01:09:55 -!- heatsink has joined. 01:10:54 hi heatsink 01:13:15 Hi Toreun 01:13:40 I discovered a perl obfuscator that was installed on my computer today! 01:14:25 You give it an input filename and output filename, 01:14:35 And it reads the input file and writes obfuscated perl to the output file 01:15:11 ooh, sounds... useless 01:15:13 It's called "cat" 01:15:19 LOL 01:15:24 :) 01:15:47 I don't want to try that in #perl... 01:16:57 you never know with those perl programmers 01:20:10 check out the new design I made: http://www.toreun.org/esoteric 01:20:23 it'll be customizable, I'm just making a few samples 01:20:45 this one works better in IE... not sure about Konqueror, my KDE box is currently dead, so I can't test it 01:22:22 Style 2 looks like andreou's 01:22:52 it is... well, my css'd version 01:23:09 style 1 doesn't look right 01:23:42 it should look like... *screenshot* h/o 01:24:58 Did you send that to something@burr.something? 01:25:10 Because I won't get thta 01:25:27 no... I'm gonna put it on my server 01:25:31 ok 01:26:25 hmm, are negative margins allowed? 01:26:35 yeah 01:27:24 http://www.toreun.org/esoteric/style1.png 01:28:49 The formatting of the boxes is strange 01:29:27 The

boxes are constant width and appear in front of the text 01:30:44 that's... weird 01:31:41 so you can't see the text? 01:31:57 I can see everything except for the last character 01:32:14 The boxes are narrow 01:33:50 hmm... I suppose I could make the boxes a fixed width, but that could be bad when the links are long 01:34:03 I'm playing with the stylesheet now 01:34:06 ok 01:34:32 I'll have to make a third one anyway... a very simple one 01:35:46 In #main p:first-line, add border: none 01:36:00 Otherwise, it inherits the dashed border from #main p 01:36:13 And there are confusing extra dashes in the document 01:36:25 ok 01:37:24 This is annoying -- when you turn that off, the dashed border on the left side of the first line disappears 01:37:38 That should be a bug report 01:37:45 I'll do border-top and border-bottom none 01:38:09 how's that? 01:38:27 That looks okay 01:39:23 ok 01:42:58 Also, li display:inline seems to be messing things up, although when it's not inline it inserts newlines between the list elements 01:43:19 hmm... 01:44:07 how's that look... it might be more compatible, but I'm not sure I like the floating left 01:44:32 actually... let me try something 01:44:50 It looks the same 01:45:00 I still see the first-line boxes, also 01:45:24 ok... that didn't work 01:45:52 they should be left aligned rather than center now 01:46:02 I used float: left 01:47:27 the first line boxes? where's the border?? 01:48:03 In style1.css, I don't see any border-top: or border-bottom: 01:48:10 Maybe something is caching the webpage 01:48:27 hmm... try shift-refresh, I think 01:48:35 I'm pretty sure that does a hard refresh 01:48:35 oh, yes 01:48:43 It looks okay now 01:48:57 how's the left align look? 01:49:01 rather than it being in the middle? 01:49:03 And the

It definitely would look nicer if you could put that in the middle 01:49:25 I know 01:49:32 but without using display: inline I'm not sure I can 01:49:38 and you said that's giving you problems 01:50:24 I know is deprecated, but it seems to be the only portable way to accomplish some things 01:50:43 * Toreun winces 01:51:05 the problem with that is the multiple stylesheets... 01:51:13 which is my whole philosophy of webdesign 01:51:15 oh, right 01:51:42 in theory it should look fine, because Mozilla seems to always display things correctly 01:51:56 but only... what, 10% of the population uses it? 01:51:58 at most 01:52:22 yeah, something like that 01:52:35 ie gets the lions share 01:54:40 brb 01:55:21 k 02:00:47 b 02:00:55 wb 02:01:07 I can't seem to figure out how to center it... 02:02:15 so I'm gonna leave it as display: inline and make a *much* less intensive stylesheet 02:02:21 okay 02:03:04 As a programmer, I have to say that CSS is too restrictive 02:03:17 yes, I've noticed that too 02:03:41 I want to be able to have successive lines of text spaced by successive prime-number distances 02:03:53 it's way too hard to center everything! you have to use roundabout methods that were originally unexpected 02:04:08 that would need a turing complete markup, wouldn't it? 02:04:12 I think so :) 02:04:45 I haven't been able to center a

in all of IE, Netscape, and Konqueror without using the tag 02:05:21 There's something in the CSS specification about text-align: center only applying to inline elements 02:05:50 if only it wasn't so difficult to get something standard in webdesign... maybe there would be a turing complete design language 02:06:21 Imagine all the webpage-bombs though 02:06:41 that's true 02:07:15 100.000 bottles of beer on the wall... 02:08:08 well... would there be a way to prevent dynamic text insertion? 02:09:16 That wouldn't be very turing-complete 02:09:37 well... not necessarily... dynamic images? 02:10:06 Actually I think Microsoft is trying to use .NET to add programmability to webpages, like Sun tried with Java 02:10:38 that's... not very good 02:10:56 Yeah 02:15:28 .NET is getting awfully bloated, IMO 02:25:27 -!- Toreun has left (?). 02:25:31 -!- Toreun has joined. 02:26:22 wb 02:26:47 hi 03:51:14 -!- lament has joined. 04:42:59 -!- mooz- has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 04:44:18 -!- mooz- has joined. 04:44:18 -!- irc.freenode.net has set channel mode: +o mooz-. 04:44:22 -!- ChanServ has set channel mode: -o mooz-. 07:51:46 -!- heatsink has quit ("Leaving"). 07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended). 08:00:00 -!- clog has joined. 08:12:15 -!- lament has quit ("Leaving"). 11:11:22 -!- andreou has joined. 11:29:13 -!- andreou has quit ("My damn controlling terminal disappeared!").