00:13:44 -!- spruit11 has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 00:13:56 -!- spruit11 has joined. 00:24:22 -!- diverger has joined. 00:25:10 -!- divergence has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 00:36:49 [[XENBLN]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70440&oldid=70236 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+116) 00:43:31 [[XENBLN]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70441&oldid=70440 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-22681) /* Commands */ 00:43:50 That seems...annoying to look at 00:44:06 kinda neat though. 01:05:53 “of the Russian transliteration (kind of) of "Jelly" (which is "Желлый")” => wh…what?? O_o 01:06:22 Do you know how to write in Russian? 01:06:24 I’d say джелли is a perfectly normal transliteration 01:06:48 zzo38: yeah :) 01:06:54 OK, good 01:11:32 though now I wonder if I mix transliteration with something else, hm, like this one I wrote reads as near to “jelly” as possible (if one considers reading double лл as a non-geminated consonant, which is usually the case), but it’s also a transliteration. Though “джели” wouldn’t be a transliteration, and it may be a more preferred as a transcription (though someone may disagree) 01:12:00 What is the Russian word for "jelly", though? 01:13:11 hm how would дж be pronounced, is either consonant assimilated to the other? 01:13:50 @messages-loud 01:13:50 int-e said 3d 7h 31m 24s ago: Agatha is such a terrbible mad scientist. 01:14:30 because a dental followed by a retroflex is not something my tongue wants to pronounce 01:15:23 (then again, i'm not russian.) 01:17:04 (also someone may accidentally put the accent on the last syllable, and it would be suboptimal; one can prevent that from happening by writing the accent mark explicitly: дже́лли, but as Russian is not Spanish, excessive accenting may be frowned upon; and this is sad) 01:17:04 zzo38: желе (more for fruit ones), студень (also may be used for non-edible things), холодец (this one usually contains pieces of meat), and maybe a special chemical term which I forgot 01:18:32 int-e: someone has to be the sane one to save the world 01:21:20 notable that холодец and студень is formed more or less like Latin gelata (from which, gelatine and jelly via French) — both relate to something cold/frozen/solidified, though all of them in different ways, no long-distance relations here, just a jelly preparation wisdom :D 01:21:48 (and желе is most probably via that same French too) 01:25:24 corollary: Fractran is almost certainly TC with 6 fractions, although the size of the fractions is probably going to be astronomical <-- cool 01:25:34 oerjan: oh sorry I missed your question, one sec 01:27:31 I think in most cases д would be a retroflex one, or at least something closer to retroflex than a usual dental д, and ж should stay unchanged 01:28:35 also as дж is in most normal cases not an affricate, it can have a relatively long (phonetically) transition between д and ж and then it’s not that hard to pronounce 01:30:15 ah 01:30:20 though of course if you’d read a thorough phonetic work on this, prefer it to my rationalizations, I’m not a phonetics specialist 01:35:14 also someday I need to complete reading a J. C. Catford’s “A practical introduction to phonetics”, a neat book with experimental interludes to make oneself closer to understanding what can be articulated by us humans :D Maybe not a monograph but very useful. I learned how to make ejectives and something, though without practice I already unlearned that. Though it’s fixable as easily 01:36:03 -!- arseniiv has quit (Quit: gone too far). 01:36:59 oerjan: I didn't @tell that part, but I also complained that having second thoughts is so inefficient :) 01:41:23 ah. i didn't get to it in the logs yet, lambdabot just pinged me 01:42:10 i also dislike second thoughts, especially when they happen after i've already started following the first one. 01:45:11 i see Para Ventura also does not count restoration from backup as immortality. 01:46:36 someone should remember to back up Cindy, though. 01:46:59 mmm 01:47:27 Oh it updated already. (Of course, I'm just bad with time zones.) 01:48:01 it's just a few weeks while the US has transited to DST but Europe hasn't 01:50:43 I would hope that Cindy's backing herself up, actually. 01:51:19 Though the backup location may be Petey's domain and that's a prime target... I wonder how distributed He is. 01:55:28 istr the toughs backup to eina afa 01:56:02 some distribution is still in order 01:56:38 [[Line Feed]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70442&oldid=70429 * A * (+92) Let's keep both interpreters 02:11:40 Oh well, I'm re-reading some old lessons in ethics. https://www.schlockmercenary.com/2001-04-15 02:16:55 (I was really looking for the first appearance of Petey, which comes 2 weeks later) 02:23:42 i followed that link, clicked Next, and got somewhat astounded by the art evolution of dr. bunnigus. 02:28:03 19 years is a long time 02:28:34 FWIW, https://www.schlockmercenary.com/2001-05-18 is where they finally agree on "Petey" 02:31:53 -!- imode has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 03:04:45 -!- FreeFull has quit. 03:08:10 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 03:11:11 -!- imode has joined. 03:17:01 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 06:01:59 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: leaving). 06:56:01 -!- imode has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 07:13:36 -!- atslash has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 07:16:00 -!- LKoen has joined. 07:24:06 -!- atslash has joined. 07:47:23 -!- atslash has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 07:48:50 -!- atslash has joined. 09:06:23 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has joined. 09:07:14 -!- Lord_of_Life has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 09:07:43 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has changed nick to Lord_of_Life. 09:09:15 -!- atslash has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 09:11:41 -!- atslash has joined. 09:35:20 -!- diverger has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 09:36:32 -!- diverger has joined. 10:05:02 -!- wib_jonas has joined. 11:26:23 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 11:54:08 -!- rain1 has joined. 12:07:56 -!- xkapastel has joined. 12:19:36 -!- tromp_ has joined. 12:22:50 -!- tromp has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 13:23:23 -!- diverger has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 13:25:45 -!- shinh_ has joined. 13:25:48 -!- diverger has joined. 13:27:07 -!- arseniiv_ has joined. 13:27:14 -!- shinh has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 13:27:19 -!- arseniiv_ has changed nick to arseniiv. 14:02:14 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 14:47:03 -!- xelxebar has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 15:13:10 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 16:17:56 -!- wib_jonas has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 16:35:43 -!- imode has joined. 16:41:10 -!- MDead has joined. 16:43:00 -!- MDude has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 16:43:05 -!- MDead has changed nick to MDude. 17:13:07 [[Infinite Goto]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70443&oldid=70374 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+25) /* Resources */ 17:37:44 -!- kspalaiologos has joined. 17:52:24 -!- diverger has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 17:53:51 -!- FreeFull has joined. 17:54:25 -!- diverger has joined. 18:00:56 -!- sftp has quit (Excess Flood). 18:01:18 -!- sftp has joined. 18:05:37 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 18:16:29 -!- diverger has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 18:19:00 -!- diverger has joined. 19:01:25 we've got some cool fonts right 19:01:30 where are they again? 19:02:02 for terminals 19:02:10 I'm getting tired of my IBM BIOS dump 19:03:42 `? fonts 19:03:43 ​#esoteric bitmap fonts include: \oren\'s font http://www.orenwatson.be/fontdemo.htm , lifthrasiir's font https://github.com/lifthrasiir/unison/ , b_jonas's font http://www.math.bme.hu/~ambrus/pu/fecupboard20-c.pcf.gz , fizzie's font https://github.com/fis/rfk86/tree/master/web/font , FireFly's fonts http://xen.firefly.nu/up/fonts/ 19:04:32 yeah 19:04:33 thats this one 19:05:06 \oren\'s font is a bit unreadable to me 19:05:09 but it's gorgeous 19:58:05 -!- LKoen has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:58:22 -!- LKoen has joined. 20:02:15 -!- kspalaiologos has quit (Quit: Leaving). 20:02:26 -!- kspalaiologos has joined. 20:07:49 -!- kspalaiologos has quit (Quit: leaving). 20:22:56 What improvements do you think should be made to the SQLite virtual table mechanism? 20:38:45 zzo38: Have you stopped beating your wife? 20:40:35 I do not have a wife. 20:50:28 18 smaller apples eh? 20:56:19 -!- xelxebar has joined. 21:06:59 What about small apples eh? 21:07:32 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has joined. 21:09:49 -!- Lord_of_Life has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 21:10:19 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has changed nick to Lord_of_Life. 21:29:17 zzo38: sorry, it's today's xkcd 21:34:32 O, that's what it is. 21:36:34 tbf, you just don't picture it all at once 21:38:17 Imagine a 1m^3 cube, zoom in on a corner of 1mm^3 size, imagine that's your new 1m^3 cube. Repeat 4 times. Imagine that the cube you are now left with is 10 bytes then put it all together again. 21:39:22 -!- rain1 has quit (Quit: leaving). 21:41:22 I think either I’ve gone crazy or I got an amalgamation of effects with coeffects, at least for a simple formulation of either, and in context of applicative programming with quotes 21:41:51 arseniiv: how about both? 21:42:06 maybe both :′( 21:43:13 (But sorry, no constructive feedback is forthcoming from me; I can't bring myself to figure out what that might say.) 21:44:58 all in all, an effect constructors abuses the part after it upto the end of the handled chunk; a coeffect constructor “retroactively” abuses a chunk from the start of the handled chunk upto before itself. Now we can make a bracket of these constructors, beginning with effect ctor and ending with coeffect ctor, and they would abuse the code between them, when handled 21:46:30 where is the department for the prevention of code abuse when you need it 21:48:07 though one needsnot only a handler but four extra additional converting routine arguments in case the bracket would be malformed. Usual effects with handlers use just a single one, when no effect constructor was called, and my coeffect analogy uses just one too, but this one seems to need four 21:48:52 if this thing would work, I name it proeffects, as in “profunctor” 21:49:48 though I’m explicitly not sure if it may be useful and if it may be generalized upto what effects-with-algebraic-declarations-and-handlers-and-whatnot are now 21:50:44 on the plus side, in this case one doesn’t need separate effect and coeffect tagging on types 21:50:44 -!- vivax has joined. 21:52:16 hello 21:52:44 `relcome 21:52:46 ​Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: . (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on EFnet or DALnet.) 21:57:55 at least I hope I’ll be able to explain what I did for effects in this concatenative typed setting. int-e would you be interested? 21:59:25 sorry, no 21:59:32 ah okay no problem 22:00:19 I’ll make an exposition anyway I think :D 22:24:28 anyone familiar enough with Haskell types and concatenative languages should I think be able to get the following: 22:24:28 we’ll type a stack as a heterogeneous list of types of its elements, like [bottom] 2 'a' [top] will have a type Char::Int::Nil. Usually one considers only several top elements of the stack, typing the mentioned one as Char::Int::xs or Char::xs or xs; 22:24:28 a single-word function would be typed as xs → ys. Now suppose we can quote parts of the code, writing that as []. If : ts₁ → ts₂, then [] : xs → [ts₁ → ts₂]::xs; 22:24:28 enter effects. We would denote the type of a function xs → ys having effects E when applied, as xs −E→ ys. Now we can type a concatenation simply as: f : xs −E₁→ ys, g : ys −E₂→ zs ⊢ f g : xs −(E₁∪E₂)→ zs; 22:24:28 let ESig e vs rs express that any constructor of effect named e takes vs and leaves rs (this is a simplistic setting); and we can add two primitives, effect and handle, with types 22:24:28 effect : ESig e vs rs ⇒ vs −{e}→ rs; handle : ESig e vs rs ⇒ [[rs −E→ bs]::vs −E′→ cs]::[bs −E″→ cs]::[as −E→ bs]::as −((E\{e})∪E′∪E″)→ cs; 22:24:28 effect is obvious, it just makes an effect. handle takes an effect handler, a normal return handler, and a code in which we would handle the effect e; 22:24:29 when a constructor is handled, the handler receives an additional delimited continuation, from the constructor upto the end of the code being handled, and the handler may choose to continue with it any numer of times or to return early; 22:24:29 this is not new but the presentation for the concatenative setting may be or not be interesting. The dual thing would give a continuation from the start of the code upto a constructor, and I hope that captures something coeffectful; 22:24:30 that’s all! I’ll go read something about coeffects once again or maybe I’m going to play backgammon with a friend. Hopefully this isn’t too long 22:25:19 s/isn’t/wasn’t 22:28:38 ah, also: executing effectful code would be straightforward, using a call stack enhanced with “handle entries” using as delimiters. Executing a coeffectful code will require a translation of the code, as one needs to handle constructors right to left 22:29:02 (if I’m not mistaken) 22:31:44 and the translation should might be done very simply (with effects, too), quoting all the continuations which would be required to handle each constructor, and add some glue 22:35:20 s/“handle entries” using as delimiters/…used… 22:42:42 I am making a major template for making Magic: the Gathering cards with TeXnicard. This includes .auto. command to automatically fill in some fields (such as the collector numbers and color identity), and .errors. command to tell you what errors it detects in the current record. 23:07:13 -!- vivax has left ("WeeChat 2.7.1"). 23:23:50 -!- zzo38 has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds). 23:24:03 -!- voidio has joined. 23:24:31 -!- dnm_ has joined. 23:24:39 -!- Deewiant_ has joined. 23:25:26 -!- ^[ has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 23:25:26 -!- dnm has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 23:25:26 -!- Deewiant has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 23:25:27 -!- iovoid has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 23:25:27 -!- dnm_ has changed nick to dnm. 23:25:38 -!- ^[_ has joined. 23:26:05 -!- iczero has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 23:26:31 -!- iczero has joined. 23:28:33 -!- zzo38 has joined. 23:35:40 -!- wlp1s1 has joined. 23:36:07 -!- j4cbo_ has joined. 23:37:06 -!- iczero has quit (Excess Flood). 23:37:07 -!- j4cbo has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 23:37:07 -!- j4cbo_ has changed nick to j4cbo. 23:54:29 `? economics 23:54:30 economics? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ 23:54:47 `learn Economics is just applied numerology. 23:54:50 Learned 'economic': Economics is just applied numerology. 23:55:03 `? just 23:55:04 Just is just a just adverb. 23:55:08 ``mv wisdom/economic{,s} 23:55:09 ​`mv? No such file or directory 23:55:13 `` mv wisdom/economic{,s} 23:55:14 mv: cannot stat 'wisdom/economic': No such file or directory 23:55:34 right, what's that environment variable again? 23:56:02 Or I could use the .. trick 23:56:33 `` mv $HACKENV/wisdom/economic{,s} 23:56:35 No output. 23:57:14 `hwrl economics 23:57:15 https://hack.esolangs.org/repo/log/tip/wisdom/economics