00:03:57 -!- kevinalh has joined. 00:07:15 -!- LKoen has quit (Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”). 00:33:47 -!- sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 00:35:46 -!- sprocklem has joined. 00:53:40 -!- sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 00:54:35 -!- sprocklem has joined. 02:05:08 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 02:13:06 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 02:26:34 [[User:Tetratrary/Sandbox]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71963&oldid=71948 * Tetratrary * (-1169) 02:27:02 [[User:Tetratrary/Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71964&oldid=71963 * Tetratrary * (-45) /* Operations */ 02:28:35 [[User:Tetratrary/Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71965&oldid=71964 * Tetratrary * (+0) /* Example Programs */ 02:29:33 -!- copumpkin has joined. 02:33:29 [[User:Tetratrary/Sandbox]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71966&oldid=71965 * Tetratrary * (+3) /* Example programs */ 02:39:02 [[User:Tetratrary/Sandbox]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71967&oldid=71966 * Tetratrary * (+0) /* Operations */ 03:16:52 Some of my new rules for Magic: the Gathering (to use with my custom cards) include generalized haunt and mutate, and also runebanding. 03:18:26 Bands with other runes? 03:25:29 Yes. Well, with other runebanding runes, that is. 03:35:26 Now "haunt" can specify what object it haunts, and "mutate" can specify what permanent it mutates (it still needs to have the same owner as the spell, though). 03:39:52 -!- ArthurStrong has quit (Quit: leaving). 03:52:57 See if you make up a card using any of these things. 04:00:53 -!- ArthurStrong has joined. 04:14:36 -!- Antebrationist has joined. 04:15:49 orbitaldecay? I was reading the logs for esowar, and it seems very interesting. Is it only 1d? 04:18:16 huh, in C++, is std::bind(std::uniform_int_distribution{0,1}, rng); expected to take a copy of the rng? *mumble* 04:21:49 You mean instead of a pointer? 04:21:57 I guess it's impossible to know with these C++ things. 04:22:23 It is probably clearer to write it with a lambda. 04:27:27 Apparently "the answer" is to use std::ref. 04:28:17 https://godbolt.org/z/FFkBtD 04:28:58 Oh boy, what an answer. 04:29:07 A better answer is surely to scrap std::bind. 04:30:42 Thanks. 04:31:43 [&rng]() { return std::uniform_int_distribution{0,1}(rng); } is probably clearer? 04:32:07 What a maze of std::little::passages, all different, it is to figure out what's going on here. 04:33:01 You can also just write [&]() { ... } 04:33:02 Yeah I did manage to write the lambda. :) 04:33:25 I'm more annoyed that I've been doing this wrong, blissfully unaware of the copy. 04:33:33 OK, I just felt like I should argue for the more reasonable thing a little more after mentioning the ridiculous thing. 04:34:33 Well, it's the quicker fix :P 04:34:43 (using std::ref that is.) 04:35:08 Maybe if you never ever have to understand what's going on with that code. 04:35:17 Man, C++ is so ridiculous. 04:35:39 I've said it before, and I'll say it many more times. It's one of my favorite esolangs. 04:35:52 Why? 04:35:56 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LOOP_%28programming_language%29 This is the same idea I thought of the day before, but I used a different syntax. Set to zero is the name and a equal sign, increment is the name and a plus sign, loop is the name and then a left bracket and then the commands and then the right bracket, commands are separated by spaces. 04:35:58 I agree on the eso, but why favorite? 04:36:27 shachaf: I finally noticed because I wanted to run several instances of my program, providing seeds on the command line (for reproducibility)... and saw that the seed had no effect. bummer. 04:36:50 idk, there's something amazing about this farce that people keep pretending that it's a Real Serious Language™ when it's about as well-designed as fucking MUMPS 04:37:02 (out of laziness, the rng is a global variable, and I re-seeded it with the program argument) 04:37:25 I'm sure no harm can come of accidentally copying a random number generator. 04:37:44 This is for http://www.research.ibm.com/haifa/ponderthis/challenges/May2020.html ... not production code by any standard. 04:37:54 No harm at all... 04:38:12 Maybe; I don't know. Some people use C++, I use C. I also think many features of C++ are not so well designed, and had a different idea to do some of its similar things differently in C, but different and without any extra runtime libraries needed. 04:38:46 shachaf: I mean who wouldn't want this: http://paste.debian.net/1145790/ 04:39:25 huh, that's missing two lines, #include and #include 04:39:29 int-e: Exactly. 04:41:21 My idea was that you cannot overload the assignment operator, but you can overload the assignment through pointer operator. I don't know if overloading the assignment through pointer operator is possible in C++; do you know? 04:42:08 Which operator is that? 04:42:52 For example *x=y; 04:45:27 I doubt that can have a different interpretation from the separate meanings of * and = 04:45:57 zzo38: My idea (which is also the way ALGOL 68 and BLISS work) is that there are no mutable variables, only pointers. 04:46:25 And instead of a mutable variable you have an immutable pointer to a mutable memory cell. 04:46:46 So you might have to explicitly dereference: x = $x + 1 04:47:12 The assignment operator = takes two arguments, a reference and a value. The derefernece operator $ takes a reference and returns a value. 04:47:16 Yes, I think that way is good too, I like that too 04:47:19 Do you like this? 04:47:36 I answered that question already 04:47:41 Yes, I asked it too late. 04:47:45 OK 04:47:49 I'm worried that this will make code too verbose. 04:48:10 With all the extra dereferences you don't need to write in a typical language. 04:48:15 What do you think? 04:49:40 I think it is OK; some other programming languages already work similarly and it works OK, including Forth. 04:50:37 Say you have the equivalent of "T *array;" in C. 04:51:01 The C code "array[i]" would turn into "$array[$i]", I suppose. 04:51:20 Or "$($array + $i)". Does the [] have an implicit $? 04:52:03 In C a[i] is an lvalue, so really the direct corresponding thing here is just +. 04:52:17 I don't know. 04:52:21 $($a[$i]) is just ridiculous, though. 04:52:48 It all seem kind of noisy. 04:53:02 Another thing you can do is implicitly figure out when things are dereferenced, like ALGOL 68 does. 04:53:31 But then I'm worried that things are ambiuous, for example in the situation "int f(int *x);" vs. "int g(int x);" being called the same way. 04:53:38 I think is best then to don't have a [] notation 04:54:05 Then what instead? 04:54:11 Of course [] isn't the only problem, it's just one thing. 04:54:15 You can use + instead 05:15:58 -!- Antebrationist has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 05:41:54 Yay, I found an application for sortin arrays in http://www.research.ibm.com/haifa/ponderthis/challenges/May2020.html :-) 05:42:23 hello brain... I meant sorting networks 06:04:42 -!- imode has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 06:23:20 -!- ais523 has joined. 06:24:01 shachaf: last time I implemented something that used this, arrays themselves were generally immutable (only their elements were mutable) 06:24:24 so normally you wouldn't be explicitly dereferencing an array 06:24:49 actually, I implemented arrays as functions that returned references, and postfix () had higher precedence than $ 06:25:17 so array[i] turns into $array[$i] which parses as $(array[$i]) 06:26:00 * array[$i] turns into $array($i) which parses as $(array($i)) 06:26:19 your examples look weird to me, though, because the language in question used $ for dereference but := for assignment 06:26:43 (= was used to define the value of an immutable thing as it came into scope) 06:29:57 ais523: Yes, I was thinking of that. 06:30:25 I think there's also the odd thing that when you switch something from immutable to mutable, you have to go through all the use sites and modify them. 06:30:42 It make some sense, but when you compare it to a C program it's pretty awkward. 06:31:26 Even if arrays are immutable, there are probably other things with similar problems. 06:32:38 But maybe an array that can be reassigned is a weird enough thing that $($arr)[$i] is fine. 06:32:57 What was the language in question? 06:34:07 I'm pretty curious how awkward this works out to be in practice. 06:34:52 Also, if you had structs, did e.g. struct dereference have a meaning for both references to structs and structs? 06:40:54 -!- kevinalh has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 07:32:40 So... 100M generations per second on a single core. Yum :) 07:37:29 (For the May Ponder This challenge, and with the fixed rule string from that challenge.) 07:56:17 Hmm, for 121 cells. 07:56:30 I wonder whether you can speed up a finite torus board with hashlife. 07:59:29 doubt it. 07:59:54 I mean, hashlife will kick in when you have a cycle... but for this problem, you're done at that point. 08:00:40 And then there's memory usage... nah, I only see reasons why it probably doesn't work. 08:01:06 s/work/help/ 08:19:18 It sounds that way. But maybe there's some trick. 08:19:21 Probably not. 08:27:42 -!- LKoen has joined. 08:28:49 -!- ArthurStrong has quit (Quit: leaving). 08:56:19 -!- sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 08:58:19 -!- sprocklem has joined. 09:03:22 -!- sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 09:03:55 -!- sprocklem has joined. 09:05:04 -!- ais523 has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 09:11:01 -!- rain1 has joined. 09:23:56 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has joined. 09:25:43 -!- Lord_of_Life has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 09:26:46 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has changed nick to Lord_of_Life. 09:53:34 -!- sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 09:54:19 -!- sprocklem has joined. 10:18:18 -!- sebbu has quit (Quit: reboot). 10:30:52 [[La We]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71968&oldid=67514 * Pelirodri * (+2121) Factorial sample. 11:07:03 -!- zseri has joined. 11:29:53 -!- spruit11 has joined. 11:42:49 -!- sebbu has joined. 11:43:44 -!- sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 11:44:00 -!- sprocklem has joined. 11:55:57 -!- arseniiv_ has joined. 11:57:54 -!- sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 12:00:00 -!- sprocklem has joined. 12:03:08 [[SoT]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71969&oldid=59469 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+130) /* Underload */ 12:13:01 -!- rain1 has quit (Quit: leaving). 12:32:34 -!- zseri has quit (Quit: zseri). 12:43:44 -!- v has joined. 12:43:51 -!- v has changed nick to psdw22. 12:43:57 ``` ls s/work/help/ 12:43:59 ls: cannot access 's/work/help/': No such file or directory 12:44:04 ``` ls s/work/ 12:44:07 ls: cannot access 's/work/': No such file or directory 12:44:09 ``` ls s/work 12:44:10 ls: cannot access 's/work': No such file or directory 12:44:10 -!- psdw22 has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 12:46:49 IDGI. 12:47:47 (I guess someone misinterpreted int-e's s/work/help/ comment as a pathname?) 13:04:11 -!- sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 13:05:50 -!- sprocklem has joined. 13:05:58 -!- rain1 has joined. 13:10:50 -!- sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 13:11:23 -!- sprocklem has joined. 14:11:46 -!- grumble has quit (Quit: As we empty our lint traps, we're just slowly throwing our clothes in the garbage.). 14:16:50 -!- grumble has joined. 14:23:02 -!- kevinalh has joined. 14:59:05 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 15:11:36 -!- arseniiv_ has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds). 15:15:18 -!- arseniiv_ has joined. 15:22:47 -!- kevinalh has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 15:37:19 -!- kspalaiologos has joined. 15:37:38 -!- imode has joined. 15:42:48 -!- zseri has joined. 15:53:01 -!- kevinalh has joined. 16:07:18 -!- zseri has quit (Quit: zseri). 16:18:34 -!- arseniiv_ has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 16:22:14 -!- kevinalh has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 16:30:56 fizzie: hah, cute. 16:32:32 -!- arseniiv_ has joined. 16:38:14 -!- kevinalh has joined. 16:44:51 [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * NichtElias * New user account 17:28:22 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 17:37:47 -!- LKoen has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 17:39:15 -!- LKoen has joined. 17:48:34 [[Esowar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71970&oldid=71955 * Orby * (+340) /* Example base */ 18:04:08 http://zzo38computer.org/img_1D/sensorrec.png Now do you believe me? 18:04:49 (Note: Due to the way the data is recorded, it won't record the system load as zero even when it is zero.) 18:14:21 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 18:35:01 -!- ais523 has joined. 18:37:07 What was the language in question? ← Verity; it isn't very well known 18:37:24 it didn't/doesn't have structs, so that issue hasn't come up yet 18:38:19 [[Brainfuck/w/index.php?title=Talk:Brainfuck/index.php]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71971&oldid=43586 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+19) /* Computational class */ total 18:52:30 -!- ais523 has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 19:03:58 -!- ais523 has joined. 19:48:34 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 20:00:20 -!- epsilon00 has joined. 20:00:30 hi can someone help me please 20:00:33 ng 20:01:07 Oo 20:01:55 dunno, w/ what? 20:07:27 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 20:11:00 The temperature of my computer is currently reported as 35.5 Celsius. 20:11:14 (That is the CPU temperature) 20:13:26 hi 20:16:33 hi rain! 20:23:12 ais523: Oh, but I think you've mentioned it before. 20:23:14 hi! i gotta go 20:23:15 -!- rain1 has quit (Quit: leaving). 20:23:22 BLISS also doesn't have structs. 20:32:32 -!- kspalaiologos has quit (Quit: Leaving). 20:41:38 -!- TheLie has joined. 21:02:03 -!- TheLie has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:02:20 -!- arseniiv_ has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 21:04:19 -!- TheLie has joined. 21:23:30 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has joined. 21:26:36 -!- Lord_of_Life has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 21:26:41 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has changed nick to Lord_of_Life. 21:36:19 -!- epsilon00 has quit. 21:48:34 Do you need the C program and PostScript program I wrote for these temperature recording and plotting? 21:52:06 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 21:57:08 hello all 21:57:47 Do some computer games use compression formats that will sometimes fail for unsolvable levels? 21:58:52 i doubt that 22:00:25 Well, I have done that with a sokoban game once; its compression algorithm sometimes fails for unsolvable levels (such as levels with cornered boxes, unreachable areas, etc) 22:01:18 (Not because it checks for such things, but because the compressed format is incapable of representing some of those features.) 22:02:46 Actually, I think this is also true of Gruniozerca 3. The way that the compression works requires that the solution is recorded too, apparently. 22:23:51 [[Esowar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71972&oldid=71970 * Orby * (+161) Tie condition 22:24:04 -!- zzo38 has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 22:25:29 -!- zzo38 has joined. 23:17:37 -!- zzo38 has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 23:28:14 -!- zzo38 has joined. 23:50:44 -!- TheLie has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 23:52:25 -!- Sgeo has joined. 23:55:52 -!- Sgeo_ has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds).