< 1271635535 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"END < 1271635536 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like BAD, but worse. The interpreter terminated, either as a result of Mycology realizing that the interpreter doesn’t support something required in a future test, or as a result of the interpreter crashing." How, exactly, is Mycology able to detect the interpreter crashing? < 1271635576 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps a wrapper shell script? Dunno. < 1271635578 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1271635582 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's just how he reported the results. < 1271635586 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not what Mycology /says/. < 1271635859 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I make a t for LiveFunge-98, will anyone be angry? < 1271635974 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1271635997 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Concurrent Befunge-93! < 1271636054 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are no Befunge jobs, silly :-P < 1271636121 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you said -98 < 1271636154 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION meant -93
< 1271636155 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.> < 1271636232 0 :Tritonio_GR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1271636274 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1271636327 0 :Asztal!~asztal@host86-169-5-190.range86-169.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1271637006 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION misreads Church's Thesis as "Chuck's Thesis"
< 1271637106 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Rugxulo < 1271637144 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1271637157 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1271637481 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1271638207 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271638773 0 :alise!~alise@212.183.140.38 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271638776 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/summary?doi=10.1.1.39.4193 < 1271638777 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is GOLD < 1271638781 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/summary?doi=10.1.1.39.4193 | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1271638785 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone please remind me of it next week < 1271638856 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Note that here we make an essential use of the universes hierarchy: There is not a unique CAT , < 1271638857 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a family of CATi , and each CATi is a Categoryj for i < j . Thus we do not have \small" < 1271638857 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and \large" categories, but \relatively small" categories. Thus the construction of CAT above is < 1271638857 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :consistent with the analysis by Coquand 4] of paradoxes related to the category of categories. < 1271638859 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :amazing < 1271638867 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i gotta go now < 1271638870 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it's time again < 1271638888 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye alise < 1271638901 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see you guyayayz < 1271638931 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Keep working on improving your situation < 1271638945 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1271638947 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1271638947 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye < 1271638951 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1271639528 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tried implementing bf using a very small subset of my language's features in order to try and catch the ones that were already implemented < 1271639563 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :turns out I have to implement a huge amount of new stuff and complicate the grammar in order to do something useful < 1271640436 0 :coppro!~coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1271640591 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1271640632 0 :coppro!~coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1271641135 0 :aschueler!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1271641274 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: reboot < 1271642788 0 :cheater2!~cheater@ip-80-226-13-254.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1271643119 0 :Sleeping_boy!~hehewoxin@2001:da8:215:8107:21e:ecff:febe:a3e6 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271643712 0 :Sleeping_boy!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: 暂离 < 1271644113 0 :coppro!~coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1271644555 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: I will do anything (almost) for a new router. < 1271644582 0 :michael__!~michael@c-76-118-245-128.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271644600 0 :michael__!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :maedhros777 < 1271644648 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone here know of a good Fugue compiler besides this one: http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/Fugue_Compiler? Because I'm having problems with that compiler. < 1271644701 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use Linux, and when I run the executable that's created it says "cannot execute binary file" < 1271645025 0 :cheater2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1271645178 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: Looks to me like that compiler's output is PE/COFF for Windows. Try wine? Alternatively, write your own :) < 1271645216 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, I'll try wine -- judging by the size of the compiler, I don't think I could write my own :) < 1271645511 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds like it's about time for EgoFugue :P < 1271645540 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just tried wine and it didn't work, unfortunately. Maybe I'll have to write my own compiler, because this language seems interesting. < 1271645566 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What would be really awesome would be if I could make a piece that actually sounded good and executed :) < 1271645609 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye now. < 1271645611 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1271645735 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1271645736 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AndroFugue! < 1271645743 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is obsessed with Android
< 1271645935 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271646000 0 :augur!~augur@c-68-54-80-152.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271647783 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1271647994 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lower ASCII values < 1271647994 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :means lower precedence (isn't that *much* easier to remember? < 1271648046 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://catseye.tc/projects/n-dcnc/doc/readme.txt < 1271648056 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aces are only high in certain restricted situations, such < 1271648057 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as when the compiler mistakenly assumes they are high. < 1271648328 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awesome! < 1271648338 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ifs are division by 0! < 1271648345 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, just division < 1271648712 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that language spec is awesome < 1271649410 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION notes that there exists another Concurrent Befunge-93 interpreter
< 1271649624 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION thinks that a Befunge-93 Live Wallpaper might not actually be that pretty
< 1271651766 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: android can have live wallpaper? < 1271651788 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hz1YBcYw_qE < 1271651860 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As of 2.1 I think < 1271652657 0 :Gracenotes!~person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1271654405 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1271654768 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1271655269 0 :coppro!~coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1271655407 0 :Owner!~chatzilla@daffa.rh.rit.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1271655426 0 :Owner!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :evincar < 1271655465 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arbitrary obligatory introduction. < 1271655583 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What, nobody's up tonight? < 1271655719 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is awake
< 1271655738 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woah hey. < 1271655741 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not alone. < 1271656044 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You working on anything interesting? < 1271656086 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you asked me around the beginning of 2008, I'd have said yes < 1271656101 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I am working on something now not related to esolangs < 1271656138 0 :augur!~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1271656151 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haha...well, I've got a while. What's the story from then to now? < 1271656175 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No one but me cared, so I stopped < 1271656189 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION was an overzealous promoter
< 1271656205 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Esolangs'll do that to you. < 1271656212 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cruell mistresses, the lot of 'em. < 1271656252 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the record, that was supposed to be "cruelle", but I mistyped my misspelling. :/ < 1271656314 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, what's the project of the now? < 1271656363 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A game < 1271656369 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Active Worlds < 1271656377 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That I shouldn't be talking about, but have, at length < 1271656398 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haha...love that. < 1271656404 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Call it drumming up interest. < 1271656414 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1271656460 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All the language stuff I do nowadays is DSLs to fill specific needs in other projects. < 1271656464 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sourceforge.net/projects/protodata/ < 1271656478 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://sourceforge.net/projects/vision-language/ < 1271656504 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is eating then sleeping
< 1271656510 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll look at those another day probably < 1271656527 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alright, whatever you want. < 1271656538 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just trying to kill some time, honestly. < 1271656550 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Somebody caring would be pretty cool, though. < 1271656563 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, those project seem interesting < 1271656574 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and someone reviewed the Vision Web Template thing < 1271656587 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh? < 1271656589 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I don't quite understand that one. The Protodata seems nice < 1271656594 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sourceforge.net/projects/vision-language/ < 1271656618 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, yeah, that's from a friend of mine. :P < 1271656629 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :morning < 1271656634 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Evening. < 1271656648 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Night < 1271656649 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh not in Europe I guess < 1271656652 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and bbl, going to university → < 1271656659 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Laters. < 1271656663 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And no.) < 1271656857 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1271656862 0 :augur!~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1271657345 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Welp, there goes my interaction for the night. < 1271657349 0 :evincar!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Sleep. < 1271659635 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1271659846 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1271660255 0 :tombom!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1271663324 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: I will do anything (almost) for a new router. < 1271663439 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1271663449 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1271663999 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1271664000 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1271664863 0 :adam_d!~Adam@cpc2-acto6-0-0-cust48.brnt.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1271666462 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I recommend that everyone go watch this movie Following by Chris Nolan < 1271667285 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1271667291 0 :augur!~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1271667469 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1271667899 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: lament < 1271668479 0 :aschueler!~alec@host86-167-40-196.range86-167.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1271668547 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1271670626 0 :Tritonio_GR!~Tritonio@ix.ceid.upatras.gr JOIN :#esoteric < 1271671576 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271671607 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1271671659 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :current connection is ssh tunnel over unreliable university wlan, and there are microwave ovens near here, so if I don't reply suddenly you now know why. < 1271671714 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, ok < 1271671721 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my connection is similar, except without the tunnel < 1271671872 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you both have sucky connections it seems :( < 1271674980 0 :Mathnerd314_!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271675172 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1271675186 0 :Mathnerd314_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Mathnerd314 < 1271676828 0 :cheater2!~cheater@ip-80-226-27-235.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1271677348 0 :cheater2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1271679240 0 :zdhwjcln!~Administr@123.53.35.25 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271679266 0 :zdhwjcln!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there somebody? < 1271679292 0 :zdhwjcln!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1271679655 0 :Asztal!~asztal@host86-169-5-190.range86-169.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1271679782 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zdhwjcln: yes but you didn't stay long enough to find out < 1271679795 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, that's a pretty dubious hostname (~Administr as the username, and an IP) < 1271680950 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Yes... I turned on the radio this morning and heard something like, "A volcano has erupted in Iceland... but we can't tell you which one, since none of us American reporters would even dare to try to pronounce the name. Tweet us if you know how." < 1271681238 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1271681532 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise for the logs: the iPhone developer contract is getting even crazier, see http://www.wired.com/epicenter/2010/04/with-new-developer-agreement-apple-unlevels-the-iad-playing-field/ < 1271681561 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks like they've done enough stupid arbitrary restrictions on programmers for the time being, now they're going after marketers < 1271681610 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and managing to get rid of loads of useful information for programmers at the same time < 1271682190 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1271682298 0 :lereah_!~lereah@nanpc301.in2p3.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1271682482 0 :cheater2!~cheater@ip-80-226-242-81.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1271684265 0 :MigoMipo!~MigoMipo@84-217-1-14.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271685045 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1271687297 0 :aschueler!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1271687430 0 :maedhros777!~michael@c-76-118-245-128.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271687452 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone know of a good Prelude compiler? < 1271687533 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If there's not one linked on the wiki, then there's probably not one ... which means it's time for you to write one ... although prelude being semi-multithreaded would make that interesting ;) < 1271687558 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is one on the wiki, but I don't think it works. < 1271687585 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I might write a Prelude to C compiler and then write a Fugue to Prelude compiler. < 1271687595 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then put it on the wiki < 1271687600 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good, that means I don't have to. < 1271687604 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1271687618 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does a period do anything in Prelude? < 1271687626 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a prelude to BF compiler somewhere, IIRC < 1271687635 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Really? < 1271687637 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where? < 1271687638 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, no, other way round < 1271687641 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darn < 1271687647 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think i saw it on the wiki < 1271687656 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So does a period do anything? < 1271687674 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I have a Prelude interp, it seems < 1271687680 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where? < 1271687693 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the wiki? < 1271687701 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on my hard drive, but I could paste it as soon as I figure out how it works < 1271687714 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it doesn't seem to do anything special in response to . < 1271687715 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How did you make it without knowing how it works? < 1271687719 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I did once < 1271687723 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1271687726 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's years old < 1271687734 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could you put it on the wiki? < 1271687748 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ ls -l prelude.c < 1271687749 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-rw-r--r-- 1 ais523 ais523 4309 2006-08-06 17:35 prelude.c < 1271687754 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, that's old < 1271687758 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1271687767 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nice, you use Linux < 1271687778 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep; unfortunately the code appears to be DOS-specific < 1271687784 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Too bad < 1271687794 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I'll just write my own compiler. < 1271687797 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but luckily, I had a hint of cross-platform-ness back then and put the DOS stuff in #defines < 1271687811 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it should be a one-line change to port < 1271687826 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should I make it to C or to BrainF**k, do you think? < 1271687848 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're compiling, to C might be easier < 1271687859 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :emulating the effective multiple tapes thing isn't that bad in BF, but it may take some thought < 1271687870 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I guess so. Bye now, I'll put it on the wiki when I'm finished. < 1271687873 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1271687896 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do people have something against staying on IRC... < 1271687899 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I was about to paste it as well < 1271687900 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.pastebin.ca/1867807 < 1271687950 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1271687971 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it's not only on the wiki already < 1271687977 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but someone ported it to POSIX < 1271688021 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what you really don't want to see is my Prelude to Fugue compiler < 1271688037 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it was so specific to the specific system it was running on, I think it could only have run on that one computer < 1271688051 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it first worked out what the sequence of notes was (sane) < 1271688081 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then sent a sequence of keystrokes via the Windows SendKeys API to a proprietary MIDI editor which had its keyboard shortcuts set up to be able to receive them properly (insane) < 1271688114 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1271688225 0 :maedhros777!~michael@c-76-118-245-128.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271688256 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, I just thought of something -- what do ^ and v do in Prelude, exactly? Because I don't get the wiki's explanation. < 1271688288 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: why don't you stay in the channel, btw? < 1271688295 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, ok < 1271688302 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we discovered that my compiler was the one that was already on the wiki just after you left < 1271688308 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that on the wiki, it was ported to Linux# < 1271688314 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You mean the interpreter? < 1271688317 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, yes < 1271688337 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it work? Because I tried the hello world example and it didn't do anything < 1271688339 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, ^ and v basically peek the top of the next voice's stack < 1271688345 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and push onto the current stack < 1271688352 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, what syntax did you use to run it < 1271688383 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems to take a file from the command line and output on stdout < 1271688394 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I compiled the interpreter, put it in my path, and did: $ prelude helloworld.txt < 1271688406 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing happened < 1271688417 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's the hello world: http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/Hello_world_program_in_esoteric_languages#Prelude < 1271688423 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing happened = it hung, or it quit with no output < 1271688433 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quit with no output < 1271688442 0 :Gregor-L!~Gregor@pal-165-148.itap.purdue.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1271688451 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just ran that program through the interpreter and it worked fine < 1271688457 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, it doesn't output a final newline < 1271688462 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's possible that your command prompt overwrote it < 1271688471 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, let me try it again. < 1271688487 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll have to download the interpreter again, because I just deleted it :) < 1271688488 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try adding "; echo" to the end of the command line to add a newline < 1271688527 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, yours is the C interpreter, right? Not the python one? < 1271688530 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1271688535 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, hang on < 1271688553 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a Perl fan, it's pretty rare for me to write things in Python as a result ;) < 1271688556 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1271688558 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1271688558 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1271688561 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :E_WORKSFORME < 1271688644 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :#esoteric, the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment - #esoteric is not associated with the joke language Perl, please visit www.perl.org - logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/ < 1271688653 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Didn't work < 1271688671 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :E_YOUFAILATC :P < 1271688677 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is the code you're using, right? < 1271688681 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...8+.!v...4+.1+!..v!..vvv...4+.!vvv.....9+.3-!###!..v6-!..vv..v < 1271688683 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :9+(1-)^#7+(1-)..^7+!^3+!##8+(1-)^###9+1+(1-)..^^^^^3+!..^8-!#1+! < 1271688807 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right? < 1271688837 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was kind of confused about all the periods < 1271688992 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Presumably nops. < 1271689001 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To synchronize "timing", you have to waste time. < 1271689016 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I get it < 1271689025 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So was that the program you were running? < 1271689032 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1271689040 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's strange < 1271689080 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And this is the interpreter you're using, right? http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/files/prelude/impl/prelude.c < 1271689084 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1271689094 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just downloaded, compiled and ran it < 1271689103 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then what could I be doing wrong? < 1271689128 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my guess is the problem's with I/O somehow < 1271689135 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess < 1271689138 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either providing the wrong input, or looking in the wrong place for the output < 1271689148 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hang on, I'll look at the interpreter < 1271689232 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on another topic, I finally discovered the solution to something that had been bothering me for days: http://www.astucia.co.uk/products/product-details?categoryid=176910&productid=179235&class=product < 1271689251 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was walking for miles down a cycle path and wondering wtf those things were (it was daytime) < 1271689257 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1271689277 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but luckily some of them were unworn enough to have readable brand names on, and I traced them via the company that made them < 1271689298 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(you don't know how hard it is to make out the word "Astucia" when it's mostly covered by dirt and worn in places...) < 1271689462 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Does interstack communication create a race condition in Prelude, or is there a guaranteed order of evaluation between the voices? < 1271689475 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what are cv, nv, sp, c, and f? < 1271689488 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L: I don't see any evidence that it isn't a race condition; that hello world is designed to avoid races with appropriate NOPing < 1271689490 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't really tell without enough description in the variable names < 1271689517 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: You don't find those variable names helpful and self-explanatory? :P < 1271689519 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :current voice, number of voices for the first two < 1271689541 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, okay. I'll go replace the variable names :) < 1271689544 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sp seems to be the instruction pointer < 1271689566 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :c seems to just be a generic temporary < 1271689574 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay < 1271689581 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and f's a flag used for breaking out of loops < 1271689629 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, kind of ridiculous that I can refigure out what this code does so quickly after not seeing it for three years < 1271689646 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And what does kp stand for? < 1271689683 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :must be the stack pointer < 1271689691 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stacK Pointer < 1271689692 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the array of stack pointers < 1271689702 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523 doesn't quite ... "get" initialisms. < 1271689702 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1271689703 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still, I have no clue why the IP is called sp < 1271689713 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L: s/doesn't/didn't/ < 1271689718 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl < 1271689729 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no evidence as to whether I get them or not atm < 1271689764 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I've also noticed that that program only has one way to exit, and it's always with status code EXIT_FAILURE < 1271689768 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is... slightly bizarre < 1271689776 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :=D < 1271689802 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not counting command line arg problems, which /also/ exit with EXIT_FAILURE) < 1271689826 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just scolding you for using esolangs. < 1271689838 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if it works, running it is still FAILURE. < 1271689848 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least I can guess why the static arrays are 10 by 6553; it must be to prevent exceeding the maximum static array size limit in DOS < 1271689859 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, it's scolding you for not writing infinite loops < 1271689871 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :int kp[10]={0}; /* stack pointers. Points to TOS. */ < 1271689878 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, there's actually a comment saying what kp does < 1271689891 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stacK Pointers < 1271689926 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least the code doesn't randomly break with 32-bit ints < 1271689935 0 :songhead95!~jay@c-75-67-0-54.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271689941 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(up until around 4 or 5 years ago, I used to write all my code assuming int was 16 bits) < 1271689948 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow < 1271689948 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(apart from when it really had to use the win32 API) < 1271689949 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow < 1271689952 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fail < 1271689960 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Welcome to the 21st century :P < 1271689965 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1271689992 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What changed around 4 or 5 years ago? < 1271690002 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: He installed Windows 95 < 1271690004 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :moved to Linux < 1271690011 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L: nah, this was even on Windows XP < 1271690023 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, to UNIX first, then Linux < 1271690027 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Long live Linux < 1271690037 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What distro do you run? < 1271690048 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH GOD NO I see distro wars ahead *sobs* < 1271690052 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L: I got really disappointed that the deprecated API for working the PC speaker directly was removed in Windows XP, I used to have fun with that one < 1271690061 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nah, I don't care much about different distros < 1271690065 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: And that drove you to Linux? < 1271690072 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: X-D < 1271690082 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: originally, Ubuntu because it was preinstalled, then Ubuntu again because I had to replace my laptop in a hurry and didn't want too radical a change while I was in the middle of something else < 1271690092 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I use Ubuntu too < 1271690095 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that, and the random 20-second pauses whenever you tried to load a MIDI file < 1271690108 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OpenSUSE looks pretty good though, I might try it sometime < 1271690122 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the end, my games just spent 5 or 6 minutes at the start loading all the MIDI files so it could play them immediately < 1271690138 0 :deschutron!~alex@122-49-156-76.ip.adam.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1271690151 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Our workstations here at work used to run OpenSUSE, but they went Ubuntu recently-ish; not many years ago. < 1271690152 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sidux blar blar < 1271690152 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the strange thing is, this bug affected Microsoft's own media player too, although for some reason there, it happened the second time the file was loaded, rather than the first) < 1271690162 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nowait < 1271690164 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LFS blar blar < 1271690169 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All other distros are for pussies. < 1271690189 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :=D < 1271690266 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of these cluster nodes here run CentOS, I think. < 1271690296 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CentOS is amusing. Getting some money now and then would be nice ... NO. < 1271690298 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the desktop in my office triple-boots CentOS, CentOS, and Windows 7 < 1271690303 0 :lereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1271690312 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L: yet Red Hat are still pretty profitable < 1271690316 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Triple boot? < 1271690316 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehow < 1271690318 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow < 1271690324 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yeah, I don't get it :P < 1271690327 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I double boot XP and Ubuntu < 1271690330 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All my computers single-boot sidux :P < 1271690333 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have yet to figure out why there are two CentOS boots on there < 1271690343 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never use XP, though < 1271690357 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: SO LONG AS IT IS INSTALLED IT WILL BE YOUR SHAME < 1271690362 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :True < 1271690376 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll be getting a new laptop soon, though < 1271690385 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll try to get a Windows refund < 1271690391 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : And it'll double-boot Windows 7 and Ubuntu. < 1271690392 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have win7 installed, partly for the purpose of obeying the letter of various contracts < 1271690392 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1271690393 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And i'll probably fail < 1271690406 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Down with the Windows tax! < 1271690413 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We should have a tea party < 1271690419 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, the box this computer came in basically had a sticker on saying "by opening this box you accept that you can't get a Windows refund even though the EULA inside says otherwise" < 1271690435 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that neighbour cluster runs Rocks, it seems. < 1271690496 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's an amusing joke about dual-booting in a Finnish parody site, but unfortunately it's in Finnish only. < 1271690513 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: as in, doesn't work when translated? < 1271690521 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't MS generally required to give a refund? < 1271690525 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"this sentence is difficult to translate into French" < 1271690542 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`translateto fr this sentence is difficult to translate into French < 1271690552 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cette phrase est difficile ŕ traduire en français < 1271690569 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: no, MS's EULA says that the hardware company has to give you a refund, and doesn't refund the price of Windows to the hardware company itself < 1271690587 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's part of their own contracts with the hardware companies that the hardware companies have to put up with this < 1271690594 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darn < 1271690595 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: As in, I don't have time to translate ans wouldn't probably generate very good prose anyway. The gist of it is that it's a parody of a column in a computing magazine, and the guy's recounting his experiences on installing Linux on a computer that currently "dual-boots MacOS and Netware 5 simultaneously". < 1271690611 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I could get a refund, but it would benefit MS? < 1271690614 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so dodging the Microsoft tax unfortunately doesn't hurt Microsoft, just the hardware manufacturer < 1271690629 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow < 1271690631 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: you could /maybe/ get a refund; the majority of companies eventually pay persistent people to go away < 1271690647 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it costs them less money than actually trying to handle the whole legally dubious issue < 1271690649 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but a Windows OS is like $200 < 1271690653 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it isn't < 1271690658 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is it, then? < 1271690661 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's how much it costs to buy in the shop < 1271690665 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the price preinstalled is much lower < 1271690673 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like what? < 1271690687 0 :songhead95!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what window manager do you prefer? < 1271690697 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :songhead95: X11 is for the weak. < 1271690714 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :After the distro wars: window management wars! < 1271690720 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow < 1271690723 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1271690724 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: just looking around online, it seems that the OEM price - that's the price that you could get buying in bulk as a small computer manufacturer - tends to be about half the price of buying in the shops < 1271690726 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awesome for me, even with the Lua bad-smell. < 1271690739 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: That's still $100 *shrugs* < 1271690741 0 :songhead95!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an esoteric wm would be awsome < 1271690743 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1271690755 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does Apple give refunds? < 1271690758 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the values for large manufacturers buying in bulk tend to be lower still < 1271690761 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: Haw < 1271690773 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: Apple barely acknowledges that Mac OS X isn't burnt into ROM. < 1271690780 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1271690798 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_refund is a list of the actual amounts that people were refunded when they actually tried and succeeded < 1271690965 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess MS just gets tired of arguing < 1271690991 0 :songhead95!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope apple will follow that example < 1271691017 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, in pretty much all minor lawsuits, there comes a point where it's cheaper just to give in and pay a trivial amount of money for the other side to go away < 1271691023 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1271691024 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is normally just before the lawyers get involved < 1271691050 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They should really be less monopolistic < 1271691058 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If only < 1271691060 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as for window managers, I'm using Compiz at the moment < 1271691068 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same < 1271691086 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I use xmonad from time to time, I haven't yet figured out how to get it to work with sound and networking, both of which are a little important < 1271691088 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But i use Metacity for Blender, it doesn't work with Compiz < 1271691090 0 :songhead95!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most people would say it's just good fair in the business world < 1271691122 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for some reason, the way Ubuntu sets up startup things, which WM you use somehow affects networking and audio, probably because it's different between KDE and Gnome so xmonad gets nothing) < 1271691227 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it just me, or in the Prelude interpreter, does sp remain 0 for most of the program, when it's used? < 1271691243 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ever since line 83 < 1271691316 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, never mind < 1271691323 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It changes at 180 < 1271691335 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the instruction pointer rarely changes value in an interp < 1271691350 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was under the impression that large corporations have teams of lawyers on retainer-sort of deals all the time anyway, and can use them to bully little people if they're not doing anything more important at the moment. < 1271691353 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :normally, it increments once each time round the main loop, and sometimes jumps up or down if you find a loop < 1271691371 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: but their travel costs to small claims court would be too expensive < 1271691374 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I'm getting sick of these corporations < 1271691388 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about we start a tea party? :) < 1271691470 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Destroy all the Windows boxes < 1271691476 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And throw them in the Boston harbor < 1271691500 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then declare ourselves an independent country < 1271691516 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One microsoft lawyer estimated (in a bar over beers, unofficially, to a visiting lecturer) that they spent around a megadollar on lawyer expenses for the EU part of the Oracle-Sun deal, even though it didn't directly concern them. < 1271691517 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, the problem would be with trying to get rid of a particular magnetic pattern on the hard drive, and throwing that into the harbor < 1271691519 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing wrong with the computer < 1271691535 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :True < 1271691547 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then we can just destroy the software. < 1271691554 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Windows is beginning to reach the stage of not being that bad < 1271691556 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Infiltrate it with viruses. < 1271691566 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that bad? Are you serious? < 1271691588 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: it's been stealing a whole load of good ideas from other OSes, and maybe even having a few of its own < 1271691594 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's certainly /usable/, just frustrating < 1271691606 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, i'll admit it's usable < 1271691613 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But definitely frustrating < 1271691618 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's also stole good ideas from Windows 1 and advertized them to no end as if they're new :P < 1271691633 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I'd rather not have MS benefit. < 1271691637 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L: seriously? Windows 1 hardly had any features at all < 1271691658 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: "Snap" is effectively the ONLY window layout of Windows 1, and now it's a feature ;) < 1271691676 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The lady in the commercial just annoys me < 1271691677 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, aha < 1271691690 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Windows 7 was my idea!" What nonsense. < 1271691691 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also, "snap" already had a meaning in all other windowing systems, and they decided to take it for something else because they're douchebags) < 1271691698 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux is truly the people's idea. < 1271691706 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The People's idea. < 1271691715 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The People's Republic of Idea. < 1271691720 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :COMMUNISM < 1271691724 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one interesting thing to notice, btw, is that both the Microsoft and Apple commercials try to make the decision "Mac vs. PC" rather than "OS X vs. Windows" < 1271691727 0 :pineapple!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :windows 7: mouse gestures to give you what keyboard shortcuts could give you anyway < 1271691746 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yes, both of them want to choke out other options, just like the Democratic and Republican parties. < 1271691746 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1271691747 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is, I suppose, a good way to confuse people into not realizing Linux exists < 1271691757 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, well, OpenSolaris or the BSDs < 1271691759 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even FreeDOS < 1271691762 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, you sound like you have my politics, Gregor < 1271691778 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L: the UK politics situation has become really confusing < 1271691780 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My politics are "I fucking hate politics" :P < 1271691800 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was a big televised debate on Thursday, and the Liberal Democrats somehow managed to win it by all sensible measures, shocking everyone < 1271691805 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a self-titled anarcho-syndicalist =D < 1271691829 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Similar to democratic socialism < 1271691841 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're currently within-statistical-noise of the Conservatives at the top of the polls, with Labour in third, which is also rather unexpected < 1271691850 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you guys are in the UK? < 1271691854 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although, the voting system means that they don't have much of a chance < 1271691856 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523 is. < 1271691859 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: I'm in the UK; I think Gregor-L is American < 1271691862 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1271691880 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Amerk'n < 1271691890 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!help < 1271691891 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :help: General commands: !help, !info, !bf_txtgen. See also !help languages, !help userinterps. You can get help on some commands by typing !help . < 1271691895 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, whom do you vote for? < 1271691905 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen Never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down < 1271691908 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you don't like the Republicrats < 1271691911 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nader? < 1271691911 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :481 ++++++++++++[>+++++++>++++++>+++++++++>+++<<<<-]>>++++++.>-------.+++++++++++++++++.<+++++++++++++++++++++++.>----.>----.<<++.++++++++.-.>----.<<+++++++++++++.>>>.<-------.++.+++++++++++++.<<++++.>>>.<+++.<+.>----.>.<.<+.>>++++++++++++.------------.<<--.---------.>+.<.>----.>.<<<++.>>---.<<+++++++..>----.-----------------------------------------------------------------.<--.-------.>>+++++.<.>+++++.----------.++++++.<.<-.+++++++++++.++++++++.------- < 1271691912 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, this is needed to settle an argument in another channel < 1271691918 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: Given that the two parties are the only ones that have non-zero chance of winning at the national scale, I vote democrat. < 1271691927 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usually < 1271691930 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At the local level it varies. < 1271691940 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1271691955 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do hate the Republicrats, though < 1271691956 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In one election I voted for a republic, a democrat, a green, a libertarian and an independent all on one ballot :P < 1271691961 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow < 1271691961 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*republican < 1271691977 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You voted for a republican??!!! < 1271691978 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :technically speaking, isn't the US both a republic and a democracy? < 1271691981 0 :songhead95!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: songhead95 < 1271691982 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They were each the best and most qualified for the respective roles *shrugs* < 1271691988 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow < 1271692000 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I guess the Dems aren't much better < 1271692001 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It's a democratic republic and/or representative republic. < 1271692005 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: from an external point of view, the democrats and republicans are so similar that it makes more sense to vote for the sanest person than for the party < 1271692015 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exactly, I agree < 1271692032 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just that if i had to vote for a Republicrat, it would be a Dem < 1271692035 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably < 1271692043 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BTW, I'm an Oregonian ... we're even weirder out there :P < 1271692048 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1271692059 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Strange word, Oregonian < 1271692061 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's one of the few states where Greens actually win positions occasional. < 1271692064 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*occasionally < 1271692071 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gawd, these fekking wrist splints are making me mistype < 1271692078 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I'm a massachussettsian =D < 1271692085 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If that's what the name is < 1271692099 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Presently I'm in Indiana *bleh* < 1271692312 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you aren't (yet) grounded by an Icelandic ash cloud < 1271692325 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although, really people need to stop relying on air travel so much < 1271692339 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is strange -- when I change the interpreter to print the number of voices, it says there are 4 < 1271692347 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shouldn't it be 2? < 1271692369 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: aha, maybe somehow newlines have been doubled in your input file < 1271692375 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or there are trailing newlines, or something like that < 1271692382 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps, let me check < 1271692405 0 :songhead95_!~jay@c-75-67-0-54.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271692407 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How would I change that? < 1271692422 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm using gedit, does it do anything strange with newlines? < 1271692470 0 :songhead95___!~jay@c-75-67-0-54.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271692471 0 :songhead95_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1271692517 0 :songhead95___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi I'm a mac booting debian, and in the other room is a pc running freebsd < 1271692552 0 :songhead95___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in my hand is an ipod ssh-ing into the pc, because you can do that with a jailbreak < 1271692557 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: $ file helloworld.txt < 1271692568 0 :songhead95___!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1271692584 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prelude.txt: ASCII text < 1271692591 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah, I renamed it prelude.txt < 1271692624 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :strange, file normally says what sort of file terminators it has < 1271692751 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When i do "cat prelude.txt", it just shows two lines < 1271692873 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: if there are carriage-returns in there, they won't be visible < 1271692876 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try cat -v prelude.txt < 1271692889 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still two lines < 1271692908 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any ^M written at the ends of them? < 1271692919 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1271692956 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION reappears.
< 1271692973 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well that's fuckular. < 1271692981 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got nothin' < 1271693025 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hang on, let me try using ftell() in the interpreter when it encounters a newline. < 1271693173 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, it works now < 1271693188 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Turns out there were 2 newlines at the end of the file < 1271693214 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now to write a Fugue to Prelude compiler! < 1271693274 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Schweet. Have fun with MIDI :P < 1271693291 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only problem will be that Fugue allows more than just 0..9 < 1271693328 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll have to alter the interpreter a bit, or just directly interpret Fugue using the interpreter code < 1271693407 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you listen to the Fugue Hello World (http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/Hello_world_program_in_esoteric_languages#Fugue) it sounds horrible =D < 1271693495 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you a musician? < 1271693504 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1271693518 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1271693522 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well then it seems to me like it's up to you to improve upon it :P < 1271693531 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: it was autogenerated < 1271693536 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, okay < 1271693540 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually find autogenerated Fugue music kind-of beautiful < 1271693544 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow < 1271693544 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271693554 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the program has some sort of a purpose behind it, it's not the normal computer's autogenerated ramblings < 1271693559 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it grows on you after a while < 1271693568 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What would be awesome would be if an existing piece compiled in Fugue :) < 1271693581 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I mean that it did something < 1271693584 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(meanwhile, I've been looking at ; just how /do/ you pronounce Eyjafjallajökull, anyway?) < 1271693620 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they actually interviewed a bunch of icelanders, and they all gave different pronunciations < 1271693798 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some day I want to compile Lost Kingdoms to Fugue < 1271693804 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how long the resulting tune would be? < 1271693814 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I probably need to learn the MIDI file format first, though, so I can generate it directly < 1271693837 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: http://alsa.opensrc.org/index.php/MidiComp Use this intermediary format instead. < 1271693873 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, web's being unreliable again < 1271693881 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not a DNS problem or proxy problem < 1271693894 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because there's no proxy (that I know of), and I'm using level3's DNS < 1271693904 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1271693909 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :midicomp is a MIDI-to-ASCII-to-MIDI convertor that uses an ASCII format very related to MIDI, but without fekking around with MIDI bignums and the like. < 1271693909 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it works or doesn't work randomly when I try to load the page < 1271693932 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use it whenever I have to write programs that fekk with MIDIs :P < 1271693981 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I'll just use CPAN < 1271694460 0 :Asztal!~asztal@host86-169-5-190.range86-169.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1271694799 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1271695132 0 :Tritonio_GR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1271695164 0 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271695504 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, MIDI bignums? < 1271695505 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1271695520 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: MIDI files use a bignum format. < 1271695533 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, heh, as scaled integer or what < 1271695535 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1271695559 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: One bit of each byte is used to indicate whether the next byte is part of the bignum. The rest are used as part of the number. < 1271695574 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's used for ... everything. < 1271695584 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: lament < 1271695644 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L: hmm, like UTF-9? < 1271695658 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Never 'eard of UTF ... 9 ... < 1271695676 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, sure, but consider the length of a note for example. How is that encoded? An _integer_ wouldn't work unless you could do a _scaled_ integer or a ratio between two or such < 1271695696 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: It's an integer number of ticks. < 1271695704 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: You have to choose your ticks wisely so that you can encode all notes you need. < 1271695710 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1271695718 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, and how is the tick encoded? < 1271695730 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ticks per beat, an integer. < 1271695738 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1271695745 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And beats are in something like microseconds per beat. < 1271695756 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, tempo is, that is. < 1271695772 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I was trying to figure out how that recursive definition worked ;P < 1271695817 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sadly, most systems that write MIDIs use a fixed, and often bad, tick length. < 1271695821 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm < 1271695825 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ticks/beat rather < 1271695829 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1271695838 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1024 is a popular (and inexcusably flawed) choice. < 1271695860 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It should be a large power of 2 times as many primes as you can reasonably get. < 1271695873 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. 256*3*5*7*11 < 1271695882 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, what a about rosegarden? < 1271695890 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION checks
< 1271695917 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It uses 480 < 1271695921 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is a decent one. < 1271695922 0 :pineapple!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L: i thought it was 960, not 1024 < 1271695947 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Perl libraries default to 96, unless you really happen to need a different division < 1271695952 0 :pineapple!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've seen 960 used by something, but i forget what < 1271695952 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pineapple: 960 is the less-popular, non-flawed choice. < 1271695964 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :96 doesn't allow for proper 5-tuplets. < 1271695964 0 :Asztal!~asztal@host86-160-121-77.range86-160.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1271695967 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, 480 is less detailed than 1024? < 1271695980 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: 1024 doesn't allow for proper 3- or 5-tuplets. < 1271695997 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It needs to be a power of many 2s, and as many primes as possible to allow for tuplets. < 1271696004 0 :pineapple!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :840? < 1271696012 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since 7-tuplets and higher are rare, multiples of 7 are generally reserved for Chopin :P < 1271696012 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, true. So what about 8192*3*5*7*13 or such? < 1271696017 0 :pineapple!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems to be the best i can come up with < 1271696030 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: If you get too high, you're liable to make beat counts be enormous :P < 1271696040 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, heh < 1271696046 0 :pineapple!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: i think the format is limited to 1024 < 1271696056 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be the number with the most factors less than 16384 < 1271696057 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, IMO rosegaden should check how much it needs when exporting to midi < 1271696068 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pineapple, that would be stupid < 1271696079 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1271696083 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: It might, I just checked an example file *shrugs* < 1271696100 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pineapple: The format isn't limited IIRC, although it's quite possible that many /players/ are limited. < 1271696101 0 :pineapple!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i might be wrong about the limit < 1271696134 0 :pineapple!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well... 3.5.7 = 105; i'd be tempted to add another 3 in that before adding an 11 < 1271696152 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pineapple: WOULDJA LIKE SOME 2S < 1271696153 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1271696162 0 :pineapple!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L: i'm adding the 2s on afterwards < 1271696177 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd say 128ths are more common than 9-tuplets. < 1271696179 0 :pineapple!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :work out how many i have "room" for < 1271696216 0 :pineapple!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20160 ? < 1271696226 0 :pineapple!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3.3.5.7.64 < 1271696374 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've done a reasonable bit of manual MIDI file handling for a former jobplace; it's certainly a bit crafty format. The time division field is either 15-bit "ticks per beat" thing, or some sort of SMPTE time-code based frames-per-second value (7 bits for fps, 8 for ticks/frame). < 1271696390 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1271696546 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, I demand 127-tuplets! < 1271696560 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in your next piece ;P < 1271696571 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no clue how it would sound < 1271696598 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, btw what about midi as in the hardware protocol thingy, does it use such a tick too? < 1271696659 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know. < 1271696662 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I only know the file format. < 1271696716 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: When two people dream the same dream, it ceases to be an illusion. KVIrc 3.4.2 Shiny http://www.kvirc.net < 1271696756 0 :Asztal!~asztal@host81-129-119-203.range81-129.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1271696780 0 :maedhros777!~michael@c-76-118-245-128.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271696798 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, I lost my internet connection < 1271696977 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So does anyone know of an MIDI library or where the specification is? < 1271696990 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`google midi file format < 1271696994 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1271696995 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The standard MIDI file format is a very strange beast. When viewed as a whole, it can be quite overwhelming. Of course, no matter how you look at it, ... \ faydoc.tripod.com/formats/mid.htm - [13]Cached - [14]Similar < 1271697018 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :midicomp is a MIDI-to-ASCII-to-MIDI convertor if you want to make your life easier but have another intermediary. < 1271697031 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, I googled it and i got that exact site :) < 1271697049 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: How unsurprising what with `google being a script that googles :P < 1271697061 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, this is a strange format < 1271697135 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah -- I don't know if any of you are musicians, but are accidentals allowed in Fugue, or a key other than C major? < 1271697167 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The spec makes that utterly unclear. < 1271697176 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would say, since it's interval-based, assume the first note is the root. < 1271697184 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Which is horribly broken, but ignore that :P ) < 1271697199 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Treat diminshed and augmented intervals as if they were the natural interval. < 1271697203 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I guess that just gives you C major, A minor, and all the strange modes out there < 1271697220 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do like Phrygian though < 1271697257 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: I recall this spec being quite useful: http://www.sonicspot.com/guide/midifiles.html < 1271697271 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, thanks < 1271697335 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, if i take forever, I could write a 2-hour composition in E phrygian that does a text adventure game when run =D < 1271697340 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would be so awesome < 1271697346 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... yes :P < 1271697355 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But not if I do it first. < 1271697358 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Which I won't) < 1271697358 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I take it you're a musician? < 1271697368 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/music/ < 1271697380 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have a website? < 1271697394 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... no, I was just linking some totally random site < 1271697419 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, you're a good pianist < 1271697437 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okidokie. < 1271697447 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you write all these, or just some? < 1271697467 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything on that page was written by me. < 1271697472 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sweet < 1271697478 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are your influences? < 1271697517 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/hats.php Nice hats :) < 1271697526 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My favorite composer is Borodín, I like all the other Romantic-era Russian composers, also Chopin ... I also like to think there's a tiny tidbit of jazz in there, though not much. < 1271697546 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I like Chopin < 1271697574 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My favorites are Baroque,like Bach and Vivaldi, and some Romantic like Mendelssohn and Paganini < 1271697588 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://aforteforpiano.wordpress.com/ I was working on Chopin's third nocturne from Op. 9 until I just recently got my hands put in wrist splints as punishment for working on Chopin's third nocturne from Op. 9 ... < 1271697596 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I play guitar, right now I'm trying to learn Paganini's 24 caprice < 1271697600 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's wicked hard < 1271697613 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6XJkRBPSQc < 1271697646 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Guitar in a classical context doesn't get the respect it deserves. < 1271697650 0 :adam_d!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1271697651 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1271697661 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I play guitar and piano < 1271697666 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meanwhile, the piano gets tossed in over music that predates the instrument :P < 1271697674 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1271697684 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bach used the harpischord < 1271697690 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It sounded pretty good < 1271697707 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've got a sweet digital piano with a really nice harpsichord sound, I like to use it when I play Bach. < 1271697712 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nice < 1271697750 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know a really good pianist who can play Mendelssohn's fantasy in F# minor (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODorVTR7p4w) < 1271697753 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's insane < 1271697785 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :His fingers move at like a billion mph < 1271697848 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y'know, I think raw velocity isn't quite the right measurement for such things :P < 1271697855 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :=D < 1271697880 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, there isn't really a unit of measurement for finger speed on piano < 1271697906 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure there is ... the scale goes from "first grader who just started Piano lessons" to "Rachmanninov" < 1271697929 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1271697942 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's also a hand-size scale, btw. < 1271697948 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not great at piano, right now I just play a bit of Beethoven < 1271697963 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And some jazz stuff < 1271698005 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So on choosemyhat.com, do you actually wear those hats wherever you go? < 1271698009 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup < 1271698024 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm wearing a pakul even as we speak. < 1271698030 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sweet < 1271698053 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I vote for the Scottish hat tomorrow < 1271698073 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only one vote though, too bad < 1271698083 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks pretty awesome :) < 1271698099 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should get a Viking helmet. < 1271698168 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have two Scottish hats :P < 1271698174 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I try to keep my hats JUST south of insane. < 1271698183 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darn :) < 1271698195 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The scottish hat looks pretty good, though < 1271698223 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still have two Scottish hats :P < 1271698225 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So can the same IP vote for different days? < 1271698235 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1271698238 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But only one per day. < 1271698242 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll do that < 1271698280 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I voted for the pirate hat on Wednesday < 1271698375 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't own a pirate hat, but I appreciate your vote for my extremely-patriotic American-style tricorn. < 1271698391 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1271698446 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's funny how myths about pirates spring up, real pirates live in Somalia and wouldn't say "arr", they'd just shoot you with an m16 < 1271698529 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if they'd get the hell out of there, the government could fix itself and I could finally buy the domain name which is my greatest dream: libc.so < 1271698556 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do you want that? < 1271698572 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... because it's libc.so! < 1271698577 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1271698590 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/colormatch/ Pretty interesting < 1271698598 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even know what I'd use it for, probably just forward it to the GNU libc page ;P < 1271698705 0 :tombom!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1271698725 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, you have a lot of results < 1271698819 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/colormatch/q/index.php This is pretty accurate < 1271698832 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm saying yes to a lot of them < 1271698956 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, did you write Plof by yourself? < 1271699049 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks interesting, extremely flexible < 1271699177 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Today, a tour of Gregor Richards Technologies :P < 1271699190 0 :deschutron!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1271699196 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep < 1271699197 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of the standard library was written by pikhq, the interpreter, spec and most of the standard library were written by me. < 1271699238 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, I downloaded Plof but the INSTALL file says to run configure; I don't see it < 1271699257 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or should i be running configure.ac? < 1271699263 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, that INSTALL is autogenerated; you have to have autoconf and automake installed, and run ./autoreconf.sh before running configure. < 1271699289 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Conventionally, since configure scripts are generated, they're not put into source repositories) < 1271699335 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1271699379 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When I run make it says "plof/plof.h:31:19: error: gc/gc.h: No such file or directory" < 1271699387 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Requires libgc :P < 1271699399 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And libgc-dev or whatever your package manager wants to call it for compiling) < 1271699415 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, I'll apt-get it < 1271699439 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Get libffi-dev while you're at it. < 1271699444 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not STRICTLY necessary, but a huge plus. < 1271699447 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay < 1271699484 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also, we should probably move this to #plof ) < 1271699493 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1271699564 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1271699596 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271699669 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, what package? < 1271699672 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh plof < 1271699852 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1271700009 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got highlighted, and the highlight is not in my buffer. < 1271700042 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Wow, did you write Plof by yourself? < 1271700042 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Some of the standard library was written by pikhq, the interpreter, spec and most of the standard library were written by me. < 1271700047 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, there it is. Away message. < 1271700054 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:29 #esoteric: < coppro> pikhq: ping? < 1271700065 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was the highlight. < 1271700069 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A few days ago. < 1271700079 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION just returned from weekend-ness
< 1271700121 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L: BTW, just "autoreconf" works instead of ./autoreconf.sh nowadays. < 1271700142 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ./autoreconf.sh just runs autoreconf, then find . -name autom4te.cache | xargs rm -rf :P < 1271700149 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I see. < 1271700150 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1271700166 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is the point of autom4te.cache? < 1271700169 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always wondered < 1271700181 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, it seems just as slow with as without that cache < 1271700182 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION goes off to take a cold shower
< 1271700198 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you run autom4te (as part of autoconf) again, it doesn't need to expand macros it has cached. < 1271700216 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, I never noticed any speed diff < 1271700223 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's quite stupid, because we live in 2010, not 1975 :P < 1271700229 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, and _why_ does plof (presumably) use autoconf? < 1271700239 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all we live in 2010, not 1975 :P < 1271700251 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because all the alternative systems suck donkey balls, and autoconf merely sucks dog balls? < 1271700271 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, yeah but it is one of those huge wild dogs :P < 1271700305 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, anyway there are non-sucky build systems. < 1271700320 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When you spend two years doing software build automation, you learn to love autoconf and hate {plain makefiles,scons,that one the name of which I can't remember} < 1271700328 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however all those I know of are targeting a single specific language < 1271700332 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like erlang or whatever < 1271700348 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, BSD make? < 1271700368 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, also there is a technical term for that. It is: brainwashing < 1271700379 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CMake? < 1271700382 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CMake! < 1271700385 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the one I hate the most! < 1271700388 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :God CMake sucks. < 1271700399 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most build systems are *terrible* for automation. < 1271700401 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Couldn't even remember that crappile's name. < 1271700405 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, why? I mean, it used to be worse. But even back then it was better than autoconf < 1271700408 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Autoconf at least gets it right. < 1271700409 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, CMake SUCKS for automation. < 1271700437 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :custom build system? < 1271700442 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L: Less so than it used to. < 1271700442 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl < 1271700449 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Those, I BURN WITH FIRE. < 1271700450 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, the kernel has a _very_ nice build system IMO < 1271700458 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, so you prefer the kernel to use autoconf? < 1271700463 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine the _huge_ command line < 1271700468 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION too has spend quite a bit of time doing build automation
< 1271700479 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: That no longer counts as custom, and its system only makes sense when you have an untenably huge number of configuration options. < 1271700482 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: No, that is one of the *very* few custom build systems that's not evil. < 1271700485 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to ./configure --arch=amd64 --enable-sata --disable-whatever --with-foo=module < 1271700487 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so on < 1271700508 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's great when you have a massive number of configuration options. < 1271700514 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most software packages are nowhere near as build-configurable as {the kernel,busybox}. < 1271700515 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, iirc uclibc uses kernel configure < 1271700519 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so does busybox iirc < 1271700533 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1271700537 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uclibc and busybox are both complex enough to need it. < 1271700540 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1271700549 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's also ALFS. < 1271700554 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder why glibc doesn't use it < 1271700557 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ALFS? < 1271700567 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Automated Linux From Scratch. < 1271700571 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Automated Linux From Scratch. It is exactly as WTF as it sounds. < 1271700573 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, oh it uses that? < 1271700577 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1271700580 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ALFS sounds like cheating ;P < 1271700590 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only slightly. < 1271700592 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION did LFS and HLFS the hard way
< 1271700609 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and HLFS I did successfully for a (back then at least) unsupported arch < 1271700629 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION can generally bootstrap a build chain from memory by now
< 1271700639 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but ALFS sounds interesting, I would very much like to learn how the kernel build system works on the inside < 1271700655 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but perhaps it will start to look horrible around then < 1271700658 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I start having issues when members of the build chain don't build without patches. < 1271700669 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stupid patches :P < 1271700672 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1271700677 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(uClibc; GCC just plain *hates* uClibc without patches) < 1271700687 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, do llvm + clang? < 1271700693 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X_X < 1271700698 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or isn't that mature enough to manage libc, kernel and so on yet? < 1271700707 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Insufficiently mature. < 1271700711 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : clang solves ALL PROBLEMS and also allows us to lock GNU out of OS X. < 1271700713 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1271700727 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, you started hating clang now? < 1271700728 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. The *C* frontend is, but the C++ frontend in the stable release isn't. < 1271700733 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you loved it recently < 1271700736 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: No, I don't hate clang, I hate Apple. < 1271700739 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never loved clang. < 1271700741 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1271700743 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1271700743 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm ambivalent toward clang. < 1271700748 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps it was pikhq who did < 1271700756 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do quite like Clang. < 1271700765 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It gives useful errors. Is nice. < 1271700770 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's an Apple IIe emulator for Android < 1271700783 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, who cares about C++? I don't think you need C++ for the base system < 1271700784 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do I have a feeling one will never exist for iProduct? < 1271700787 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: On a scale from one to ten, I find that entirely unsurprising. < 1271700801 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Because it's against the SDK license agreement? < 1271700808 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well of course you do for clang itself < 1271700817 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah apart from that (and that includes llvm) < 1271700817 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Surprisingly? Many things do require C++. < 1271700832 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, how is RoboZZle not against it? < 1271700841 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, getting a bootable POSIX shell with the standard POSIX commands does not < 1271700863 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It probably "is", but the license agreement is more about Apple asserting themselves as douchebags than actually accomplishing anything. < 1271700869 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depends on what you mean by "standard". Sure, coreutils and fileutils you can get without a C++ compiler.. < 1271700922 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well, all that is required from POSIX. I very much doubt you can't get that without C++. Unless it explicitly declares there should be a /usr/bin/c++ (and I have forgotten that) < 1271700940 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and by that I mean POSIX.1-2008 with no optional features < 1271700962 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only thing that is an issue is the C compiler < 1271700964 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as I said above < 1271700982 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in theory you could just use an older gcc version before it needed c++ stuff or pcc < 1271700990 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or tcc) < 1271701072 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh this looks nifty: http://codu.org/projects/stuff/hg/index.cgi/file/32bf7f3d092d/lddcapture < 1271701129 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can actually build GCC without a C++ compiler, and not build in C++ support. < 1271701144 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, does it copy just the files listed in ldd or does it try to copy the original one in case it happens to be a symlink? and then run ldconfig to recreate the symlink < 1271701164 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yes but gcc nowdays depend on some C++ libs iirc < 1271701173 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think they are optional any more < 1271701198 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: It copies and does not recreate symlinks. < 1271701200 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://gcc.gnu.org/install/prerequisites.html < 1271701211 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or hm maybe not < 1271701216 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: The created files are not expected to be canonical names, they are expected to be the names expected by the linker. < 1271701229 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, ah okay < 1271701258 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, this explains why it was too good to be true. Was hoping it was the perfect tool for populating chroots with the required libs < 1271701303 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it could certainly do that, so long as you don't care about the filename being correct ... that being said, if the libs depend on other files, you're still screwed. < 1271701323 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(e.g. files in /usr/share) < 1271701323 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, oh. Very much to good to be true then < 1271701326 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1271701343 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, so it *does* do foo -> libbar -> libquux correctly then? < 1271701352 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, in the sense that ldd does that for it. < 1271701369 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: No, those libraries just have optional C++ bindings. < 1271701388 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Must disappear now, ta. < 1271701390 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1271701391 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L, idea for future version: decompile the code in case of dlopen() to figure out (if possible) the arguments it is called with ;) < 1271701402 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah, he missed that lame joke < 1271701409 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, hm < 1271701446 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION feels unsanitary :(
< 1271701977 0 :Mathnerd314_!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271702137 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1271702138 0 :Mathnerd314_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Mathnerd314 < 1271703663 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~chatzilla@cpc5-sgyl29-2-0-cust220.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1271703684 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a thing like fork() which keeps the two threads using and modifying the same memory? < 1271703691 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In C, I should add. < 1271703788 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look into pthreads. < 1271703804 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also: abandon all hope, ye who enter here. < 1271704464 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanke ye. < 1271704858 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O dear god the manual pages don't cross-reference properly. < 1271704863 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HELP. < 1271705045 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1271705058 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, it doesn't? < 1271705070 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what bit of it specifically? < 1271705095 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :things under "see also" in man pthreads seems to work < 1271705097 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tried only a few < 1271705139 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there is always man pthread < 1271705258 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't have much more than twenty things in man, < 1271705301 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've checked Synaptic, and it doesn't look like there's a doc package I'm missing, or at least not an obvious one. < 1271705548 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh? < 1271705558 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what specific man page are you missing? < 1271705571 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, try apt-file on it < 1271705585 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(install and update apt-file's db first of course) < 1271705684 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most of the ones beginning with "pthreads", it seems. < 1271705740 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I can't help you without a *specific* example < 1271705748 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I can search for what package provides it < 1271705763 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now since you seem completely uninterested I'll leave it to yourself < 1271705766 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have fun with apt-file < 1271705808 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it might be 3p, worth considering) < 1271706275 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :manpages-posix-dev < 1271706450 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, he could have tried to help himself. He refused the help first, then the help to help. < 1271706486 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pthread_create < 1271706495 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well Gregor already helped you < 1271706506 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops, missed that. Thanks. < 1271706513 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I'm not feeling in the mood for helping someone who needs to look up in a dict what "specific" means < 1271706548 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that is the only theory consistent with your behaviour...) < 1271706710 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Feeling a modicum more dickish than usual, eh < 1271706773 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, I'm rather annoyed in general if that is what you mean < 1271706795 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah x-p < 1271706804 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, I also always have a problem with people who can't keep up in a convo. < 1271706809 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1271706815 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is fine up to a point < 1271706832 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that point varies depending on lots of things) < 1271707083 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye < 1271707085 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.5.9/20100401213457] < 1271707302 0 :MigoMipo!~MigoMipo@84-217-1-14.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271707814 0 :MizardX!~MizardX@unaffiliated/mizardx JOIN :#esoteric < 1271708049 0 :Tritonio_GR!~Tritonio@150.140.231.13 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271708264 0 :Tritonio_GR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1271708480 0 :charlls!~charlls@201.226.222.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271715782 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1271715782 0 :clog!nef@bespin.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1271715789 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271715843 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well? How do they work? < 1271716399 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No clue; they haven't told us. < 1271716437 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the Storage System (tm) is a commercial thing; the name was mentioned. < 1271716665 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was a SAN system called EMC CLARiiON AX150, but I'm not sure if that's the new or the old one. < 1271716893 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The laboratory has two large disk systems. The primary disk system is an HP EVA 5000, and the secondary is the newer EMC AX150." < 1271716905 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just not sure the "newer" here equals "newest", too. < 1271716930 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least the server names have changed. < 1271717310 0 :Norvig_Bonanza!~n.bonanza@189.216.232.19 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271717320 0 :Norvig_Bonanza!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1271717376 0 :augur!~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1271717459 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last SysAdmGroup meeting minutes document says they've actually been thinking about 5 GB/10 GB (soft/hard) quotas for ~; nothing for project and work disks, of course. < 1271717486 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1271718613 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1271718623 0 :cheater2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1271718941 0 :charlesq__!~charlls@201.226.222.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271718965 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Oh, and you asked about the SSD speed; this is the lamest benchmark of them all (hdparm -t --direct), but http://pastebin.com/TwSHuU5f -- sda's the SSD, sdb and sdc are identical "energy-save, low-noise" marketed 5400 RPM 1TB rotating disks. < 1271719081 0 :charlls!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1271719122 0 :Rugxulo!~rugxulo@adsl-065-013-115-246.sip.mob.bellsouth.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1271719139 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "Windows 7 was my idea!" What nonsense. < 1271719150 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they show the French ad (!) here in the U.S. ad nauseum ... why???? < 1271719166 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo: Fuck if I know. < 1271719181 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not even like we have a notable French-speaking population outside of Louisiana... < 1271719205 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Hey! Listen! < 1271719210 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's got (very small) subtitles, but they also (less often) show the English (U.K.) ad too < 1271719223 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least that one is comprehensible < 1271719237 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still, talk about a waste of money ... "Buy Windows! Oh wait, 99% of you already have it!" < 1271719274 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still laugh at the truth in ye olde "advertising, advertising, advertising ... fix Vista ... advertising, advertising, advertising ..." joke ad < 1271719370 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : It's one of the few states where Greens actually win positions occasional. < 1271719390 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY does Apple want to restrict apps, exactly? < 1271719391 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well Jesse Ventura made big headlines as (Independent) governor of Minnesota back in the day < 1271719393 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does it get them? < 1271719400 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno ... money, I guess < 1271719404 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree, it's silly < 1271719416 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"no cross-compiled stuff" ... eh? as if it matters! < 1271719466 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : well, you aren't (yet) grounded by an Icelandic ash cloud < 1271719482 0 :charlls!~charlls@201.226.222.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271719484 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/10/Eyjafjallajökull.ogg < 1271719555 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ejafjatlajokutl] < 1271719559 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something close to that < 1271719586 0 :cheater2!~cheater@ip-80-226-26-251.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1271719594 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gesundheit < 1271719601 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;-) < 1271719660 0 :charlesq__!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1271719711 0 :charlesq__!~charlls@201.226.222.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271719798 0 :charlls!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1271719808 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION imagines "As Katla erupts, the whole of Europe shivers, while American newscasters breathe a sound of relief."
< 1271719885 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/sound/sigh/ < 1271720075 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : God CMake sucks. < 1271720090 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's more and more common these days < 1271720372 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : and in theory you could just use an older gcc version before it needed c++ stuff or pcc < 1271720393 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :G++ only works with GCC (while I think you can, or used to, be able to build GCC itself with other CCs) < 1271720397 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo: Still a royal pain for build automation. < 1271720421 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, G++ only works with GCC, but that's quite irrelevant. < 1271720434 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just perform a bootstrap build, so that everything but GCC is built with GCC. < 1271720609 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what compilers work at compiling GCC? I presume ICC would work (or probably did in the past), doubt many others do (Sun C ???) < 1271720653 0 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-59-249.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1271720665 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1271720678 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sebbu < 1271720695 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo: GCC proper actually goes to great pains to be buildable by other compilers. < 1271720706 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the longest time it was written to allow a K&R compiler to build it. < 1271720709 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GCC is a great pain to build, IMHO ;-) < 1271720715 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is. < 1271720730 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It only uses autoconf, not automake. Ugh. < 1271720775 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, I imagine that using GCC 2.7.2 to build 2.95 would then allow newer versions to compile properly, if in a pinch (since those are easier, esp. 2.7.2) < 1271721286 0 :charlls!~charlls@201.226.222.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1271721431 0 :charlesq__!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds