< 1263945741 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1263946373 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone know a command that's like echo + cat? < 1263946386 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :specifically, it can append or prepend to standard output < 1263946569 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1263947057 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :echo | cat < 1263947065 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :echo foo | cat - /dev/hda < 1263947168 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1263947458 0 :sebbu2!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-28-94.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1263947610 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in bash, i think cat - `echo whatever` works < 1263947619 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er wait < 1263947647 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cat - <(echo whatever) may have been it < 1263947679 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway there is some syntax for inserting the output of one command as a file in another < 1263947709 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<<<`foo` < 1263947712 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe < 1263947716 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :var TiredPerson = new { Name = "Sgeo" }; < 1263947722 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in any case, I just switched to perl < 1263947761 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is irrationally addicted to C#
< 1263947769 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bad < 1263947839 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :var coppro = (from chatter in CSharpHaters select chatter).First(); < 1263947880 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1263947944 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION may end up installing Visual Studio so that he can easily use SQLite
< 1263948035 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1263948042 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The syntax is a pipe :P < 1263948046 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :echo foo | cat - bar < 1263948062 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: fail < 1263948073 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you cannot pass the _original_ stdin to cat that way < 1263948088 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't pass the original stdin to cat your way. < 1263948091 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd have to do something like < 1263948093 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I want is a command like "append foo" that output foo+stdin < 1263948098 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure you can < 1263948098 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without using backticks < 1263948130 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Wait, so you just want cat foo - < 1263948142 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: <(bleh) overrides stdin < 1263948147 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: no < 1263948157 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that outputs the content of the file `foo` < 1263948163 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: You'd have to specify an input FD, then convince cat to read from that fd (/proc/self/fds/bleh) < 1263948165 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: in that case <() is not what i meant < 1263948167 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just want "foo+(whatever came through stdin)" < 1263948177 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahhhhhhhh, OK < 1263948203 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In that case, (echo foo; cat) :P < 1263948225 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: bash has a syntax for creating named pipes with the output of a given command, and putting the _name_ of that pipe in an outer command < 1263948242 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Ah, then I am unaware of that syntax. < 1263948251 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it may be that i remembered <() wrongly for it < 1263948290 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seeing as i haven't used it in years, myself < 1263948362 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, <() was correct < 1263948400 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BTW, the pipe is only viewable by the process that bash invokes < 1263948414 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Process substitution is the term used < 1263948443 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Process substitution is supported on systems that support named pipes (FIFOs) or the /dev/fd method of naming open files. It takes the form of <(list) or >(list). < 1263948443 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :process substitution doesn't work when the command feeds the filename to a second command < 1263948446 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1263948462 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. if that command is a shell script < 1263948469 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm true < 1263948529 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um wouldn't that only apply if the second command tried to access it after it has been deleted? < 1263948554 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think so < 1263948576 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely /dev/fd looks different to each process? < 1263948587 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh maybe < 1263948597 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1263948605 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the named pipe thing should still work? < 1263948618 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ cat `echo <(ls)` < 1263948619 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cat: /dev/fd/63: No such file or directory < 1263948652 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC: that doesn't count anyway, because echo obviously finishes before cat opens the file < 1263948661 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn < 1263948691 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1263948717 0 :coppro!n=coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1263948748 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well, sounds brittle anyhow < 1263948783 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, you can't read from it twice < 1263949989 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1263950584 0 :kwertii!n=kwertii@ResNet-1-118.resnet.ucsb.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1263951922 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1263952130 0 :augur!n=augur@c-68-33-240-147.hsd1.dc.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263952840 0 :Sgeo_!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263953184 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1263954184 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1263954212 0 :coppro!n=coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1263955056 0 :kwertii_!n=kwertii@ResNet-1-118.resnet.ucsb.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1263955069 0 :kwertii_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1263955096 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1263955883 0 :augur_!n=augur@c-68-33-240-147.hsd1.dc.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263955893 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1263956887 0 :zeotrope!n=zeotrope@bas3-kitchener06-1096623078.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1263962343 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1263962711 0 :Pthing!n=pthing@cpc11-pres4-0-0-cust168.pres.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263963098 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1263964636 0 :augur!n=augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr2.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263964992 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1263965270 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263965271 0 :coppro!n=coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1263966115 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1263966663 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wooot < 1263966676 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like the Edmonton library approved my loan of Once More with Footnotes < 1263969738 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1263970328 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1263970651 0 :cal153!n=cal@c-69-181-46-213.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263970966 0 :oklopol!n=oklopol@a91-153-117-63.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1263971680 0 :FireFly!n=firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1263972443 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1263972922 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1263974399 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1263974400 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1263977138 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263978234 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1263979225 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1263979274 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1263981216 0 :Pthing!n=pthing@cpc11-pres4-0-0-cust168.pres.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263981637 0 :cheater!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Verlassend" < 1263982798 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1263984944 0 :jpc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1263988219 0 :adu!n=ajr@pool-74-96-89-187.washdc.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263989627 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1263989629 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1263990398 0 :scarf!n=scarf@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263990540 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990540 0 :Ayeraw!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990541 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990541 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990541 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990541 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990541 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990541 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990649 0 :Leonidas!n=Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1263990649 0 :Ayeraw!n=wareya@cpe-74-70-140-214.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263990649 0 :rodgort!n=rodgort@adsl-71-142-227-255.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263990649 0 :SimonRC!n=sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263990649 0 :jix!n=jix@cyb0rg.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263990649 0 :mtve!n=nnnnnmtv@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263990649 0 :HackEgo!n=HackEgo@codu.xen.prgmr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263990649 0 :dbc!n=daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263990659 0 :Leonidas1!n=Leonidas@chronon.pointtec.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1263990674 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Success < 1263990674 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1263990675 0 :SimonRC!n=sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263990680 0 :Ayeraw!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1263990966 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990967 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990968 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990968 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990968 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990968 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990969 0 :Leonidas1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990969 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990969 0 :yiyus!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990970 0 :mycroftiv!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990970 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990972 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990972 0 :zeotrope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990972 0 :cheater2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990973 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990974 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990975 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990975 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990975 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990975 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990976 0 :comex_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990976 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990976 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990977 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990978 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990978 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263990978 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263991003 0 :AnMaster!n=AnMaster@cl-394.sto-01.se.sixxs.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991411 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1263991515 0 :uorygl!n=warrie@lunch.normish.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991515 0 :Deewiant!n=deewiant@kekkonen.cs.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991515 0 :sebbu2!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-28-94.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991515 0 :cal153!n=cal@c-69-181-46-213.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991515 0 :MizardX!n=MizardX@unaffiliated/mizardx JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991552 0 :sebbu!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-28-94.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991552 0 :SimonRC!n=sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991552 0 :rodgort!n=rodgort@adsl-71-142-227-255.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991552 0 :jix!n=jix@cyb0rg.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991552 0 :mtve!n=nnnnnmtv@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991552 0 :HackEgo!n=HackEgo@codu.xen.prgmr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991552 0 :dbc!n=daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :Ayeraw!n=wareya@cpe-74-70-140-214.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :adu!n=ajr@74.96.89.187 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :cheater3!n=cheater@ip-80-226-230-231.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :Leonidas1!n=Leonidas@chronon.pointtec.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :scarf!n=scarf@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :yiyus!i=12427124@je.je.je JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :mycroftiv!n=infernus@h69-128-47-243.mdsnwi.dedicated.static.tds.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :augur!n=augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr2.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :zeotrope!n=zeotrope@bas3-kitchener06-1096623078.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@75.106.100.139 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@174-16-91-41.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :Slereah_!n=Slereah@ANantes-259-1-69-215.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :olsner!n=salparot@c83-252-238-148.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :lifthrasiir!i=r8UXdG9h@143.248.133.205 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :comex_!i=comex@c-98-210-192-54.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :ineiros!n=itniemin@dsl-hkibrasgw1-fe27f900-103.dhcp.inet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991581 0 :Gracenotes!n=person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991605 0 :AnMaster_!n=AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991782 0 :sebbu3!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-28-94.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991791 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263991791 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263991791 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263991792 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263991792 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263991792 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263991792 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263991824 0 :sebbu!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-28-94.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991824 0 :SimonRC!n=sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991824 0 :rodgort!n=rodgort@adsl-71-142-227-255.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991824 0 :jix!n=jix@cyb0rg.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991824 0 :mtve!n=nnnnnmtv@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991824 0 :HackEgo!n=HackEgo@codu.xen.prgmr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991824 0 :dbc!n=daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263991991 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263991991 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263991991 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263991991 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263992055 0 :cal153!n=cal@c-69-181-46-213.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263992055 0 :sebbu2!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-28-94.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1263992055 0 :Deewiant!n=deewiant@kekkonen.cs.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1263992055 0 :uorygl!n=warrie@lunch.normish.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263992067 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Dead socket < 1263992202 0 :Leonidas1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263992203 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263992203 0 :yiyus!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263992203 0 :mycroftiv!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263992306 0 :Leonidas1!n=Leonidas@chronon.pointtec.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1263992306 0 :scarf!n=scarf@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263992306 0 :yiyus!i=12427124@je.je.je JOIN :#esoteric < 1263992306 0 :mycroftiv!n=infernus@h69-128-47-243.mdsnwi.dedicated.static.tds.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263992410 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1263992442 0 :rodgort!n=rodgort@adsl-71-142-227-255.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263992618 0 :comex!i=comex@c-98-210-192-54.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263992620 0 :comex_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1263992910 0 :cheater!n=cheater@62.176.155.187 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993129 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263993129 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263993129 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263993130 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263993130 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263993130 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263993130 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263993190 0 :comex!i=comex@c-98-210-192-54.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993288 0 :sebbu!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-28-94.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993288 0 :SimonRC!n=sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993288 0 :jix!n=jix@cyb0rg.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993288 0 :mtve!n=nnnnnmtv@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993288 0 :HackEgo!n=HackEgo@codu.xen.prgmr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993288 0 :dbc!n=daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993313 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1263993324 0 :SimonRC!n=sc@217.155.91.250 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993328 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1263993338 0 :jix!n=jix@cyb0rg.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993344 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1263993426 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263993426 0 :cheater!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263993426 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263993426 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263993426 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263993450 0 :cal153!n=cal@c-69-181-46-213.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993463 0 :cheater!n=cheater@62.176.155.187 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993463 0 :rodgort!n=rodgort@adsl-71-142-227-255.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993463 0 :Deewiant!n=deewiant@kekkonen.cs.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1263993463 0 :uorygl!n=warrie@lunch.normish.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994190 0 :cheater!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994190 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994190 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994190 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994191 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994191 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994191 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994191 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994191 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994193 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994194 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994195 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994195 0 :Leonidas1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994195 0 :mycroftiv!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994195 0 :yiyus!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994197 0 :zeotrope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994197 0 :cheater3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994197 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994198 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994198 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994199 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994199 0 :AnMaster_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994200 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994200 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994200 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994200 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994201 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994201 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994201 0 :Ayeraw!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :lindbohm.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1263994942 0 :MizardX!n=MizardX@unaffiliated/mizardx JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :uorygl!n=warrie@lunch.normish.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :Deewiant!n=deewiant@kekkonen.cs.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :rodgort!n=rodgort@adsl-71-142-227-255.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :dbc!n=daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :HackEgo!n=HackEgo@codu.xen.prgmr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :mtve!n=nnnnnmtv@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :SimonRC!n=sc@217.155.91.250 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :cal153!n=cal@c-69-181-46-213.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :scarf!n=scarf@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :mycroftiv!n=infernus@h69-128-47-243.mdsnwi.dedicated.static.tds.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :yiyus!i=12427124@je.je.je JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :Leonidas1!n=Leonidas@chronon.pointtec.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :comex!i=comex@c-98-210-192-54.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :jix!n=jix@cyb0rg.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :AnMaster_!n=AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :Ayeraw!n=wareya@cpe-74-70-140-214.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :adu!n=ajr@74.96.89.187 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :cheater3!n=cheater@ip-80-226-230-231.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :augur!n=augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr2.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :zeotrope!n=zeotrope@bas3-kitchener06-1096623078.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@75.106.100.139 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@174-16-91-41.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :Slereah_!n=Slereah@ANantes-259-1-69-215.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :olsner!n=salparot@c83-252-238-148.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :lifthrasiir!i=r8UXdG9h@143.248.133.205 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :ineiros!n=itniemin@dsl-hkibrasgw1-fe27f900-103.dhcp.inet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1263994982 0 :Gracenotes!n=person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1263995026 0 :cheater!n=cheater@62.176.155.187 JOIN :#esoteric < 1263995729 0 :Pthing!n=pthing@cpc11-pres4-0-0-cust168.pres.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1263995778 0 :run-bandit!n=run-band@c122-107-157-99.eburwd5.vic.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1263995793 0 :run-bandit!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this place < 1263995799 0 :run-bandit!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :programming language? < 1263995802 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1263995811 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the less serious programming languages around < 1263995899 0 :run-bandit!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1263995986 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What, isn't esolangery Serious Business™? < 1263996010 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you never know, it might be < 1263996020 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only by exploring the silly can you find the interesting on the edge of serious < 1263996287 0 :run-bandit!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"lol" < 1263997331 0 :MissPiggy!n=quantum@unaffiliated/fax JOIN :#esoteric < 1263999475 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1263999482 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1263999492 0 :Deewiant!n=deewiant@kekkonen.cs.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1264000299 0 :cpressey!n=CPressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1264001686 0 :Pthing!n=pthing@cpc11-pres4-0-0-cust168.pres.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1264001778 0 :FireFly!n=firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1264003674 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1264003831 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1264003846 0 :scarf!n=scarf@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1264004128 0 :jpc!n=jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1264004157 0 :cheater!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so does esolang run in a vm of some sort < 1264004171 0 :cheater!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do i get an interpreter for esolang under ubuntu? < 1264004174 0 :cheater!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1264004354 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, version 3.1.1 of esolang was just released last week < 1264004455 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"esolang"'s a general term < 1264004471 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although you can find interpreters for individual esolangs in the repositories if they're really well known, or on the wiki otherwise < 1264004473 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi cpressey by the way < 1264004620 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1264004665 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm too busy with RL stuff to really do much esolanging at the moment... < 1264004841 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to find more time for it recently. < 1264004866 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The last interesting one I've done is: http://catseye.tc/projects/zowie/ < 1264004914 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I noticed that one in #esoteric's last review of What Cats's Eye Has Been Up To Recently, but didn't really look at it in detail < 1264004925 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For some reason "zowie" made my mind immediately jump to "Yom Kippur", used as some kind of generic expression of happiness. "Yom Kippur, this is the tastiest pie I've ever had!" < 1264004939 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's rather reminicent of continuation passing style, though < 1264005022 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scarf: Huh. I have been very interested in continuations lately, but honestly, I wasn't thinking about them at all in ZOWIE < 1264005025 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but instead of storing the IP and data together, you can access each of them separately < 1264005048 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a Zowie program state is almost a continuation, except you only use half of it at a time, which is rather interesting < 1264005132 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I wonder if it's TC even without the ability to rollback? it's a lot less obvious whether it's TC or not then, but it's not obviously incomplete < 1264005205 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scarf: From what I remember... without rollback you can only do "repeat" loops, not "while". < 1264005223 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but I think repeat may be enough for TCness by itself < 1264005229 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders if he should try and force his C lambda code into using CPS...
< 1264005234 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea is, immediately after each loop you "undo" one interation of it < 1264005243 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would have the advantage of getting rid of the stack overflows... < 1264005244 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's not obvious that doing that is always possible < 1264005251 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it seems to be folklore that repeat is insufficient for TC. i remember looking and i couldn't find an explicit proof < 1264005268 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Explicit repeat count? < 1264005274 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm relatively certain that it depends on other details of the language; it's sufficient sometimes, but not otherwise < 1264005276 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tho, i think i know what you're talking about re "undo" < 1264005279 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: no, while but that always loops at least once < 1264005281 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(computing fact 10 overflows the stack ATM. ... In addition.) < 1264005313 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1264005334 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No if construct? < 1264005343 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scarf: if you could prove that "repeat" loops are sufficient for TC I think you would have something very publishable. at least, that is the impression i formed from what research i did see (e.g. Kozen's work on "while programs") < 1264005364 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: "if" + "repeat" can emulate "while" < 1264005365 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: no if < 1264005385 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easy enough to imagine languages in which it is possible < 1264005413 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine a C-like language which stored a sort of "transaction history" of all changes to variables, and had a method to undo the most recent change < 1264005430 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION cannot quite get to grips with this scarf-ais guy
< 1264005447 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by using a stack of counters which held how many changes there had been, you could just undo the right number of changes < 1264005460 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's requiring a rather implausibly high amount of support from the language, though < 1264005534 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scarf: well, maybe too much support to be taken seriously, but still an interesting esolang design < 1264005571 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm wondering how little language support you could get away with; for instance, bignum BF probably has enough, although I'm less sure about that < 1264005587 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or rather, I should say "DoFuck", I suppose) < 1264005619 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since BF maps very easily to "repeat programs", i think that would be publishable < 1264005646 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps, but I'm trying to do too many papers in parallel as it is < 1264005654 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(again, to clarify, i don't think "publishable" should necessarily be anyone's goal, i'm just using it to describe how surprising it would be) < 1264005724 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one thing that comes to mind is: set a variable to 0 before the loop, and to 1 at the end. then at least you should be able to do any _arithmetic_ as if it was a while loop, by exploiting that (assuming you have at least multiplication) < 1264005743 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/at the end/just before the end/ < 1264005789 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1264005801 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you then have a flag to help you ignore the first iteration < 1264005813 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that sounds reasonable < 1264005888 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and for TC you don't need anything more then than arithmetic assignments, i think < 1264005936 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :folklore has been proven wrong before :) < 1264005939 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you guys talking about reversibly TC languages? < 1264005948 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm you can even do output with C-like strings, as long as you don't mind outputting a lot of 0-length strings < 1264005973 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no afaik < 1264005985 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MissPiggy: about TC languages without the ability to skip code < 1264005996 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. every loop runs at least once, no if < 1264006030 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the relationship between that and reversible programs is... obscure, at least < 1264006041 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i won't say they're not related somehow tho < 1264006046 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they do feel related < 1264006051 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can't skip code, you have to undo the loop < 1264006060 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, too deep, too early, too little coffee :) < 1264006072 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally, it turns out that INTERCAL is TC even with no flow control but jumping from the end of the program to the start < 1264006078 0 :Asztal!n=asztal@host86-166-171-80.range86-166.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1264006084 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it has rather a rich set of ways to not do commands, so that's rather unsurprising < 1264006137 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, one of the "while program" results is that you only really need one while loop, so... yeah < 1264006172 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, if you only need the one loop, it surely isn't much of a problem to ensure it always iterates once < 1264006192 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless the result allows cheating by using things like ifs inside the loop < 1264006251 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well... if you collapse nested loops into a single loop then you can't take oerjan's suggestion of setting a variable to 0 "just before the end" of an inner loop because you've eliminated the inner loop < 1264006307 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but then you wouldn't need to < 1264006368 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, i can't really tell how it would work at this point. < 1264006383 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely you convert to a single while loop before converting that one into repeat < 1264006406 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you clearly can't do BF with just a single loop < 1264006412 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at any rate, i'm occupied for the next little while, so i'll let my brain marinate < 1264006450 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: but if it's while, can't you skip it? < 1264006481 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION whistles innocently
< 1264006503 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1264006508 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scarf: true, because you need loops to perform and/or, which while loop collapsing needs < 1264006534 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as I said already, I think it's going to be heavily dependent on the other details of the language < 1264006568 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i can't see why not < 1264006583 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(*woosh*) < 1264006647 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i'd need to see an example in order to reason about it, at this point. < 1264006672 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: um that was a pun, referring to your "next little while" < 1264006710 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh :) < 1264006724 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is the #1 danger of having a productive mathematical discussion with oerjan < 1264006750 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl < 1264007735 0 :AnMaster_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :AnMaster < 1264008039 0 :sebbu3!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sebbu < 1264008887 0 :jpc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1264008926 0 :jpc!n=jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1264009033 0 :jpc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1264009072 0 :jpc!n=jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1264009211 0 :sexygirl153!n=cal@c-69-181-46-213.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1264009279 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1264009915 0 :cheater3!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1264010441 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1264011513 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1264011873 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA" < 1264012182 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1264013127 0 :Gracenotes!n=person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1264015716 0 :augur!n=augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1264017042 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1264017151 0 :adu!n=ajr@pool-74-96-89-187.washdc.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1264018627 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1264019124 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1264019307 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"reboot" < 1264022479 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater3: hi < 1264022515 0 :sebbu!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-28-94.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1264022767 0 :cheater3!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi SimonRC < 1264022806 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it gets busier later < 1264022812 0 :cheater3!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know < 1264022830 0 :cheater3!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are some esolangs you work with simon? < 1264023365 0 :nooga!n=nooga@sc82.internetdsl.tpnet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1264023391 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1264023444 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? < 1264023474 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :evening of weird nicknames < 1264023513 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sexygirl153 is the best < 1264023533 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's for sure < 1264023544 0 :sexygirl153!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for sure < 1264023580 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1264023656 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seur < 1264023808 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that "153" age or a birth-year or what? < 1264024201 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1264026032 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1264028199 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1264028408 0 :Azstal!n=asztal@host86-172-3-224.range86-172.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1264028603 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know < 1264028623 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1264028627 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hae an idea but it's so undefined that i cannot even express it < 1264028673 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1264028683 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga you should talk to me with this idea in mind < 1264028703 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you get this feeling sometimes? < 1264028774 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1264028787 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of times < 1264028826 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1264028836 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION isn't sure if he does
< 1264028839 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1264028873 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure i can think an idea if i don't express it somehow < 1264029025 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more specifically, i think i have trouble _remembering_ things that cannot be put in words < 1264029039 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or symbols, at least) < 1264029079 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which could of course mean that i _do_ have such feelings but just don't remember them < 1264029173 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION should probably eat
< 1264029192 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION tends to die if he doesn't eat
< 1264029207 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this a frequent problem of yours? < 1264029278 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1264030354 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1264031197 0 :augur!n=augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr2.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1264031348 0 :coppro!n=coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1264031727 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving"