dinky ~]$ ./src/battery < 1281293266 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5% (.22 hours remaining) < 1281293267 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh-oh. < 1281293270 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A large subset of everything? < 1281293276 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Nope. < 1281293285 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it is possible to add stuff in some sections meant for that purpose < 1281293298 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A small subset of everything and a billion Chinese characters? < 1281293352 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I seem to recall Unicode can encode all *currently spoken* natural languages by now. < 1281293368 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But MATHEMATICS? < 1281293375 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, all currently spoken, *spoken* natural languages, with an orthography. < 1281293401 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a decent number of historical scripts as well. < 1281293406 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By no means complete though. < 1281293427 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, of course, its encoding of Chinese script is very much incomplete. < 1281293493 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gets the vast majority of CJK glyphs currently used, at least. < 1281293536 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though it inexplicably doesn't encode "Biáng biáng noodles". < 1281293693 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okayyy, I sure hope there is a good PDF reader in existence that isn't Evince. < 1281293696 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Evince depends on GNOME.) < 1281293718 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: What do you read PDFs with? < 1281293781 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Currently, xpdf. < 1281293787 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would love a better PDF reader. < 1281293788 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ew. < 1281293803 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Evince is really nice if you can handle the GNOME dependencies; really really nice. < 1281293818 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You might like zathura: https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=80458 < 1281293836 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't because I'm a bit of a mouse weenie. < 1281293882 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My perfect PDF reader: Continuous view, scroll bar for the whole PDF. Resizing the window scales the PDF to fit the width. /Maybe/ some way to show the page number. < 1281293895 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Write one. < 1281293921 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay. < 1281293926 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I need to figure out poppler and GTK. < 1281293935 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yuh. < 1281293941 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(thank God for poppler) < 1281293970 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I shall christen it... pew. For "Pdf viEW"? Maybe? < 1281294053 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Okay, I'd better install an editor then! < 1281294060 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All I have is XFCE's mousepad (which is a nice notepad replacement, btw.) < 1281294073 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have fun reflowing PDFs. < 1281294085 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Scaling != reflowing < 1281294093 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scaling = zoom < 1281294103 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that. < 1281294110 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, OK, I misinterpreted the goals then. < 1281294119 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Mind you, I'd /love/ to be able to reflow PDFs. < 1281294123 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Y'know what there's a horrible lack of? Nice keyboard-based GUIs. < 1281294144 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: There is, but this PDF reader won't fill that gap, seeing as it'll have, uh, no controls. < 1281294159 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might have /one/ control: to show the page # information. < 1281294180 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See, I prefer graphics over a console. Unfortunately, the only things with keyboard-based interfaces are on a terminal for the most part... < 1281294191 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, also search. < 1281294195 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Search will just be /foo. < 1281294207 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe Ctrl+S foo. < 1281294209 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or Ctrl+F foo. < 1281294210 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who knows. < 1281294254 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION just walked into a throne room in Nethack.  < 1281294258 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, crap. < 1281294269 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A GUI IM client which can be used without a mouse would be nice, for instance. < 1281294272 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION attempts to close the door on the roomful of monsters. < 1281294296 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as would a TUI IM client at all, for that matter. I'm currently using freaking irssi via bitlbee. Bit clunky.) < 1281294307 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, look, the stairs are in it. Wonderful. < 1281294312 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: If I ever get around to making my IRC client it'll fit that definition. < 1281294324 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It /will/ have menus, but anything you're ever going to want to do will be keyboard-based. < 1281294334 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Mmkay. < 1281294342 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, occasionally I end up operating in mouse-only mode for a while. < 1281294350 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially if I'm browsing a lot. < 1281294366 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oh, and of course the main feature, which will be proper typography. < 1281294378 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Say, /actual spacing/ between the messages. Actual line spacing, for that matter. < 1281294385 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, I could just take cues from how plays are typeset, couldn't I? < 1281294391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're pretty similar to IRC. < 1281294404 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just that... Urgh. The mouse is such a piss-poor interface device for most things. < 1281294417 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree, but... with reservation. < 1281294421 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Romeo is feeling suicidal < 1281294434 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like to manage windows with my mouse -- that doesn't imply a floating manager, though. < 1281294443 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover knows about my platonically-ideal tiling mouse-based WM design. < 1281294445 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It is glorious.) < 1281294467 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, yes. A mouse is good for dealing with things that are inherently dealing with XY positions. < 1281294490 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's poorly adapted for "I want to hit the foo button, then the bar button, and then the baz option on the menu." < 1281294501 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right now I can manage all my windows with just a three-button mouse and the alt key. (Alt+left to move, Alt+middle to group in tabs iwth another window, Alt+right to resize, double click title bar to maximise, middle click title bar to close, right click title bar to hide, alt+right click title bar to bring up menu) < 1281294521 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(This is, incidentally, the nicest WM workflow I've come across yet. At least until I make that tiling WM.) < 1281294534 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A keyboard is *better* for such things, though perhaps a bit sub-par. < 1281294547 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better for what I said or for what you said? < 1281294553 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For what I said. < 1281294575 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mm. For what I said, wrt the clicks, you'd think so, but actually the instinctual action kicks in. Like the Plan 9 guys say, the keyboard is a lot more think-y, whereas the mouse is a lot more do-y. < 1281294602 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(optimal would be something with an entirely-software-driven tactical interface. Physical buttons being made as the software needs it, for instance.) < 1281294607 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So even for closing windows, etc., I find the mouse more efficient (even though if you "self-timed" yourself in your head it'd probably seem slower since the keyboard is occupying brain CPU time, whereas the mouse is "boring" instinctual work) < 1281294611 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes; very yes. < 1281294624 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Although any position where you can touch your screen is awkward with a typical screen. < 1281294630 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you read Stanislav's The Glove Box? < 1281294641 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.loper-os.org/?p=35 < 1281294643 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never said anything about it being the normal display screen. < 1281294646 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1281294655 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Glove Box is a 3D, tactile display. < 1281294656 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Think about something like a keyboard, except the buttons come in and out as the software demands. < 1281294669 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or a 3D tactile display. :P < 1281294680 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suggest reading the post; it even mentions how you could do such a "display". < 1281294683 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and of course, you get a normal keyboard for text input) < 1281294710 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno, I bet I could invent hand movements that represent letters/words more efficient than a keyboard. < 1281294711 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look at sign language. < 1281294719 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With the Glove Box, that would be easy to implement. < 1281294786 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: I was imagining just a mere keyboard-thing with software-defined buttons. < 1281294797 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With the Glove Box, you've got much more room for input design. < 1281294799 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You mean the Optimus thing? XD < 1281294808 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Optimus Maximus < 1281294810 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.artlebedev.com/everything/optimus/ < 1281294817 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: No, no, no. The buttons do not exist until the software requires them. < 1281294821 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only $2,400! < 1281294824 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And they exist in the shape so asked for. < 1281294838 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This would be, ah, *hard*. < 1281294844 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Glove Box is amusingly a bit easier. :P < 1281294862 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(add-hook 'c-mode-hook (lambda () < 1281294862 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (c-set-style "linux") < 1281294862 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (setq tab-width 4) < 1281294862 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (setq c-basic-offset 4))) < 1281294866 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Time to code. < 1281294921 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"There is currently very little documentation." --poppler < 1281294923 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION cries < 1281294929 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Glib: Documentation is in the release under glib/reference/html/ < 1281294931 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh fuuuck you. < 1281294988 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Glib" is another good name for software. < 1281294997 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A good name for awful software. < 1281295022 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Glib <=> Object-oriented C? < 1281295047 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ePDFView may be good; Evince sans GNOME. < 1281295051 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Plus other crap base don that, yes. < 1281295052 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*based on < 1281295063 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not just OOP C; GObject, the worst possible incarnation of it. < 1281295072 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It's in emerge. < 1281295115 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281295121 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't support proper continuous mode though. Sigh. < 1281295220 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: "index.sgml" --poppler source tree < 1281295228 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is actually SGML; I am not fucking with you. < 1281295241 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1281295241 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1281295241 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1281295241 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1281295254 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... *It is actually straight SGML*. My God. < 1281295278 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's wrong with straight SGML? < 1281295287 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, pew will be written in either Vala or Genie. < 1281295304 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since I have to deal with Glib and GTK+. < 1281295352 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, if you're using GTK+ you may as well retain sanity. < 1281295422 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Genie is great, have I mentioned that? It's a compiled-almost-straight-down-to-C-plus-GObject language with Pythonesque syntax (but without stupid colons) and with proper lambdas (they can contain statements)... < 1281295460 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is it with Python's crippled lambdas, by the way? < 1281295531 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GvR is retarded. < 1281295551 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mm... popplers < 1281295572 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My competing PDF library will be called "tribble". < 1281295585 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, that's an indirect reference. Can we get some three-star referencers in here? < 1281295640 0 :bsmntbombdood_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281295658 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: This: http://sprunge.us/cKiP compiles to this: http://sprunge.us/feLC < 1281295756 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you configure the browser XChat uses? < 1281295814 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Nice. < 1281295846 0 :AnMaster!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1281296097 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, apart from the above mentioned pano today I have this one: http://mewtwo.sporksirc.net/~anmaster/images/gothenburg2010/tjol__oe__holm_2.jpg < 1281296108 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my good camera, but some parallax < 1281296121 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :less in the preview, it really selected bad seams < 1281296168 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have a few more, not sure if I will do them now or later < 1281296232 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1281296307 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You killed fungot < 1281296308 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1281296356 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1281296384 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't < 1281296396 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A best kind of PDF view is, displays nothing except status bar (which shows page number and filename, and numeric prefix to commands), and the page view. < 1281296405 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, s/A/The/ ? < 1281296413 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then, "v" switch view to normal document view or bookmarks view, "p" to print document, "s" to search, "S" for document status, "d" to change display settings, "return" to go to page by numeric prefix, "t" to convert to text, < 1281296416 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"a" to adjust settings of document in memory, "C" to adjust command-line flags, < 1281296435 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No interactive or animation or whatever < 1281296444 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(unless enabled by command-line flags) < 1281296459 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, as far as I know pdf isn't interactive in any way? < 1281296470 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you can make links, so you can click on "see figure 4.2" < 1281296470 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, document security settings is ignored unless told in command-line flags to be standards-compliant < 1281296473 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is rather useful < 1281296489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also a way to jump back to where you were before following the link in many readers < 1281296523 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1281296534 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, all pdf readers except xpdf on linux has an option to ignore those, most ignore them by default < 1281296535 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And each of three mouse-buttons different function, also depending on single-click/double-click, shift key held down or not, etc < 1281296536 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so nothing new there < 1281296541 0 :bsmntbombdood_!~gavin@97-124-206-72.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281296555 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, all I know about that is < 1281296581 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if you have links and a way to jump back like that, then also have, "b" to go back, and "k" to follow a fake link that points to the current location (so that you can navigate manually and then push "b" to go back) < 1281296582 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I suppose someone knows why the Haskell logo is based on the bind operator. <-- i am pretty sure there was a contest. the previous one was a hodgepodge of lambdas and other symbols < 1281296604 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Unfortunately, it appears that there is no genie-mode. < 1281296639 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what is the context? < 1281296654 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, everything is awfully slow on this wlan, so "check logs" is extremely unhelpful < 1281296657 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: :( < 1281296671 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact everything but upload speed, very strange < 1281296671 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: There, is these things OK now in your opinion? < 1281296686 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Haskell_logos < 1281296686 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: things. < 1281296689 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's a language thing. < 1281296711 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, you said no interactive, do you include having clickable (or otherwise followable) links in that category? < 1281296733 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: No, followable internal links don't count as interactive in this case < 1281296743 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, right < 1281296759 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Left-click selects text or objects, left-double-click follows internal link, middle-click scrolls, right-click to drag to draw a zoom box) < 1281296774 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, I still suspect I will just continue to use evince, but your one sounds like a usable minimalistic alternative then < 1281296775 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And right-double-click zooms out) < 1281296814 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, the haskellwiki itself hasn't had the logo updated :| < 1281296820 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, for following internal links, having a browser like history for them is really helpful, especially when the link is to some page 400 pages away and then you need to go back < 1281296842 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PDFs can also sometimes send a message to a server by internet every time you view it, my PDF viewer also would not do such a thing unless you enable standards-compliant mode < 1281296854 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, I really like that feature of okular < 1281296859 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :evince doesn't have it < 1281296862 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :afaik < 1281296866 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, you push "b" to go back, that is the history! And then, possibly, "B" for list of history. < 1281296870 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1281296899 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where's ais523 when you need him < 1281296955 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, since the pdfs I read mostly fall into the category of standards with 400+ pages and lots of cross references... it is extremely useful < 1281297047 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, of course, that is why, that you would be able to use these kind of function, and PDF bookmarks menu, for these purpose. < 1281297059 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: WTF? TAB in Fundamental mode is sometimes inserting spaces. < 1281297064 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tab-width is 8 < 1281297067 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indent-tabs-mode is t < 1281297104 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, and what is indention width < 1281297112 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no such thing in fundamental < 1281297114 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*indentation, also. < 1281297117 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1281297125 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is why i'm so confused < 1281297225 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1281297239 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, maybe you misunderstood and there is such a thing in that mode? < 1281297256 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, or does it insert them up to the next tab stop? < 1281297262 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with that being 8? < 1281297281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is there any pattern behind when it happens? < 1281297285 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ctrl+V TAB even inserts 4 spcaes! < 1281297286 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*spaces < 1281297287 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT. < 1281297294 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, if there is something in the tabs before < 1281297295 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at column 0 < 1281297299 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like: abc < 1281297303 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1281297305 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ctrl+v doesn't do that heh < 1281297307 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, okay *that* is confusing < 1281297311 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's C-q < 1281297315 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which works < 1281297316 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C-q TAB works < 1281297320 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TAB in col 0 inserts 4 spaces < 1281297347 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm C-v is scroll-up < 1281298167 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Bleh, This Is Hard. < 1281298228 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then, change the setting if you do not like it like that < 1281298272 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I can't figure out why it's doing it. < 1281298357 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You could try mupdf. < 1281298362 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://mupdf.com/ < 1281298379 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It may not be able to search for text, but by golly, it's the most precise and accurate PDF rendering you'll find! < 1281298385 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it /is/ entirely keyboard-based. :P < 1281298533 0 :alise_!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281298534 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1281298538 0 :alise_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It ... froze ... < 1281298539 0 :alise_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :alise < 1281298543 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MuPDF was so accurate it froze my system. < 1281298582 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it brought the system down to 0 entropy, thus 0 kelvin < 1281298661 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has developed an Evil Plan < 1281298672 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a language more naziesque than agda *and* eiffel < 1281298689 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :design by contract proofs < 1281298693 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1281298738 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can see why Eiffel -> Nazi, but why Agda? < 1281298753 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. < 1281298756 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a language more naziesque than ada *and* eiffel < 1281298763 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry. :P < 1281298841 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how boring < 1281298849 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So a type system that would make God himself cry? < 1281298852 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well, Ada and Eiffel are more naziesque than Agda < 1281298857 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the statement is stronger < 1281298874 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a > b /\ a > c) = (a > max(b,c)) ofc. < 1281298909 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only if Ada is Nazier than Eiffel. < 1281298930 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :True. < 1281299002 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about values start in a type, and *stay* there? < 1281299012 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1281299017 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :None of this "Char → Int" stuff! < 1281299026 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Functions are all a->a! < 1281299031 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a > b /\ a > c) = (a > b \/ c) < 1281299036 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION cackles evilly < 1281299063 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm wait that is true for >=, not > < 1281299085 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because technically max(b,c) itself could be > b and > c < 1281299121 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, b \/ c < 1281299143 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :max might imply it's one of them < 1281299176 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :max(a,b) is definitely either a or b :P < 1281299204 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it exists < 1281299243 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, nazi orders _should_ be total, come to think of it < 1281299271 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, which is Nazier? Ada or Eiffel? < 1281299275 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ada < 1281299324 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Examples of Nazi typing? < 1281299410 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :procedure Maximum(A : Integer, B : Integer) -> Integer; < 1281299410 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : MuPDF was so accurate it froze my system. <-- um, how? < 1281299410 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : result Result; < 1281299410 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does; < 1281299410 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if A > B; < 1281299410 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Result := A; < 1281299410 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : else; --{ Thus B > A } < 1281299412 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Result := B; < 1281299414 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : end if; < 1281299416 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :end Maximum; < 1281299420 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Note that return parameters can have "tags". < 1281299425 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, swap trash or 100% cpu resources? Or kernel bug < 1281299430 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance, the functions that do console IO will return with the tag [Performs_IO]. < 1281299433 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or X freezing? < 1281299435 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All functions that use them will also have this tag. < 1281299440 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ah, I remember that from my Pascal days. < 1281299444 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stupid as hell. < 1281299446 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No... < 1281299448 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'm inventing this. < 1281299462 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can call a function with the expectation that it will not perform console IO because it does not have the [Performs_IO] tag. < 1281299465 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tada! < 1281299483 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I mean the need for a named variable for return values. < 1281299503 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, that code looks very much like a cross between pascal and VHDL to me < 1281299516 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, also the := < 1281299525 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it would call it function not procedure < 1281299534 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since procedure is a function returning nothing < 1281299536 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in pascal < 1281299551 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION had an idea for a weird module system with only "export". < 1281299560 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to think of a suitably ludicrous contract for Maximum < 1281299563 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is unable to think of one < 1281299563 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm? what's so strange with that < 1281299576 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, you can use fully qualified name, in fact you do in many module systems < 1281299586 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha, I made an error in my comments! < 1281299587 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because there's no statement to import a module. < 1281299615 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you want to have the stuff in foo in bar, you need to but "export to bar" in foo. < 1281299628 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well, there isn't in erlang either. You can import functions from modules, meaning you use bar() instead of foo:bar() < 1281299633 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, but that is it < 1281299644 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, you misunderstand me. < 1281299668 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, oh like C++ "friend" stuff < 1281299687 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION carefully avoids C++ < 1281299709 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, so do I to the extent that it is possible < 1281299714 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :university and so on < 1281299734 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was some course using C++ this autumn iirc < 1281299756 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :been C and python so far. Oh and VHDL and SQL but those are not general purpose < 1281299954 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I present to you: Naked Zit (NaZi for short), the programming language. < 1281299954 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sprunge.us/KXHO < 1281299962 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maximum, Minimum, and a relation between the two. < 1281299988 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note: The three spaces used for indentation are SOLELY for show; real code is always indented with tabs, the most reliable indentation character. Editors will display these as three spaces. < 1281300006 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is an error in this code. < 1281300008 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you spot it? < 1281300019 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, that editors would display it as 3 spaces < 1281300029 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could be anything :P < 1281300037 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :personally I prefer to have it equal 4 < 1281300055 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it is specified in the standard. < 1281300072 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now find the real error. < 1281300100 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is made especially easy by NaZi's clear syntax and precise specification. < 1281300108 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, tl;dr < 1281300128 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: If you can't handle Maximum and Minimum, how will you *ever* handle writing enterprise-grade systems in it?! < 1281300149 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, "it" is not clear in the last sentence I said. I hereby replace "it" with "NaZi". < 1281300152 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiler error. < 1281300156 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Syntactical style not obeyed. < 1281300160 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, tl;dr because Idon < 1281300170 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't plan to figure out that language < 1281300176 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm half asleep anyway < 1281300183 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and finally I'm busy doing other stuff on the side < 1281300192 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do you need to declare A and B twice? < 1281300206 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The second time is in the contract. < 1281300228 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is the contract for? < 1281300228 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Which is abstract behaviour disconnected from the implementation. < 1281300241 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The contract specifies behaviour about the function. It is checked every time the function is called in debug mode. < 1281300244 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is standard from Eiffel. < 1281300274 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But... why do you need to say that A and B are integers *twice*? < 1281300280 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not just prove that contract statically? < 1281300288 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: There are two A and Bs. < 1281300302 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The A and B in the contract specify abstract variables, like a "for all" quantification. < 1281300312 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The A and B in the procedure declaration represent the specific A and B passed to the call. < 1281300334 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, that's flawed, but who cares, it's nazi. < 1281300338 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spotted the error yet?! < 1281300376 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it states Maximum /= Minimum. < 1281300381 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is obviously false. < 1281300390 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does not state that. < 1281300397 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Procedures are not values, and /= is not a defined relation. < 1281300420 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maximum(A, B) =/= Minimum(A, B) is obviously false, then < 1281300425 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prove it. < 1281300474 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maximum(3, 3) = Minimum(3, 3) < 1281300502 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You win a prize! That prize is the corrected version made before I even asked: http://sprunge.us/GPWD < 1281300512 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This includes a never-seen-before language feature: contract conditions! < 1281300534 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, make it require a proof of the contract. < 1281300542 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An *explicit* proof < 1281300550 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No! You might prove the WRONG THING. < 1281300569 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prove that you prove the right thing, then. < 1281300601 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO < 1281300608 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WE HAVE ALWAYS BEEN AT WAR WITH COQASIA < 1281300620 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Coqasians, noted for their white skin, are EVIL INCARNATE. < 1281300623 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I maed pun) < 1281300630 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, no, none of those *POLYMORPHIC* things! < 1281300658 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dependent types are obviously the work of the allies! < 1281300678 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:21:50 Phantom_Hoover: alise has this thing < 1281300679 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:21:56 jokes about "monad" and "nomad" < 1281300681 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*/prog/ has this thing < 1281300688 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Absolutely. No polymorphism. < 1281300693 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They can't even handle tagged types. < 1281300704 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: */prog/? < 1281300704 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We'll make our OWN proof checker! < 1281300788 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: nomad is /prog/'s "joke", not mine < 1281300798 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont know what /prog/ is < 1281300803 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it might as well be your joke < 1281300806 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here at least < 1281300809 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4chan? < 1281300814 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dis.4chan.org/prog/; I recommend not visiting, since it's turned to complete and utter shit. < 1281300816 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1281300820 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wont be visiting at all < 1281300824 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, almost; a text board. < 1281300924 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I should write a Roguelike. < 1281300951 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, Elite: the Roguelike! < 1281300954 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It must be done! < 1281300981 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No! < 1281300993 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Space Invaders: The Roguelike < 1281301003 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elite! < 1281301072 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elite Invaders! < 1281301091 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's easy enough. < 1281301144 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone's probably done it in Oolite by now. < 1281301152 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oolite? < 1281301160 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, some souped-up Elite clone. < 1281301172 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. < 1281301216 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For some reason my GPU hangs when I try to play it since I installed Lucid.. < 1281301325 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Eben Moglen on LLVM: "Nobody has ever tried before, to build a multi-platform C compiler solely in order to undermine freedom" < 1281301329 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*freedom. < 1281301333 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Extra ". < 1281301346 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hahahahahaha. < 1281301368 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LLVM is free, isn't it? < 1281301369 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I suggest you use Alise Linux instead! < 1281301371 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*alise < 1281301379 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is my ridiculous name for Arch + my desktop stuff. < 1281301389 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's BSD! EVIL EVIL BSD. < 1281301394 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They use a DEMON as their logo. < 1281301395 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GPL 4eva < 1281301414 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a driver issue, so I suspect getting a new computer is the best course of action. < 1281301452 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARCH HAS ALL THE DRIVERS < 1281301455 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What card? < 1281301464 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not have a card. < 1281301479 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Onboard video? < 1281301483 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What brand? Intel? < 1281301483 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a bit of cardboard with some lines and an Intel logo drawn on it stuck to my motherboard. < 1281301497 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Intel video on Arch is pretty snazzy here... < 1281301566 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It only actually crashes in some circumstances. < 1281301605 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "Eben Moglen on LLVM: "Nobody has ever tried before, to build a multi-platform C compiler solely in order to undermine freedom" < 1281301609 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that a joke? < 1281301612 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: nope. < 1281301612 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and who is that guy < 1281301621 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Software Freedom Law Centre guy, FSF lawyer < 1281301623 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a retard obviously, unless I missed something HUGE < 1281301627 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you didn't < 1281301641 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he thinks Steve Jobs piling money into LLVM is evil because it's to stop the gpl < 1281301643 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and thus is against freedom < 1281301651 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, LLVM is BSD right? < 1281301654 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BSD-2? < 1281301658 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1281301662 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :again, FSF guy < 1281301672 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even rms isn't that crazy :) < 1281301719 0 :bsmntbombdood_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1281301744 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, people could use it and not give back to the community. While there are some good points in that, you have to see both sides of it. However it should be up to each author if he wants other to be able to build stuff on his code without opening it up to everyone. < 1281301759 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems to come down to patents... < 1281301759 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yeah he is retarded < 1281301764 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm... < 1281301768 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: no < 1281301784 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah I don't see issues with GPL, nor with BSD-2 < 1281301786 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from another time: < 1281301787 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Moglen explained how Apple’s use of LLVM as an alternative compiler to the GCC represented a threat to the movement. If I followed correctly, this is due to the fact that LLVM has a more permissive, “BSD-style” license." < 1281301803 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depeneds on what project and what you want others to be able to do with your code < 1281301826 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, yes that one makes no sense < 1281301826 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is getting that from reddit comments and the guy's speech < 1281302276 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't use BSD-style licenses in my own programs (unless I am making modifications of a program that is already BSD-licensed). I mostly prefer GNU GPL, but for some programs I just make it public domain. < 1281302427 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not the worst point ever, I strongly suspect that the GPL is waaaaay up there in the reasons why Apple is so interested in clang and LLVM. Still, everybody else benefits too, so who cares :P < 1281302430 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there any command in TeX to tell it to ignore the outerness of commands? < 1281302440 0 :derdon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1281302452 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ... outerness? < 1281302456 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: GPL3, yes; they were fine with GPL2. < 1281302468 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: They started pouring more and more money into LLVM when gcc switched to GPLv3, which Apple wouldn't bundle. < 1281302471 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Like, if a word is defined with \outer < 1281302475 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yeah, calling LLVM a /thread to freedom/ is just... what. < 1281302533 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, threat* < 1281302542 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, thread to freedom sounds like it means the opposite < 1281302550 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1281302570 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to decide between two Arch font rendering packages. < 1281302587 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, it also sounds like a metaphor that was initially delivered way past it's breaking point < 1281302601 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Metaphors are like babies ... you deliver them < 1281302609 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you eat them. < 1281302619 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you get carried away with them. < 1281302634 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, indeed I extended that metaphor of "extending a metaphor past it's breaking point" past it's breaking point < 1281302641 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, alise, that was a simile. < 1281302664 0 :bsmntbombdood_!~gavin@97-124-206-72.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281302670 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, was that a meta joke? < 1281302686 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Similies are a new dawn. < 1281302697 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shakes his fist :P < 1281302697 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are the brightest girder in the pile of tacks. < 1281302708 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Welp, looks like I've finally gone insane < 1281302712 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Metaphors are like babies, similes are a new dawn. < 1281302720 0 :alise_!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281302727 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what you're saying / but this has to rhyme with scorn. < 1281302735 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WE ARE ALL INSANITY! < 1281302751 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well put. < 1281302755 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Do not worry, it is good things in some contexts, i.e.) < 1281302756 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Gregor: Similies are a new dawn. <-- wait, is that a reference to that auto-tuned carl sagan thingy? < 1281302760 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is impressed with mupdf already < 1281302772 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We are insanity! I got all my esolangers with me! < 1281302775 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: But it can't even search! < 1281302775 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mupdf: PDFs for muppets. < 1281302778 0 :alise_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1281302779 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or am I just too paranoid... < 1281302784 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: No. < 1281302785 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Nor can xpdf. :P < 1281302785 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Paranoid. < 1281302788 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Really? < 1281302792 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, right < 1281302793 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Really. < 1281302799 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: MuPDF is primarily designed for accurate reproduction of the printed result, anyway. < 1281302810 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, besides now I got an urge to listen for it, but I really want to play nwn for a bit. argh < 1281302813 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shall check it out < 1281302850 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Check what out? < 1281302891 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instead of using \outer I just changed yesweb so that any initializations like \newcount and so on go on a like with \init before \start (the "\in" at the beginning is significant, due to how yesweb works) < 1281302895 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: MuPDF's actual PDF rendering. < 1281302930 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, that video... it seems that guy made more auto tuned ones from cosoms < 1281302936 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least based on google search < 1281302947 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have yet to check that other one out < 1281302961 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It calculates to a precision of fractions of a pixel. < 1281302971 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Especially text metrics: < 1281302972 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The renderer in MuPDF is tailored for high quality anti-aliased graphics. It renders text with metrics and spacing accurate to within fractions of a pixel for the highest fidelity in reproducing the look of a printed page on screen." < 1281302993 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unfortunately, its UI is... lacking. < 1281303012 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb, testing something < 1281303022 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281303035 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281303051 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see if my eyes can adjust to this particular blend of subpixel antialiasing. < 1281303068 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because dammit, I need higher fidelity fonts. < 1281303089 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: I'm actually not minding its UI, except for lack of features. < 1281303097 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scrolling is... painful. < 1281303102 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In the part before \start, the "n" is a comment character and \i is defined to do nothing) < 1281303106 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The tragedy of Libertine and Biolinium is that freetype can't fucking render them properly! < 1281303111 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With any settings! < 1281303122 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: I've mostly used Libertine in TeX for that reason. < 1281303148 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: BTW, MuPDF also offers a *library*. < 1281303189 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it does. < 1281303202 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it'll be significantly easier to use than poppler, however, and the fidelity is mostly a pedantic conern. < 1281303211 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aaargh freetype doesn't render "fi" as a ligature < 1281303348 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281303361 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281303362 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"fi" should not be rendered as a ligature in monospace text. (2600 does render "fi" as a ligature even in monospaced text, and that is a bad idea.) < 1281303369 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not monospaced text. < 1281303377 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2600? The magazine? < 1281303382 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Yes. < 1281303389 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Okay, how come freetype does "Qu" but not "fi"? < 1281303389 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do mean the magazine. < 1281303399 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it sort of does "fi". Sort of. < 1281303427 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: BTW, have you ever tried ROX-Filer? < 1281303437 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It's like file managers, done right. In fact, it's not like that, it IS that. < 1281303498 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: No, my idea for file manager is more better (at least in my opinion) < 1281303509 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see what kind of spells/powers my D&D character has: < 1281303545 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prestidigitation; Read Magic; Enlarge Person; Silent Image; Comprehend Languages; Summon Spider I; Locate Object; Hold Portal; Expeditious Retreat; Remove Hand; Object Mirrored; < 1281303570 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Summon Rope of Spidersilk: Azore's Speaking Tome; Mirror Surface; Create Water; Amanuensis; Stick; < 1281303608 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Well, I wasn't referring to your opinion of file managers; I was referring to mine. < 1281303622 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think your idea is worse, at least for my usage. < 1281303665 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Detect Psionics; Inertial Armor; My Light; Far Hand; Vigor; Touch of Health; Control Sound; Concealing Amorpha; Tongues; Levitate; Dispel Psionics; Detect Hostile Intent; Mass Missive; Control Light; Trace Teleport; Dimension Door; Major Creation; Object Reading; Time Hop; Make Food, Restore Extremity; Eidetic Lock; ..... < 1281303676 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: OK, that can be your opinion, is OK < 1281303748 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which spells/powers do you dislike? < 1281303752 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: urxvt sucks at font spacing. < 1281303890 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hereby recommend uxterm in its place ... < 1281304021 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281304412 0 :benuphoenix!~benuphoen@ool-182e6881.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281304419 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[One expression I sometimes hear in motion pictures is the following: "I'm screwed". The character will pronounce these words when he suddenly realizes some problem that affects him cannot be solved. I looked in wiktionary.org for the verb to screw and the two definitions (acepciones in Spanish) closer in sense to what I think the verb means in the context of the above said expression are 2 and 3. < 1281304419 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm almost certain it is a very rude expression. And wiktionary def.2 seems to confirm this. But I do now understand quite well def.3, especially when it says "screw follows fuck". However, I just have read a post in a very serious computer forum where somebody titles his post "Color prompt screws bash". I do not think the moderators there would allow it if it had sexual connotations.]] < 1281304429 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Funniest thing I've read all day ^ < 1281304457 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha < 1281304493 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(President Skroob is totally a pun) < 1281304608 0 :fizzie!~fis@2001:1bc8:102:587b:230:18ff:fea9:6f01 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281304667 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: there appears to be a fungot shortage < 1281304688 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Yes, we lost them electricities for about two hours. < 1281304751 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Sometimes I have trouble believing this is a city.) < 1281304790 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was apparently a blackout in trondheim the other day. not here though. < 1281304825 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was a pretty localized break, something like ten times 5 city blocks (it's a bit hard to be sure, this is not a very grid-like layout). < 1281304833 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it affected the center of town, including the main hospital) < 1281304868 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was a reasonably strong storm here; we of course walked right through the rain and lightning, since we were at a (graduation) party of two friends from the university, and had to get home. < 1281304908 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, the fungot laptop/server hybrid isn't speaking to me. < 1281304916 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well then, obviously the lightning used up all the electricity. < 1281304936 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was in the room not long ago, and the GRUB boot menu was showing up okay. < 1281304951 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There were a dozen kernels to pick from, though, and I have no clue whether I selected the right one. Possibly not. < 1281304984 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds like an idea for steganography < 1281305014 0 :benuphoenix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually, I pick the newest one < 1281305096 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They all had the same version, just different suffixes related to different adventurous voyages in virtualization-land. < 1281305103 0 :benuphoenix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :steganography? find the hidden message: asdfghjkl < 1281305124 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1281305125 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The one I picked (the highlighted one, I think it's with grub's savedefault so it should be good) apparently wasn't the right one, based on a kernel panic it had gotten into. < 1281305133 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps this one will fare better. < 1281305145 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least it answers to SSH, which is a good sign. < 1281305154 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That system is in a serious need of cleaning up.) < 1281305183 0 :benuphoenix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dont use xen or uml kernels < 1281305231 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It used to run Xen, but they completely dropped support for non-PAE processors, and that thing has the 1.5 GHz single Pentium M model that doesn't do PAE at all. < 1281305244 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UML I've ran elsewhere, but not on that thing. < 1281305260 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Currently it was a choice between kernels with openvz, vserver, or both, in the name. < 1281305268 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Apparently "both" was a working alternative.) < 1281305314 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umlpenvxenver < 1281305341 0 :benuphoenix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happened to vmlinuz? < 1281305391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ mupdf libertine.pdf < 1281305391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :detected cpu features: mmx mmxext sse sse2 < 1281305391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ximage: mode 24/32 00ff0000 0000ff00 000000ff (16,8,0) lsb < 1281305391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ximage: ARGB8888 to BGRA8888 < 1281305391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ximage: XShmPutImage < 1281305398 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: World's most advanced PDF renderer. < 1281305412 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Hah. < 1281305480 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell take 100$List.nubBy(((>1).).gcd)[2..] < 1281305494 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[2,3,5,7,11,13,17,19,23,29,31,37,41,43,47,53,59,61,67,71,73,79,83,89,97,101,103,107,109,113,127,131,137,139,149,151,157,163,167,173,179,181,191,193,197,199,211,223,227,229,233,239,241,251,257,263,269,271,277,281,283,293,307,311,313,317,331,337,347,349,353,359,367,373,379,383,389,397,401,409,419,421,431,433,439,443,449,457,461,463,467,479,487,491,499,503,509,521,523,541] < 1281305682 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: So, do you think I should write my PDF reader using MuPDF? < 1281305691 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: jumpin' jumpin' < 1281305693 0 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1281305695 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Sure. < 1281305700 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Quit" looks so elegant in this font. < 1281305711 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also those reverses, I really need to fix 'em. < 1281305734 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1281305738 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: < 1281305742 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://mupdf.com/repos/mupdf/mupdf/ < 1281305745 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://mupdf.com/repos/mupdf/apps/ < 1281305750 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Worlds most advanced PDF viewer's C code. < 1281305783 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://mupdf.com/repos/mupdf/fitz/ Some geometry thing it uses. < 1281305788 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://mupdf.com/repos/mupdf/draw/ Drawing library... < 1281305807 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whole thing: http://mupdf.com/repos/mupdf/ < 1281305825 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281305892 0 :benuphoenix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does that haskell line work? i'd love to try in it c < 1281305916 0 :benuphoenix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/in it/it in/ < 1281305964 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Complicatedly. < 1281306038 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(((>1).).gcd) is the same as \x y -> (x `gcd` y) > 1 , it's a test for whether two numbers have a common prime factor < 1281306074 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not particularly efficient, just short < 1281306092 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(especially since x will always be a prime in this program) < 1281306159 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nubBy goes through the infinite list [2..] of all integers >= 2, throwing way all that have common factors with previous remaining elements < 1281306167 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*away < 1281306245 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's a form of eratosthenes sieve < 1281306250 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*'s < 1281306277 0 :benuphoenix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see < 1281306358 0 :benuphoenix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my programs just use the function for generating primes < 1281306405 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1281306423 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that function probably uses such a sieve underneath, if it gives primes by number < 1281306461 0 :benuphoenix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i for got what c header file it was in < 1281306512 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i'm not aware of any way of finding the nth prime without essentially testing all previous ones. although i might just not have heard of it.) < 1281306539 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/testing/going through/ < 1281306549 0 :benuphoenix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm referring to whatever the isprime() is called < 1281306555 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :benuphoenix: well that's cheating. < 1281306557 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that < 1281306587 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isprime() is less efficient than a sieve if you want to list all < 1281306594 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@92.233.174.117 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281306616 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1281306618 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it duplicates work. well i guess it could use a list of primes internally to shortcut some) < 1281306650 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Duplicates! < 1281306728 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone pinged me? < 1281306736 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pong < 1281306759 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(don't use gcd either, use mod) < 1281306795 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, sieving is fast < 1281306803 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell take 100$List.nubBy(((<1).).flip mod)[2..] < 1281306804 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[2,3,5,7,11,13,17,19,23,29,31,37,41,43,47,53,59,61,67,71,73,79,83,89,97,101,103,107,109,113,127,131,137,139,149,151,157,163,167,173,179,181,191,193,197,199,211,223,227,229,233,239,241,251,257,263,269,271,277,281,283,293,307,311,313,317,331,337,347,349,353,359,367,373,379,383,389,397,401,409,419,421,431,433,439,443,449,457,461,463,467,479,487,491,499,503,509,521,523,541] < 1281306840 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the speedup here is probably not noticable though) < 1281306899 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, when I do the LargePositiveInteger thing, I get 0 < 1281306919 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in principle one shouldn't use a linked list either, but an array for fast looping < 1281306928 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that a bit strange? c+=first_col*!!(!(c=(c+1)%(first_col+num_cols)) && r++); < 1281306933 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(LargePositiveInteger new: 3) printit -> 0 < 1281306948 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it even valid in C without undefined behavior? < 1281306960 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Erm, yeah, I pasted a long snippet. < 1281306980 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm two assignments to c < 1281306990 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: that's not defined < 1281306990 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :afaik < 1281307000 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: < 1281307001 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:23:25 b := a positive ifTrue: [LargePositiveInteger new: 4] ifFalse: [LargeNegativeInteger new: 4]. < 1281307001 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:23:30 b replaceFrom: 1 to: 4 with: a startingAt: 1. < 1281307003 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both lines are important < 1281307020 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/4/a digitLength/ to get something more general. < 1281307028 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*/g < 1281307039 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Why do UIs suck so hard? < 1281307068 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Because. What UI is specifically giving you crap? < 1281307093 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Just a general sentiment is all. < 1281307116 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does the && give a sequence point? i'm not a C expert but _maybe_ it's well-defined in that case? < 1281307116 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: O, it is not defined? Because of both assignment to |c| both at once? OK < 1281307129 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I think the && gives a sequence point < 1281307153 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i'd suggest changing it anyway :D < 1281307157 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: how's MuPDF? < 1281307160 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Yes, that is what I am doing < 1281307164 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Nice rendering. < 1281307172 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hardly any features. < 1281307175 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better than xpdf. < 1281307194 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is now easier: if(!(c=(c+1)%(first_col+num_cols)) && r++) c=first_col; < 1281307294 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: But not so good scrolling/zooming/etc. < 1281307308 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I have all of my own idea, instead, which is differently, but that is OK < 1281307380 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: True. < 1281307596 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1281307666 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: We know. :P < 1281307889 0 :gm|lap!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1281307895 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Proposal: Interrobang as the Ligature for "?!" and "!?" < 1281307904 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Imagine that in an OpenType font. Instant interrobangs! < 1281307922 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or exclagates, in the case of "!?". < 1281307960 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1281308039 0 :calamari!~calamari@ip70-162-184-205.ph.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281308118 0 :Flonk!~chatzilla@93-82-35-167.adsl.highway.telekom.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1281308331 0 :Flonk_!~chatzilla@80-123-36-193.adsl.highway.telekom.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1281308346 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281308431 0 :Flonk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1281308431 0 :Flonk_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Flonk < 1281308551 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :GreaseMonkey < 1281309561 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exclagates? < 1281309708 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: New quit message. Entering 2006 in style. < 1281310184 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1281310191 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interrobang = Interrogate + bang. < 1281310196 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exclagate = Exclamation + interrogate. < 1281310297 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that means if I exclagate you I don't bang you at all. < 1281310300 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where's the fun in that? < 1281310667 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is contemplating watching SGU when he finishes SGA < 1281310674 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Well, you'll stay on the right side of the law. < 1281310682 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Fair point. < 1281310687 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do have a friend who likes SGU, so maybe it's not so bad < 1281310694 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It's ... not great. < 1281310696 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: If the first two parts of Air are anything to go by, yes yes yes do. But get it in HD, it's filmed beautifully. < 1281310708 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OTOH, Gregor has watched ... more than me, presumably. < 1281310713 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro likes SGU. < 1281310721 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then I'm pretty sure coppro sat through the entirety of Voyager, so YMMV < 1281310726 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've watched all that have been released thusfar. < 1281310740 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's progressively turning into a cheesy soap opera. < 1281310744 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Quit < 1281310747 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It had potential, but it's just getting more stupid by the episode. < 1281310748 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thusfar: Not TECHNICALLY a word! < 1281310760 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although someone I hooked on the Stargate franchise doesn't like SGU < 1281310765 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Technically "not TECHNICALLY a word" is meaningless. < 1281310776 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then again, he also didn't like seasons 9+10 of SG-1 < 1281310781 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: The "gurl zvffrq... gjvpr" plotline that coppro told me about sounded awfully cheesy. < 1281310793 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: When did that guy whose name I forget "transcend"? < 1281310805 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought that was awfully, terribly cheesy, and missed him; he was a good character. < 1281310811 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hm? Daniel Jackson ascended twice < 1281310821 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: He came back in the next season :P < 1281310823 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the second time, not quite, I think < 1281310827 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: >_< < 1281310834 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, at one point he disappeared and somebody replaced him. < 1281310838 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Pretend that season doesn't exist. < 1281310846 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Done. < 1281310855 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: The guy who replaced him is a Scientologist whose real name is more alien than his alien name :P < 1281310862 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1281310868 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, "Corin Nemec". < 1281310869 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But then you don't get to see the many deaths of O'Neill! < 1281310897 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION double-checks his spelling < 1281310902 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I didn't even realise he was an alien. Apparently "alien" means "identical to human". < 1281310909 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He doesn't even have forehead ridges! < 1281310917 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Alien in the sense that if you moved to the US, you'd be an alien. He's human. < 1281310927 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ohhhhhhhhh. < 1281310931 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Well, more alien than that, he's not from Earth :P < 1281310933 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well that makes much more sense XD < 1281310934 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But he is human. < 1281310944 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most aliens are human < 1281310950 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've always been uncomfortable with this humans-are-everywhere thing. < 1281310962 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of the reasons why Stargate: SG-1 was good is that the aliens looked human because they WERE human, and the truly alien aliens didn't look human. < 1281310966 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SG:A ruined that. < 1281310972 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, the aliens-are-humanoid thing too. But that's to, you know, be practical to film. < 1281310974 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it backpatched a cheesy explanation. < 1281310994 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jaffa cakes < 1281310997 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LULZ < 1281311002 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw < 1281311002 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/86/Teal'c.jpg < 1281311004 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Teal'c smiling < 1281311007 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :be prepared to scream < 1281311016 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Teal'c is not a vulcan :P < 1281311025 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but he also never smiles < 1281311029 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And NOW I KNOW WHY < 1281311041 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hahaha < 1281311047 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, what was SGA's explanation? Humans evolved similarly to the ancients? Are the humans in Pegasus not actually human, but decended from ancients, or...? < 1281311068 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, he tells jokes! < 1281311079 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The problem with abandoning the "aliens are pretty similar to humans" thing is that... well, you can't really make a long-lasting TV series out of Solaris. < 1281311091 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ka6tvlewO3c < 1281311095 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Sapiens were seeded to evolve as they did by the ancients. The Wraith are half-human. < 1281311103 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: All very cheesy. < 1281311119 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: See, but that's why SG-1 was good: It had an explanation that made sense, AND didn't require crazy costumes. < 1281311137 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: But OTOH, humans are not very interesting aliens. < 1281311148 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: And indeed, they aren't the interesting aliens. < 1281311152 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: They're the slave race. < 1281311160 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Star Trek, with its "fuck it, let's just make them humanoid" attitude, produces more interesting aliens. < 1281311162 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the goa'uld are, and they're parasites so they can be played by humans! < 1281311178 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes... now try adding more aliens after you run out of plotlines. < 1281311184 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Asgard were also pretty awesome. < 1281311199 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't get me wrong, I think Stargate is probably the most sci-fi of the sci-fi franchises out there. < 1281311200 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: *BOOM* < 1281311221 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know, I'd be pretty ticked by the Asuran replicators if they didn't say "most efficient form *that they knew*" < 1281311229 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Asgard were just Greys < 1281311230 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, there are still some out there < 1281311236 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Still awesome. < 1281311238 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Greys are NOT COOL < 1281311243 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Shhhh, don't give away SG:A plots :P < 1281311248 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Norse! Greys! < 1281311260 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still, yeah. It's a concept that works well for about a reasonable show's length... < 1281311278 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a stupid fucking GCSE English essay to be done by stupid fucking tomorrow demanded by my stupid fucking ex-teacher. < 1281311279 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FML < 1281311281 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Making another *show* of it requires, well, bizarre writing hacks. < 1281311292 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(see: SGA, SGU) < 1281311316 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everyone should watch SGA "Irresistible" < 1281311319 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course a /true/ sci-fi series has an infinite budget by definition and can represent all these aliens. < 1281311319 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SG:U could have had potential ... but they went all soap-opera. < 1281311329 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Farscape? < 1281311332 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1281311336 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Sad to hear that; the one I watched was pretty cool. < 1281311353 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait, that had lots of humanoid aliens too. < 1281311354 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1281311358 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pet peeve: Why is it that sci-fi writers, when trying to give something an exotic name, simply pick the least common letters in English and then add apostrophes? < 1281311364 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, come ON. It is not fucking hard to avoid that cliche. < 1281311376 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many sci-fi writers are completely unaware of linguistics. < 1281311393 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the aliens can pronounce sounds like ours, they can pronounce a regular-ish name; if they can't, you can't give them a name like that. < 1281311406 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: But even the most idiotic sci-fi reader can see that it's a cliche! < 1281311410 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1281311422 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This, incidentally, is the thing that annoys me most about Niven. < 1281311458 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe regular-ish sounds are reserved for non-names? < 1281311463 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :His alien names are random letters and apostrophes. (well, except when he opts for not-sucky names.) < 1281311469 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Maybe no. < 1281311547 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :("Chmeee" is a solidly meh name. Speaker-to-Animals is just somewhat interesting.) < 1281311605 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd just invent a rudimentary alphabet and then specify the sounds, to be done as SFX. < 1281311671 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Fun fact: The first posted copyright-violation report was made by "Chuq Von Rospach", the first of June, 1986, on the posting of Niven's "Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex", and it was even more self-righteous than the copyright defenders are today: http://groups.google.com/group/net.comics/msg/22a6091beb0762eb < 1281311690 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I also suggest < 1281311691 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that the person involved contact Larry Niven with an apology, and see what < 1281311691 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can be done to minimize the damage." < 1281311697 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, earlier: < 1281311703 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"by < 1281311707 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :leaving the copyright notices off you have possibly put the work into the < 1281311707 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :public domain and infringed on Niven's rights to potential future earnings." <-- LOL WUT < 1281311729 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely e means that some may mistake it for being in the public domain? < 1281311739 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Npe. < 1281311741 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Nope. < 1281311780 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> >This article is not in the puiblic domain.  Mr. Crist has commiteed a crime < 1281311780 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> >by publishing it without permission. < 1281311780 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love how absolutely DISGUSTED they are. < 1281311780 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Again, I recommend seriously that all System Administrators find the < 1281311780 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :offending copy of this article and delete it from their systems. All people < 1281311781 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who made copies of the story should destroy them." < 1281311812 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1281311818 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then he quotes the anarchist cookbook in his sig < 1281311825 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely that was before how widely understood it was that you can't really remove stuff from the Internet? < 1281311856 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1281311857 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net < 1281311866 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Sorry, what was that about Farscape? < 1281311871 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You could remove things from Usenet. < 1281311878 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sysadmins, remember. < 1281311891 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But someone would surely just post it again < 1281311914 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Posts can be cancelled. etc. < 1281311942 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh and another thing ... why can't "serious" sci-fi shows just use the word "fuck" instead of coming up with shitty alien words for it? < 1281311995 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :US prudishness.