< 1154736014 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not _quite_ sure you understand yourself what you're talking about < 1154736036 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: Like I said, I'm making it up as I go right now. :p < 1154736045 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see. < 1154736054 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're just getting my thoughts on the subject right now. < 1154736069 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sucks. < 1154736075 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How so? < 1154736099 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want your thoughts, i want a spec :) < 1154736116 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh. I'm not entirely sure that's truly multidimensional code. < 1154736136 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's merely code that has a lot of ways to fork. < 1154736157 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still seems good in my head, but. . . < 1154736168 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's more of a "Brainfuck with functions" as it is, right now. < 1154736251 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the love of god, can people stop creating more brainfuck variants? < 1154736254 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's 9832478907345 already < 1154736263 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: Sorry. Thought this was interesting. < 1154736281 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not too late to abort it, though. :p < 1154736557 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has a (rather small) spec. . . < 1154736601 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.ca/115926 < 1154736767 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes AFK < 1154736840 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's all my fault, isn't it? < 1154736898 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1154736909 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit the topic is long. < 1154736914 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION just noticed < 1154736937 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1154736954 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thoughts? Comments? Accusations of stupidity? < 1154737090 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're stupid. < 1154737126 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was beginning to think that myself. < 1154737136 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems my brain and I have gone our seperate ways. < 1154737469 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could you just forget everything I've aid in the past. . . $large_amount_of_time? < 1154737518 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1154737539 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could you at least be willing to try and forgive me? < 1154737875 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I assume that'd be pending upon me doing something smart) < 1154738075 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, I've got a psuedo-smart specification on my hard drive. < 1154738084 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And no, I'm not posting it yet. < 1154738105 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to re-examine it some time when I'm not in the middle of a stupidity streak. < 1154739574 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think programming in this is going to be a bitch. < 1154739625 0 :GregorR-W!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Unlike BF, in which programming is like a cool summer breeze) < 1154740127 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Well, ][ is useless, except in making comments. < 1154740127 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Just like <>, ><, +-, and -+. < 1154740143 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I disagree. < 1154740189 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can find uses for all of the pairs of commands in the second line. < 1154740244 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many BF interpreters stop when D=0 and executing <, so <> can be thought of as "Stop if D=0; otherwise continue normally." < 1154740288 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about the others? < 1154740292 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>< can be a check to stop if no more memory is available. < 1154740329 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the case of nonwrapping-constrained interpreters, -+ can serve as a check for if an attempt to decrement zero is done. < 1154740361 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, of course, +- can be used for overflow detection in the same interpreter scenario. < 1154740395 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't find a use for ][, though, except writing comments which is useful per se. < 1154740419 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or even commenting out code. < 1154740511 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, they're all useless in BF interpreters which provide infinite tapes in both directions and allow arbitrary integers of either sign... < 1154740547 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which are not very numerous and are highly nonstandard < 1154740549 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.P < 1154740551 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1154740588 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(nonstandard for the infinite tape part) < 1154740656 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that will not stop you if you were planning a BF-tidy program :) < 1154740679 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or BF-lint < 1154740809 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have also imagined another BF variant in which ][ could be useful < 1154740884 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the number of BF variations is now 9832478907346 including mine < 1154740930 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this variant the code starts at data position -1 and goes backwards < 1154740962 0 :GregorR-W!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Chatzilla 0.9.75 [Firefox 1.5.0.2/0000000000]" < 1154741007 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the commands are in ASCII so it permits self-modification < 1154741047 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in order to manipulate instructions it may be necessary to have "dead code" in the middle of the program < 1154741100 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this would allow a BFOS, since in this way loaders could be written < 1154741160 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it wouldn't allow optimization of code and all that. < 1154741176 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, you have to live with that < 1154741215 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but some programs with unbalanced [] could even be valid < 1154741271 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. a program with an extra ] could be valid if the data area (which is also executable) has been written with a matching [ < 1154741325 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or if self-modified to match < 1154741350 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it opens a whole new world of BF power :) < 1154741373 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's an idea: an optimizing BF compiler that turns its input into some fancy type thing, then churns out something of that type, which is the compiled program. < 1154741398 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'd be hard to guarantee that each type only goes with one program, though, eh? < 1154741456 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't get the fancy type thing part < 1154741481 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like a VM BF? < 1154741788 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pgimeno: don't forget that +-, -+, <>, and >< could be useful in a self-modifying BF program as spacers, even moreso ][, which in the case of [......][.....] could be "opened up" to [............] as a simple way of extending a main loop. < 1154741848 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, interesting usage case too :) < 1154741867 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1154741968 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :off to bed, bye < 1154741978 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cya < 1154742330 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The compiler would just turn its input into some complex specification of just what the program does, then turn it into some other type of code. < 1154742576 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always thought a good tool would be a powerful preprocessor for BF that would support things like macros, variable names, etc, (vaguely like BFBASIC, perhaps), that would render out raw BF, and then a matching BF compiler that would transform the raw BF into efficient assembly. < 1154742632 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they kinda exist as seperate utilities, but if you combined the two it would be like a regular high-level language. < 1154742673 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brings to mind the old "gluing parts onto a skateboard to make a luxury car" adage. < 1154743534 0 :Arrogant!i=Scott@28.orlando-06-08rs.fl.dial-access.att.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1154743578 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION just might have his infinite dimensional Brainfuck variant specified by now. . . < 1154743667 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :show us what you've got. < 1154743700 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think ihope can attest that, right now, you *don't* want to see it. < 1154743733 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1154743740 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fair enough < 1154743757 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Give me a couple more days to make sure I'm not just on crack by mistake. :p < 1154746605 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this image speaks to me: http://i.somethingawful.com/inserts/articlepics/photoshop/08-04-06-difficulty/occamsmonkey.jpg < 1154746894 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Diiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiet Cherry Vanilla Orange Grape Lemon Lime Mint Roast Chicken Mayonnaise and Colaaaaaaaaaaaa Dr Pepper! < 1154746954 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this a bizzare chef variant? < 1154747000 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAHAHAHAHA < 1154747003 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, but it needs to be < 1154747034 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm... I see possibilities... < 1154747065 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we should design a language around your previous sentence so that it will *become* a hello world. < 1154747435 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. "Hello, World" = 12 characters. there are 12 a's in "Colaaaaaaaaaaaa", so that can be output. < 1154747458 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Diiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiet" can allocate a stack or something... < 1154747485 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then we need to get "Cherry Vanilla Orange Grape Lemon Lime Mint Roast Chicken Mayonnaise" to push data into a stack... or something... < 1154747498 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and "Dr Pepper" can be an end statement. < 1154748456 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Evil. < 1154748484 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that's kinda the idea... < 1154749784 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://nickv111.is-a-geek.com:8080/~pikhq/dimensifuck < 1154749844 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm gettin' a 404... < 1154749856 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try again. < 1154749911 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, much better. < 1154750031 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait- isn't this ultimately just a *big* three dimensional space? < 1154750045 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm? < 1154750071 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :each "dimension" is a 2d codespace. < 1154750083 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are many of these spaces, so it's 3d. < 1154750092 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh. < 1154750099 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless I misunderstand the spec... < 1154750102 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a bug in how I'm specifying the dimensions. < 1154750108 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. < 1154750113 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need a good damned way of doing it. < 1154750133 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use dimensions like a tree structure. < 1154750147 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine a cubical arrangement of cells. < 1154750161 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now imagine a line of these cubes- that's time. < 1154750164 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(4d) < 1154750183 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now imagine a whole series of these lines. that's 5d < 1154750190 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1154750194 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That makes sense. < 1154750210 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good. I'm glad I could describe it. < 1154750211 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then a set of those series is 6d. . . And so on. < 1154750225 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just imagine panning back infinitely. < 1154750243 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, to actually store this as a data structure, you'll need a treelike system. < 1154750273 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :problem is, you'd have to define it bottom-up, which makes things difficult. < 1154750273 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd prefer a way of representing it in simple ASCII. < 1154750407 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1154750461 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think there's a simple way to represent xD code that is at the same time clear. < 1154750478 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could just store *data* in an xD space... < 1154750594 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe express it as follows: 2D piece 1, 3D piece 4, 4D piece 3. . . etc.? < 1154750600 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh. idea- add a command that sets you to a random "dimensional index"... < 1154750639 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would define dimensions like ip addresses- x.y.z.a?.b?... < 1154750656 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. That's a good idea. < 1154750662 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Easier to parse. < 1154750755 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.codu.org/dcvogllmrcmcdp.ogg < 1154750773 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want to define your code that way, you can preface each command with an address like that- sorta like BASIC line-numbers. < 1154750868 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That could work. < 1154750888 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What'd be nice is a program to allow easy editing of code like this. ;) < 1154750912 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: it's all clear now! < 1154750924 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is? < 1154750949 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've got a new spec up. < 1154750959 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION perceives the meaning of gregor's enigmatic food-related statement! < 1154750960 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try it, and see if that's a less sucky version. < 1154750974 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry. Need to copy to public_html. < 1154750988 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, that first section is my voice unedited. Yeah, my voice sucks. < 1154751058 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've heard much, much worse. < 1154751061 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There. < 1154751085 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or not. < 1154751104 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made edits, and they disappeared. < 1154751121 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Crap, I screwed it up .... I didn't say "lemon lime" in the "small print" < 1154751147 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuxxor. < 1154751373 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now? < 1154751408 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The spec could use refining, I know, but I believe now it should at least be actually infinite-dimensional in nature. . . < 1154751495 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it actually is correct, then I dare someone to write an interpreter or compiler for it. :p < 1154751564 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION demands a credit line for fundamental underlying concepts of dimensifuck. < 1154751606 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION demands the same < 1154751675 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just getting your head around it is a challenge. Specifying a language in it is making me near-insane. < 1154751705 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the fact that I'm not even sure if any of it makes any sense at all isn't helping. < 1154751746 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just be sure to include my name somewhere in the Esolang article when you create it. < 1154751770 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I intend to. < 1154751792 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Along with Nick, for a) giving me the idea and b) trying to convert my scratchings into a proper LaTeX spec. < 1154751821 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :w00t. < 1154751837 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LaTeX ftw! < 1154751860 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd do it, but I'm not entirely capable of figuring out what I mean at the moment, so. . . < 1154751981 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at one point, I knew some LaTeX... < 1154752018 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly just math markup, though. < 1154752095 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There, that should be a bit more clear. < 1154752136 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry. Need to fix it. < 1154752151 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My explanation of the example code, mostly. < 1154752199 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*There*. < 1154752273 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION waits for the inevitable accusations of stupidity/insanity < 1154752464 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION just realised one thing that it needs < 1154752475 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You think maybe I could use a way to end the program? < 1154752485 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. < 1154752495 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :programs that end are easier to write interpreters for. < 1154752509 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"X", perhaps? < 1154752515 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1154752526 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or "E", to avoid clashing with braintwist. < 1154752576 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It already clashes with Braintwist. :p < 1154752637 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, at least I know my language is Turing complete, via a trivial isomorphism with Brainfuck. ;p < 1154752700 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just do: 1.1 *brainfuck code here*X < 1154752702 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Voila. < 1154752715 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bingo < 1154752760 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any Brainfuck coder can write for Dimensibrain. Just not every Brainfuck coder can use the dimensional features. ;) < 1154752779 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh. s/ibrain/ifuck/ < 1154752788 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION needs to get the name right, at least. < 1154752791 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Argh. s/ibrain/ifuck/ < 1154752795 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your know quote for life. < 1154752804 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1154752806 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brillaint < 1154752836 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ notice the clever combination of "Brillaint" and "ain't" (which is not a word) < 1154752849 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now. . . Do you think that it's now actually validly multi-dimensional, and *gasp* makes sense? < 1154752854 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ notice the un-clever failure to spell. < 1154752870 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: to a reasonable degree. < 1154752906 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION notices an issue. . . < 1154752925 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION prepares to resolve an issue. < 1154752985 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Care to inform? < 1154753026 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to *tell* me the issue before I can solve it, unless you want me to make shit up. < 1154753052 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just that ^ and v ended up doing the opposite of what they'd appear to do. < 1154753067 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Err. . . < 1154753073 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's just an issue with my example code. < 1154753076 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hang on. < 1154753082 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okie-dokie, < 1154753085 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION needs to stop coding when he's this irrational. < 1154753089 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds acceptable. < 1154753288 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*There*, the example code should now actually fit the language. < 1154753336 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an excellent way to start a spec. < 1154753343 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1154753367 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's actually a language that makes some sense now, I believe. < 1154753377 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it only took me a few hours to get there. :p < 1154753426 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d'you know that gasoline smell? Smells like... victory! < 1154753441 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION loves the smell of esolang napalm in the morning. < 1154753451 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION runs s/three/five/ on his spec < 1154753454 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at 11:50 at night, as the case may be. < 1154753607 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe this can be called "masochism at work" now. < 1154753620 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION dares anyone to implement it < 1154753768 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what would such a madman win? < 1154753880 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a small portion of your immortal soul? < 1154753895 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$2.67? < 1154753912 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the respect and admiration of your peers? < 1154753956 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Proof of madness. < 1154753973 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. like a certificate? < 1154753980 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1154754088 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A certificate which is written in Dimensifuck. < 1154754237 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"In a moment, pikhq is going to step into another dimension. A dimension not only of sight and sound, but of the mind. There's a signpost up ahead- he has entered... The Dimensifuck Zone..." < 1154754245 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LMAO < 1154754362 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm glad I stumbled across this channel a few days ago- I feel so at home. :) < 1154754384 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1154754474 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been learning about esolangs as a hobby for years now- little did I know there was a community of madmen (and madwomen) just like me RIGHT BELOW MY NOSE < 1154754508 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1154754550 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION dances joyfully < 1154754768 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1.1 ^.,v < 1154755033 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just be glad I'm not overloading the operators. :p < 1154755050 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, sweet jesus < 1154755157 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. does anyone know anything about raytracing? < 1154755237 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been thinking about the feasibility of implementing a raytracer in BFVGA, but I know nothing about raytracing other than that it's slow and looks cool. < 1154755711 0 :BigZaphod!n=sean@g1083a.resnet.uni.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1154756687 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, BigZ. < 1154756707 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't know you were into esoteric programming. < 1154756763 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Redid the spec. < 1154756785 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A friend convinced me that ^ and v should be conditional, so we can get rid of [ and ]. < 1154756841 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Nick got a nice LaTeX version. < 1154756870 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. the plot thickens. < 1154756905 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://nickv111.is-a-geek.com/~pikhq/dimensifuck.tex < 1154756948 0 :BigZaphod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: hey! I remember you. :-) < 1154756957 0 :BigZaphod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made Whirl, Cow, Taxi, and 3code. ;-) < 1154756987 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really? wow! < 1154756993 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been working on Dimensifuck with a few people. < 1154757011 0 :BigZaphod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :been quite awhile since I've been in that world, though. :-) < 1154757025 0 :BigZaphod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I'm just popping off to play a game with the wife for a spell. be back later. ;-) < 1154757032 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cya < 1154757070 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://nickv111.is-a-geek.com:8080/~pikhq/dimensifuck.tex < 1154757079 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry. < 1154757124 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very nicely formatted. < 1154757138 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I notice you adapted my explanation. < 1154757153 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, that happened by chance. < 1154757158 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He didn't hear any of that. < 1154757166 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION didn't right that; my friend Nick did < 1154757179 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1154757180 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/right/write < 1154757186 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one thing- I < 1154757195 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh. This has been a very bad day for me. Can't seem to think at all. < 1154757200 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure it's "Epsilon", not "Upsilon" < 1154757209 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless he was being punny. < 1154757231 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Him? Probably being punny. < 1154757237 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reappears. < 1154757273 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :howdy, GregorR. < 1154757280 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's serious, and begs to differ with you. < 1154757309 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dot dot dot. < 1154757313 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upsilon < 1154757321 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epsilon < 1154757331 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We're both right, it would appear. :/ < 1154757354 0 :nickv111!n=nick@70-33-45-234.clspco.adelphia.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1154757359 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am Alpha and Omega. And that guy is Epsilon. < 1154757359 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1154757370 0 :nickv111!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi < 1154757384 0 :nickv111!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um, pikhq tells me you guys don't think Upsilon is a Greek letter, or something of the like < 1154757385 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume that you, nickv111, are the guy assisting pikhq with his esolang. < 1154757388 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nickv111: RodgerTheGreat just found out you're both right. < 1154757399 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[12:54am] RodgerTheGreat: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upsilon < 1154757399 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[12:54am] RodgerTheGreat: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epsilon < 1154757399 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[12:55am] RodgerTheGreat: We're both right, it would appear. :/ < 1154757408 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1154757424 0 :nickv111!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, I said specifically to pikhq, "If you look up greek letters, Upsilon is definitely a greek letter < 1154757427 0 :nickv111!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:55 < 1154757430 0 :nickv111!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So is Epsilon < 1154757432 0 :nickv111!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:55 < 1154757434 0 :nickv111!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both of them are definitely greek letters" < 1154757437 0 :nickv111!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, I said both of them were definitely greek letters. < 1154757441 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah- he didn't convey that to me in it's entirety. < 1154757468 0 :nickv111!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I never said that Epsilon isn't a greek letter. I said that Epsilon and Upsilon are two completely separate letters < 1154757473 0 :nickv111!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just wanted to clear that up ;) < 1154757475 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't see that when I said "He's serious, and begs to differ with you.". < 1154757503 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:54. < 1154757507 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's all cool. < 1154757513 0 :nickv111!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh < 1154757536 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nickv111: So, would you agree with me that anyone who implements this is quite probably insane? < 1154757541 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interestingly, it appears nick and I came up with similar explanations for multiple dimensions independently. < 1154757639 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1154757640 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[10:55pm] RodgerTheGreat: use dimensions like a tree structure. < 1154757640 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[10:55pm] RodgerTheGreat: imagine a cubical arrangement of cells. < 1154757641 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[10:55pm] RodgerTheGreat: now imagine a line of these cubes- that's time. < 1154757641 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[10:55pm] RodgerTheGreat: (4d) < 1154757643 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[10:56pm] RodgerTheGreat: now imagine a whole series of these lines. that's 5d < 1154757645 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[10:56pm] pikhq: Ah. < 1154757648 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[10:56pm] pikhq: That makes sense. < 1154757651 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[10:56pm] RodgerTheGreat: good. I'm glad I could describe it. < 1154757653 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[10:56pm] pikhq: Then a set of those series is 6d. . . And so on. < 1154757656 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[10:56pm] RodgerTheGreat: just imagine panning back infinitely. < 1154757658 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[10:57pm] RodgerTheGreat: now, to actually store this as a data structure, you'll need a treelike system. < 1154757934 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I'm going to get some sleep. Good night, everyone. < 1154757952 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1154760293 0 :nickv111!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Lost terminal" < 1154762534 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :co'o < 1154762600 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Ex-Chat" < 1154762841 0 :Arrogant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1154763166 0 :_jol_!n=_@c5850-a3-2-62-147-23-73.dial.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1154763543 0 :bsmntbombdood_!n=gavin@unaffiliated/bsmntbombdood JOIN :#esoteric < 1154763559 0 :bsmntbombdood_!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1154764715 0 :Arrogant!n=scotty@242.orlando-06-08rs.fl.dial-access.att.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1154764799 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1154764800 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1154766257 0 :_jol_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1154766677 0 :CXI!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) < 1154766705 0 :CXI!i=Sanity@dialup-72.89.221.203.acc50-kent-syd.comindico.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1154769957 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :bsmntbombdood_ < 1154769972 0 :bsmntbombdood_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :bsmntbombdood < 1154770167 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :bsmntbombdood__ < 1154770207 0 :bsmntbombdood__!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :bsmntbombdood < 1154771364 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"sleeping" < 1154781332 0 :Arrogant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1154790122 0 :RodgerTheGreat!n=RodgerTh@c-68-41-14-137.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1154790135 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good morning. < 1154790909 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ello. < 1154791038 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi, ihope_. < 1154791352 0 :_jol_!n=_@c5850-a3-2-62-147-23-182.dial.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1154792766 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl < 1154794269 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Morning. < 1154794395 0 :_jol_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1154794624 0 :smokecfh!n=user@53549344.cable.casema.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1154795992 0 :_jol_!n=_@c5850-a3-2-62-147-21-40.dial.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1154797393 0 :_jol_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1154797699 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1154797754 0 :smokecfh!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1154797938 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if someone's going to be crazy enough to implement Dimensifuck < 1154797998 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno... I might try it in Java at some point, but my OOP-fu is weak < 1154798040 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One condition: try and make it work with GCJ, please. < 1154798051 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION doesn't like having non-free software around. . . < 1154798060 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :creating the data structure necessary for storing code is gonna be a bitch. < 1154798083 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION doesn't care, because JVM is bundled with his OS. < 1154798106 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it should just end up being a simple CLI app, so it should work with GCJ. . . < 1154798115 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most likely. < 1154798132 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION also likes the ability to compile the Java bytecode to a native binary. ;) < 1154798139 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have access to a shell on a machine with GCJ so I ought to be able to test it out. < 1154798145 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :K. < 1154798191 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java is really pretty fast, dude- a properly coded app can achieve 60-70% the speed of C, and it's actually portable. Take a look at JAKE, for example. < 1154798262 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, yeah, yeah. . . < 1154798271 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION codes in Tcl, not C, anyways. ;) < 1154798327 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C has it's place (coding drivers, for example), but I think it's inconvenient for most of my purposes. < 1154798349 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've done most of my recent coding work in PHP, actually. < 1154798359 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm... < 1154798374 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y'know, I might try making an online interpreter. < 1154798390 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think *Java* is inconvenient for most purposes. < 1154798441 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Combines the ease of use of C++ with the speed of running your code in an emulator. < 1154798451 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :textedit -> javac -> java. No screwing around with preprocessors, makefiles or compiler flags. < 1154798499 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then I'll run gcj on the Java bytecode when I get it, so I have a native binary. < 1154798568 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mostly for simplicity of execution; using gij to execute it takes a little bit more typing. < 1154800486 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl < 1154801217 0 :CXI!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) < 1154801244 0 :CXI!i=Sanity@dialup-72.89.221.203.acc50-kent-syd.comindico.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1154802017 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1154802023 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello, CXI < 1154804061 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :RodgerTheAfk < 1154804512 0 :smokecfh!n=user@53549344.cable.casema.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1154805928 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@unaffiliated/bsmntbombdood JOIN :#esoteric < 1154806843 0 :_jol_!n=_@c5850-a3-2-62-147-23-153.dial.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1154807679 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugggh. I can't stand C. < 1154807717 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Java *isn't* fast. < 1154807718 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P. < 1154807733 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially on older machines. < 1154807795 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: got some benchmark? < 1154807836 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lindi-: Not offhand, no. < 1154807847 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not as much speed as it eats up memory like the devil. < 1154807859 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially on a box with only 256 MB of RAM. < 1154807874 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends on the program i guess < 1154807893 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even something small like jMemorize takes up almost as much memory as an Opera session with 40 tabs. < 1154807936 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java and GTK2 are the two biggest memory hogs for Linux. GTK2 is improving, but I can't see Java improving. < 1154807968 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not unless you use the OSS VMs, which require GNU Classpath for the most part, which relies on a bunch of stupid Gnome dependancies that I don't want to deal with. < 1154808039 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: gnu classpath has QT4 peers < 1154808050 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: and pure X peers are being planned < 1154808051 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It uses too damned much memory. And I've got 1G. . . < 1154808086 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"java.lang.reflect.InvocationTargetException at java.lang.reflect.Method.invokeNative(Native Method) at java.lang.reflect.Method.invoke(Method.java:372) at jamvm.java.lang.JarLauncher.main(JarLauncher.java:49) Caused by: java.lang.NullPointerException at jmemorize.gui.swing.CardTable.valueChanged(Unknown Source) at javax.swing.DefaultListSelectionModel.fireValueChanged(DefaultListSelectionModel.java:710) " < 1154808092 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's from jMemorize < 1154808101 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: What do you think of Dimensifuck? < 1154808113 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C = nice. C++ = horrible but usable bastardization of C. Java = horrible, weak, insulting bastardization of C++. < 1154808129 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Insulting because it treats the programmer like an idiot) < 1154808149 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Derrr, what are pointers? ME SCARED BY POINTER ARITHM...ARITH...ADDING N' STUFF! < 1154808215 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lindi-: Oh yes, QT4 is also full of annoying dependancies. I only have QT3. < 1154808228 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jeeze. . . If you're going tu use C syntax, at least be willing to use the power of pointers. < 1154808229 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends :) < 1154808245 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(They may be highly annoying at times, but they *are* powerful in the right hands) < 1154808247 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: i'm all in favor of reusing parts and not reinventing the wheel unnecessarily :) < 1154808248 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer C# over Java many times over, personally. < 1154808248 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, Qt4 has very few dependencies ... < 1154808259 0 :ChanServ!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Shutting Down < 1154808267 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: and as i said, it is possible to add new peers quite easily < 1154808274 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: Oddly enough, C# is more free then C++. ;) < 1154808280 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: I don't run any DE, or anything resembling one.... so anything that depends too heavily past GTK/GTK2 or base of QT is annoying for me. < 1154808298 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/C++/Java/ < 1154808299 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x_x < 1154808307 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hehehe. < 1154808310 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I was gonna say ... :P < 1154808317 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I know. It's really ``hit it off'' in the OSS community. < 1154808318 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Public service announcement: D. < 1154808333 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lindi-: Are there any pure GTK2 or QT3 peers? < 1154808335 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but portability is a problem with java definitely, too many programs run only on sun's class library < 1154808343 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: Which is disgusting, because as soon as it's big enough in the OSS community, M$ will drop their patent hammer. < 1154808352 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For GNU Classpath, since I wouldn't mind running Kaffee just to bear with my Java programs. < 1154808387 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: That's why Mono and are being written, no? < 1154808396 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dotgnu < 1154808403 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There we are. < 1154808413 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: You can't break copyright law without knowing it. You can break patent law without knowing it. < 1154808425 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(oversimplification) < 1154808427 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1154808440 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: there's GTK and QT4 currently < 1154808443 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes to wash l'car. < 1154808452 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Razor-X: GTK2 < 1154808455 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lindi-: But GTK depends on GConf. < 1154808459 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is :( . < 1154808496 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*the GTK version < 1154808501 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, if i can get freedom by spending some extra ram i'm all for it :) < 1154808528 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmmm? < 1154808555 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Freedom shouldn't come at the cost of the means of production. < 1154808565 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Shameless Marx reference.) < 1154808677 0 :ChanServ!ChanServ@services. JOIN :#esoteric < 1154808677 0 :irc.freenode.net!unknown@unknown.invalid MODE #esoteric :+o ChanServ < 1154811239 0 :_jol_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"co'o rodo" < 1154812546 0 :smokecfh!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1154817965 0 :RodgerTheGreat!n=rodger@208.64.37.45 JOIN :#esoteric < 1154817970 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1154818238 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello. < 1154818325 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any interesting recent developments? < 1154818502 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing. < 1154819053 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. < 1154819170 0 :ihope__!n=foo@c-71-205-100-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1154819178 0 :ihope__!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ihope < 1154819663 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ihope: I think you'll be glad to hear that my infinite dimensional Brainfuck variant is now in the realms of sanity. < 1154820145 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what makes you say that? < 1154820177 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1154820233 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The last time he saw it, I think, it wasn't even ooD. < 1154820237 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was more like 3D. < 1154820248 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION was highly confused then < 1154820248 0 :RodgerTh1Great!n=RodgerTh@c-68-41-14-137.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1154820284 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, now dimensions are defined quite a bit differently. < 1154820319 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last spec I saw defined "dimension indices" in a format a bit like an IP. < 1154820376 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is how it still works. < 1154820401 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Really hasn't changed much since late last night. < 1154820512 0 :RodgerTheAfk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1154820535 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm.