< 1227657866 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If a program does nothing but output a single character many times, running it is probably a bad way of determining how many times it outputs that character. < 1227657886 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION takes a look at BF busy beaver < 1227659179 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :warrie_, hrrm? < 1227659205 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well bf is deterministic depending on input < 1227659211 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no random operator < 1227659221 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the same program should give the same count < 1227659228 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when given the same input < 1227659239 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... found an interesting blog when I tried to find the BFBB... http://eigenratios.blogspot.com/ < 1227659261 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MizardX, seen it before once < 1227659267 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what is eigenratio? < 1227659288 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :old :P < 1227659297 0 :ab5tract!n=ab5tract@pool-71-246-5-13.phlapa.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227659311 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eigen values is some special constants that comes from matrices, and a few other systems. < 1227659315 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How would you determine the amount of output given by a program like +[->++<]>[->++<]>[->++<]>[->++<]>[->++<]>[->++<]>[->++<]>[->++<]>[->++<]>[->++<]>[->++<]>[->++<]>[->++<]>[->++<]>[-..]? < 1227659321 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MizardX, hm ok < 1227659339 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :warrie_, run it with a given input? < 1227659346 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait till it finishes < 1227659367 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doing it otherwise sounds like it would solve the halting problem < 1227659378 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you may be able to solve that specific case however < 1227659387 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: suppose there are 1,000,000 [->++<]>s. < 1227659397 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2^15 < 1227659409 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :characters will be printed < 1227659411 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :warrie_, hm I think that may be well defined < 1227659421 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would you run it, or perform some simple calculation and end up at 2^1000001? < 1227659421 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that one is easy in fact < 1227659435 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes since you can see much much every [->++<]> adds < 1227659456 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then figure out the rate for decrementing < 1227659495 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :warrie_, but the general case of bf programs.. wouldn't that solve the halting program? < 1227659515 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1227659535 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, maybe not. < 1227659553 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really? < 1227659576 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION waits for warrie_ to explain himself < 1227659686 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find it likely at the moment that it's possible to take any program that outputs n (possibly infinitely many) characters and produce one that runs faster and outputs a number of characters of which n is a function. < 1227659695 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Modulo formality and all. < 1227659759 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously, it's possible to run the [->++<]> program, note the number of characters it outputs, and produce the null program, with the function being a constant function. < 1227659928 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227659929 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.getacoder.com/projects/bug_finder_92913.html < 1227660117 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That there is a computable function F whose input is a program that outputs n characters and whose output is n if n is finite, where F runs faster than the trivial function satisfying this criterion. < 1227660121 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That being the "run it" function. < 1227660169 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, that won't do. < 1227660195 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe it will. < 1227660269 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1227662272 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, my ORK interpreter now runs *all* demo programs correctly, including the Kipple interpreter. < 1227662301 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've also added implementation notes and bugs. < 1227662311 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.formauri.es/personal/pgimeno/temp/esoteric/orkdemo.php < 1227662568 0 :Corun!n=Corun@94-192-102-5.zone6.bethere.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1227662954 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"This computer has gone to sleep" < 1227664213 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eigenratio for the Conway's Life self-interpreter: 5760. ("That's the number of generations that need to be run in Dean Bell's unit cell at level N in order to emulate a single generation in level N+1.") < 1227664275 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1227664453 0 :ab5tract!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1227664731 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer the eigenratio 5760*500*500, since each big generation-cell is that many little generation-cells. < 1227665652 0 :ab5tract!n=ab5tract@pool-71-246-5-13.phlapa.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227668937 0 :ab5tract!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1227671223 0 :Organ_used_homos!n=Slereah@ANantes-252-1-37-61.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1227671396 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better description of eigenratio: http://eigenratios.blogspot.com/2006_08_18_archive.html (He was the one who named it) < 1227671531 0 :Organ_used_homos!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay :D < 1227671565 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Organ_used_homos: Please describe the reason for your nickname with NO DETAILS AT ALL < 1227672031 0 :Organ_used_homos!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's an explanation with no detail : It was on another server. < 1227672037 0 :Organ_used_homos!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Slereah_ < 1227672059 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Please include precisely one more level of detail. < 1227672103 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was a joke. < 1227672237 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1227672440 0 :psygnisfive!n=psygnisf@c-71-57-164-119.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227674858 0 :ab5tract!n=ab5tract@pool-71-246-5-13.phlapa.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227674865 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'sup dude < 1227674912 0 :ab5tract!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1227676946 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mmm, supper. < 1227676952 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is a sup dude. < 1227676967 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GET IT? GET IT? IT'S A PUN. < 1227677073 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO YOU WANT MORE DETAILS NOW < 1227678351 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION randomly decided to look at JSMIPS again. < 1227678409 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ "today" < 1227678464 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :JSMIPS? < 1227678497 0 :warrie_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1227678541 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: http://codu.org/jsmips/ < 1227678796 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol! < 1227679911 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) < 1227682315 0 :GreaseMonkey!n=gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1227685131 0 :sebbu2!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-55-108.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1227685199 0 :olsner!n=salparot@79.136.60.96 JOIN :#esoteric < 1227686288 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1227686289 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sebbu < 1227686399 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1227686400 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1227689462 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"I'm a thaasophobic." < 1227689768 0 :nooga_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Lost terminal" < 1227690455 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1227690869 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1227692167 0 :trave!n=chatzill@c-98-202-197-109.hsd1.ut.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227693307 0 :trave_!n=chatzill@c-98-202-197-109.hsd1.ut.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227693371 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1227693373 0 :trave_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :trave < 1227694170 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 145 (Connection timed out) < 1227695036 0 :trave!n=chatzill@97-117-111-148.slkc.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227696610 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1227697521 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1227697830 0 :Corun!n=Corun@94-193-40-216.zone7.bethere.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1227698625 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"This computer has gone to sleep" < 1227699968 0 :Corun!n=Corun@94-193-40-216.zone7.bethere.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1227700385 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"This computer has gone to sleep" < 1227700878 0 :nooga!n=nooga@89.174.55.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1227700883 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shiiit < 1227700887 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i forgot C < 1227701006 0 :trave_!n=chatzill@97-117-100-121.slkc.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227701050 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1227701076 0 :trave_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :trave < 1227701245 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1227701542 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: impressive! (jsmips) < 1227701670 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Orc looks cool. < 1227701681 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I can do sum pi-calc with it :o < 1227701775 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1227703038 0 :nooga!n=nooga@89.174.55.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1227703047 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clock() does not work :C < 1227703112 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about cock() < 1227703118 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does it not work? < 1227703252 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.ladyada.net/make/fuzebox/ < 1227703254 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fucking WANT < 1227703891 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4K ram? good for 99bob and stuff but quite limited otherwise < 1227704015 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"NTSC RCA composite and S-video out (PAL not supported at this time)" < 1227704016 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1227704034 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that limits it's usefulness here in Europe < 1227704441 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pgimeno: it's for 8-bit games < 1227704443 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see the video < 1227705267 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems that a fully functional VM is pretty hard... < 1227705273 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need to pass everything to functions to get it working < 1227705278 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you have to put the functions SOMEWHERE < 1227705288 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's mutation of the machine state < 1227705455 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm. < 1227705458 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Machine state. < 1227705466 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I for one welcome our new robot overlord. < 1227705569 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1227706196 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: appealing a cfj because of schildt < 1227706198 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT i can support < 1227706209 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: wrong channel, but yes < 1227706223 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, schildt's programming is esoteric < 1227706224 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1227706611 0 :oklokok!n=nnscript@a91-153-121-248.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1227706774 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o < 1227706898 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, http://www.wired.com/techbiz/people/magazine/16-12/ff_kaminsky?currentPage=all < 1227706901 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ interesting. < 1227707090 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheap sensation < 1227707109 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the attack is absolutely not cheap < 1227707417 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The article, on the other hand... < 1227707420 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The vulnerability gave him the power to transfer millions out of bank accounts worldwide." < 1227707452 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes. < 1227707456 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's entertaining. < 1227707472 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who reads wired for serious, somber articles? < 1227707521 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1227708202 0 :Mony!n=AssHole@AToulouse-258-1-138-29.w86-217.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1227708252 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plop < 1227708318 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yo < 1227708337 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :salut Slereah_ ^^ < 1227708359 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Comment vas-tu, Mona. < 1227708367 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mona :O < 1227708376 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ça va < 1227708377 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :et toi ? < 1227708410 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :De même. < 1227708420 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Je dis Mona car c'est le nom des chats de 2chan. < 1227708447 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :c'est aussi le nom d'une femme < 1227708452 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, je ne suis pas une femme :D < 1227708559 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://membres.lycos.fr/bewulf/Divers6/Shii2.jpg < 1227708571 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Mona vient de la police utilisé pour les faire) < 1227708624 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/ < 1227708725 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The scary part is that I understood half of that conversation/ < 1227708794 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it did involve kittuns < 1227710381 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who wants to think about a purely functional vm and how it's impossible < 1227711018 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Virtual machine? < 1227711031 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also why would it be impossible? :o < 1227711444 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: yes, and because to do anything you have to modify e.g. the call stack or similar < 1227711446 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :le francophonic invasion < 1227711449 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's impossible to have a VM that only appends < 1227711450 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaa < 1227711450 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without mutating < 1227711459 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because at the heart, its based on memory which mutates < 1227711526 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird : Only if you consider every memory-part of the machine as the memory. < 1227711542 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus, imagine if your machine just rearranged its connections! < 1227711554 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: well, show me a spec for a purely-functional (no mutation whatsoever) vm that lets you add two numbers < 1227711558 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what connections do you mean? < 1227711558 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll show the mutation. < 1227711572 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BETWEEN THE COMPONENTS < 1227711579 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wires and such. < 1227711583 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < 1227711589 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Virtual ones. < 1227711609 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also < 1227711616 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am a functional machine D: < 1227711624 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: Show the specccccc :P < 1227711627 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Give me a program, I'll interpret it for you < 1227711658 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :filthy ocaml junkie you are < 1227711668 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_ doesn't know ocaml < 1227711670 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as I know < 1227711671 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so shush < 1227711681 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he < 1227711682 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'s a scheme lad. < 1227711686 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know Ocaml < 1227711690 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha! < 1227711690 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just don't use it < 1227711705 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I'm curious about picaml < 1227711712 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also orc on the esowiki < 1227711715 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am intrigued. < 1227711727 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To pick a single point out there, I'm not seeing why you couldn't have an immutable call stack. < 1227711762 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: how would you call a function? < 1227711770 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's immutable. you can't change the call stack. < 1227711774 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it must not change. < 1227711799 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can construct a new call stack, though. < 1227711810 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes indeed. Whatever that means. < 1227711810 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Where do you put it? < 1227711812 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't replace it. < 1227711815 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With the new one. < 1227711832 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just assume it means something along "Using memory-part as not the memory itself" < 1227711864 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You can all very well construct a new call stack, but it just sits there doing nothing. < 1227711871 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't put it into VM memory; it's immutable. < 1227711950 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can pass it to the function. < 1227711965 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's more of a continuation than a call stack in that case, though. < 1227711973 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Pass it to what function? < 1227711979 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't construct a function, it has nowhere to go in memory. < 1227712009 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need to make a function then pass a reference to the vm so that it calls it. < 1227712020 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But making a function and getting a reference requires putting a function in memory, thus mutating memory. < 1227712029 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vm-memory that is < 1227712045 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh? I assume you have something that can allocate new memory, yes. < 1227712060 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes, but the _in-vm memory cannot change_. < 1227712065 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is the whole point: it's purely functional < 1227712076 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you cannot _mutate anything existing_ that exists inside the VM < 1227712100 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not about implementation < 1227712103 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's about the deisgn of the vm itself < 1227712107 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh... cons'ing new storage does not sound like mutation to me. < 1227712108 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all code in the vm is purely functional, that is < 1227712123 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that requires changing the VM's memory. < 1227712127 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :changing anything within the VM is not allowed. < 1227712158 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just means giving it new storage. I'm not sure why your completely functional VM would have mutable memory anyway. < 1227712169 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... when did I say it would? < 1227712192 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Since I absolutely cannot see how it is possible: how would you spec a VM that mutates nothing within the VM, that lets you add two integers together? < 1227712224 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there must be some issue of definition mismatch somewhere. < 1227712238 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most likely. < 1227712243 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But how would you spec such a trivial thing? < 1227712302 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume a purely functional VM would have (wrt. memory) a single primitive like (cons), which would not be considered mutation. < 1227712324 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Example? < 1227712335 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus, why are you always thinking of Lisp? < 1227712345 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not like it's the only functional thingamagig. < 1227712352 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Umm. < 1227712355 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since when am I? < 1227712357 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, a single primitive like malloc, then, if you want it to sound low-levelish. < 1227712358 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also. < 1227712361 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lisp is not purely functional. < 1227712370 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not the language, ehird < 1227712373 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The original lisp! < 1227712373 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that was directed to me. I know it most, that's why. < 1227712381 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The lisp that is purely functional < 1227712385 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm just asking how you can have a functional VM that lets you add two integers together. I'm not sure you can. < 1227712437 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not going to start speccing things. But it's a *virtual machine*, you can freely select what sort of primitives you provide. < 1227712456 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not think you can create a virtual machine that is able to operate without any mutation whatsoever. < 1227712470 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You've basically just said "you're wrong", soooooo... < 1227712701 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your VM can have "call this object as a function" as a primitive, for one thing. You don't need to construct any call stacks or do any mutation "inside the VM" to call a function, then. < 1227712710 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: how do you make an object < 1227712720 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :push to a stack? ding, you just mutated < 1227712725 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :put in a register? dinnnnnnggggggggggg < 1227712728 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :put in vm memory? DINGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG < 1227712740 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With another primitive that allocates new storage. < 1227712753 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, and what does it return? How do you use the storage? < 1227712779 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, allocates and initializes to whatever you want. < 1227712786 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Immutable storage, that is. < 1227712791 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Variable sized objects? < 1227712794 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you initialize them? < 1227712820 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't need variable-sized objects, but I don't see why that would be a problem. < 1227712832 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: In the actual bytecode. < 1227712843 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you initialize an object with a variable sized initialization? < 1227712869 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The function call primitive can easily accept a variable number of parameters. < 1227712885 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, let's look at this example: < 1227712890 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or the storage-allocation-and-initialization primitive. < 1227712892 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{...} call < 1227712892 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you can build variable-sized objects out of fixed-size objects, anyway. < 1227712901 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that {...} has to mutate, to put it on the stack or similar < 1227712961 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh? If it's a parameter to call, why would you need to put it on a stack? < 1227712984 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: {...} being a function < 1227712993 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, why not. < 1227712995 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Besides, how can call take variable parameters? < 1227713007 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm talking at bytecode-level here < 1227713016 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a virtual machine, why couldn't your "bytecode" do whatever you want? < 1227713039 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm lost < 1227713076 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Obviously my Lisp interpreter is a virtual machine. < 1227713079 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :After all, it runs programs. < 1227713082 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A completely functional VM (with primitives like "apply") will probably resemble a functional-paradigm language quite a lot, since indeed you don't have registers or anything, just parameters and return values. < 1227713108 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes. < 1227713183 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PICKLE SURPRISE! < 1227713282 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1227713313 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y < 1227713340 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1227713366 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1227713464 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I mean, a VM bytecode isn't exactly going to be efficient if it's a nested tree ala lisp. < 1227713475 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yet it's kind-of hard to make a stack based VM that doesn't mutate a stack. < 1227713492 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes; if you base a VM on mutable concepts, it is indeed hard to make one that doesn't use mutation. < 1227713535 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes, but the point is... < 1227713550 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you make your VM use arbitrary nested trees of a few primitives... you've invented Lisp < 1227713552 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A functional VM like that would not probably be very "low-level", which I guess is quite understandable, given that "low-level" pretty much means "close to the underlying system", which is very mutation-rich. < 1227713556 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And yet most lisps compile down to a vm, heh.) < 1227713580 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: The idea is, it's a low-level thing, except the system it's being low-level on is a mystical immutable computer. < 1227713603 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want a mystical computer < 1227713608 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: a VM can implement a purely functional abstraction even if it isn't purely functional at the physical level (which nothing in our universe can be, presumably) < 1227713615 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, duh, oerj < 1227713616 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: < 1227713624 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but...that's not the point < 1227713633 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the _VM WORLD_ has to be immutable < 1227713642 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. everything you can access via the VM code has to be immutable in every way < 1227713646 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :VM code = code running on it < 1227713696 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: you can do something monadic, the access calculates the next world from the previous < 1227713707 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but that's not exactly very functional in spirit < 1227713719 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm talking more the lambda-calculus type < 1227713749 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :combonotors :o < 1227713757 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you can probably make a purely functional abstraction that's on a "lower level"; you can easily get rid of abitrarily nested trees, at least. (As long as you allow constructing those with the cons-like operation.) < 1227713767 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: i am reminded slightly of reversible turing machines < 1227713796 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: The problem is trees in general; it's not very efficient. < 1227713802 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the connection being that it is hard to remove information from those, since you need to uncalculate it < 1227713814 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cons 1 (cons 2 nil) vs nil 2 cons 1 cons < 1227713839 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION should mention that he is not entirely sober, since that might explain something < 1227713884 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also: < 1227713891 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THe former needs a call stack. < 1227713905 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, if you want something that's efficient to execute a conventional computer, you'd probably best use a VM that's close to it. < 1227713908 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So now you've got something even less like a VM; CPS-transformed lisp. < 1227713916 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not really interested in efficiency. < 1227713918 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just low-levelity. < 1227713968 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: a kind of graph machine, where graphs grow like crystals, but generated parts of crystals cannot be changed < 1227713978 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that, except lower-level :-P < 1227713986 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crystals are low-level < 1227714069 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't it muriel or something that only allows you to copy information forward? that's almost immutable < 1227714087 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think so < 1227714092 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm. < 1227714093 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1227714097 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like SMITH, Muriel has no traditional control structures. Instead, Muriel has a command to replace the currently running Muriel program with a given string, and run that instead. This leads to a programming method where a program must quine itself in order to perform any sort of loop. < 1227714110 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it was SMITH < 1227714181 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm seems so < 1227714262 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[. It has no jumps whatsoever; the instruction pointer can only be incremented, and only by one instruction at a time. As a substitute for loops, the language allows code to be copied forward where it will be executed in the future.]] < 1227714263 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kind of. < 1227714360 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also there's Elephant (barely non-esoteric) < 1227714449 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where everything about the past can be referenced < 1227714469 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, that's mccarthy's isn't it? < 1227714471 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not low-level, of course < 1227714486 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1227714510 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Slereah_ doesn't know ocaml < 1227714518 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impossible! he's french after all < 1227714590 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see, what i'm planning on implementing is a high-level smalltalk-alike, except it's purely functional, and prototype-based < 1227714636 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is ocaml Frenh? :o < 1227714720 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's developed by INRIA and Xavier Leroy iirc < 1227714726 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Normal people would just do a "traditional" VM that's just a bit more functionally-oriented than the rest. < 1227714729 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SECD_machine was < 1227714767 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: well this is ehird we are talking about < 1227714785 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, and this is #esoteric. < 1227714789 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To hell with traditional things, I want purely functional! :-P < 1227714805 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't actually care if it's slow, Squeak is a dog anyway - besides, I'm planning on writing the VM in the language itself < 1227714807 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the compiler too. < 1227714815 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#esoteric can only do purely dysfunctional < 1227714816 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(As well as a bootstrap in-C vm&compiler.) < 1227714828 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But beyond that...) < 1227714929 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't dysfunctional the unlambda/BF mix? < 1227715129 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0x29A < 1227715143 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there is no reason we couldn't have more < 1227715152 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why that name by the way? < 1227715161 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hint: it's hex < 1227715161 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't roll well on your toungue. < 1227715169 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hex for what? < 1227715184 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sheesh < 1227715186 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :666 < 1227715192 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1227715202 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1227715203 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait < 1227715208 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about the other one. < 1227715220 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? < 1227715238 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1227715271 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE ... oh wait i just claimed the opposite didn't i < 1227715301 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I recall some language called 0x29C or something < 1227715306 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Related to the first < 1227715349 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/0x29C < 1227715353 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yah < 1227715356 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how observant < 1227715361 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :668? < 1227715366 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, current thinking: I need to figure out how to do a purely-functional, applicationy-language without having a lisp-like (nested (tree)) < 1227715381 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why 668 :o < 1227715390 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_, you said 0x29C < 1227715423 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus you said 668 < 1227715427 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1227715428 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know. < 1227715433 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But why is it called 668. < 1227715458 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i say potayto, you say 0xP0TAHT0 < 1227715468 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, what base is that < 1227715487 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it isn't valid hex expressed in the common 0x way < 1227715489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at leas < 1227715491 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :least* < 1227715505 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's base humor < 1227715521 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait doesn't "base humor" mean something else? < 1227715533 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the phrase sounds familiar < 1227715552 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and AnMaster wins! < 1227715552 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/wait /wait, / < 1227715559 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, eh? < 1227715577 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you detected a pun. that still keeps surprising me. < 1227715585 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially when not sober < 1227715594 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm always sober < 1227715601 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, and, what is "base humor"? < 1227715603 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm not < 1227715603 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't remember < 1227715607 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except having heard the word < 1227715608 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: why aren't you sober? < 1227715639 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because an old friend came to town and bought a bottle of red wine < 1227715663 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :drink in moderation, or better yet, don't drink at all < 1227715684 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the first time i drink since June. i think that's plenty of moderation. < 1227715704 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: why? drinking a lot is great for ideas, drinking a lot if great for getting things done that are not fun to do < 1227715720 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*drinking a little to the first one < 1227715726 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :,... < 1227715728 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: low-level humor, btw, iirc < 1227715730 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fucking latter one i mean < 1227715743 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :oklopol < 1227715749 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :afk for the rest of the evening < 1227715767 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bie < 1227716038 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this Orc thing, how is it esoteric? < 1227716157 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not < 1227716158 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems < 1227716177 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't Orc a bit old? < 1227716182 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes on a blanking rampage < 1227716199 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :delete, don't blank < 1227716199 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1227716218 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bottle of red wine? < 1227716228 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't vodka beter for blanking? ;p < 1227716256 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/et/ett/ < 1227716261 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly < 1227716314 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm we don't seem to have a deletion request template < 1227716344 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're an op < 1227716346 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just delete it < 1227716366 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not < 1227716384 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dang < 1227716388 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1227716406 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have returned from breslavia todays morning and had no sleep < 1227716461 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know, it's easy to make that assumption from my air of wisdom and authority < 1227716486 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :correct < 1227716497 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, why do you act sober when not sober? < 1227716509 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess it's starting to wear off < 1227716566 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was only half a bottle after all < 1227716614 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :half a litre per capita is the definition of nothing, as we say in Poland < 1227716637 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(vodka ofc) < 1227716645 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i wasn't seriously out of training it would probably have been nothing to me too < 1227716670 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, I can't drink < 1227716677 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe a beer sometimes < 1227716682 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not too much < 1227716697 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, end of work, bbl < 1227716699 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Lost terminal" < 1227718789 0 :AquaLoqua!n=anonym@dsl-245-59-94.telkomadsl.co.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1227719267 0 :Slereah!n=Slereah@ANantes-252-1-37-61.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1227719430 0 :AquaLoqua!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Dana" < 1227719782 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@e-169.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1227720158 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/1cnis <<< doesn't perl have a "use" for getting bignums? < 1227720176 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use fairly_big_numbers; < 1227720189 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1227720224 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah that wasn't really a question < 1227720309 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1227720437 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THEN WHY DID YOU USE A QUESTION MARK DUMBASS < 1227720448 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, hi < 1227720453 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) < 1227720495 0 :MizardX!i=MizardX@92.254.128.248 JOIN :#esoteric < 1227721533 0 :Slereah_!n=Slereah@ANantes-252-1-37-61.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1227722066 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i like you when you're drunk :D < 1227722072 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i guess you aren't anymore < 1227722092 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not half as think as you drunk i am < 1227722128 0 :Corun!n=Corun@94-193-40-216.zone7.bethere.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1227722584 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo < 1227722654 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1227726225 0 :warrie!n=Peggy@c-98-209-136-197.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227727671 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oko < 1227729542 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye < 1227729544 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Join the Damnation now !" < 1227730056 0 :Slereah!n=Slereah@ANantes-252-1-37-61.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1227730708 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1227731228 0 :Slereah_!n=Slereah@ANantes-252-1-37-61.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1227731446 0 :olsner!n=salparot@79.136.60.96 JOIN :#esoteric < 1227731804 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: concatenative < 1227731813 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: wat < 1227731829 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : anyway, current thinking: I need to figure out how to do a purely-functional, applicationy-language without having a lisp-like (nested (tree)) < 1227731836 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except: < 1227731843 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no mutation allowed, and it has to be low-level [it's a vm] < 1227731847 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :keyword mutation there < 1227731852 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :....concatenative < 1227731856 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're pushin' 'n poppin' to a stack < 1227731856 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know what mutation means < 1227731858 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're mutating. < 1227731861 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: changing. < 1227731867 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...i know that < 1227731917 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know what you mean < 1227732164 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ditto. < 1227732284 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure how a "low-level"-feeling thing you'll get without having at least some registers. I'm sure you could do some sort of functional tarpit, though. < 1227732299 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1227732323 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guys < 1227732343 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.spinnoff.com/zbb/viewtopic.php?p=649306 < 1227732370 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think psygnisfive just set a record for "time until conversation reaches offtopicity" < 1227732372 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by starting off on it. < 1227732385 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1227732389 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is esoteric. there is no topic < 1227732400 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | this is not the topic you are looking for < 1227732460 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i send that link because im curious if any of yous guys care to figure out some explanation for the phenomena that's explanation < 1227732461 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :excplanatory < 1227732521 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1227733095 0 :Sgeo_!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227733114 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody? nobody? < 1227733304 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@a-165.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1227733501 0 :jix!n=jix@dyndsl-095-033-090-013.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1227733537 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1227733576 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive, what? < 1227733590 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.spinnoff.com/zbb/viewtopic.php?p=649306 < 1227733595 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :off topic < 1227733605 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION agrees with ehird < 1227733624 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but this is esoteric. nothing is on topic here. :P < 1227733658 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i take it AnMaster commented inbetween < 1227733671 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which case i'd like to tell AnMaster that this channel is pretty anarchic, and just about any topic goes. < 1227733684 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i ask here because i figure you guys like solving queer problems < 1227733688 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could ask how to program a turing machine to follow that rule. that would probably be utterly irrelevant to how the brain does it. < 1227733692 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it's linguistics < 1227733693 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and this is definitely a queer problem < 1227733696 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and esoteric-y linguistics < 1227733697 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sooooooo < 1227733720 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah, ehird changed point of view just to avoid agreeing with me < 1227733723 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how sad < 1227733727 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night all < 1227733731 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1227733732 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night < 1227733754 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION rreads logs. AnMaster: wrong < 1227733761 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i said it was off-topic, i didn't say that was a bad thing. < 1227733789 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: thats an idea. how would you design a TM to follow that rule, without simply /listing/ all the different versions < 1227733800 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | all talking in channel forbidden < 1227733810 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there, now everything is guaranteed off topic < 1227733827 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: i'd implement strong ai first. < 1227733840 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | The topic is everything that AnMaster doesn't say < 1227733855 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: :P < 1227733863 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cmon be serious now < 1227733879 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if AnMaster says [[http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | The topic is everything that AnMaster doesn't say]] < 1227733882 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then he will cause a paradox < 1227733888 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and we shall exile him. < 1227733908 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | The topic is everything that ehird doesn't say < 1227733956 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | The topic is "AnMaster fails to sleep after saying so, due to defending himself against the annoying ehird, and probably sighing a lot in the process. /sigh" < 1227733996 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | ehird thinks this is funny. I suggest lament sets a sane topic and then +t mode. < 1227734008 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's not going to happen < 1227734016 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last time this channel was opped is when I got kicked on request < 1227734035 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't like us doing what the fuck we want, make your own channel < 1227734038 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a dictatorship. < 1227734039 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you are free to ignore me, but please don't try to be annoying then < 1227734041 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so get lost < 1227734044 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*shrug* < 1227734054 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I never said it was bad either < 1227734058 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to be off topic < 1227734063 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reads logs. I'll be as annoying as I'd like, I'm very sure you have an /ignore. I do; it's very useful for ignoring your blabber. < 1227734064 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like you I just said it was off topic < 1227734109 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there we go < 1227734111 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ignored < 1227734113 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good idea ehird < 1227734119 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so ehird < 1227734123 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeo < 1227734125 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any ideas? :P < 1227734126 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi psygnisfive < 1227734128 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1227734130 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm no linguist < 1227734140 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well pretend its not a linguistics problem at all < 1227734198 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because its really not < 1227734207 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't read most of the post < 1227734207 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1227734217 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok well heres a summary in linguistics-less terminology < 1227734241 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | This topic may not be changed. < 1227734251 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | o rly < 1227734255 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now night < 1227734256 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cya < 1227734273 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a sequence consisting of {A, B, C, X}, when any of {A, B, C} precede X, the ordering is always A-B-C < 1227734281 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ordering of those that precede, i mean < 1227734285 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1227734291 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what what < 1227734295 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the butt < 1227734339 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you not what i said < 1227734353 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, he accidentally all of it < 1227734365 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep... the WHOLE thing < 1227734366 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you not get* < 1227734367 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1227734374 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, i was just there, right < 1227734382 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i accidentally the WHOLE WHAT YOU SAID < 1227734383 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::\ < 1227734391 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jesus, it was really. < 1227734398 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should i explain it again? :P < 1227734406 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :After I accidentally it?! < 1227734410 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No way! Not again! < 1227734414 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's unpossible! < 1227734423 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION stabs ehird in the face < 1227734434 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You purposefully my whole face! < 1227734477 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION fucks ehird in the face < 1227734491 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You purposefully carrier lost < 1227734502 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whaa < 1227734530 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :african or european carrier? < 1227734538 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lost carrier < 1227734627 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lava < 1227734629 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4 pieces of < 1227734630 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 pieces of < 1227734630 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lava < 1227734632 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Infinite lava < 1227734635 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Delicious < 1227734637 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Benny Lava! < 1227734640 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For your breakfast lunchtime! < 1227734652 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love the lava live and it loves me... < 1227734719 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo_ < 1227734725 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1227734980 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok a silly idea, there are 5 slots. the first can only contain an A, the second B, etc., the last can contain any of A B C < 1227735100 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the remainder is left as an exercise for the reader < 1227735136 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey psygnisfive < 1227735146 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you like smalltalk (the programming language, damnit) < 1227735279 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never used it < 1227735317 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well thats not the whole of it: < 1227735337 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when _any_ of {A, B, C} precedes X, the order is A-B-C < 1227735342 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :among those that precede. < 1227735358 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but when they follow X, the order among those that follow is unrestricted < 1227735359 0 :nooga!n=nooga@eod6.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1227735363 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well duh the slots are ordered < 1227735410 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1227735414 0 :trave!n=chatzill@c-98-202-197-109.hsd1.ut.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227735415 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, was there a conclusion about this functional VM? < 1227735417 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but order within a slot is arbitrary < 1227735422 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: not yet < 1227735431 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean order within a slot?? < 1227735434 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though only the last slot can contain more than one element < 1227735447 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i see < 1227735466 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you mean theres something like [1] [2] [3] X [4] < 1227735469 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1227735489 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1] - [3] restricted to containing only one item, while [4] can have n items < 1227735511 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and [1] - [3] are content restricted < 1227735518 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gives psygnisfive a C on the exercise < 1227735522 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well this works, but its not very explanator :( < 1227735525 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y < 1227735530 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so? < 1227735548 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well the challenge was to find an explanatory way of describing the restrictions :P < 1227735563 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you _really_ expect anything to explain it better than what you actually said? < 1227735602 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the actual explanation may involve neuron structure and genes, in a horribly twisted way < 1227735605 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure! there are actually atleast two explanations that are relatively simple, in that the orderings just sort of fall out of the assumptions you put on the systems < 1227735620 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i dont mean neuronal/genetic explanations i mean computational system explanations < 1227735661 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are two really simple explanations, as i said. they're both very very computationally oriented < 1227735700 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than just an arbitrary specification like your slot hypothesis < 1227735711 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would anyone be interested in checking out a diagram i put together, that attempts to associate the color spectrum to specific definitions? < 1227735719 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure :D < 1227735724 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1227735732 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was just intended to be quasi-linguistic < 1227735743 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://illuminerd.wordpress.com/2008/10/12/om-resource-system/ < 1227735748 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: syntax is very computationally. < 1227735772 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im writing a paper for a syntax seminar on the restrictions that the formal system we use has < 1227735775 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trave: makes sense to me. < 1227735783 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1227735793 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trave: i dont get it. < 1227735832 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im hoping to work out a GTD style organizing system that you can log every aspect of "life" into color coded compartments < 1227735839 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks colorful and nice < 1227735880 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, like if it was an iPhone application, youd have a spinning color coded sphere where you can keep track of things in bins < 1227735897 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so oerjan: no ideas besides that? :( < 1227735917 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: i find the idea boring < 1227735921 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1227735939 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :object-oriented design is the roman numerals of computing. -- rob pike < 1227735957 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :roman numerals in their original form were actually pretty darn useful < 1227735973 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's right; although i like oop - < 1227735984 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :roman numerals were useful, but that doesn't stop them being primitive < 1227736016 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: what is U20 v2 ? < 1227736020 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what id like to see is relations between these object spheres, how resources are related between parties < 1227736061 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trave: i don't get it < 1227736119 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trave: i don't get it < 1227736123 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :id have to post this other word doc that i wrote up that explains the mechanics of the idea more, rather than the esoteric color associates < 1227736127 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :associations < 1227736140 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, how are the associations esoteric? < 1227736150 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... ohhh, you mean esoteric as in the non-programming language sense < 1227736151 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :colors == elements < 1227736164 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't realise because this channel is often offtopic, but the official topic is esoteric programming languages < 1227736170 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, i didnt know esoteric was a programming language, hah < 1227736175 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: pms < 1227736177 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not < 1227736182 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Esoteric_programming_language < 1227736187 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a type of proglang < 1227736190 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but umm anything goes here < 1227736191 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1227736223 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah that makes sense < 1227736225 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1227736267 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is pretty much the most generic channel on irc. < 1227736309 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the elements can be associated to colors, red/fire, blue/water, green/earth, etc. and the "purpose" of those elements can be given broader meanings... so like yellow == wind == words, etc. < 1227736342 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: you mean ... http://encyclopediadramatica.com/PMS < 1227736348 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or green == earth == money/property < 1227736348 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no :P < 1227736352 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :private messages < 1227736353 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1227736355 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PMs < 1227736371 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION doesn't understand psygnisfive's PM obsession. < 1227736389 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, im talking to him about that ordering stuff and im sure you dont want to hear it so < 1227736413 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do it to not inconvenience you guys < 1227736436 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we don't mind :P < 1227736454 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh. still. < 1227736577 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't like *all* numbers < 1227736602 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just REAL numbers? < 1227736678 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those pesky tranfinite numbers. coming here living off welfare and and taking our jobs. < 1227736905 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: thanks a lot... my *mother* is a transfinite number < 1227737016 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1227737041 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not to mention an expert in cardinal sins < 1227737112 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ba dum dum ching. < 1227738565 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :applause < 1227738740 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"..." < 1227738871 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1227738895 0 :Corun!n=Corun@94-193-40-216.zone7.bethere.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1227738901 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :textual esoteric languages are boring < 1227738931 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so last year. this is the age of _smell_ < 1227738940 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no no no < 1227738941 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :touch < 1227738944 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sexual programming languages. < 1227738945 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Stage 69 has me beat. < 1227738953 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: which is that < 1227738970 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly a problem in the sexual programming < 1227738971 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Hey ... I'm anosmic :( < 1227738984 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: The evil one. < 1227738987 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: :P < 1227738989 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: what's the code < 1227739007 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, ansomic: awesome < 1227739008 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :763-716 < 1227739064 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh < 1227739066 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't look hard < 1227739067 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tedious yes < 1227739069 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not hard < 1227739091 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't get the third one. < 1227739096 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The first two and last one are trivial. < 1227739099 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll try it. < 1227739121 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it the one with four uppity-caves you have to climb < 1227739126 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats so hard about it < 1227739126 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1227739130 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is that game? < 1227739132 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the third is EVIL < 1227739137 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dotaction.fizzlebot.com/ < 1227739143 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is it hard < 1227739145 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just looks tediou < 1227739146 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1227739152 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: you should apply for a service dog that can translate the smells for you < 1227739164 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pretty easy, you just jump, and hit left very quickly just as you're on the hole, so you get on the brink < 1227739167 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then just repeat < 1227739175 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can only fail in the middle doing that < 1227739186 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ORLY THANX I NEVR THOT OF THAT LAWL < 1227739188 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION slaps oklopol  < 1227739203 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Yes. Because anosmia is life-hindering :P < 1227739214 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ansomnia would be awesome < 1227739219 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: err, you can't do it like that? < 1227739222 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :smells, in general, aren't overwhelmingly interesting < 1227739226 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yet < 1227739231 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you get to not deal with all the crappy smells < 1227739232 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i envy you sir < 1227739252 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Do you like tea, coffee or beer? < 1227739256 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i discovered that, i did it in two tries < 1227739263 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Toffeer < 1227739266 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I can't get the timing right X_X < 1227739286 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: They all taste like bitter water to me. < 1227739286 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: it's pretty trivial to just hit the button when you're at the hole. < 1227739294 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yeah, well so's your face. < 1227739294 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: Oh :( < 1227739297 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: What about chocolate? < 1227739316 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Dark chocolate is good ... it's a good bitterness ... bitterness combined with deep flavor ... like Moxie. < 1227739329 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: i'm going to tell you that about every level until you beat 97 ;) < 1227739329 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So basically everything is bitter to you :P < 1227739335 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is at 98, and not playing atm < 1227739349 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :atm meaning like, probably not this week < 1227739357 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Well, I don't like milk chocolate, that was just a bad example :P < 1227739369 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Chicken does not taste bitter to me. < 1227739378 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Turkey (more relevantly) does not taste bitter to me. < 1227739416 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, the last tower is the hard one < 1227739419 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the third one is easy < 1227739431 0 :trave_!n=chatzill@c-98-202-197-109.hsd1.ut.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227739468 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whaaa? I did the last tower on my first try! All you have to do is get at the edge of each hole and jump, you can't overrun getting into the next hole so just hold down (and of course make sure to pull up before falling off the edge, but that's not hard) < 1227739478 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1227739482 0 :trave_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :trave < 1227739485 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are we talking abotu the same one < 1227739501 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think so X-P < 1227739517 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Level bow-chicka-bow-wow. < 1227739540 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't it more like bow-bow-chicka-wow? < 1227739580 0 :GreaseMonkey!n=gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1227739581 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i must flee now, i have AN INFINITE SET to prove things about < 1227739582 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--> < 1227739593 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(IT'S FUCKING INFINITE) < 1227739603 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what _she_ said < 1227739720 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in regards to how long you have to wait to get some? < 1227739738 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH < 1227739739 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Burn. < 1227739817 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"The forks." < 1227739825 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: falling into the lava again? < 1227740084 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: i had a friend who's dad falled from a cliff and crashed his head... after that he was forced to discover flavours again < 1227740110 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so he ate things like a sausage with chocolate and mayonaise < 1227740122 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: ... yum ... or not. < 1227740132 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or jam with pepper and cucumber < 1227740177 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I notice that in both of your examples there's really only one offensive ingredient :P < 1227740193 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :liver with strawberries + smoking a cig < 1227740197 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so on < 1227740251 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1227740276 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR is falling in lava? with whom? < 1227740284 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with his LOVE < 1227740302 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey whazza full code again < 1227740308 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1227740311 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have it < 1227740315 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wut iz it < 1227740317 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i think it's better if fizzie gives it < 1227740321 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: < 1227740326 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: can you give the full codie again? < 1227740336 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: what's the code for 1-100? < 1227740350 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ehird wants to play can you give him the code? < 1227740409 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wut izi t < 1227740414 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: We luv spamming u < 1227740419 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: do u luv being spammed? < 1227740426 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: cuz ur gunna get lots LAWL < 1227740531 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hes idle < 1227740532 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just tell me < 1227740532 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::< < 1227740607 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1227740620 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :809-936 < 1227740635 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://infosthetics.com/archives/chocolate_pie_chart.jpg < 1227740679 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What that chart tells me is that white chocolate sucks (which it does), milk chocolate sorta sucks, and dark chocolate is good. < 1227740692 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thank you ok < 1227740693 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1227740699 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why milk chocolate sorta sucks? < 1227740699 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey i like white chocolate < 1227740707 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :milk chocolate has the majority of the pie < 1227740710 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also milk chocolate. also dark chocolate. < 1227740725 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i... pretty much just like chocolate < 1227740744 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chocolate is pretty tasty. < 1227740747 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i prefer meat < 1227740748 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :White chocolate isn't chocolate. < 1227740753 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't go calling white chocolate a type of chocolate. < 1227740755 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it's not. < 1227740756 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a LIE. < 1227740756 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually it is schocolate. < 1227740770 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since its made from cocoa butter. < 1227740780 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, its sort of chocolate. < 1227740803 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT'S A LIE < 1227740804 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it lacks the cacao < 1227740946 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :proper chocolate is just basically ground up chocolate bean + milk and sugar and such, while white chocolate is chocolate bean fat + milk and sugar and such < 1227740961 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1227740965 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and such as. < 1227740967 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Making it a LIE. < 1227740982 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, white chocolate is tasty < 1227740984 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so stfu < 1227740986 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its only a lie if you require the phrase "white chocolate" to be strictly compositional < 1227741000 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, the "such" contains the all-important and extremely-underrated ingredient vanilla. < 1227741004 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And vanilla is delicious. < 1227741007 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and for "chocolate" to mean all and only the products produced using the whole bean < 1227741008 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes < 1227741010 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vanilla is delicious < 1227741014 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmmmmmmm < 1227741022 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hate it when people say "vanilla" is "plain" < 1227741024 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And also a yellow-brown color. < 1227741026 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is so not < 1227741028 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vanilla is not plain < 1227741033 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vanilla is tasty and exploding and MMMMMM < 1227741035 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you make icecream without vanilla, it tastes bland < 1227741035 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: It's all the fault of American ice cream companies. < 1227741037 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything is better with vanilla < 1227741038 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats plain < 1227741041 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and everything is better with chocolate < 1227741042 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and everything is better with bacon < 1227741044 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :add vanila and WOW < 1227741045 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chocolate bacon has been done < 1227741045 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1227741046 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not < 1227741050 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vanilla chocolate bacon < 1227741056 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT MUST HAPPEN < 1227741066 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's vanilla in chocolate. < 1227741070 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Therefore it has been done. < 1227741070 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i actually refuse to make non-vanila icecream on a plain base < 1227741074 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but NOT ENOUGH GregorR < 1227741075 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :egg & bacon icecream has been done < 1227741077 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i only use vanilla icecream as a base < 1227741080 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do not like sweets < 1227741086 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, coffee icecream? < 1227741091 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer meat. < 1227741092 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so much better if you start with a vanilla base < 1227741094 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i eat something sweet, i must smoke immediately < 1227741095 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: how dare you call chocolate sweets < 1227741100 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how dare you call vanilla a sweet < 1227741100 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to kill the flavour < 1227741105 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(how dare you call bacon a sweet) < 1227741109 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As well as yourself. < 1227741110 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are GODS of your PUNY EXISTANCE < 1227741114 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah < 1227741115 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what GregorR said :P < 1227741123 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soon you won't have to smoke after sweets! < 1227741127 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or indeed eat at all! :D < 1227741133 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cancer cures smoking! < 1227741145 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gregorr: apparently most american white chocolate has no cocoa butter at all < 1227741154 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh < 1227741158 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Smoking cures cancer! For some definition of curing! Or cancer! OR SMOKING! < 1227741167 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: That's because it's a LIE! :P < 1227741173 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, corned beef is good. < 1227741173 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :non smokers are funny < 1227741184 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Smoking cures cancer, if by 'smoking' you mean 'chemotherapy'" < 1227741188 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: are you playing the sequel to Portal? < 1227741193 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE WHITE CHOCOLATE IS A LIE < 1227741201 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: yes, smoking destroys the humor gland < 1227741203 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: There's a sequel to Portal? X-P < 1227741210 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not yet but if there were!@ < 1227741210 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he was joking < 1227741229 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1227741235 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was being optimistic :( < 1227741246 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hoping and joking don't mix < 1227741257 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, well so's your face. < 1227741273 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :touche < 1227741298 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has decided, spurned on by an episode of Scrubs, to use that in all situations in which it's nonsensical. < 1227741315 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: Yeah, well so's your face. < 1227741319 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Burn. < 1227741320 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh kurwa < 1227741320 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: you needed the scrubs episode to motivate that? < 1227741324 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Walked right into that one. < 1227741334 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just being on the internet should've motivated you < 1227741334 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: Yeah, but so's your face. < 1227741339 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scrubs is great < 1227741343 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but you know what, GregorR? < 1227741346 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOUR FACE IS A LIE < 1227741346 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yeah, well so's your face. < 1227741347 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...wait < 1227741352 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D-8 < 1227741360 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: yeah i've been told that < 1227741367 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i went there < 1227741387 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i went into the Mixed Nerd Cultural Phraseology territory < 1227741393 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND WHAT < 1227741395 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :speaking of < 1227741399 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Big Bang Theory < 1227741416 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bang bang < 1227741424 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bong bong < 1227741442 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh yea < 1227741447 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bing bing < 1227741462 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if the universe was created by a Big Bong? < 1227741471 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D:D:D < 1227741473 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MNCPT is dangerous < 1227741474 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Big Bong theory < 1227741478 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for your tongue < 1227741490 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trave: the egyptians believed the universe was created by a very large ejaculation. < 1227741504 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sweet. < 1227741508 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this theory might've been inspired by a big bong, however. < 1227741516 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to join the OTO and participate in some of that < 1227741530 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Big Bong theory assumes that it was a very large inhalation < 1227741535 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1227741578 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*greetings from cancer* < 1227741618 0 :Slereah!n=Slereah@ANantes-252-1-37-61.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1227741654 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then we have the theories of the Big Binge, the Big Bungee, and the Big Bongo < 1227741757 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Big Bigloo < 1227741940 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :big bang theory tho < 1227741942 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good show < 1227741943 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very nerdy < 1227741945 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very current < 1227741990 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a "big gang bang" theory yet? < 1227742001 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i just added that to the multi-verse < 1227742031 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was wondering... from where did they get words describing things and abstract ideas in various languages < 1227742051 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im sure theres some possible world where there is such a theory < 1227742058 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's quite hard to make completely new dictionary from scratch < 1227742076 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it started with Vowels from what I gather < 1227742110 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :theres only 5 "connecting" sounds, the consenants seem like theyre the static < 1227742119 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: that show stole a game from one of Wooble (from ##nomic)'s friends < 1227742127 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it like "oh, i see that thing... let it be a wyeirmd... nah... or rather .... a tree ! (xD)" < 1227742128 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently. http://www.samkass.com/theories/RPSSL.html < 1227742135 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: what? < 1227742142 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh! < 1227742147 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dude haha < 1227742148 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats awesome < 1227742158 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i told you they're current < 1227742167 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that game was invented 10 years ago. < 1227742171 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still < 1227742173 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its nergy < 1227742176 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nerdy* < 1227742178 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hebrew numbers are represented by alphabetic letters, there is no separation < 1227742187 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1227742202 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1227742220 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: what do you think about that? < 1227742241 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: still, how cool is that? someone from ##nomic, their friend, now has a game on a tv show < 1227742244 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its cool dude cmon! < 1227742247 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: of what? < 1227742258 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:27 < 1227742278 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :making a dictionary from scratch? < 1227742279 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, letters/sounds become associated to meaningful attributes, which then are strung together into words < 1227742280 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: well, he wasn't credited or told about it and the show apparently portrayed it as if it'd invented it < 1227742286 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and now people yell about it daily on his comment section < 1227742287 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :saying he stole it < 1227742297 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure the upside is good enough to cover that :-P < 1227742302 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: i dont think anyone believes they invented anything in the show < 1227742313 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because its all very real < 1227742313 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :look at the comments. < 1227742314 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1227742321 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sheldon twitters, for instance < 1227742330 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well ok maybe some people think it was invented in the show but < 1227742343 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the show is for real geeks < 1227742350 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything is an inside joke < 1227742354 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I find interesting is that before man evolved to a state of verbal language, we communicated like how "primitive" animals do through chemicals and mental vibes. < 1227742359 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :made funnier by the fact that its all genuine < 1227742367 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trave: "man was originally primitive then evolved" < 1227742367 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its parodying us by BEING us < 1227742368 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :deep. < 1227742396 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trave: individual sounds arent associated with meanings really < 1227742408 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats one of the things about language that makes it language < 1227742421 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chemical communication is neat because it lingers over time, chatter so temporary and "secret" < 1227742424 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the actual sound content of words is arbitrary < 1227742448 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but try to name things you see with your own words that arent riddiculous and do not resemble any words that you know for those things in the languages you know < 1227742451 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hard, huh? < 1227742465 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well im talking about the beginning of verbal communication, its gotten pretty fragmented with so many new variations and dialects over time < 1227742473 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: how's that hard? i have python < 1227742475 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: ofcourse its hard < 1227742478 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we speak a particular language < 1227742491 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trying to break out of that is difficult because the sound-meaning association is so very strong < 1227742506 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trees just LOOK like they should be called "tree"! < 1227742525 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you ask a french person, trees just LOOK like they should be called "arbre" < 1227742531 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1227742535 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a japanese person, trees just LOOK like they should be called "moku" < 1227742537 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc < 1227742541 0 :warrie!n=Peggy@c-98-209-136-197.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1227742542 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it's pretty simple to start thinking in a random inexistant language, only educated fools think languages we know make us associate words with them < 1227742558 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you have to realise that you're bizarre < 1227742560 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1227742576 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a tree? i think it's should be called something with a shizzle < 1227742578 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you ask me in Polish, "co to jest?" (what is that) pointing a tree i will immediately say "drzewo" (a tree) < 1227742588 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like znor < 1227742592 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im curious about the ideas of orwells new-speak that < 1227742594 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but when you ask me in English, i would immediately say "a tree"" < 1227742601 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe with a CZZHHH at the end < 1227742613 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1227742622 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... reducing out all the redundancy out of language and working towards the most basic < 1227742624 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: it seems polish is pretty close to my idea word for tree then < 1227742633 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :możliwe < 1227742648 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(possible) < 1227742661 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe my brain is polish? < 1227742666 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1227742725 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trave: it wouldnt do anything < 1227742735 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't be glad about that in your place ;p < 1227742755 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the sapir-whorf hypothesis, that language constrains thought, is false. < 1227742758 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :patently. < 1227742794 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wish it was true because i like imagining AIs programmed in BASIC being really fucking dumb and yet making all kinds of cool shit < 1227742800 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brainfuck ones twiddling away for ages to do incomprehensible stuff slowly < 1227742801 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc < 1227742816 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehah < 1227742820 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1227742827 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats a whole different issue there < 1227742832 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1227742835 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a different way in which language affects "thought" < 1227742847 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seen perl 6 ? < 1227742849 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously since those languages are TC theres nothing one can do that the other cant < 1227742862 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i get cha. the time it takes to read is already at the speed of thought, its arbitrary what the letter combinations are, its emotion that you are recording. < 1227742864 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the sapir-whorf hypothesis tho is that we THINK in the language we SPEAK < 1227742870 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is not true < 1227742887 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :welllllll < 1227742887 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trave: the speed of reading is actually not. < 1227742889 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think in english < 1227742890 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a language that is capable of altering itself to the enourmous abstraction levels < 1227742890 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of the time < 1227742892 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fun experiment: read something, speak it, and type it all at the same time while thinking about something else entirely. < 1227742899 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont mean what your inner voice is in, ehird < 1227742914 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch, that makes my head hurt just visualizing that experiment < 1227742920 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, everyone has a little monitor in their head right? < 1227742927 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inner voices are definitely in your native language, or whatever < 1227742929 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, you can display images sort of... in the block of space on your head above your eyes < 1227742933 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except it's kind of not there < 1227742936 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's kind of everywhere < 1227742944 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm assuming this is normal < 1227742957 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, you have to think about what you're reading to some extent in order to speak it. < 1227742957 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i mean is that actual _thought_ is in your language < 1227742960 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :agh i just used that and eeeeek < 1227742962 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it creeps me out < 1227742966 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just read it and type it at the same time. < 1227742967 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like for instance < 1227742972 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depending on situation i can think in my basic english, or polish or even both simultaneously < 1227742977 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: TELL ME WHERE THOSE IMAGES ARE < 1227742978 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::--------------------; < 1227742980 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if your language lacked tense and words for time concepts < 1227742992 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you would be INCAPABLE of conceiving of the notion of time < 1227742999 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: there are no images. what? < 1227743006 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no cartesian theatre. :P < 1227743014 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: what, you mean you can't display images in your head?!?! < 1227743026 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D: < 1227743030 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats not what i said ;) < 1227743034 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. < 1227743038 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just freaks me out. < 1227743042 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can see them, but i can't see them in any place. < 1227743059 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you say see them but not in any place < 1227743062 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean actually? < 1227743069 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't see them with my eyes, i guess < 1227743071 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just... perceive them < 1227743074 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I cannot think about calculus without thinking in English to some extent. < 1227743076 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yes sure < 1227743076 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can "see" them but they're not placed anywhere. < 1227743084 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm assuming everyone else can do that/ < 1227743088 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION realizes that he's had ehird on ignore all this time, and /unignores him < 1227743088 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but are they in space around you? < 1227743091 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. just conjour up an image? < 1227743093 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'r rather like you create a more or less abstract scene described in brain compatible format < 1227743093 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no. < 1227743100 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're... nowhere, really. < 1227743100 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh thats interesting < 1227743104 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 145 (Connection timed out) < 1227743105 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...that was wrong. < 1227743112 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: imagine a random scene < 1227743113 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in your head < 1227743114 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I cannot think about calculus without thinking in images to some extent. < 1227743115 0 :Slereah_!n=Slereah@ANantes-252-1-37-61.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1227743116 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you see it if you try to? < 1227743117 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is related to what that diagram i showed you guys is all about... all these various tangible/intangible "objects", can be organized into nested meaningful color-coded levels. for example: blue == water (emotions/life) == people... < 1227743118 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just think of an image < 1227743125 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you know where exactly are things on that scene and what happens there < 1227743129 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can perceive it, right? < 1227743132 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you don't see it anywhere < 1227743136 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's no actual seeing to speak of < 1227743137 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yet it's there < 1227743138 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but its sort of within my spacial model of the world, to an extent < 1227743151 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: does it like, appear in front of you? < 1227743163 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you have had enough mushrooms, it does < 1227743164 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that its anyhere in particular, but its not exactly completely dislocated from a spatial position < 1227743183 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesnt appear in from of me in the sense that it looks as real as things i see with my eyes < 1227743185 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use the word "hallucinate". < 1227743207 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: it kind of appears above my range of eyes < 1227743207 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then < 1227743210 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can appear anywhere < 1227743210 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it inherently has a position in my internal model of space < 1227743212 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without being there < 1227743220 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is weird. < 1227743221 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most people can think of images. Most people cannot voluntarily hallucinate them. < 1227743223 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, ehird, i think we should distinguish two things < 1227743228 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :warrie: of course < 1227743233 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm asking how they think of them < 1227743235 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one: whether it "looks" the same as stuff you see with your eyes < 1227743244 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. can you tell whether its an imagined image or a real one < 1227743251 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :painter can show you the image from his head < 1227743261 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and two: whether it necessarily occupies a position in space or not < 1227743270 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the two aren't the same < 1227743294 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can imagine something in front of my eyes, in my normal visual field, but its distinguishably not coming from my eyeballs < 1227743307 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its the third eye :] < 1227743326 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not entirely sure i can envision it outside of my visual field. perhaps only partially < 1227743332 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i had a pretty vivid dream once standing above my bed, i could see the room like plain as day. < 1227743347 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that does make a lot of sense, because visual imagination is _very_ strongly tied into the actual visual cortex of the brain < 1227743348 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it happens sometimes < 1227743366 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :infact, when you visually imagine something, your visual cortex looks exactly as it would if you were actually seeing that thing < 1227743371 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: right, I can picture mickey mouse on my deks, but it's very faint < 1227743373 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the same goes for other imagination < 1227743376 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's obviously not there, and it's very very faint < 1227743376 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to be out of body or not be out of body, that is the question < 1227743385 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1227743387 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: < 1227743391 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of trying to project an image < 1227743392 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just think of one < 1227743395 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just think of the image itself < 1227743398 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :completely dissociating things from places in the visual field is very difficult i think < 1227743405 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll appear *nowhere* < 1227743409 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yet it'll seem to appear somewhere < 1227743413 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you imagine a car that you hear on the street and place it on that street nest to your home while you can't see the car because there is a wall? < 1227743413 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you won't be able to place where it is < 1227743414 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: well, think of an image, as in "think of the mona lisa" < 1227743414 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just htink of an image < 1227743418 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: yea < 1227743420 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just think of it < 1227743421 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or ENVISION the mona lisa < 1227743426 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :think of it < 1227743431 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call up FACTS, or call up VISUALS < 1227743433 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and... turn on imaging mode < 1227743434 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1227743435 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dunno < 1227743436 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call up visuals < 1227743440 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but don't try and project it < 1227743440 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to think of his integration by parts picture without it being in any place < 1227743445 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just think of the actual image object that represents it < 1227743473 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know if I can do it. < 1227743478 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it comes naturally to me o.o;; < 1227743485 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just what happens when i think of an imge. < 1227743486 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*image < 1227743492 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can image mona lisa on the wall next to me < 1227743496 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: well, we might be experiencing the same thing < 1227743504 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or i can imagine it nowhere < 1227743515 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i do think its tied in to a location in visual space < 1227743518 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as well < 1227743519 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone else have a mind jukebox? i can play full songs in my head at command. < 1227743521 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if you get pinpoint it clearly < 1227743527 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: yep < 1227743529 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and modify them in any way while they're playing. < 1227743532 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's weird. but fun. < 1227743534 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: sometimes yeah. < 1227743542 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: how easily can you pick apart chords and such? < 1227743551 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: especialy Pink Floyd < 1227743555 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont have the memory for full songs, but i can occasionally end up almost hearing a song in my head < 1227743560 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have absolute pitch? < 1227743561 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :warrie: not at all; it's just blobs of audio data, except I can imagine a tune and it'll do it < 1227743563 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but this is all precisely what you'd expect < 1227743567 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i play with it so much that it invented a gui < 1227743568 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mm. < 1227743571 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which appears in my no-space above my vision field < 1227743577 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks basically like winamp or xmms XD < 1227743597 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however < 1227743600 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i play back songs in my head < 1227743604 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah, thats fanciful. < 1227743604 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't hear them through anything < 1227743606 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heheh < 1227743607 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even hear in particular < 1227743613 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes my inner record play starts skipping :( < 1227743613 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just... the sound is there. < 1227743621 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it's very low volume < 1227743624 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can't go loud < 1227743628 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: yes < 1227743633 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is whats called imagination :P < 1227743634 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same as my visual projection is very faint < 1227743635 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1227743635 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone has that < 1227743637 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: i know < 1227743641 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've just always been interested < 1227743646 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the sort of mechanics of it < 1227743649 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1227743656 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :our subconcious can probably just barely hear "our" end much the same way < 1227743656 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i think its fairly trivial actually < 1227743657 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :playing Pink Floyd - Dogs, second solo, atm < 1227743657 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. how other people percieve it < 1227743659 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in terms of cognitive mechanisms < 1227743681 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have absolute pitch (though I can't easily recognize anything except G) and can pick apart chords with some difficulty. I think it would be a little bit cool to be a musical savant or something. < 1227743693 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a musical idiot. < 1227743699 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have absolutely no musical knowledge whatsoever, this saddens me :( < 1227743703 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :being savant is cool < 1227743719 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably. < 1227743754 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you can sing in tune, you're not a musical idiot. Otherwise, we'll need to perform further testing. < 1227743774 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :warrie: I wouldn't know if I sang in tune. I couldn't tell. < 1227743778 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, i'm not tone deaf. < 1227743785 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I wouldn't be able to recognize if I was singing in tune. < 1227743795 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you recognize if other people are singing in tune? < 1227743798 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can play the tune i imagine on a guitar if it's slow enough < 1227743810 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: interestingly, musical knowledge isn't stored in the brain in terms of absolute pitch but rather intervals < 1227743834 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and its not stored in as just a single music-score like piece of information but rather a markov-chain-like structure < 1227743835 0 :trave!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats why all those 8bit nintendo loops get recalled in my mind so easilly < 1227743836 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: then you're either more talented or more practiced than me. < 1227743839 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :warrie: yes, that's pretty obvious, I guess < 1227743842 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a linked list sort of structure < 1227743847 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I'm absolutely, absolutely useless at playing an instrument < 1227743874 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: so if someone shifted in key by a little bit between phrases of the national anthem, you'd notice. < 1227743881 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :warrie: Probably not. < 1227743886 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION nods < 1227743921 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: have you read anything by dennett or ramachandran? < 1227743935 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fraid not. < 1227743953 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should < 1227743954 0 :warrie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I once had the opportunity to listen to other-smart-guy sing. I was disappointed at his lack of singing ability. I still wonder whether he thinks like me or not. < 1227743956 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of good stuff < 1227743960 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: kay < 1227743963 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dennett: consciousness explained < 1227743968 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ramachandran: phantoms in the brain < 1227743984 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, is there ANY person who hasn't come up with the idea of "what if everyone saw colours different to me - i'd never know"? < 1227743991 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :absolutely EVERY person i've talked to thought of that at one point in their lives