00:00:15 I've reached the 40s in nethack with only one key. 00:00:18 i died as a knight in the first few moves because i fall from my horse 2 times 00:00:35 THats sad 00:03:16 i want to write a roquelike in asm 00:03:27 preferable some old cpu 00:04:10 Older the better 00:04:37 1802 is infinite cool 00:04:43 it's from like 1976 00:05:23 but i don't know a computer based on it that is roquelike-able 00:06:03 Hmm, yeah, that could be an issue 00:06:18 the voyager uses 1802 cpus 00:06:28 (the space thing...) 00:06:51 the NASA asked me for a cpu and i told them a random number... 00:08:32 * jix searches a computer at http://emulation.net/ 00:10:37 maybe i should use a 6502 cpu based computer 00:11:36 maybe i shouldn't start writing that because i won't finish that anyway 00:12:07 Might be a good idea. I haven't really started any details until I finish the spec... 00:12:20 I've got one more issue to deal with, then I think I can move on to the instruction reference and be done 00:15:00 I'll spend a while writing a manual and handy printable pdf reference chart, then work on the interpreter 00:15:28 And the dev tools I mentioned earlier - file format spec (easy) and conversion utility (relatively easy) 00:16:50 i'm going to write a mandelbrot renderer in 1802 asm and then mv self bed 00:17:09 Sounds good... I think 00:17:43 but i don't get how to controll PIXIE(b/w) graphic chip... 00:18:12 it uses the 1802 data channel to direct access the memory and slow down the cpu by stealing a few cycles 00:20:30 Hmm... 00:20:40 * WildHalcyon tries to do some vague research on that 00:20:58 the tinyelf emulator for osx is pretty cool for development 00:21:19 it has a mem viewer internal state viewer execution tracer breakpoints stepping... 00:22:01 and the 1802 has a SEX instruction 00:22:05 SEt X 00:22:36 lol 00:23:18 and you often need to set x 00:23:28 so 1802 programs contain a lot of SEX 00:23:45 hmm... never seen a chip that needs to be rated M 00:23:50 and even the voyager space thing has a lot of SEX 00:24:17 * WildHalcyon lacks an OSX machine 00:24:29 WildHalcyon: buy one 00:24:33 what about designing a SEX Programming Language 00:25:02 EOF -> orgasm or something 00:25:22 i may be kicked 00:25:40 Jix: Once I pay off my $70K student loans 00:26:01 my machine is 5 or 6 years old... 00:26:25 * WildHalcyon votes not to kick Gs30ng, provided he mentions John Holmes in the contributers section of his spec for the lang 00:26:51 i did some upgrades on it and it's still pretty fast 00:27:18 First order of business is to get a new linux box 00:27:22 who is John Holmes 00:27:47 An actor from the 70s 00:28:00 John Holmes, Porn Star 00:28:21 google is your friend 00:28:23 He's fairly famous, and slightly esoteric, but not really. 00:39:46 BF->Sex translation (for encoding possibly illegal algorithms when your only means of production is porn): + = standard missionary vaginal sex, - = standard doggy-style anal sex, < = woman-on-man oral, > = man-on-woman oral, [ = 69ing, ] = anything kinky ;), ',' = female orgasm, '.' = male orgasm 00:40:40 Now, for DeCSS encoded as sex :P 00:41:43 Does the program cause an error if . comes before , ? 00:42:10 That sounded cleaner in my head. I apologize 00:42:53 It's purely a method of encoding BF, all quirks of BF apply. 00:43:10 you don't have to translate BF... BF is already sex. like, brainF*CK. 00:43:18 Heheh 00:47:29 ok reboot in windows 00:47:36 -!- Gs30ng has quit ("to reboot in windows"). 00:59:26 -!- Gs30ng has joined. 00:59:50 i got the pixie to display a fixed mem position without interrupts.. 00:59:59 i'd like to do it with interrupts 01:00:03 ... yay? 01:00:07 oh 01:00:09 hmmm 01:03:17 and the up down resolution of the PIXIE is higher than i thought 01:03:27 most programs downsample it using tricky timing 01:03:48 and my programm is destruktive.. it destroys itself 01:03:53 by zeroing the first byte 01:04:01 and 0 == idle == halt cpu until interrupt 01:05:07 the updown resolutine is like 3x leftright resolution 01:06:36 gn8 01:07:50 What are the resolutions? 01:08:13 i didn't count the pixels 01:08:16 * jix is searching a spec 01:08:46 64 pixels in a line 01:09:27 128 lines 01:09:41 Thats fairly small. You'd be hard pressed to write a reliable roguelike on that 01:10:06 the odd thing is that it is for tv output but tvs have more ppl than lines 01:10:13 ppl is a tla for pixels per line 01:11:01 got it 01:11:18 tla is a tla for three letter acronym 01:11:24 Well... it makes some sense, if they're trying to get square output 01:11:39 square output? 01:12:23 the pixels are like dashes 01:12:29 not like dots/squares 01:12:37 the other way around it'd make sense 01:13:14 I suppose because conventional pixels aren't square, they're rectangular as well 01:14:14 but conventional pixels are supposed to be 1:1 like not 1:3.. 1:1.n is ok but 1:3... 01:15:55 Well, I can confidently claim that I have no idea why they did that 01:18:08 hehe 01:18:09 gn8 01:18:14 -!- jix has quit ("Bitte waehlen Sie eine Beerdigungnachricht"). 01:57:53 conventional pixels aren't 1:1, are they? 01:58:20 I dont think they are... 01:59:43 PAL uses a square ratio 02:00:20 NTSC doesnt 02:00:59 NTSC uses 1.23 02:53:57 ............ 02:54:06 I didn't think PAL was square .... 02:54:18 Not that I have any reason to think either way :P 02:55:16 Furthermore, televisions don't have horizontal pixels per se. 02:56:06 -!- calamari has joined. 02:56:12 hi 02:56:19 I was just looking at the site 02:56:20 They have a fixed number of scanlines (480 in NTSC if I remember right) with non-discrete content. 02:56:22 Hey! 02:56:26 You two can help me! 02:56:30 Oh no. 02:56:31 ;) 02:56:50 * calamari hides 02:57:13 Im taking a break from my REAL esolang to work on one that is more or less just a shell of an idea. 02:57:16 come in here! ----> +[] ;) 02:57:31 Is it a party? 02:57:45 * WildHalcyon wears a funny hat 02:57:57 it's liek the hotel california.. you can enter but never leave ... 02:58:10 * GregorR wears a black top-hat. 02:58:36 hmmm... I suppose, but thats only IF you believe the eagles. I personally think they were a bunch of lying bastards. 02:58:40 * calamari doesn't generally wear hats.. 02:58:54 which is weird because it's so sunny here in AZ 02:59:32 WildHalcyon: sorry.. bf joke.. hehehe, 02:59:44 So, I discovered the beauty of balanced ternary arithmetic 02:59:55 No, I get it ;-) 03:00:01 * WildHalcyon knows some BF 03:00:50 ooh, you called it ternary istead of trinary.. coolness.. what's up? 03:01:30 Now Im trying to implement an esolang with {-,0,+} with the + representing angels, and - represent demons, and the language motto is: "The ultimate battle between good & evil is now turing complete!" 03:02:20 I thought about implementing a 2D terrain map, with little roads that the armies of men could take to travel between cities (operators)... but Im not quite sure where to go from there, or even if I should go anywhere with this 03:02:26 what's 0.. luke-warm? 03:02:42 I suppose, 0 would be neutral, like.. um... purgatory 03:02:46 or Earth, even. 03:03:09 sounds interesting 03:03:20 that'd be cool 03:03:23 Essentially, each variable is an army, with the individual trits representing good/neutral/evil souls within the army 03:03:30 especially once I get my 3-d graphics card working again 03:05:57 * calamari has been messing around with particles and gravity.. still working out how to do the math 03:06:12 I have an idea, just can't seem to make the final connections 03:06:55 Thats where Im at with my normal esolang, which is much less esoteric, much more practical 03:06:58 F=G*m1*m2/r^2, resulting force = sum of force vectors acting on the object 03:07:18 Right? 03:08:11 oh wait.. tan angle = opp / adj, iirc 03:08:42 yep.. figured it out then :) 03:08:55 yup 03:09:02 Oh, hmm... alright 03:09:19 been too long since physics class 03:09:54 I vaguely remember physics, with my hippie professor. Man, that was crazy 03:20:58 -!- int-e has joined. 04:15:41 -!- Gs30ng has quit ("SKYIRC Ver Pro http://cafe.naver.com/skyirc.cafe #skyirc"). 04:47:04 -!- calamari_ has joined. 04:50:44 Hmm 04:50:53 well.. welcome back doppelganger 04:51:10 hi WildHalcyon :) 04:51:19 Ive been reading some slashdot on ternary computing. Man... they get defensive! 04:51:51 * calamari_ has particles wiggling around (no physics yet, random walk) but some kind of bug makes it reset or something every few seconds 04:52:16 So... what exactly does it... ermm.. what is it supposed to do? 04:52:21 wonder if the garbage collector is doing it 04:52:42 I wanted to apply gravity forces to the particles and see what happened 04:53:04 just simple curiousity 04:53:39 So, you have several particles, and they're all under gravitational forces from one another, correct? 04:54:21 not yet.. but yeah 04:54:30 so initially they have 0 velocity and 0 accel 04:54:33 I hate GC 04:55:23 but as the forces are applies they should start moving around :) 04:56:06 I was thinking that if two particles collided I would make it an inelastic collision 04:56:25 then the new mass would be the sum of the two old masses 04:56:35 It should, unless you're providing some kind of repelling force 04:57:14 anyhow.. it's weird that it is doing this resetting thing 04:57:48 What do you mean by "resetting" ? 04:58:40 the dots will be wiggling around, then all the sudden they will all be in totally different places and there will be less of them 04:59:05 Oh.. yeah, thats resettin' all right 04:59:17 Is there some kind of counter overflow? 04:59:47 hmm interesting.. doesn't seem to happen if I Thread.sleep() with a high enough value 05:01:04 Anyhow, Ive got class tomorrow, so Im outta here for the night ;-) 05:01:05 not really using counters.. using an iterator to go through the particles 05:01:10 cya WildHalcyon 05:01:18 later! 05:01:24 -!- WildHalcyon has left (?). 05:03:12 hahahaha.. I know what's wrong.. dumb dumb dumb 05:03:45 not thread safe :) 05:11:00 -!- calamari has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 05:46:27 -!- int-e has quit ("Bye!"). 07:48:15 -!- WildHalcyon has joined. 07:48:31 Anyone still up? I ended up doing the non-sleep thing 07:50:55 hi 07:50:59 Hey! 07:51:06 what about class? 07:51:23 I know.. 07:52:11 I have a problem with insomnia occassionally. I tend to think too much, or something. 07:52:15 * WildHalcyon is thinking 07:53:07 I have a similar problem if I go to bed just after programming something 07:53:41 I mgiht sleep, but badly.. usually filled with "nightmares" such as trying to figure something complicated out but never being able to 07:54:00 or having to remember something 07:54:06 lol, programming nightmares? That sounds like... hmm.. programming 07:54:14 (which never seems to be useful once I wake up) 07:55:00 reading slashdot or sites like imdb usually seems to cure it 07:57:23 found a neat linux program called planets.. better than the program I was hoping to write 07:57:36 well, there we go! 07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended). 08:00:00 -!- clog has joined. 08:02:06 I finished the prelim spec on my language: http://www4.ncsu.edu/~bcthomp2/CRAWL.txt 08:02:13 its in alpha development :-D 08:03:45 what class did you have? 08:04:39 Genetics, not a terribly difficult class 08:05:02 But I should probably show up in the hopes of getting a karmic reward or something 08:23:04 Alright, Im gonna give sleep another go 08:23:17 -!- WildHalcyon has left (?). 08:26:48 -!- calamari has joined. 08:26:53 re 08:46:11 -!- calamari_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 08:55:07 -!- calamari has quit ("Leaving"). 10:18:47 -!- kipple has joined. 11:50:26 -!- jix has joined. 11:50:52 moin moin 13:52:59 -!- int-e has joined. 14:29:23 moin int-e 14:29:29 Hi 14:29:45 bbl 15:07:40 /back 15:07:50 GregorR: ping 15:52:38 -!- WildHalcyon has joined. 16:18:46 -!- Kmkr has joined. 16:18:53 'ello 16:19:25 can anyone summary the past days logs in few words? 16:38:27 mostly harmless. 16:41:08 ah 16:41:10 :) 16:45:57 -!- cpressey has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 16:46:28 hmmm this CRAWL seems interesting 16:48:48 * GregorR stumbles across the desert, bleeding from the ping wound through his shoulder. 16:49:11 * GregorR collapses, no longer able to stay conscious because of blood lost from his ping wound. 16:49:26 hrhr 16:49:41 hi 16:50:43 Hmm, jix has a vowel in the name but none in the message, Kmkr has a vowel in the message but none in the name :P 16:52:25 NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!! 16:52:37 it can't be coincidence 16:55:21 grh.. no time to do anything.. back to reading.. 16:55:42 * Kmkr 's head explodes. 16:55:45 -!- Kmkr has quit ("I've seen this déjà vu before.."). 16:56:03 his head exploded. 17:10:34 These things happen *shrugs* 17:42:07 -!- cpressey has joined. 18:11:40 -!- Gs30ng has joined. 18:13:32 -!- Keymaker has joined. 18:14:20 back again.. enough of reading :p 18:18:58 well, your head exploded 18:19:15 yes 18:19:27 that's a good point to stop reading ;) 18:19:34 ah 18:33:32 that's why we need multiple head 18:33:36 democracy or something 18:33:56 hehe 18:49:11 mh 18:50:24 [insert several angry animal voices here] 19:40:51 [insert several happy animal voices here] 19:46:40 lol 19:46:52 [insert several in-heat animal voices here] 19:48:12 aarhhg z] 20:01:56 bye 20:02:12 -!- Keymaker has left (?). 20:34:57 HURRAH FOR ALL THE ESOLANG!!!!!! 20:39:01 -!- cpressey has quit ("Lost terminal"). 20:40:36 -!- cpressey has joined. 20:51:45 -!- cpressey has quit ("Lost terminal"). 20:53:08 -!- cpressey has joined. 21:52:17 * GregorR hands cpressey a case of terminals, plus a few pseudoterminals and xterms. 21:52:36 haha 21:53:09 He seems to be losing them awfully fast, figured he could use them more than I could *shrugs* 21:53:12 * int-e hopes GregorR left a hole for pizza delivery 21:54:06 * Gs30ng is now stuck in it 21:56:52 i think that terminal means some kind of examination and cpressey lost it, like, failed or something 21:57:28 GregorR would rather give him some advice to be a copycat rather than more terminals 22:06:11 thank you, GregorR. 22:06:20 it could have been worse... my connection could be been refused by peer 22:06:36 or, perish the thought, there might have been no route to host 22:08:37 -!- {^Raven^} has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 22:09:26 -!- {^Raven^} has joined. 22:10:27 or, in the worst case imaginable, your client could have quit 22:10:57 or NASA guys again 22:15:40 -!- calamari has joined. 22:15:48 hi 22:15:56 moin calamari 22:17:05 i always feel a bit weird when i see that moin of jix... in my hometown language moin means 'grouped' or 'congregated' 22:17:15 so it goes 'grouped calamari' 22:17:33 in my language moin means "I hope you die" 22:18:56 lament: lol 22:18:57 hi jix, grouped Gs30ng :) 22:19:07 moin lament ;) 22:19:30 lol 22:22:14 afk 22:22:20 GregorR: how's your mud going? 22:24:43 he's doing a game too? 22:24:59 he's designing an engine 22:25:11 mud engine, i heard 22:25:29 unfortunately not in esolang 22:25:35 calamari: yes but not for the contests afaik 22:25:36 but in C++ 22:25:38 was just about to ask... :) 22:26:04 again, what kind of terminal did you lose, cpressey? a token? a literal? did you ever lose a non-terminal? 22:26:12 calamari: i need some weird computer for writing a textadv for it 22:26:23 and when i say weird i mean REALLY weird 22:26:37 jix: abacus? 22:26:41 maybe cosmac elf works 22:26:48 but the screen is that lowres 22:26:58 64x128 (yes 68x 128y) 22:27:11 and on a real tv screen it doesn't show the full area afaik 22:27:26 ;) http://lilly.csoft.net/~jeffryj/images/misc/bfcomp.jpg 22:27:28 and i don't know what part of the area is displayed 22:27:37 hrhr 22:28:09 where's the space to insert the code 22:28:09 oh that's not lowres; ZX-81 had 64x44 22:28:26 pgimeno: pixel in bw? 22:28:28 has, even (I have one handy) 22:28:31 yep 22:28:36 wow 22:28:47 ok tiny elf has to work 22:28:55 I can't remember what channel f had 22:28:55 it's actually a semi-graphic character (the screen is 32x22) 22:29:14 the good thing 1802 asm is really short 22:29:44 128x64.. wow.. advanced :) 22:29:47 all instructions are 1 byte (but may take a 1byte value/adress or 2 byte adress) 22:29:54 calamari: wait 22:29:58 64x128 22:30:10 that's really stupid that its 64x128 instead of 128x64 22:30:39 the thing about the channel f is that the games looked and sounded pretty bad.. but they were fun! 22:30:45 then it's pretty much the same as Z80, except the Z80 has some prefixes to extend the instruction set 22:31:08 pgimeno: but z80 has not 16 16bit registers 22:31:28 oh and whenever you play one of GregorR's muds never type pwnd.. that kill's you 22:31:28 indeed, it has just 9 IIRC 22:31:43 and the z80 can't use ANY of them as IP 22:32:26 right (oh well, I didn't count PC, IR, AF or AF') 22:32:33 and the z80 isn't in the voyager (satellite ) 22:32:43 i didn't count the 8bit accumulator 22:32:47 but it's in the good ol' Speccy :P 22:32:50 and the 4bit X and P register 22:32:58 and the 8 bit T register 22:32:58 maybe your own computer out of transistors 22:33:07 calamari: thought about that 22:33:20 4bit registers? funny 22:33:21 but i'd prefer a fpga it's easier.. 22:33:27 pgimeno: they are register pointers 22:33:28 that DOES make it superior 22:33:37 they point to one of the 16 16bit registers 22:33:43 P points to the IP 22:34:02 and X points to the register used for memory addressing for many instructions 22:34:16 and you can set X using the SEt X instruction .. short: SEX 22:34:32 yeah, I've read it in the backlog :) 22:34:37 I once programmed an asm that had the SEX instr 22:34:55 it was pretty nice.. had 16 registers r0 to r15 22:35:07 calamari: maybe it was 1802 22:35:10 can't remember the chip model 22:35:36 1802 is a cpu from the 70s 22:35:53 this was the 90's, maybe a decendant of the 1802 22:36:07 there are two decendants 22:36:19 and they were 70s too i think 22:36:33 they weren't very popular.. 22:36:39 but they are COOL 22:36:39 the only reason to use a chip that old is if it was cheap 22:36:54 it was cheap to that time too 22:37:11 the cosmac elf was a build it yourself computer for only 100$ 22:37:29 or you can build a cpu from other logic chips 22:37:29 altair cost like 1000$ afaik 22:38:15 many phone line powered devices used? the 1802 22:38:36 because it has no minimum frequency and could work slow but without consuming much power 22:38:44 cool 22:38:52 and they were manufactured silicon on sapphire too 22:39:06 (thats why they used it in satellites) 22:39:14 that'd be perfect for the whole programmable watch thing 22:39:33 maybe they are too slow 22:39:49 can't be THAT slow 22:39:51 and with today technologies it would be possible to design a low power cpu that is much faster than the 1802 22:40:00 calamari: you have to slow it down to safe power 22:40:04 can fpga's be low power? 22:40:12 calamari: don't think so 22:40:54 they need more gates for simulating a gates => they need more power 22:41:07 and they are bigger than normal ICs 22:41:15 and i know how they work 22:41:21 they use LUTs for EVERYTHING 22:41:37 that's why it's inefficient to design a fpga logic gate by gate 22:41:48 verylog => 4bit LUTs is more efficient 22:41:52 or VHDL 22:43:05 * jix is writing a 1802 assembler because the one he has SUCKS 22:43:28 isn't there a table-driven assembler for Linux? 22:43:33 like TASM for DOS 22:43:36 hmm just reading about the 1802.. couldn't have been my old cpu, as I remember being able to call subroutines 22:43:56 pgimeno: there's tasm for linux too 22:43:58 calamari: you can call subroutines just branch to them using another IP 22:44:01 oh, nice 22:44:07 and return by using the old IP 22:44:21 yeah, I have the registered version of tasm and the guy is still supporting it 22:44:50 ah, no wonder it's not in Debian 22:45:06 yeah, it's shareware.. 22:45:56 I use it for 6502 22:46:07 i use cc65 for 6502 comes with an asm 22:46:12 i don't use it 22:46:14 but i have it installed 22:46:32 jix: you said x86 asm was ugly? 22:46:39 pgimeno: imo it is 22:46:52 that's because you haven't tried AT&T's assembler 22:46:56 i just hate ju?mp 22:46:57 assembly, even 22:47:08 i want branch not jump 22:47:44 bra 22:48:08 it's kind of weird... an inconditional jump is not a branching in the flow graph 22:48:11 actually, that instruction doesn't exist on the 6502's in the old atari's 22:48:30 calamari: branch-relative-absolute? that makes no sense 22:48:38 bra branch always 22:48:48 bla makes sense thats branch-link-absolute 22:48:50 it was a 1-byte relative branch 22:48:54 valid ppc instruction 22:49:09 I want an assembly language where the instruction that changes PC is called GOTO :P 22:49:18 pgimeno: uh 22:49:19 so instead of using 3 bytes for a jump, you could do it in 2 if it was short range 22:49:31 just to bug jix 22:49:35 i just like to write b because it's shorter than jump 22:49:47 it's jmp 22:49:52 ;) 22:49:55 int-e: b is still shorter 22:50:01 or on the 1802 br 22:50:15 calamari: br is 1 byte adressing 22:50:18 I know. And it does not matter. je is shorter than beq ;-) 22:50:34 int-e: k... 22:50:41 i just don't like jump 22:50:46 dunno why 22:50:47 the only problem of jmp is that j and m are both typed with the same finger 22:50:48 jz :) 22:50:50 that's ok. 22:51:00 jz, je, same thing. 22:51:05 pgimeno: no jmp is typed using 3 finger 22:51:13 I type it with 3 fingers 22:51:19 * calamari doesn't touch type.... 22:51:47 i dont use a this finger that key.. i just use a finger that is free and near to that key 22:51:50 probably why I'm so slow.. hunt & peck with years of experience 22:52:04 I know exactly what you're talking about. 22:52:14 it was freaky when I realized I could do it without looking 22:52:17 i never "learned" how to type i just did it 22:52:36 calamari: i started typing on keyboards in the kindergarden 22:52:44 btw, in Z80 they're jr (relative), jp (absolute) 22:53:01 afk 22:53:07 and speaking of SEX... 22:53:34 the Z80 has no SEX but has STI which is an ultra-high level instruction (that's what is left when you take the 'E' out of 'SETI') 22:53:44 usually it finds none so it just sets the interrupt flag and goes on, disappointed 22:54:04 haha 22:54:22 and it's not SeT Interrupt? 22:54:45 oh, maybe that's it and I've been wrong all this time! 22:54:53 no... 22:55:00 i don't think it's SeT Interrupt 22:55:27 that's unlikely.. i think it's the SETI thing 22:55:47 anyway it's strange because it doesn't even find me :P 22:55:58 mnemonic quiz is fun 22:56:10 a easy one: ldi 22:56:14 wbinvd 22:56:23 int-e: no idea 22:56:26 in Z80? load, increment 22:56:28 jix, z80, load index register. 22:56:31 oh 22:56:34 ikh 22:56:36 eek 22:56:44