< 1171238420 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D6 could be a roleplaying reference < 1171238446 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Could* be. < 1171238447 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no clue < 1171238453 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION rolls 5000d20
< 1171238456 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1171238486 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the name of the D function int Gregor.R(real) mangled. < 1171238518 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :done < 1171238537 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_D6Gregor1RFeZi: yes, that looks correct now < 1171238558 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok that means _ was the only part i nearly understood :) < 1171238579 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.ca/351161 < 1171238586 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :50 lines < 1171238680 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_D6Gregor1RFeZi: Sorry; I don't do C++. < 1171238688 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean. . . < 1171238698 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't look at C++'s mangled names. < 1171238705 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's D, not C++ < 1171238729 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. . . I thought D used one of the name mangling schemes made for C++. . . < 1171238748 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, _D means the D language, 6Gregor means Gregor, 1R means R, F = float, Z = int, and I don't know about e and i/ < 1171238750 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's similar, but certainly not the same. D's name mangling is made for D. < 1171238788 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell can spit out some interesting mangled names in its linker error messages. < 1171238800 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gotta love mangling :P < 1171238870 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was easier than i thought < 1171238887 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would have been a lot cleaner if python files had ungetc < 1171238954 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, at least it's got a consistent mangler; removes the issues that C++'s lack of standard mangling schemes produces. . . < 1171239004 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: C++'s mangling is standardized ... just nothing complies to the standard :P < 1171239065 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION boggles at the C code that ghc emits:
< 1171239069 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :typical extract: < 1171239071 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :R1.p = (P_)(W_)&GHCziBase_unpackCStringzh_closure; < 1171239095 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heheheh < 1171239189 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BTW, what about my proposed analysis of your name? < 1171239267 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sukoshi: looks like a custom parser is the way to go < 1171239285 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC: I'm actually not sure about "FeZi" - I just got the mangling name by compiling the appropriate file :P < 1171239302 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mangling! Fun. < 1171239326 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well FeZi has to encode int and real somehow, doesn't it? < 1171239337 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"ldi1e2:ab3:abci56e1:gli2ei3eeei42ee" <-- fun < 1171239356 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is [{1: 'ab', 'abc': 56, 'g': [2, 3]}, 42] bencoded < 1171239427 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like bencode < 1171239467 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yeah. < 1171239478 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: And the fact that one of them is a parameter, and the other is a return type. < 1171239693 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess we need you to go and compile a different function :) < 1171240490 0 :pikhq_!n=pikhq@c-75-70-69-187.hsd1.co.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1171240521 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grr. . . < 1171240525 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1171240531 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :STOP TURNING OFF THE CABLE MODEM, DAMN IT! < 1171240533 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :pikhq < 1171240684 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1171240828 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sukoshi: A yacc parser for bencode is way too much < 1171241237 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what kind of parser is the one i wrote? < 1171241251 0 :digital_me!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Lost terminal" < 1171241333 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like pretty straightforward recursive descent predictive parser < 1171241524 0 :ShadowHntr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1171241843 0 :kxspxr!n=kxspxr@x1-6-00-0c-41-39-32-8e.k302.webspeed.dk JOIN :#esoteric < 1171241872 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1171242628 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SETI: A 99.999% chance of being a waste of effort and a 0.001% chance of destroying the entire Human race. < 1171242631 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1171242697 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either they don't exist, they already know we are here, or we wouldn't want them to? < 1171242768 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl < 1171242834 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically the chance that two civilizations should develop and not be millions of years apart in time is minimal < 1171242842 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asdf < 1171242880 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if they are millions of years apart then the first one will have colonized the galaxy or destroyed itself before the other one arises < 1171242994 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the're just intorverts < 1171243089 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm... < 1171243222 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was this book i read about alien life that suggested maybe interstellar travel was _so_ awkward no civilization actually bothered to do it < 1171243267 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alas, there is always another option, including the one we haven't thought of < 1171243343 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think this just about sums up the present day: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Population_curve.svg < 1171243346 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1171243364 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ignore the actual units of the y-axis or even what it's measuring < 1171243413 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps. it doesn't show the fact that the growth is now decelerating < 1171243438 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't mean for population particulary. < 1171243454 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An exponential growth curve should be the logo for the 21st century < 1171243498 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technological_singularity < 1171243498 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, in _Orion's Arm_, there is a quite nice explanation using wormholes and time dilation that predicts that as long as intelligent civilisations are reasonably distant from one another, they will encounter one another while all having the about same tech level. < 1171243504 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reddit# < 1171243545 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reddit#? < 1171243565 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have read that already < 1171243587 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The growth is decelerating? < 1171243608 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1171243609 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it has been predicted that it will stabilize around 9 billions or so < 1171243614 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :logistic < 1171243616 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You mean the growth is going down, or it's actually slowing down? < 1171243629 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slowing down < 1171243644 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's currently above zero? < 1171243648 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what caused the two dips in the 1000's? < 1171243652 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1171243657 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, of course, the population is above zero as well? < 1171243661 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one is the great plague < 1171243663 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of them is certainly the Black Death < 1171243681 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...Yes, I should have known the fact that growth is above zero as well... < 1171243705 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ihope: do you know about differentiation? < 1171243715 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh nice the've actually got the data for analyis < 1171243720 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. < 1171243737 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Derivatives and integrals... and limits. Calculus is fun. < 1171243752 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about? < 1171243788 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about what? < 1171243793 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calculus < 1171243797 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i am saying that the second derivative of population wrt. time is negative < 1171243806 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fun. < 1171243848 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i forget how to tell gnuplot to fit a curve < 1171243933 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about calculus is fun, you mean, then? < 1171243939 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1171243970 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :disregard my comment < 1171244120 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1171244126 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Undefined value during function evaluation" < 1171244267 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1171244289 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone know gnuplot? < 1171244337 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sort of < 1171244340 0 :digital_me!n=digital@wikipedia/Digitalme JOIN :#esoteric < 1171244345 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@c-75-70-69-187.hsd1.co.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1171244350 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f(x) = a/(b + exp(-1*c*x)) < 1171244354 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fit f(x) "/tmp/popdata" via a, b, c < 1171244362 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that well. < 1171244363 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :=> Undefined value during function evaluation < 1171244392 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: that almost looks like Haskell. < 1171244415 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :digital_me: do you know? < 1171244884 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :garg < 1171244934 0 :digital_me!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"brb" < 1171244949 0 :digital_me!n=digital@wikipedia/Digitalme JOIN :#esoteric < 1171245071 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh damn < 1171245075 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the values are too big < 1171245124 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exponential of large numbers? < 1171245129 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1171245133 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1171245139 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually that shouldn't matter < 1171245145 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only goes up to like 6000... < 1171245149 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since the exponent is negative < 1171245161 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah :/ < 1171245199 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you do if then else? < 1171245233 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't think < 1171245235 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be reasonable to define exp(-6000) as 0 < 1171245243 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll just divide everything by 1000 < 1171245250 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, that's a terrible fit < 1171245293 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1171245354 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this curve fitting sucks < 1171245492 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, i can do conditionals < 1171245852 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :according to this model, in about 2700, the world population will go to 53,000 million, then by 2800 be -120,000 million < 1171245881 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negative? < 1171245889 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1171245934 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i guess if we learn to control antimatter :) < 1171246036 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's barely changing my initial parameters :/ < 1171246098 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps your function is not suitable for least squares estimation or whatever gnuplot uses < 1171246115 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what should i use? < 1171246153 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know < 1171246300 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a big population spike at -400 < 1171246376 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the growth from -700 to -400 was the biggest for a long time < 1171246482 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :untill like 1600 < 1171246491 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it just goes crazy < 1171246555 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and those two happen to be around the first and second golden ages of science... < 1171246591 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that with the timing... < 1171246633 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first population increase may have caused the age of philosophy while the second was _caused_ by the age of science < 1171246667 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-700 to -400 was a golden age of science? < 1171246681 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, -400 or so < 1171246687 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1171246718 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with aristotle, euclid and everything. < 1171246759 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course i mean philosophy as an analogy of science < 1171246834 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was another jump at -4900 < 1171246917 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think you can deduce that much < 1171246952 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it looks pretty major when graphed < 1171246973 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only with a log scale though < 1171247014 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, the numbers in the table are only accurate to the nearest million < 1171247025 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*accurate=given < 1171247071 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there may have been a jump from -5000 to -4000 but there is no way to say exactly when the growth started from the table < 1171247103 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1171247106 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there was a doubling in the next millennium < 1171247163 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and each of the two next ones < 1171247205 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then more than tripled from -1000 to 0 < 1171247222 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, i tried to fit it using a sixth order polynomial. it failed. < 1171247236 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i'ld say the -5000..-4000 was pretty tame in comparison < 1171247279 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably that was when most of people shifted to agriculture < 1171247331 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then it grew exponentially until the potential for that technology was used up < 1171247387 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Singular matrix in Invert_RtR! < 1171248874 0 :kxspxr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1171253410 0 :GreaseMonkey!n=notapoly@222-152-167-219.jetstream.xtra.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric < 1171253463 0 :SevenInchBread!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1171254113 0 :digital_me!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1171255206 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1171256114 0 :RodgerTheGreat!n=Rodger@wads-5-232-13.resnet.mtu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1171256130 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'sup? < 1171256188 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pus < 1171256480 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :antibiotics would be a good idea < 1171256607 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the antibiotic alternative < 1171257216 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anybody want to help me redesign Plof? < 1171257226 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why, what's crap about it? < 1171257252 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a functions-that-return-deep vs functions-that-return-shallow problem. < 1171257264 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eg if returns deep, but normal functions return shallow. < 1171257307 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lemme rephrase that: < 1171257315 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The 'if' function, for example, returns deep, but normal functions return shallow. < 1171257330 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the diff between "deep" and "shallow"? < 1171257350 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An example: If you do this: a = { if(condition, { return 1; }); }; < 1171257359 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then that inner return ought to return out of the a function. < 1171257364 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even though it's several layers in. < 1171257373 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a deep return. < 1171257380 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ok < 1171257394 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weird, plof looks kinda like tomato < 1171257396 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1171257402 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but implemented < 1171257408 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plof kicks ass. < 1171257423 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Except for the return problem, which makes for some VERY ugly builtin functions :P < 1171257423 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it does have a major issue (that being that it's not done). < 1171257428 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though in tomato, to return something: < 1171257436 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_D6Gregor1RFeZi: Yeah. . . < 1171257446 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION contemplates a Plofish way to do that. . .
< 1171257449 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :douche@(foo!4,bar!4) = { foo+bar; }; < 1171257455 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I need some kind of nomenclature to differentiate them, but that would increase the confusion involved in writing Plof by quite a bit :( < 1171257476 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so how does while return? < 1171257490 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deep as well. < 1171257501 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k < 1171257542 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a@(condition) = { if({condition}, { 1; }); }; < 1171257556 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is quite weird how plof has its similarities to tomato < 1171257570 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmmmm ... combination of an explicit way to note something as a deep-return function, then a way to catch returns from shallow-return functions. < 1171257576 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i admit plof was made first < 1171257612 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about the last "dropped" value returns it? < 1171257629 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... ? < 1171257647 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dropped value, as in: < 1171257650 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a+b; < 1171257656 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't set it < 1171257659 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1171257666 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't set a variable to it < 1171257697 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That doesn't really solve the problem :P < 1171257720 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THEN, you can return that shallow, and then the outer function will return that value < 1171257810 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you know that Firefox is already compatible with XHTML2.0? < 1171257845 0 :calamari!n=calamari@ip72-200-73-175.tc.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1171258103 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm starting to go in a big loop on my deep-return stuff :P < 1171258118 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I keep whittling it down in my head, and then I end up right back where I am already. < 1171258141 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the unfortunate return mechanism is just implicit to the language design. < 1171258162 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. any language which uses functions like Plof does will need to have a complex return system. < 1171258822 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't you just have implicit returns? < 1171258844 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, like functional languages? < 1171258858 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: This is a functional language. < 1171258877 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's mostly functional, but functions can have a list of statements instead of an expression. < 1171258887 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As such, the implicit return concept sort of breaks down. < 1171258902 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'll never beat lisp < 1171258905 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION goes
< 1171258912 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That just makes it an odd functional language, Gregor. < 1171258918 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lisp has already been beaten, bsmntbombdood :P < 1171258924 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NEVAR!!!!!!!! < 1171258925 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: True. < 1171259007 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you fix arrays yet? < 1171259038 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arrays do woik < 1171259080 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how? < 1171259101 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a = array(1, 2, 3); a[2] = 4; a[] = 7; < 1171259120 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1171259129 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so operator overloading? < 1171259143 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No - that's another reason I want to reorganize it. < 1171259146 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, a[] = 7; ? < 1171259158 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: That's concatenation. < 1171259174 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/ < 1171259191 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :overload + for that < 1171259206 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Expose a method of overloading operators. < 1171259206 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's wrong with a[] = 7 < 1171259209 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric := can't be overloaded because of how objects work, + can't be overloaded because it already has a meaning in terms of objects. < 1171259216 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1171259219 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fugly < 1171259226 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anything else could be overloaded, but it doesn't make sense to allow -, * or / to be overloaded given that + can't be. < 1171259232 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although yes, yes. . . < 1171259232 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a[] = 7 doesn't make sense < 1171259251 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: It's how PHP does it, and I find it totally intuitive there :) < 1171259261 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :object3=object + object2; makes a huge, new object. . . < 1171259268 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :php sure is a symbol of elegance < 1171259274 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yeah. < 1171259321 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you add numbers, then? < 1171259326 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ < 1171259345 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yuck < 1171259349 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_D6Gregor1RFeZi: Are you going to think of a way of doing command line arguments? < 1171259356 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: Numbers aren't classes. < 1171259362 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'm hoping so ^^ < 1171259364 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yuck again < 1171259375 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's gross < 1171259376 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :afk food < 1171259382 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF bsmntbombdood, are you a Java programmer? Shaddap. < 1171259395 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :java? < 1171259422 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[func=(a as int){println("Foo");}] < 1171259422 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Java, everything is an Object, but they allow gigantic exceptions to their rules of operator overloading to make that work. < 1171259444 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything isn't an object in java < 1171259472 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Int foo = new(Int);, I believe, is valid Java. < 1171259485 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X_X < 1171259503 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :java is yucky < 1171259511 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I don't do Java, so take that with a grain of salt) < 1171259565 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'm thinking about changing + for objects to something else, and thereby allowing overloading of everything but = < 1171259581 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe : < 1171259588 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not overload =? < 1171259608 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: a = [ foobar ]; b = a; c = b; d = [ bleh ]; < 1171259640 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: Which is to say, it's ambiguous. < 1171259644 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Suggestion. . . < 1171259666 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Class and function definitions use a new operator, :=? < 1171259672 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION gones
< 1171259703 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Hmmmmmm ... I sort of don't like the inconsistency that would create. < 1171259738 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. . . < 1171259795 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_^ < 1171259922 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm thinking about making programming language design my specialty for grad school. < 1171259939 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heheh. < 1171260129 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1171260170 0 :RodgerTheGreat!n=Rodger@wads-5-232-13.resnet.mtu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1171260394 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1171260632 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice idea < 1171260645 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<_D6Gregor1RFeZi> I'm thinking about making programming language design my specialty for grad school. < 1171262771 0 :flagitious!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1171264248 0 :na[zZz]gjunk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Bi-la Kaifa" < 1171265404 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1171265593 0 :Sukoshi!n=user@user-11fa9mp.dsl.mindspring.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1171265615 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1171265654 0 :Sukoshi!n=user@user-11fa9mp.dsl.mindspring.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1171266116 0 :Arrogant!i=Arrogatn@41.orlando-09rh15-16rt.fl.dial-access.att.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1171267199 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1171267200 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1171268747 0 :cmeme!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Client terminated by server" < 1171268758 0 :cmeme!n=cmeme@boa.b9.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1171268864 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1171268872 0 :puzzlet!n=puzzlet@122.46.198.22 JOIN :#esoteric < 1171269192 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"nighty everyone" < 1171272621 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1171278155 0 :kxspxr!n=kxspxr@x1-6-00-0c-41-39-32-8e.k302.webspeed.dk JOIN :#esoteric < 1171278351 0 :kxspxr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1171278391 0 :Arrogant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1171281764 0 :ihope_!n=ihope@c-71-205-100-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1171281776 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ihope < 1171282952 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1171291231 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# I'm being followed by /etc/shaddow # -- by /bin/cat stevens < 1171291798 0 :nazgjunk!n=htitan@wikipedia/Nazgjunk JOIN :#esoteric < 1171292186 0 :helios24!i=helios@2001:6f8:1036:3304:0:0:0:12 JOIN :#esoteric < 1171292264 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi * 2 < 1171292311 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_D6Gregor1RFeZi: why? < 1171293544 0 :helios24!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1171293546 0 :helios24!i=helios@2001:6f8:1036:3304:0:0:0:12 JOIN :#esoteric < 1171293620 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION goes
< 1171294238 0 :nazgjunk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) < 1171294897 0 :helios24!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1171294900 0 :helios24!i=helios@2001:6f8:1036:3304:0:0:0:12 JOIN :#esoteric < 1171295058 0 :nazgjunk!n=htitan@wikipedia/Nazgjunk JOIN :#esoteric < 1171295480 0 :helios24!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1171295481 0 :anonfunc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1171296024 0 :anonfunc!n=dholman@adsl-69-106-180-88.dsl.chi2ca.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1171296082 0 :helios24!i=helios@2001:6f8:1036:3304:0:0:0:12 JOIN :#esoteric < 1171296101 0 :anonfunc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1171297020 0 :FabioNET!i=500@217.201.28.41 JOIN :#esoteric < 1171297522 0 :_D6Gregor1RFeZi!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :GregorR < 1171299466 0 :nazgjunk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Bi-la Kaifa" < 1171299838 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1171301612 0 :nazgjunk!n=htitan@wikipedia/Nazgjunk JOIN :#esoteric < 1171302494 0 :kxspxr!n=kxspxr@x1-6-00-0c-41-39-32-8e.k302.webspeed.dk JOIN :#esoteric < 1171303160 0 :nazgjunk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1171303185 0 :nazgjunk!n=htitan@wikipedia/Nazgjunk JOIN :#esoteric < 1171303300 0 :RodgerTheGreat!n=Rodger@rover-93-124.rovernet.mtu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1171303631 0 :nazgjunk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Bi-la Kaifa" < 1171304231 0 :jix__!n=jix@L62b2.l.strato-dslnet.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1171304274 0 :jix__!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :jix < 1171304672 0 :sebbu!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-73-73.w83-203.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1171305616 0 :calamari!n=calamari@ip72-200-73-175.tc.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1171305955 0 :_FabioNET_!i=500@217.201.19.128 JOIN :#esoteric < 1171305978 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1171306082 0 :FabioNET!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 145 (Connection timed out) < 1171306198 0 :digital_me!n=digital@wikipedia/Digitalme JOIN :#esoteric < 1171306663 0 :RodgerTheGreat!n=Rodger@wads-5-232-13.resnet.mtu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1171307263 0 :Arrogant!i=Paragon@137.orlando-09rh15-16rt.fl.dial-access.att.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1171307571 0 :helios24!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1171307713 0 :helios24!i=helios@2001:6f8:1036:3304:0:0:0:12 JOIN :#esoteric < 1171308957 0 :wooby!n=alan@70-101-34-4.dsl2-plymouth.roc.ny.frontiernet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1171308957 0 :wooby!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1171309127 0 :helios24!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1171309530 0 :helios24!i=helios@2001:6f8:1036:3304:0:0:0:12 JOIN :#esoteric < 1171309530 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1171310896 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1171313086 0 :helios24!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1171313192 0 :tgwizard!n=tgwizard@c-9b3ee155.178-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1171314077 0 :RodgerTheGreat!n=Rodger@rover-93-124.rovernet.mtu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1171314091 0 :sebbu2!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-68-190.w83-203.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1171314692 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1171315099 0 :ihope_!n=ihope@c-71-205-100-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1171315114 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ihope < 1171315137 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Bitte waehlen Sie eine Beerdigungnachricht" < 1171315153 0 :nazgjunk!n=htitan@wikipedia/Nazgjunk JOIN :#esoteric < 1171315277 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1171315277 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sebbu < 1171315641 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1171315643 0 :nazgjunk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1171315646 0 :UpTheDownstair!n=htitan@wikipedia/Nazgjunk JOIN :#esoteric < 1171315876 0 :UpTheDownstair!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :nazgjunk < 1171316751 0 :UpTheDownstair!n=htitan@wikipedia/Nazgjunk JOIN :#esoteric < 1171316768 0 :nazgjunk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1171316771 0 :UpTheDownstair!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :nazgjunk < 1171317441 0 :nazgjunk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"i seriously need some sleep -_- guh." < 1171317599 0 :kxspxr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1171317642 0 :RodgerTheGreat!n=Rodger@wads-5-232-13.resnet.mtu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1171318095 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1171318430 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1171318545 0 :_FabioNET_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"A domani..." < 1171319229 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interestingly there was recently mention of deep vs. shallow return on Lambda the Ultimate < 1171319241 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: ^ < 1171319271 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm < 1171319330 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my impression was that shallow return made most sense if the language distinguished methods from closures < 1171319359 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the discussion was in the context of lexical scoping < 1171319409 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while deep return made most sense if there were only one kind of functions < 1171319428 0 :puzzlet!n=puzzlet@122.46.198.22 JOIN :#esoteric < 1171319444 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no me understando < 1171319447 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i thought of one possibility: you could allow labels on blocks, to return from them by name < 1171319461 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CL does that < 1171319467 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the last in the context of your plof question) < 1171319500 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so does perl i think < 1171319513 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :another P-language :) < 1171319633 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does plof have lexical scoping? < 1171319914 0 :Arrogant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1171320827 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"No me understando"? Sheesh, even GregorR's Spanish is better than that. < 1171320830 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1171320847 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heck even mine :) < 1171320853 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1171320863 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1171320911 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least you got the verb ending right :) < 1171320998 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: pff. Can you translate "I would have been to like it if he hadn't been wanting to eat" into Spanish? < 1171321026 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, no. < 1171321039 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I would have been to like it if it weren't for his wanting to eat." < 1171321054 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you translate that into English first? :) < 1171321088 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no, i doubt i could go beyond the present tense without googling somewhat < 1171321098 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I would have been to like it" is perfectly good and understandable English, isn't it? < 1171321104 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BabelFish translation: "Habría sido como a él si no estaba para el suyo que deseaba comer." < 1171321131 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BabelFish back-translation: "He would have been like a he if it were not for his that wished to eat." < 1171321171 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps but it is excessive for English, it reads almost like Douglas Adams' wioll haven been < 1171321198 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you say those last three words again? < 1171321231 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my memory may be shaky but those were part of his mock grammar for time travellers < 1171321299 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did he actually include "would have been to" in there somewhere?\ < 1171321351 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1171321371 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Google search for "I would have been to" yields things like "I couldn't talk about it to anybody, I would have been to ashamed." < 1171321396 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aha! "I would have been to see Himmler or Hitler on the very first day; on the very same day." < 1171321399 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a misspelling of "too" < 1171321433 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1171321447 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but "be to see" is an undividable phrase, isn't it? < 1171321496 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am sure there may be occasions when you need that precision, but: < 1171321505 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, "I would have been to like it if it weren't for his wanting to eat." through Lost in Translation with Chinese, Japanese and Korean enabled produces "_ way I, because this material, with which contat of sees, we wished, poss est did not know _" < 1171321514 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it undividable? < 1171321537 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for most cases you would do just as well with "I would have liked it" etc. < 1171321625 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"be to see" certainly does not have the usual future implication of "be to" < 1171321678 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh, wait < 1171321718 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually i find that Hitler quote ambiguous in that respect < 1171321759 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would depend on context < 1171321848 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But in "Have you been to see him?" it would be a phrase < 1171321891 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least a different kind of construction < 1171321901 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see. < 1171321909 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyhow, you are the native speaker here < 1171321915 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So like "gone to see"? < 1171321923 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1171322892 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"@+"