00:04:26 <oklopol> +ul (:::::*****)((a)~(b)~(~())~(a)~^^^)S
00:04:31 <oklopol> +ul (:::::*****)((a)~(b)~(~())~(a)~^^^)^S
00:04:58 <oklopol> +ul (:::::*****)((a)~(b)~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^S
00:05:02 <oklopol> +ul (::::****)((a)~(b)~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^S
00:05:06 <oklopol> +ul (:*)((a)~(b)~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^S
00:05:11 <oklopol> +ul (!())((a)~(b)~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^S
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02:00:06 <oklopol> +ul (:*)((!())~()~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^(x)~^S
02:00:10 <oklopol> +ul (::**)((!())~()~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^(x)~^S
02:00:14 <oklopol> +ul ()((!())~()~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^(x)~^S
02:00:18 <oklopol> +ul (!())((!())~()~(~())~(a)~^^^!)^(x)~^S
02:01:08 <oklopol> +ul (::**)(:(:)~^(!!()())*~(*)~^*)^(x)~^S
02:01:14 <oklopol> +ul (:::***)(:(:)~^(!!()())*~(*)~^*)^(x)~^S
02:10:46 <oklopol> oh my god the stack is hard to use.
02:11:41 <oklopol> +ul (::::****)((:)~*(*)*)^(x)~^S
02:11:47 <oklopol> +ul (!())((:)~*(*)*)^(x)~^S
02:12:01 <oklopol> +ul (!())((:)~*(*)*)^((:)~*(*)*)^(x)~^S
02:14:37 <oerjan> +ul (a)(b)a~a*:^~!~^SSS
02:19:48 <thutubot> a{{c}}{{b}} ...S out of stack!
02:20:04 <oklopol> +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a^)^SSS
02:20:05 <thutubot> a{{c}}{{b}} ...S out of stack!
02:20:27 <oklopol> oerjan: just let me spam in peace !
02:20:40 <oerjan> where are those {} from?
02:20:52 <oklopol> well no one knows really :)
02:21:18 <oklopol> +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a^^)^SSS
02:21:19 <thutubot> {{{{c}}{{b}}}} ...S out of stack!
02:21:27 <thutubot> {{a}}{{c}}{{b}} ...S out of stack!
02:22:52 <oklopol> +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a*^)^SS
02:22:54 <oklopol> +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a*^)^SSS
02:23:15 <oklopol> right, you can rotate things on the stack pretty freely
02:23:58 <oerjan> yeah it's just a bit verbose
02:24:01 <oklopol> +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a*^a:*~a*~a*^)^SSS
02:24:18 <oklopol> +ul (a)(b)(c)(a~a*~a*^a:*~a*~a*^)^SSSS
02:24:28 <oklopol> okay, you can do *anything* to the stack.
02:24:39 <oklopol> for some reason i thought you can't.
02:25:50 <oerjan> the a operation is pretty essential
02:26:34 <oerjan> without it you couldn't reach more than two levels down without mangling things
02:27:06 <oklopol> withouth it, would it still have powah?
02:27:39 <oklopol> i should retry sleeping probably, have to be awake in a few hours
02:27:51 <oklopol> i'll probably write a stackmongler tomorrow
02:28:10 <oklopol> a program that codes underload for me
02:28:43 <oklopol> because i'm a wimpy wampy wussypants loser.
02:28:46 <oerjan> it seems those {} are an artifact of debugging output...
02:29:23 <thutubot> {{a}}{{b}}c ...S out of stack!
02:29:37 <oklopol> perhaps popping doesn't remove the balues
02:29:44 <oklopol> and it prints the stack contents
02:31:19 <oklopol> seems output is only done at the end of execution, and failure triggers a raw output mode
02:31:41 <oklopol> but i don't see what sense that makes
02:31:49 <thutubot> {{{{TEST}}}} ...S out of stack!
02:33:38 <oerjan> except we know it can cut off infinite output
02:33:55 <oklopol> well it needs to buffer it
02:34:23 <thutubot> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ...too much output!
02:34:45 <oerjan> hm maybe it just halts
02:35:04 <thutubot> (A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A)(A) ...too much output!
02:35:26 <thutubot> {{A}}:{{{{A}}}}SSSSS:{{{{A}}}}SSSSS ...S out of stack!
02:38:37 <thutubot> ((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B)((A))(B) ...too much output!
02:38:53 <oerjan> it seems the too much output case doesn't trigger this
02:39:24 <oklopol> no, just when you empty the stack
02:40:02 <oklopol> does it just cut execution at illegal chars?
02:43:25 <oerjan> +ul (({{TEST}}))((A))SS
02:43:35 <oklopol> {}'s are actually not allowed in underload iirc
02:43:40 <oerjan> +ul ((A))(({{TEST}}))SS
02:43:42 <oklopol> so that's not actually a bug.
02:43:58 <oerjan> well not as commands, but...
02:44:00 <oklopol> just implementation-defined stuff defined by an implementation
02:44:40 <oerjan> well we can assume thutubot's implementation uses {} for something internally
02:45:13 <oklopol> although i can't say i know what exactly.
02:46:10 <oklopol> which means we should continue
02:46:21 <oerjan> the wiki says nothing about {} although it says []<>" need quoting
02:46:24 <oklopol> or you should. i'm too tired to think, but i like watching this :P
02:46:38 <oerjan> but that interpreters don't implement it
02:47:02 <oerjan> ^ul ((A))(({{TEST}}))SS
02:47:56 <oerjan> i would assume fungot's implementation is entirely different
02:47:56 <fungot> oerjan: the reason this was created was that information on this page. note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 may, 2006, and lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on wikipedia:criteria for speedy deletionimages.2fmediacriteria for speedy deletion. if you have
02:48:28 <oklopol> it's written in an entirely different paradigm
02:49:22 <oklopol> when exactly does that appear?
02:50:06 <oerjan> when you mix () and {} in the output
02:51:03 <oklopol> okay i need to go to sleep :P
03:16:10 <oerjan> +ul (()(*))(~:^!(:)~*(*)*a~^~^:S( )Sa*~:^):^
03:16:11 <thutubot> * ** ****** ************************ ************************************************************************************************************************ ...too much output!
03:18:27 <oerjan> +ul ((*)())(~:^!(**)*a~^*:S( )Sa*~:^):^
03:18:28 <thutubot> * **** ********* **************** ************************* ************************************ ************************************************* ...too much output!
03:57:47 <oerjan> +ul ((0)(1))(~:^:Sa~a~*a~^a~a*a*~:^)(0)S:^
03:57:49 <thutubot> 01(1)(0)((1)(0))((0)(1))(((1)(0))((0)(1)))(((0)(1))((1)(0)))((((1)(0))((0)(1)))(((0)(1))((1)(0))))((((0)(1))((1)(0)))(((1)(0))((0)(1))))(((((1)(0))((0)(1)))(((0)(1))((1)(0))))((((0)(1))((1)(0)))(((1)(0))((0)(1)))))(((((0)(1))((1)(0)))(((1)(0))((0)(1))))((((1)(0))((0)(1)))(((0)(1))((1)(0))))) ...too much output!
04:00:14 <oerjan> +ul ((0)(1))(~:^:S*a~^~*a*~:^)(0)S:^
04:00:15 <thutubot> 0110100110010110100101100110100110010110011010010110100110010110100101100110100101101001100101100110100110010110100101100110100110010110011010010110100110010110011010011001011010010110011010010110100110010110100101100110100110010110011010010110100110010110 ...too much output!
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05:12:16 <GregorR> http://purdueextremecroquet.org/
05:14:33 <GregorR> And yet I just keep on rererererelinking it 8-D
05:24:24 <oklopol> so, doesn't croquet have this rule where you get to strike the opponent's ball anywhere you like as far as you can, if you get your balls to touch
05:28:08 <GregorR> If that wasn't part of the rules, it wouldn't be croquet at all.
05:28:16 <GregorR> There's a reason that's called the /croquet/ shot.
05:28:18 <fizzie> Wasn't that oerjan's underload loop a bit too complicated? Although I did have to bump up fungot's Underload time limits for this too:
05:28:26 <fizzie> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
05:28:40 <oklopol> for some reason i thought something there contradicted it or something.
05:28:42 <fungot> +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
05:28:43 <thutubot> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
05:29:00 <fungot> +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
05:29:00 <thutubot> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
05:29:16 <oklopol> 11.4: (Replace) Players must make a reasonable effort not to interfere with
05:29:16 <oklopol> their own or others' balls. If a player accidentally moves a ball that was at
05:29:16 <oklopol> rest, that player must replace the ball without penalty.
05:29:17 <fungot> +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
05:29:18 <thutubot> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
05:29:22 <fizzie> Of course fungot's so slow that's not much of a loop.
05:29:35 <fungot> +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
05:29:35 <fungot> fizzie: every single orchestration and band scoring text i've checked gives the range of the ' ' mensa magazine" may not be confirmed. and i mean come on, at what age is the dividing line between
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05:29:35 <thutubot> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
05:29:37 <GregorR> oklopol: That's not as a result of a shot, that's if they trip over the ball or whatnot.
05:29:44 <GregorR> oklopol: You need to read that into context to see the real meaning :P
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05:30:18 <oklopol> GregorR: yeah it's clear it means that.
05:30:41 <oklopol> only an idiot would not realize that.
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05:32:47 <oklopol> GregorR: anyway, my point was exactly that if you had removed that rule, you shouldn't be calling it croquet
05:33:03 <GregorR> oklopol: I totally agree with that. Good thing I didn't remove that rule :P
05:34:06 <oklopol> (okay i prolly just would've said it makes the game a lot less fun, and less strategical; the poetic reference to the name was all yours.)
05:34:15 <GregorR> So, does everybody know that "uber" is officially dead?
05:34:45 <oklopol> you mean, using the incorrect umlautless german word for "over" to mean "supahcool"?
05:34:59 <GregorR> It was used in a commercial for feminine pads, and is therefore no longer to be used.
05:35:12 <oklopol> err what are feminine pads?
05:35:33 <oklopol> i did not know this, i thought it died ages ago :D
05:35:59 <GregorR> ... I so don't want to explain this ... pads that collect the ... flow ... from the monthly feminine .. predicament.
05:36:25 <oklopol> oh you mean menstrual filters
05:36:53 <GregorR> Uhhhhh, suuuure, except that none of those terms are used :P
05:39:09 <oklopol> i thought feminine pads were more like those things kids use for swimming, the things you attach to their arms
05:40:11 <oklopol> the other guess was dance pads for dance dance revolution
05:40:19 <GregorR> Actually, they said "an uber-absorbent material", but eh.
05:41:03 <oklopol> but i can't have seen the ad
05:41:39 <oklopol> also exam about word and excel in 20 minutes, this is going to be sweet
05:46:03 <GregorR> <oklopol> also exam about word and excel in 20 minutes, this is going to be sweet
05:46:40 <oklopol> the sweet part or just the exam part
05:48:20 <oklopol> yeah, it's a bit of a wtf, they've started teaching us cs students computer basics obligatorily now
05:48:38 <oklopol> and i hate it, because i had to learn to use word, which is an ugly program
05:48:43 <GregorR> Hahaha, your college sucks.
05:49:31 <GregorR> At Purdue and PSU all the undergrad CS is done on UNIX, so even if they DID make the baby stuff mandatory it'd be with better software.
05:49:52 <lament> word is pretty much the best for what it does.
05:50:16 <oklopol> lament: wordpad opens faster.
05:50:22 <oklopol> that's really all that matters.
05:50:36 <oklopol> GregorR: we have a unix part too
05:50:53 <lament> GregorR: and far, far slower to write stuff in
05:51:05 <GregorR> lament: That example /might/ have been sarcastic :P
05:51:09 <oklopol> but that's a lot simpler, just some catting and pipering
05:52:31 <oklopol> anyway, i don't dislike the fact we have windows as much as i dislike the fact we're taught about computers in general, i don't care about computers, i wanna learn computer science
05:52:54 <fizzie> I think we had a Windows Word/Excel/something part in the obligatory-for-all-students-not-just-CS "this is how you use them computers" course; I don't think I've had to touch a windows box since then.
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08:39:30 <ais523> <oerjan> where are those {} from? <--- you hit a bug in Thutubot's error handling, I think, it uses those internally
08:40:13 <ais523> <oklopol> seems output is only done at the end of execution, and failure triggers a raw output mode <--- yes, I think that's exactly what's happening, probably
08:41:09 <ais523> it uses {{ }} internally to distinguish inside parens from outside parens
08:41:40 <ais523> and the = you came up with is used internally by Thutu for things, you definitely hit a Thutubot bug if you can get one of those in the output without putting it in the input
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09:48:25 <ais523> puzzlet: afternoon according to your client
09:48:30 <ais523> which time zone is that, by the way?
09:49:14 <puzzlet> 5:49 PM, normal in South Korea
09:49:40 <ais523> 8 hours ahead of the UK
09:49:58 <ais523> grr, always get time zones backwards...
09:50:18 <puzzlet> i'm always confused with tz
10:01:14 <pikhq> (pikhq here saying: all-nighters to get your homework done suck balls.
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10:31:19 <fizzie> Shouldn't do the "it's a small change, I won't bother testing locally" thing.
10:31:32 <ais523> testing locally is normally faster
10:31:55 <ais523> now, I just have to figure whether me or AnMaster wrote the topic
10:32:02 <ais523> it's AnMasterish language, but I suspect it was me
10:32:51 <AnMaster> ais523, and how is it "AnMasterish language"?
10:33:02 <ais523> the use of the word "such" there looks weird
10:33:06 <ais523> but I can understand that I might do that
10:33:14 <fizzie> Awww, I just lost the state file.
10:33:19 <AnMaster> what would you recommend isntead?
10:33:50 <fizzie> There goes my ^cho and ^choo reimplementations, and the nifty pow2. Although they're all in IRC logs.
10:34:03 <fizzie> I have a "backup" copy of the state file, but it's old.
10:34:42 <oklopol> AnMaster: "writing those in esolangs"?
10:34:48 -!- fungot has joined.
10:34:51 <fungot> echo reverb rev bf rot13 hi rev2 fib wc xaa enctst copy badrot13 chtopic top topiccode compat_cat trulyawfulrot13 rot26 me echochohoo lolercakes echo_cho_ho_o baddoubles ul test
10:35:44 <AnMaster> oklopol, I don't think I said the line in topic
10:35:57 <AnMaster> but yeah I guess that makes more sense in English
10:36:14 <AnMaster> that's a lot of commands fizzie
10:36:29 <fizzie> Many of them make no sense, that's why I removed some of 'em.
10:36:52 <fizzie> That's curious; the line in topic doesn't appear in my logs. I must've not been here when it was said.
10:37:31 <ais523> well, at least that one's back
10:37:40 <ais523> but most of it is just CO2Games spam
10:37:41 <fizzie> I already "reimplemented" it as ^cho.
10:37:54 <fungot> echo reverb rev bf rot13 hi rev2 fib wc
10:38:30 <fizzie> ^def cho bf >,[>,]<[<]>[[.>]<[<]>[-]>]
10:38:39 <fizzie> ^def choo bf >,[>,]++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++[<]>[[.>]<[<]>[-]>]
10:39:04 <fizzie> Whooopsie, there's still a bug in "^save", which means that whatever I did there was completely for naught.
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10:40:24 <fungot> echo reverb rev bf rot13 hi rev2 fib wc ul cho choo
10:40:39 <fungot> ^<lang> <code>; ^def <command> <lang> <code>; ^show [command]; lang=bf, code=text/str:N; ^str 0-9 get/set/add [text]
10:40:39 <fizzie> (Did those commands in the query before bringing it on-channel.)
10:40:51 <ais523> what are cho and choo?
10:40:53 <fizzie> Oh, I still haven't remembered the ^bool in help.
10:41:03 <fizzie> ais523: ^echochohoo and ^echo_cho_ho_o.
10:41:26 <fungot> fungot ungot ngot got ot t
10:41:33 <fungot> echo reverb rev bf rot13 hi rev2 fib wc ul cho choo
10:41:35 <ais523> no, it's just being slow for some reason
10:41:46 <AnMaster> ais523, the ^fib didn't work it seems
10:41:48 <fizzie> It's slow because I have raised the brainfuck cycle count.
10:41:54 <fizzie> And I think fib got borkened at some point.
10:41:57 <fungot> >+10>+>+[[+5[>+8<-]>.<+6[>-8<-]+<3]>.>>[[-]<[>+<-]>>[<2+>+>-]<[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>[-]>+>+<3-[>+<-]]]]]]]]]]]+>>>]<3][]
10:42:03 <fizzie> Hmm, no. That looks sensible.
10:42:14 <fizzie> On first glance, anyway.
10:42:14 <ais523> the [] at the end is suspicious
10:42:18 <ais523> but it might just have been a header comment
10:43:00 <AnMaster> ^bf ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.
10:43:14 <fizzie> There seems to be some extra []s.
10:43:15 <AnMaster> looks like several saved ones are borked
10:43:24 <fizzie> And it was ^wc that had gotten borkeded earlier, I think.
10:44:05 <fungot> ,[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+14<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>>+5[<-5>-]<2-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+
10:44:20 <ais523> there has to be a shorter way to write rot13...
10:44:30 <fizzie> ais523: There is, but that one executes very fast.
10:44:40 <AnMaster> ais523, well that one is too long for an irc line too
10:44:45 <ais523> it's an unrolled switch statement
10:45:25 <AnMaster> ais523, ah that reminds me, how goes gcc-bf?
10:45:44 <pikhq> This is the earliest I've been up in months.
10:45:58 <pikhq> Damned all-nighters.
10:46:30 <pikhq> 5:00, and I'm not done with calculus yet.
10:47:21 <fizzie> Actually I think I've just broken the "..." and maybe "... out of time" outputs.
10:47:47 <fizzie> That one still works, but I think the "too much output" one doesn't.
10:47:55 <fungot> echo reverb rev bf rot13 hi rev2 fib wc ul cho choo pow2
10:48:24 <thutubot> xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ...too much output!
10:50:11 <fizzie> It's actually a bit curious that it doesn't completely crash there; it goes completely off the route.
10:50:34 <ais523> does it hit a stray ^ or something when it comes back from the other side of the program?
10:50:53 <fizzie> I think it hits a "o" in a comment, reflects, goes back to the | where it went lost but takes the other branch this time and uses the normal exit.
10:51:33 <fungot> <CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP> ...
10:51:39 <fungot> 0.1.1.2.3.5.8.13.21.34.55.89.144.233.377.610.987.1597.2584.4181.6765.10946.17711.28657.46368.75025.121393.196418.317811.514229.832040.1346269.2178309.3524578.5702887.9227465.14930352.24157817.39088169.632459 ...
10:51:41 <fungot> 1 2 4 8 16 32 64 128 256 512 1024 2048 4096 8192 16384 32768 65536 131072 262144 524288 1048576 2097152 4194304 8388608 16777216 33554432 67108864 134217728 268435456 536870912 1073741824 2147483648 42949672 ...
10:51:51 <fizzie> Witness the power of this fully operational Befunge bot.
10:54:34 <fizzie> fungot: I don't suppose I messed up your language skills when doing those changes?
10:54:34 <fungot> fizzie: the article does not meet the guidelines on neutrality and stability required for ga status. the focus should be in " description" fnord 22:23, 16 january 2007 ( utc)) hendrix remains an extremely influential figure in music the article, and in the end, we can quote him in support of his clean air fnord to the statements in fnord
10:56:03 <fizzie> I think that was a "no".
10:56:32 <ais523> it's surprising how Wikipedia-like fungot's comments are atm
10:56:33 <fungot> ais523: this article is strangely absent of scientific backup. please wikipedians interested in this line of thought. i know nothing about the middle name thing until yesterday ( i knew about mi funding for jeugkrag, or that ' ' some more"
10:58:42 <fizzie> It's also a bit surprising how well it worked even without stripping any of the MediaWiki markup. (Although fungot strips out all unrecognized punctuation.)
10:58:42 <fungot> fizzie: ' ' shake" the fnord or system of which that position is a part of total cost of operation are the maintenance and support direct and indirect casulties included. why aren't you following clear guideline?
10:58:45 <fungot> AnMaster: i also threw together a fnord transportation section from former edits still needs work, but seriously i thought it was fnord fnord source: corporate.wwe.com user:sephiroth stormsephiroth storm 16:26, 21 april 2008 ( utc
10:59:08 <AnMaster> (the sad thing is that both WP:WP and WP:ACRONYM actually seem to exist.....)
10:59:08 <ais523> fungot: MediaWiki markup for bold seems to confuse it most often
10:59:08 <fungot> ais523: there has been in the relationship between the gallon and the bushel that is not clear what meaning the author intended to convey.
10:59:25 <ais523> AnMaster: the WP: shortcuts are designed to be easy to remember
10:59:28 <fizzie> Yes, since 's are recognized as stuff.
10:59:29 <ais523> and so they make lots of spares
10:59:48 <AnMaster> ais523, yes and making a joke of them by saying WP:WP doesn't work since that seems to lead to a list of all WP:*
11:00:26 <ais523> I mean, what's wrong with having WP:WP be about WP: pages?
11:00:48 <AnMaster> ais523, nothing, however it is ruins a good joke
11:03:11 <fizzie> Need to restart since I don't have a ^reload-state command yet...
11:03:17 <fizzie> ^raw QUIT :my mind is going!
11:03:17 -!- fungot has quit ("my mind is going!").
11:03:37 -!- fungot has joined.
11:13:23 <AnMaster> I *think* I may have a working solution to the issue with funge space bounds updates
11:13:49 <AnMaster> it is messy but seems to work correctly when ATHR isn't used and should work ok with ATHR loaded
11:16:46 <Ilari> What's ATHR? Any URL describing it?
11:17:12 <AnMaster> http://rafb.net/p/jT1WV348.html
11:18:33 <AnMaster> Ilari, I have a partly done implementation
11:47:43 <AnMaster> Ilari, well what do you think of it?
11:48:32 <Ilari> AnMaster: Pretty standard async threads library (aside of odd terminology used, as is normal in esolangs)...
11:49:00 <AnMaster> it is difficult to implement though
11:49:15 <AnMaster> even though I'm doing it in a language with built in support for concurrency
11:49:44 <Ilari> AnMaster: One thing stood up: S reflects both on error and in child. Using it correctly requires recognizing wheither forward thread exists or not...
11:50:49 <AnMaster> the reason 1) t (sync thread, round robin, standard funge) reflects child. 2) Most funge instructions reflect on errors
11:51:37 <AnMaster> (and so far I only implemented some core changes and such, not the actual fingerprint interface, so it would be easy to change)
11:51:54 <Ilari> AnMaster: Recognizing forward thread of t is easier due to its synchronous nature than recognizing the forward thread of S.
11:52:35 <AnMaster> Ilari, So do you have a good solution?
11:53:33 <Ilari> AnMaster: Nope. Splitting left and right only works in two dimensions, so it really can't be used...
11:54:19 <AnMaster> Ilari, hm? It works up/down too
11:54:26 <AnMaster> it is "opposite direction" simply
11:54:35 <AnMaster> so it means you can get it from any delta
11:54:58 <Deewiant> AnMaster: he meant turning one like [ and the other ]
11:57:47 <Ilari> Well, one could implement recognizing if there was spawn-and-borrow-in-child instruction...
11:58:20 <AnMaster> Ilari, "borrow in child"? what would that do?
11:58:28 <Ilari> Or if S returned return value like fork() does...
11:59:10 <Ilari> AnMaster: It borrows book that has given number in child immediately after creating the child (atomically).
11:59:59 <AnMaster> Ilari, well that would be highly complex considering that my ATHR is planned to work distributed (current version won't, need to add local funge-space cache or such)
12:00:47 <AnMaster> if it is only atomic against parent it could work
12:00:51 <Ilari> AnMaster: It is entierely possible to generate IDs in distributed way (if the space to choose from is large enough).
12:01:15 <AnMaster> well yeah it is, my funge is bignum ;P
12:01:31 <Ilari> AnMaster: Well, locking only has to be atomic with respect to parent...
12:01:52 <AnMaster> hm would doing that or doing like fork be best I wonder.
12:02:18 <Ilari> AnMaster: The fork way would be easier for programmer...
12:03:01 <Ilari> AnMaster: Umm... Nope. :-)
12:04:26 <AnMaster> Ilari, still I think ATHR may be quite easy to use, while it looks complex. The terminology helps with that a bit I guess.
12:04:38 <AnMaster> and that could actually be a goal
12:08:19 <Ilari> AnMaster: Or it could even be simple 0 => success, 1 => failure in reflected thread...
12:08:50 <AnMaster> Ilari, yes that could work. So child gets 0 or 1?
12:08:51 <Ilari> AnMaster: No real need to have that in forward thread, as it impiles success anyway.
12:09:10 <AnMaster> Ilari, the check of thread id could also be used I think
12:09:26 <Ilari> AnMaster: Yea. That would work...
12:09:38 <Ilari> AnMaster: So no real need to add anything new... :-)
12:09:54 <AnMaster> and would need no change. Plus it is easy but not obvious until you think of it. (If you see what I mean)
12:09:58 <fizzie> Phew; fixed (hopefully) all the places where fungot was hardcoded to brainfuck. Now it lets you specify underload programs... unfortunately those aren't interpreted yet.
12:09:58 <fungot> fizzie: i'm sure i'm not the person who wrote the letter that keeps being removed. fnord 00:05, 30 august 2008 ( utc
12:10:37 <fizzie> No, it just won't do anything.
12:11:01 <fizzie> Now I need to stick the underload interpreter in the correct place and mangle it a bit to read the program from the right place.
12:12:24 <fizzie> Oh, and it needs some sort of cycle counter to handle infinite loops.
12:16:26 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | got it..
12:38:18 <ais523> I won't be evil and write an infinite loop
12:38:32 <ais523> fizzie: one trick worth knowing in Underload is that it's impossible to have an infinite loop without the : command
12:38:38 <ais523> so if it's easier, you can just count colons
12:41:40 <fungot> ^<lang> <code>; ^def <command> <lang> <code>; ^show [command]; lang=bf, code=text/str:N; ^str 0-9 get/set/add [text]
12:41:47 <fungot> echo reverb rev rot13 rev2 fib wc ul cho choo pow2 foo
12:41:59 <fungot> <CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP><CTCP> ...
12:42:12 <fungot> echo reverb rev rot13 rev2 fib wc ul cho choo pow2 foo
12:42:19 <AnMaster> didn't hang on input of course
12:42:46 <AnMaster> fizzie, didn't you filter non-printable before?
12:43:26 <AnMaster> fizzie, also for cycle counter, what about using t and having another thread insert a "abort" if it takes too long?
12:59:26 <fizzie> That might be better, but harder to arrange than a simple count of executed Underload instructions.
12:59:46 <fizzie> Although the underload instructions do take a rather variable amount of time and stack space.
13:00:22 <fizzie> I'm not sure who wanted it to filter only newlines; at least CTCP-annoying is now possible with it.
13:00:39 <fizzie> And the current ^ul command is still the brainfuck one.
13:01:10 <fizzie> I'm still mashing that interpreter in, and even in my local copy only "^def foo ul ..." + "^foo" work; I'll have to add a separate command for ^ul.
13:23:43 <fizzie> There are probably bazillion bugs left, but...
13:24:09 <fizzie> (The 'show' command still shows the brainfuck version, but that's not what it uses.)
13:24:47 <fizzie> Also just a quick test...
13:24:48 <fizzie> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:48 <fungot> +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:49 <thutubot> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:49 <fungot> +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:49 <thutubot> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:49 <fungot> +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:50 <thutubot> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:50 <fungot> +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:50 <thutubot> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:50 <fungot> +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:51 <thutubot> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:51 <fungot> +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:51 <thutubot> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:52 <fungot> +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:52 <thutubot> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:53 <fungot> +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:53 <thutubot> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:55 <fungot> +ul (+ul )(^ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:55 <thutubot> ^ul (^ul )(+ul )(~:SaS~aS:aSS)~:SaS~aS:aSS
13:24:57 -!- fungot has left (?).
13:25:08 <fizzie> Yes, that would be a good idea.
13:25:37 -!- fungot has joined.
13:26:01 <fizzie> Well, no output is still no output.
13:26:03 <fungot> echo reverb rev rot13 rev2 fib wc ul cho choo pow2 foo
13:26:39 <fizzie> Oh, I've forgotten to add a output length limit thing.
13:27:55 <oklopol> AnMaster: space is not an underload command
13:28:11 <AnMaster> oklopol, I was just checking mismatched ()
13:28:24 <fizzie> ) is not a valid instruction.
13:28:41 <fizzie> It doesn't handle ) as a instruction, just when parsing (.
13:29:03 <oklopol> fizzie: why did that (crash) thing crash?
13:29:04 <AnMaster> how would you push a ( or a ) on the stack?
13:29:15 <fizzie> oklopol: I don't know; it works in the stand-alone interpreter.
13:29:19 <thutubot> crashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrash ...too much output!
13:29:59 <ehird> <AnMaster> how would you push a ( or a ) on the stack?
13:30:05 <oklopol> i should really get me some kebab
13:30:37 <AnMaster> a Encloses the top element of the stack in a pair of parentheses. <-- ah
13:30:46 <ehird> that doesn't let you get unbalanced parentheses
13:30:54 <ehird> which you can already do
13:31:02 <AnMaster> ehird, so how would you simulate a string with unbalanced ( ) in?
13:31:12 <AnMaster> ehird, so you can't output that?
13:31:25 <oklopol> AnMaster: simulating strings is quite complicated in general
13:32:00 <fizzie> That 'crashcrashcrash...' output is what I was hoping for. Well, actually I was expecting it to crash in some way, since it's an infinite loop; the cycle-counter would've stopped it at some point, but...
13:32:02 <oklopol> i mean, you cannot exactly use the actual strings as strings
13:32:08 <oklopol> if you want to be able to do something with them
13:32:25 <fizzie> Hmm, maybe the cycle-counter exit goes to the "out of stack" message accidentally or something.
13:33:19 <AnMaster> shouldn't they say out of stack or did I misunderstand?
13:33:20 <fizzie> That's still no output.
13:33:33 <fungot> echo reverb rev rot13 rev2 fib wc ul cho choo pow2 foo
13:33:39 <fizzie> It's not "out of stack"; that one is stack underflow, actually.
13:33:41 <AnMaster> fungot didn't say anything though
13:33:41 <fungot> AnMaster: as for the " popular engineering audience" ( although nobody else has that as their whole fnord 03:58, 30 march 2007 ( utc)'" with all due respect, it embraced a much broader category of theory than just the appearance of fnord,
13:33:51 <fizzie> It's a bit work-in-progress.
13:35:01 <AnMaster> fizzie, "stack underflow"? Hm wouldn't it keep duplicating all the time?
13:35:17 <fizzie> Yes, I mean, the "out of stack" message means "stack underflow".
13:36:02 <fizzie> It's funny that the cycle-counter stoppage -- which I think happens with (:^):^ -- doesn't say anything.
13:36:36 <AnMaster> http://esolangs.org/wiki/Underload#Self-interpreter <-- hahah
13:37:22 <AnMaster> http://esolangs.org/wiki/Underload#Reserved_characters <-- ???
13:37:33 <oklopol> i'd say ^ is the self-interpreter, and not really cheating.
13:37:33 <AnMaster> it seems to say that " should be quoted with "?
13:37:43 <oklopol> well cheating in that it's just an eval
13:37:49 <ais523> but everyone ignores that rule, even me
13:37:54 <ais523> so I should remove it from the language some time
13:38:55 <AnMaster> ais523, how the heck do you do flow control in underload?
13:39:06 <fizzie> What the... now I get "bad insn!" out of ^.
13:39:11 <ais523> AnMaster: generally by generating code and doign ^
13:39:38 -!- deveah has joined.
13:39:50 <fizzie> Am I having the same version here...
13:39:51 <AnMaster> ais523, what would you use for an "if top value of stack is a, do foo, otherwise do bar"
13:40:11 <ais523> for instance to run code iff TOS is 0, you can do :(code here)~(!())~^^^
13:40:12 <fizzie> That gives me "bad insn" locally. I think I messed something up.
13:40:42 <AnMaster> ais523, how does that make it conditional?
13:40:57 <oklopol> ais523: won't that run it N times where N is the number?
13:41:06 <ais523> because I'm not running it N times
13:41:10 <ais523> but 0 to the power N time
13:41:19 <ais523> and 0 to the power 0 is 1, but 0 to the power anything else is 0
13:41:35 <AnMaster> ais523, I can't figure out how ":(code here)~(!())~^^^" works
13:41:45 <oklopol> i wrote an isZero yesterday, and it was a lot longer
13:42:48 <oklopol> but well, in a language like underload, there's either a reeeeeally simple way, or you have to actually go through the logic, which results in tons of code
13:42:58 <AnMaster> before the first ^ in that... stack would be "value code !() value"?
13:43:48 <AnMaster> ais523, isn't that ! run unconditionally?
13:44:05 <ais523> well, it puts the code underneath 0 underneath the number that you're depending on
13:44:13 <ais523> then it evaluates the number you're depending on and makes that many copies of 0
13:44:21 <ais523> if it makes any copies of 0, they eliminate the (code here) and replace it with the null string
13:44:25 <ais523> then you run either the code here, or the null string
13:44:35 <ais523> because it might itself have been eliminated
13:44:37 <AnMaster> ais523, wait, where does it make copies?
13:44:39 <ais523> basically, if the TOS is (!()), the (code here) runs
13:44:43 <ais523> if the TOS is a positive number, the (code here) doesn't
13:44:45 <ais523> so it's equivalent to if(!x) { codehere; }
13:44:47 <ais523> AnMaster: the number itself makes copies
13:44:49 <ais523> that's how Underload numbers work
13:44:53 <ais523> 0 makes 0 copies of the TOS
13:45:18 <AnMaster> ais523, I can't see it mentioned on http://esolangs.org/wiki/Underload ?
13:45:27 <ais523> they aren't built into the lang
13:45:31 <ais523> it's just the normal way to define numbers
13:45:43 <ais523> (!()) () (:*) (::**) (:::***) (::::****) and so on
13:46:01 <oklopol> oh, right, of course that's 1
13:46:03 <ais523> oklopol: null string is the correct output there
13:46:09 <ais523> 0 to the power 0 is 1...
13:46:09 <AnMaster> ais523, so... is underload actually tc?
13:46:18 <ais523> I have an ski to Underload compiler
13:46:24 <ais523> and a BF-minus-input to Underload compiler
13:46:29 <oklopol> yeah, it was just my "oh empty input something's wrong" reflex
13:46:30 <AnMaster> also where did 0 to the power of 0 get into it?
13:46:45 <ais523> <oklopol> +ul (!())(!())^S <--- calculate 0 to the power 0
13:47:09 <ais523> AnMaster: what made you think Underload wasn't TC?
13:47:17 <ais523> I picked the commands very carefully to make it a tarpit
13:47:28 <AnMaster> ais523, just that I couldn't figure out non-trivial flow control
13:47:45 <oklopol> ais523: 0^0 is indeed 1, but when exponentiation is done like that, i don't automatically trust it works on the corner cases
13:47:48 <thutubot> ::::****::::****::::****::::****::::****
13:47:51 <ais523> flow control is interesting in Underload, but very neat once you get used to it
13:48:02 <oklopol> not everyone even defines 0^0 as 1
13:48:11 <AnMaster> ais523, also you can't do "bf minus input", you can't output unbalanced () after all
13:48:15 <ais523> well, but Church numerals have 0^0 as 0
13:48:20 <ais523> AnMaster: I output them as ?
13:48:25 <ais523> different character set...
13:48:35 <pikhq> I define 0^0 as 0^^(0^0)
13:48:40 <ais523> also, when 0 is defined as "make 0 copies"
13:48:45 <AnMaster> ais523, still I'd argue that isn't "bf-complete except input"
13:48:48 <ais523> then it makes intuitive sense for 0 to the power 0 to be 1
13:48:59 <ehird> AnMaster: Can your BF implementation output klingon characters?
13:49:04 <fizzie> Wow, there was an utter bug in ^.
13:49:05 <ehird> No? It's not output-complete then.
13:49:08 <ais523> AnMaster: BF-complete except input and output of some characters, are you happy now?
13:49:18 <AnMaster> ehird, well yes, I just output the bytes needed
13:49:29 <ehird> AnMaster: Klingon is not in unicode.
13:49:57 <AnMaster> ehird, well if it doesn't have a code point then it could be hard. And that wasn't the point
13:50:01 <AnMaster> I never said "output complete"
13:50:14 <ehird> AnMaster: The character set that underload uses happens to not have the code point that ( and ) are on.
13:50:18 <ehird> Also, BF does not define the output character set.
13:50:31 <ais523> AnMaster: http://paste.eso-std.org/b
13:50:35 <AnMaster> indeed it doesn't. it just allows you to output any value between 0 and 255
13:50:54 <fizzie> Hey, the out-of-timeity works.
13:51:04 <fungot> crashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashcrashc
13:51:11 <AnMaster> ais523, I suggest a pastebin that doesn't result in a download dialog next time ;P
13:51:14 <fizzie> fungot: Are you still alive after that?
13:51:15 <fungot> fizzie: the politically based content of the section is to be barefoot and pregnant, augmented, pregnant and augmented), the rotational kinetic energy: i will change the introduction accordingly. user:barnaby dawsonbarnaby dawson 09:16, 24 july 2006 ( utc
13:51:17 <ehird> AnMaster: That is intentional.
13:51:45 <ais523> AnMaster: so your editor does the syntax highlighting
13:51:45 <ehird> AnMaster: Your editor is a better syntax-highlighter & code navigator than some web script.
13:51:56 <ehird> My browser, at least, when I click, opens it directly in my editor.
13:52:08 <ais523> so do both the ones I've tried
13:52:09 <AnMaster> ehird, I'd just like to view it raw in web browser, no highlighting
13:52:15 <ais523> although Firefox goes via a dialog box
13:52:17 <AnMaster> and when I open it I gets a html page
13:52:29 <ehird> AnMaster: Why do you want to view it raw in a web browser?
13:52:38 <ehird> Don't you want to read code how you configured emacs to do it?
13:52:48 <ehird> If not, why not? What do you use instead?
13:53:01 <AnMaster> ehird, ? I just like a raw text view
13:53:17 <AnMaster> I normally only use minimal level of syntax highlighting
13:53:25 <ehird> AnMaster: Then open it in a raw text editor.
13:53:42 <ehird> Do whatever you'd do to read code normally. You know more about that than a website does.
13:53:55 <ehird> If you configure your browser properly, it'll open in what you want.
13:54:09 <AnMaster> ehird, what if I want it to open in firefox? ;P
13:54:12 <ais523> <ehird> If you configure your browser properly <--- I suspect only about 3 people have done that...
13:54:28 <ehird> AnMaster: You'd configure open with -> Firefox.
13:54:32 <ehird> But why do you want to read code in firefox?
13:54:43 <ehird> What makes it more superior than, say, gedit, for unhighlighted text/
13:54:46 <ehird> Or kate, or whatever.
13:54:47 <ais523> well, I loaded it in Firefox
13:54:49 <ais523> so as to be able to run it
13:54:50 <ehird> Why is it superior?
13:54:55 <ehird> It's not in any way.
13:55:00 <AnMaster> ehird, it means no need to change to another program
13:55:09 <AnMaster> just viewing it quickly in the same app is faster
13:55:16 <ehird> AnMaster: The fact that your desktop environment is hostile to multitasking is not my problem, sorry.
13:56:06 <ehird> I'm merely stating that the only reason you want to view it in firefox is because your system apparently cannot handle easy usage of more than one application at once.
13:56:07 <AnMaster> ehird, idea. offer a ?mode=raw
13:56:24 <ehird> Because there is no justification for it.
13:56:32 <AnMaster> ehird, the reason is that I prefer it that way
13:56:40 <ehird> AnMaster: Then configure _your_ client to use it that way.
13:56:43 <ehird> It is not a server issue.
13:57:11 <oklopol> i'm used to just looking at things in ff, and not having to click on an okay-button; not sure AnMaster is comfortable with saying pressing the button is just too hard, i most certainly am.
13:57:27 <AnMaster> very well I recommend pastebin.ca or rafb.net/paste or paste.lisp.org/new
13:57:39 <ehird> AnMaster: Unlikely to happen, as both I and ais523 prefer it that way.
14:00:20 <oklopol> nah nevermind i'll go buy some food ->
14:02:32 <ais523> AnMaster: that's interesting... I'd argue that doing something that's both utterly unexpected and technically correct is correct behaviour for an ESO pastebin
14:03:09 <ais523> ehird: AnMaster told me not to paste on eso-std.org because he didn't want to read pastes there
14:03:26 <ehird> ais523: please stop talking in #esoteric, i don't want to read your messages here
14:03:40 <ais523> well, not quite like that
14:03:44 <ais523> he said that if I did he wouldn't read them
14:03:57 <ehird> what an excellent idea
14:03:57 <ais523> which is more reasonable than what I accidentally portrayed him as saying...
14:04:19 <ehird> "I don't want to configure my client to be reasonable, therefore the website is at fault, therefore I am extorting you not to use it"
14:04:30 <ais523> ehird: the problem here is that nobody's client is reasonable
14:04:36 <ehird> it works absolutely fine
14:04:37 <ais523> thus your request that people use a reasonable client is unreasonable
14:04:44 <ehird> and i didn't even need to configure it
14:04:50 <ehird> so at least one person's client is reasonable.
14:04:54 <ais523> over here, Firefox puts up a dialog box, Konq downloads directly to editor without a prompt
14:05:09 <ehird> My browser does the konq behaviour.
14:05:11 <ehird> Which is reasonable.
14:05:13 <ais523> however, working like that is not how AnMaster wants it to work, obviosuly
14:05:13 <ehird> You click a link, the document appears.
14:05:24 <ehird> Why obviously? What is the problem with getting a document up when you request for it?
14:06:01 <ais523> I suppose it's a similar argument as a page obnoxiously opening in a new window
14:06:15 <AnMaster> well in konq it opens inline kwrite, which is horrible IMO
14:06:22 <ehird> AnMaster: So configure it.
14:06:26 <AnMaster> and I normally end up using ff because it works better
14:06:28 <ais523> and Kate isn't horrible IMO
14:06:42 <AnMaster> ais523, kate is a bit better, but I prefer emacs most of the time
14:07:02 <ais523> Kate is one of the better designed-for-GUI editors I know
14:07:05 <ehird> AnMaster: In the time it's taking you to tell ais523 to stop using it and to tell me to break it, you could have configured it 50 times over.
14:07:05 <AnMaster> and with just syntax highlight of keywords (bold) and comments (blue)
14:07:10 <ais523> Emacs is still a console application really
14:07:24 <ais523> and Kate's syntax highlighter is really good IME
14:07:27 <AnMaster> ais523, well that is what I use it as (emacs in console)
14:07:32 <ais523> about as good as Emacs'
14:07:40 * ais523 tries opening paste.eso-std.org/b in w3m
14:07:48 <AnMaster> ais523, well it lacks a way to script it
14:08:12 <ais523> hmm... w3m just displays it inline, just like AnMaster asked
14:08:27 <ais523> (because Content-Disposition: isn't in the spec, IIRC)
14:08:48 <ehird> http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2183.txt
14:09:18 <ais523> ok, so Microsoft are just-about catching up to it now then?
14:09:30 <ehird> they haven't managed html4 yet.
14:09:40 <ehird> hmm, that's later.
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14:25:12 <AnMaster> Hm how easy is it to golf using scheme?
14:25:59 <ais523> AnMaster: it's 20th on Anagolf
14:26:14 <ais523> which implies slightly harder than in BASIC, but slightly easier than in Io
14:26:34 <AnMaster> ais523, don't know either of those languages, but how many are there on that list in total?
14:26:45 <ais523> 63, but some of them are esolangs
14:27:11 <ais523> GolfScript is winning ofc
14:27:44 <ais523> it's a good place to practice programming too, btw
14:27:52 <ais523> even though many of the problems are buggy or cheatable
14:28:25 <AnMaster> (define (x y)(define c 0)(lambda ()(set! c (+ c y)) c))(define a (x 2))
14:28:45 <AnMaster> using (define d define) seems to make it longer actually
14:29:21 <ais523> the existence of a set! in there implies you possibly aren't doing it the right way
14:30:06 <ais523> even so, would passing it as an argument to everything monad-style be shorter or longer?
14:30:08 <AnMaster> non-golfed version was (define make-counter-adder (lambda (x) (define counter 0) (lambda () (set! counter (+ counter x)) counter)))
14:30:39 <AnMaster> ais523, and I was just checking for how golfable it was
14:31:30 <AnMaster> ais523, anyway how would you suggest that, with the same resulting function signature for the constructed functions
14:31:44 <ais523> they wouldn't have the same signature, that's the whole point...
14:32:30 <AnMaster> ais523, so you suggest building functions like (whatever value) then?
14:34:43 <AnMaster> (define (x y)(lambda (z)(+ z y)))
14:35:09 <ehird> Is AnMaster trying tto learn scheme?
14:35:23 <AnMaster> I'm evaluating how golfable it is
14:35:28 <ais523> ehird: he's trying to golf Scheme
14:35:40 <ehird> it's not that golfable
14:35:41 <AnMaster> ais523, rather: checking how golfable it is
14:35:43 <ehird> common lisp is very golfable
14:35:55 <ehird> due to its myriad of short-named functions and extra syntax up the wazoo
14:36:00 <ehird> but scheme is too minimal to be golfed effectively
14:36:18 <ais523> what's match-digit in Perl regexen?
14:37:58 <ehird> if anyone's wondering why most of the users there seem to be japanese (in their names & the language used in the descriptions and such) it's because 1. shinh is japanese 2. ruby has its largest userbase in japan 3. and golfing also seems to be really popular in japan
14:38:11 <ehird> the engrish gives it a nice touch, though.
14:38:41 <ehird> http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?echo wtf? Perl cat is 7 chars long?
14:38:43 <ehird> Longer than I expected.
14:39:01 <ais523> it's a command-line option in Perl
14:39:16 <ais523> so it's actually only 1 char long in a practical Perl one-liner
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14:39:25 <ais523> but Anagolf doesn't let you specify command line args
14:40:27 <AnMaster> ehird, awk one is apperently of length 1
14:40:37 <ehird> the char is the space
14:40:40 <ehird> as awk behaves like that by default
14:40:53 <ais523> ehird: cat is 2 chars in HOMESPRING, IIRC
14:40:58 <ehird> and it'll need a full path
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14:41:38 <AnMaster> oh so exec is enabled for bash
14:41:49 <ais523> yep, bash is allowed to exec
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14:44:25 <ehird> AnMaster: submit it
14:44:32 <ehird> note that it's -93
14:44:43 <ehird> AnMaster: it tells you what your prorgam outputted
14:44:45 <ehird> and what was expected
14:44:47 <ehird> below the fail message
14:45:13 <ehird> does it work with -93?
14:45:23 <ehird> your program never exits
14:45:33 <ehird> then it takes more than 3 seconds to execute
14:45:55 <ais523> AnMaster: what is your program, and to do what?
14:46:23 <AnMaster> however anagolf thinks it fails to output
14:46:24 <ais523> AnMaster: ~ doesn't reflect on EOF in Befunge-93
14:46:33 <ais523> it inputs -1 instead, IIRC
14:46:53 <AnMaster> well it only said befunge, not befunge-93, they should clarify it then
14:47:03 <ehird> DOES IT WORK WITH -93
14:47:10 <ehird> also, BEFUNGE in common parlance MEANS BEFUNGE-93
14:47:19 <ehird> AnMaster: when i asked, i meant TEST IT
14:48:08 <AnMaster> ais523, it is not mentioned in http://catseye.tc/projects/befunge93/doc/befunge93.html
14:48:29 <ais523> well then I would expect -1 on EOF, that's what undefined stuff normally ends up doing
14:49:50 <AnMaster> Hm how can C++ version be longer than C version? After all you should save one char in the includes by doing <cstdio> instead of <stdio.h>
14:50:08 <ehird> because it'll use actual c++, probably
14:50:24 <AnMaster> ehird, but you can use C headers from inside C++
14:50:34 <ehird> so nobody thought of that
14:50:41 <ehird> why not submit your shorter version?
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14:51:35 * ehird considers writing overengineered, well-indented, commented, meaningful and easy-to-read code to anagolf just to make people go wtf when they see me at the bottom of the rankings
14:51:47 <ehird> 100 line hello world? you bet!
14:51:53 <fizzie> Also <cstdio> should put printf in the 'std' namespace.
14:52:25 <fizzie> My Underload interpreter is full of bugs. :/
14:52:31 <ehird> it's funny, anagolf shows that ruby actually beats perl a lot of the time
14:52:48 <ehird> perl generally beats it for just-regex kind of stuff, though
14:52:57 <fizzie> ^ul ((................)~:^):^
14:53:26 <fizzie> Hmm, the limits might be a bit too tight now. Set them with RC/Funge, while fungot's actually running on cfunge.
14:53:27 <fungot> fizzie: it would be interesting to see that the number of grades drop, the number of people in society actually behave in a rational, but more explicitly in his interviews, fergusson indicates that it was closed.
14:53:37 <fizzie> ^ul (((................)!)~*:^):^
14:53:41 <ehird> http://golf.shinh.org/reveal.rb?Life+game/fsystem/1194358586&rb An amazing Game of Life.
14:56:10 <AnMaster> ehird, what language is that in?
14:56:23 <ehird> it only works for the inputs specifically tested
14:56:37 <ehird> it's just some clever compression along with a condition on the input
14:56:39 <AnMaster> hm randomized inputs would be better
14:56:52 <ehird> challenges are user-submitted
14:56:58 <ehird> well, technically you could enter a program that prints inputs
14:57:00 <ehird> but that's way more work
14:57:10 <ehird> people specifically mark them as cheats, generally
14:57:16 <ehird> they're still clever, for their compression
14:57:23 <AnMaster> well it could still be possible, say, random-string random-number
14:57:28 <Slereah_> <ehird> http://golf.shinh.org/reveal.rb?Life+game/fsystem/1194358586&rb An amazing Game of Life. <- what language is this?
14:57:34 <ehird> Slereah_: Ruby, but it's a cheat
14:57:48 <ehird> It only works for the inputs that are tested.
14:58:10 <AnMaster> ehird, if it was me asking the second time you would just have told me to read scrollback
14:58:24 <ehird> AnMaster: No, I wouldn't, I'd have said the exact same thing while snarking about deja vu.
14:58:31 <ehird> I onyl say that when you actually word the question differently.
14:58:36 <ehird> But I was amused as he said the exact same thing.
14:59:01 <AnMaster> ehird, the question was worded differently
14:59:21 <ehird> [[what language is this?]]
14:59:25 <ehird> [[what language is that in?]]
15:00:30 <fizzie> Running "(((................)!)~*:^):^" under RC/Funge gives me an "unterminated (" error; I guess it's again some sort of fixed-maximum-size-in-STRN thing.
15:00:56 <AnMaster> fizzie, well cfunge have fixed max too, limited by size_t
15:01:09 <fizzie> That's a bit different from a fixed maximum of 1000, though.
15:01:31 <oerjan> ais523: btw your thutubot ul has bugs with {}, in case that's not intended
15:02:09 <AnMaster> ehird, btw creating a random generation system is quite easy
15:02:16 <AnMaster> you need something like a reverse regex
15:02:23 <ehird> AnMaster: Not. Easy. For. The. Submitting. Users.
15:02:39 <ehird> http://golf.shinh.org/mkprob.html = simple as hell and a low barrier to entry means they get submitted a lot.
15:02:52 <ehird> Also, cheats are accepted, generally. Just as long as they're marked as such.
15:03:23 <oerjan> ehird: one option would be to have a secret test case
15:03:39 <ehird> oerjan: except then if you had a bug in your submission you wouldn't be able to figure out what the problem is.
15:03:44 <ehird> = less submissions.
15:04:10 <AnMaster> however I don't consider something like: \rand[A-Z]{3,4} or such in a input format hard
15:04:27 <ehird> AnMaster: Yes, it is, because they haev to learn it.
15:04:31 <Ilari> Context free grammars are easier to use as generators and somewhat easier to understand...
15:04:35 <ehird> Right now, they can think of a problem, describe it in english, and give a few examples.
15:04:38 <ehird> And submit. that's it.
15:04:49 <ehird> No coding or anything involved, just give some examples, say what you mean, and you're done.
15:05:11 <ehird> Additionally, submitters also have to learn how the generator works, so they know what to code for
15:05:22 <AnMaster> ehird, well it isn't really hard, you need one command \rand or whatever, followed by a range a-zA-Z0-9 or whatever in [], followed by how many chars
15:05:38 <AnMaster> and the site is for coders obviously
15:05:45 <ehird> You lost me at the part where you raised the barrier to entry by making me learn something knew, then testing it, making sure there aren't bugs, then finally submitting it.
15:05:58 <ehird> It's a lot easier to check for bugs in input->output pairs.
15:06:03 <ehird> Even now, people still get it worng
15:06:08 <ehird> and have to have shinh delete the broken ones.
15:06:34 <ehird> I've got it wrong before, it's not hard to mess up.
15:07:30 <ehird> you're missing what i mean
15:07:39 <ehird> often your script itself is buggy
15:07:42 <ehird> that generates the cases
15:09:11 <AnMaster> ehird, so how hard is it to make cat. \rand[a-zA-Z0-9]{1,100} -> \1
15:09:45 <ehird> I would happily submit my version, not yours.
15:10:02 <AnMaster> I guess regex doesn't come naturally to you then.
15:10:22 <oerjan> ais523: oh you already noted
15:10:28 <ehird> Does anyone feel like explaining to AnMaster how he's missing the point? I kind of think his brain might be a closed-world logical system.
15:10:33 <ehird> Tricky things, those.
15:10:53 <ehird> oklopol: everyone's always wrong, including you
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15:11:11 <AnMaster> oklopol, so what do you suggest?
15:11:12 <ehird> oerjan: no, you're wrong
15:11:21 <oerjan> ehird: you are _so_ right
15:11:46 <fungot> fizzie: this nickname is offensive to me as ive been told by 3 doctors i can never again fnord im certain you can imagine. i suggest:
15:12:02 <ehird> fungot's fnord capability was removed
15:12:02 <fungot> ehird: ok, this debate seems to be no sil code for alsatian. fnord ( user fnord)
15:12:07 <ehird> so now he's upset that he's still called fungot
15:12:08 <fungot> ehird: the article is disputed, or restore the tag. i believe a site with professional, crisp clear photos and illustrations would be proper for the new manager being adam chapman and series 10 fnord. the name of an illyrian tribe called the fnord page, and the grace budd image is in compliance with wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
15:12:11 <ehird> as fungot's hallmark is fnording
15:12:12 <fungot> ehird: in light of the resolution of the failed rfa and my proposal to fix it up some? fnord 06:22, 29 january 2008 ( utc)/small!-- template:unsignedip
15:12:15 <fungot> ehird: major points are appropriately cited.
15:12:31 <fizzie> Heh, he's a real Wikipedian.
15:12:48 <AnMaster> ehird, I agree that a non-programmer could easily mess up that generation, but anyone that can program (which I assume anagolf users are capable of) can easily understand it
15:12:51 <ehird> ais523: replace all the words in your wikipedia signature with fnord
15:13:18 <Slereah_> ais523: replace all the words in your wikipedia signature with <- with what?
15:13:41 <ehird> Slereah_: i dunno lol
15:14:19 <ehird> AnMaster: with ""?
15:15:01 <fizzie> Wikipedia "fnord" article has the explanation, though.
15:15:11 <ehird> AnMaster: an empty message? huh?
15:15:42 <Slereah_> AnMaster does not know what it means
15:15:49 <ehird> Slereah_: What what means?
15:15:51 <oerjan> ehird: i don't know there was something backward about it
15:15:57 <ehird> oerjan: yeah, it's odd
15:16:01 <ehird> AnMaster: fizzie said wikipedia
15:16:32 <ehird> Slereah_: gee, not knowing what "it" means?
15:16:41 <ehird> that's a basic word in english!
15:17:04 <Slereah_> ARE YOU DONE GOOGLING ANMASTER
15:17:16 <AnMaster> I'm reading on wikipedia since several minutes yes
15:17:29 <ehird> reading WHAT on wikipedia?!
15:17:49 <Slereah_> ehird : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human-goat_sexual_intercourse
15:17:56 <ehird> Slereah_: Oh, okay.
15:18:02 <ehird> I was scared it'd be something ... weird.
15:18:06 <AnMaster> ehird, no Slereah_ isn't correct
15:18:14 <AnMaster> ehird, see http://xrl.us/oux4b
15:18:33 <Slereah_> It's full of syntaxic weirdness
15:18:43 <ehird> "is the typographic representation"
15:18:46 <ehird> The interjection ""
15:18:49 <ehird> "To see the means to be"
15:18:54 <AnMaster> Slereah_, see the url in the addressbar
15:19:05 <ehird> Huh, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/
15:19:09 <ehird> Did someone vandalize the main page to that?
15:19:21 <AnMaster> ehird, no it is an easter egg in mediawiki
15:19:42 <ais523> ehird: what are you talking about?
15:19:55 <Slereah_> I probably won't read it again.
15:19:57 <ais523> it looks normal to me...
15:20:08 <Slereah_> It's a classic, but really, it's a terrible read
15:20:18 <Slereah_> It's over a thousand pages and the plot goes everywhere
15:20:48 <AnMaster> ais523, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fnord#The_Illuminatus.21_Trilogy explains it
15:21:06 <ehird> I think ais523 might just know.
15:21:09 <ehird> The point is he was d/c'd.
15:21:23 <AnMaster> ehird, yes so I tried to help him catch up
15:22:00 <ais523> although I'v ebeen having huge connection trouble
15:22:39 <ehird> <mircbot> ais523 submits 98B of Perl for Ranking __REVENGE__, ranking #1 (10000pts).
15:24:41 <ehird> <mircbot> ais523 submits 97B of Perl for Ranking __REVENGE__, ranking #1 (10000pts).
15:25:45 <ais523> chomp,$a++,print$b{/(\d+)$/,$1}||=$a," $_
15:25:45 <ais523> "for sort{(split/ /,$b)[-1]<=>(split/ /,$a)[-1]}<>
15:26:09 <ais523> also, I got it down to 93b
15:27:21 <ehird> <mircbot> ais523 submits 93B of Perl for Ranking __REVENGE__, ranking #1 (10000pts).
15:27:56 <ais523> is it randking within the lang, or something?
15:28:23 <oerjan> beware of the randking
15:28:29 <oerjan> he's totally unpredictable
15:29:22 <ehird> ranking within the lang, i think
15:46:30 * ais523 is disappointed that there aren't more Perlists on anagolf atm
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18:16:27 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | I've had experience with bad project names, and this isn't one.
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18:28:07 <ais523> what's going on over here?
18:28:34 <AnMaster> ais523, I suggest you read scrollback, less than a screen since your last comment
18:28:44 <ais523> I don't have scrollback, connection problems
18:28:58 <AnMaster> * optbot has changed the topic to: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | I've had experience with bad project names, and this isn't one
18:28:58 <AnMaster> <Slereah_> optbot, destroy lament
18:28:58 <optbot> AnMaster: Same year as the Turing machine, IIRC.
18:28:58 <optbot> AnMaster: "...and is not suitable for practical use." <-- i made an IRC bot in it
18:28:58 <optbot> AnMaster: 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 0
18:29:35 <AnMaster> hm the webserver yaws look nice
18:29:59 <AnMaster> can't find any performance data however, and seems like docs are outdated
18:31:17 <AnMaster> or rather, last comparison is for outdated versions
18:31:33 <AnMaster> what I'm interested in is current yaws version and current lighttpd
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18:37:31 <fizzie> Multiple arbitrarily long lists of arbitrarily long strings are a bit annoying to keep in Funge-Space. Maybe I should have a limited number of slots for ignores.
18:38:22 <fizzie> Well, okay, there I can get by with limited string length.
18:38:30 <AnMaster> fizzie, I think 005 on connect contains max lengths
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18:38:52 <AnMaster> fizzie, it varies between different servers
18:39:07 <fizzie> I'm still not going to start parsing those numerics.
18:39:25 <AnMaster> fizzie, anyway you can easily store them
18:40:05 <fizzie> Yes, if there is a fixed amount of rows there's no problem.
18:40:23 <AnMaster> what about adding a buffer of 500 lines?
18:40:30 <AnMaster> should be more than enough, 500 ignores
18:40:47 <AnMaster> otherwise.. implement a malloc with SUBR ;P
18:41:33 <fizzie> Maybe I should use REXP and have regular-expression ignores; now that'd be useless. (The "only one regular expression per X" thing is a bit annoying; is it even per IP or per interpreter or what?)
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18:42:44 <AnMaster> ais523, I got no idea if this will affect you but previously funge loading in cfunge happened with char*, and unless there is a good reason I'm changing that to unsigned char*
18:42:55 <AnMaster> this would affect the loading code that intercal uses too
18:42:57 <ais523> no, it won't make a difference
18:43:02 <ais523> as I load from a string literal
18:43:28 <ais523> but the great thing about C is you can cast anything to/from unsigned char*...
18:43:33 <AnMaster> ais523, since I mmap() then load it as a string literal ;P
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18:49:38 <AnMaster> Deewiant, question: Funge-98 specs doesn't say if i, o or initial code loading should be signed or unsigned right?
18:49:44 <AnMaster> funge space itself is signed yes
18:50:01 <AnMaster> Deewiant, where does it say so?
18:50:04 <ais523> hmm... native char would be more obvious
18:50:09 <ais523> char is signed in some ABIs, unsigned in others
18:50:20 <Deewiant> where it talks about "the meaning of char #217 is always char #217 to funge" or whatever
18:50:37 <AnMaster> Deewiant, mycology doesn't test that I think
18:50:53 <Deewiant> yes, but it depends on it in some fingerprint
18:51:00 <Deewiant> it's on my list of things to add
18:52:05 <AnMaster> Deewiant, FILE certainly doesn't say either signed or unsigned
18:52:21 <Deewiant> of course it doesn't, it's one of Mike's :-P
18:52:33 <Deewiant> why on earth would it say something like that :-P
18:53:25 <Ilari> I read the spec as "ASCII characters 0-127 are mapped to funge numbers 0-127, characters with high bit set are implementation-defined.".
18:53:55 <AnMaster> Ilari, what specific bit do you refer to?
18:54:14 <Ilari> Characters 128-255 (that is, those with bit 7 set).
18:54:37 <AnMaster> ais523, current bzr version is now using unsigned, even if the function you use to load
18:54:45 <AnMaster> may need a cast to prevent a warning
18:55:45 <AnMaster> Ilari, that wording can't be found in Funge-98?
18:57:38 <AnMaster> oh I think FILE is signed in cfunge heh, well would be non-trivial to fix and require lots of changes elsewhere
18:57:55 <AnMaster> or rather FILE uses the system's native signed-ness
18:58:12 <Ilari> That is, 0-127 must be encoded as characters 0-127, but any other value can be encoded as anything (that involves at least one extended character, so it is uniquely decodeable).
18:58:55 <Ilari> Or, actually, anything can be encoded as anything, but 0-127 have specified decodings (and meanings).
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18:59:18 <AnMaster> Ilari, yes but where in the Funge-98 spec does it say so? I can't find anything backing your claim in it
19:00:16 <AnMaster> SOCK W and R use unsigned char.
19:00:57 <Ilari> Hmm... Actually reading it again it seems to say that file read as sequence of codepoints (encoded in unspecified manner) and those codepoint numbers are used as numbers in funge-space.
19:01:37 <AnMaster> for efunge I seem to read it as unsigned big endian (though the latter doesn't matter since it reads one byte at a time)
19:02:07 <AnMaster> Ilari, as long as I don't need to parse utf8 I'm happy
19:02:42 <AnMaster> and for any RC/Funge fingerprint I will just argue that due to being so poorly defined I can do whatever I want anyway ;P
19:03:12 <Deewiant> AnMaster: I think having cfunge be internally inconsistent about what it uses where is a bad idea
19:03:34 <Ilari> In fact I interpret the spec that doing UTF-8 decoding on source file and using codepoint values as number sequence fed to parser would be allowed...
19:04:09 <AnMaster> Deewiant, no it is just a case of push_gnirts using char*
19:04:36 <AnMaster> push_gnirts is the name used in efunge...
19:04:54 <AnMaster> Deewiant, so I would need a push_unsigned_string
19:05:11 <Deewiant> AnMaster: no, you just need to change it to unsigned char*
19:05:29 <AnMaster> Deewiant, no I will need to add various casts too
19:06:02 <AnMaster> Deewiant, -Wall -Wextra -Wa-lot-more -Wactually-think-warnings-are-useful
19:06:12 <Deewiant> why would you ever need to cast anything
19:06:12 <AnMaster> /home/arvid/src/cfunge/trunk/src/funge-space/funge-space.c: In function 'fungespace_load':
19:06:12 <AnMaster> /home/arvid/src/cfunge/trunk/src/funge-space/funge-space.c:376: warning: pointer targets in passing argument 1 of 'load_string' differ in signedness
19:06:24 <Deewiant> you should never have any char except unsigned char
19:06:33 <AnMaster> Deewiant, yes I do, from system
19:06:48 <AnMaster> which may or may not be signed
19:08:01 <AnMaster> Deewiant, hm... does STRN expect stuff to be cast to char* before being written/read from funge space
19:08:11 <AnMaster> considering you may loose precision that way
19:08:18 <AnMaster> considering the name of the fingerprint I'd say yes
19:08:53 <Ilari> Anyway, the current way I read the spec is that sequence of bytes is translated to sequence of numbers in some undefined manner and only meaning of that number sequence is defined.
19:09:25 <AnMaster> Deewiant, stack_(push|pop)_string are used everywhere anything says 0"gnirts" in any fingerprint or core instruction
19:09:33 <AnMaster> meaning they all end up as char there
19:10:13 <AnMaster> ah. Deewiant have you considered non-ASCII?
19:10:27 <AnMaster> Hm I think they will need to remap stuff
19:10:29 <Deewiant> Ilari: I read it as being defined by the platform and not the interpreter
19:10:38 <Deewiant> AnMaster: what do you mean have I considered them
19:11:01 <AnMaster> Deewiant, I meant EBIC or whatever that one was
19:11:10 <AnMaster> which aren't even ASCII compatible in any way
19:11:52 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well a-f is a continuous range there iirc but not a-z
19:23:38 <AnMaster> Deewiant, I end up adding casts in nearly every case due to that I happen to use libc :P
19:25:42 <Deewiant> doesn't either cast implicitly to the other
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19:29:31 <Deewiant> "loss of precision" or what nonsense?
19:29:39 <AnMaster> <AnMaster> /home/arvid/src/cfunge/trunk/src/funge-space/funge-space.c: In function 'fungespace_load':
19:29:40 <AnMaster> <AnMaster> /home/arvid/src/cfunge/trunk/src/funge-space/funge-space.c:376: warning: pointer targets in passing argument 1 of 'load_string' differ in signedness
19:30:59 <ais523> pointer targets differ in signedness can actually play hell in the comparisons of loops, I sort-of understand why it warns people about those
19:31:02 <Deewiant> just use -Wno-pointer-sign or cast
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19:31:12 <AnMaster> ais523, yes it does in many cases
19:31:20 <AnMaster> for example writing out to funge space
19:31:34 <AnMaster> there would have been some nasty bugs in STRN without those warnings
19:31:44 <AnMaster> so Deewiant is plain wrong in thinking they are harmless
19:31:50 <Deewiant> I did not say they are harmless
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19:46:00 <AnMaster> as in ~& and various fingerprints
19:53:48 <AnMaster> Deewiant, impossible for those since they return signed
19:54:16 <AnMaster> Deewiant, also funge-space itself is signed
19:54:36 <Deewiant> and it's not impossible, just cast
19:54:55 <AnMaster> Deewiant, tell me where in the spec it says so
19:55:23 <Deewiant> I think whoever thought up signed chars was an idiot, or then I'm grossly misinformed about something
19:55:27 <AnMaster> ah so mycology won't test it apart from loading?
19:55:35 <AnMaster> Deewiant, um, same for signed integers?
19:55:53 <Deewiant> how could I test stdin signedness anyway
19:56:12 <Deewiant> AnMaster: chars are not integers, and neither are bytes.
19:56:13 <fizzie> Re ~, the corresponding C standard library function -- getchar()/fgetc() -- returns unsigned characters.
19:56:14 <AnMaster> Deewiant, hm true, maybe echo some char
19:56:38 <AnMaster> fizzie, fgets() fputs() return/take char*
19:57:59 <fizzie> But ~ does not do bulk IO; and fgets/fputs are not very "bulk IO" either, being line-based; and for the fwrite()/fread() calls you can specify the interpretation yourself, since they take a void *.
20:00:14 <AnMaster> hah I just reduced time for mycology a lot
20:00:21 <AnMaster> by not using fflush() as often
20:00:26 <fizzie> Anyway, if you want to "act like the C library does", ~ ought to return a unsigned char, since that's what the C library function which does the same thing returns. Doesn't much matter how you implement it, of course.
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20:00:48 <fizzie> (Disclaimer: I haven't really been following the whole conversation.)
20:01:13 <AnMaster> ais523, before I did fflush() on input ~& and newline in output
20:01:26 <AnMaster> now it is changed to only do it when it actually reads input
20:01:34 <AnMaster> just before the call to cf_getline
20:01:56 <AnMaster> so if input can be served from buffer it won't call fflush() either
20:02:04 <AnMaster> and it won't call it on every newline
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20:03:26 <AnMaster> ais523, and that shaves off almost 0.020 seconds
20:03:51 <fizzie> You mean you fflush() stdout before reading input, to make prompts and such visible?
20:04:20 <AnMaster> fizzie, and I used to do it more often than needed
20:04:22 <fizzie> "fflush() on input" just sounded a bit strange.
20:04:45 <AnMaster> I used to follow the same algorithm as ccbi claim(ed?) it uses in --help
20:06:23 <AnMaster> fizzie, I have a non-public script here to build a special build for speed runs, for mycology that script actually doesn't make a lot of difference to -O3 -fweb
20:06:32 <AnMaster> but for life.bf it does for some reason
20:06:41 <AnMaster> anyway life.bf is even faster now
20:07:13 <ais523> AnMaster: -fweb's implied by funroll loops, in gcc
20:07:39 <AnMaster> ais523, well not by -O3 according to docs for gcc 4.1.2 at least
20:07:57 <ais523> are you not funrolling loops for a reason, btw?
20:08:00 <AnMaster> ais523, and my special build system use profile feedback
20:08:23 <ais523> yes, and thanks for all the help it gave me in the ICFP, I survived until about 3 rounds from the end
20:08:30 <AnMaster> ais523, well except they can slow down sometimes due to cache locality iirc
20:08:40 <AnMaster> I'm pretty sure I have seen examples of that
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20:11:58 <AnMaster> ais523, http://omploader.org/vdjY2 <-- it is about 3 times as fast when I'm not using xvidcap btw....
20:12:18 <AnMaster> showing how fast cfunge is at life of game
20:12:38 <ais523> hmm... why not just have used ttyrec?
20:12:40 <AnMaster> of course I'm unable to test ccbi under same conditions due to it being in D
20:13:04 <ais523> it's mostly used to record games of text-based games like NetHack
20:13:43 <AnMaster> ais523, what about speed? My screen only shows a blur for those bits on screen when xvidcap isn't running
20:13:54 <AnMaster> so I guess faster than this monitor's response time
20:14:05 <ais523> AnMaster: there are players that can slow it down
20:14:17 <AnMaster> ais523, well I want to show how fast it actually is
20:14:24 <ais523> look up ipbt, although it seems not to be packaged it compiles from source well
20:15:05 <AnMaster> ais523, compared to ccbi and rc/funge
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20:15:22 <AnMaster> actually I should probably publish the profiled building script
20:15:50 <AnMaster> http://rafb.net/p/diPMmW23.html
20:16:06 <AnMaster> be aware of that that requires mycology to exist in a specific place
20:16:26 <AnMaster> and you need to change CHOSTFLAGS
20:17:07 <AnMaster> it is really meant for local usage
20:17:16 <fizzie> I'm a bit curious about how fast thutubot's +ul is, compared to fungot's ^ul. (Although the latter probably has some bugs left.)
20:17:16 <fungot> fizzie: 14:58, april 24, 2007.. 24.166.157.216 ( talk block)
20:17:19 <AnMaster> but I assume some people may find it interesting
20:17:35 <ais523> fizzie: Thutu is inherently slow, although the algorithm it uses is a pretty fast one for Thutu
20:17:37 <AnMaster> fizzie, well that may depend on if you compile it using some way like the one I linked
20:17:44 <ais523> also, Thutu programs run slower the more they store in memory
20:17:48 <Deewiant> ais523: befunge isn't exactly inherently fast either ;-)
20:17:53 <ais523> so it'll depend on all sorts of things
20:17:58 <ais523> Deewiant: it is by esolang standards
20:18:02 <AnMaster> fizzie, be aware of that if that cause bugs it is probably not high priority to fiux
20:18:05 <ais523> at least it isn't a factor of n slower
20:18:31 <ais523> fungot: busy signing fizzie's messages for em?
20:18:56 <AnMaster> fungot, what do you mean with ' '?
20:18:57 <fungot> AnMaster: finally, in the process of being verified right now that are very real in my personal experience. when i first stumbled across 141's edits, i can't see why you would include this personal rant. what you two have been doing business with each other.
20:19:11 <ais523> AnMaster: '' is mediawiki markup for italic, ''' for bold
20:19:15 <ais523> they confuse fungot quite a lot
20:19:15 <fungot> ais523: i've noticed this before whilst listening to the answer by the minister for health and fnord.
20:19:34 <fizzie> fungot: In what country they have a minister for health and fnord?
20:19:35 <fungot> fizzie: yes, that is, levinson went to kish, disappeared, had on your behalf countless official pleas and responses from the u.s. and canadian newspapers, using fnord connected to the hydrogen station series. i also had to change it to the article.
20:19:58 <ais523> I really like this fungot database, btw
20:19:58 <fungot> ais523: ( 4) http://news.com.com/ fnord/ fnord/ fnord/ fnord/ fnord/ bios/ overview/ atpd683.html french open ( roland fnord, fnord
20:20:11 <ais523> it's very Wikipedia-like
20:20:26 <AnMaster> ais523, except the fnords I guess?
20:20:36 <fizzie> And all that comes from just 1/256th of the talk pages.
20:22:44 <fizzie> In case someone's interested, http://zem.fi/~fis/fungot_articles.txt has the list of articles used. (The names have had "Talk:" removed, and the titles have been filenamized; spaces to _, slashes to @, and all kinds of more special characters escaped with +nn or +unnnn.)
20:22:44 <fungot> fizzie: if there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this article.
20:23:15 <ais523> yes, fizzie, fair use rationales are verry important
20:23:37 <fizzie> Yes, but for a plain-text list of filenames from my own disk?
20:26:13 <fizzie> fungot: So, tell me about... the ZX Spectrum character set. You should know something about it, it's there in the list.
20:26:13 <fungot> fizzie: fnord) refers to ashoka maurya as a maha-asura i.e. a few wrote, fnord, which
20:26:53 <fizzie> Maybe it's not really very useful as a fact-bot.
20:27:32 <ais523> I never mistook fungot for a fact-bot...
20:27:33 <fungot> ais523: i removed the mention of any other fnord was one of the templates at wikipedia:fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
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20:27:53 <fizzie> It is _very_ concerned about the fair use of images.
20:27:53 <ais523> although it seems to care a lot about fair-use policy
20:28:12 <ais523> OTOH, optbot is a factbot sometimes, just you don't normally get the fact you want
20:29:03 <AnMaster> yeah if you actually want a fact bot you would need to consider input
20:29:16 <optbot> ais523: i'm taking an apathetic stance
20:29:16 <optbot> fungot: if you were, you could always try $ cat | sed 'regular exp here' :>
20:29:16 <fungot> optbot: bought by sun microsystems. citation sun press room fnord/ fnord fnord the encyclopaedia britannica: a dictionary of arts, sciences, commerce and law. faculties of medicine ( 1936), co-author of the ugly american. ' '
20:29:17 <fungot> optbot: i think the song " clementine" or anything about huckleberry hound. why he might decide to do this)? thanks! fnord fnord --user:protiousgeorge ( user talk:protioustalk) 01:44, 8 september 2008 ( utc
20:29:18 <fungot> optbot: i changed the 2007 population data in the infobox, but i note a couple things still stick out. first, the idea that " things lose value because they cease to exist". if we can make a wide speculation like that without knowing. there is also an improvement over an fnord body of text that is published elsewhere under different terms, that does not give the base of the log. small—preceding wikipedia:signaturesunsigned co
20:29:19 <optbot> fungot: this is my point. We all know that a halting solver is impossible to do exactly. It'll either keep going and going, only halted by a timeout (which would be inaccurate, perhaps), or it'll halt and return true. (but we all know that, so I just wasted effort typing all this out.)
20:29:19 <fungot> o:optbot: meaning that the western asian people known as " dom", as the
20:29:21 <fungot> optbot: i also think the article also has a strong reputation as a remedy against me. if you can't convince each other, right? fnord!
20:29:24 <fungot> optbot: i've put in this picture of the coronation. i assume that it is common to use the cbs name. in the same manner as other south slavs are, although the apa does not recognize this syndrome and convened a panel that rejected the existence of
20:29:24 <optbot> fungot: how're you doing with the Basil puzzle?
20:29:28 <fungot> optbot: i am currently investigating fnord and permanent hair removal as a permanent solution to this problem. the problem is that faith and belief are fnord acts and can not ever be like today. there is already someone by that name, which should be relevant for this page?
20:29:28 <optbot> fungot: that would make continuations rather worthless
20:29:32 <fungot> optbot: please go to :image:logo ulivo fnord image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with wp:fufair use.
20:29:35 -!- fungot has left (?).
20:29:41 <ais523> that's not meant to happen...
20:29:43 <fizzie> Who has brokeded the loop-checker?
20:29:49 <fizzie> Well, me, most likely, but still.
20:30:14 <AnMaster> no clue how the heck to do that
20:30:23 <ais523> using Befunge Units, of course
20:30:39 <ais523> well, I just made them up, and there aren't any details yet
20:30:50 <ais523> but probably something like mini-funge
20:33:22 * ais523 ponders the concept of compiling BackFlip into Funge
20:33:23 <fizzie> I did mess around the loop-checker when updating fungot not to use NULL any more, but I can't see how I would've broken it.
20:33:23 <AnMaster> ais523, continuous(sp?) integration for Funge?
20:33:36 <ais523> well, no, it was just a flippant pun, really
20:33:42 <ais523> but you spelt continuous correctly
20:34:13 <AnMaster> Funge IDE with project files and so on
20:34:33 * AnMaster considers Visual Studio Funge#
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20:41:16 <fizzie> That's curious, the loop-checker seems to work when single-stepping through it.
20:42:01 <fizzie> Maybe a large negative number has somehow ended up there, although I don't see how, since it should reset to zero whenever someone talks to fungot.
20:42:06 -!- fungot has joined.
20:42:13 <fizzie> fungot: First I say something to you.
20:42:13 <fungot> fizzie: respectfully, fnord ( ancestral form of modern iranian fnord fnord, fnord
20:42:19 <fungot> optbot ptbot tbot bot ot t
20:42:19 <optbot> fizzie: allowed_execs["__import__"] = None
20:42:20 <fungot> optbot: they needed cars, fnord and fnord) and all stocky muscle could easily tip the scale at close to 1600 pounds. ( note: women rowers have close to the disparity of sub-saharn africa would have the slight advantage of leaving the existing links to " hull speed".
20:42:20 <fungot> optbot: this page is going to be long, and needs to be discussed, it should be deleted, not merged. but new england flood of may 2006 has the fnord nest with the fnord
20:42:21 <optbot> fungot: !befunge http://catseye.mine.nu:8080/projects/befunge93/eg/hello2.bf
20:42:21 <fungot> optbot: includes almost every naval aircraft ever used. the major ideas need a page number from those books cited. ideally one should use the binary prefixes. if you have
20:42:22 <fungot> optbot: 3. unlike some fighters whose fnord decreases after their prime, kung fu will relate to chinese martial arts page and the pic fnord changing. i dont think that this article be renamed but there was no official release date. fnord listed it as simply the " horn" and " impute". is this a cognate of the spanish fnord fnord?
20:42:23 <optbot> fungot: I forget that methods are non-first-class in java
20:42:31 <fizzie> Okay, there, it stopped.
20:42:53 <fizzie> The same thing should really be happening even if the underload interp is used to initiate the loop.
20:43:11 <fizzie> fungot: I'm just resetting the limit again.
20:43:11 <fungot> fizzie: i finally tracked down some related publications by searching directly for professor fnord fnord.
20:43:14 <AnMaster> fizzie, you could have attached gdb and dumped the location using call if you had a debug (-O0) build
20:43:24 <optbot> fizzie: pymacs or something
20:43:24 <fungot> optbot: an annular hurricane. i think we can use the compressed air at 70 psi to operate the points for the fnord web
20:43:24 <optbot> fungot: What time is i
20:43:25 <fungot> optbot: it should be named in english, using both terms. --user:jondeljondel 09:49, 24 june 2008 ( utc
20:43:25 <optbot> fungot: and then you'll never be able to use the lambda special form!!
20:43:25 <fungot> optbot: the region was originally inhabited by the fnord show syndicated on the n all over the place.
20:43:26 <fungot> optbot: my apologies for the tone of the series' fnord.
20:43:26 <optbot> fungot: that's the 'official' name
20:43:32 <fizzie> Okay, it stopped again.
20:43:50 <fizzie> Maybe I had a botched copy running on the box where the IRCed fungot sits.
20:43:50 <fungot> fizzie: this article could be expanded. user:badagnanibadagnani 21:01, 27 september 2006 ( utc
20:44:06 <AnMaster> fizzie, in a debug build: call fungespace_dump()
20:44:16 <AnMaster> but that won't exist in a release build
20:44:25 <AnMaster> it just dumps it raw to stdout btw
20:44:55 <AnMaster> fizzie, wait you store it negative?
20:45:04 <AnMaster> fungespace_dump dumps from 0,0 to edge
20:45:26 <fizzie> Yes, the counter is at x=0, y=-15; and the last nick who spoke to it is in x=1..., y=-15.
20:47:13 <AnMaster> fizzie, that is kind of "tricky" to reach in cfunge
20:47:31 <AnMaster> I would just add a print where I needed it in the code
20:47:34 <AnMaster> fungespace_get(vector_create_ref(x, y)))
20:47:41 <AnMaster> but vector_create_ref is a macro
20:48:10 <AnMaster> fungespace_get(& (fungeVector){x, y}) or such iirc
20:48:19 <AnMaster> that is a pointer to a struct on stack
20:48:33 <AnMaster> which is tricky to call from gdb to put it mildly
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20:53:23 <fungot> fizzie: he claims it on his web site? fnord 16:09, 28 december 2007 ( utc))) which quotes these formulae and confirms that this is supposed to be assuming good faith here? please suggest any changes that you think would be a better type of article for a good article but it is always called " le fnord di figaro," w.a. mozart; the title role in " the other side has not been updated in years, not since their first creation of the
20:53:33 <fizzie> ^code 0ad00f-gU0": ciretose# GSMVIRP"AAN51p08P0851g21gW$
20:53:44 <fizzie> Hmm, that should've worked.
20:54:19 <fizzie> But it just hung up this time. Meh, worked locally, too.
20:54:29 -!- fungot has quit (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)).
20:55:08 <fizzie> I probably should be using the same interpreter for local testing and actual running, too.
20:55:08 <oklopol> lol @ ciretose, that sounds coool
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20:55:59 <oklopol> about the putting the actual befunge unlambda on the bot, isn't there a fingerprint for some kinda procedures?
20:56:39 <fizzie> There's SUBR which has call/return instructions.
20:57:36 <oklopol> i'm off to hesburger to read my book ->
20:57:54 <fizzie> Heh, yes: that ^code call indeed works with RC/Funge, but doesn't with cfunge.
20:58:18 <fizzie> It's *again* the SUBR 'A' thing. :p
20:58:33 <oklopol> are you saying it's become a *blind*funge?
20:59:02 <fizzie> The current SUBR fingerprint has an 'A' instruction which masks the STRN 'A' I was trying to use there.
20:59:15 <fizzie> I think it's also in a new RC/Funge-98 like that, but my build is a bit old.
20:59:40 <oklopol> or maybe a desertfunge, but that's probably even harder to get
21:00:00 <ais523> looks like you need to mess aobut with FING...
21:00:27 <AnMaster> fizzie, last rc/funge would have it too
21:01:08 <AnMaster> fizzie, and older rc/funge may have slightly different semantics for FING on empty stacks
21:02:30 <fizzie> Well, I no longer do anything involving empty stacks except using Z to push things on them, which is pretty standard stuff.
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21:02:55 <fizzie> Workarounded it a bit.
21:03:00 <fizzie> ^code 0ad00f-gU0": ciretose# GSMVIRP"AAN51p08P0851g21gW$
21:03:17 <fizzie> That "simple and easy-to-remember command" can be used to check the counter.
21:03:24 <fizzie> fungot: I say something.
21:03:26 <fungot> fizzie: ( undent) right, that's why put it in more clear english: a thought i experience proves its own existence, but it doesn't explain the play. the explaination given here does not explain, contrary to your assertion, why the fnord sexism? people need to stop changing the date. i bought it on that day, and fire was on it by night, in long grass, between fnord, fnord
21:03:28 <fizzie> fungot: I say something else.
21:03:29 <fungot> fizzie: apart from the whole confusion he writes we have two sets of evidence: " the british bulldog" fnord boy smith, " fnord и fnord " fnord fnord fnord
21:03:30 <fizzie> ^code 0ad00f-gU0": ciretose# GSMVIRP"AAN51p08P0851g21gW$
21:04:07 <AnMaster> fizzie, what about adding a command to actually do that?
21:04:30 <AnMaster> fizzie, shouldn't it be 2 there?
21:04:53 <fizzie> It starts with 0 when it sets the "who spoke last" thing.
21:05:22 <fizzie> Then it does "++counter > 3" to check whether it should stop.
21:05:45 <fizzie> ^code 0ad10f-G0": ciretose# GSMVIRP"AAN51p08P0851g21gW$
21:05:48 <fizzie> That's who spoke last.
21:06:21 <fizzie> Yes, I guess I could add some sort of funge-space fetch commands to accompany ^code. Not sure if I'll bother, though.
21:08:47 <fizzie> Actually I think there's a slight wrap-around problem: if you speak to the bot something like 2^31 times (without anyone else speaking in-between) it'll again start answering to you, and actually continue answering until the counter again reaches positive numbers.
21:09:01 <fizzie> (Don't try this on-channel, please.)
21:11:59 <fungot> lament: everything in the article to decide. fnord 22:11, 17 january 2008 ( utc) copyedit finished. good luck. cheers, fnord 19:04, 9 december 2006 ( utc)
21:12:01 <fungot> lament: question: are arepas known outside of broadcasting fnord. the center is located about miles 10 miles west of kusinagar. the place abounded in peepul trees and there were also presuppositions unique to discourse:
21:12:04 <fungot> lament: guys, please don't hesitate to add information, but it seems like that's been resolved ( at least in the part of the states to decide who to regulate and how much of this has been going around vandalizing pages by putting stuff about hen fap in the third paragraph, which i not yet can see as " at least ten thousand years ago, which is the primary source document of islamic international law, there is no
21:12:06 <fungot> lament: i decided to add the link yesterday, but wasn't aware of any comparative studies that have proven the fnord of coats and pants etc do not require such grounds. furthermore, the article ' of course christ didn't actually look as christian art suggested.' but we don't ' ' '
21:12:16 <ehird> hey lament, can you kick lament?
21:12:37 <fizzie> No, it's in the ignore mode now.
21:12:53 <lament> damn, i was hoping to wrap around
21:12:56 <fizzie> But when you say that thing 2^31-4 more times, it'll again answer.
21:13:12 <fizzie> Unless someone goes and speaks to the bot before you can manage to do it.
21:13:50 <ehird> lament: welp, guess you'd better start.
21:14:23 <ehird> wonder if you could do it with mechanical turk
21:14:56 <lament> i can say it about twice per second
21:15:05 <lament> so it'll only take 2^30 seconds
21:16:41 <ehird> today, children, we see AnMaster not finding something funny funny.
21:17:03 <ehird> 'that would take ages' = ruins the joke by explaining it.
21:17:28 <AnMaster> http://www.mezzacotta.net/singles/jokes_explained_explained.php
21:17:47 <ehird> yes, explaining jokes is funny, but only if you do it in a funny way
21:17:51 <fizzie> Oh, it's only 34 years? Maybe I need to use a 64-bit build to avoid that problem, then.
21:17:59 <ehird> (being extremely literal, serious and in-depth)
21:18:27 <AnMaster> ehird, also that link I gave do the same on a second level :)
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22:18:25 <AnMaster> night, won't be reachable during most of tomorrow
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