00:27:53 -!- olsner has quit ("Leaving"). 00:48:20 -!- CO2Games has joined. 00:55:05 -!- tusho has quit (Client Quit). 00:58:50 -!- Sgeo has joined. 01:30:31 -!- CO2Games has quit ("And I invented doors, no joke!"). 01:34:29 -!- moozilla has quit ("- nbs-irc 2.37 - www.nbs-irc.net -"). 01:34:44 -!- moozilla has joined. 02:20:34 -!- Sgeo has quit (Remote closed the connection). 03:45:39 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | at least, one file visible to the compilation. 04:28:56 -!- sebbu has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 05:08:42 -!- oerjan has quit ("Good night"). 05:24:53 -!- CO2Games has joined. 06:20:32 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined. 07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended). 08:00:00 -!- clog has joined. 08:23:05 Deewiant, there? 08:32:34 Deewiant, as soon as you wake up, please check your mail 08:44:22 -!- sebbu has joined. 09:45:45 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | When (if) I get my Ph.D, I'll change my nickname to DrGregor :P. 10:09:14 GregorR, was it you who said that thing in topic now? 10:20:03 AnMaster: morning 10:21:08 1) that's your problem. if all other interpreters as well as the latest standard say that you should do X and you still want to do Y, that's fine, but now that instruction is useless. 10:21:28 2) the BAD comes from what's at the bottom of the file: F is off by one. 10:21:54 3) echo "10xyzhhTesting, testing." | cfunge mycouser.b98 10:22:16 or wait, that last may be incorrect 10:22:33 3) echo "10xyz19-hhTesting, testing." | cfunge mycouser.b98 10:23:50 as for updating Mycology, what do you want me to do? Almost every time I tested a new interpreter I ran into a bug in Mycology. It would have taken me until christmas to update the comparison if I had started now and released iteratively. 10:24:06 in any case I think that you definitely should say "mycology 2008-xx-yy" conforming 10:24:29 because that is of course the case, you don't know what's up in the latest versions and the older versions are probably incorrect in some way. 10:25:23 and cfunge is under "Interpreters tested", you must have missed it 10:36:29 Deewiant, it doesn't say if it is 0 or 1 based in the specs for TIME 10:37:23 and as you know I'm against changing a fingerprint unless it is very new 10:37:28 that is why I accepted the FING change 10:37:31 since it was so new 10:38:00 Deewiant, so indv basically stors the vector vertically now instead of horizontally? 10:38:29 no 10:38:53 it's just that when W pushes it pushes x then y, and when V pops it pops y then x 10:38:58 originally, V popped x then y 10:39:03 which meant that the vector was flipped 10:39:17 Deewiant, so is the F in TIME 1 or 0 indexed? 10:39:37 specs doesn't say 10:39:37 the docs say "Day since First of year" 10:39:42 which is of course 0 for the first day of the yeas 10:39:45 s/s/r/ 10:39:51 ok hm 10:39:55 s:s/:s$/: 10:41:12 Deewiant, STRN does indeed not use the buffer the rest of the interpreter use 10:41:16 but I'd say that is undefined 10:41:31 so it reflected due to EOF 10:42:22 I would say it most certainly is not undefined 10:42:30 Deewiant, then where is it defined? 10:42:41 if you use fgets() followed by fgetc() would you expect that they read from different places? 10:42:50 I think it's common sense 10:46:59 "Common sense", isn't that like a swearword around here? 10:47:23 fizzie, indeed 10:51:34 Deewiant, STRN and TIME are fixed. In INDV I argue it is an UNDEF 10:52:00 while I agree the other order would be more logical, this is still an undef 10:52:04 argue all you want, it's a one-line change and doing it wrong is just belligerency 10:52:14 Deewiant, you know that once a RFC is published it is never changed? 10:52:28 that is the same reasons fingerprints should never be changed 10:52:33 exactly the same reason 10:53:07 Deewiant, so you suggest RFCs should be updated randomly? 10:53:08 you know that 10000 other things are just as UNDEF? the only reason that one was made separate is because I wasn't 100% sure whether it was intentional or not 10:53:10 is that right? 10:53:19 who said anything about RFCs? 10:53:36 the fact that the original Mycology called it an UNDEF was a BUG 10:53:48 Deewiant, both RFCs and fingerprint specs are immutable once published 10:53:59 and where does it say that 10:54:06 that's an UNDEF if ever I've seen one :-P 10:54:17 Deewiant, common sense 10:54:26 :P 10:54:39 because once you change stuff, retconn them, stuff are going to get messy 10:54:40 since we don't have versioning I think it makes very much sense to correct obvious mistakes 10:55:09 Deewiant, since we don't have versioning I think it makes sense to have immutable fingerprints, possible with a separate errata 10:56:05 Deewiant, oh and I found a new befunge98 for you to test on GreaseMonkey's website 10:56:06 http://greasemonkey.nonlogic.org/befunge98-r002.zip 10:56:16 I very much suspect it is early early alpha 10:56:28 it's pretty much abandoned 10:56:33 so if there's a mistake which implies that the whole fingerprint is useless (like FNGR) you suggest it should remain like that forever, taking up one slice of the fingerprint space for no good at all? 10:57:32 Deewiant, yes, I agree there are downsides to that, but the other ones are worse 10:57:33 heh 10:57:36 // x - Absolute Delta (wtf?!) 10:57:45 eh? 10:57:50 from the source of that 10:57:55 not worth my time, sorry :-P 10:58:23 ah well 10:58:45 Deewiant, but if you agree it is an UNDEF then I'm happy to change it 10:58:59 Fight for the rights of the UNDEF! 10:59:19 AnMaster: I maintain that since practically all Funge programmers are taking part in this very discussion, changing fingerprints is fine as long as they're notified 10:59:35 and no, it's not UNDEF. 10:59:47 Deewiant, well then I suggest notifying at least a week before you update mycology 11:00:11 like said, in this case that would have meant that the update you wanted so much would have taken months. 11:00:38 I wanted to do it and so I did. If you want to make a quick release fixing the bugs and you care about it so much I can have cfunge-0.3.3 there pretty quickly. 11:01:36 Deewiant, doesn't W suffer the same problem as V in INDV then? 11:01:46 no it doesn't 11:01:53 FungeSpaceSet(b.y, &a); 11:01:53 FungeSpaceSet(b.x, VectorCreateRef(a.x+1, a.y)); 11:01:55 from my W 11:02:05 that's not the relevant part 11:02:13 the relevant part is where you pop stuff from the stack 11:02:13 a = GetSecondVector(ip); 11:02:16 hm ok 11:02:44 in any case the INDV tests need to be somewhat rewritten for the new storage offset stuff 11:03:33 Deewiant, the "bugs" are fixed in current cfunge bzr head, but I make at most one release / week, not "another day another release", there are limits to the "release early, release often" 11:03:45 why 11:03:52 maybe "another hour, another release" next? 11:04:10 why not, what does it matter? 11:05:23 that freshmeat have a policy against that, and I make release announcements, same about sf.net, iirc they got some policy too 11:06:42 sucks to have to work with others doesn't it :-P 11:06:59 Deewiant, hm? 11:07:50 well that's part of the reason I prefer to host everything myself 11:07:58 Deewiant, anyway I concentrate development on efunge currently, though I have some plans for cfunge too 11:08:04 mainly rewritten TURT 11:08:18 but for both I currently have limited time 11:08:37 and efunge is still 93 11:09:45 -!- GreaseMonkey has quit ("Jesus loves you"). 11:09:51 Deewiant, why are you using -W for cfunge? 11:10:10 reporting unknown instructions *is* against the specs really 11:10:31 not if you request it 11:10:38 food -> 11:10:58 Deewiant, another issue, with that last rcfunge, the reported "vanity" output, can't it be disabled? 11:11:21 http://users.tkk.fi/~mniemenm/befunge/mycology-output/fp-file/rcfunge-mark-2.txt <-- a binary file? 11:14:33 Deewiant, other odd thing, the rcfunge output for PERL is correct in the one it crash on TURT but incorrect in the case where TURT support is not compiled? 11:15:30 Deewiant, also it doesn't say environment variables have to be in order anywhere, so why is that mentioned at the end of http://users.tkk.fi/~mniemenm/befunge/mycology-output/y/rcfunge-mark-2.txt 11:18:22 Deewiant, and http://users.tkk.fi/~mniemenm/befunge/mycology-output/input/rcfunge-mark-2.txt is a 404 11:28:35 Deewiant, if efunge becomes a befunge98 interpreter, will you test it? since it will need special knowledge really 11:28:59 with that I mean weird build system (emakefile, not makefile) 11:29:01 and so on 11:31:00 if I can get it to work, sure 11:32:06 man, if only Windows had soft links 11:33:02 404s taken care of 11:33:24 Deewiant, and windows does, *.lnk thougj 11:33:27 though* 11:33:34 no, that's just bullshit :-P 11:33:35 (and no, not really, just poking fun at windows) 11:34:11 -!- Slereah has joined. 11:34:15 Please input a character: UNDEF: got -116 'ÂŒ' which is hopefully correct. <-- that in rcfunge looks like memory corruption to me 11:34:37 AnMaster: I think it clears the input buffer and then reads out of uninitialized memory, just a guess though 11:35:14 Deewiant, does any test in mycology depend on a finite cell size? 11:35:28 shouldn't 11:35:33 since efunge doesn't have that, it use bignums all the way through 11:36:24 Deewiant, oh and I do know my STRN got an issue which you didn't detect. STRN's I mess up on UTF8 for some unknown reason, it cuts off after the first non-ascii char 11:36:43 fixed the Rc/Funge consistency stuff 11:37:08 AnMaster: I can't detect everything. 11:37:08 Deewiant, hm? 11:37:15 but I think the issue is with getline() rather than STRN... 11:37:17 AnMaster: 2008-09-14 13:14:33 ( AnMaster) Deewiant, other odd thing, the rcfunge output for PERL is correct in the one it crash on TURT but incorrect in the case where TURT support is not compiled? 11:37:24 ah yes 11:37:27 Deewiant, what caused that? 11:37:50 the files I generated stuff from said "rcfunge-mark-2:" instead of "rcfunge:\nrcfunge-mark-2:" 11:37:54 so a manual messup of mine 11:37:59 ah 11:38:17 this is why it takes so long to update: so much has to be done by hand and it's fairly error prone :-/ 11:38:33 Deewiant, err why does REFC say N/A for cfunge? 11:38:43 that is plain wrong 11:38:59 typo 11:39:13 wasn't it auto generated? 11:39:38 NA has to be written by hand of course 11:39:42 Deewiant, a good way to check how much mycology actually tests would be coverage analysis 11:39:46 -!- Slereah_ has joined. 11:39:50 yes, I know 11:39:53 and? :-P 11:40:04 in efunge the various mycology programs test all the b93 parts except two lines 11:40:16 fixed that NA 11:40:16 -!- Slereah has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 11:40:20 which are swap on stack with one item, and dup on stack with one item 11:40:21 iirc 11:40:36 as for binary files: can't be helped that they contain binary in the output, that's what the interpreter outputs 11:40:53 Deewiant, what mime type do you send them as? 11:41:04 I have no clue and I can't do anything about it, not my server 11:41:13 probably autodetects them 11:42:13 or hmm, can that be done in .htaccess? 11:43:22 maybe I can do something about it after all 11:46:03 -!- moozilla has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 11:47:07 Deewiant, no clue 11:47:10 -!- moozilla has joined. 11:47:10 I use lighttpd 11:47:11 not apache 11:51:13 maybe firefox still wants to "save as" regardless 11:51:45 possibly 11:52:16 oh well, whatever 11:53:18 yay for new build system, using two types of make 11:53:25 ERL = erl -boot start_clean 11:53:25 all: 11:53:25 $(ERL) -noshell -eval "make:all(), init:stop()." 11:53:25 clean: 11:53:25 rm -rf *.beam *~ erl_crash.dump 11:53:30 that is my entire Makefile 11:53:40 then my Emakefile is: 11:53:41 ['src/*']. 11:53:42 {'*',[warn_obsolete_guard,warn_untyped_record,warn_unused_import,warn_missing_spec]}. 11:53:48 lovely simple build system 11:54:18 and that's not portable to windows because of "rm" :-) 11:54:40 Deewiant, well I could put that in a variable 11:54:53 but you could built it still 11:55:01 just run make:all(). 11:55:02 and then the user would have to edit the makefile to get it to build 11:55:04 in an erlang shell 11:55:08 Deewiant, not really 11:55:17 you could set the environment variables 11:55:25 to override makefile ones 11:55:39 ERL = erl -boot start_clean 11:55:40 RM = rm -rf 11:55:42 what about that? 11:56:02 Deewiant, I don't think the makefile will work out of box on windows anyway 11:56:07 since windows has werl 11:56:10 which is gui stuff 11:56:47 in any case you have to mess with stuff 11:56:53 I'm not saying you should have to change it 11:56:58 Deewiant, agreed, but that can't be avoided 11:57:08 this is just part of my motivation for Coadjute 11:57:18 Deewiant, well it means I would need to install haskell wouldn't it? 11:57:19 :P 11:57:35 ERL_COMPILER_OPTIONS='[inline,native,{hipe,[o3]}]' make clean all 11:57:40 for the speedy build 11:57:43 sure 11:57:46 and that really helps for life.b93 11:58:08 yes I know that will look cryptic to a non-erlang programmer 11:58:15 it is a list of atoms and tuples 11:58:31 tupels? tuples? 11:59:06 tuples 11:59:34 right 12:02:34 -!- lament has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 12:04:51 Deewiant, efunge won't have an option to print warnings for unknown instructions btw 12:04:59 not sure why you would want that anyway 12:05:16 can be handy for debugging 12:05:22 well I mean for mycology 12:06:00 it's like stats: might as well make them as verbose as possible (without obscuring the befunge output) 12:06:21 Deewiant, compile time option then 12:06:34 I don't care whether you include it or not 12:06:57 Deewiant, is any interpreter on the mycology page using bignums+ 12:07:00 s/+/?/ 12:07:01 nope 12:08:16 -!- olsner has joined. 12:23:36 blergh needs to track edges now 12:23:39 * AnMaster ponders 12:48:33 -!- tusho has joined. 13:06:48 -!- jix has joined. 13:33:35 Deewiant, Efunge98 is progressing nicely 13:33:44 will take a few weeks due to time constrains currently 13:50:12 []abcdef; of 98 are implemented so far 13:50:20 hm k 13:50:21 blergh 13:54:16 -!- Slereah has joined. 13:54:17 -!- Slereah_ has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 13:55:56 -!- CO2Games has quit ("And I invented doors, no joke!"). 13:59:08 -!- tusho has quit (Client Quit). 13:59:24 -!- tusho has joined. 14:06:38 in efunge: BAD: 0k^ executes ^ at ^ 14:06:39 hm 14:06:44 wtf was that one now again? 14:13:53 Isn't 0k^ supposed to execute ^ 0 times (that is, skip it). 14:14:08 ah yes 14:14:11 while 1 and such would not step over 14:14:18 so in effect 1 iteration would execute it twice 14:14:33 ah GOOD all the way to w now 14:15:05 (btw if you wonder, this is not for cfunge, but another funge interpreter in another language) 14:15:55 AnMaster: we can and do read previous messages 14:16:01 you have mentioned efunge like 5 times. we are not blind. 14:16:05 you don't have to point it out. 14:16:54 tusho, but I assume you will prefer efunge over cfunge? 14:17:08 AnMaster: i'll prefer ccbi or rc/funge, probably. 14:17:18 tusho, but that wasn't the question 14:17:26 anyway cfunge is more conforming that rc/funge 14:17:28 even now 14:17:39 I have not looked at efunge. 14:17:42 http://users.tkk.fi/~mniemenm/befunge/mycology-comparison.html <-- yes cfunge get a few bad, all fixed today 14:17:59 tusho, efunge is not fully 98 yet, the version that is uploaded is 93 onlty 14:18:03 only* 14:18:25 but I think this code is very nice: 14:18:27 iterate(0, _Instr, IP, Stack, _Space) -> 14:18:27 {IP, Stack}; 14:18:27 iterate(Count, Instr, IP, Stack, Space) -> 14:18:27 {IP2, Stack2} = processInstruction(Instr, IP, Stack, Space), 14:18:27 iterate(Count-1, Instr, IP2, Stack2, Space). 14:18:41 For things I would use, my ranking goes for non-vaporware stuff: RC/Funge, CCBI1, [huge gaping chasm], cfunge. 14:18:44 I do not know where efunge is there. 14:18:55 RC/Funge is above CCBI1 because it'll be more useful for socket apps etc 14:18:56 tusho, efunge is indeed not finished yet 14:18:58 based on fizzie's experience 14:19:05 but it is partly implemented 14:19:11 Ideal situation, my ranking would be CCBI2, RC/Funge, CCBI1, [huge gaping chasm], cfunge. 14:19:15 it gets all the way to w 14:19:45 rc/funge is *less* conforming than ccbi: http://users.tkk.fi/~mniemenm/befunge/mycology-comparison.html 14:19:58 and than cfunge 14:20:03 tusho, can't see why you hate cfunge 14:20:15 if you want unreadable source code you go for rc/funge 14:20:18 way less readable 14:20:18 AnMaster: I don't give a flying fuck about conforming, RC/Funge is the most useful for real apps due to its array of fingerprints. 14:20:41 tusho, cfunge implements most of the fingerprints that ccbi1 does: http://users.tkk.fi/~mniemenm/befunge/mycology-comparison.html 14:20:55 And RC/Funge still comes out on top. 14:21:12 tusho, with a lot of useless and badly defined fingerprints 14:21:14 indeed sure 14:21:23 And a lot of useful and well-defined ones, too. 14:21:33 fungot runs on Rc/Funge and does it very well too. 14:21:37 which ccbi and/or cfunge implements 14:21:45 tusho, it runs on cfunge too 14:21:49 and ccbi iirc 14:22:00 AnMaster: but cfunge is a retarded piece of crap, and you already know that that's my opinion 14:22:08 and you have known that is my opinion for months 14:22:09 tusho, I don't see *why* you think so 14:22:17 AnMaster: then you haven't been listening very well 14:22:23 also, just peeked at the rc/funge code, perfectly readable 14:22:33 tusho, it is fast, I fixed my funge-space hash to have good performance 14:22:49 tusho, not when I last looked, which was last week I looked at some fingerprint code 14:23:02 Presumably because you aren't very good at reading C. 14:23:10 It's regular, sane code. 14:23:45 tusho, I am, but I prefer well structured code with one indention style, K&R coding style or some slight variant of that 14:24:00 It is well structured. 14:24:13 tusho, but you still haven't said why you hate cfunge 14:24:20 since the hash library have been fixed 14:24:26 Yes, I have, over the course of many months, in great detail. 14:24:37 tusho, "because I didn't fix hash library" yes 14:24:39 I am not condensing all of those lines into one because it would be far too much of a lossy conversion. 14:24:41 but that has been done 14:24:42 tusho has already explained everything, there 14:24:43 AnMaster: Where the fuck did you get that idea? 14:24:46 's no use asking him anything 14:24:51 tusho, from you 14:24:55 I have mentioned the hash library like ONCE 14:24:56 (this goes for everything.) 14:24:58 since you complained about that 14:25:14 a lot 14:25:17 not once 14:25:25 more like 50 times 14:25:27 no, i didn't, you're hallucinating 14:25:31 you are 14:25:41 i know what i've said, thanks 14:25:54 tusho, so you hate that I'm POSIX only too? well so is rc/funge 14:26:08 it even requires X 14:26:10 No, I don't, now if you actually want to know what I said, grep tusho and cfunge in the logs. 14:26:11 unlike cfunge 14:26:14 now i'm quite busy 14:26:17 same 14:36:44 Deewiant, http://rafb.net/p/DdE9wq23.html <-- hm, I'm not sure, and yes j isn't yet implemented, but that is an interesting way to fail 14:43:58 -!- oklobol has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 14:47:24 Deewiant, I still get that error with all GOOD before 14:47:25 ... 14:47:45 http://rafb.net/p/FLYm0g77.html 14:47:49 -!- funktio has left (?). 14:47:50 any clue what could be happening? 15:19:37 ah it was broken flying wrapping 15:19:59 Deewiant, idea: report broken non-cardinal wrapping better 15:21:44 broken non-cardinal wrapping 15:21:52 it sounds like something out of star trek 15:26:41 heheh 15:27:05 thought it actually means that funge-space wrapping is broken when ip doesn't move as in Befunge-93 15:27:15 that is anything byt ^v<> 15:27:19 but* 15:30:38 tusho, Now wrapping (at warp 9) in efunge works with a non-cardinal delta index in the warp core plasma. 15:30:44 * AnMaster runs 15:30:52 AnMaster: eject into HYPERSPACE!! 15:31:17 hey hyperspace is star wars not star trek! 15:31:45 Hyperspace is in any and all works of hacks to explain FTL 15:31:58 Like ASIMOV 15:32:24 Slereah, Star Trek got wrap instead 15:32:35 AnMaster: it is a SECRET facet of the TIME CUIBE 15:32:42 warp is the EDUCATED LIE they tell you 15:32:43 hm? 15:32:46 to hide TRUE HYPERSPACE 15:32:49 haha 15:33:04 well yes it fill the function 15:33:19 Warp space is the same 15:33:25 allow travel between planets without changing crew all the time 15:33:32 It's just "Let's give the work to another universe" 15:33:46 That's the outsourcing of labor. 15:34:17 Slereah, wrap in Star Trek works by Using negative energy to compress the space-time itself, thus shortening the path you have to travel, in effect the ship travels at sub-FTL speeds 15:34:45 Thank god the trekkie heard about the Alqubier propulsion to justify it! 15:34:58 Of course, it doesn't actually work, but it sounds moar scientific 15:35:03 indeed 15:35:21 and if it worked it would still need a LOT more energy than can ever be contained in a ship 15:35:34 The Alqubierre propulsion is silly 15:35:41 is that the name of it? 15:35:46 It's based on making up a metric for space time. 15:36:00 Without any regard for the stress energy tensor 15:36:04 I'm no huge fan of Star Trek 15:36:17 just happen to have watched a lot of TNG and Voyager 15:36:27 not a lot of TOS 15:36:50 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcubierre_drive 15:36:50 Thar 15:37:07 NATURE'S 4 DAYS OF HARMONIOUS TIME CUBE ROTATION 15:37:17 Oh you :D 15:37:28 -1 * -1 = 1 IS STUPID AND EVIL 15:37:33 tusho, oh that sounds familiar..... not *THAT* crap surely 15:37:49 AnMaster: ACADEMIC IS _EVIL_ 15:37:54 YOU HAVE BEEN EDUCATED *STUPID* 15:38:07 oh my, I seen that crap website before once 15:38:31 AnMaster: educators altere dyour mind, YOU CANNOT THINK opposite of what you were taught to think. 15:38:36 AnMaster : Search for "Time cube" 15:38:40 it was just a lot of shouting, didn't even manage to get the point what it wanted to say across 15:38:44 *shrug* 15:39:05 AnMaster: When the Sun shines upon Earth, 2 - major Time points are created on opposite sides of Earth - known as Midday and Midnight. Where the 2 major Time forces join, synergy creates 2 new minor Time points we recognize as Sunup and Sundown. 15:39:05 The 4-equidistant Time points can be considered as Time Square imprinted upon the circle of Earth. In a single rotation of the Earth sphere, each Time corner point rotates through the other 3-corner Time points, thus creating 16 corners, 96 hours and 4-simultaneous 24 hour Days within a single rotation of Earth - equated to a Higher Order of Life Time Cube. 15:39:08 Slereah, yes and it never explained in a clear way what it meant by "time cube" iirc 15:39:24 AnMaster: YOU HAVE A CYCLOP PERSPECTIVE AND TAUGHT ANDROID MENTALITY - LOBOTOMIZED ANALYTICAL ABILITY 15:39:31 Don't ask insane people to explain themselves. 15:39:42 Slereah, I guess so 15:39:56 -!- CO2Games has joined. 15:40:31 "thus creating 16 corners, 96 hours and 4-simultaneous 24 hour Days within a single rotation of Earth" <-- now that makes no sense 15:40:37 not that the rest do either 15:40:39 AnMaster: YOU ARE EVIL 15:40:41 Heh. 15:40:42 but that bit makes even less sense 15:40:42 AND EDUCATED STUPID 15:40:47 What were you expecting. 15:40:52 omfg timecube.com is down 15:40:53 :((((((((((((((( 15:40:54 Slereah, nothing else 15:40:59 GENE RAY WHAT HAS HAPPENED TO YOU?????? 15:41:30 AnMaster: YOU HAVE KILLED THE WISEST HUMAN, YOU EVIL ACADEMIC 15:42:36 you are free to go on with that silly spam, but please don't highlight me 15:42:50 AnMaster: -1 * -1= +1 is WRONG, it is academic stupidity and is evil. The educated stupid should acknowledge the natural antipodes of +1 * +1 = +1 and -1 * -1 = -1 exist as plus and minus values of opposite creation - depicted by opposite sexes and opposite hemispheres. 15:43:23 AnMaster: idea: if non-cardinal wrapping doesn't work you can end up absolutely anywhere, there's nothing I can do about it 15:43:41 Deewiant, ah true 15:44:09 Deewiant, but you could handle some common cases easily 15:44:16 which case is that 15:44:32 Deewiant, applying b93 wrapping at f98 edge size 15:44:38 that is: 15:44:53 if X == MaxX -> X = MinX 15:45:07 and if X > MaxX? 15:45:07 err I mean: if X > MaxX -> X = MinX 15:45:12 that is what I meant 15:45:23 and the same for Y? 15:45:24 ... 15:45:27 GENE RAY IS XENU 15:45:33 yes 15:45:39 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | not as far as I know, but CLC-INTERCAL still supports Baudot and punched cards, and maintaining compatibility as far back as possible is a running INTERCAL in-joke. 15:45:50 and same for if X < MinX -> X = MaxX 15:45:55 Deewiant, if you see what I mean 15:46:11 AnMaster: so where does it end up in that case 15:46:25 Deewiant, the basic algorithm I use for cardinal wrapping is: http://rafb.net/p/ZakhhS22.html 15:47:17 Cardinal wrapping? 15:47:33 Deewiant, bouncing between u and o like this: http://rafb.net/p/FLYm0g77.html 15:47:57 AnMaster: what would help is the next cell it hits, space included 15:48:04 Slereah, Befunge way of saying, "moving north/south/west/east" and not diagonally 15:48:15 Deewiant, hm... a sec 15:53:00 Deewiant, http://rafb.net/p/kOS6BT80.html 15:53:02 hope that helps 15:57:52 -!- CO2Games has quit ("And I invented doors, no joke!"). 15:59:31 blergh at stack-stacks 15:59:35 really blergh 16:00:27 I forgot about them when planning the design 16:00:27 A STACK OF STACKS 16:00:37 probably because I don't use them a lot myself when coding funge 16:06:48 AnMaster: uploaded a Mycology which should catch that case now 16:07:59 "Fixed: test for k with a negative count was expecting pre–2008–07–26 k behaviour." <-- what exactly would that mean? 16:08:17 Deewiant, k with negative reflect is what I implement iirc, and it is an UNDEF 16:08:28 yes, and? 16:08:45 so how would it expect pre–2008–07–26? 16:09:06 for instance in that when it says "pops more than the absolute value of the count" it would be off by one 16:09:13 ah right 16:09:19 I never seen it say that 16:09:49 AnMaster: can/will you test that noncardinal wrapping again? 16:10:03 Deewiant, you forgot one case: pushes "You are an UNDEF jerk, and be happy this isn't DeathStation 9000" on stack and reflects 16:10:06 * AnMaster runs 16:10:10 (no I don't) 16:10:23 Deewiant, sure in a bit, want to get the current change I'm working on done first 16:10:26 DeathStation 9000 >:| 16:10:32 9000 is (c) my ass >:| 16:10:38 Slereah, eh? 16:10:51 Don't you remember the LOVEMACHINE 9000? 16:10:51 AnMaster: his langs end with 9000 16:10:54 Love Machine 9000, etc 16:10:54 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DeathStation_9000 16:10:56 see that 16:11:00 it has been around for ages 16:11:23 Speaking of langs 16:11:38 How would you go about to parse a bunch of parenthesis in Scheme? 16:11:52 I'm trying to make a lang based on mu functions. 16:12:26 With 0, suc, projection, mu, and two functions : recursion and composition. 16:12:34 That way, everything can be written in one line 16:12:44 Unlambda-like 16:21:58 no clue 16:22:13 I could just use the syntax of Scheme 16:22:19 But it feels a little like cheating 17:17:34 Deewiant, your mycology update works 17:17:54 Assuming we can trust x... 17:17:54 BAD: wraparound with non-cardinal delta doesn't work 17:17:54 Instruction { is not implemented (at x=63 y=70). 17:24:41 -!- Slereah_ has joined. 17:24:41 -!- Slereah has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 17:30:55 -!- Slereah has joined. 17:35:55 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has joined. 17:37:59 -!- Slereah2 has joined. 17:38:00 >:| 17:42:13 -!- puzzlet_ has quit (Remote closed the connection). 17:42:32 -!- puzzlet has joined. 17:46:35 Deewiant, Hm does { copy elements, or move them? 17:47:45 -!- Slereah_ has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 17:48:03 "transfers n elements from the SOSS to the TOSS"... 17:48:29 Deewiant, "It copies these elements as a block, so order is preserved." 17:48:55 that is what made me wonder 17:49:02 '"Transfer" is used here in the sense of "move," not "copy": the original cells are removed.' 17:49:23 true 17:49:44 -!- Hiato has joined. 17:52:01 -!- oklobol has joined. 17:52:39 Deewiant, I swear lists:reverse/2 in stdlib of erlang was made for Stack Stacks as I implement them... 17:52:41 > lists:reverse([1, 2, 3, 4], [a, b, c]). 17:52:41 [4,3,2,1,a,b,c] 17:52:57 it reverses the first list and appends to second list to the end of the first one 17:53:12 that's silly 17:53:27 (++) . reverse 17:53:32 perfect for Stack Stack End 17:53:37 I'd expect lists:reverse([1,2,3,4],[a,b,c]) to return two values 17:53:42 [4,3,2,1] and [c,b,a] 17:53:46 Deewiant, um the ++ is rather ineffective in Erlang 17:53:54 since lists are cons cells like in lisp 17:54:02 AnMaster: same in haskell 17:54:04 but ++ is efficient 17:54:09 so accessing head is the effective way 17:54:15 AnMaster: you think that that function doesn't do an append internally? 17:54:19 the lists:reverse/2 is implemented internally yes 17:54:24 Deewiant: he is thinking it'd be two traversions 17:54:26 I know it is 17:54:27 as in a non-lazy language 17:54:36 but in haskell it's just one traverse like the erlang 17:54:38 it is a BIF 17:54:43 Built In Function 17:54:47 ah right, in a strict language it would be two traversals 17:54:58 Deewiant, hm? 17:55:12 reverse x ++ y would traverse x twice in a strict language 17:55:14 -!- Slereah has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 17:55:20 I assume it does some strange magic internally in the runtime system 17:55:42 AnMaster: he meant that lists:reverse will traverse it 17:55:46 but you thought it'd traverse twice 17:55:50 in Deewiant's version 17:55:51 you are wrong 18:11:28 -!- Hiato has quit ("Leaving."). 18:26:04 "Artificial Bee Colony Algorithm (ABC) is an optimization algorithm based on the intelligent foraging behaviour of honey bee swarm, proposed by Karaboga in 2005 " 18:26:40 Slereah2, intriguing 18:26:44 details? 18:27:45 Slereah2, I'd love to hear what it is about 18:27:57 http://mainegov-images.informe.org/agriculture/pi/images/bee.jpg 18:28:01 Oops 18:28:04 I mean, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_Bee_Colony_Algorithm 18:28:04 :D 18:32:40 Slereah2, Seems rather far-fetched 18:33:04 Bees! 18:33:14 yes? 18:33:21 Let's make a language out of it. 18:33:28 Like... Beesfuck 18:33:30 Or something 18:33:38 you finished your scheme variant? 18:35:18 No. 18:35:27 I'm back to school :( 18:35:32 No time for langs right now. 18:35:41 what timezone? 18:35:53 how is the bee algo different from local beam search ? 18:35:55 because it is Sunday here 18:36:00 and it is late evening 18:36:06 can't see how that ends up as school 18:36:17 oklobol, local beam search? 18:36:22 AnMaster : I mean, generally 18:36:25 related to erlang compiled .beam file? 18:36:28 ;) 18:36:43 local beam search is a long story 18:36:52 obviously searching for a compiled module, ignoring any nfs mounts! 18:37:01 * AnMaster runs 18:37:08 :) 18:41:03 blergh 18:41:15 Deewiant, I hate stackstack since it really mess up the whole code 18:41:15 :( 18:43:18 consider writing it differently so it doesn't mess it all up :-P 18:44:20 Deewiant, well, having a CONS list as a stack would be sane, right? 18:44:40 now erlang is single-assignment 18:44:53 which means if I change stack I need to put it back into the stack stack list 18:45:00 Whoah. 18:45:04 my submission is #1 on programming.reddit 18:45:11 consider helper functions 18:45:14 ... and #7 on reddit proper 18:45:17 Deewiant, hm 18:45:22 tusho, and that submission is? 18:45:27 http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/71e5c/sketchpad_an_advanced_painting_program_from_1963/ 18:48:30 tusho, interesting, but horrible sound 18:48:34 AnMaster: It' 18:48:38 s a video from the 1980s. 18:48:42 What the heck did you expect? 18:48:50 A video from the 1980s showing footage from the 1960s. 18:49:00 tusho, better, since professional movies back then had better sound 18:49:07 AnMaster: It's just someone speaking, jeez. 18:49:12 k 18:50:06 Wowzers. #5. 18:50:16 :P 18:52:30 tusho, cool and I think some of those features may not be found in modern systems really 18:52:35 at least not systems I work on 18:52:36 nope, unfortunately not 18:52:44 it looks totally neato, i'd love to try it out 18:52:44 possible pro CAD apps? 18:52:52 i wonder what the constraint programming language looked like 18:52:55 AnMaster: well, it was a 2d system 18:52:57 tusho, I got no clue what sort of emulator you would need 18:52:59 looks vector-based 18:53:10 well yes I'd say it was vector based too 18:53:11 AnMaster: probably doesn't exist. I'll just get my time machine 18:54:20 definitely not based on pixels I'd say 18:54:36 AnMaster: well duh 18:54:40 there weren't any pixel-based screens then 18:54:44 of course 18:54:52 I was just being Captain Obvious 18:54:53 dunno what that output is, though 18:54:57 an oscilloscope? 18:55:05 the way the lines wave a bit seem to suggest so 18:55:06 no clue 18:55:29 "Sketchpad was the first program ever to utilize a complete graphical user interface, using an x-y point plotter display" 18:55:33 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sketchpad 19:00:28 neato 19:00:41 #4 on reddit :\ 19:00:46 96 points 19:00:52 Well, I sure got lucky. :p 19:02:01 tusho, and tomorrow it is gone again... 19:02:07 what is the point? 19:02:13 fame for a day? 19:02:50 no, I just wanted to share it :) 19:02:54 Holy shiet, #1 on programming.reddit 19:03:04 Still #4 on reddit.com. 19:03:11 tusho, yet you are about how high it ends up? 19:03:15 and you said it before 19:03:17 AnMaster: no, i'm just surprised 19:03:19 Whoah. 19:03:19 my submission is #1 on programming.reddit 19:03:26 Yes, I was surprised. 19:03:30 Ah. 19:03:33 Well, I forgot. :P 19:03:39 Anyway, I'm just amused. 19:03:50 As I don't think I've had anything on the front page before. 19:04:03 (If I were a karma whore, then the reason would be karma, but I don't care. It's just a number in my profile.) 19:18:14 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Vector_Video_Standards2.svg <-- do anyone else think the name QSXGA is silly? 19:19:35 AnMaster: IDKWYATAITIAAVRN 19:19:49 I don't know what you ....? 19:19:55 no I can't decode it 19:20:09 what you are talking about 19:20:20 no longer than that 19:20:28 ITIAAVRN I can't guess at 19:24:23 AnMaster: I Don't Know What You Are Talking About I Think It's A (?) Very Reasonable Name 19:24:36 hahah 19:24:40 sarcasm I bet 19:25:15 according to that chart, my current screen is SXGA+, and my old was SXGA 19:25:38 WSXGA+ for me 19:25:56 I prefer 4:3 19:25:58 iMac 20" screen, matte, very nice lighting 19:26:04 UGA for the win 19:26:08 AnMaster: i did too but os x lends itself very well for widescreen usage 19:26:29 well, my current screen is 21" and matte 19:26:51 AnMaster: yea, mac displays generally have higher dpi than most others 19:26:56 true 19:27:13 Deewiant, how large would UGA be? 19:27:18 AnMaster: it's on the chart... 19:27:32 I mean 24" seems reasonable? 19:27:33 or? 19:27:39 ah 19:27:41 21" 19:27:47 ah, higher DPI 19:28:12 also I have seen other formats 19:28:55 I remember seeing some greyscale-only screen with a insanely high resolution, extremely expensive, target at hospitals and such 19:29:00 don't remember details 19:29:14 it was a standing format, that is taller than it was wide 19:29:36 3nnn x ????? 19:29:37 iirc 19:29:40 err 19:29:44 3nnn x ???? 19:29:51 nnn> 19:29:53 *> 19:29:54 *? 19:29:57 haha 19:31:58 yay I solved the stack stack issue I think 19:32:03 #3 on reddit, yikes. 19:32:10 I only submitted it an hour ago. 19:35:25 in fact I will need no code changes except changing -import(fstack, [push/2, peek/1, pop/1, popVec/1, dup/1, swap/1]). to -import(fstackstack, [push/2, peek/1, pop/1, popVec/1, dup/1, swap/1]). 19:38:38 basically then end up as wrappers like: 19:38:39 push([TOSS|T] = StackStack, V) -> 19:38:39 NewTOSS = fstack:push(TOSS, V), 19:38:39 [NewTOSS|T]. 19:41:09 #2 19:41:10 :| 19:42:02 "I'd like to see some evidence this isn't fake.. 19:42:03 Anyone have citations for this? 19:42:03 That computer seemed too high rez and the touch screen tech seemed too advanced for 67." 19:42:04 ahahahahhahah 19:42:06 high rez 19:42:07 :D 19:42:14 bet he thinks it's a pixel based screen 19:42:21 wow, apparently sketchpad was written in simula 19:42:46 -!- oklopol has joined. 19:44:23 -!- oklobol has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 19:51:04 -!- puzzlet has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)). 19:51:08 -!- puzzlet has joined. 19:55:44 tusho, cool 19:55:56 is there any modern compiler for that language? 19:56:54 yes i think so 19:57:09 Simula 67 introduced objects, classes, subclasses, virtual methods, coroutines, discrete event simulation, and features garbage collection. 19:57:11 first oo language 19:57:14 here 19:57:15 Major implementations GNU Cim 19:57:19 http://www.gnu.org/software/cim/cim.html 19:57:31 Begin 19:57:31 OutText ("Hello World!"); 19:57:31 Outimage; 19:57:31 End; 19:57:33 a hello world 19:57:47 the syntax is quite sane, very readable 20:03:36 -!- Slereah_ has joined. 20:03:40 -!- Slereah2 has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 20:09:50 ... 20:09:52 #1 on reddit 20:14:26 sucks to be you doesn't it? 20:14:34 yes 20:14:35 i'm weeping 20:16:47 tusho, number 2 20:16:56 AnMaster: duh, it fluctuates 20:17:02 and number 1 is way way higher 20:17:16 AnMaster: it isn't based solely on score. 20:17:31 see, e.g. the 1000+ point submission below me 20:17:53 it's based on a combination of score, hotness, controversialness, and a bunch of other factors that reddit won't reveal to us because it's their business model 20:18:50 who decides "controversialness" 20:19:03 and is that a good or bad thing 20:19:21 AnMaster: if an item has 500 upvotes and 500 downvotes, it'd be 100% controversial 20:19:32 ah I see 20:19:40 tusho, and does that count as a + or a -? 20:19:59 AnMaster: + i think, but obviously if you have 300 upvotes and 310 downvotes the - comign from that will probably cancel it out 20:23:25 tusho, right 20:24:32 -!- puzzlet_ has joined. 20:36:16 -!- oerjan has joined. 20:36:28 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has quit (Remote closed the connection). 20:37:30 -!- puzzlet has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 20:37:59 BAD: { transfers cells incorrectly 20:37:59 10 0 0 Stopping due to fear of corrupt stack stack 20:38:03 Deewiant, what does that mean? 20:38:21 incorrect how? 20:38:28 would be useful saying stuff like: 20:38:30 "reversed" 20:38:37 or "should have been 0 0 10" 20:38:38 or whatever 20:46:45 Deewiant, IMO the current error is unusuable 20:47:19 brb 20:56:25 http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/2058.html 20:59:28 Deewiant, ah found the issue, I pushed offset before I popped for transfer 20:59:40 now code locks up after "GOOD: } transfers cells correctly" 21:01:28 -!- Figs has joined. 21:12:40 "This is totally Sketchpaded. I can tell by the vectors and having played a lot of Tempest in my time." 21:12:42 *g* 21:12:55 :P 21:13:06 oh hi figs 21:13:09 I just saw that on reddit 21:13:10 hi 21:13:12 i'm the one who ordered you to come in here :P 21:13:18 who is figs? 21:13:23 AnMaster: a regular in 2007ish 21:13:30 I am Figs! (*muahahahha*) 21:13:35 "This is totally Sketchpaded. I can tell by the vectors and having played a lot of Tempest in my time." <-- don't make sense 21:13:37 doesn't* 21:13:38 AnMaster: yes it does 21:13:51 it's a play on the meme "This is photoshopped, I can tell by the pixels and having seen a few shops in my time" 21:14:03 ah 21:14:09 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mOZqRJzE8xg <-- sketchpad 21:14:16 yes I seen the video 21:14:24 ah, k ;) 21:14:25 tusho, anyway Tempest? 21:14:39 Figs, so what esolangs do you use? 21:14:45 Figs: i submitted that link 21:14:48 so everyone here has seen it :P 21:15:03 yes he told us like 15 times already 21:15:07 :P 21:15:11 AnMaster: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tempest_(arcade_game) 21:15:14 "omg #3, omg #2, omg #1" 21:15:21 early vector game 21:15:23 Actually, I didn't notice that you'd submitted it 21:15:28 *gasp* 21:15:41 Figs: mwahahaha! i am internet famous! or something 21:16:45 AnMaster: I've played around with BF a bit, and a few other things that aren't coming to mind, but mostly I come here to bother people about language design/implementation and for random insanity/fun :) 21:17:00 I also used to enjoy obfuscating C++ 21:17:20 (Which I've been told, on a couple occasions, is redundant...) 21:18:02 AnMaster here's specialty is copypasting code from CCBI and then microoptimizing parts that don't need to be to make his funge-98 interpreter cfunge. 21:18:17 [{esoteric, [Befunge, Brainfuck]}, {nonesoteric, [C, Erlang, Bash]} 21:18:20 err 21:18:22 [{esoteric, [Befunge, Brainfuck]}, {nonesoteric, [C, Erlang, Bash]}] 21:18:22 even 21:18:23 :) 21:18:43 and tusho is lying 21:18:45 he just hates me 21:18:56 no, I'm not lying, and i don't hate you 21:19:01 i think you're annoying, sure 21:19:01 yes you do 21:19:07 but i don't hate you 21:19:07 and you are lying 21:19:16 whatever you say... 21:19:28 tusho, I did base a few fingerprints on CCBI ones where the spec was unclear 21:19:51 but nothing in the core is based on it, or is based on discussions with CCBI author or similiar 21:20:04 and most fingerprints aren't based on it 21:20:08 What's CCBI? :P 21:20:15 Figs: concurrent conforming befunge interpreter 21:20:19 another Befunge interpreter 21:20:34 * AnMaster goes back working on efunge 21:20:45 (a befunge-98 interpreter coded in Erlang) 21:20:56 efunge is exactly like cfunge except it's written in erlang and he can't use _posix_fadvise or _posix_fuzzy_logic_core_seed. 21:21:12 AnMaster: http://rafb.net/p/by2Tg875.html 21:21:19 tusho, and you are still lying 21:21:25 example of some of the kinds of crap I used to make... :P 21:21:26 AnMaster: no: you disagree with me 21:21:28 different thing 21:21:31 I use no posix_* in file reading any more 21:21:36 so it is a lie to say I use them 21:21:45 AnMaster: it still exemplifies the general style. 21:21:49 Figs, I said C not C++ 21:21:57 AnMaster: he wasn't replying to you. 21:22:02 though it is certainly obfuscated 21:22:06 he was showing some obfuscated c++ that he made a while back 21:22:06 I said C++, not C 21:22:16 that he mentioned when saying his esolangs 21:22:17 Figs, well I can't read C++ 21:22:31 AnMaster: you don't have to be able to read it to see the obfuscation 21:22:32 tusho, " AnMaster: http://rafb.net/p/by2Tg875.html" " AnMaster: he wasn't replying to you." <-- really? 21:22:37 seems like a *highlight* to me 21:22:38 AnMaster: addressing you != replying to you 21:22:52 tusho, " though it is certainly obfuscated" " AnMaster: you don't have to be able to read it to see the obfuscation" 21:22:54 your point? 21:22:57 I already said it 21:23:15 AnMaster: i'm saying that "well I can't read C++" was a silly statement as I doubt anyone but figs can read that 21:23:29 Oh, you were trying to explain the languages you know with your [{( messages... :P 21:23:34 I didn't catch that 21:23:38 Figs, yes I did 21:23:41 I thought you were arguing with tusho 21:23:49 Figs: we're always arguing, generally 21:23:54 Figs, it was a list of tuples 21:24:02 containing lists 21:24:05 Figs: he's just showing off that he knows erlang. 21:24:16 :P 21:24:28 tusho is always arguing with someone 21:24:35 hi oklopol 21:24:36 oklopol: shut up, you're wrong 21:24:36 we're not as clever as him 21:24:42 :D 21:24:42 so 21:24:44 naturally 21:24:47 Figs, actually you need to quote them as they start in uppercase 21:24:49 3> [{esoteric, ['Befunge', 'Brainfuck']}, {nonesoteric, ['C', 'Erlang', 'Bash']}]. 21:24:49 [{esoteric,['Befunge','Brainfuck']}, 21:24:49 {nonesoteric,['C','Erlang','Bash']}] 21:24:49 he ends up correcting us all the time 21:24:50 Did you ever play my song, oklopol? 21:25:12 oklopol, except he is wrong a lot of the time 21:25:14 Figs: no :) but i'm getting my piano back soon, perhaps i could retry 21:25:23 haha, ok :P 21:25:25 AnMaster: you're wrong a lot of the time too 21:25:45 currently i just have my synth, and i'm too lazy to upload any good sounds on it 21:25:49 I'm always wrong, except when I'm not. 21:25:57 so it just has square, which is a bit chaotic with polyphonic music 21:27:00 where tusho is wrong, it's irrelevant whether he was right or not 21:27:13 where tusho is wrong, it's irrelevant whether he was right or not 21:27:14 zen 21:27:25 very 21:27:45 btw, just got the art of computer programming trilogy from amazon 21:27:51 it's so pretty <3 21:27:57 nice 21:28:00 oklopol: ooooh 21:28:06 want :} 21:28:11 but it costs like £100 21:28:12 :( 21:28:13 i just browsed through the pages and drooled 21:28:18 even though 21:28:19 want 21:28:20 :| 21:28:22 so, the books are really unusable now 21:28:26 I've got a box of those too; a friend ordered two and sold me the other one. 21:28:51 i also bought a haskell programming book, but it was of noobial quality 21:29:21 One of these days, I'm going to have to force myself to actually learn Haskell :P 21:30:17 Although, I've been learning x86 assembly lately... 21:33:51 x86 is awful 21:34:01 so, good choice 21:34:04 http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/71e5c/sketchpad_an_advanced_painting_program_from_1963/c05ffid i bring so many people together <3 21:34:09 oklopol: which book did you get? 21:34:10 yaht? 21:34:12 yaht owns 21:34:17 real world haskell also owns 21:34:44 expand yaht 21:34:51 oklopol: Yet Another Haskell Tutorial 21:35:01 this one is "programming in haskell" 21:35:16 I now have the weirdest craving for bbq sauce on pizza :| 21:35:30 ima ask #haskell what they think of that book oklopol :P 21:35:31 Unfortunately, I have neither... 21:35:42 tusho: thanks, actually. 21:36:01 i'll read it anyway, since i bought it, though, of course 21:36:21 hmm, apparently dcoutts reccomends it, dcoutts is pretty cool 21:36:29 maybe you just think it's noobish :-P 21:36:52 (saw on the webb) 21:36:58 oklopol: graham hutton? i like the book, but its a little thin. 21:37:04 i just took a quick glance 21:37:27 RWH [ed: real world haskell] is broader, with more emphasis on practical stuff 21:37:35 yeah it's very, very thin 21:37:44 and i don't care for practicality, of course 21:37:51 as if i'd ever *use* it ;;) 21:37:53 oklopol: yea, i just told them that :D 21:38:03 -!- Figs has changed nick to Figs|AfkPhoneCal. 21:38:06 if you could destroy every practical computer in the world I bet you would 21:38:12 tusho: i like the book, i was particularly happy that he covered some equational reasoning/proof stuff in it 21:38:25 he really wants a book called "How to write completely unreadable Haskell" 21:38:27 if no one had computers, i'd gladly live without one 21:39:13 oerjan: s/unreadable/oko/ 21:39:20 get your terms right 21:39:22 there is a difference 21:39:38 that might nearly be possible 21:40:03 oko o = o (okoko o) okokoko 21:40:25 that's not very okoy 21:40:29 okoy that would be 21:40:47 oko=\o->flip o okokoko$okoko o 21:41:15 ah ok (o) 21:42:27 -!- puzzlet_ has quit (Remote closed the connection). 21:42:28 -!- puzzlet has joined. 21:45:39 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | http://www.codu.org/plof/dplof-x86-gnuWlinux-2006-12-19-2. 21:48:49 Deewiant, 21:48:50 BAD: 101-{} doesn't leave stack top as 0 and next as 1 21:48:55 care to say what it does instead? 21:48:59 BAD: fedcba0{05-} doesn't leave 15 on stack 21:49:00 same 21:49:16 -!- bsmntbombdood has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 21:54:08 v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 :r: 4v4 21:54:13 ends up in that loop later 21:57:55 Deewiant, I suspect misaligned code at: 21:58:03 4 (x=27 y=84) 21:58:03 (x=27 y=85) 21:58:03 : (x=27 y=86) 21:58:03 r (x=27 y=87) 21:58:22 the v above that 4 seems to point to wrong place 22:03:56 night Deewiant 22:04:02 and everyone else 22:05:20 -!- Figs|AfkPhoneCal has changed nick to Figs. 22:05:41 HelloooooooooooO! I have returned! 22:05:47 hi 22:23:21 -!- jix has quit (Nick collision from services.). 22:23:31 -!- jix has joined. 22:25:03 -!- puzzlet_ has joined. 22:25:47 -!- puzzlet has quit (Remote closed the connection). 22:26:05 hmm 22:26:11 I just killed windows explorer 22:26:52 Figs: run it again 22:26:57 there's a "run task" in the task manager 22:27:03 Yeah, I know :P 22:27:06 :P 22:27:11 wowzers. 22:27:12 #1 on reddit 22:31:24 :P 22:31:44 careful now, lest you get addicted. 22:32:10 hah. 22:32:14 i just find it amusing 22:32:35 addicted to being #1 on reddit seems hard 22:33:06 could easily get ugly, if there was more than one addict 22:33:24 :P 22:33:48 maybe that's why so many places on the internet are ugly 22:34:59 Like this one: http://www.ugliestwebsite.com/ ? 22:35:09 (or so i've heard, i don't tend to stay at such places) 22:35:54 no not that kind of ugly 22:36:12 with the exception of those that are addicted to getting on that website :D 22:49:16 AnMaster: whoa 22:49:20 it wasn't in simula 22:49:21 it predated simula 22:49:23 [[ Sketchpad’s implementation of class and instance-based inheritance (though not called objects) predated Simula by several years.]] 22:49:29 sketchpad had the first OOP system. 22:50:08 so it invented... non-procedural programming, vector graphics programs, pen-operated touch screens, OOP, what else 22:54:27 -!- Figs has changed nick to Figs|AFK. 22:59:26 -!- jix has quit ("CommandQ"). 23:33:12 I seem to recall that someone here was retargeting GCC to Brainfuck... 23:35:33 pikhq: ais 23:36:51 Ah, yes. 23:37:00 * pikhq wonders how far he's gotten with that 23:37:43 pikhq: Far. 23:40:10 How... Vague. 23:40:37 With Great Power comes Great Insanity 23:41:13 darn, there _was_ a tvtrope by that exact name 23:41:37 * oerjan blames his subconscious 23:42:42 pikhq: He basically has everything done apart from actually generating the BF code. 23:42:55 He has an intermediate language called ABI (for maximum nameclash) that can be assembled into BF pretty trivially. 23:43:07 He just has to fix up the last bits of that then write the converter (apparently very trivial) 23:44:00 i wouldn't say scetchpad invented oop 23:44:26 oklopol: why not? It's from 1963. 23:44:33 well i just saw the youtube clip 23:44:52 i wouldn't say it invented oop, because it... didn't 23:45:11 oklopol: duh not in its UI 23:45:13 but it was coded with oop 23:45:18 except it wasn't called that, ofc 23:45:18 oh 23:45:24 since it was the first to do it 23:45:32 well as i said, i only know what i saw in the clip 23:46:00 i thought it was a bit far-fetched to call the ui a language :) 23:46:26 oklopol: the language to specify constraints (e.g. to make the lines parallel and such) was a full language 23:46:27 maybe it was a sign language 23:46:28 non-imperative 23:47:00 tusho: That's fairly impressive. 23:47:14 pikhq: what? 23:47:17 sketchpad or gcc-bf 23:50:52 -!- Figs|AFK has quit ("...hold the mayo, Mr. Mayor!"). 23:57:22 is this genuine maya mayo?