< 1164412865 0 :ivan`!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :" HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- The professional IRC Client" < 1164413693 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Didn't old versions of GCC used to start playing the towers of hanoi if you encountered certain undefined behaviour? < 1164413709 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1164413722 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and failing that, they'd load up Nethack < 1164413740 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's mentioned here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Undefined_behavior < 1164414904 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf61f7.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1164416036 0 :ivan`!i=ivan@wikipedia/ivan JOIN :#esoteric < 1164417987 0 :GreaseMonkey!n=thematri@222-152-165-185.jetstream.xtra.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric < 1164418739 0 :tgwizard!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1164419993 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1164419999 0 :Azstal!n=asztal@cpc1-stkn2-0-0-cust919.midd.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1164420002 0 :Azstal!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Asztal < 1164420228 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1164420234 0 :Azstal!n=asztal@cpc1-stkn2-0-0-cust919.midd.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1164420238 0 :Azstal!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Asztal < 1164420300 0 :ivan`!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :" Like VS.net's GUI? Then try HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-" < 1164421908 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :welcome to undernet < 1164422136 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean "ünternet"? < 1164422205 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1164422286 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like that < 1164424148 0 :Asztal!n=asztal@cpc1-stkn2-0-0-cust919.midd.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1164429323 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: What's the Java equivalent of a struct? < 1164429403 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a struct in a stupid lang < 1164429455 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1164429946 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: I'm pretty sure you'd just use a container class- just make a class that has the variables you need, possibly a constructor and (if you want to use information-hiding principles) a collection of getters/setters < 1164430035 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: Wtf are you doing programming in *java* anyway?! < 1164430050 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreaseMonkey: Cross portability, high level (moreso than C). < 1164430063 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: Well, I'd know if it was a general purpose struct, but I need to use the struct's properties of named byte fields. < 1164430088 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I basically need some sort of container for bytes that can be fed to an output port serially. < 1164430151 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrm.. well, I may have a weak understanding of the capabilities of structs (I am not a C coder), but you might be able to use chars < 1164430190 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A struct is really simple. It's a chunk of contiguous memory containing the variables of choice. < 1164430230 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :higher level, higher lag, higher filesize. < 1164430247 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and higher frustration, and higher chance of getting sacked. < 1164430250 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreaseMonkey: If this was time critical, I'd do it in C. < 1164430256 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I always thought of it as serving the same function as container classes, only less OO overhead when you don't need it < 1164430262 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a concept test, which I prefer to do in an easier environment. < 1164430325 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :struct point { int x; int y; } has a size of 2 ints (2*sizeof(int)). The way I'm using structs here though is telling a function to send a struct of size sizeof(struct blah), so that the bytes stay in order. < 1164430354 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1164430397 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is why I was initially reluctant to do this in a higher-level language, because it does get pretty low-level in places. < 1164430422 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But managing timeouts in C is a *pain*. < 1164430646 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do I have to use an array of bytes ? I wanted something named, so... < 1164430693 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, there's MOV eax,[edx+0x4C] and stuff < 1164430724 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Forth's as low as I (like to regularly) go, sorry. < 1164430852 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i still prefer C to anything else except for when it's being a pain in the ass < 1164430858 0 :calamari!n=calamari@ip72-200-73-175.tc.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1164430864 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scheme is what I prefer. < 1164430868 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1164430884 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heya. < 1164430900 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey calamari! < 1164430911 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi greasy < 1164430978 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was your old nick? hehe < 1164430982 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me=thematrixeatsyou < 1164430990 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1164430998 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1164431051 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't even believe I coded before I learned Lisp. < 1164431057 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was like, an enlightenment. < 1164431062 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :had to go to 5 stores to find a halfway decent kitchen apron for my wife, and then it was $20 < 1164431066 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: CharSequences are what I need, no? < 1164431123 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm... you mean a character array? < 1164431136 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I mean a CharSequence. < 1164431168 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems to be the low-level mechanism behind Strings. < 1164431189 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh... but it's read-only :( < 1164431198 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: MOV $2000,Razor-X; ADD $2000,UserSuggestions; MOV ($2000),LearnARealLanguage < 1164431237 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gtg food, then i'll be out < 1164431296 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"food is good, that's why i'm eating it" < 1164433557 0 :xor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha java < 1164433827 0 :CakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1164433846 0 :CakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :notCakeProphet < 1164433865 0 :xor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Am I the only one here who actually likes c? < 1164433953 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION huggles C. < 1164433997 0 :notCakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably. < 1164434006 0 :notCakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find C annoying. < 1164434008 0 :notCakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1164434028 0 :notCakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh sure it's machine efficient... but it sucks at human efficiency. < 1164434050 0 :xor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C is fun < 1164434064 0 :xor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lets you be creative < 1164434094 0 :notCakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All programming languages do that. ;) < 1164434115 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My ideal world has C as an intermediary language used by compilers. Takes a lot of strain off of writing compilers (for higher-level languages) without diminishing efficiency to any significant degree. < 1164434123 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, D is awesome. < 1164434147 0 :xor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, compiling to asm for a new language is stupid < 1164434163 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C is very nice because nothing is black-box. < 1164434170 0 :xor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1164434173 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's an easy transform from the language to machine code. < 1164434178 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can mentally compile everything. < 1164434189 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unlike Java, where EVERYTHING is black-box. < 1164434200 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(A GPL'd black box now, yes, but still fairly opaque ;) ) < 1164434267 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1164435462 0 :notCakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :CakeProphet < 1164436425 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1164436547 0 :Asztal!n=asztal@cpc1-stkn2-0-0-cust919.midd.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1164438838 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That I definitely agree with. < 1164439166 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Chatzilla 0.9.75 [IceWeasel 1.0.1b2] (kidding!)" < 1164439330 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Forth is even better though. No type checking. < 1164439381 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Want to make a character out of a cell? Forth doesen't care, it'll just use the least significant byte. < 1164439442 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Double precision integers, for example, take up two stack positions and need special words to modify. < 1164439460 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could, unwarily, use a double precision integer as two normal integers. < 1164439924 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1164441599 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1164441600 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1164449127 0 :jix!n=jix@L624f.l.strato-dslnet.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1164449917 0 :wooby!n=alan@ny-lancastercadent4g1-3a-236.buf.adelphia.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1164452025 0 :tgwizard!n=tgwizard@c-a93ee155.178-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1164456799 0 :Asztal!n=asztal@cpc1-stkn2-0-0-cust919.midd.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1164459571 0 :CakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"haaaaaaaaaa" < 1164459987 0 :tgwizard!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1164463917 0 :jix_!n=jix@L602c.l.strato-dslnet.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1164464590 0 :ihope!n=foo@c-71-205-100-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1164464962 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1164470447 0 :tgwizard!n=tgwizard@c-923fe155.178-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1164474865 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf61f7.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1164483584 0 :wooby!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1164485094 0 :meatmanek!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"User disconnected" < 1164485157 0 :meatmanek!n=meatmane@cpe-65-29-79-179.indy.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1164485165 0 :meatmanek!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1164485235 0 :meatmanek!n=meatmane@cpe-65-29-79-179.indy.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1164490563 0 :ivan`!i=ivan@wikipedia/ivan JOIN :#esoteric < 1164491309 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reads up < 1164491564 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reads down < 1164491582 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I read from left to right. < 1164491673 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I read based on a complex and ad-hoc algorithm < 1164491803 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT R READ MEANING < 1164491877 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol idot its wen u putwords in ur hed < 1164491888 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1164491888 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::--D < 1164492100 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow... I had an issue with my befunge interpreter going into an infinite loop, and it turns out that someone else's interpreter does the exact same thing < 1164492132 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Caused by a # at the edge of a program, but I'm sure it's caused by something far more sinister < 1164492139 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1164492160 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, at least it proves you aren't the first one to make that mistake < 1164492193 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's a different mistake with the same result, because theirs does it in befunge-93 mode too :) < 1164492197 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure that #'s at the edge of a program aren't defined by the standard to infinite loop? :) < 1164492206 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine is ... something to do with wrapping < 1164493304 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: Does D have a good socket library? < 1164493370 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, not the C FFI. No. No. < 1164493377 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO! NEVER! < 1164493386 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Uggh. Managing 30 structs gets tiring quickly.) < 1164493790 0 :jix_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Bitte waehlen Sie eine Beerdigungnachricht" < 1164494445 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yarr, fixed :) < 1164494462 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how my cube intersection function ever worked, but it's fixed now < 1164495842 0 :CakeProphet!n=CakeProp@h205.250.213.151.ip.alltel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1164496302 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: It has std.socketstream, which (shockingly) treats sockets as streams. Very easy to use. < 1164497101 0 :xor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this sepperation of functions and variables in common lisp is really getting on my nerves < 1164497278 0 :xor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i don't want to do (funcall x ...), i just want to do (x ...) < 1164497560 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1164497627 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love LISP too. < 1164497666 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that I've done much with it. < 1164497701 0 :xor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm reading _ai programming, case studies in lisp_ < 1164498560 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anoyone know of a language with a for-each type loop that can express zipping? I found the lack of one very irritating in C#. < 1164498600 0 :xor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha (gps '(unknown poor) '(rich famous)) < 1164498605 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, KoL has a basic test of English grammar and spelling before you are allowed to use the chat feature. < 1164498611 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is zipping? < 1164498626 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, i remember. < 1164498671 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe the ghc compiler for haskell has an extension to the list comprehension syntax called parallel, which is essentially zipping. < 1164498690 0 :xor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zip([1,2],[3,4]) == [[1,3],[2,4]], right? < 1164498708 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :roughly, yes < 1164498713 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. [(x,y) | x <- m | y <- l] = zip m l < 1164498748 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking mostly but not only of languages like Java or C#. < 1164498757 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: nice, I think. < 1164498765 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course haskell also has the zipBy high-level function. < 1164498779 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is portable. < 1164498857 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ITYM "zipWith" < 1164498865 0 :tgwizard!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1164498877 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, right. i've made that mistake before. < 1164498901 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are some other "genericized" functions that use the By suffix, i believe. < 1164498947 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sortBy e.g. < 1164498981 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They take an argument that specifies equality/comparison criteria. < 1164498984 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps python? < 1164499029 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although you could probably make one in Java. < 1164499158 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :??! < 1164499182 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are suggesting that I can *make* a new control structure in Java?