00:04:26 +ul (:::::*****)((a)~(b)~(~())~(a)~^^^)S 00:04:26 (a)~(b)~(~())~(a)~^^^ 00:04:31 +ul (:::::*****)((a)~(b)~(~())~(a)~^^^)^S 00:04:31 (((((~()))))) 00:04:58 +ul (:::::*****)((a)~(b)~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^S 00:04:58 b 00:05:02 +ul (::::****)((a)~(b)~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^S 00:05:03 b 00:05:06 +ul (:*)((a)~(b)~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^S 00:05:07 b 00:05:11 +ul (!())((a)~(b)~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^S 00:05:11 a 00:05:24 okay, isZero 00:05:34 was just falling asleep 00:05:36 when it hit me 00:05:37 hehe 00:05:39 -> 00:07:48 night 00:13:05 -!- sebbu has quit ("@+"). 00:16:26 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | (*)Y(*). 00:37:03 -!- LinuS has quit ("Puzzi. Sì, parlo proprio con te. Puzzi."). 01:33:16 i forgot how to sleep. 01:33:41 very nasty, that 01:50:05 ya. 01:58:16 hey oklopol 01:58:27 hey 02:00:06 +ul (:*)((!())~()~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^(x)~^S 02:00:07 x 02:00:10 +ul (::**)((!())~()~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^(x)~^S 02:00:11 x 02:00:14 +ul ()((!())~()~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^(x)~^S 02:00:14 x 02:00:18 +ul (!())((!())~()~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^(x)~^S 02:00:51 D: 02:00:54 what is this now 02:01:08 +ul (::**)(:(:)~^(!!()())*~(*)~^*)^(x)~^S 02:01:08 xx 02:01:14 +ul (:::***)(:(:)~^(!!()())*~(*)~^*)^(x)~^S 02:01:14 xxx 02:01:16 oh nothing. 02:10:46 oh my god the stack is hard to use. 02:11:41 +ul (::::****)((:)~*(*)*)^(x)~^S 02:11:42 xxxxxx 02:11:47 +ul (!())((:)~*(*)*)^(x)~^S 02:11:48 x 02:12:01 +ul (!())((:)~*(*)*)^((:)~*(*)*)^(x)~^S 02:12:02 xx 02:14:37 +ul (a)(b)a~a*:^~!~^SSS 02:14:37 aba 02:18:45 +ul (a)(b)(c)(~)^SSS 02:18:45 bca 02:19:47 +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~)^SSS 02:19:48 a{{c}}{{b}} ...S out of stack! 02:20:04 +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a^)^SSS 02:20:05 a{{c}}{{b}} ...S out of stack! 02:20:07 :D 02:20:14 +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a^)SSS 02:20:14 a~a*~a^cb 02:20:16 what? 02:20:17 ... 02:20:27 oerjan: just let me spam in peace ! 02:20:40 where are those {} from? 02:20:48 ah those 02:20:52 well no one knows really :) 02:21:18 +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a^^)^SSS 02:21:19 {{{{c}}{{b}}}} ...S out of stack! 02:21:23 .... 02:21:26 +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a)^SSS 02:21:27 {{a}}{{c}}{{b}} ...S out of stack! 02:21:30 +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a)^S 02:21:30 (a) 02:21:32 +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a)^SS 02:21:33 (a)(c)(b) 02:21:34 hm 02:21:40 +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a^)^SS 02:21:40 a(c)(b) 02:22:52 +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a*^)^SS 02:22:53 ab 02:22:54 +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a*^)^SSS 02:22:55 abc 02:23:15 right, you can rotate things on the stack pretty freely 02:23:58 yeah it's just a bit verbose 02:24:01 +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a*^a:*~a*~a*^)^SSS 02:24:01 cba 02:24:18 +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a*^a:*~a*~a*^)^SSSS 02:24:18 cbaa 02:24:28 okay, you can do *anything* to the stack. 02:24:39 for some reason i thought you can't. 02:25:50 the a operation is pretty essential 02:26:34 without it you couldn't reach more than two levels down without mangling things 02:26:42 hmm 02:27:05 +ul (a)SS 02:27:06 a ...S out of stack! 02:27:06 withouth it, would it still have powah? 02:27:09 *without 02:27:39 i should retry sleeping probably, have to be awake in a few hours 02:27:45 +ul ((a)(b))SS 02:27:46 {{a}}{{b}} ...S out of stack! 02:27:51 i'll probably write a stackmongler tomorrow 02:27:55 +ul ((a)(b))S 02:27:56 (a)(b) 02:27:59 and by that i mean 02:28:10 a program that codes underload for me 02:28:43 because i'm a wimpy wampy wussypants loser. 02:28:46 it seems those {} are an artifact of debugging output... 02:28:51 peeeeeerhaps 02:28:58 they may be el stacko 02:29:03 err 02:29:05 naaahh 02:29:08 they arrrren't 02:29:22 +ul (c)((a)(b))SSS 02:29:23 {{a}}{{b}}c ...S out of stack! 02:29:31 hmm 02:29:37 perhaps popping doesn't remove the balues 02:29:38 *values 02:29:44 and it prints the stack contents 02:29:55 +ul (a)(b)(c)!!!! 02:29:56 ...! out of stack! 02:30:06 +ul (c)((a)(b))SS 02:30:07 (a)(b)c 02:30:07 err. 02:30:14 that's 02:30:17 sick. 02:30:31 hmm 02:31:07 +ul ({{TEST}})S 02:31:07 {{TEST}} 02:31:13 +ul ({{TEST}})SS 02:31:13 {{TEST}} ...S out of stack! 02:31:19 seems output is only done at the end of execution, and failure triggers a raw output mode 02:31:20 or something 02:31:29 umm. 02:31:29 yeah 02:31:41 but i don't see what sense that makes 02:31:48 +ul (({{TEST}}))SS 02:31:49 {{{{TEST}}}} ...S out of stack! 02:31:54 yay 02:32:14 ..yay? 02:32:24 weirdness 02:33:25 coool weirdnecessarity 02:33:38 except we know it can cut off infinite output 02:33:55 well it needs to buffer it 02:34:22 +ul (:(* )S^):^ 02:34:23 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ...too much output! 02:34:34 hmm 02:34:45 hm maybe it just halts 02:34:58 you mean, after a while 02:35:02 +ul (:((A))S^):^ 02:35:04 (A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A) ...too much output! 02:35:26 +ul (:((A))SSSSS):^ 02:35:26 {{A}}:{{{{A}}}}SSSSS:{{{{A}}}}SSSSS ...S out of stack! 02:35:32 :D 02:35:41 what the fuck :D 02:35:44 oh 02:38:36 +ul (:(((A))(B))S^):^ 02:38:37 ((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B) ...too much output! 02:38:53 it seems the too much output case doesn't trigger this 02:39:24 no, just when you empty the stack 02:39:44 +ul (asd)Ss 02:39:44 asd 02:39:47 +ul (asd)S 02:39:48 asd 02:39:49 +ul (asd)S e 02:39:49 asd 02:39:51 +ul (asd)S S 02:39:52 asd 02:39:55 hmm 02:40:02 does it just cut execution at illegal chars? 02:40:03 +ul ((A)(B))ST 02:40:04 (A)(B) 02:40:26 +ul (a)S (a)S 02:40:27 a 02:40:28 +ul (H)S (I)S 02:40:29 H 02:40:30 yeah i guess 02:40:45 +ul (H)SS (I)S 02:40:46 H ...S out of stack! 02:41:30 +ul ({{TEST}})S 02:41:31 {{TEST}} 02:42:09 +ul (({{TEST}}))S 02:42:10 ({{TEST}=)} 02:42:16 ooh 02:42:38 found a bug! 02:43:03 :D 02:43:16 now what the fuck is that 02:43:24 ah 02:43:25 +ul (({{TEST}}))((A))SS 02:43:26 (A)({{TEST}=)} 02:43:35 {}'s are actually not allowed in underload iirc 02:43:40 +ul ((A))(({{TEST}}))SS 02:43:40 ({{TEST}=)}(A) 02:43:42 so that's not actually a bug. 02:43:58 well not as commands, but... 02:44:00 just implementation-defined stuff defined by an implementation 02:44:03 oh 02:44:06 right, as data, yeah 02:44:40 well we can assume thutubot's implementation uses {} for something internally 02:44:56 yes 02:45:13 although i can't say i know what exactly. 02:46:10 which means we should continue 02:46:21 the wiki says nothing about {} although it says []<>" need quoting 02:46:24 or you should. i'm too tired to think, but i like watching this :P 02:46:31 ah 02:46:33 i see 02:46:38 but that interpreters don't implement it 02:47:02 ^ul ((A))(({{TEST}}))SS 02:47:08 ({{TE ...out of time! 02:47:14 bah :D 02:47:56 i would assume fungot's implementation is entirely different 02:47:56 oerjan: the reason this was created was that information on this page. note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 may, 2006, and lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on wikipedia:criteria for speedy deletionimages.2fmediacriteria for speedy deletion. if you have 02:48:08 well yeah 02:48:22 +ul (({{}}))S 02:48:22 ({{}=)} 02:48:27 ^ul (({{}}))S 02:48:28 it's written in an entirely different paradigm 02:48:31 ({{}}) 02:48:37 no bug there 02:48:59 yeah 02:49:22 when exactly does that appear? 02:49:31 when you have two }}'s? 02:49:40 +ul (}})S 02:49:41 }} 02:49:44 +ul ({{}})S 02:49:45 {{}} 02:49:49 +ul (({{}}))S 02:49:50 ({{}=)} 02:49:52 +ul ((}}))S 02:49:52 (}=)} 02:49:55 +ul ((}))S 02:49:55 (=)} 02:50:00 ... 02:50:01 xD 02:50:06 when you mix () and {} in the output 02:50:08 i think 02:50:18 yeah but look at that 02:50:22 it jumped out of the /( 02:50:24 *() 02:51:03 okay i need to go to sleep :P 02:51:04 -> 02:51:17 +ul (({))S 02:51:17 ({) 02:51:28 oh that had no bug 02:51:40 +ul (({{))S 02:51:40 ({{) 02:51:53 +ul (})S 02:51:54 } 02:52:00 +ul ((}))S 02:52:00 (=)} 02:52:04 +ul (({}))S 02:52:05 ({=)} 02:52:45 +ul (({{}))S 02:52:45 ({{=)} 02:52:51 +ul (({}}))S 02:52:51 ({}=)} 03:09:30 +ul ({{{{X}}}})S 03:09:30 {{{{X}}}} 03:09:36 +ul ({{{X}}})S 03:09:37 {{{X}}} 03:16:10 +ul (()(*))(~:^!(:)~*(*)*a~^~^:S( )Sa*~:^):^ 03:16:11 * ** ****** ************************ ************************************************************************************************************************ ...too much output! 03:18:27 +ul ((*)())(~:^!(**)*a~^*:S( )Sa*~:^):^ 03:18:28 * **** ********* **************** ************************* ************************************ ************************************************* ...too much output! 03:57:47 +ul ((0)(1))(~:^:Sa~a~*a~^a~a*a*~:^)(0)S:^ 03:57:49 01(1)(0)((1)(0))((0)(1))(((1)(0))((0)(1)))(((0)(1))((1)(0)))((((1)(0))((0)(1)))(((0)(1))((1)(0))))((((0)(1))((1)(0)))(((1)(0))((0)(1))))(((((1)(0))((0)(1)))(((0)(1))((1)(0))))((((0)(1))((1)(0)))(((1)(0))((0)(1)))))(((((0)(1))((1)(0)))(((1)(0))((0)(1))))((((1)(0))((0)(1)))(((0)(1))((1)(0))))) ...too much output! 03:57:57 oops 03:59:36 what the hell is this now 03:59:54 too many a's 04:00:14 +ul ((0)(1))(~:^:S*a~^~*a*~:^)(0)S:^ 04:00:15 0110100110010110100101100110100110010110011010010110100110010110100101100110100101101001100101100110100110010110100101100110100110010110011010010110100110010110011010011001011010010110011010010110100110010110100101100110100110010110011010010110100110010110 ...too much output! 04:00:23 there we go 04:01:35 thue-morse sequence 04:03:12 lol 04:34:17 -!- oerjan has quit ("Good night"). 05:12:16 http://purdueextremecroquet.org/ 05:14:10 old. 05:14:33 And yet I just keep on rererererelinking it 8-D 05:24:24 so, doesn't croquet have this rule where you get to strike the opponent's ball anywhere you like as far as you can, if you get your balls to touch 05:26:44 That's what she said. 05:26:45 ... 05:26:46 But yes. 05:26:54 That's a croquet shot. 05:27:36 i see 05:27:57 you have that rule? 05:28:08 If that wasn't part of the rules, it wouldn't be croquet at all. 05:28:13 yeah 05:28:16 There's a reason that's called the /croquet/ shot. 05:28:18 Wasn't that oerjan's underload loop a bit too complicated? Although I did have to bump up fungot's Underload time limits for this too: 05:28:18 fizzie: ' ' ' 05:28:26 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 05:28:40 for some reason i thought something there contradicted it or something. 05:28:42 +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 05:28:43 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 05:28:57 i'll try to locate what 05:29:00 +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 05:29:00 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 05:29:08 Yay, it worksors. 05:29:16 11.4: (Replace) Players must make a reasonable effort not to interfere with 05:29:16 their own or others' balls. If a player accidentally moves a ball that was at 05:29:16 rest, that player must replace the ball without penalty. 05:29:17 +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 05:29:18 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 05:29:22 Of course fungot's so slow that's not much of a loop. 05:29:35 +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 05:29:35 fizzie: every single orchestration and band scoring text i've checked gives the range of the ' ' mensa magazine" may not be confirmed. and i mean come on, at what age is the dividing line between 05:29:35 -!- fungot has left (?). 05:29:35 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 05:29:37 oklopol: That's not as a result of a shot, that's if they trip over the ball or whatnot. 05:29:44 oklopol: You need to read that into context to see the real meaning :P 05:29:46 -!- fungot has joined. 05:30:18 GregorR: yeah it's clear it means that. 05:30:41 only an idiot would not realize that. 05:31:41 -!- immibis has joined. 05:32:47 GregorR: anyway, my point was exactly that if you had removed that rule, you shouldn't be calling it croquet 05:33:03 oklopol: I totally agree with that. Good thing I didn't remove that rule :P 05:34:06 (okay i prolly just would've said it makes the game a lot less fun, and less strategical; the poetic reference to the name was all yours.) 05:34:15 So, does everybody know that "uber" is officially dead? 05:34:45 you mean, using the incorrect umlautless german word for "over" to mean "supahcool"? 05:34:53 Yes. 05:34:59 It was used in a commercial for feminine pads, and is therefore no longer to be used. 05:35:12 err what are feminine pads? 05:35:33 i did not know this, i thought it died ages ago :D 05:35:52 it's, like, überold 05:35:59 ... I so don't want to explain this ... pads that collect the ... flow ... from the monthly feminine .. predicament. 05:36:25 oh you mean menstrual filters 05:36:34 blood preventers 05:36:43 flow distractors 05:36:53 Uhhhhh, suuuure, except that none of those terms are used :P 05:39:09 i thought feminine pads were more like those things kids use for swimming, the things you attach to their arms 05:39:10 "It's uberabsorbent"? 05:39:13 ...only for women 05:39:19 immibis: Yup. 05:39:26 oklopol: LOL 05:39:48 lol 05:40:11 the other guess was dance pads for dance dance revolution 05:40:13 ...but with flowers 05:40:17 ... 05:40:19 Actually, they said "an uber-absorbent material", but eh. 05:40:52 that sounds familiar 05:41:03 but i can't have seen the ad 05:41:11 so prolly i'm psychic 05:41:39 also exam about word and excel in 20 minutes, this is going to be sweet 05:41:40 -> 05:41:50 WTF X-D 05:44:17 wtif indeed 05:44:18 *wtf 05:45:17 wtf @ what exactly? 05:46:03 also exam about word and excel in 20 minutes, this is going to be sweet 05:46:33 which was the wtf 05:46:40 the sweet part or just the exam part 05:47:07 The exam part. 05:48:20 yeah, it's a bit of a wtf, they've started teaching us cs students computer basics obligatorily now 05:48:24 i don't know why 05:48:38 and i hate it, because i had to learn to use word, which is an ugly program 05:48:43 Hahaha, your college sucks. 05:48:57 :P 05:49:31 At Purdue and PSU all the undergrad CS is done on UNIX, so even if they DID make the baby stuff mandatory it'd be with better software. 05:49:52 word is pretty much the best for what it does. 05:50:16 lament: wordpad opens faster. 05:50:22 that's really all that matters. 05:50:32 LaTeX is prettier X-P 05:50:36 GregorR: we have a unix part too 05:50:53 GregorR: and far, far slower to write stuff in 05:51:05 lament: That example /might/ have been sarcastic :P 05:51:09 but that's a lot simpler, just some catting and pipering 05:52:31 anyway, i don't dislike the fact we have windows as much as i dislike the fact we're taught about computers in general, i don't care about computers, i wanna learn computer science 05:52:46 but, taste you later -> 05:52:54 I think we had a Windows Word/Excel/something part in the obligatory-for-all-students-not-just-CS "this is how you use them computers" course; I don't think I've had to touch a windows box since then. 05:59:05 -!- immibis has quit ("Hi Im a qit msg virus. Pls rplce ur old qit msg wit tis 1 & hlp me tk ovr th wrld of IRC. and dlte ur files. and email ths to). 06:12:37 -!- bsmntbombdood_ has changed nick to bsmntbombdood. 06:16:26 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | INTERCAL's probably better for really complex programs, but writing such in esolangs is normally inadvisable anyway. 06:19:56 -!- Slereah_ has joined. 06:41:50 -!- Sgeo has quit ("Ex-Chat"). 07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended). 08:00:00 -!- clog has joined. 08:07:12 -!- pikhq has quit (Remote closed the connection). 08:13:26 -!- pikhq has joined. 08:39:30 where are those {} from? <--- you hit a bug in Thutubot's error handling, I think, it uses those internally 08:40:13 seems output is only done at the end of execution, and failure triggers a raw output mode <--- yes, I think that's exactly what's happening, probably 08:41:09 it uses {{ }} internally to distinguish inside parens from outside parens 08:41:14 to do paren-matching 08:41:40 and the = you came up with is used internally by Thutu for things, you definitely hit a Thutubot bug if you can get one of those in the output without putting it in the input 09:03:56 -!- omniscient_idiot has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 09:08:43 morning 09:08:57 morning 09:11:29 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined. 09:24:40 Quasi-morning. 09:45:04 evening 09:48:25 puzzlet: afternoon according to your client 09:48:30 which time zone is that, by the way? 09:48:44 let me check myself 09:49:14 5:49 PM, normal in South Korea 09:49:36 ah, ok 09:49:40 8 hours ahead of the UK 09:49:46 so GMT-9 09:49:48 + 09:49:58 grr, always get time zones backwards... 09:50:18 i'm always confused with tz 10:00:59 Psuedo-morning. 10:01:14 (pikhq here saying: all-nighters to get your homework done suck balls. 10:05:54 -!- Jiminy_Cricket has quit. 10:20:32 heh 10:29:00 -!- GreaseMonkey has quit ("Unisex."). 10:30:53 -!- fungot has quit (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)). 10:31:00 "Whoops." 10:31:19 Shouldn't do the "it's a small change, I won't bother testing locally" thing. 10:31:32 testing locally is normally faster 10:31:55 now, I just have to figure whether me or AnMaster wrote the topic 10:32:02 it's AnMasterish language, but I suspect it was me 10:32:18 I don't remember writing it 10:32:51 ais523, and how is it "AnMasterish language"? 10:33:02 the use of the word "such" there looks weird 10:33:06 but I can understand that I might do that 10:33:09 on occasion 10:33:12 oh 10:33:14 Awww, I just lost the state file. 10:33:19 what would you recommend isntead? 10:33:21 instead* 10:33:26 fizzie, use backup? ;P 10:33:50 There goes my ^cho and ^choo reimplementations, and the nifty pow2. Although they're all in IRC logs. 10:34:03 I have a "backup" copy of the state file, but it's old. 10:34:42 AnMaster: "writing those in esolangs"? 10:34:48 -!- fungot has joined. 10:34:50 ^show 10:34:51 echo reverb rev bf rot13 hi rev2 fib wc xaa enctst copy badrot13 chtopic top topiccode compat_cat trulyawfulrot13 rot26 me echochohoo lolercakes echo_cho_ho_o baddoubles ul test 10:34:54 Heh, it was that old. 10:35:44 oklopol, I don't think I said the line in topic 10:35:57 but yeah I guess that makes more sense in English 10:36:14 that's a lot of commands fizzie 10:36:29 Many of them make no sense, that's why I removed some of 'em. 10:36:36 well remove them again 10:36:39 then 10:36:52 That's curious; the line in topic doesn't appear in my logs. I must've not been here when it was said. 10:37:22 ^echochohoo 10:37:25 ^echochohoo test 10:37:25 testeststt 10:37:31 well, at least that one's back 10:37:40 but most of it is just CO2Games spam 10:37:41 I already "reimplemented" it as ^cho. 10:37:52 ^code 002aaa***99++p 10:37:54 ^show 10:37:54 echo reverb rev bf rot13 hi rev2 fib wc 10:38:01 ^def ul bf str:5 10:38:01 Defined. 10:38:07 ^ul (foo)S 10:38:08 foo 10:38:30 ^def cho bf >,[>,]<[<]>[[.>]<[<]>[-]>] 10:38:31 Defined. 10:38:39 ^def choo bf >,[>,]++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++[<]>[[.>]<[<]>[-]>] 10:38:39 Defined. 10:38:41 ^save 10:38:44 ^cho fungot 10:39:04 Whooopsie, there's still a bug in "^save", which means that whatever I did there was completely for naught. 10:39:07 -!- fungot has quit (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)). 10:40:14 -!- fungot has joined. 10:40:16 fizzie, heh... 10:40:17 ^cho fungot 10:40:17 fungotungotngotgotott 10:40:23 That's "better". 10:40:23 ^show 10:40:24 echo reverb rev bf rot13 hi rev2 fib wc ul cho choo 10:40:39 ^help 10:40:39 ^ ; ^def ; ^show [command]; lang=bf, code=text/str:N; ^str 0-9 get/set/add [text] 10:40:39 (Did those commands in the query before bringing it on-channel.) 10:40:51 what are cho and choo? 10:40:53 Oh, I still haven't remembered the ^bool in help. 10:40:59 ^bool 10:40:59 Yes. 10:41:01 ^bool 10:41:02 No. 10:41:02 ^bool 10:41:02 No. 10:41:03 ais523: ^echochohoo and ^echo_cho_ho_o. 10:41:09 ah, ok 10:41:16 ^fib 999 10:41:17 ^choo fungot 10:41:26 fungot ungot ngot got ot t 10:41:27 something broke it? 10:41:33 ^show 10:41:33 echo reverb rev bf rot13 hi rev2 fib wc ul cho choo 10:41:35 no, it's just being slow for some reason 10:41:46 ais523, the ^fib didn't work it seems 10:41:48 It's slow because I have raised the brainfuck cycle count. 10:41:54 And I think fib got borkened at some point. 10:41:55 nor did it say "out of time" 10:41:57 ^show fib 10:41:57 >+10>+>+[[+5[>+8<-]>.<+6[>-8<-]+<3]>.>>[[-]<[>+<-]>>[<2+>+>-]<[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>[-]>+>+<3-[>+<-]]]]]]]]]]]+>>>]<3][] 10:42:03 Hmm, no. That looks sensible. 10:42:10 fizzie, the [] at the end? 10:42:14 On first glance, anyway. 10:42:14 the [] at the end is suspicious 10:42:18 but it might just have been a header comment 10:42:45 ^wc 10:42:48 ^wc abc 10:42:58 ^show wc 10:42:59 [] 10:43:00 ^bf ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++. 10:43:00 10:43:07 Hmm. 10:43:14 There seems to be some extra []s. 10:43:15 looks like several saved ones are borked 10:43:21 ^show hi 10:43:24 And it was ^wc that had gotten borkeded earlier, I think. 10:43:26 hm? 10:43:30 ^show hi 10:43:32 'hi' is empty. 10:43:35 ah 10:43:35 So it won't show up. 10:43:40 ^show rev 10:43:41 >,[>,]<[.<] 10:43:47 ^show reverb 10:43:48 ,[..,] 10:43:51 ^reverb test 10:43:52 tteesstt 10:44:00 ^cho test 10:44:00 testeststt 10:44:04 ^show rot13 10:44:05 ,[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+14<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>>+5[<-5>-]<2-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+ 10:44:10 ^rot13 abc 10:44:11 nop 10:44:15 ^rot13 no? 10:44:15 ab? 10:44:18 ah it works 10:44:20 there has to be a shorter way to write rot13... 10:44:30 ais523: There is, but that one executes very fast. 10:44:40 well, yes 10:44:40 ais523, well that one is too long for an irc line too 10:44:45 it's an unrolled switch statement 10:44:49 hehe 10:45:25 ais523, ah that reminds me, how goes gcc-bf? 10:45:39 still stalled 10:45:44 This is the earliest I've been up in months. 10:45:58 Damned all-nighters. 10:46:30 5:00, and I'm not done with calculus yet. 10:47:21 Actually I think I've just broken the "..." and maybe "... out of time" outputs. 10:47:25 ^bf +[] 10:47:34 ...out of time! 10:47:47 That one still works, but I think the "too much output" one doesn't. 10:47:54 ^bf +[.] 10:47:55 ^show 10:47:55 echo reverb rev bf rot13 hi rev2 fib wc ul cho choo pow2 10:47:58 Yep. 10:48:24 +ul ((x)S:^):^ 10:48:24 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ...too much output! 10:50:11 It's actually a bit curious that it doesn't completely crash there; it goes completely off the route. 10:50:21 the IP gets lost? 10:50:34 does it hit a stray ^ or something when it comes back from the other side of the program? 10:50:53 I think it hits a "o" in a comment, reflects, goes back to the | where it went lost but takes the other branch this time and uses the normal exit. 10:51:29 ^reload 10:51:29 Reloaded. 10:51:33 ^bf +[.] 10:51:33 ... 10:51:38 ^fib 10:51:39 0.1.1.2.3.5.8.13.21.34.55.89.144.233.377.610.987.1597.2584.4181.6765.10946.17711.28657.46368.75025.121393.196418.317811.514229.832040.1346269.2178309.3524578.5702887.9227465.14930352.24157817.39088169.632459 ... 10:51:41 ^pow2 10:51:41 1 2 4 8 16 32 64 128 256 512 1024 2048 4096 8192 16384 32768 65536 131072 262144 524288 1048576 2097152 4194304 8388608 16777216 33554432 67108864 134217728 268435456 536870912 1073741824 2147483648 42949672 ... 10:51:51 Witness the power of this fully operational Befunge bot. 10:52:51 the joys of Befunge! 10:54:34 fungot: I don't suppose I messed up your language skills when doing those changes? 10:54:34 fizzie: the article does not meet the guidelines on neutrality and stability required for ga status. the focus should be in " description" fnord 22:23, 16 january 2007 ( utc)) hendrix remains an extremely influential figure in music the article, and in the end, we can quote him in support of his clean air fnord to the statements in fnord 10:56:03 I think that was a "no". 10:56:32 it's surprising how Wikipedia-like fungot's comments are atm 10:56:33 ais523: this article is strangely absent of scientific backup. please wikipedians interested in this line of thought. i know nothing about the middle name thing until yesterday ( i knew about mi funding for jeugkrag, or that ' ' some more" 10:56:36 even given the source 10:58:10 hehe 10:58:42 It's also a bit surprising how well it worked even without stripping any of the MediaWiki markup. (Although fungot strips out all unrecognized punctuation.) 10:58:42 fizzie: ' ' shake" the fnord or system of which that position is a part of total cost of operation are the maintenance and support direct and indirect casulties included. why aren't you following clear guideline? 10:58:44 fungot, WP:WP:WP:ACRONYM 10:58:45 AnMaster: i also threw together a fnord transportation section from former edits still needs work, but seriously i thought it was fnord fnord source: corporate.wwe.com user:sephiroth stormsephiroth storm 16:26, 21 april 2008 ( utc 10:59:00 what did I just miss? 10:59:08 (the sad thing is that both WP:WP and WP:ACRONYM actually seem to exist.....) 10:59:08 fungot: MediaWiki markup for bold seems to confuse it most often 10:59:08 ais523: there has been in the relationship between the gallon and the bushel that is not clear what meaning the author intended to convey. 10:59:10 ''' 10:59:25 AnMaster: the WP: shortcuts are designed to be easy to remember 10:59:28 Yes, since 's are recognized as stuff. 10:59:29 and so they make lots of spares 10:59:48 ais523, yes and making a joke of them by saying WP:WP doesn't work since that seems to lead to a list of all WP:* 10:59:58 and why wouldn't it? 11:00:11 ais523, ? 11:00:26 I mean, what's wrong with having WP:WP be about WP: pages? 11:00:48 ais523, nothing, however it is ruins a good joke 11:03:11 Need to restart since I don't have a ^reload-state command yet... 11:03:17 ^raw QUIT :my mind is going! 11:03:17 -!- fungot has quit ("my mind is going!"). 11:03:37 -!- fungot has joined. 11:12:54 Ok... 11:13:23 I *think* I may have a working solution to the issue with funge space bounds updates 11:13:49 it is messy but seems to work correctly when ATHR isn't used and should work ok with ATHR loaded 11:16:46 What's ATHR? Any URL describing it? 11:16:58 a sec 11:17:12 http://rafb.net/p/jT1WV348.html 11:18:33 Ilari, I have a partly done implementation 11:47:43 Ilari, well what do you think of it? 11:48:32 AnMaster: Pretty standard async threads library (aside of odd terminology used, as is normal in esolangs)... 11:48:40 ok 11:49:00 it is difficult to implement though 11:49:15 even though I'm doing it in a language with built in support for concurrency 11:49:17 (Erlang) 11:49:44 AnMaster: One thing stood up: S reflects both on error and in child. Using it correctly requires recognizing wheither forward thread exists or not... 11:50:01 Ilari, hm... true 11:50:49 the reason 1) t (sync thread, round robin, standard funge) reflects child. 2) Most funge instructions reflect on errors 11:51:07 so yes it needs some work 11:51:37 (and so far I only implemented some core changes and such, not the actual fingerprint interface, so it would be easy to change) 11:51:54 AnMaster: Recognizing forward thread of t is easier due to its synchronous nature than recognizing the forward thread of S. 11:52:23 true 11:52:35 Ilari, So do you have a good solution? 11:53:33 AnMaster: Nope. Splitting left and right only works in two dimensions, so it really can't be used... 11:54:19 Ilari, hm? It works up/down too 11:54:26 it is "opposite direction" simply 11:54:35 so it means you can get it from any delta 11:54:58 AnMaster: he meant turning one like [ and the other ] 11:55:05 ah right 11:57:47 Well, one could implement recognizing if there was spawn-and-borrow-in-child instruction... 11:58:20 Ilari, "borrow in child"? what would that do? 11:58:28 Or if S returned return value like fork() does... 11:58:41 ah that may be a better idea 11:59:10 AnMaster: It borrows book that has given number in child immediately after creating the child (atomically). 11:59:16 ah 11:59:59 Ilari, well that would be highly complex considering that my ATHR is planned to work distributed (current version won't, need to add local funge-space cache or such) 12:00:17 anyway hm 12:00:47 if it is only atomic against parent it could work 12:00:51 AnMaster: It is entierely possible to generate IDs in distributed way (if the space to choose from is large enough). 12:01:15 well yeah it is, my funge is bignum ;P 12:01:31 AnMaster: Well, locking only has to be atomic with respect to parent... 12:01:52 hm would doing that or doing like fork be best I wonder. 12:02:18 AnMaster: The fork way would be easier for programmer... 12:02:29 true 12:02:41 Is that a goal? 12:03:01 AnMaster: Umm... Nope. :-) 12:04:26 Ilari, still I think ATHR may be quite easy to use, while it looks complex. The terminology helps with that a bit I guess. 12:04:38 and that could actually be a goal 12:08:19 AnMaster: Or it could even be simple 0 => success, 1 => failure in reflected thread... 12:08:31 hm 12:08:50 Ilari, yes that could work. So child gets 0 or 1? 12:08:51 AnMaster: No real need to have that in forward thread, as it impiles success anyway. 12:09:10 Ilari, the check of thread id could also be used I think 12:09:15 comparing old and new value 12:09:26 AnMaster: Yea. That would work... 12:09:38 AnMaster: So no real need to add anything new... :-) 12:09:54 and would need no change. Plus it is easy but not obvious until you think of it. (If you see what I mean) 12:09:58 Phew; fixed (hopefully) all the places where fungot was hardcoded to brainfuck. Now it lets you specify underload programs... unfortunately those aren't interpreted yet. 12:09:58 fizzie: i'm sure i'm not the person who wrote the letter that keeps being removed. fnord 00:05, 30 august 2008 ( utc 12:10:16 ^def foo ul (foo)S 12:10:16 Defined. 12:10:17 ^show foo 12:10:18 (foo)S 12:10:23 ^foo 12:10:31 crash? 12:10:37 No, it just won't do anything. 12:11:01 Now I need to stick the underload interpreter in the correct place and mangle it a bit to read the program from the right place. 12:12:24 Oh, and it needs some sort of cycle counter to handle infinite loops. 12:16:26 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | got it.. 12:36:07 hi ais523 12:37:30 hi 12:37:44 ^ul (:aSS):aSS 12:37:46 (:aSS):aSS 12:38:18 I won't be evil and write an infinite loop 12:38:32 fizzie: one trick worth knowing in Underload is that it's impossible to have an infinite loop without the : command 12:38:38 so if it's easier, you can just count colons 12:41:12 ^ul ^ul 12:41:22 * AnMaster waits 12:41:30 what about "out of time"? 12:41:40 ^help 12:41:40 ^ ; ^def ; ^show [command]; lang=bf, code=text/str:N; ^str 0-9 get/set/add [text] 12:41:43 hm 12:41:47 ^show 12:41:47 echo reverb rev rot13 rev2 fib wc ul cho choo pow2 foo 12:41:59 ^bf +[.] 12:41:59 ... 12:42:05 ^bf ,,, 12:42:08 hm 12:42:09 ? 12:42:11 ^show 12:42:12 echo reverb rev rot13 rev2 fib wc ul cho choo pow2 foo 12:42:13 ah 12:42:18 ^choo 12:42:19 12:42:19 didn't hang on input of course 12:42:22 ^choo choo 12:42:22 choo hoo oo o 12:42:46 fizzie, didn't you filter non-printable before? 12:42:49 Why did you stop? 12:43:26 fizzie, also for cycle counter, what about using t and having another thread insert a "abort" if it takes too long? 12:43:35 another ip* 12:59:26 That might be better, but harder to arrange than a simple count of executed Underload instructions. 12:59:46 Although the underload instructions do take a rather variable amount of time and stack space. 13:00:22 I'm not sure who wanted it to filter only newlines; at least CTCP-annoying is now possible with it. 13:00:39 And the current ^ul command is still the brainfuck one. 13:01:10 I'm still mashing that interpreter in, and even in my local copy only "^def foo ul ..." + "^foo" work; I'll have to add a separate command for ^ul. 13:23:43 There are probably bazillion bugs left, but... 13:23:44 ^reload 13:23:44 Reloaded. 13:23:52 ^ul (:aSS):aSS 13:23:52 (:aSS):aSS 13:24:09 (The 'show' command still shows the brainfuck version, but that's not what it uses.) 13:24:14 ^ul * 13:24:14 ...out of stack! 13:24:47 Also just a quick test... 13:24:48 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:48 +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:49 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:49 +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:49 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:49 +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:50 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:50 +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:50 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:50 +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:51 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:51 +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:51 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:52 +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:52 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:53 +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:53 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:55 +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:55 ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS 13:24:56 ugh 13:24:57 -!- fungot has left (?). 13:25:03 you need ignore 13:25:08 Yes, that would be a good idea. 13:25:33 Maybe later. :p 13:25:37 -!- fungot has joined. 13:25:50 ^ul test 13:25:50 ...bad insn! 13:25:54 ^ul () 13:25:57 hm? 13:25:59 ^ul ()S 13:26:01 Well, no output is still no output. 13:26:02 ^show 13:26:03 echo reverb rev rot13 rev2 fib wc ul cho choo pow2 foo 13:26:05 ^ul (a)S 13:26:05 a 13:26:10 ^ul (aS)aS 13:26:10 (aS) 13:26:12 hm 13:26:20 underload is strange 13:26:35 no it isn't 13:26:39 Oh, I've forgotten to add a output length limit thing. 13:27:44 ((test) a S 13:27:47 ^ul ((test) a S 13:27:47 ...unterminated (! 13:27:50 ah 13:27:55 AnMaster: space is not an underload command 13:27:58 oh 13:28:01 well i see. 13:28:03 ^ul ((crash)S:^):^ 13:28:03 ...out of stack! 13:28:11 oklopol, I was just checking mismatched () 13:28:13 Hmm, that's strange. 13:28:15 yap 13:28:15 ^ul )(S 13:28:15 ...bad insn! 13:28:18 hm? 13:28:24 ) is not a valid instruction. 13:28:25 mismatched I'd say 13:28:30 oh ok 13:28:40 fizzie, just a marker? 13:28:41 It doesn't handle ) as a instruction, just when parsing (. 13:28:54 err 13:29:03 fizzie: why did that (crash) thing crash? 13:29:04 how would you push a ( or a ) on the stack? 13:29:15 oklopol: I don't know; it works in the stand-alone interpreter. 13:29:18 +ul ((crash)S:^):^ 13:29:19 crashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrash ...too much output! 13:29:39 +ul 00000000000 13:29:46 ^ul 00000000000 13:29:47 ...bad insn! 13:29:59 how would you push a ( or a ) on the stack? 13:30:00 can't 13:30:04 +ul (alive?)S 13:30:05 alive? 13:30:05 i should really get me some kebab 13:30:23 ehird, hm ok 13:30:37 a Encloses the top element of the stack in a pair of parentheses. <-- ah 13:30:42 no 13:30:46 that doesn't let you get unbalanced parentheses 13:30:48 just a => (a) 13:30:49 ah right 13:30:54 which you can already do 13:31:00 (foo)a == ((foo)) 13:31:02 ehird, so how would you simulate a string with unbalanced ( ) in? 13:31:06 can't 13:31:12 ehird, so you can't output that? 13:31:16 nope. 13:31:24 Ah, not bf-complete then 13:31:25 AnMaster: simulating strings is quite complicated in general 13:32:00 That 'crashcrashcrash...' output is what I was hoping for. Well, actually I was expecting it to crash in some way, since it's an infinite loop; the cycle-counter would've stopped it at some point, but... 13:32:02 i mean, you cannot exactly use the actual strings as strings 13:32:08 if you want to be able to do something with them 13:32:25 Hmm, maybe the cycle-counter exit goes to the "out of stack" message accidentally or something. 13:32:57 ^ul (::^):^ 13:33:03 +ul (::^):^ 13:33:05 hm 13:33:19 shouldn't they say out of stack or did I misunderstand? 13:33:20 That's still no output. 13:33:22 ...too much memory used! 13:33:25 ah 13:33:27 Well, there's that. 13:33:32 ^show 13:33:33 echo reverb rev rot13 rev2 fib wc ul cho choo pow2 foo 13:33:39 It's not "out of stack"; that one is stack underflow, actually. 13:33:41 fungot didn't say anything though 13:33:41 AnMaster: as for the " popular engineering audience" ( although nobody else has that as their whole fnord 03:58, 30 march 2007 ( utc)'" with all due respect, it embraced a much broader category of theory than just the appearance of fnord, 13:33:51 It's a bit work-in-progress. 13:33:54 right 13:34:57 ^ul (:^):^ 13:35:01 fizzie, "stack underflow"? Hm wouldn't it keep duplicating all the time? 13:35:17 * AnMaster tries to work it out 13:35:17 Yes, I mean, the "out of stack" message means "stack underflow". 13:35:23 ah 13:35:30 ^ul ^ 13:35:30 ...out of stack! 13:35:32 right 13:35:39 hi ais523 13:35:47 +ul (:^):^ 13:35:48 ...out of time! 13:35:49 hi 13:36:02 It's funny that the cycle-counter stoppage -- which I think happens with (:^):^ -- doesn't say anything. 13:36:36 http://esolangs.org/wiki/Underload#Self-interpreter <-- hahah 13:36:42 that is so cheating 13:36:57 yeah 13:37:04 ^ul ("")S 13:37:04 "" 13:37:06 hm 13:37:12 wait 13:37:14 ^ul (""")S 13:37:14 """ 13:37:16 err 13:37:20 well 13:37:22 http://esolangs.org/wiki/Underload#Reserved_characters <-- ??? 13:37:33 i'd say ^ is the self-interpreter, and not really cheating. 13:37:33 it seems to say that " should be quoted with "? 13:37:43 well cheating in that it's just an eval 13:37:44 AnMaster: well, yes 13:37:49 but everyone ignores that rule, even me 13:37:54 so I should remove it from the language some time 13:37:56 ^ul ("[]")S 13:37:56 "[]" 13:38:00 I see 13:38:55 ais523, how the heck do you do flow control in underload? 13:39:06 What the... now I get "bad insn!" out of ^. 13:39:11 AnMaster: generally by generating code and doign ^ 13:39:14 *doing ^ 13:39:38 -!- deveah has joined. 13:39:50 Am I having the same version here... 13:39:51 ais523, what would you use for an "if top value of stack is a, do foo, otherwise do bar" 13:39:53 or such 13:40:00 ^ul ((foo)S)^ 13:40:11 for instance to run code iff TOS is 0, you can do :(code here)~(!())~^^^ 13:40:12 That gives me "bad insn" locally. I think I messed something up. 13:40:42 ais523, how does that make it conditional? 13:40:57 ais523: won't that run it N times where N is the number? 13:41:02 oklopol: no 13:41:06 because I'm not running it N times 13:41:10 but 0 to the power N time 13:41:11 *times 13:41:19 and 0 to the power 0 is 1, but 0 to the power anything else is 0 13:41:30 damn, it's that simple?!? 13:41:35 ais523, I can't figure out how ":(code here)~(!())~^^^" works 13:41:45 i wrote an isZero yesterday, and it was a lot longer 13:42:48 but well, in a language like underload, there's either a reeeeeally simple way, or you have to actually go through the logic, which results in tons of code 13:42:58 before the first ^ in that... stack would be "value code !() value"? 13:43:17 huh 13:43:48 ais523, isn't that ! run unconditionally? 13:44:05 well, it puts the code underneath 0 underneath the number that you're depending on 13:44:09 +ul (!())(:::***)^ 13:44:11 +ul (!())(:::***)^S 13:44:12 !()!()!()!() 13:44:13 then it evaluates the number you're depending on and makes that many copies of 0 13:44:21 if it makes any copies of 0, they eliminate the (code here) and replace it with the null string 13:44:25 then you run either the code here, or the null string 13:44:25 +ul (!())(!())^S 13:44:27 nope 13:44:35 because it might itself have been eliminated 13:44:37 ais523, wait, where does it make copies? 13:44:39 basically, if the TOS is (!()), the (code here) runs 13:44:43 if the TOS is a positive number, the (code here) doesn't 13:44:45 so it's equivalent to if(!x) { codehere; } 13:44:47 AnMaster: the number itself makes copies 13:44:49 that's how Underload numbers work 13:44:52 ah 13:44:53 0 makes 0 copies of the TOS 13:44:54 1 makes 1 copy 13:44:57 2 makes 2 copies 13:44:59 and so on 13:45:18 ais523, I can't see it mentioned on http://esolangs.org/wiki/Underload ? 13:45:27 they aren't built into the lang 13:45:31 it's just the normal way to define numbers 13:45:34 oh that type of number... 13:45:38 +ul (!())()^S 13:45:38 !() 13:45:41 right 13:45:43 (!()) () (:*) (::**) (:::***) (::::****) and so on 13:45:51 +ul (!())(!())^S 13:46:01 oh, right, of course that's 1 13:46:03 oklopol: null string is the correct output there 13:46:09 0 to the power 0 is 1... 13:46:09 ais523, so... is underload actually tc? 13:46:13 AnMaster: yes 13:46:18 I have an ski to Underload compiler 13:46:24 and a BF-minus-input to Underload compiler 13:46:29 yeah, it was just my "oh empty input something's wrong" reflex 13:46:30 also where did 0 to the power of 0 get into it? 13:46:45 +ul (!())(!())^S <--- calculate 0 to the power 0 13:46:51 oh 13:47:09 AnMaster: what made you think Underload wasn't TC? 13:47:17 I picked the commands very carefully to make it a tarpit 13:47:28 ais523, just that I couldn't figure out non-trivial flow control 13:47:45 ais523: 0^0 is indeed 1, but when exponentiation is done like that, i don't automatically trust it works on the corner cases 13:47:48 +ul (::::****)(::::****)^S 13:47:48 ::::****::::****::::****::::****::::**** 13:47:50 hm? 13:47:51 flow control is interesting in Underload, but very neat once you get used to it 13:48:02 not everyone even defines 0^0 as 1 13:48:11 ais523, also you can't do "bf minus input", you can't output unbalanced () after all 13:48:15 well, but Church numerals have 0^0 as 0 13:48:20 AnMaster: I output them as ? 13:48:24 ah 13:48:25 different character set... 13:48:35 I define 0^0 as 0^^(0^0) 13:48:40 also, when 0 is defined as "make 0 copies" 13:48:45 ais523, still I'd argue that isn't "bf-complete except input" 13:48:48 then it makes intuitive sense for 0 to the power 0 to be 1 13:48:59 AnMaster: Can your BF implementation output klingon characters? 13:49:04 Wow, there was an utter bug in ^. 13:49:05 No? It's not output-complete then. 13:49:07 ^reload 13:49:07 Reloaded. 13:49:08 AnMaster: BF-complete except input and output of some characters, are you happy now? 13:49:18 ehird, well yes, I just output the bytes needed 13:49:23 for the unicode or whatever 13:49:28 ais523, yes :) 13:49:29 AnMaster: Klingon is not in unicode. 13:49:31 Try again. 13:49:52 ^ul ((meh)S)^ 13:49:52 meh 13:49:57 ehird, well if it doesn't have a code point then it could be hard. And that wasn't the point 13:50:01 I never said "output complete" 13:50:05 I said "bf complete" 13:50:14 AnMaster: The character set that underload uses happens to not have the code point that ( and ) are on. 13:50:18 Also, BF does not define the output character set. 13:50:31 AnMaster: http://paste.eso-std.org/b 13:50:33 ^ul (:^):^ 13:50:34 ...out of time! 13:50:35 indeed it doesn't. it just allows you to output any value between 0 and 255 13:50:38 inclusive 13:50:42 that's my compiler 13:50:54 Hey, the out-of-timeity works. 13:50:59 written in JS 13:51:04 ^ul ((crash)S:^):^ 13:51:04 crashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashc 13:51:11 ais523, I suggest a pastebin that doesn't result in a download dialog next time ;P 13:51:14 fungot: Are you still alive after that? 13:51:15 fizzie: the politically based content of the section is to be barefoot and pregnant, augmented, pregnant and augmented), the rotational kinetic energy: i will change the introduction accordingly. user:barnaby dawsonbarnaby dawson 09:16, 24 july 2006 ( utc 13:51:17 AnMaster: That is intentional. 13:51:18 Strange. 13:51:30 ehird, oh? why? 13:51:45 AnMaster: so your editor does the syntax highlighting 13:51:45 AnMaster: Your editor is a better syntax-highlighter & code navigator than some web script. 13:51:56 My browser, at least, when I click, opens it directly in my editor. 13:52:08 so do both the ones I've tried 13:52:09 ehird, I'd just like to view it raw in web browser, no highlighting 13:52:15 although Firefox goes via a dialog box 13:52:17 and when I open it I gets a html page 13:52:19 very strange 13:52:24 oh wait 13:52:26 it is indeed 13:52:29 AnMaster: Why do you want to view it raw in a web browser? 13:52:31 It's code. 13:52:38 Don't you want to read code how you configured emacs to do it? 13:52:48 If not, why not? What do you use instead? 13:53:01 ehird, ? I just like a raw text view 13:53:17 I normally only use minimal level of syntax highlighting 13:53:25 AnMaster: Then open it in a raw text editor. 13:53:27 Say, cat(1). 13:53:42 Do whatever you'd do to read code normally. You know more about that than a website does. 13:53:55 If you configure your browser properly, it'll open in what you want. 13:54:09 ehird, what if I want it to open in firefox? ;P 13:54:12 If you configure your browser properly <--- I suspect only about 3 people have done that... 13:54:14 How wouldI do that 13:54:21 would I* 13:54:28 AnMaster: You'd configure open with -> Firefox. 13:54:32 But why do you want to read code in firefox? 13:54:41 why not? 13:54:43 What makes it more superior than, say, gedit, for unhighlighted text/ 13:54:46 Or kate, or whatever. 13:54:47 well, I loaded it in Firefox 13:54:49 so as to be able to run it 13:54:50 Why is it superior? 13:54:51 It's not. 13:54:55 It's not in any way. 13:55:00 ehird, it means no need to change to another program 13:55:09 just viewing it quickly in the same app is faster 13:55:16 AnMaster: The fact that your desktop environment is hostile to multitasking is not my problem, sorry. 13:55:32 why do you think it is? 13:55:37 I just prefer this workflow 13:55:43 no need to get angry over it 13:55:47 I'm not angry. 13:56:06 I'm merely stating that the only reason you want to view it in firefox is because your system apparently cannot handle easy usage of more than one application at once. 13:56:07 ehird, idea. offer a ?mode=raw 13:56:14 AnMaster: No. 13:56:18 why not? 13:56:24 Because there is no justification for it. 13:56:32 ehird, the reason is that I prefer it that way 13:56:40 AnMaster: Then configure _your_ client to use it that way. 13:56:43 It is not a server issue. 13:57:11 i'm used to just looking at things in ff, and not having to click on an okay-button; not sure AnMaster is comfortable with saying pressing the button is just too hard, i most certainly am. 13:57:27 very well I recommend pastebin.ca or rafb.net/paste or paste.lisp.org/new 13:57:28 :) 13:57:39 AnMaster: Unlikely to happen, as both I and ais523 prefer it that way. 13:59:31 ais523, see /msg btw 13:59:56 someone msg me too! 14:00:20 nah nevermind i'll go buy some food -> 14:02:32 AnMaster: that's interesting... I'd argue that doing something that's both utterly unexpected and technically correct is correct behaviour for an ESO pastebin 14:02:53 um 14:02:55 context plz. 14:03:09 ehird: AnMaster told me not to paste on eso-std.org because he didn't want to read pastes there 14:03:26 ais523: please stop talking in #esoteric, i don't want to read your messages here 14:03:29 thank you 14:03:40 well, not quite like that 14:03:44 he said that if I did he wouldn't read them 14:03:52 ahh, boycotting 14:03:57 what an excellent idea 14:03:57 which is more reasonable than what I accidentally portrayed him as saying... 14:04:16 and I said "probably" 14:04:19 "I don't want to configure my client to be reasonable, therefore the website is at fault, therefore I am extorting you not to use it" 14:04:30 ehird: the problem here is that nobody's client is reasonable 14:04:34 mine is 14:04:36 it works absolutely fine 14:04:37 thus your request that people use a reasonable client is unreasonable 14:04:44 and i didn't even need to configure it 14:04:50 so at least one person's client is reasonable. 14:04:54 over here, Firefox puts up a dialog box, Konq downloads directly to editor without a prompt 14:05:09 My browser does the konq behaviour. 14:05:11 Which is reasonable. 14:05:13 however, working like that is not how AnMaster wants it to work, obviosuly 14:05:13 You click a link, the document appears. 14:05:24 Why obviously? What is the problem with getting a document up when you request for it? 14:06:01 I suppose it's a similar argument as a page obnoxiously opening in a new window 14:06:11 Not really. 14:06:15 well in konq it opens inline kwrite, which is horrible IMO 14:06:22 AnMaster: So configure it. 14:06:24 inline Kate over here 14:06:26 and I normally end up using ff because it works better 14:06:28 and Kate isn't horrible IMO 14:06:42 ais523, kate is a bit better, but I prefer emacs most of the time 14:07:02 Kate is one of the better designed-for-GUI editors I know 14:07:05 AnMaster: In the time it's taking you to tell ais523 to stop using it and to tell me to break it, you could have configured it 50 times over. 14:07:05 and with just syntax highlight of keywords (bold) and comments (blue) 14:07:10 Emacs is still a console application really 14:07:24 and Kate's syntax highlighter is really good IME 14:07:27 ais523, well that is what I use it as (emacs in console) 14:07:32 about as good as Emacs' 14:07:40 * ais523 tries opening paste.eso-std.org/b in w3m 14:07:48 ais523, well it lacks a way to script it 14:07:51 kate lacks options 14:08:12 hmm... w3m just displays it inline, just like AnMaster asked 14:08:27 (because Content-Disposition: isn't in the spec, IIRC) 14:08:38 yes it is 14:08:48 http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2183.txt 14:08:51 ah, ok 14:08:59 august 1997 14:09:18 ok, so Microsoft are just-about catching up to it now then? 14:09:20 sorry, bad joke 14:09:30 they haven't managed html4 yet. 14:09:39 they have almost 14:09:40 hmm, that's later. 14:24:50 -!- fungot has quit (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)). 14:25:12 Hm how easy is it to golf using scheme? 14:25:59 AnMaster: it's 20th on Anagolf 14:26:08 ah interesting 14:26:14 which implies slightly harder than in BASIC, but slightly easier than in Io 14:26:34 ais523, don't know either of those languages, but how many are there on that list in total? 14:26:45 63, but some of them are esolangs 14:27:11 GolfScript is winning ofc 14:27:28 ais523, anagolf.com? 14:27:37 golf.shinh.org 14:27:44 it's a good place to practice programming too, btw 14:27:52 even though many of the problems are buggy or cheatable 14:28:00 1GolfScript heh 14:28:25 (define (x y)(define c 0)(lambda ()(set! c (+ c y)) c))(define a (x 2)) 14:28:31 any way to golf that further? 14:28:45 using (define d define) seems to make it longer actually 14:29:21 the existence of a set! in there implies you possibly aren't doing it the right way 14:29:41 ais523, I'm making a counter 14:30:06 even so, would passing it as an argument to everything monad-style be shorter or longer? 14:30:08 non-golfed version was (define make-counter-adder (lambda (x) (define counter 0) (lambda () (set! counter (+ counter x)) counter))) 14:30:26 for the function 14:30:39 ais523, and I was just checking for how golfable it was 14:31:30 ais523, anyway how would you suggest that, with the same resulting function signature for the constructed functions 14:31:44 they wouldn't have the same signature, that's the whole point... 14:31:51 hm right 14:32:30 ais523, so you suggest building functions like (whatever value) then? 14:32:34 oldvalue that is 14:34:43 (define (x y)(lambda (z)(+ z y))) 14:34:52 (define a (x 3)) 14:34:53 (a (a 4)) 14:34:53 10 14:34:54 hm 14:34:54 wait. 14:35:09 Is AnMaster trying tto learn scheme? 14:35:13 ehird, no I'm not 14:35:15 read up 14:35:23 I'm evaluating how golfable it is 14:35:28 ehird: he's trying to golf Scheme 14:35:37 ah. 14:35:40 it's not that golfable 14:35:41 ais523, rather: checking how golfable it is 14:35:43 common lisp is very golfable 14:35:50 ah interesting 14:35:55 due to its myriad of short-named functions and extra syntax up the wazoo 14:36:00 but scheme is too minimal to be golfed effectively 14:36:18 what's match-digit in Perl regexen? 14:36:51 ais523: dunno. 14:36:57 /\d/, I assume. 14:37:58 if anyone's wondering why most of the users there seem to be japanese (in their names & the language used in the descriptions and such) it's because 1. shinh is japanese 2. ruby has its largest userbase in japan 3. and golfing also seems to be really popular in japan 14:37:59 go figure 14:38:11 the engrish gives it a nice touch, though. 14:38:41 http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?echo wtf? Perl cat is 7 chars long? 14:38:43 Longer than I expected. 14:39:01 it's a command-line option in Perl 14:39:16 so it's actually only 1 char long in a practical Perl one-liner 14:39:24 -!- oerjan has joined. 14:39:25 but Anagolf doesn't let you specify command line args 14:39:27 #!perl -p 14:39:29 :-P 14:39:58 hi all 14:40:27 ehird, awk one is apperently of length 1 14:40:27 heh 14:40:37 the char is the space 14:40:40 as awk behaves like that by default 14:40:42 oh wait 14:40:42 ah right 14:40:43 shorter perl one 14:40:45 newline 14:40:50 #!cat 14:40:51 wait, no 14:40:53 ehird: cat is 2 chars in HOMESPRING, IIRC 14:40:54 exec is disabled 14:40:57 dot neline 14:40:58 and it'll need a full path 14:41:00 *dot newline 14:41:05 hm 14:41:08 -!- oerjan has quit (Client Quit). 14:41:08 bash 2 chars? 14:41:12 * AnMaster considers 14:41:17 dd 14:41:26 AnMaster: dd 14:41:27 two in VI too 14:41:28 ZZ 14:41:38 oh so exec is enabled for bash 14:41:40 not pure bash 14:41:47 duh 14:41:49 yep, bash is allowed to exec 14:43:06 -!- oerjan has joined. 14:43:07 5 for befunge? hm.... ~,#@ 14:43:10 that is 4 14:44:22 wb ais523 14:44:25 AnMaster: submit it 14:44:32 says fail, odd 14:44:32 note that it's -93 14:44:37 it works locally 14:44:43 AnMaster: it tells you what your prorgam outputted 14:44:45 and what was expected 14:44:47 below the fail message 14:44:51 no output 14:44:53 huh 14:45:13 does it work with -93? 14:45:20 ah 14:45:20 AnMaster: timeout 14:45:23 your program never exits 14:45:26 yes it does 14:45:31 since ~ reflects on EOF 14:45:33 then it takes more than 3 seconds to execute 14:45:36 so it will hit @ 14:45:39 after wrapping 14:45:55 AnMaster: what is your program, and to do what? 14:46:05 ais523, befunge cat: 14:46:10 ~,#@ 14:46:23 however anagolf thinks it fails to output 14:46:24 AnMaster: ~ doesn't reflect on EOF in Befunge-93 14:46:31 ais523, hm good question 14:46:33 it inputs -1 instead, IIRC 14:46:53 well it only said befunge, not befunge-93, they should clarify it then 14:46:59 AnMaster: i asked 14:47:01 like five times 14:47:03 DOES IT WORK WITH -93 14:47:09 ehird, as far as I know 14:47:10 also, BEFUNGE in common parlance MEANS BEFUNGE-93 14:47:11 it should 14:47:19 AnMaster: when i asked, i meant TEST IT 14:48:08 ais523, it is not mentioned in http://catseye.tc/projects/befunge93/doc/befunge93.html 14:48:17 so undefined for 93 14:48:29 well then I would expect -1 on EOF, that's what undefined stuff normally ends up doing 14:49:50 Hm how can C++ version be longer than C version? After all you should save one char in the includes by doing instead of 14:49:52 weird 14:50:08 because it'll use actual c++, probably 14:50:09 (std::) 14:50:24 ehird, but you can use C headers from inside C++ 14:50:31 and? 14:50:34 so nobody thought of that 14:50:40 heh 14:50:41 why not submit your shorter version? 14:50:42 * AnMaster considers 14:50:45 I will 14:51:20 -!- fungot has joined. 14:51:35 * ehird considers writing overengineered, well-indented, commented, meaningful and easy-to-read code to anagolf just to make people go wtf when they see me at the bottom of the rankings 14:51:47 100 line hello world? you bet! 14:51:53 Also should put printf in the 'std' namespace. 14:51:59 ah right 14:52:04 and C++ needs void in main() 14:52:06 so yeah 14:52:08 won't wrok 14:52:09 work* 14:52:17 tada 14:52:18 :-P 14:52:25 My Underload interpreter is full of bugs. :/ 14:52:31 it's funny, anagolf shows that ruby actually beats perl a lot of the time 14:52:33 ^ul (:^):^ 14:52:33 ...out of time! 14:52:35 for golfing 14:52:48 perl generally beats it for just-regex kind of stuff, though 14:52:57 ^ul ((................)~:^):^ 14:52:57 ...too much stack! 14:53:26 Hmm, the limits might be a bit too tight now. Set them with RC/Funge, while fungot's actually running on cfunge. 14:53:27 fizzie: it would be interesting to see that the number of grades drop, the number of people in society actually behave in a rational, but more explicitly in his interviews, fergusson indicates that it was closed. 14:53:37 ^ul (((................)!)~*:^):^ 14:53:39 ...out of time! 14:53:41 http://golf.shinh.org/reveal.rb?Life+game/fsystem/1194358586&rb An amazing Game of Life. 14:53:54 Oh, wait. 14:53:57 That's a cheat. 14:53:58 :-P 14:56:10 ehird, what language is that in? 14:56:14 ruby. 14:56:16 but it is a cheat 14:56:21 how is it a cheat? 14:56:23 it only works for the inputs specifically tested 14:56:37 it's just some clever compression along with a condition on the input 14:56:39 hm randomized inputs would be better 14:56:46 impossible 14:56:52 challenges are user-submitted 14:56:58 well, technically you could enter a program that prints inputs 14:57:00 but that's way more work 14:57:03 besides 14:57:10 people specifically mark them as cheats, generally 14:57:16 they're still clever, for their compression 14:57:23 well it could still be possible, say, random-string random-number 14:57:25 in some way 14:57:28 http://golf.shinh.org/reveal.rb?Life+game/fsystem/1194358586&rb An amazing Game of Life. <- what language is this? 14:57:29 how. 14:57:34 Slereah_: Ruby, but it's a cheat 14:57:41 How does it cheat? 14:57:46 Slereah_, read up 14:57:48 It only works for the inputs that are tested. 14:57:51 (Gee, deja vu) 14:58:07 Oh. 14:58:10 ehird, if it was me asking the second time you would just have told me to read scrollback 14:58:24 AnMaster: No, I wouldn't, I'd have said the exact same thing while snarking about deja vu. 14:58:31 I onyl say that when you actually word the question differently. 14:58:36 But I was amused as he said the exact same thing. 14:59:01 ehird, the question was worded differently 14:59:07 Barely. 14:59:08 "is it" != "does it" 14:59:21 [[what language is this?]] 14:59:25 [[what language is that in?]] 14:59:35 ehird, again a bit different 14:59:40 Barely. 14:59:44 for both yes 15:00:30 Running "(((................)!)~*:^):^" under RC/Funge gives me an "unterminated (" error; I guess it's again some sort of fixed-maximum-size-in-STRN thing. 15:00:56 fizzie, well cfunge have fixed max too, limited by size_t 15:01:03 ;P 15:01:09 That's a bit different from a fixed maximum of 1000, though. 15:01:19 1000? What a silly max 15:01:30 should report it as a bug 15:01:31 ais523: btw your thutubot ul has bugs with {}, in case that's not intended 15:01:44 +ul ((}))S 15:01:45 (=)} 15:01:54 ^ul ((}))S 15:01:54 (}) 15:02:09 ehird, btw creating a random generation system is quite easy 15:02:16 you need something like a reverse regex 15:02:23 AnMaster: Not. Easy. For. The. Submitting. Users. 15:02:39 http://golf.shinh.org/mkprob.html = simple as hell and a low barrier to entry means they get submitted a lot. 15:02:52 Also, cheats are accepted, generally. Just as long as they're marked as such. 15:03:23 ehird: one option would be to have a secret test case 15:03:37 ah yes 15:03:39 oerjan: except then if you had a bug in your submission you wouldn't be able to figure out what the problem is. 15:03:44 = less submissions. 15:04:10 however I don't consider something like: \rand[A-Z]{3,4} or such in a input format hard 15:04:22 for the submitter 15:04:27 AnMaster: Yes, it is, because they haev to learn it. 15:04:31 Context free grammars are easier to use as generators and somewhat easier to understand... 15:04:35 Right now, they can think of a problem, describe it in english, and give a few examples. 15:04:38 And submit. that's it. 15:04:49 No coding or anything involved, just give some examples, say what you mean, and you're done. 15:05:11 Additionally, submitters also have to learn how the generator works, so they know what to code for 15:05:13 in your system 15:05:22 ehird, well it isn't really hard, you need one command \rand or whatever, followed by a range a-zA-Z0-9 or whatever in [], followed by how many chars 15:05:38 and the site is for coders obviously 15:05:45 You lost me at the part where you raised the barrier to entry by making me learn something knew, then testing it, making sure there aren't bugs, then finally submitting it. 15:05:58 It's a lot easier to check for bugs in input->output pairs. 15:05:58 A lot. 15:06:03 Even now, people still get it worng 15:06:08 and have to have shinh delete the broken ones. 15:06:19 heh strange 15:06:34 I've got it wrong before, it's not hard to mess up. 15:06:44 you don't test locally first? 15:07:30 you're missing what i mean 15:07:39 often your script itself is buggy 15:07:42 that generates the cases 15:09:11 ehird, so how hard is it to make cat. \rand[a-zA-Z0-9]{1,100} -> \1 15:09:22 compared to 15:09:24 foo -> foo 15:09:25 asdashdaksd 15:09:25 Ã¥sdasd 15:09:26 -> 15:09:29 asdashdaksd 15:09:32 Ã¥sdasd? 15:09:34 Very hard. 15:09:45 I would happily submit my version, not yours. 15:10:02 I guess regex doesn't come naturally to you then. 15:10:09 Yes, it does. 15:10:22 ais523: oh you already noted 15:10:28 Does anyone feel like explaining to AnMaster how he's missing the point? I kind of think his brain might be a closed-world logical system. 15:10:33 Tricky things, those. 15:10:37 you're both wrong 15:10:53 oklopol: everyone's always wrong, including you 15:10:59 nuh-uh! 15:11:04 -!- jix has joined. 15:11:05 oklopol: it's true! 15:11:11 NO :< 15:11:11 oklopol, so what do you suggest? 15:11:12 oerjan: no, you're wrong 15:11:21 ehird: you are _so_ right 15:11:26 oerjan: suuuuuure 15:11:45 fungot: Who's right? 15:11:46 fizzie: this nickname is offensive to me as ive been told by 3 doctors i can never again fnord im certain you can imagine. i suggest: 15:11:57 aww... 15:11:59 LOL 15:12:02 fungot's fnord capability was removed 15:12:02 ehird: ok, this debate seems to be no sil code for alsatian. fnord ( user fnord) 15:12:07 so now he's upset that he's still called fungot 15:12:08 ehird: the article is disputed, or restore the tag. i believe a site with professional, crisp clear photos and illustrations would be proper for the new manager being adam chapman and series 10 fnord. the name of an illyrian tribe called the fnord page, and the grace budd image is in compliance with wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. do not simply insert a blank template on an image page. 15:12:11 as fungot's hallmark is fnording 15:12:12 ehird: in light of the resolution of the failed rfa and my proposal to fix it up some? fnord 06:22, 29 january 2008 ( utc)/small!-- template:unsignedip 15:12:15 shut up fungot 15:12:15 ehird: major points are appropriately cited. 15:12:31 Heh, he's a real Wikipedian. 15:12:48 ehird, I agree that a non-programmer could easily mess up that generation, but anyone that can program (which I assume anagolf users are capable of) can easily understand it 15:12:51 ais523: replace all the words in your wikipedia signature with fnord 15:12:52 doooooo it 15:13:18 ais523: replace all the words in your wikipedia signature with <- with what? 15:13:41 Slereah_: i dunno lol 15:13:41 Slereah_: yay 15:14:13 Slereah_, with "fnord"? 15:14:19 AnMaster: with ""? 15:14:19 What? 15:14:39 are you filtering that word? 15:14:42 AnMaster: inside joke 15:14:49 dronf 15:15:01 Wikipedia "fnord" article has the explanation, though. 15:15:04 Must go. 15:15:11 AnMaster: an empty message? huh? 15:15:42 AnMaster does not know what it means 15:15:49 Slereah_: What what means? 15:15:51 ehird: i don't know there was something backward about it 15:15:54 I'm googling now 15:15:57 oerjan: yeah, it's odd 15:16:01 AnMaster: fizzie said wikipedia 15:16:16 ehird : "it" 15:16:29 oh no he said it 15:16:32 Slereah_: gee, not knowing what "it" means? 15:16:35 what a retard :| 15:16:41 that's a basic word in english! 15:16:42 Heh. 15:16:43 wb ais523 15:17:04 ARE YOU DONE GOOGLING ANMASTER 15:17:16 I'm reading on wikipedia since several minutes yes 15:17:29 reading WHAT on wikipedia?! 15:17:44 http://xrl.us/oux4b 15:17:49 ehird : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human-goat_sexual_intercourse 15:17:56 Slereah_: Oh, okay. 15:18:02 I was scared it'd be something ... weird. 15:18:06 ehird, no Slereah_ isn't correct 15:18:14 AnMaster: O RLY 15:18:14 ehird, see http://xrl.us/oux4b 15:18:26 That article is weird 15:18:33 It's full of syntaxic weirdness 15:18:39 yeah 15:18:39 Like... WORDS MISSING D: 15:18:43 "is the typographic representation" 15:18:46 The interjection "" 15:18:49 "To see the means to be" 15:18:54 Slereah_, see the url in the addressbar 15:18:57 ehird, you too 15:18:58 :P 15:19:05 Huh, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ 15:19:09 Did someone vandalize the main page to that? 15:19:21 ehird, no it is an easter egg in mediawiki 15:19:27 Weird shit. 15:19:39 Heh. 15:19:42 ehird: what are you talking about? 15:19:47 I read Illuminatus once. 15:19:54 ais523, e is being silly 15:19:55 I probably won't read it again. 15:19:57 it looks normal to me... 15:20:08 It's a classic, but really, it's a terrible read 15:20:18 It's over a thousand pages and the plot goes everywhere 15:20:34 ais523, yes he is being silly 15:20:48 ais523, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fnord#The_Illuminatus.21_Trilogy explains it 15:21:06 I think ais523 might just know. 15:21:09 The point is he was d/c'd. 15:21:23 ehird, yes so I tried to help him catch up 15:21:54 I@m still here 15:22:00 although I'v ebeen having huge connection trouble 15:22:39 ais523 submits 98B of Perl for Ranking __REVENGE__, ranking #1 (10000pts). 15:22:42 -- #anagol 15:24:02 GO ANAL 15:24:07 afk. food 15:24:41 ais523 submits 97B of Perl for Ranking __REVENGE__, ranking #1 (10000pts). 15:24:41 *g* 15:25:45 chomp,$a++,print$b{/(\d+)$/,$1}||=$a," $_ 15:25:45 "for sort{(split/ /,$b)[-1]<=>(split/ /,$a)[-1]}<> 15:26:09 also, I got it down to 93b 15:26:12 but that isn't 1st 15:26:14 it's 4th 15:27:21 ais523 submits 93B of Perl for Ranking __REVENGE__, ranking #1 (10000pts). 15:27:56 is it randking within the lang, or something? 15:28:23 beware of the randking 15:28:29 he's totally unpredictable 15:29:18 ais523: yes 15:29:22 ranking within the lang, i think 15:35:19 down to 92b now 15:46:30 * ais523 is disappointed that there aren't more Perlists on anagolf atm 16:04:44 -!- sebbu has joined. 16:27:55 -!- Sgeo has joined. 16:46:52 -!- ab5tract has joined. 16:56:48 -!- oerjan has quit ("leaving"). 17:03:56 -!- M0ny has joined. 17:04:37 plop 17:05:02 hi M0ny 17:05:42 hi 17:25:37 -!- LinuS has joined. 18:02:46 -!- Judofyr has joined. 18:16:27 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | I've had experience with bad project names, and this isn't one. 18:16:51 perfect topic 18:17:38 optbot, destroy lament 18:17:39 Slereah_: nah 18:17:42 :( 18:18:59 -!- Jiminy_Cricket has joined. 18:20:15 -!- deveah has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 18:27:51 haha 18:28:01 Slereah_, stop being evil 18:28:07 what's going on over here? 18:28:13 ais523, nothing much 18:28:34 ais523, I suggest you read scrollback, less than a screen since your last comment 18:28:44 I don't have scrollback, connection problems 18:28:50 thus the need to ask 18:28:53 ais523, well 5 lines even 18:28:58 * optbot has changed the topic to: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | I've had experience with bad project names, and this isn't one 18:28:58 perfect topic 18:28:58 optbot, destroy lament 18:28:58 Slereah_: nah 18:28:58 :( 18:28:58 AnMaster: Same year as the Turing machine, IIRC. 18:28:58 AnMaster: "...and is not suitable for practical use." <-- i made an IRC bot in it 18:28:58 AnMaster: 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 0 18:29:02 ah, ok 18:29:35 hm the webserver yaws look nice 18:29:59 can't find any performance data however, and seems like docs are outdated 18:31:17 or rather, last comparison is for outdated versions 18:31:22 like apache 2.0.39 18:31:33 what I'm interested in is current yaws version and current lighttpd 18:31:36 all properly tuned 18:32:52 -!- Linus` has joined. 18:37:31 Multiple arbitrarily long lists of arbitrarily long strings are a bit annoying to keep in Funge-Space. Maybe I should have a limited number of slots for ignores. 18:37:45 fizzie, they aren't unlimited 18:38:22 Well, okay, there I can get by with limited string length. 18:38:30 fizzie, I think 005 on connect contains max lengths 18:38:31 iirc 18:38:38 -!- kar8nga has joined. 18:38:52 fizzie, it varies between different servers 18:38:57 nicks are limited definitely 18:38:59 so are idents 18:39:02 not sure for hosts 18:39:07 I'm still not going to start parsing those numerics. 18:39:25 fizzie, anyway you can easily store them 18:39:44 you just need to decide where 18:39:49 and for number of slots 18:39:53 hm 18:40:05 Yes, if there is a fixed amount of rows there's no problem. 18:40:23 what about adding a buffer of 500 lines? 18:40:30 should be more than enough, 500 ignores 18:40:42 Yes, I guess so. 18:40:47 otherwise.. implement a malloc with SUBR ;P 18:40:58 or something 18:41:33 Maybe I should use REXP and have regular-expression ignores; now that'd be useless. (The "only one regular expression per X" thing is a bit annoying; is it even per IP or per interpreter or what?) 18:42:15 ais523, there? 18:42:19 yes 18:42:40 -!- LinuS has quit (No route to host). 18:42:44 ais523, I got no idea if this will affect you but previously funge loading in cfunge happened with char*, and unless there is a good reason I'm changing that to unsigned char* 18:42:55 this would affect the loading code that intercal uses too 18:42:57 no, it won't make a difference 18:43:02 as I load from a string literal 18:43:18 maybe it needs a cast 18:43:20 ais523, same routine 18:43:28 but the great thing about C is you can cast anything to/from unsigned char*... 18:43:33 ais523, since I mmap() then load it as a string literal ;P 18:43:37 brb phone 18:45:25 -!- Slereah_ has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 18:48:23 back 18:49:38 Deewiant, question: Funge-98 specs doesn't say if i, o or initial code loading should be signed or unsigned right? 18:49:44 funge space itself is signed yes 18:49:53 unsigned 18:50:01 Deewiant, where does it say so? 18:50:04 hmm... native char would be more obvious 18:50:09 char is signed in some ABIs, unsigned in others 18:50:20 where it talks about "the meaning of char #217 is always char #217 to funge" or whatever 18:50:37 Deewiant, mycology doesn't test that I think 18:50:51 or? 18:50:53 yes, but it depends on it in some fingerprint 18:51:00 it's on my list of things to add 18:51:05 hrrm 18:52:05 Deewiant, FILE certainly doesn't say either signed or unsigned 18:52:10 pretty sure about that 18:52:21 of course it doesn't, it's one of Mike's :-P 18:52:33 why on earth would it say something like that :-P 18:53:25 heh 18:53:25 I read the spec as "ASCII characters 0-127 are mapped to funge numbers 0-127, characters with high bit set are implementation-defined.". 18:53:55 Ilari, what specific bit do you refer to? 18:54:14 Characters 128-255 (that is, those with bit 7 set). 18:54:37 ais523, current bzr version is now using unsigned, even if the function you use to load 18:54:45 may need a cast to prevent a warning 18:55:45 Ilari, that wording can't be found in Funge-98? 18:55:51 I searched 18:57:38 oh I think FILE is signed in cfunge heh, well would be non-trivial to fix and require lots of changes elsewhere 18:57:55 or rather FILE uses the system's native signed-ness 18:58:12 That is, 0-127 must be encoded as characters 0-127, but any other value can be encoded as anything (that involves at least one extended character, so it is uniquely decodeable). 18:58:55 Or, actually, anything can be encoded as anything, but 0-127 have specified decodings (and meanings). 18:59:12 -!- Slereah_ has joined. 18:59:18 Ilari, yes but where in the Funge-98 spec does it say so? I can't find anything backing your claim in it 19:00:16 SOCK W and R use unsigned char. 19:00:57 Hmm... Actually reading it again it seems to say that file read as sequence of codepoints (encoded in unspecified manner) and those codepoint numbers are used as numbers in funge-space. 19:01:37 for efunge I seem to read it as unsigned big endian (though the latter doesn't matter since it reads one byte at a time) 19:02:07 Ilari, as long as I don't need to parse utf8 I'm happy 19:02:42 and for any RC/Funge fingerprint I will just argue that due to being so poorly defined I can do whatever I want anyway ;P 19:03:12 AnMaster: I think having cfunge be internally inconsistent about what it uses where is a bad idea 19:03:34 In fact I interpret the spec that doing UTF-8 decoding on source file and using codepoint values as number sequence fed to parser would be allowed... 19:04:09 Deewiant, no it is just a case of push_gnirts using char* 19:04:12 err 19:04:27 stack_push_string 19:04:28 I mean 19:04:36 push_gnirts is the name used in efunge... 19:04:54 Deewiant, so I would need a push_unsigned_string 19:05:11 AnMaster: no, you just need to change it to unsigned char* 19:05:29 Deewiant, no I will need to add various casts too 19:05:40 why 19:06:02 Deewiant, -Wall -Wextra -Wa-lot-more -Wactually-think-warnings-are-useful 19:06:12 why would you ever need to cast anything 19:06:12 /home/arvid/src/cfunge/trunk/src/funge-space/funge-space.c: In function 'fungespace_load': 19:06:12 /home/arvid/src/cfunge/trunk/src/funge-space/funge-space.c:376: warning: pointer targets in passing argument 1 of 'load_string' differ in signedness 19:06:14 stuff like that 19:06:24 you should never have any char except unsigned char 19:06:29 anywhere 19:06:30 ever 19:06:33 Deewiant, yes I do, from system 19:06:41 since I use libc 19:06:43 which uses char* 19:06:48 which may or may not be signed 19:06:53 POS library >:-/ 19:06:56 POS? 19:07:03 well, just cast away then 19:07:04 well it's libc 19:07:12 which is kind of needed 19:08:01 Deewiant, hm... does STRN expect stuff to be cast to char* before being written/read from funge space 19:08:11 considering you may loose precision that way 19:08:18 considering the name of the fingerprint I'd say yes 19:08:27 lose* 19:08:53 Anyway, the current way I read the spec is that sequence of bytes is translated to sequence of numbers in some undefined manner and only meaning of that number sequence is defined. 19:09:25 Deewiant, stack_(push|pop)_string are used everywhere anything says 0"gnirts" in any fingerprint or core instruction 19:09:33 meaning they all end up as char there 19:10:13 ah. Deewiant have you considered non-ASCII? 19:10:20 what about such platforms? 19:10:27 Hm I think they will need to remap stuff 19:10:29 Ilari: I read it as being defined by the platform and not the interpreter 19:10:38 AnMaster: what do you mean have I considered them 19:10:43 CCBI originally used UTF-8 19:10:54 heh 19:11:01 Deewiant, I meant EBIC or whatever that one was 19:11:10 which aren't even ASCII compatible in any way 19:11:10 what about EBCDIC 19:11:32 ah that was the name 19:11:52 Deewiant, well a-f is a continuous range there iirc but not a-z 19:11:56 just as an examplke 19:11:57 example* 19:12:00 yes and what's your point 19:23:38 Deewiant, I end up adding casts in nearly every case due to that I happen to use libc :P 19:25:42 doesn't either cast implicitly to the other 19:27:54 -!- Slereah_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 19:28:53 Deewiant, with warnings 19:29:31 "loss of precision" or what nonsense? 19:29:39 /home/arvid/src/cfunge/trunk/src/funge-space/funge-space.c: In function 'fungespace_load': 19:29:40 /home/arvid/src/cfunge/trunk/src/funge-space/funge-space.c:376: warning: pointer targets in passing argument 1 of 'load_string' differ in signedness 19:29:43 was an eample 19:29:45 example* 19:30:59 pointer targets differ in signedness can actually play hell in the comparisons of loops, I sort-of understand why it warns people about those 19:31:02 just use -Wno-pointer-sign or cast 19:31:10 -!- Slereah_ has joined. 19:31:12 ais523, yes it does in many cases 19:31:20 for example writing out to funge space 19:31:34 there would have been some nasty bugs in STRN without those warnings 19:31:44 so Deewiant is plain wrong in thinking they are harmless 19:31:50 I did not say they are harmless 19:33:58 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has joined. 19:40:47 -!- Slereah has joined. 19:45:51 Deewiant, what about stdin? 19:46:00 as in ~& and various fingerprints 19:46:06 signed or unsigned? 19:47:33 Deewiant, well? 19:51:23 everything unsigned ever 19:53:48 Deewiant, impossible for those since they return signed 19:53:52 system routines 19:54:16 Deewiant, also funge-space itself is signed 19:54:19 no, they return impl-defined 19:54:36 and it's not impossible, just cast 19:54:37 Deewiant, yes char* 19:54:38 true 19:54:55 Deewiant, tell me where in the spec it says so 19:55:02 nowhere 19:55:06 it's my opinion 19:55:23 I think whoever thought up signed chars was an idiot, or then I'm grossly misinformed about something 19:55:27 ah so mycology won't test it apart from loading? 19:55:35 Deewiant, um, same for signed integers? 19:55:40 and signed shorts? 19:55:53 how could I test stdin signedness anyway 19:56:12 AnMaster: chars are not integers, and neither are bytes. 19:56:13 Re ~, the corresponding C standard library function -- getchar()/fgetc() -- returns unsigned characters. 19:56:14 Deewiant, hm true, maybe echo some char 19:56:38 fizzie, fgets() fputs() return/take char* 19:56:45 and I tend to do bulk IO 19:56:59 rather than one at a time 19:57:59 But ~ does not do bulk IO; and fgets/fputs are not very "bulk IO" either, being line-based; and for the fwrite()/fread() calls you can specify the interpretation yourself, since they take a void *. 20:00:14 hah I just reduced time for mycology a lot 20:00:21 by not using fflush() as often 20:00:25 what, even further? 20:00:26 Anyway, if you want to "act like the C library does", ~ ought to return a unsigned char, since that's what the C library function which does the same thing returns. Doesn't much matter how you implement it, of course. 20:00:28 -!- Slereah has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 20:00:45 ais523, yes 20:00:48 (Disclaimer: I haven't really been following the whole conversation.) 20:01:13 ais523, before I did fflush() on input ~& and newline in output 20:01:26 now it is changed to only do it when it actually reads input 20:01:34 just before the call to cf_getline 20:01:56 so if input can be served from buffer it won't call fflush() either 20:02:04 and it won't call it on every newline 20:03:03 -!- Slereah_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 20:03:26 ais523, and that shaves off almost 0.020 seconds 20:03:51 You mean you fflush() stdout before reading input, to make prompts and such visible? 20:03:58 fizzie, yes 20:04:05 Okay. 20:04:20 fizzie, and I used to do it more often than needed 20:04:22 "fflush() on input" just sounded a bit strange. 20:04:45 I used to follow the same algorithm as ccbi claim(ed?) it uses in --help 20:06:23 fizzie, I have a non-public script here to build a special build for speed runs, for mycology that script actually doesn't make a lot of difference to -O3 -fweb 20:06:32 but for life.bf it does for some reason 20:06:35 interesting 20:06:41 anyway life.bf is even faster now 20:07:13 AnMaster: -fweb's implied by funroll loops, in gcc 20:07:39 ais523, well not by -O3 according to docs for gcc 4.1.2 at least 20:07:41 iirc 20:07:44 no 20:07:57 are you not funrolling loops for a reason, btw? 20:08:00 ais523, and my special build system use profile feedback 20:08:12 -fprofile-use 20:08:23 yes, and thanks for all the help it gave me in the ICFP, I survived until about 3 rounds from the end 20:08:30 ais523, well except they can slow down sometimes due to cache locality iirc 20:08:40 I'm pretty sure I have seen examples of that 20:09:44 -!- asiekierka has joined. 20:11:58 ais523, http://omploader.org/vdjY2 <-- it is about 3 times as fast when I'm not using xvidcap btw.... 20:12:07 it's an *.mpeg 20:12:18 showing how fast cfunge is at life of game 20:12:38 hmm... why not just have used ttyrec? 20:12:40 of course I'm unable to test ccbi under same conditions due to it being in D 20:12:45 ais523, ttyrec? Hm 20:12:50 * AnMaster looks for that package 20:13:04 it's mostly used to record games of text-based games like NetHack 20:13:43 ais523, what about speed? My screen only shows a blur for those bits on screen when xvidcap isn't running 20:13:54 so I guess faster than this monitor's response time 20:14:05 AnMaster: there are players that can slow it down 20:14:09 and rewind, and so on 20:14:17 ais523, well I want to show how fast it actually is 20:14:24 look up ipbt, although it seems not to be packaged it compiles from source well 20:15:05 ais523, compared to ccbi and rc/funge 20:15:05 -!- asiekierka has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 20:15:22 actually I should probably publish the profiled building script 20:15:50 http://rafb.net/p/diPMmW23.html 20:16:06 be aware of that that requires mycology to exist in a specific place 20:16:07 and so on 20:16:26 and you need to change CHOSTFLAGS 20:16:53 oh and gnu toolchain needed 20:16:58 at least for ld 20:17:02 apart from gcc 20:17:07 it is really meant for local usage 20:17:16 I'm a bit curious about how fast thutubot's +ul is, compared to fungot's ^ul. (Although the latter probably has some bugs left.) 20:17:16 fizzie: 14:58, april 24, 2007.. 24.166.157.216 ( talk block) 20:17:19 but I assume some people may find it interesting 20:17:35 fizzie: Thutu is inherently slow, although the algorithm it uses is a pretty fast one for Thutu 20:17:37 fizzie, well that may depend on if you compile it using some way like the one I linked 20:17:44 also, Thutu programs run slower the more they store in memory 20:17:48 ais523: befunge isn't exactly inherently fast either ;-) 20:17:53 so it'll depend on all sorts of things 20:17:58 Deewiant: it is by esolang standards 20:18:02 fizzie, be aware of that if that cause bugs it is probably not high priority to fiux 20:18:03 fix* 20:18:05 at least it isn't a factor of n slower 20:18:31 fungot: busy signing fizzie's messages for em? 20:18:31 ais523: ' ' fnord 20:18:44 heh 20:18:56 fungot, what do you mean with ' '? 20:18:57 AnMaster: finally, in the process of being verified right now that are very real in my personal experience. when i first stumbled across 141's edits, i can't see why you would include this personal rant. what you two have been doing business with each other. 20:19:01 and the fnord too 20:19:11 AnMaster: '' is mediawiki markup for italic, ''' for bold 20:19:15 they confuse fungot quite a lot 20:19:15 ais523: i've noticed this before whilst listening to the answer by the minister for health and fnord. 20:19:28 health and fnord 20:19:29 hehehee 20:19:34 fungot: In what country they have a minister for health and fnord? 20:19:35 fizzie: yes, that is, levinson went to kish, disappeared, had on your behalf countless official pleas and responses from the u.s. and canadian newspapers, using fnord connected to the hydrogen station series. i also had to change it to the article. 20:19:48 fizzie, do they* 20:19:58 I really like this fungot database, btw 20:19:58 ais523: ( 4) http://news.com.com/ fnord/ fnord/ fnord/ fnord/ fnord/ bios/ overview/ atpd683.html french open ( roland fnord, fnord 20:20:06 hahah 20:20:11 it's very Wikipedia-like 20:20:26 ais523, except the fnords I guess? 20:20:31 well, yes 20:20:36 And all that comes from just 1/256th of the talk pages. 20:22:44 In case someone's interested, http://zem.fi/~fis/fungot_articles.txt has the list of articles used. (The names have had "Talk:" removed, and the titles have been filenamized; spaces to _, slashes to @, and all kinds of more special characters escaped with +nn or +unnnn.) 20:22:44 fizzie: if there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this article. 20:23:15 yes, fizzie, fair use rationales are verry important 20:23:32 hahaha 20:23:37 Yes, but for a plain-text list of filenames from my own disk? 20:26:13 fungot: So, tell me about... the ZX Spectrum character set. You should know something about it, it's there in the list. 20:26:13 fizzie: fnord) refers to ashoka maurya as a maha-asura i.e. a few wrote, fnord, which 20:26:53 Maybe it's not really very useful as a fact-bot. 20:27:32 I never mistook fungot for a fact-bot... 20:27:33 ais523: i removed the mention of any other fnord was one of the templates at wikipedia:fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. do not simply insert a blank template on an image page. 20:27:46 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has quit (Remote closed the connection). 20:27:53 It is _very_ concerned about the fair use of images. 20:27:53 although it seems to care a lot about fair-use policy 20:28:12 OTOH, optbot is a factbot sometimes, just you don't normally get the fact you want 20:28:13 ais523: no 20:28:21 or indeed its context 20:28:51 hehe 20:29:03 yeah if you actually want a fact bot you would need to consider input 20:29:15 ^ul (optbot)S 20:29:15 optbot 20:29:16 ais523: i'm taking an apathetic stance 20:29:16 fungot: if you were, you could always try $ cat | sed 'regular exp here' :> 20:29:16 optbot: bought by sun microsystems. citation sun press room fnord/ fnord fnord the encyclopaedia britannica: a dictionary of arts, sciences, commerce and law. faculties of medicine ( 1936), co-author of the ugly american. ' ' 20:29:16 fungot: !ps 20:29:17 optbot: i think the song " clementine" or anything about huckleberry hound. why he might decide to do this)? thanks! fnord fnord --user:protiousgeorge ( user talk:protioustalk) 01:44, 8 september 2008 ( utc 20:29:17 fungot: 55) 20:29:18 optbot: i changed the 2007 population data in the infobox, but i note a couple things still stick out. first, the idea that " things lose value because they cease to exist". if we can make a wide speculation like that without knowing. there is also an improvement over an fnord body of text that is published elsewhere under different terms, that does not give the base of the log. small—preceding wikipedia:signaturesunsigned co 20:29:19 fungot: this is my point. We all know that a halting solver is impossible to do exactly. It'll either keep going and going, only halted by a timeout (which would be inaccurate, perhaps), or it'll halt and return true. (but we all know that, so I just wasted effort typing all this out.) 20:29:19 o:optbot: meaning that the western asian people known as " dom", as the 20:29:19 fungot: hmm 20:29:21 optbot: i also think the article also has a strong reputation as a remedy against me. if you can't convince each other, right? fnord! 20:29:21 fungot: SEXAY 20:29:24 optbot: i've put in this picture of the coronation. i assume that it is common to use the cbs name. in the same manner as other south slavs are, although the apa does not recognize this syndrome and convened a panel that rejected the existence of 20:29:24 fungot: how're you doing with the Basil puzzle? 20:29:25 Hey. 20:29:27 wait 20:29:28 optbot: i am currently investigating fnord and permanent hair removal as a permanent solution to this problem. the problem is that faith and belief are fnord acts and can not ever be like today. there is already someone by that name, which should be relevant for this page? 20:29:28 fungot: that would make continuations rather worthless 20:29:29 what 20:29:32 optbot: please go to :image:logo ulivo fnord image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with wp:fufair use. 20:29:32 fungot: missed a . 20:29:33 kill it 20:29:35 -!- fungot has left (?). 20:29:41 that's not meant to happen... 20:29:43 Who has brokeded the loop-checker? 20:29:43 fizzie, rate limit broken 20:29:49 Well, me, most likely, but still. 20:29:51 fizzie, you I guess 20:30:01 fizzie, hm UNIT 20:30:07 Befunge Unit testing 20:30:08 :D 20:30:14 no clue how the heck to do that 20:30:23 using Befunge Units, of course 20:30:29 ais523, oh details? 20:30:39 well, I just made them up, and there aren't any details yet 20:30:50 but probably something like mini-funge 20:32:51 ais523, :/ 20:33:22 * ais523 ponders the concept of compiling BackFlip into Funge 20:33:23 I did mess around the loop-checker when updating fungot not to use NULL any more, but I can't see how I would've broken it. 20:33:23 ais523, continuous(sp?) integration for Funge? 20:33:36 well, no, it was just a flippant pun, really 20:33:42 but you spelt continuous correctly 20:34:13 Funge IDE with project files and so on 20:34:33 * AnMaster considers Visual Studio Funge# 20:34:34 :( 20:34:48 that would be truly horrible 20:39:22 -!- ab5tract has quit. 20:41:16 That's curious, the loop-checker seems to work when single-stepping through it. 20:42:01 Maybe a large negative number has somehow ended up there, although I don't see how, since it should reset to zero whenever someone talks to fungot. 20:42:06 -!- fungot has joined. 20:42:13 fungot: First I say something to you. 20:42:13 fizzie: respectfully, fnord ( ancestral form of modern iranian fnord fnord, fnord 20:42:18 ^choo optbot 20:42:19 optbot ptbot tbot bot ot t 20:42:19 fizzie: allowed_execs["__import__"] = None 20:42:19 fungot: 2 20:42:20 optbot: they needed cars, fnord and fnord) and all stocky muscle could easily tip the scale at close to 1600 pounds. ( note: women rowers have close to the disparity of sub-saharn africa would have the slight advantage of leaving the existing links to " hull speed". 20:42:20 fungot: maxima 20:42:20 optbot: this page is going to be long, and needs to be discussed, it should be deleted, not merged. but new england flood of may 2006 has the fnord nest with the fnord 20:42:21 fungot: !befunge http://catseye.mine.nu:8080/projects/befunge93/eg/hello2.bf 20:42:21 optbot: includes almost every naval aircraft ever used. the major ideas need a page number from those books cited. ideally one should use the binary prefixes. if you have 20:42:22 fungot: afk 20:42:22 optbot: 3. unlike some fighters whose fnord decreases after their prime, kung fu will relate to chinese martial arts page and the pic fnord changing. i dont think that this article be renamed but there was no official release date. fnord listed it as simply the " horn" and " impute". is this a cognate of the spanish fnord fnord? 20:42:23 fungot: I forget that methods are non-first-class in java 20:42:30 worked? 20:42:31 Okay, there, it stopped. 20:42:53 The same thing should really be happening even if the underload interp is used to initiate the loop. 20:43:11 fungot: I'm just resetting the limit again. 20:43:11 fizzie: i finally tracked down some related publications by searching directly for professor fnord fnord. 20:43:14 fizzie, you could have attached gdb and dumped the location using call if you had a debug (-O0) build 20:43:23 ^ul (optbot)S 20:43:23 optbot 20:43:24 fizzie: pymacs or something 20:43:24 fungot: exactly 20:43:24 optbot: an annular hurricane. i think we can use the compressed air at 70 psi to operate the points for the fnord web 20:43:24 fungot: What time is i 20:43:25 optbot: it should be named in english, using both terms. --user:jondeljondel 09:49, 24 june 2008 ( utc 20:43:25 fungot: and then you'll never be able to use the lambda special form!! 20:43:25 optbot: the region was originally inhabited by the fnord show syndicated on the n all over the place. 20:43:26 fungot: it wasn't 20:43:26 optbot: my apologies for the tone of the series' fnord. 20:43:26 fungot: that's the 'official' name 20:43:32 Okay, it stopped again. 20:43:50 Maybe I had a botched copy running on the box where the IRCed fungot sits. 20:43:50 fizzie: this article could be expanded. user:badagnanibadagnani 21:01, 27 september 2006 ( utc 20:44:06 fizzie, in a debug build: call fungespace_dump() 20:44:07 iirc 20:44:16 but that won't exist in a release build 20:44:25 it just dumps it raw to stdout btw 20:44:55 fizzie, wait you store it negative? 20:45:04 fungespace_dump dumps from 0,0 to edge 20:45:11 so only in positive space 20:45:26 Yes, the counter is at x=0, y=-15; and the last nick who spoke to it is in x=1..., y=-15. 20:47:04 ah hm 20:47:13 fizzie, that is kind of "tricky" to reach in cfunge 20:47:31 I would just add a print where I needed it in the code 20:47:34 fungespace_get(vector_create_ref(x, y))) 20:47:41 but vector_create_ref is a macro 20:47:50 you end up with 20:48:10 fungespace_get(& (fungeVector){x, y}) or such iirc 20:48:19 that is a pointer to a struct on stack 20:48:33 which is tricky to call from gdb to put it mildly 20:48:44 -!- Corun has joined. 20:49:09 -!- fungot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 20:49:14 Whoopsie. 20:49:32 fizzie, eh? 20:53:10 -!- fungot has joined. 20:53:13 Just experimenting. 20:53:18 fizzie, oh? 20:53:22 fungot: Hello there. 20:53:23 fizzie: he claims it on his web site? fnord 16:09, 28 december 2007 ( utc))) which quotes these formulae and confirms that this is supposed to be assuming good faith here? please suggest any changes that you think would be a better type of article for a good article but it is always called " le fnord di figaro," w.a. mozart; the title role in " the other side has not been updated in years, not since their first creation of the 20:53:33 ^code 0ad00f-gU0": ciretose# GSMVIRP"AAN51p08P0851g21gW$ 20:53:42 fizzie, huh? 20:53:44 Hmm, that should've worked. 20:53:54 ciretose# ? 20:54:01 #esoteric, of course. 20:54:07 ah 20:54:19 But it just hung up this time. Meh, worked locally, too. 20:54:29 -!- fungot has quit (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)). 20:54:30 fizzie, buggy I guess 20:54:36 you need to be less random 20:54:52 easier to track it down then 20:55:08 I probably should be using the same interpreter for local testing and actual running, too. 20:55:08 lol @ ciretose, that sounds coool 20:55:49 -!- Corun has quit ("This computer has gone to sleep"). 20:55:59 about the putting the actual befunge unlambda on the bot, isn't there a fingerprint for some kinda procedures? 20:56:39 There's SUBR which has call/return instructions. 20:57:20 wellllllllllllll 20:57:36 i'm off to hesburger to read my book -> 20:57:54 Heh, yes: that ^code call indeed works with RC/Funge, but doesn't with cfunge. 20:58:09 Oh, right. 20:58:18 It's *again* the SUBR 'A' thing. :p 20:58:33 are you saying it's become a *blind*funge? 20:59:02 The current SUBR fingerprint has an 'A' instruction which masks the STRN 'A' I was trying to use there. 20:59:15 I think it's also in a new RC/Funge-98 like that, but my build is a bit old. 20:59:40 or maybe a desertfunge, but that's probably even harder to get 21:00:00 looks like you need to mess aobut with FING... 21:00:27 fizzie, last rc/funge would have it too 21:00:37 99% sure 21:01:08 fizzie, and older rc/funge may have slightly different semantics for FING on empty stacks 21:02:30 Well, I no longer do anything involving empty stacks except using Z to push things on them, which is pretty standard stuff. 21:02:47 -!- fungot has joined. 21:02:55 Workarounded it a bit. 21:03:00 ^code 0ad00f-gU0": ciretose# GSMVIRP"AAN51p08P0851g21gW$ 21:03:00 0 21:03:17 That "simple and easy-to-remember command" can be used to check the counter. 21:03:24 fungot: I say something. 21:03:26 fizzie: ( undent) right, that's why put it in more clear english: a thought i experience proves its own existence, but it doesn't explain the play. the explaination given here does not explain, contrary to your assertion, why the fnord sexism? people need to stop changing the date. i bought it on that day, and fire was on it by night, in long grass, between fnord, fnord 21:03:28 fungot: I say something else. 21:03:29 fizzie: apart from the whole confusion he writes we have two sets of evidence: " the british bulldog" fnord boy smith, " fnord и fnord " fnord fnord fnord 21:03:30 ^code 0ad00f-gU0": ciretose# GSMVIRP"AAN51p08P0851g21gW$ 21:03:31 1 21:04:07 fizzie, what about adding a command to actually do that? 21:04:30 fizzie, shouldn't it be 2 there? 21:04:53 It starts with 0 when it sets the "who spoke last" thing. 21:05:22 Then it does "++counter > 3" to check whether it should stop. 21:05:45 ^code 0ad10f-G0": ciretose# GSMVIRP"AAN51p08P0851g21gW$ 21:05:45 fizzie 21:05:48 That's who spoke last. 21:06:21 Yes, I guess I could add some sort of funge-space fetch commands to accompany ^code. Not sure if I'll bother, though. 21:08:47 Actually I think there's a slight wrap-around problem: if you speak to the bot something like 2^31 times (without anyone else speaking in-between) it'll again start answering to you, and actually continue answering until the counter again reaches positive numbers. 21:09:01 (Don't try this on-channel, please.) 21:09:49 heh 21:10:56 hahhaha 21:11:58 fungot: test 21:11:59 lament: everything in the article to decide. fnord 22:11, 17 january 2008 ( utc) copyedit finished. good luck. cheers, fnord 19:04, 9 december 2006 ( utc) 21:12:00 fungot: test 21:12:01 lament: question: are arepas known outside of broadcasting fnord. the center is located about miles 10 miles west of kusinagar. the place abounded in peepul trees and there were also presuppositions unique to discourse: 21:12:03 fungot: test 21:12:04 lament: guys, please don't hesitate to add information, but it seems like that's been resolved ( at least in the part of the states to decide who to regulate and how much of this has been going around vandalizing pages by putting stuff about hen fap in the third paragraph, which i not yet can see as " at least ten thousand years ago, which is the primary source document of islamic international law, there is no 21:12:05 fungot: test 21:12:06 lament: i decided to add the link yesterday, but wasn't aware of any comparative studies that have proven the fnord of coats and pants etc do not require such grounds. furthermore, the article ' of course christ didn't actually look as christian art suggested.' but we don't ' ' ' 21:12:08 fungot: test 21:12:09 uh-oh 21:12:16 hey lament, can you kick lament? 21:12:17 he's spamming 21:12:19 ... wait 21:12:31 did i kill it? :( 21:12:37 No, it's in the ignore mode now. 21:12:40 oh 21:12:53 damn, i was hoping to wrap around 21:12:56 But when you say that thing 2^31-4 more times, it'll again answer. 21:13:12 Unless someone goes and speaks to the bot before you can manage to do it. 21:13:39 lol 21:13:50 lament: welp, guess you'd better start. 21:14:18 hmm 21:14:23 wonder if you could do it with mechanical turk 21:14:40 fizzie: oh, i see 21:14:43 rate limit 21:14:43 hm 21:14:45 fungot: test 21:14:46 fungot: test 21:14:47 that would take ages 21:14:48 fungot: test 21:14:56 i can say it about twice per second 21:15:05 so it'll only take 2^30 seconds 21:16:12 lament, around 34 years? 21:16:41 today, children, we see AnMaster not finding something funny funny. 21:16:50 ehird, I was 21:16:52 you weren't 21:17:03 'that would take ages' = ruins the joke by explaining it. 21:17:28 http://www.mezzacotta.net/singles/jokes_explained_explained.php 21:17:47 yes, explaining jokes is funny, but only if you do it in a funny way 21:17:51 Oh, it's only 34 years? Maybe I need to use a 64-bit build to avoid that problem, then. 21:17:59 (being extremely literal, serious and in-depth) 21:17:59 fizzie, hahah 21:18:27 ehird, also that link I gave do the same on a second level :) 21:43:44 -!- jix has quit (Remote closed the connection). 21:47:39 -!- jix has joined. 21:54:42 -!- jix has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 21:55:11 -!- jix has joined. 22:02:51 -!- mental has joined. 22:14:16 -!- lament has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 22:15:39 -!- kar8nga has left (?). 22:18:25 night, won't be reachable during most of tomorrow 22:32:05 -!- Sgeo_ has joined. 22:46:32 Mmmmmmmmmmmmoxie. 22:46:40 Egad Moxie is good. 22:46:44 It's soooooooooooo good. 22:47:01 -!- Sgeo has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 23:11:20 -!- M0ny has quit ("Hum... Hum..."). 23:23:28 -!- Linus` has quit ("Puzzi. Sì, parlo proprio con te. Puzzi."). 23:39:01 -!- Sgeo_ has changed nick to Sgeo. 23:47:55 -!- jix has quit ("CommandQ"). 23:56:37 -!- Corun has joined. 23:56:58 -!- oerjan has joined.